well the simple solution to that would be add dil rewards for all and people would flock.
dont get me wrong the stories are good, i like them, the sector patrols in between each one is a bit of a cop out on their part, there should have been a bit more story missions but whatever.
but here is another problem...adding dil would take away from all the wonderful glorious cash they are making. They have been doing everything they can in this update to make dil harder to get, they would NEVER make it easier.
Nobody seems to understand that the problem here is that no one was playing the new delta rising content. Because of this cryptic couldn't show their Chinese overlords that the investment put into the expansion was worth it.
I thought Delta Rising was "the most successful update ever for Star Trek Online!", hence the celebration weekend and the Lobi giveaway.
To be fair, that could be either actual celebration or emergency PR control.
This is simply not true. Japori kills award the same exact amount of XP as any other LvL 50 kills.
For comparison, LvL 60 Argala kills give you ~1300 XP, while LvL 50 Japori kills give you ~750 XP, so it's perfectly normal.
Enlighten me on the Argala bit. If there's another way to get to 60 painlessly, I want to know.
That said, devs just don't shut something down if it's working as intended. There was something going on with the Tau Dewa patrols that was not intended, be it simple XP gain, dilithium gain, or rocketing through mastery/specialization tiers effortlessly. There was something wrong that needed dealt with. If it was really in line with everything else as you claim, every patrol would have been shut down and every patrol would see aggressive farming. But that clearly isn't happening.
Enlighten me on the Argala bit. If there's another way to get to 60 painlessly, I want to know.
Argala is considered one of the "easy" DR patrols (By DR standards). Before Japori was discovered, people were running Argala on Elite to cover XP gaps.
I'm sorry then...I guess it would look more official to you if they re-wrote the definition for a word every-time they used it.
I'm sorry I was not the one claiming to be the "Exploit expert", while quoting Wiki Entries to contradict myself in the next sentence ... you might have missed that part ... shame on me, though ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
Hmm. I am starting to think that this entire mess has more to do with the dil being awarded for each level after you fill every specialization point. Well, not each level, but each X amount of xp after? Not sure that's worded exactly right, but regardless, Dil not xp is quite possibly the real issue.
Very well oh grasshoppers, cometh and sit 'round my fire so that I might bequeath unto thee the knowledge passeth down through the MMO ages:
In this case, assuming it is the XP/dil/R&D mat grinding that the dev have a problem with, it is the fact that players are manipulating a system in the game to produce results well beyond what it was intended to produce. It does not matter that the actual programming is functioning the way it was "intended" to, players are combining these functional features in a way that outputs rewards above what the game is supposed to. This is what makes it an EXPLOIT and not a bug or cheat. Look up Destiny Loot Cave or US tax law for some good examples.
The only problem here is the devs absurd reaction to the whole thing. Shutting the whole place down was a massive overreaction.
dammit I quoted the wrong one, i hate this forum, disregard.
Argala is considered one of the "easy" DR patrols (By DR standards). Before Japori was discovered, people were running Argala on Elite to cover XP gaps.
I have 2 problems with Argala (but my fleet still does it):
1)The mobs take FOREVER to kill and it gets really boring
2)Craptic screwed it up so bad that there is no transfer with team, so every-time we start a new patrol we need to enter-leave-re-enter about 10 times before we all end up in the same instance.
It can be done but it should not be shoved down our throats by taking out japori. The only reason to do this is what I stated previously...so they can show their Chinese overlords the new content is being used by the player base and the investment was worth it.
you are right but they can leave and take their money with them and if a enough ppl that are not so desperate to fly a star trek ship leave means no money to pay the bills = you dont get to fly your trek ship any more just saying ppl need to stop thinking this game is immune to death by making bad decisions
That is simply not true, the Germans buy 100x more Zen than probably the rest of the world, and they love Star Trek, this game could be stick figures running around with the name "Star Trek" and they would buy Zen.
The Germans will not care if they have to run the same dumb story mission 1000 times to gain a bubble of XP, they will still buy Zen, and be happy to play.
Cryptic would not shed a tear if the entire North American continent stopped playing.
but here is another problem...adding dil would take away from all the wonderful glorious cash they are making. They have been doing everything they can in this update to make dil harder to get, they would NEVER make it easier.
Well someone is pouring zen into this game i doubt it's them and the one constant has always been the refining cap of 8000/day +1000 for vets.
as i mentioned earlier the voth battle zone is easy enough to run and hit that cap with its dailies in 30 mins.
My thoughts on the whole nerfing dil on certain queues and as naieve this may be is to actually get people to do the other queues and not just the borgs like we have all been doing
the queues should have been standardised rewards across the board from the outset and this is just fixing that but as i said i am probably being naieve here.
Hmm. I am starting to think that this entire mess has more to do with the dil being awarded for each level after you fill every specialization point. Well, not each level, but each X amount of xp after? Not sure that's worded exactly right, but regardless, Dil not xp is quite possibly the real issue.
BUT... it only gives Dilithium ORE.
You can still only refine 8k a day.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Enlighten me on the Argala bit. If there's another way to get to 60 painlessly, I want to know.
That said, devs just don't shut something down if it's working as intended. There was something going on with the Tau Dewa patrols that was not intended, be it simple XP gain, dilithium gain, or rocketing through mastery/specialization tiers effortlessly. There was something wrong that needed dealt with. If it was really in line with everything else as you claim, every patrol would have been shut down and every patrol would see aggressive farming. But that clearly isn't happening.
OFC it was not working as intended for Cryptic, that part is already known, since they are responsible for closing the whole sector, it's not a bug.
What we are debating and wondering, is whether it was to stop the power leveling, or for something else. These patrols were in the game since a long time, and to my understanding, they were never changed, at least not recently.
So, it's either a long standing exploit, as in running for months, or to stop power leveling. No matter what, they are wrong. They either took months to correct an exploit that was important (at least enough to suddenly close an entire sector), or they don't want players to have fun the way they want, using tools the game provided to us since the beginning, in a way that was known to Cryptic.
Now, it could be to avoid people farming the upgrades, but they were not dropping that much, especially considering you had to share with your fellow teammates. Honestly, that would be overreacting.
That is simply not true, the Germans buy 100x more Zen than probably the rest of the world, and they love Star Trek, this game could be stick figures running around with the name "Star Trek" and they would buy Zen.
The Germans will not care if they have to run the same dumb story mission 1000 times to gain a bubble of XP, they will still buy Zen, and be happy to play.
..
They probably put some Germans in camps somewhere to buy ZEN, because you know they're all evil ZEN-buyers ...
... the real reason might be ... there's just a lot of Germans, compared to other countries, but that sounds to crazy to be true ...
Congrats you just played the racism card on Germans, you Sir win the Internet ...
Patch Notes : Resolved an Issue, where people would accidently experience Fun.
That is simply not true, the Germans buy 100x more Zen than probably the rest of the world, and they love Star Trek, this game could be stick figures running around with the name "Star Trek" and they would buy Zen.
The Germans will not care if they have to run the same dumb story mission 1000 times to gain a bubble of XP, they will still buy Zen, and be happy to play.
Cryptic would not shed a tear if the entire North American continent stopped playing.
..
your right i forget some time how desperate some ppl truly are to fly that starship
but i thought they love the hek out of star wars? :P
I prefer to wait for an explanation before forming a digital lynch mob.
Perhaps it'll turn out to be nothing, or something we haven't even considered.
... or maybe it's exactly what we are thinking and it became a total over-reaction by Cryptic.
The one thing about the forums is that with so many different ideas posted, odds are somebody is probably right.
:cool:
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
That is simply not true, the Germans buy 100x more Zen than probably the rest of the world, and they love Star Trek, this game could be stick figures running around with the name "Star Trek" and they would buy Zen.
The Germans will not care if they have to run the same dumb story mission 1000 times to gain a bubble of XP, they will still buy Zen, and be happy to play.
Cryptic would not shed a tear if the entire North American continent stopped playing.
..
You should see how bonkers the Germans get on the RSI forums when they don't get preferential treatment.
They could have just silently changed things this Thursday. Why the freak out to do it now? I guess they have calculations that it leads to a severe financial hit.
Still seems kinda...petty?
When i play mmos, especially F2P ones i tend to never expect sanity from the developers.
I prefer to wait for an explanation before forming a digital lynch mob.
Perhaps it'll turn out to be nothing, or something we haven't even considered.
I would agree with this if they did not post a non-sense response on an anonymous moderator account because no one wanted their name associated with this mess. Something is crooked in this situation that much seems to be clear.
Im quite tired of how this is going. So much things that need to be adressed ... people have come up with whole lists. But leveling on patrol missions is a negative thing all of a sudden?
Gaps inbetween storyline missions above 50 is something they thought of to force the player to rehash more content? Bugs since release still exist? The unbalanced advanced PvE content is still a problem? Its never possible to perfectly balance things in an MMO, but why does it have to be so min/max? 1st it was too easy, and now it takes forever to take down a cube with a PUG or fleet mates that just dont have Mk XIV epic? Sorry that might be for another topic.
So much id like to say and ask, i never speak up:
And what really is the real content of the new DR missions? Also a lot of patrolling and killing wave after wave? What the hell is the difference with for example Tau Dewa patrols?
I havent read all the pages in this thread because its simply to much ... But is the main reason they turned off the sector patrols only because people were leveling so quickly?
The game has never been perfect, but if people choose to grind patrol missions instead of doing PvE queues, battlezones, or PvE storyline (again and again with very little reward) isnt there something wrong with the content you give us in the first place?
It is working exactly as they intended, and the same as it has been for years. They don't like that DR's content is severely lacking and unfun and unplayable at times. so everybody avoids it. Then they go nuts to kill off all other gameplay to force you into DR. It just won't work. Folks can see through it and it makes people quit the game rather than be forced to play bad content.
Enlighten me on the Argala bit. If there's another way to get to 60 painlessly, I want to know.
That said, devs just don't shut something down if it's working as intended. There was something going on with the Tau Dewa patrols that was not intended, be it simple XP gain, dilithium gain, or rocketing through mastery/specialization tiers effortlessly. There was something wrong that needed dealt with. If it was really in line with everything else as you claim, every patrol would have been shut down and every patrol would see aggressive farming. But that clearly isn't happening.
The trick that is needed is a patrol that immediately goes into a fight. Many of them have dialog before combat, possibly multiple glowies (escort the space fishies/gekli). Many others have no combat at all (the tau dewa merchant trade round-robin).
There's not a lot of patrols that meet the requirements for a good farm.
Im quite tired of how this is going. So much things that need to be adressed ... people have come up with whole lists. But leveling on patrol missions is a negative thing all of a sudden?
Gaps inbetween storyline missions above 50 is something they thought of to force the player to rehash more content? Bugs since release still exist? The unbalanced advanced PvE content is still a problem? Its never possible to perfectly balance things in an MMO, but why does it have to be so min/max? 1st it was too easy, and now it takes forever to take down a cube with a PUG or fleet mates that just dont have Mk XIV epic? Sorry that might be for another topic.
So much id like to say and ask, i never speak up:
And what really is the real content of the new DR missions? Also a lot of patrolling and killing wave after wave? What the hell is the difference with for example Tau Dewa patrols?
I havent read all the pages in this thread because its simply to much ... But is the main reason they turned off the sector patrols only because people were leveling so quickly?
The game has never been perfect, but if people choose to grind patrol missions instead of doing PvE queues, battlezones, or PvE storyline (again and again with very little reward) isnt there something wrong with the content you give us in the first place?
What a bunch of fish smelling nonsense!
Its the free dil you get when your spec tree is maxed. Dil rewards were reduced in so many places in this patch. The blog post announcing free dil after maxing the tree is written as "if you ever managed to" implying they expected it to be rare. These patrols made it not so rare.
I'm quite sure this had to do with people ignoring DR...and why not.
There is no equipment tied to actually playing the content, it's all upgrades which can be crafted for crying out loud. No incentive there if the story is weak and the leveling slow...
There is no requirement for level advancement tied to the content, again no incentive if you don't appreciate the content you don't have to play it....
Except apparently you do....???
Cryptic YOU set up the system. This temper tantrum is your own fault, so quit calling people exploiters and shutting down sectors. Wipe your nose, put on your big boy pants and soldier on, because you will never and I mean NEVER control what people do. Most people find this out somewhere between the ages of 5 and 20.
Comments
but here is another problem...adding dil would take away from all the wonderful glorious cash they are making. They have been doing everything they can in this update to make dil harder to get, they would NEVER make it easier.
I thought Delta Rising was "the most successful update ever for Star Trek Online!", hence the celebration weekend and the Lobi giveaway.
To be fair, that could be either actual celebration or emergency PR control.
Enlighten me on the Argala bit. If there's another way to get to 60 painlessly, I want to know.
That said, devs just don't shut something down if it's working as intended. There was something going on with the Tau Dewa patrols that was not intended, be it simple XP gain, dilithium gain, or rocketing through mastery/specialization tiers effortlessly. There was something wrong that needed dealt with. If it was really in line with everything else as you claim, every patrol would have been shut down and every patrol would see aggressive farming. But that clearly isn't happening.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
WHOA forgot about that good spot there
my money is on the later
I'm sorry then...I guess it would look more official to you if they re-wrote the definition for a word every-time they used it.
Argala is considered one of the "easy" DR patrols (By DR standards). Before Japori was discovered, people were running Argala on Elite to cover XP gaps.
I'm sorry I was not the one claiming to be the "Exploit expert", while quoting Wiki Entries to contradict myself in the next sentence ... you might have missed that part ... shame on me, though ...
dammit I quoted the wrong one, i hate this forum, disregard.
I have 2 problems with Argala (but my fleet still does it):
1)The mobs take FOREVER to kill and it gets really boring
2)Craptic screwed it up so bad that there is no transfer with team, so every-time we start a new patrol we need to enter-leave-re-enter about 10 times before we all end up in the same instance.
It can be done but it should not be shoved down our throats by taking out japori. The only reason to do this is what I stated previously...so they can show their Chinese overlords the new content is being used by the player base and the investment was worth it.
So this is kind of what the players deserve. You let them get away with worse in the past, now you reap the "rewards" .
I'm totally not surprised by this. :rolleyes:
That is simply not true, the Germans buy 100x more Zen than probably the rest of the world, and they love Star Trek, this game could be stick figures running around with the name "Star Trek" and they would buy Zen.
The Germans will not care if they have to run the same dumb story mission 1000 times to gain a bubble of XP, they will still buy Zen, and be happy to play.
Cryptic would not shed a tear if the entire North American continent stopped playing.
..
Well someone is pouring zen into this game i doubt it's them and the one constant has always been the refining cap of 8000/day +1000 for vets.
as i mentioned earlier the voth battle zone is easy enough to run and hit that cap with its dailies in 30 mins.
My thoughts on the whole nerfing dil on certain queues and as naieve this may be is to actually get people to do the other queues and not just the borgs like we have all been doing
the queues should have been standardised rewards across the board from the outset and this is just fixing that but as i said i am probably being naieve here.
BUT... it only gives Dilithium ORE.
You can still only refine 8k a day.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
What we are debating and wondering, is whether it was to stop the power leveling, or for something else. These patrols were in the game since a long time, and to my understanding, they were never changed, at least not recently.
So, it's either a long standing exploit, as in running for months, or to stop power leveling. No matter what, they are wrong. They either took months to correct an exploit that was important (at least enough to suddenly close an entire sector), or they don't want players to have fun the way they want, using tools the game provided to us since the beginning, in a way that was known to Cryptic.
Now, it could be to avoid people farming the upgrades, but they were not dropping that much, especially considering you had to share with your fellow teammates. Honestly, that would be overreacting.
They probably put some Germans in camps somewhere to buy ZEN, because you know they're all evil ZEN-buyers ...
... the real reason might be ... there's just a lot of Germans, compared to other countries, but that sounds to crazy to be true ...
Congrats you just played the racism card on Germans, you Sir win the Internet ...
Perhaps it'll turn out to be nothing, or something we haven't even considered.
your right i forget some time how desperate some ppl truly are to fly that starship
but i thought they love the hek out of star wars? :P
system Lord Baal is dead
Nope I don't but I think Cryptic does now!
Zeus
I know and that's what makes this whole thing so utterly ridiculous. OK whether due to leveling or dil awarded past a maxed spec tree it's ridiculous.
... or maybe it's exactly what we are thinking and it became a total over-reaction by Cryptic.
The one thing about the forums is that with so many different ideas posted, odds are somebody is probably right.
:cool:
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
You should see how bonkers the Germans get on the RSI forums when they don't get preferential treatment.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
When i play mmos, especially F2P ones i tend to never expect sanity from the developers.
I would agree with this if they did not post a non-sense response on an anonymous moderator account because no one wanted their name associated with this mess. Something is crooked in this situation that much seems to be clear.
Im quite tired of how this is going. So much things that need to be adressed ... people have come up with whole lists. But leveling on patrol missions is a negative thing all of a sudden?
Gaps inbetween storyline missions above 50 is something they thought of to force the player to rehash more content? Bugs since release still exist? The unbalanced advanced PvE content is still a problem? Its never possible to perfectly balance things in an MMO, but why does it have to be so min/max? 1st it was too easy, and now it takes forever to take down a cube with a PUG or fleet mates that just dont have Mk XIV epic? Sorry that might be for another topic.
So much id like to say and ask, i never speak up:
And what really is the real content of the new DR missions? Also a lot of patrolling and killing wave after wave? What the hell is the difference with for example Tau Dewa patrols?
I havent read all the pages in this thread because its simply to much ... But is the main reason they turned off the sector patrols only because people were leveling so quickly?
The game has never been perfect, but if people choose to grind patrol missions instead of doing PvE queues, battlezones, or PvE storyline (again and again with very little reward) isnt there something wrong with the content you give us in the first place?
/endthread
The trick that is needed is a patrol that immediately goes into a fight. Many of them have dialog before combat, possibly multiple glowies (escort the space fishies/gekli). Many others have no combat at all (the tau dewa merchant trade round-robin).
There's not a lot of patrols that meet the requirements for a good farm.
Its the free dil you get when your spec tree is maxed. Dil rewards were reduced in so many places in this patch. The blog post announcing free dil after maxing the tree is written as "if you ever managed to" implying they expected it to be rare. These patrols made it not so rare.
There is no equipment tied to actually playing the content, it's all upgrades which can be crafted for crying out loud. No incentive there if the story is weak and the leveling slow...
There is no requirement for level advancement tied to the content, again no incentive if you don't appreciate the content you don't have to play it....
Except apparently you do....???
Cryptic YOU set up the system. This temper tantrum is your own fault, so quit calling people exploiters and shutting down sectors. Wipe your nose, put on your big boy pants and soldier on, because you will never and I mean NEVER control what people do. Most people find this out somewhere between the ages of 5 and 20.