I don't think it's so much the Dil. There is still a daily cap, so Cryptic doesn't care if you hit the cap in an hour or the day. What is more likely the issue are the drops of superior tech upgrades. That represents a significant lowering of profit in the upgrade system.
I would hope they simple adjust the loot tables. If they add any type of timer thats problematic. It then becomes saying "This is how we want you to play our game" Which is contrary to an MMO
I'm not mad they are nerfing the Tau Dewa patrols, I'm just not terribly impressed with the DR patrols.
No need to be angry, no; your prerogative. But, I'd say, be afraid. Be very afraid! Because when, from here on in, 'free roaming' is considered some form of exploit, then I'm out of here (no, you can't haz my stuff: it's bound to character).
I've been saying this about R&D too: they just nerf everything else around it, or make it otherwise way too expensive, so you are, de facto, forced to do R&D, after all. I, for one, find this a rather disturbing trend, impeding on my sense of choice.
I bet they'll put a 24h cooldown on all patrol missions now. :rolleyes:
I understand that the DL income from capped players had to be controlled but punishing all players for just grinding to get those points is just an unneccessary move.
Simply block the Specialization-Dilithium and leave the maps as they are.
THAT would have been a sane, reasonable response to a "problem" they perceived they had.
Calling your playerbase exploiters and shutting down a sector is the adult equivalent of sitting in the middle of the room, screaming as loud as you can, and throwing yourself backward so hard you hit your head on the floor.....
If there is any developer apologists left, please keep talking about responsibility with the entire developer team straight up hiding.
First thing to happen is set up a meeting where they going to discuss when to have the actual meeting.
Then because someone called in sick that day the meeting to set up the meeting had to be reschedueled.
Now the first meeting is just going to be a briefing with no decisions being made.
Then you set up a fourth meeting to discuss when you will be having the 2nd real meeting, the feedback meeting.
And around it goes.
If they spend 1/15 of the time working on the game, as they did in pointless meetings, whose culmination is deleting tour the galaxy, exploration, doff upgrinder, nuke stf, reputation passives etc. the game would be flawless, yes flawless.
Tough week for the PR crew over there too!
Same day they try to push out the "best expansion ever" blog, just can't catch a break eh?
/edit
ps. catch 22 right?
You admit your content was hated on and ignoed (on the day you post a blog praising yourself)
You flame the players for breaking the rules and deny reality
Landmine scenario I guess, once you step on it can't go here can't go there
I don't think it's so much the Dil. There is still a daily cap, so Cryptic doesn't care if you hit the cap in an hour or the day. What is more likely the issue are the drops of superior tech upgrades. That represents a significant lowering of profit in the upgrade system.
I would hope they simple adjust the loot tables. If they add any type of timer thats problematic. It then becomes saying "This is how we want you to play our game" Which is contrary to an MMO
in 5 hours of doing this i think i had like 4 drop..............
THAT would have been a sane, reasonable response to a "problem" they perceived they had.
Calling your playerbase exploiters and shutting down a sector is the adult equivalent of sitting in the middle of the room, screaming as loud as you can, and throwing yourself backward so hard you hit your head on the floor.....
This would be one fix granted however 80% of the new content is patrols which you need to do to level up so I can't see how this will work.
Its funny though as we was doing it on Tribble also just now all of a sudden its an issue
I don't think it's so much the Dil. There is still a daily cap, so Cryptic doesn't care if you hit the cap in an hour or the day. What is more likely the issue are the drops of superior tech upgrades. That represents a significant lowering of profit in the upgrade system.
I would hope they simple adjust the loot tables. If they add any type of timer thats problematic. It then becomes saying "This is how we want you to play our game" Which is contrary to an MMO
Usually a 1 in 5 chance to get an R&D drop per run. The dil/zen cost associated with that is tiny compared to the raw Dil ore after maxing specialisations.
I hear you on the cap though. Overall very little about the nerf makes sense. I'd love to hear a full explanation from Cryptic on why it was so critical to take down the only meaningful way of gaining exp to actually experience their new content in a decent manner. The way they chose to make it available was obviously not the best way or even the most palatable way for the playerbase to accept.
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
THAT would have been a sane, reasonable response to a "problem" they perceived they had.
Calling your playerbase exploiters and shutting down a sector is the adult equivalent of sitting in the middle of the room, screaming as loud as you can, and throwing yourself backward so hard you hit your head on the floor.....
You know what I almost feel sorry for that poor nerf bat, its going to get a right battering over the next few months.
Just because some people dont want to start, stop, grind, start again,enjoy, start again ace this is so cool whats next?
Oh no wait a minute got to stop and grind again and some more, nearly there, cool, start, *%$£ got to grind again etc.
One Cryptic dev commented earlier on this non evasive, non game breaking, non market changing situation.
"How very dare they."
( Not really I just made that up ;-)
On a semi serious note it is a crying shame as I can see great dev work on some missions and I am sure most of the devs would love to push the boundrys of this slowly ageing engine and outstanding ageless IP that is star trek.
To give us the real STO. A game that the players and many of the devs themselves deserve to have.
Unlikely I know but I love to dream.
At least we can find some cold comfort in the immutable truth.
That as one avenue is closed others will be found used and enjoyed until they in turn are also closed, ad infinitum.
Poor. Poor. Nerf bat.
Quote of the day.
"Its not that they are stupid because they most certainly are not stupid.
Its just the instructions they get make them seem to be from time to time."
(Yep you all guessed it. I made this one up too :-) ?
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,150Community Moderator
If there is any developer apologists left, please keep talking about responsibility with the entire developer team straight up hiding.
First thing to happen is set up a meeting where they going to discuss when to have the actual meeting.
Then because someone called in sick that day the meeting to set up the meeting had to be reschedueled.
Now the first meeting is just going to be a briefing with no decisions being made.
Then you set up a fourth meeting to discuss when you will be having the 2nd real meeting, the feedback meeting.
And around it goes.
If they spend 1/15 of the time working on the game, as they did in pointless meetings, whose culmination is deleting tour the galaxy, exploration, doff upgrinder, nuke stf, reputation passives etc. the game would be flawless, yes flawless.
Tough week for the PR crew over there too!
Same day they try to push out the "best expansion ever" blog, just can't catch a break eh?
/edit
ps. catch 22 right?
You admit your content was hated on and ignoed (on the day you post a blog praising yourself)
You flame the players for breaking the rules and deny reality
Landmine scenario I guess, once you step on it can't go here can't go there
I just want to let you know. I wasn't insulted until AFTER you decided I was part of the evil conspiracy just for disagreeing with you on something.
Actually while it seems suicidal, the way out of that minefield is to admit when you ****ed up.
However, someone that isn't just <a CM getting scapegoated> needs to man up and step into the line of fire. They will be lambasted for sure, but respect for the devs and game, overall, will heal a little doing that. With acts like these, the swearing and ******** that still does occur a little becomes a more soothing, healing venting of one's issues.
This would be one fix granted however 80% of the new content is patrols which you need to do to level up so I can't see how this will work.
Its funny though as we was doing it on Tribble also just now all of a sudden its an issue
LOL, so much for testing.
...oops, forgot it's the players fault for not logging onto tribble TO test. I forgot who said that. Guess I should've sub'd so I COULD login to tribble to test.
:rolleyes:
...oops, forgot it's the players fault for not logging onto tribble TO test. I forgot who said that. Guess I should've sub'd so I COULD login to tribble to test.
:rolleyes:
But wait, it gets better! The ones who did test weren't listened to! :eek:
Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head. - Euripides
I no longer do any Bug Hunting work for Cryptic. I may resume if a serious attempt to fix the game is made.
MY opinion its more to do with moving the player base to play the level grind-able content in Delta rather than playing older content to level grind in . untill i hear more on the "exploit" thats what im sticking with . cuz its has to be more than endcap di grinding , cuz there are better ways IMO.
...oops, forgot it's the players fault for not logging onto tribble TO test. I forgot who said that. Guess I should've sub'd so I COULD login to tribble to test.
:rolleyes:
Yes, totally the fault of all the players who didn't log into tribble to test.
Except of course for all the ones who did that and pointed out all those bugs through several test builds and patches, and pointed them out again and again over and over and over.
I just want to let you know. I wasn't insulted until AFTER you decided I was part of the evil conspiracy just for disagreeing with you on something.
Heheh, no reason to be insulted it's nothing personal.
Is just developer apologist lower the quality of the game in addition to just parroting blog PR mindlessly.
So the integrity of the game is in play it's not about any one person rather just the consequences of that behaviour.
I don't have anything against you or anyone else but I will reserve the right to maybe seem a little arrogant when it comes to the obvious and if nothing else 110% firm, that I might use a confrontational style and you can hate for me it, but I am honest and I stand up for what is right.
You teach people how to treat you and I don't have a short fuse, I have a deficit fuse.
You are full of PR and scamming until proven innocent. Twice so if you are an american and triple so if you work for a corporation.
Double triple if you work in the gaming industry which is entirely un-regulated.
That's like the minimum bet or wager right there to get in on the pot. This tall to ride or you can go get some candyfloss with the other kids and let us have some peace and quiet.
If you don't get the elementary parts then you shouldn't be talking, you dragging down the team, the group, the game and the community.
And that's why stupidity is not cute and innocent it's dangerous and has to be attacked on sight
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,150Community Moderator
edited October 2014
Well then I guess EVERYONE on the forum is based on your logic. Thank you for basically declaring me and everyone who doesn't agree with your views as "The reason things are messed up". I guess we should all just abandon the forums and let you have discussions with yourself if you don't like our opinions.
You're the one who isn't willing to have a civil discussion without declaring someone with a different view as a plague on the fourms.
I'm here to enjoy a game. Not be used as an example of "what is wrong with everything". I treat people with respect. You... are showing a lack of respect right now, not only to me, but the entire forum as a whole. All I did was bring up some holes in your thinking in a civil manner, and you all but blast me for being in on some conspiracy to make things worse. And on top of that, you are saying I'm in on it even more all because I'm American? Where the hell does that make sense?
Simple game mechanics, you kill ships - get xp. So where do i get my romu marks now, from stupid ground missions? I actually don't care if people power level, i think it is ok, why should you care??
This whole affair just proves to me more and more that we are now entering a phase of the game where we are pushed down a route determined by the game itself, rather than how we want to play it. Basically if you want to get anywhere it requires grinding out XP/Dilithium/EC or whatever, most of which is slowly being locked behind time gates to slow things down to a crawl (but with the option of real cash payments to skip the time-gates).
Every new thing added seems to be turned into a massive grind now so that the only way to realistically get past the grinding is to loose your life to the game with a massive time input or pay real world cash to unlock/skip through things quicker.
With DR they even turned the actual story missions into a grind by adding in huge XP barriers between them and half the missions being simply dull patrol grind-fests.
Then when the players find a way to avoid this by powering through some patrols elsewhere so they can enjoy the real story content it gets mysteriously shut down with little explanation.
Plus they even turned the PVE queues into a grind too, by adding in ridiculous HP boosts to the NPCs and forcing you to go for upgrades/better kit (at huge cost) or lose out on your dilithium earnings (pressuring you to spend for real cash for zen/dilithium).
I'm now not even sure why I want to log in anymore as it no longer feels like i'm playing the game for fun, it feels like a chore that must be carried out like clockwork just to allow me a few minutes of real story content.
I can't enjoy the odd PVE battle anymore as i'm simply not interested in chasing huge DPS numbers and it now appears even going to play some areas of the game not part of the new content is getting hit too (exploration, patrols outside of DR).
I hate to use the word logic.
First because it's a spock buzz-word and second it's too presumptuous.
I don't know if I am logical probably not, probably half the stuff I say maybe all of it contradicts what I just said.
It kind of feeds into everything I've been explaining.
It's not personal, it's isn't polite or mature and it's also maybe not logical.
Just not interesting to consider, it's fastest way from A to B with no resistance like the leveling in japori...
There is only the functionality of it.
The functionality, the result, of being a developer apologist is bad for the game and that's the focus I am interested in.
It's not really exciting if I can logically put up sentences that can't be word split or someone frowns for not having their post auto-respected just for typing it.
The result is the same, the focus is the same and the functionality is the same.
But no you don't get a cookie just for talking, that's how you treat a parrot at the zoo.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,150Community Moderator
edited October 2014
I am not an apologist or a frakkin' parrot! I'm just a normal person, but apparently you've decided I'm contributing to whatever evil you're seeing just by existing and trying to have a civil discussion!
You said Forum mods were bad because of some reason or another. I pointed out that OUR mods were volunteers, and that there is no connection between them and the game Devs themselves.
I admit I like Tacofangs, because when he's on the forum, he's pretty funny. I've had my own problems with the Dev Team, specifically with the imfamous Season 7 Accolade Bug that hit some people trying to unlock hard earned MACO visuals.
So could you consider for a minute that I'm not some lackey of some evil conspiracy and have a civil discussion without resorting to pretty much name calling if you don't agree?
This is pretty stupid. I will never level the way PWE wants. I will in fact find every other way to get EXP than to do what they want. Are they going to shut down the whole game then because of that? Good luck trying. That amounts to pissing in the ice cream so nobody can have some. Petty, ignorant behavior.
Comments
I cannot start the first LTCDR mission for the Roms, due to a maps error, caused by the nerfing.
/sarcasm
F'n brilliant.
.
I would hope they simple adjust the loot tables. If they add any type of timer thats problematic. It then becomes saying "This is how we want you to play our game" Which is contrary to an MMO
No need to be angry, no; your prerogative. But, I'd say, be afraid. Be very afraid! Because when, from here on in, 'free roaming' is considered some form of exploit, then I'm out of here (no, you can't haz my stuff: it's bound to character).
I've been saying this about R&D too: they just nerf everything else around it, or make it otherwise way too expensive, so you are, de facto, forced to do R&D, after all. I, for one, find this a rather disturbing trend, impeding on my sense of choice.
THAT would have been a sane, reasonable response to a "problem" they perceived they had.
Calling your playerbase exploiters and shutting down a sector is the adult equivalent of sitting in the middle of the room, screaming as loud as you can, and throwing yourself backward so hard you hit your head on the floor.....
^^ This. So this!
I didn't get any Dilithium for earning surplus XP before, either. So, I wouldn't miss it either (by the time I finished all Specializations).
Questions just is, if they didn't want ppl to make Dilithium that way, why add the reward in the first place?! It don't make no sense.
If there is any developer apologists left, please keep talking about responsibility with the entire developer team straight up hiding.
First thing to happen is set up a meeting where they going to discuss when to have the actual meeting.
Then because someone called in sick that day the meeting to set up the meeting had to be reschedueled.
Now the first meeting is just going to be a briefing with no decisions being made.
Then you set up a fourth meeting to discuss when you will be having the 2nd real meeting, the feedback meeting.
And around it goes.
If they spend 1/15 of the time working on the game, as they did in pointless meetings, whose culmination is deleting tour the galaxy, exploration, doff upgrinder, nuke stf, reputation passives etc. the game would be flawless, yes flawless.
Tough week for the PR crew over there too!
Same day they try to push out the "best expansion ever" blog, just can't catch a break eh?
/edit
ps. catch 22 right?
You admit your content was hated on and ignoed (on the day you post a blog praising yourself)
You flame the players for breaking the rules and deny reality
Landmine scenario I guess, once you step on it can't go here can't go there
in 5 hours of doing this i think i had like 4 drop..............
system Lord Baal is dead
This would be one fix granted however 80% of the new content is patrols which you need to do to level up so I can't see how this will work.
Its funny though as we was doing it on Tribble also just now all of a sudden its an issue
Usually a 1 in 5 chance to get an R&D drop per run. The dil/zen cost associated with that is tiny compared to the raw Dil ore after maxing specialisations.
I hear you on the cap though. Overall very little about the nerf makes sense. I'd love to hear a full explanation from Cryptic on why it was so critical to take down the only meaningful way of gaining exp to actually experience their new content in a decent manner. The way they chose to make it available was obviously not the best way or even the most palatable way for the playerbase to accept.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
And then crying to mom and dad you hit them.
Just because some people dont want to start, stop, grind, start again,enjoy, start again ace this is so cool whats next?
Oh no wait a minute got to stop and grind again and some more, nearly there, cool, start, *%$£ got to grind again etc.
One Cryptic dev commented earlier on this non evasive, non game breaking, non market changing situation.
"How very dare they."
( Not really I just made that up ;-)
On a semi serious note it is a crying shame as I can see great dev work on some missions and I am sure most of the devs would love to push the boundrys of this slowly ageing engine and outstanding ageless IP that is star trek.
To give us the real STO. A game that the players and many of the devs themselves deserve to have.
Unlikely I know but I love to dream.
At least we can find some cold comfort in the immutable truth.
That as one avenue is closed others will be found used and enjoyed until they in turn are also closed, ad infinitum.
Poor. Poor. Nerf bat.
Quote of the day.
"Its not that they are stupid because they most certainly are not stupid.
Its just the instructions they get make them seem to be from time to time."
(Yep you all guessed it. I made this one up too :-) ?
I just want to let you know. I wasn't insulted until AFTER you decided I was part of the evil conspiracy just for disagreeing with you on something.
However, someone that isn't just <a CM getting scapegoated> needs to man up and step into the line of fire. They will be lambasted for sure, but respect for the devs and game, overall, will heal a little doing that. With acts like these, the swearing and ******** that still does occur a little becomes a more soothing, healing venting of one's issues.
LOL, so much for testing.
...oops, forgot it's the players fault for not logging onto tribble TO test. I forgot who said that. Guess I should've sub'd so I COULD login to tribble to test.
:rolleyes:
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
But wait, it gets better! The ones who did test weren't listened to! :eek:
Yes, totally the fault of all the players who didn't log into tribble to test.
Except of course for all the ones who did that and pointed out all those bugs through several test builds and patches, and pointed them out again and again over and over and over.
... and then watched those bugs go live.
Mine Trap Supporter
Heheh, no reason to be insulted it's nothing personal.
Is just developer apologist lower the quality of the game in addition to just parroting blog PR mindlessly.
So the integrity of the game is in play it's not about any one person rather just the consequences of that behaviour.
I don't have anything against you or anyone else but I will reserve the right to maybe seem a little arrogant when it comes to the obvious and if nothing else 110% firm, that I might use a confrontational style and you can hate for me it, but I am honest and I stand up for what is right.
You teach people how to treat you and I don't have a short fuse, I have a deficit fuse.
You are full of PR and scamming until proven innocent. Twice so if you are an american and triple so if you work for a corporation.
Double triple if you work in the gaming industry which is entirely un-regulated.
That's like the minimum bet or wager right there to get in on the pot. This tall to ride or you can go get some candyfloss with the other kids and let us have some peace and quiet.
If you don't get the elementary parts then you shouldn't be talking, you dragging down the team, the group, the game and the community.
And that's why stupidity is not cute and innocent it's dangerous and has to be attacked on sight
You're the one who isn't willing to have a civil discussion without declaring someone with a different view as a plague on the fourms.
I'm here to enjoy a game. Not be used as an example of "what is wrong with everything". I treat people with respect. You... are showing a lack of respect right now, not only to me, but the entire forum as a whole. All I did was bring up some holes in your thinking in a civil manner, and you all but blast me for being in on some conspiracy to make things worse. And on top of that, you are saying I'm in on it even more all because I'm American? Where the hell does that make sense?
I'm sorry, I laughed way too hard at this. Probably harder than I should've. Co-workers now think I'm nuts
Every new thing added seems to be turned into a massive grind now so that the only way to realistically get past the grinding is to loose your life to the game with a massive time input or pay real world cash to unlock/skip through things quicker.
With DR they even turned the actual story missions into a grind by adding in huge XP barriers between them and half the missions being simply dull patrol grind-fests.
Then when the players find a way to avoid this by powering through some patrols elsewhere so they can enjoy the real story content it gets mysteriously shut down with little explanation.
Plus they even turned the PVE queues into a grind too, by adding in ridiculous HP boosts to the NPCs and forcing you to go for upgrades/better kit (at huge cost) or lose out on your dilithium earnings (pressuring you to spend for real cash for zen/dilithium).
I'm now not even sure why I want to log in anymore as it no longer feels like i'm playing the game for fun, it feels like a chore that must be carried out like clockwork just to allow me a few minutes of real story content.
I can't enjoy the odd PVE battle anymore as i'm simply not interested in chasing huge DPS numbers and it now appears even going to play some areas of the game not part of the new content is getting hit too (exploration, patrols outside of DR).
Cryptic, with their eyes closed.
First because it's a spock buzz-word and second it's too presumptuous.
I don't know if I am logical probably not, probably half the stuff I say maybe all of it contradicts what I just said.
It kind of feeds into everything I've been explaining.
It's not personal, it's isn't polite or mature and it's also maybe not logical.
Just not interesting to consider, it's fastest way from A to B with no resistance like the leveling in japori...
There is only the functionality of it.
The functionality, the result, of being a developer apologist is bad for the game and that's the focus I am interested in.
It's not really exciting if I can logically put up sentences that can't be word split or someone frowns for not having their post auto-respected just for typing it.
The result is the same, the focus is the same and the functionality is the same.
But no you don't get a cookie just for talking, that's how you treat a parrot at the zoo.
You said Forum mods were bad because of some reason or another. I pointed out that OUR mods were volunteers, and that there is no connection between them and the game Devs themselves.
I admit I like Tacofangs, because when he's on the forum, he's pretty funny. I've had my own problems with the Dev Team, specifically with the imfamous Season 7 Accolade Bug that hit some people trying to unlock hard earned MACO visuals.
So could you consider for a minute that I'm not some lackey of some evil conspiracy and have a civil discussion without resorting to pretty much name calling if you don't agree?