The tension that you feel when you may be attacked at any moment engenders a fundamentally different game experience. I think that would be too radical a change for STO.
Perhaps you're right. Yet, I think one of the coolest things I've seen in STO was Klingons invading ESD, and players got banned for it.
Even if you happen to get ganked what's the worst that could happen? A bruised ego.
Ganking actually encourages players to be more social. Getting ganked? Get help from your friends, fleetmates, or random members of your faction in the area.
This game is basically warfare being fought on multiple fronts, yet the war is always fought on your terms. I can't remember the last time my ship was destroyed outside of PVP.
War is tension and fear wrapped in carnage.
Sure this is a complicated subject but I think having more pvp a part of the average players experience would be step in the right direction. Maybe an episode line that includes pvp?
c. protect the paying customer who doesn't want to pvp
If you going to sell a pvp update it has to be tied into a dil/zen/cash hook in a major way like crafting.
I wouldn't mind babysitting pvp'ers if I got paid to be their gameplay but how is cryptic going to profit from that.
Doing a pvp reputation is like pissing your pants, we learned that from the queue so what do you do to make people spend zen/dil/cash on pvp?
Protecting people is way easier could be as simple as pvp and pve instances.
/edit.
To me the major problem with pvp is it wastes my time away from earning.
Like if I had to try to get through the already torturing story mission with a pack of bored pvp'ers on me keeping me from leveling up, I can't imagne a much more painful experience just wasting my time so others can be entertained for my dime and money ugh.
Key word is...optional. It would have to be, it's just not that type of game to be having open PVP in at all.
Territorial control in a separate sector of space and you would receive a warning prior to entering that you're entering a PVP sector, are you sure you wish to enter? Although that idea wasn't all that popular.
PVP needs serious fixing in other areas before this would even be considered.
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
Or, perhaps, maybe an instant challenge, where one player can challenge another and both are instantly switched to a pvp map (no opt-out).
The problem with this one, as the game stands now, is that the "Challenge" button is underneath the "Look up Player Info" one. I've had a challenge given several times by accident by people who were trying to look up more about my character.
So at the very least, this idea would get Cryptic to change that part of the UI around.
This game just feels wayy too safe. There needs to be a pucker factor here somewhere.
"Oh TRIBBLE I'm going through Eta Eridani...I better keep my eyes open"
As far as those that complain that it would be annoying to die....all you have to do is push a button and there you are. No consequences as per usual.
All the episodes with Kirk and Picard entering the neutral zone...there is none of that here and there should be.
This people is the WORST idea in the history of bad ideas, especially the way this game is structured. This is also complicated by the simple notion that Cryptic wishes to make money from this F2P game, and not scare away noobs or frustrate the veterans in the crowd.
It is also complicated by the fact that Power Creeps has been introduced 100 fold since the game went F2P, and will require reprogramming the entire game.
NOT
Not going to happen, as they claim they don't have enough money to buy coffee cups. :rolleyes:
I actually liked BSGO, but it didn't have any story, so I left. I never played EVE, but that's a P2P game, so peeps know what they're in for. The whole pirating factor of it.
STO is a F2P (P2W, if you want to put it that way) game.
A completely open PvP system wouldn't work b/c it would discourage new players. They need to level up in order to get somewhere.
I would say it could be plausable if it was based on the way that diplomat or marauding scales, based upon level. If you're level A, you cannot be attacked in a level B sector. I hope that makes sense. I just woke up.
Nice non-answer. Eve is an entirely different game with an entirely different experience. It's often referred to as "spreadsheets online" for a reason. No one suggested that STO be 100% open-world PVP, but the way people are posting in this thread, they're already quivering at the thought of their super serious trophy lockbox ships exploding for a few seconds before pressing "respawn" to absolutely zero penalties as a result of "dying."
This game, quite frankly, is too safe. Kerrat isn't sufficient. Will ganking happen? Yeah, probably, but the way people moan and cry about disco balls shows that most of you will cry at just about anything you don't like in the game. Just got back from reading a "Champions is getting a larger update!" thread, and basically lol. If there are certain sectors with pvp enabled, then lowbies have the option of "not going there," which sounds like a pretty fair option to me.
There should be more contested zones/areas, like Eti Eridani, where open PVP can happen. I've always liked the **** pvp model (edit: you know the popular three-realm pvp mmo) because if people want to play space barbies, they can just crouch in the forests of Albion all day while others partake in pvp. It's not an open world pvp system, but it is better than the one we have, and it has the potential to give the game a little element of danger people want.
Actually, that is exactly what the OP is suggesting.
So what, STO is too safe... there are plenty of game out there that can give you the 'thrill' you want.
Again, go play one of those, stop suggesting that STO should become something it's not.
:cool:
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
If you want open world pvp, then travel around the different sectors, click on a ship passing by that looks interesting and ask for a challenge match. If they accept, there's your open world pvp with an opt out.
The open world pvp games I have tried (eve and wow) have just ended up being "Bullies Online". It's frustrating trying to level up in such a game.
If you want a pve challenge, use a tier one ship in an elite STF or one of the more difficult episode missions or go to Kerrat.
Completely agree with OP. I would love to see large sectors of space where anything might happen. I LOVE the "Elite Dangerous" game type concept. Wishing it could applied to a Star Trek game. Easy for people who don't want PvP just don't venture there. Would make the game way more enjoyable. Same old STF's over and over and over again does get OLD.
This people is the WORST idea in the history of bad ideas, especially the way this game is structured. This is also complicated by the simple notion that Cryptic wishes to make money from this F2P game, and not scare away noobs or frustrate the veterans in the crowd.
It is also complicated by the fact that Power Creeps has been introduced 100 fold since the game went F2P, and will require reprogramming the entire game.
NOT
Not going to happen, as they claim they don't have enough money to buy coffee cups. :rolleyes:
Several things need to be corrected here.
1. You think Cryptic makes money based on how easy the game is? There is probably a very constant bleeding off of players because there is a lack of challenge. Just no argument there.
2. Power creep hardly requires a reprogramming of the entire game....how about defense x3? thats a whole entire line of code.
3. Perfect World Entertainment earned 3.1 BILLION dollars in revenue last year. There is plenty of coffee cups to go around.
I think a very doable idea is to make huge PvEvP sectors where random battles between NPC ships races and fleets would occur. You be notified of a current battle going on, you could then join the battle choosing your side you might want to fight for. Make it huge open space instance where it always varies who's fighting who and and who's actually winning. Then who ever wins the epic battle makes gains in that sector for dilithum mining or something, until the opposing force makes ground back. This could work and would add years and fun to this game with this game engine.
I personally would quit if it were not flag based (choose to allow others to attack you or not). This is mmo pvp, so gear > skill until 2 builds are roughly equal. And the majority of players are nowhere near the top gear. So a handful of players would grief everyone else out of the game in short order.
I personally would quit if it were not flag based (choose to allow others to attack you or not). This is mmo pvp, so gear > skill until 2 builds are roughly equal. And the majority of players are nowhere near the top gear. So a handful of players would grief everyone else out of the game in short order.
I think they should let all ranks and classes fly in the zone but make the zone so large it someone wanted to pick on you it be a matter of chance they found you, and also make the huge zones full of vavuable stuff that makes the risk of going there worth it.
It would make this game WAY less dull I think IMHO.
Currently there is no way of having combat at all in sector space. In order to do this, they would have to create a way to have combat take place in sector space which is all warp speed.
Currently there is no way of having combat at all in sector space. In order to do this, they would have to create a way to have combat take place in sector space which is all warp speed.
I think it would be easy enough to drop you out of warp speed (and sector space) into a challenge map just for the purpose.
I'd see this as working, more or less, like the current challenge system does......except you can opt in to voluntarily not be able to opt out of them.
I have not bothered reading all of the 9 pages worth of post, but here is my opinion and I am sure I am parroting what others have already stated...
It is an interesting idea. However, from a practicality point of view it is not worth implementing unless there is an option to opt out of open world PvP.
It is a known fact that PvP does not play a huge role in STO. Therefore, it seems that most people including myself simply want to play STO so that can go about their business and do whatever they plan on doing given the amount of time they can devote to the game.
Forcing people to into PvP whether they like it or not is a very good way to decrease the player population and probably infuriate the players who purchased the LTS with no intention playing PvP. If players cannot opt out of "open world PvP", then getting attacked in sector space will be viewed as form of harassment since those players will be forced into situations that they do not want a part of.
The logicial outcome of being harassed in a game means that players will not longer find the game fun to play. The obvious conclusion would be that players will simply stop playing STO if they cannot avoid being harassed by PvP'ers (the minority of players). If this goes on long enough, the player population would likely fall off the cliff.
While PvP'ers will be having fun in an "open world PvP" STO, they will also likely have sealed the fate of STO because fewer players means less potential revenue and the possibility of not generating enough revenue to cover expenses. If STO cannot generate an acceptable level of revenue for PWE, guess what will happen...
Then you don't agree with the OP. He wants no opt out and ALL zones to be pvp...hence open pvp. A pvp zone I am okay with.
Amazing how people cannot do basic reading comprehension eh?
Again, to everybody who wants open world PVP, Eve and Battlestar Galactica Online are ->
Then come back and tell us how that epic open world PvP was for ya. Been there, done that did not enjoy it all that much. If this went to straight open world PvP no safe zones, I'd quit literally instantly.
Reason I like STO, I don't have to worry about PvP. I want to go PvP these days, I'll go play War thunder or World of Tanks.
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
nobody said everything ingame has to be constrained by whatever narrow RP somebody wants to play.
Its not role playing its the game's actual storyline. PVP even acknowledges the war is over, or did you noticed that Klingon can team with feds in PVP and their all described as wargames now.
In WoW they had servers dedicated to open world PvP in addition to 'safe' PvE servers, not that we're likely to see a whole bunch of servers anytime soon.
Yes because in addition to the question of fragmenting the population across a number of different servers to accommodate a small handful of uncomfortably lax bottoms this isn't at all an intelligent move, most of all because that is not the game STO is trying to be.
You could just as easily ask that Cryptic replace all ground combat with conventional FPS mechanics because as it is STO lacks those. Or perhaps they could add in a relationship system with BOFFS because STO just isn't scratching that same itch that the SIMS [or worse] may have done for you once (not making an inference just presenting a point). They could even add card-based mnigame for DOFF based boarding action because as it is STO isn't doing anything for MTG or Hearthstone fans.
The point is that STO could do a lot to try to satisfy niches it presently doesn't but in no meaningful way would that be good for the game because in each of those cases you have a group of people who have been left out because of STO's intended format. It's not trying to be the home of well developed PvP combat (its there but its more or less there just to provide a basic service) because there are so many other things which it IS trying to accomplish (customization, narratives, grinding, a Star Trek setting, ect.) Those deserve developer attention with new elements being brought in to support those key, established aspects. Where people can go for random PvP engagements is simply elsewhere (its the easiest, more economical option and certainly the one with the least potential to completely break the game.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
As I believe in many topics in life the answer is balance.
I don't believe you should be open to attack no matter where you are, but I also don't think you should be able to completely go about your business with no worry of it ever happening.
As someone said earlier the game is 99% PVE. Well that's not balance.
There are a lot of options to make the game more challenging and more pvp friendly that wouldn't require a lot of re-coding.
The exploration system could be reworked to be pvp zones, or the next episode line could be based on pvp. There's been numerous idea's put forth in this thread that are worth entertaining.
I just want the game to feel more alive and dynamic...when the vast majority of players just do their daily grind with nothing unexpected happening...it's not good.
Are we still debating this? I feel like I've walked into a gathering of Pakleds. Who need things. Things to make them go.
There's a case to be made for having more zones like Ker'rat, or improving that overall experience. But open-world PVP comes with too many problems, particularly since, thematically, this is a Star Trek game and Starfleet captains do not generally go around attacking each other.
Keep the ice cream in the ice cream section instead of selling it everywhere in the store.
The artist formerly known as PlanetofHats.
Actual join date: Open beta, 2009ish.
Nice non-answer. Eve is an entirely different game with an entirely different experience.
I don't get it. Are you the only one allowed to use non-answer, and tell players to move onto another game ?
Also, changing STO into open pvp would entirely change the game, by affecting it's core gameplay. A change it seems you want because you don't want to move onto another game already offering this kind of gameplay (I was talking Eve as example, but there are dozens of options around, planetside 2, darkfall, age of conan on pvp server....).
Its not role playing its the game's actual storyline. PVP even acknowledges the war is over, or did you noticed that Klingon can team with feds in PVP and their all described as wargames now.
Queued events are out-of-roleplay. They are IDIC instances. You dont really think you're killing Donatra every time over and over again
In-game maps are the only in-rp content and that is Ker'rat
Comments
Perhaps you're right. Yet, I think one of the coolest things I've seen in STO was Klingons invading ESD, and players got banned for it.
Even if you happen to get ganked what's the worst that could happen? A bruised ego.
Ganking actually encourages players to be more social. Getting ganked? Get help from your friends, fleetmates, or random members of your faction in the area.
This game is basically warfare being fought on multiple fronts, yet the war is always fought on your terms. I can't remember the last time my ship was destroyed outside of PVP.
War is tension and fear wrapped in carnage.
Sure this is a complicated subject but I think having more pvp a part of the average players experience would be step in the right direction. Maybe an episode line that includes pvp?
Anyway the 3 major things are:
a. how can they profit from it
b. how can they profit from it
c. protect the paying customer who doesn't want to pvp
If you going to sell a pvp update it has to be tied into a dil/zen/cash hook in a major way like crafting.
I wouldn't mind babysitting pvp'ers if I got paid to be their gameplay but how is cryptic going to profit from that.
Doing a pvp reputation is like pissing your pants, we learned that from the queue so what do you do to make people spend zen/dil/cash on pvp?
Protecting people is way easier could be as simple as pvp and pve instances.
/edit.
To me the major problem with pvp is it wastes my time away from earning.
Like if I had to try to get through the already torturing story mission with a pack of bored pvp'ers on me keeping me from leveling up, I can't imagne a much more painful experience just wasting my time so others can be entertained for my dime and money ugh.
Territorial control in a separate sector of space and you would receive a warning prior to entering that you're entering a PVP sector, are you sure you wish to enter? Although that idea wasn't all that popular.
PVP needs serious fixing in other areas before this would even be considered.
Firstly, the opt out.
I've suggested before this could be done as a difficulty level.
The advantage of that, is that difficulty levels can be changed at will.
You usually pvp but you just want to do some dilithium mining?
Change the difficulty and change it back when you're done.
Secondly there'd need to be someway to avoid VAs ganking new toons.
Simply restrict the challenge to within a few levels of your toon and done.
The problem with this one, as the game stands now, is that the "Challenge" button is underneath the "Look up Player Info" one. I've had a challenge given several times by accident by people who were trying to look up more about my character.
So at the very least, this idea would get Cryptic to change that part of the UI around.
This people is the WORST idea in the history of bad ideas, especially the way this game is structured. This is also complicated by the simple notion that Cryptic wishes to make money from this F2P game, and not scare away noobs or frustrate the veterans in the crowd.
It is also complicated by the fact that Power Creeps has been introduced 100 fold since the game went F2P, and will require reprogramming the entire game.
NOT
Not going to happen, as they claim they don't have enough money to buy coffee cups. :rolleyes:
STO is a F2P (P2W, if you want to put it that way) game.
A completely open PvP system wouldn't work b/c it would discourage new players. They need to level up in order to get somewhere.
I would say it could be plausable if it was based on the way that diplomat or marauding scales, based upon level. If you're level A, you cannot be attacked in a level B sector. I hope that makes sense. I just woke up.
Actually, that is exactly what the OP is suggesting.
So what, STO is too safe... there are plenty of game out there that can give you the 'thrill' you want.
Again, go play one of those, stop suggesting that STO should become something it's not.
:cool:
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
The open world pvp games I have tried (eve and wow) have just ended up being "Bullies Online". It's frustrating trying to level up in such a game.
If you want a pve challenge, use a tier one ship in an elite STF or one of the more difficult episode missions or go to Kerrat.
Well, they do go.
Several things need to be corrected here.
1. You think Cryptic makes money based on how easy the game is? There is probably a very constant bleeding off of players because there is a lack of challenge. Just no argument there.
2. Power creep hardly requires a reprogramming of the entire game....how about defense x3? thats a whole entire line of code.
3. Perfect World Entertainment earned 3.1 BILLION dollars in revenue last year. There is plenty of coffee cups to go around.
What REALY needs to happen, is STO 2.
I think they should let all ranks and classes fly in the zone but make the zone so large it someone wanted to pick on you it be a matter of chance they found you, and also make the huge zones full of vavuable stuff that makes the risk of going there worth it.
It would make this game WAY less dull I think IMHO.
I think it would be easy enough to drop you out of warp speed (and sector space) into a challenge map just for the purpose.
I'd see this as working, more or less, like the current challenge system does......except you can opt in to voluntarily not be able to opt out of them.
It is an interesting idea. However, from a practicality point of view it is not worth implementing unless there is an option to opt out of open world PvP.
It is a known fact that PvP does not play a huge role in STO. Therefore, it seems that most people including myself simply want to play STO so that can go about their business and do whatever they plan on doing given the amount of time they can devote to the game.
Forcing people to into PvP whether they like it or not is a very good way to decrease the player population and probably infuriate the players who purchased the LTS with no intention playing PvP. If players cannot opt out of "open world PvP", then getting attacked in sector space will be viewed as form of harassment since those players will be forced into situations that they do not want a part of.
The logicial outcome of being harassed in a game means that players will not longer find the game fun to play. The obvious conclusion would be that players will simply stop playing STO if they cannot avoid being harassed by PvP'ers (the minority of players). If this goes on long enough, the player population would likely fall off the cliff.
While PvP'ers will be having fun in an "open world PvP" STO, they will also likely have sealed the fate of STO because fewer players means less potential revenue and the possibility of not generating enough revenue to cover expenses. If STO cannot generate an acceptable level of revenue for PWE, guess what will happen...
Amazing how people cannot do basic reading comprehension eh?
Again, to everybody who wants open world PVP, Eve and Battlestar Galactica Online are ->
Then come back and tell us how that epic open world PvP was for ya. Been there, done that did not enjoy it all that much. If this went to straight open world PvP no safe zones, I'd quit literally instantly.
Reason I like STO, I don't have to worry about PvP. I want to go PvP these days, I'll go play War thunder or World of Tanks.
Star Trek Battles member. Want to roll with a good group of people regardless of fleets and not have to worry about DPS while doing STFs? Come join the channel and join in the fun!
http://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1145998/star-trek-battles-channel-got-canon/p1
Its not role playing its the game's actual storyline. PVP even acknowledges the war is over, or did you noticed that Klingon can team with feds in PVP and their all described as wargames now.
Yes because in addition to the question of fragmenting the population across a number of different servers to accommodate a small handful of uncomfortably lax bottoms this isn't at all an intelligent move, most of all because that is not the game STO is trying to be.
You could just as easily ask that Cryptic replace all ground combat with conventional FPS mechanics because as it is STO lacks those. Or perhaps they could add in a relationship system with BOFFS because STO just isn't scratching that same itch that the SIMS [or worse] may have done for you once (not making an inference just presenting a point). They could even add card-based mnigame for DOFF based boarding action because as it is STO isn't doing anything for MTG or Hearthstone fans.
The point is that STO could do a lot to try to satisfy niches it presently doesn't but in no meaningful way would that be good for the game because in each of those cases you have a group of people who have been left out because of STO's intended format. It's not trying to be the home of well developed PvP combat (its there but its more or less there just to provide a basic service) because there are so many other things which it IS trying to accomplish (customization, narratives, grinding, a Star Trek setting, ect.) Those deserve developer attention with new elements being brought in to support those key, established aspects. Where people can go for random PvP engagements is simply elsewhere (its the easiest, more economical option and certainly the one with the least potential to completely break the game.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
I don't believe you should be open to attack no matter where you are, but I also don't think you should be able to completely go about your business with no worry of it ever happening.
As someone said earlier the game is 99% PVE. Well that's not balance.
There are a lot of options to make the game more challenging and more pvp friendly that wouldn't require a lot of re-coding.
The exploration system could be reworked to be pvp zones, or the next episode line could be based on pvp. There's been numerous idea's put forth in this thread that are worth entertaining.
I just want the game to feel more alive and dynamic...when the vast majority of players just do their daily grind with nothing unexpected happening...it's not good.
There's a case to be made for having more zones like Ker'rat, or improving that overall experience. But open-world PVP comes with too many problems, particularly since, thematically, this is a Star Trek game and Starfleet captains do not generally go around attacking each other.
Keep the ice cream in the ice cream section instead of selling it everywhere in the store.
Actual join date: Open beta, 2009ish.
Also, changing STO into open pvp would entirely change the game, by affecting it's core gameplay. A change it seems you want because you don't want to move onto another game already offering this kind of gameplay (I was talking Eve as example, but there are dozens of options around, planetside 2, darkfall, age of conan on pvp server....).
In-game maps are the only in-rp content and that is Ker'rat