Only trigger the cutscene if you go full RP and use the proximity door.
Bah, your proposal is sound. Even though I'm one of the people who enjoys ramming the docking bay doors at Full Impulse, and would probably stop doing so if I had to sit through a cutscene each time.
What do you think about making the glass portions of the walkway slick like Q's Winter Wonderland and/or having a volume effect for walking in water that makes it slower, which would make it seem more like wading. (This could apply a number of places but notably SFA, Bajor, and Risa.)
Personally, +1 to the water idea, not so much to the slippery glass idea.
^^This. D'Angelo may be many things, but "accessible" is not one of them. This isn't really a complaint - he can visit the forums as much or as little as he likes - but we're not exactly in a position to "let him know" about anything.
It's very disappointing that there seems to be so little regard for tagging art assets for Foundry use. I wish Cryptic would stop treating this as an afterthought and simply make this a part of the Art process.
I'm not a Foundry user, but I have to agree with this. If it's a feature of the game, it should have full, unconditional, support. Otherwise, it just seems like the whole thing was a testbed for Neverwinter, to be abandoned once that game launched.
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
I'm not a Foundry user, but I have to agree with this. If it's a feature of the game, it should have full, unconditional, support. Otherwise, it just seems like the whole thing was a testbed for Neverwinter, to be abandoned once that game launched.
I was under the impression that it was a testbed for Neverwinter, it didn't seem to be a coincidence that the Foundry cropped up after Cryptic started working on that game in 2010.
I was under the impression that it was a testbed for Neverwinter, it didn't seem to be a coincidence that the Foundry cropped up after Cryptic started working on that game in 2010.
I actually always assumed so as well...perhaps I should have said "just a testbed for Neverwinter."
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
We have atleast three starbases around earth. Why not use another one for new ESD and that one, what is used currently would have the old ESD? Or, What about getting some use for those turbolifts: add new ESD to another floor,"In top of another one", but keep both. Because I love both designs. But if you do like i mentioned, please no 2 admiral Quins .
I kind of would like to have access to both levels, but we don't know what kind of technical issues that would raise. Also there's the fact that part of the reason for this revamp is the fact that old Spacedock is technically and aesthetically inferior to what's being built. Part of the impetus for this new version is to bring Spacedock up to snuff with Romulan Republic Command and Flotilla. To make it look as advanced as the Odyssey bridge etc. To truly make that idea workable, they would have to rework the old Spacedock deck have the same visuals as this one does.
Too much work and who knows what it would do to the server.
That said, I understand why you would want it as I feel the same about ESD and Drozana Station.
Ok, just had the longest spacewalk ever. I fell through the floor behind the open door at the shuttle ramp and landed on the outer spacedock structure. I started to walk around a bit and ended up running the entire circumference.
Got some nice alternate vantage point screenshots of the ships inside.
Pity I couldn't get a good one of the Miranda. That thing is so low rez it doesn't even render until I am almost on top of it.
There is still tons of room inside the dock for loads more ships and theoretically enough potential room for hundreds more... er, rooms around with a view inside.
How did you get there? I wanna walk before they seal it up.
Any chance we can have the shuttles arrive and depart so they are not just static objects to look at?
Having the option to travel via the shuttles would be nice. Some of us are worried that the transporters are not really moving us, but rather creating a exact copy and killing off the original.
Look Dr. McCoy the shuttle isn't much better. "One tiny crack in the hull and our blood boils in thirteen seconds. A solar flare might crop up, cook us in our seats. And wait 'til you're sitting pretty with a case of Andorian shingles. See if you're still so relaxed when your eyeballs are bleeding! Space is disease and danger wrapped in darkness and silence."
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
I love the new ESD, it's more in line with Starfleet now rather than the old one.
There are a lot of panels that need pushing back against walls or need to be curved to fit properly, I think it would be a good idea to make these a lighter shade of grey so they fit better with the surroundings.
A few people need their positions and/or emotes adjusting, Sulu for example needs to be pulled back a little so he isn't standing in the panel he's supposed to be using. Is the hologram a live feed from the associated instance? if so, awesome The shipyard workers need to be given console panels or different emotes. Commander Tafeng needs to be turned around and given the 'interact with console' emote. The row of people including Malcom Sissel need to be moved forward so they look like they are using the consoles there. The commodity brokers need to be adjusted slightly to line them up properly with their consoles.
The next version should include accessible Bank, Exchange and Mail consoles and removing the red block people, could you also make the glass panels around the tailor shop more obviously glass? Like the ones with the white lines on them. Could you also sort out the interact buttons, the Voth Medic interact reads "Open door" but there is no door. Can we have a new lower level that matches the upper level? Some NPCs wandering around on both levels would make it feel more real, it feels a little empty at the moment.
The dialogue for the transporter chief needs updating to reflect the new ESD layout. I think that's it.
I was thinking how much I'd like a "Reputation Embassy" with easy access to all reputation activities (ie. all the adventure/battle zones, one click away and direct queueing for queued events from a relevant NPC to make it easier for new players to find).
A central reputation hub, maybe including a marks exchange. Rather than a simple hand-in conversion (which risks making unpopular events dead), I'd rather see this tailored like the dilithium exchange. Players can exchange bound marks but the marks themselves have to come from somebody actually playing the content. This would be the mechanism for trading bound marks. Maybe have it centralized so that we can buy any mark from other players with fleet marks and sell any kind of marks for fleet marks, making fleet marks the default currency. Underplayed content will naturally tend to have a higher exchange rate because fewer of the marks will be in circulation.
The more I think about this though, I think a reputation hub deserves to be its own location in the universe. But it could use similar assets to the new ESD at least, maybe as an expanded Khitomer or a Babel location.
First off, I want to congratulate the team on a wonderful re-imagining of ESD. The place is beautiful and I can see myself spending a lot of time there.
Overall, the little touches you included in today's Tribble patch were very nice.
However, I have two things I'd like to point out:
1) You have changed to doors to the shops and the tailor to some LCARS-looking glass. I think the original version looked much nicer and suited the area way better. Any chance on changing it back?
2.) Ramps. Is there a chance that some of the ramps in ESD might be changed to stairs? I think stairs always look much nicer and realistic - ramps are a very old design element of STO and I think they should be removed were possible. The ramps are especially noticable in the main area and the shipyard (compare this to the OPS section which is accesible via stairs or even the shuttlebay has some nice stairs in it). I'd love you guys to death, if you could consider this!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] "Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
First off, I want to congratulate the team on a wonderful re-imagining of ESD. The place is beautiful and I can see myself spending a lot of time there.
Overall, the little touches you included in today's Tribble patch were very nice.
However, I have two things I'd like to point out:
1) You have changed to doors to the shops and the tailor to some LCARS-looking glass. I think the original version looked much nicer and suited the area way better. Any chance on changing it back?
2.) Ramps. Is there a chance that some of the ramps in ESD might be changed to stairs? I think stairs always look much nicer and realistic - ramps are a very old design element of STO and I think they should be removed were possible. The ramps are especially noticable in the main area and the shipyard (compare this to the OPS section which is accesible via stairs or even the shuttlebay has some nice stairs in it). I'd love you guys to death, if you could consider this!
1) Ya, we actually agree. We had tried this to emulate what was done in the Admiral's Office, and the front of the Exchange, but I think we're going to be putting the old entrances back in.
2) Ramps/Stairs was my call. I don't remember seeing a lot of stairs in any Starfleet facility. A few steps here and there are fine (and we've used that all over the place in new ESD), but large staircases were never shown. I made the call to use Ramps for large changes in elevation (primarily that central run). I don't think we'll be swapping them out. However there are stairs in Ops.
On the latest update... a few things that you may want to fix:
1. All of the new mail terminals are hooked up to the bank.
2. From the entry to the shipyard looking up at the waterfall... the final area of plants and water to the right when the waterfall comes to an end doesn't look like water until you splash in it. All the other plant/water areas have a wave effect on it to see the water.
3. I'm sure you aren't done with it but the upper observation deck/bridge has false walls showing towards the shuttle bay end.
4. I also thought the dressing rooms had lights in them before but now they are dark.
5. I love the new shuttle area and the ability to walk over and view it. I hope we can enter the lower shuttle area via turbolift/stairs and take a shuttle to our ship or fleet starbase.
EDIT: 6. There is water running across the glass that encloses the walkway between the tailor and the weapon store.
Gold Sub since March 2010
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
A nice add would be to add some reflection to the inside of the glass near the spiral ramp where the bank and mail terminals are. From the inside it looks like you can walk right through until you hit the invisible wall. The outside shows the reflection so you know there is glass from that side.
Gold Sub since March 2010
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
2) Ramps/Stairs was my call. I don't remember seeing a lot of stairs in any Starfleet facility. A few steps here and there are fine (and we've used that all over the place in new ESD), but large staircases were never shown. I made the call to use Ramps for large changes in elevation (primarily that central run). I don't think we'll be swapping them out. However there are stairs in Ops.
Thanks for your reply! Much appreciated.
There aren't many grand stairs in Star Trek, sure, but this might have more to do with budget and set limitations. To be honest I don't remember too many ramps, either (except for the Enterprise-D bridge). Come to think of it, there are actually many small stairs all around the main areas of Federation ships - but they don't compare in size to anything we have ingame.
I guess my problem with ramps is, that they seem unrealistic to me. I like the ramp you put from the transporter room to the main area - this slope makes sense to me. However those ramps leading up from the shipyard to the waterfall look way too steep, to be actually usable. I'm not sure I could walk these without tipping over. Stairs might also look a little more interesting (especially those with light textures), as the ramps seem to just sit there in the middle of the room.
At the end of the day it might just be a matter of personal taste, of course. But you can't blame me for trying to convince you!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] "Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
I have to say looking at the ESD interior map from the outside gives you a sense of scale and positioning that I'm not sure is matched anywhere. This is some really impressive stuff the art/environment team has done here. It's a shame that most people probably won't see a lot of these views in regular gameplay.
(the Season 9 ESD interior pics were from a build before the current one that went up today)
Also side note: the star field from season 8's ESD skybox is a plain white starfield, compared to the full-color starfield of Season 9's skybox!
The new look is really nice, and probably more consistent with the non-STO Trek 'aesthetic' in a way that the big chunky buttresses and irregular metal structures on the walls (Exchange, I'm looking at you) aren't.
However, being able to climb up to areas like the lights was a great little 'feature' that came out of the 'old' ESD's design. It was great to be able to climb up there and chat to fleet mates without some idiot running up and spraying balloons, or disco balls, or grenades at you. Created a spot you could go and watch people walking past without being bothered, too (think Nog and Jake on DS9). More than one person I know used it as a place to go to and think. Sure you can go to your bridge, but that's dead and empty, no matter how many NPCs are standing at their stations.
Furthermore it was also challenging to reach, and a number of people in my fleet had a great time exploring and looking for ways to reach these little unintended locations. This is something that other MMOs have embraced and turned into gameplay features (GW2?), and to some extent STO has done this with, say, the accolades on Nimbus. But I do think that these upcoming changes are essentially rejecting the emergent gameplay that came from the old design, because the new starbase has a cleaner, more streamlined aesthetic that precludes climbing - how are you going to climb up a featureless vertical surface?
It's also been mentioned here that the environment feels sterile - I think overuse of white is a big contributor here. Also I don't tend to think that the addition of trees and so on sufficiently offsets this. Removing all the crates and such might be more in alignment with clean, sleek stylisation but on the other hand, Starfleet is still on a war footing in the story at this point - surely they aren't always having enough time to completely segregate all the supplies and equipment elsewhere on the station? Fair enough you don't have boxes of warheads lying around on the promenade but I'd have expected to see more materiel near the suppliers.
It would be great to see some of the 'old' areas repurposed into zones that represent other areas of the starbase. Their specific function would be altered of course, quite possibly only existing as hooks for UGC even. But it would certainly a) enhance the sense of scale of the starbase, b) at least preserve locations for climbing and emergent gameplay and c) provide some evidence of the supposed 'war' going on, what with crates of gear and storage facilities, reinforcing etc. Hell, you can't tell me that every square centimetre of the starbase is currently being used; you could have them accessible by Jeffries tube.
I should say, I'm a level designer by trade myself and realise better than most that at this late stage that what I'm proposing would be something that came along at a later point. It just seems that discarding the environment entirely or relegating it to a Foundry map is a loss of potential.
TL;DR - moar climbing! more variation in the amount of props in various areas! more hidden stuff!
It's also been mentioned here that the environment feels sterile - I think overuse of white is a big contributor here. Also I don't tend to think that the addition of trees and so on sufficiently offsets this.
True, however I think groups of NPCs walking around would offset this, I mean, starfleet things are traditionally very white afterall.
Removing all the crates and such might be more in alignment with clean, sleek stylisation but on the other hand, Starfleet is still on a war footing in the story at this point - surely they aren't always having enough time to completely segregate all the supplies and equipment elsewhere on the station? Fair enough you don't have boxes of warheads lying around on the promenade but I'd have expected to see more materiel near the suppliers.
Starfleet is on a war footing, but I doubt the potential for untidiness would go all the way back to ESD, places like DS9, K7, SB39, those I could get being untidy but ESD being above the federation capital is so far away from the front-lines and the potential for harm people do have the time to keep things tidy and keep boxes in the cargo bays, aside from small boxes for the shops.
Also, on the subject of boxes, the current boxes look hooribly out of place on the new ESD, can we have some new ones that are more in line with the new colour scheme and general feel of the place please?
And water physics... could you adjust them to account for the waterfalls?
The consoles in chairs, or the other way around, whichever...
The mannequins, can you put some more up-to-date uniforms on the tailor ones and some armour on the armoury ones please? They would look a lot more appropriate.
I haven't read the entire thread yet, but I did have one question.
There are many Foundry missions that have their starting location on the current ESD, like at the panel outside of the current Transporter Room.
With the new ESD design, have these starting points been planned for? I am just concerned that the new ESD may break the foundry missions that start there.
I haven't read the entire thread yet, but I did have one question.
There are many Foundry missions that have their starting location on the current ESD, like at the panel outside of the current Transporter Room.
With the new ESD design, have these starting points been planned for? I am just concerned that the new ESD may break the foundry missions that start there.
They've said it many many many times now: all foundry assets and entry points are on the new map. The old panel outside the transporter room has moved to a new location, however, but its on ESD still.
I have to say looking at the ESD interior map from the outside gives you a sense of scale and positioning that I'm not sure is matched anywhere. This is some really impressive stuff the art/environment team has done here. It's a shame that most people probably won't see a lot of these views in regular gameplay.
(the Season 9 ESD interior pics were from a build before the current one that went up today)
Also side note: the star field from season 8's ESD skybox is a plain white starfield, compared to the full-color starfield of Season 9's skybox!
It's also been mentioned here that the environment feels sterile - I think overuse of white is a big contributor here. Also I don't tend to think that the addition of trees and so on sufficiently offsets this. Removing all the crates and such might be more in alignment with clean, sleek stylisation but on the other hand, Starfleet is still on a war footing in the story at this point - surely they aren't always having enough time to completely segregate all the supplies and equipment elsewhere on the station? Fair enough you don't have boxes of warheads lying around on the promenade but I'd have expected to see more materiel near the suppliers.
It would be great to see some of the 'old' areas repurposed into zones that represent other areas of the starbase. Their specific function would be altered of course, quite possibly only existing as hooks for UGC even. But it would certainly a) enhance the sense of scale of the starbase, b) at least preserve locations for climbing and emergent gameplay and c) provide some evidence of the supposed 'war' going on, what with crates of gear and storage facilities, reinforcing etc. Hell, you can't tell me that every square centimetre of the starbase is currently being used; you could have them accessible by Jeffries tube.
I should say, I'm a level designer by trade myself and realise better than most that at this late stage that what I'm proposing would be something that came along at a later point. It just seems that discarding the environment entirely or relegating it to a Foundry map is a loss of potential.
TL;DR - moar climbing! more variation in the amount of props in various areas! more hidden stuff!
It is a space station and it's something you want a little sterile.
Second of all, I can assure you that any even remotely military organization will retain tidiness and order especially in their logistics up until the point where they are crippled and reduced to guerrilla warfare.
If you're seeing evidence of war on Earth Spacedock you're having a serious problem. Because that means that the enemy has regular access to your capitol. Spacedock is one of the most heavily fortified facilities in the most heavily fortified sector, of one of the superpowers of the Galaxy. You're talking about Washington DC looking like it's been touched by war in WWII. It didn't happen. At all.
I agree though that it does seem to be a waste to just throw away old Spacedock especially since it technically still exists just on another floor.
I haven't read the entire thread yet, but I did have one question.
There are many Foundry missions that have their starting location on the current ESD, like at the panel outside of the current Transporter Room.
With the new ESD design, have these starting points been planned for? I am just concerned that the new ESD may break the foundry missions that start there.
They've gone out of their way to ensure that the UGC points are all retained in the transition.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
I agree though that it does seem to be a waste to just throw away old Spacedock especially since it technically still exists just on another floor.
They've gone out of their way to ensure that the UGC points are all retained in the transition.
Both of these points are related. The old ESD maps (BOTH of them infact) are in the Foundry. We still have access to that level, Quinn's just moved upstairs and it belongs the authors now.
I don't think that the shuttles will be usable for travel, but I suppose we could hook up some kind of clickable door/volume in the area to allow you to use Shuttles to get back to your ship, or to SFA.
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
On the latest update... a few things that you may want to fix:
1. All of the new mail terminals are hooked up to the bank.
2. From the entry to the shipyard looking up at the waterfall... the final area of plants and water to the right when the waterfall comes to an end doesn't look like water until you splash in it. All the other plant/water areas have a wave effect on it to see the water.
3. I'm sure you aren't done with it but the upper observation deck/bridge has false walls showing towards the shuttle bay end.
4. I also thought the dressing rooms had lights in them before but now they are dark.
5. I love the new shuttle area and the ability to walk over and view it. I hope we can enter the lower shuttle area via turbolift/stairs and take a shuttle to our ship or fleet starbase.
EDIT: 6. There is water running across the glass that encloses the walkway between the tailor and the weapon store.
1) Fixing tomorrow
2) Already fixed
3) Fixing when as the Shuttlebay gets finished (likely tomrrow)
4) I'll double check
5) The plan is to wall off the lower section, and leave that as a vista area.
6) Intended. There is no glass, just water.
A nice add would be to add some reflection to the inside of the glass near the spiral ramp where the bank and mail terminals are. From the inside it looks like you can walk right through until you hit the invisible wall. The outside shows the reflection so you know there is glass from that side.
This whole room will get some touch ups tomorrow or Friday.
1) Fixing tomorrow
2) Already fixed
3) Fixing when as the Shuttlebay gets finished (likely tomrrow)
4) I'll double check
5) The plan is to wall off the lower section, and leave that as a vista area.
6) Intended. There is no glass, just water.
This whole room will get some touch ups tomorrow or Friday.
HAX!
How about fixing the locks ups many of us have when we try to patch tribble!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2) Ramps/Stairs was my call. I don't remember seeing a lot of stairs in any Starfleet facility. A few steps here and there are fine (and we've used that all over the place in new ESD), but large staircases were never shown. I made the call to use Ramps for large changes in elevation (primarily that central run). I don't think we'll be swapping them out. However there are stairs in Ops.
DS9 has the spiral staircase on the Promenade but that was Cardassian. Isnt there suppose to be some stair case that runs the spine of the either the galaxy class or the Constitution class? but for starbases there is two reasons no stairs 1 handicap access wheel chairs ARE still used, and 2 a one off two story set with stairs was costly and pointless heck rarely was anything more then a 1 meter height change.
Oops, I forgot to mention in my prior post that it doesn't seem like the Mail terminals have been hooked up yet? Just bank and Exchange (and some of the bank terminals say Interact).
-edit- Oh, mail is hooked up to the bank until tomorrow, got it. >_>
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
Will there also be civilian traffic in ESD? I am not entirely sure if it's intended (by lore or Cryptic) to be a pure Starfleet facility, or if there will also be the occassional freighter docking inside ESD.
I wonder what the chances are that we'll ever see a station (if not ESD, then maybe DS9) with an occassional influx of civlian traffic (in DS9, Jake and Nog liked to hang out and watch incoming passengers.)
Star Trek Online Advancement: You start with lowbie gear, you end with Lobi gear.
Thumbs up a lot for nice touch of seeing a movement on different decks of ESD Thats lovely touch
Just one comment. when you jump to that computer on the " balcony " of shuttles, from that computer, you can jump to shuttle area. Thats propably not intended option
Comments
How do you suggest we accomplish this?
Bah, your proposal is sound. Even though I'm one of the people who enjoys ramming the docking bay doors at Full Impulse, and would probably stop doing so if I had to sit through a cutscene each time.
Personally, +1 to the water idea, not so much to the slippery glass idea.
^^This. D'Angelo may be many things, but "accessible" is not one of them. This isn't really a complaint - he can visit the forums as much or as little as he likes - but we're not exactly in a position to "let him know" about anything.
I'm not a Foundry user, but I have to agree with this. If it's a feature of the game, it should have full, unconditional, support. Otherwise, it just seems like the whole thing was a testbed for Neverwinter, to be abandoned once that game launched.
I was under the impression that it was a testbed for Neverwinter, it didn't seem to be a coincidence that the Foundry cropped up after Cryptic started working on that game in 2010.
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
I actually always assumed so as well...perhaps I should have said "just a testbed for Neverwinter."
I kind of would like to have access to both levels, but we don't know what kind of technical issues that would raise. Also there's the fact that part of the reason for this revamp is the fact that old Spacedock is technically and aesthetically inferior to what's being built. Part of the impetus for this new version is to bring Spacedock up to snuff with Romulan Republic Command and Flotilla. To make it look as advanced as the Odyssey bridge etc. To truly make that idea workable, they would have to rework the old Spacedock deck have the same visuals as this one does.
Too much work and who knows what it would do to the server.
That said, I understand why you would want it as I feel the same about ESD and Drozana Station.
How did you get there? I wanna walk before they seal it up.
Look Dr. McCoy the shuttle isn't much better. "One tiny crack in the hull and our blood boils in thirteen seconds. A solar flare might crop up, cook us in our seats. And wait 'til you're sitting pretty with a case of Andorian shingles. See if you're still so relaxed when your eyeballs are bleeding! Space is disease and danger wrapped in darkness and silence."
There are a lot of panels that need pushing back against walls or need to be curved to fit properly, I think it would be a good idea to make these a lighter shade of grey so they fit better with the surroundings.
A few people need their positions and/or emotes adjusting, Sulu for example needs to be pulled back a little so he isn't standing in the panel he's supposed to be using. Is the hologram a live feed from the associated instance? if so, awesome
The next version should include accessible Bank, Exchange and Mail consoles and removing the red block people, could you also make the glass panels around the tailor shop more obviously glass? Like the ones with the white lines on them. Could you also sort out the interact buttons, the Voth Medic interact reads "Open door" but there is no door. Can we have a new lower level that matches the upper level? Some NPCs wandering around on both levels would make it feel more real, it feels a little empty at the moment.
The dialogue for the transporter chief needs updating to reflect the new ESD layout. I think that's it.
I was thinking how much I'd like a "Reputation Embassy" with easy access to all reputation activities (ie. all the adventure/battle zones, one click away and direct queueing for queued events from a relevant NPC to make it easier for new players to find).
A central reputation hub, maybe including a marks exchange. Rather than a simple hand-in conversion (which risks making unpopular events dead), I'd rather see this tailored like the dilithium exchange. Players can exchange bound marks but the marks themselves have to come from somebody actually playing the content. This would be the mechanism for trading bound marks. Maybe have it centralized so that we can buy any mark from other players with fleet marks and sell any kind of marks for fleet marks, making fleet marks the default currency. Underplayed content will naturally tend to have a higher exchange rate because fewer of the marks will be in circulation.
The more I think about this though, I think a reputation hub deserves to be its own location in the universe. But it could use similar assets to the new ESD at least, maybe as an expanded Khitomer or a Babel location.
Overall, the little touches you included in today's Tribble patch were very nice.
However, I have two things I'd like to point out:
1) You have changed to doors to the shops and the tailor to some LCARS-looking glass. I think the original version looked much nicer and suited the area way better. Any chance on changing it back?
2.) Ramps. Is there a chance that some of the ramps in ESD might be changed to stairs? I think stairs always look much nicer and realistic - ramps are a very old design element of STO and I think they should be removed were possible. The ramps are especially noticable in the main area and the shipyard (compare this to the OPS section which is accesible via stairs or even the shuttlebay has some nice stairs in it). I'd love you guys to death, if you could consider this!
"Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
"Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
1) Ya, we actually agree. We had tried this to emulate what was done in the Admiral's Office, and the front of the Exchange, but I think we're going to be putting the old entrances back in.
2) Ramps/Stairs was my call. I don't remember seeing a lot of stairs in any Starfleet facility. A few steps here and there are fine (and we've used that all over the place in new ESD), but large staircases were never shown. I made the call to use Ramps for large changes in elevation (primarily that central run). I don't think we'll be swapping them out. However there are stairs in Ops.
1. All of the new mail terminals are hooked up to the bank.
2. From the entry to the shipyard looking up at the waterfall... the final area of plants and water to the right when the waterfall comes to an end doesn't look like water until you splash in it. All the other plant/water areas have a wave effect on it to see the water.
3. I'm sure you aren't done with it but the upper observation deck/bridge has false walls showing towards the shuttle bay end.
4. I also thought the dressing rooms had lights in them before but now they are dark.
5. I love the new shuttle area and the ability to walk over and view it. I hope we can enter the lower shuttle area via turbolift/stairs and take a shuttle to our ship or fleet starbase.
EDIT: 6. There is water running across the glass that encloses the walkway between the tailor and the weapon store.
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
Lifetime Sub since June 2010
There aren't many grand stairs in Star Trek, sure, but this might have more to do with budget and set limitations. To be honest I don't remember too many ramps, either (except for the Enterprise-D bridge). Come to think of it, there are actually many small stairs all around the main areas of Federation ships - but they don't compare in size to anything we have ingame.
I guess my problem with ramps is, that they seem unrealistic to me. I like the ramp you put from the transporter room to the main area - this slope makes sense to me. However those ramps leading up from the shipyard to the waterfall look way too steep, to be actually usable. I'm not sure I could walk these without tipping over. Stairs might also look a little more interesting (especially those with light textures), as the ramps seem to just sit there in the middle of the room.
At the end of the day it might just be a matter of personal taste, of course. But you can't blame me for trying to convince you!
"Sometimes you have to do things that you hate, so you can survive to fight another day."
I have to say looking at the ESD interior map from the outside gives you a sense of scale and positioning that I'm not sure is matched anywhere. This is some really impressive stuff the art/environment team has done here. It's a shame that most people probably won't see a lot of these views in regular gameplay.
(the Season 9 ESD interior pics were from a build before the current one that went up today)
Also side note: the star field from season 8's ESD skybox is a plain white starfield, compared to the full-color starfield of Season 9's skybox!
Raptr profile
However, being able to climb up to areas like the lights was a great little 'feature' that came out of the 'old' ESD's design. It was great to be able to climb up there and chat to fleet mates without some idiot running up and spraying balloons, or disco balls, or grenades at you. Created a spot you could go and watch people walking past without being bothered, too (think Nog and Jake on DS9). More than one person I know used it as a place to go to and think. Sure you can go to your bridge, but that's dead and empty, no matter how many NPCs are standing at their stations.
Furthermore it was also challenging to reach, and a number of people in my fleet had a great time exploring and looking for ways to reach these little unintended locations. This is something that other MMOs have embraced and turned into gameplay features (GW2?), and to some extent STO has done this with, say, the accolades on Nimbus. But I do think that these upcoming changes are essentially rejecting the emergent gameplay that came from the old design, because the new starbase has a cleaner, more streamlined aesthetic that precludes climbing - how are you going to climb up a featureless vertical surface?
It's also been mentioned here that the environment feels sterile - I think overuse of white is a big contributor here. Also I don't tend to think that the addition of trees and so on sufficiently offsets this. Removing all the crates and such might be more in alignment with clean, sleek stylisation but on the other hand, Starfleet is still on a war footing in the story at this point - surely they aren't always having enough time to completely segregate all the supplies and equipment elsewhere on the station? Fair enough you don't have boxes of warheads lying around on the promenade but I'd have expected to see more materiel near the suppliers.
It would be great to see some of the 'old' areas repurposed into zones that represent other areas of the starbase. Their specific function would be altered of course, quite possibly only existing as hooks for UGC even. But it would certainly a) enhance the sense of scale of the starbase, b) at least preserve locations for climbing and emergent gameplay and c) provide some evidence of the supposed 'war' going on, what with crates of gear and storage facilities, reinforcing etc. Hell, you can't tell me that every square centimetre of the starbase is currently being used; you could have them accessible by Jeffries tube.
I should say, I'm a level designer by trade myself and realise better than most that at this late stage that what I'm proposing would be something that came along at a later point. It just seems that discarding the environment entirely or relegating it to a Foundry map is a loss of potential.
TL;DR - moar climbing! more variation in the amount of props in various areas! more hidden stuff!
True, however I think groups of NPCs walking around would offset this, I mean, starfleet things are traditionally very white afterall.
Starfleet is on a war footing, but I doubt the potential for untidiness would go all the way back to ESD, places like DS9, K7, SB39, those I could get being untidy but ESD being above the federation capital is so far away from the front-lines and the potential for harm people do have the time to keep things tidy and keep boxes in the cargo bays, aside from small boxes for the shops.
Also, on the subject of boxes, the current boxes look hooribly out of place on the new ESD, can we have some new ones that are more in line with the new colour scheme and general feel of the place please?
And water physics... could you adjust them to account for the waterfalls?
The consoles in chairs, or the other way around, whichever...
The mannequins, can you put some more up-to-date uniforms on the tailor ones and some armour on the armoury ones please? They would look a lot more appropriate.
There are many Foundry missions that have their starting location on the current ESD, like at the panel outside of the current Transporter Room.
With the new ESD design, have these starting points been planned for? I am just concerned that the new ESD may break the foundry missions that start there.
They've said it many many many times now: all foundry assets and entry points are on the new map. The old panel outside the transporter room has moved to a new location, however, but its on ESD still.
TRIBBLE Hydra! Hail Janeway!
That is awesome, never delete that it's amazing.
It is a space station and it's something you want a little sterile.
Second of all, I can assure you that any even remotely military organization will retain tidiness and order especially in their logistics up until the point where they are crippled and reduced to guerrilla warfare.
If you're seeing evidence of war on Earth Spacedock you're having a serious problem. Because that means that the enemy has regular access to your capitol. Spacedock is one of the most heavily fortified facilities in the most heavily fortified sector, of one of the superpowers of the Galaxy. You're talking about Washington DC looking like it's been touched by war in WWII. It didn't happen. At all.
I agree though that it does seem to be a waste to just throw away old Spacedock especially since it technically still exists just on another floor.
They've gone out of their way to ensure that the UGC points are all retained in the transition.
Both of these points are related. The old ESD maps (BOTH of them infact) are in the Foundry. We still have access to that level, Quinn's just moved upstairs and it belongs the authors now.
TRIBBLE Hydra! Hail Janeway!
This would be a nice little touch.
They won't stop looking at me and it's freaking me out!!!
Joined January 2009
1) Fixing tomorrow
2) Already fixed
3) Fixing when as the Shuttlebay gets finished (likely tomrrow)
4) I'll double check
5) The plan is to wall off the lower section, and leave that as a vista area.
6) Intended. There is no glass, just water.
This whole room will get some touch ups tomorrow or Friday.
HAX!
How about fixing the locks ups many of us have when we try to patch tribble!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
DS9 has the spiral staircase on the Promenade but that was Cardassian. Isnt there suppose to be some stair case that runs the spine of the either the galaxy class or the Constitution class? but for starbases there is two reasons no stairs 1 handicap access wheel chairs ARE still used, and 2 a one off two story set with stairs was costly and pointless heck rarely was anything more then a 1 meter height change.
-edit- Oh, mail is hooked up to the bank until tomorrow, got it. >_>
Joined January 2009
I wonder what the chances are that we'll ever see a station (if not ESD, then maybe DS9) with an occassional influx of civlian traffic (in DS9, Jake and Nog liked to hang out and watch incoming passengers.)
Just one comment. when you jump to that computer on the " balcony " of shuttles, from that computer, you can jump to shuttle area. Thats propably not intended option