But that would mean that the Ambassador, Guardian and Eclipse are not good anymore as well because they (2 of the T&) have only 3 Tac slots. Ony the Assault cruiser or Advanced heavy Cruiser have 4 Tac consoles ( and that ugly Brick they call Avenger. I´d rather fly into the sun than to captain that Battlecruiser)
But on all the STFs i did till now i always came out first or second.
It is all about the Style. THose ships with 3 Tac consoles usually have bette Sci or Eng Boff slots so you should take advantage of that. Even Grav. Well I is useful to distract enemies
I have to ask: Did you upgrade your Weapons and consoles to Mk XIII or XIV? Do you use Fleet weapons and NOT Phasers
guardian and eclipse can use intel powers. overload subsystem safeties averages out to like another copy of APA, with a 20 second up time and 30 second down time. ionic turbulence not only is a sick disable in an AOE you cast on someone like scramble sensors, but anyone inside it is debuffed like another copy of APB is on them, that you can only clear by escaping the cloud. EMP probe doubles down on the disable, but only goes to were the target was, best to be released point blank. any npc group controlled by GW or something, with a combination of all these 3 skills stacked against them, is going to die twice as fast, and also not even get a shot off, so being able to tank is even lower a priority when the npcs can't shoot.
im not even sure the scimitar can compete with the intel cruisers. and not only those skills, but there is also 1 more called surgical strike, that effects both beams and cannons, that if your looking for single target damage, can basically replace any other weapons skill for that. fit those 4 things on your ship in pvp, and you REALLY feel like someone who payed $125 more then your opponent. assuming you bought the whole pack, and not just a ship.
thats why the galaxy R getting something like an LTC inlet hybrid eng seat would sudenly make it an amazing ship
I have the Gal-R and FGal-X. I really want to get the Fleet Gal and make it T5U. (I'm amazed that the upgrade adds a Tactical slot. Like other have said what would really improve the Gal-R is improving the BOff slots.) Of all of them, I fly the Gal-R most of the time.
Cryptic said that we will be able to use the T5U ships in T6 content, they didn't say at what content difficulty levels.
Right now it seems that they are only usable on Normal content unless take a ship with cannons on it. Right now Normal is too easy and Advanced is still insane.
I am really hoping that the T5U ships can be played in Advanced content at least, otherwise the game is not going to be nearly as fun anymore.
Star Trek Battles Channel - Play Star Trek like they did in the series!Avatar: pinterest-com/pin/14003448816884219Are you sure it isn't time for a "colorful metaphor"? --Spock in 'The Voyage Home' SCE ADVISORY NOTICE: Improper Impulse Engine maintenance can result in REAR THRUSTER LEAKAGE. ALWAYS have your work inspected by another qualified officer.
AS long as Cryptic keeps focussing on DPS and making the other abilities rather useless there will be no perfect cruiser. But the Gal-R is a perfect cruiser. For all of those who are not trying to fly a cruiserl like an escort it is perfect. I would buy the Odyssex instead but its just no beauty. Maybe the Galaxy is a whale but the Odyssey is a Humpback whale.
AS long as Cryptic keeps focussing on DPS and making the other abilities rather useless there will be no perfect cruiser. But the Gal-R is a perfect cruiser. For all of those who are not trying to fly a cruiserl like an escort it is perfect. I would buy the Odyssex instead but its just no beauty. Maybe the Galaxy is a whale but the Odyssey is a Humpback whale.
There is no "perfect cruiser" but more ships have come closer to it than the Galaxy-class variants.
Sticking to Fed Cruisers alone, no lockbox, no lobi ships, any of these are a superior choice to the Galaxy-class variants as Cruisers.
The key to the listed ships is that they have more than enough ENG capability to take the punishment the game throws at you, punishment that Escorts & Raiders may have trouble taking. Yet they still have capable Tactical capability through 3-4 TAC Console Slots, and either of the TAC BOFF layouts:
LtCDr, LtCdr/Lt, LtCdr/Ens
The Guardian is a crazy capable traditional Cruiser that can do it all. It has heavy ENG seating but still has LtCdr TAC *and* SCI stations.
The Eclipse is deceivingly offensive capable due to the 2 Hybrid Intel BOFF Seats.
That's what you're not realizing. The Galaxy-class variants (I'm lumping the Gal-X in also, just to be sure) put too much emphasis on ENG in a game that does not need it. "Trinity" does not exist in STO. There is no need for a "Tank." You can put 10 TAC Console Slots on the Galaxy-class. If so, I'd say it's a total waste simply due to the awful BOFF layout of the Galaxy. All those console slots would be wasted on a ship with pitifully low Tactical capability.
Hell, even the Gal-X? You could do the job of the Gal-X with the Lv40 Assault Cruiser. Only thing it doesn't have is the Phaser Lance.
The key to the listed ships is that they have more than enough ENG capability to take the punishment the game throws at you, punishment that Escorts & Raiders may have trouble taking. Yet they still have capable Tactical capability through 3-4 TAC Console Slots, and either of the TAC BOFF layouts:
LtCDr, LtCdr/Lt, LtCdr/Ens
The Guardian is a crazy capable traditional Cruiser that can do it all. It has heavy ENG seating but still has LtCdr TAC *and* SCI stations.
The Eclipse is deceivingly offensive capable due to the 2 Hybrid Intel BOFF Seats.
That's what you're not realizing. The Galaxy-class variants (I'm lumping the Gal-X in also, just to be sure) put too much emphasis on ENG in a game that does not need it. "Trinity" does not exist in STO. There is no need for a "Tank." You can put 10 TAC Console Slots on the Galaxy-class. If so, I'd say it's a total waste simply due to the awful BOFF layout of the Galaxy. All those console slots would be wasted on a ship with pitifully low Tactical capability.
Hell, even the Gal-X? You could do the job of the Gal-X with the Lv40 Assault Cruiser. Only thing it doesn't have is the Phaser Lance.
I'd add the Fleet Ambassador to your list - before DR, she was my perfect Cruiser. Spot on balance of tank, utility and firepower: by going the crit route (with three SROs) she comfortably outshot any other Fed broadside Cruiser, though the Galaxy Dread was the best against the likes of SB234. I'm still exploring but I'm finding that the Galaxy Dread is the best of the FT5-U Fed Cruisers. Avenger isn't included in the above, since I'm talking about the broadside boats.
And re a comment further up: I don't use Phasers on the Gal Dread: IME it's better to focus on using the best damage type for the broadside you'll be using all the time (Polaron IMO), than to compromise all that for the weapon that you only get to fire every couple of minutes (and even then it may be better to keep broadsiding than turn to fire the Lance and then turn back to the broadside).
I still can partake in STFs with the Gal, but the solo performance on SB 234 really devestated my ego a bit...
Aye, I know exactly what you mean mate. Before DR, about the only thing left in the game I enjoyed was tweaking builds and testing them at Carraya and SB234. Now they've bollixed that up too, natch, so the only thing left I like now is....
.........
.........
.........
Anyway, I had a similar, 'WTF?! Have I just got really TRIBBLE all of a sudden?!!' about SB234, but I wouldn't let it get to you/me, bearing in mind a few things.
I used to be able to clear SB234 with ~2:24 left on the clock with my Fleet Ambassador, and ~2:31 left with my Fleet Galaxy Dread. With DR, I did the U thing, expecting that the extra console slot would improve my time, but even with the extra slots, my time (on Normal) got worse by 10-20 secs. Only my Eclipse [what a ship!!!] could match my old times, though was still a few secs slower than my Ambassador had been (~2:22 left).
Little did I know that all of a sudden I was engaging in exploitative behaviour.:rolleyes: Then they closed Tau Dewa down. When it came back, they scaled difficulty with level, in their usual, never-ending amateur hour way.
So I was level 57, tried out SB234 (on Normal) after the patch, and it was about 75/25 whether I could defeat the SB before time-out, using my usual build. Still changing nothing, except adding the stuff that should make me a bit better that comes with levelling up, I ran it a few times at level 58 and it was ~50/50 whether I could defeat the SB before time-out. With my Eclipse: It was flat-out impossible with my Gal Dread U - my previous best performer.
At level 59 today, I ran it again a few times (still on normal) and my Eclipse just about squeaked taking out the SB the very split-second I timed-out once, and failed all of the other attempts (with the SB still having ~16% HP left).
So yeah, unless you upgrade your gear [which I haven't and probably won't, since I'm feeling coerced to do so]; the better you get, the more likely you are to fail SB234: So I wouldn't be too hard on yerself.:cool:
PS, I find life's little ironies to be amongst its most redeeming features. A while ago, I took my Galaxy (not Dread) out for her regular spin and tweak - and she was awesome! Turned out that it was during that period when some consoles and stuff got their uber-stats, due to a Geko error. I'm sure that he'd hate the fact that for a brief time he'd unwittingly made that ship he dislikes so much so fantastic and a joy to fly... heheheh....:)
So since i have the Guardian and Eclipse i can agree that both are incredibly strong. Especially with the ships mastership skills (i have made it to 4 in both)
And i also enjoy switching to my Regent, ma Excelsior and my Ambassador.
So i have many altenatives to the Galaxy.
But is there really no way to make the Galaxy useful for Easy STFs and Missions? With Tac Team and BO?
So since i have the Guardian and Eclipse i can agree that both are incredibly strong. Especially with the ships mastership skills (i have made it to 4 in both)
And i also enjoy switching to my Regent, ma Excelsior and my Ambassador.
So i have many altenatives to the Galaxy.
But is there really no way to make the Galaxy useful for Easy STFs and Missions? With Tac Team and BO?
Of course you can make it useful for easy (Normal Difficulty) STFs. The problem is that those are so easy you could complete them in a T3 ship and they don't reward you, at all. Normal STFs are unfortunately a complete waste of time since they don't even award the currency to buy rep gear. Yes, that ironically means that you can't even run normal STF to get better and take on advanced at one point. Classic Cryptic
The Galaxy can "shine" with FAW 1 / APB 1 as a aggro-magnet and team support, BO1 / APD1 as a single target tank or you can even go crazy with BO1 / BO 2 and land some devestating crits. You can make the ship work and have fun, but the overall changes to gameplay at this point clearly put the ship as a disadvantage. Before I could argue, say "make the ship you love work, because it works!" but now, with the changes that came with DR, it really doesn't work, technically.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
If other ships with lances are better shouldn't the X lance at least match those or is it a t6 thing?
Cryptic has done as little as possible with the Galaxy ships and wiped with hands clean of it. Don't expect anything else. Although I think it's amazing that we get another Tactical console slot when upgrading the Gal-R to T5U, I guess you can't go past 5 console slots.
Star Trek Battles Channel - Play Star Trek like they did in the series!Avatar: pinterest-com/pin/14003448816884219Are you sure it isn't time for a "colorful metaphor"? --Spock in 'The Voyage Home' SCE ADVISORY NOTICE: Improper Impulse Engine maintenance can result in REAR THRUSTER LEAKAGE. ALWAYS have your work inspected by another qualified officer.
i have not even set foot in my gal (x and r) sense DR hit. the week before DR hit i went through every story mission with the gal-r up to voadly they road then switched to the x (RP reasons) as a final cruise as i knew it was not going to be up to par post DR with the intel boff powers we could read on tribble and how little the T5U gal-r was improved compared to other ships i had
I am willing to learn and improve if anyone knows a trick or two.
Considered Aux2Batt?
Without it, a Galaxy flown to the actual ships limit will struggle to be ASTF capable on DPS, but with it you can at least drag it up to having some breathing room.
The lance on the face hugger Guramba ship is also superior to the Galaxy-X. It's such a shame one of the 2 most identified ships with the Star Trek franchise is so poorly represented in this game and the poor old Galaxy standard version is trumped by ships 50-70 years older than her.
I bet if the Constitution did ever get the green light on being made end game even she would be made better than the Galaxy.
At present that single lt. Tact slot and heavy eng focus has made using this ship even less desirable in Elite content than before.
Galaxy-X with that uni ensign allowing 3 tact powers still allows her to be competitive.
Without it, a Galaxy flown to the actual ships limit will struggle to be ASTF capable on DPS, but with it you can at least drag it up to having some breathing room.
a2b is not even magical enough to compensate for only have a single LTtac slot in post DR
a2b is not even magical enough to compensate for only have a single LTtac slot in post DR
I'd have to agree.
In PvE this ship falls way behind everyone else.
In PvP, LOL. T5-U ships are already at a disadvantage, the Gal-R wouldn't stand a chance.
Leave it to flippin' Cryptic to give the Gal-R 3 tac slots... the exact moment it becomes worthless no matter what build we try to run on it.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
I know right finally the ship gets that 3rd tact console. DR hits and how do they make the game harder. I know we will put up a huge wall of NPC Hull and Shield HP's. Making that 3rd console as useful as that 5th eng console as the boff layout is poor.
Its almost "cough cough" like Cryptic are exploiting the fact its a Galaxy, the Ent D and Star Trek fans want to fly this ship, they charge RL money for it and then put out free of charge ships as either event ships, or same tier ships that out perform it.
Right now the T5U Galaxy, Nebula, Intrepid and Defiant all really need a overhaul. and its not a big one or game breaking either.
Galaxy needs the same boff layout as the X 1 simple ens station made uni. (This would make a huge difference to the ship. yes 1 lowly ens station changed to allow tact, it would make a massive difference)
Nebula needs a 3rd tact console not a crappy 5th science console, she has a decent boff layout, but not the right console support to take advantage (Poor stacking of science consoles and Tykrens rift and Gravity well are hard capped between 1000-1100 dps i think so stacking 5 gravity gens is like stacking 5 RCS consoles the other 3 are useless)
Intrepid 3 tact consoles but again like the Galaxy handicapped by a poor boff layout.
Defiant the best of the bunch because it can hit hard and make npc hull move in the right direction, and thats down. However she was a fairly tough ship in DS9 and that solo ens tact station should be made engineering
So no major changes to these ships just minor tweaks that would make them better than what they are so they are viable ships to use in PvE queues without feeling disadvantaged by using them.
Yes there are other ships to use, which do the jobs better in fact every other end game ship does do the job better. But i want to play these end game ships as thats what they are just like the alternative ships Cryptic offer,
So the Galaxy, Intrepid, Nebula, should all be just as capable of completing the same end game content, without feeling like playing advanced content despite queuing for normal difficulty
Nebula needs a 3rd tact console not a crappy 5th science console, she has a decent boff layout, but not the right console support to take advantage (Poor stacking of science consoles and Tykrens rift and Gravity well are hard capped between 1000-1100 dps i think so stacking 5 gravity gens is like stacking 5 RCS consoles the other 3 are useless)
Intrepid 3 tact consoles but again like the Galaxy handicapped by a poor boff layout.
(...)
I like to disagree here. Five sci consoles are awesome, especially with the lvl 15 sci trait that grants bonus criticals for exotic damage every 100 points in particle gens. I redesigned my Nebula into a tractor beam towship and it is deadly and very fun, and hardy enough to survive close encounters. Is it the best in game? No, certainly not and I don't have numbers, I can only say that it works, I score first places in many pugs (that didn't happen before), and it feels useful. If only 5 eng consoles could be used in a similiar manner.
In fact, sciboats are the only class that doesn't really need tac consoles at all as the weapons only provide proc functionality or minor fire support. The trend of Cryptic too just make all new scis into sciscorts should not blind you towars the potential that still lies in (nerfed and gimped) sci abilities
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
hopefully the next ship releases are tier 6 retrofits of the intrepid, galaxy and defiant. you would think at least the intrepid would have a tier 6 version by now.
make the ENS station a LT, possibly make it universal, make the LTC station a intel hybrid, give it the same consoles as the tier 5U version, and sell them for 2500, because tier 6 retrofits say wouldn't have new ship traits maybe.
a2b is not even magical enough to compensate for only have a single LTtac slot in post DR
It could be made to work. Not easily, but it could be done. Sarcasm Detector got 23k DPS on a run they died on, and DR powercreep will only work in the Galaxy's favour. I could see this breaking 35k DPS: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=galr1_0
Keeping it alive might be an issue, and actually getting it equipped to be a massive issue borderline insurmountable without vast resources, but it could be done.
Of course, the same equipment on a Scim and you are talking serious multiples of 35k, so the Galaxy still needs a fix.
What Cryptic really needs to do is roll back Delta Rising.
But of course they won't do that.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
I know right finally the ship gets that 3rd tact console. DR hits and how do they make the game harder. I know we will put up a huge wall of NPC Hull and Shield HP's. Making that 3rd console as useful as that 5th eng console as the boff layout is poor.
Its almost "cough cough" like Cryptic are exploiting the fact its a Galaxy, the Ent D and Star Trek fans want to fly this ship, they charge RL money for it and then put out free of charge ships as either event ships, or same tier ships that out perform it.
Right now the T5U Galaxy, Nebula, Intrepid and Defiant all really need a overhaul. and its not a big one or game breaking either.
Galaxy needs the same boff layout as the X 1 simple ens station made uni. (This would make a huge difference to the ship. yes 1 lowly ens station changed to allow tact, it would make a massive difference)
Nebula needs a 3rd tact console not a crappy 5th science console, she has a decent boff layout, but not the right console support to take advantage (Poor stacking of science consoles and Tykrens rift and Gravity well are hard capped between 1000-1100 dps i think so stacking 5 gravity gens is like stacking 5 RCS consoles the other 3 are useless)
Intrepid 3 tact consoles but again like the Galaxy handicapped by a poor boff layout.
Defiant the best of the bunch because it can hit hard and make npc hull move in the right direction, and thats down. However she was a fairly tough ship in DS9 and that solo ens tact station should be made engineering
So no major changes to these ships just minor tweaks that would make them better than what they are so they are viable ships to use in PvE queues without feeling disadvantaged by using them.
Yes there are other ships to use, which do the jobs better in fact every other end game ship does do the job better. But i want to play these end game ships as thats what they are just like the alternative ships Cryptic offer,
So the Galaxy, Intrepid, Nebula, should all be just as capable of completing the same end game content, without feeling like playing advanced content despite queuing for normal difficulty
Aye.... Like I mentioned, I suspect that the T6 Hero ships are the company's 'In case of emergency, break glass' reserve option.
Couple of months before an AGM, with profits tanked, and the only people left in the game are the 'You can get anything you want in the game without paying a dime... why is nobody selling Zen anymore?..' white knights.
Break out the T6 Hero ships, with some cheesy line about, 'We've always loved these awesome ships the same as all the other fans, which is why we took so long to release the revamped versions; since we wanted to properly digest the player feedback in order to do these great ships justice...':rolleyes: and there you go.
In the meantime, folks are still paying for the garbage versions - I certainly did on more than one char.
What Cryptic really needs to do is roll back Delta Rising.
But of course they won't do that.
Dunno, I'm as grumpy as sin about most of the recent changes; but the Intel stuff (bugs aside...) is about the most fun I've ever had in STO - and it's given us a fresh, new meta and mechanic that could be used to make the Galaxy awesome.
I'd make the Galaxy the premier (slow) broadsiding Ship of the Line: The Surgical Strike and Override System Safeties mechanics being what I'd build it on. If you didn't want to step on the toes of the Intel ships too much, you could use the idea mentioned way back, of allowing only the huge battleships to have Heavy Beam Arrays; which have some of the characteristics of OSS/SS built in (but can't use FaW). Something like that.
Couple that with a BOFF/Console layout similar to the Fleet Ambassador's (but with moar stuff, since it's T6), and you'd be half way there.
I actually use the fleet Gal-R for a few days now. THe 3rd Tac console changes everything.
Why? because you can build a fortress with the Boff layout, all those engineers can keep up your hull forever, and you finally deal some damage.
Yes, you have some restrictions about which tac abilities you use but Tac team/BO or Tac team/ BFAW are good choices. and since many people already have more than one Tac officer you can switch them while you are not on Red Alert. Or you just learn to fly a cruiser instead of trying to fly an Escort with a focus only on DPS.
And you have enough other consoles for the Rep. Systems Uni. consols and aome Sci consoles or probably the Galaxy 2-piece Set
I just wish that they would add the Envoy or Celestial skins to the fleet Exp. Cruiser.
I actually use the fleet Gal-R for a few days now. THe 3rd Tac console changes everything.
Why? because you can build a fortress with the Boff layout, all those engineers can keep up your hull forever, and you finally deal some damage.
Yes, you have some restrictions about which tac abilities you use but Tac team/BO or Tac team/ BFAW are good choices. and since many people already have more than one Tac officer you can switch them while you are not on Red Alert. Or you just learn to fly a cruiser instead of trying to fly an Escort with a focus only on DPS.
And you have enough other consoles for the Rep. Systems Uni. consols and aome Sci consoles or probably the Galaxy 2-piece Set
I just wish that they would add the Envoy or Celestial skins to the fleet Exp. Cruiser.
I'm always delighted when folks are enjoying their Galaxies, and don't like to say anything to put them off, but re the bit I underlined above....
I never enjoyed flying anything but Cruisers, and on both my Tac and Eng (who I much prefer), the Fleet Ambassador was far and away my most beloved ship. For the pre-DR meta, the Fleet Ambassador was the perfect sweet spot: The acme of Cruisers IMO. Mostly a combination of being able to use five Tac slots, with three SROs, with having enough Eng, with having that LtCmndr Sci slot - which was worth its weight in gold since it offered the versatility you'd expect from a Cruiser. I always used it for TSS III, for superior tanking ability, or healing ability since I'm one of those crazy cats who'll try to heal his team mates in a pug.
She was my only ship that I 100% trusted that I could throw into the teeth of the enemy and that she'd prevail; and all of my happiest memories of using her were very much when using her as the Cruiser that she was. Charging across the map in Azure Nebula Rescue, to help a team mate (in a DSD) who'd used up all his heals and was now at death's door. The cavalry arrived in the eleventh hour and I hit him with every single heal I had (HE, AtSIF, ET, ST and TSS), fully healing him just as he was about to die, and knowing that I'd still be OK without any spare heals of my own, since I was in my mighty Ambassador - and it was only a fleet of Tholians, which she vaped instantly.
Or ISE, when people started doing that thing recently, where they blew the first Transformer then dashed off to hit the targets on the right, without taking out the first lot of Nanite Spheres... which would then drift off to insta-heal the right Transformer the moment it was attacked, thus failing the optional. So there was just me, on my own, destroying those Spheres as they floated off towards the second Transformer. All within range of the Gate which was relentlessly hammering me for the whole fight - but succeeding because I was in the acme of Cruisers.
Placing first, or occasionally second, in every CEE I played, due to her abilty to fight and heal. And that's with Polarons, whose proc didn't do anything against the Entity or shards.
I could never dream of doing anything like that in my Galaxy. I used to squint and pretend that she was a Galaxy to be honest. When I'm talking about the Galaxy being the premier Ship of the Line, I'm talking about all of those things, and not just DPS. She should be the solid spine that holds a team together, who can tank, heal and dish out the mighty broadside as needed.
It just happens that the latter is at least twice as important in the new DR meta, unfortunately. [Now the Eclipse is the Cruiser sweet spot IMO.] By the Heavy Beam Array suggestion, I actually want Cruisers to be far more different than Escorts. I'm OK with Escorts out-DPS-ing Cruisers in their narrow front arc only, but it's ludicrous when these tiny little ships can out-broadside battleships.
Just as most Cruisers can't use DHCs, you'd make it that most everything-elses can't use HBAs, other than Cruisers. Then you'd have a greater difference in play styles. Maybe the number of HBAs would be inversely proportional with speed/agility? Heavy Cruiser/Excelsior can have two, Sovereign/Ambassador four and Galaxy/Odyssey six? Guardian would have two, since she has Intel abilities. I'd also let the poor Nebula have at least two.
Eclipse might be the mighty new Fleet Sovvy of Fed tac cruisers, but she is no sweet spot. That goes to the Guardian. While Guardian might not be great at damage, she's versatile. Pretty much what you said about the Fleet Amby, the Guardian can do as well.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
so after 100 pages, the progress we have made is a 3rd tac console on the tier 5U galaxy, but even with that its even farther behind the curve then it was before tier 6 hit, and we got a nerf the the saucer pet!
so after 100 pages, the progress we have made is a 3rd tac console on the tier 5U galaxy, but even with that its even farther behind the curve then it was before tier 6 hit, and we got a nerf the the saucer pet!
we suck at this.
Never give up , never surrender !!
And on the 100th page of this trednaught ... , I thought to add my pov :
The Galaxy was literally shown to be a jack of all trades , be they exploration , colonialism , combat , diplomacy .
What if lightning hit Cryptic studios (as in the chance of this happening) -- and the stations of the Galaxy reflected more of this ships multitude of designations .
How could this be accomplished ?
Well the simple way would be to take ONE ship and give it more universal stations .
But a better , and more profitable way would be to go the way of the Oddy 3 pack .... , with 3 Galaxy's representing the e leanings of the ship , just like the Oddy did .
We kind of have that with the R and the X , but not really ... , as many would like the R to have a little more Pew ... , even if that means just replication the D'Deridex's Boff layout , and fiddling a bit with the surrounding stats to differentiate it from the D'D (enertia , shield Mod etc) .
As Taco had said in the past , it would be nice if an eventual Galaxy interior was made ... , and to celebrate that , a 2.0 version of the Galaxy facelift & upgrade would be a nice thing to have .
... the Tech manual did say that it was built with a 100 year framework in mind with many upgrades to be included in that lifetime ... , so it should still be a viable ship in STO's lifetime ...
Comments
guardian and eclipse can use intel powers. overload subsystem safeties averages out to like another copy of APA, with a 20 second up time and 30 second down time. ionic turbulence not only is a sick disable in an AOE you cast on someone like scramble sensors, but anyone inside it is debuffed like another copy of APB is on them, that you can only clear by escaping the cloud. EMP probe doubles down on the disable, but only goes to were the target was, best to be released point blank. any npc group controlled by GW or something, with a combination of all these 3 skills stacked against them, is going to die twice as fast, and also not even get a shot off, so being able to tank is even lower a priority when the npcs can't shoot.
im not even sure the scimitar can compete with the intel cruisers. and not only those skills, but there is also 1 more called surgical strike, that effects both beams and cannons, that if your looking for single target damage, can basically replace any other weapons skill for that. fit those 4 things on your ship in pvp, and you REALLY feel like someone who payed $125 more then your opponent. assuming you bought the whole pack, and not just a ship.
thats why the galaxy R getting something like an LTC inlet hybrid eng seat would sudenly make it an amazing ship
Cryptic said that we will be able to use the T5U ships in T6 content, they didn't say at what content difficulty levels.
Right now it seems that they are only usable on Normal content unless take a ship with cannons on it. Right now Normal is too easy and Advanced is still insane.
I am really hoping that the T5U ships can be played in Advanced content at least, otherwise the game is not going to be nearly as fun anymore.
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There is no "perfect cruiser" but more ships have come closer to it than the Galaxy-class variants.
Sticking to Fed Cruisers alone, no lockbox, no lobi ships, any of these are a superior choice to the Galaxy-class variants as Cruisers.
Odyssey
Excelsior
Sovereign/Regent
Avenger
Eclipse Intel (T6)
Gaurdian (T6)
The key to the listed ships is that they have more than enough ENG capability to take the punishment the game throws at you, punishment that Escorts & Raiders may have trouble taking. Yet they still have capable Tactical capability through 3-4 TAC Console Slots, and either of the TAC BOFF layouts:
LtCDr, LtCdr/Lt, LtCdr/Ens
The Guardian is a crazy capable traditional Cruiser that can do it all. It has heavy ENG seating but still has LtCdr TAC *and* SCI stations.
The Eclipse is deceivingly offensive capable due to the 2 Hybrid Intel BOFF Seats.
That's what you're not realizing. The Galaxy-class variants (I'm lumping the Gal-X in also, just to be sure) put too much emphasis on ENG in a game that does not need it. "Trinity" does not exist in STO. There is no need for a "Tank." You can put 10 TAC Console Slots on the Galaxy-class. If so, I'd say it's a total waste simply due to the awful BOFF layout of the Galaxy. All those console slots would be wasted on a ship with pitifully low Tactical capability.
Hell, even the Gal-X? You could do the job of the Gal-X with the Lv40 Assault Cruiser. Only thing it doesn't have is the Phaser Lance.
I'd add the Fleet Ambassador to your list - before DR, she was my perfect Cruiser. Spot on balance of tank, utility and firepower: by going the crit route (with three SROs) she comfortably outshot any other Fed broadside Cruiser, though the Galaxy Dread was the best against the likes of SB234. I'm still exploring but I'm finding that the Galaxy Dread is the best of the FT5-U Fed Cruisers. Avenger isn't included in the above, since I'm talking about the broadside boats.
And re a comment further up: I don't use Phasers on the Gal Dread: IME it's better to focus on using the best damage type for the broadside you'll be using all the time (Polaron IMO), than to compromise all that for the weapon that you only get to fire every couple of minutes (and even then it may be better to keep broadsiding than turn to fire the Lance and then turn back to the broadside).
Aye, I know exactly what you mean mate. Before DR, about the only thing left in the game I enjoyed was tweaking builds and testing them at Carraya and SB234. Now they've bollixed that up too, natch, so the only thing left I like now is....
.........
.........
.........
Anyway, I had a similar, 'WTF?! Have I just got really TRIBBLE all of a sudden?!!' about SB234, but I wouldn't let it get to you/me, bearing in mind a few things.
I used to be able to clear SB234 with ~2:24 left on the clock with my Fleet Ambassador, and ~2:31 left with my Fleet Galaxy Dread. With DR, I did the U thing, expecting that the extra console slot would improve my time, but even with the extra slots, my time (on Normal) got worse by 10-20 secs. Only my Eclipse [what a ship!!!] could match my old times, though was still a few secs slower than my Ambassador had been (~2:22 left).
Little did I know that all of a sudden I was engaging in exploitative behaviour.:rolleyes: Then they closed Tau Dewa down. When it came back, they scaled difficulty with level, in their usual, never-ending amateur hour way.
So I was level 57, tried out SB234 (on Normal) after the patch, and it was about 75/25 whether I could defeat the SB before time-out, using my usual build. Still changing nothing, except adding the stuff that should make me a bit better that comes with levelling up, I ran it a few times at level 58 and it was ~50/50 whether I could defeat the SB before time-out. With my Eclipse: It was flat-out impossible with my Gal Dread U - my previous best performer.
At level 59 today, I ran it again a few times (still on normal) and my Eclipse just about squeaked taking out the SB the very split-second I timed-out once, and failed all of the other attempts (with the SB still having ~16% HP left).
So yeah, unless you upgrade your gear [which I haven't and probably won't, since I'm feeling coerced to do so]; the better you get, the more likely you are to fail SB234: So I wouldn't be too hard on yerself.:cool:
PS, I find life's little ironies to be amongst its most redeeming features. A while ago, I took my Galaxy (not Dread) out for her regular spin and tweak - and she was awesome! Turned out that it was during that period when some consoles and stuff got their uber-stats, due to a Geko error. I'm sure that he'd hate the fact that for a brief time he'd unwittingly made that ship he dislikes so much so fantastic and a joy to fly... heheheh....:)
And i also enjoy switching to my Regent, ma Excelsior and my Ambassador.
So i have many altenatives to the Galaxy.
But is there really no way to make the Galaxy useful for Easy STFs and Missions? With Tac Team and BO?
Of course you can make it useful for easy (Normal Difficulty) STFs. The problem is that those are so easy you could complete them in a T3 ship and they don't reward you, at all. Normal STFs are unfortunately a complete waste of time since they don't even award the currency to buy rep gear. Yes, that ironically means that you can't even run normal STF to get better and take on advanced at one point. Classic Cryptic
The Galaxy can "shine" with FAW 1 / APB 1 as a aggro-magnet and team support, BO1 / APD1 as a single target tank or you can even go crazy with BO1 / BO 2 and land some devestating crits. You can make the ship work and have fun, but the overall changes to gameplay at this point clearly put the ship as a disadvantage. Before I could argue, say "make the ship you love work, because it works!" but now, with the changes that came with DR, it really doesn't work, technically.
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Cryptic has done as little as possible with the Galaxy ships and wiped with hands clean of it. Don't expect anything else. Although I think it's amazing that we get another Tactical console slot when upgrading the Gal-R to T5U, I guess you can't go past 5 console slots.
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Considered Aux2Batt?
Without it, a Galaxy flown to the actual ships limit will struggle to be ASTF capable on DPS, but with it you can at least drag it up to having some breathing room.
I bet if the Constitution did ever get the green light on being made end game even she would be made better than the Galaxy.
At present that single lt. Tact slot and heavy eng focus has made using this ship even less desirable in Elite content than before.
Galaxy-X with that uni ensign allowing 3 tact powers still allows her to be competitive.
a2b is not even magical enough to compensate for only have a single LTtac slot in post DR
I'd have to agree.
In PvE this ship falls way behind everyone else.
In PvP, LOL. T5-U ships are already at a disadvantage, the Gal-R wouldn't stand a chance.
Leave it to flippin' Cryptic to give the Gal-R 3 tac slots... the exact moment it becomes worthless no matter what build we try to run on it.
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Its almost "cough cough" like Cryptic are exploiting the fact its a Galaxy, the Ent D and Star Trek fans want to fly this ship, they charge RL money for it and then put out free of charge ships as either event ships, or same tier ships that out perform it.
Right now the T5U Galaxy, Nebula, Intrepid and Defiant all really need a overhaul. and its not a big one or game breaking either.
Galaxy needs the same boff layout as the X 1 simple ens station made uni. (This would make a huge difference to the ship. yes 1 lowly ens station changed to allow tact, it would make a massive difference)
Nebula needs a 3rd tact console not a crappy 5th science console, she has a decent boff layout, but not the right console support to take advantage (Poor stacking of science consoles and Tykrens rift and Gravity well are hard capped between 1000-1100 dps i think so stacking 5 gravity gens is like stacking 5 RCS consoles the other 3 are useless)
Intrepid 3 tact consoles but again like the Galaxy handicapped by a poor boff layout.
Defiant the best of the bunch because it can hit hard and make npc hull move in the right direction, and thats down. However she was a fairly tough ship in DS9 and that solo ens tact station should be made engineering
So no major changes to these ships just minor tweaks that would make them better than what they are so they are viable ships to use in PvE queues without feeling disadvantaged by using them.
Yes there are other ships to use, which do the jobs better in fact every other end game ship does do the job better. But i want to play these end game ships as thats what they are just like the alternative ships Cryptic offer,
So the Galaxy, Intrepid, Nebula, should all be just as capable of completing the same end game content, without feeling like playing advanced content despite queuing for normal difficulty
I like to disagree here. Five sci consoles are awesome, especially with the lvl 15 sci trait that grants bonus criticals for exotic damage every 100 points in particle gens. I redesigned my Nebula into a tractor beam towship and it is deadly and very fun, and hardy enough to survive close encounters. Is it the best in game? No, certainly not and I don't have numbers, I can only say that it works, I score first places in many pugs (that didn't happen before), and it feels useful. If only 5 eng consoles could be used in a similiar manner.
In fact, sciboats are the only class that doesn't really need tac consoles at all as the weapons only provide proc functionality or minor fire support. The trend of Cryptic too just make all new scis into sciscorts should not blind you towars the potential that still lies in (nerfed and gimped) sci abilities
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make the ENS station a LT, possibly make it universal, make the LTC station a intel hybrid, give it the same consoles as the tier 5U version, and sell them for 2500, because tier 6 retrofits say wouldn't have new ship traits maybe.
It could be made to work. Not easily, but it could be done. Sarcasm Detector got 23k DPS on a run they died on, and DR powercreep will only work in the Galaxy's favour. I could see this breaking 35k DPS: http://skillplanner.stoacademy.com/?build=galr1_0
Keeping it alive might be an issue, and actually getting it equipped to be a massive issue borderline insurmountable without vast resources, but it could be done.
Of course, the same equipment on a Scim and you are talking serious multiples of 35k, so the Galaxy still needs a fix.
But of course they won't do that.
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Aye.... Like I mentioned, I suspect that the T6 Hero ships are the company's 'In case of emergency, break glass' reserve option.
Couple of months before an AGM, with profits tanked, and the only people left in the game are the 'You can get anything you want in the game without paying a dime... why is nobody selling Zen anymore?..'
Break out the T6 Hero ships, with some cheesy line about, 'We've always loved these awesome ships the same as all the other fans, which is why we took so long to release the revamped versions; since we wanted to properly digest the player feedback in order to do these great ships justice...':rolleyes: and there you go.
In the meantime, folks are still paying for the garbage versions - I certainly did on more than one char.
Dunno, I'm as grumpy as sin about most of the recent changes; but the Intel stuff (bugs aside...) is about the most fun I've ever had in STO - and it's given us a fresh, new meta and mechanic that could be used to make the Galaxy awesome.
I'd make the Galaxy the premier (slow) broadsiding Ship of the Line: The Surgical Strike and Override System Safeties mechanics being what I'd build it on. If you didn't want to step on the toes of the Intel ships too much, you could use the idea mentioned way back, of allowing only the huge battleships to have Heavy Beam Arrays; which have some of the characteristics of OSS/SS built in (but can't use FaW). Something like that.
Couple that with a BOFF/Console layout similar to the Fleet Ambassador's (but with moar stuff, since it's T6), and you'd be half way there.
Why? because you can build a fortress with the Boff layout, all those engineers can keep up your hull forever, and you finally deal some damage.
Yes, you have some restrictions about which tac abilities you use but Tac team/BO or Tac team/ BFAW are good choices. and since many people already have more than one Tac officer you can switch them while you are not on Red Alert. Or you just learn to fly a cruiser instead of trying to fly an Escort with a focus only on DPS.
And you have enough other consoles for the Rep. Systems Uni. consols and aome Sci consoles or probably the Galaxy 2-piece Set
I just wish that they would add the Envoy or Celestial skins to the fleet Exp. Cruiser.
I'm always delighted when folks are enjoying their Galaxies, and don't like to say anything to put them off, but re the bit I underlined above....
I never enjoyed flying anything but Cruisers, and on both my Tac and Eng (who I much prefer), the Fleet Ambassador was far and away my most beloved ship. For the pre-DR meta, the Fleet Ambassador was the perfect sweet spot: The acme of Cruisers IMO. Mostly a combination of being able to use five Tac slots, with three SROs, with having enough Eng, with having that LtCmndr Sci slot - which was worth its weight in gold since it offered the versatility you'd expect from a Cruiser. I always used it for TSS III, for superior tanking ability, or healing ability since I'm one of those crazy cats who'll try to heal his team mates in a pug.
She was my only ship that I 100% trusted that I could throw into the teeth of the enemy and that she'd prevail; and all of my happiest memories of using her were very much when using her as the Cruiser that she was. Charging across the map in Azure Nebula Rescue, to help a team mate (in a DSD) who'd used up all his heals and was now at death's door. The cavalry arrived in the eleventh hour and I hit him with every single heal I had (HE, AtSIF, ET, ST and TSS), fully healing him just as he was about to die, and knowing that I'd still be OK without any spare heals of my own, since I was in my mighty Ambassador - and it was only a fleet of Tholians, which she vaped instantly.
Or ISE, when people started doing that thing recently, where they blew the first Transformer then dashed off to hit the targets on the right, without taking out the first lot of Nanite Spheres... which would then drift off to insta-heal the right Transformer the moment it was attacked, thus failing the optional. So there was just me, on my own, destroying those Spheres as they floated off towards the second Transformer. All within range of the Gate which was relentlessly hammering me for the whole fight - but succeeding because I was in the acme of Cruisers.
Placing first, or occasionally second, in every CEE I played, due to her abilty to fight and heal. And that's with Polarons, whose proc didn't do anything against the Entity or shards.
I could never dream of doing anything like that in my Galaxy. I used to squint and pretend that she was a Galaxy to be honest. When I'm talking about the Galaxy being the premier Ship of the Line, I'm talking about all of those things, and not just DPS. She should be the solid spine that holds a team together, who can tank, heal and dish out the mighty broadside as needed.
It just happens that the latter is at least twice as important in the new DR meta, unfortunately. [Now the Eclipse is the Cruiser sweet spot IMO.] By the Heavy Beam Array suggestion, I actually want Cruisers to be far more different than Escorts. I'm OK with Escorts out-DPS-ing Cruisers in their narrow front arc only, but it's ludicrous when these tiny little ships can out-broadside battleships.
Just as most Cruisers can't use DHCs, you'd make it that most everything-elses can't use HBAs, other than Cruisers. Then you'd have a greater difference in play styles. Maybe the number of HBAs would be inversely proportional with speed/agility? Heavy Cruiser/Excelsior can have two, Sovereign/Ambassador four and Galaxy/Odyssey six? Guardian would have two, since she has Intel abilities. I'd also let the poor Nebula have at least two.
Or something....
I agree with everything here but this:
Eclipse might be the mighty new Fleet Sovvy of Fed tac cruisers, but she is no sweet spot. That goes to the Guardian. While Guardian might not be great at damage, she's versatile. Pretty much what you said about the Fleet Amby, the Guardian can do as well.
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*edit
so after 100 pages, the progress we have made is a 3rd tac console on the tier 5U galaxy, but even with that its even farther behind the curve then it was before tier 6 hit, and we got a nerf the the saucer pet!
we suck at this.
Nope, we suck.
why does cryptic hate the galaxy so much what did it ever do to them?
and yeah we suck
Never give up , never surrender !!
And on the 100th page of this trednaught ... , I thought to add my pov :
The Galaxy was literally shown to be a jack of all trades , be they exploration , colonialism , combat , diplomacy .
What if lightning hit Cryptic studios (as in the chance of this happening) -- and the stations of the Galaxy reflected more of this ships multitude of designations .
How could this be accomplished ?
Well the simple way would be to take ONE ship and give it more universal stations .
But a better , and more profitable way would be to go the way of the Oddy 3 pack .... , with 3 Galaxy's representing the e leanings of the ship , just like the Oddy did .
We kind of have that with the R and the X , but not really ... , as many would like the R to have a little more Pew ... , even if that means just replication the D'Deridex's Boff layout , and fiddling a bit with the surrounding stats to differentiate it from the D'D (enertia , shield Mod etc) .
As Taco had said in the past , it would be nice if an eventual Galaxy interior was made ... , and to celebrate that , a 2.0 version of the Galaxy facelift & upgrade would be a nice thing to have .
... the Tech manual did say that it was built with a 100 year framework in mind with many upgrades to be included in that lifetime ... , so it should still be a viable ship in STO's lifetime ...