I don't login to the forums often, but I just wanted to express how happy and thrilled I am with the new ESD design! It's absolutely fantastic and exceeds what I was expecting to see! It finally feels like the Star Trek universe that I'd expect to see in 2409...
Man, am I ever thrilled with this... so much awesome it's difficult to put into words! Love it... great job! Now onto ship interiors maybe?
Hate the new ESD, reminds me of the first station in TOR but much much much smaller. Looks too clinical. The ramps are just annoying and there are too many, and make no sense in a space station. I thought the idea was to make the locations closer together and therefore easier to get to. Seems to me about the same size, but with all the door ways and corners you have to go through much harder to get places. Do you remember the uproar about the new icons in ESD, but Cryptic stated it was to help new players get around, your going to need a lot here then. Don't like the trees in the main area. I guess K7 will be my home from now on, that's basically how a good station should be laid out.
I originally didn't think ESD needed a redesign, but after seeing all these pics, I can't wait for it to go live. Especially like the new sick bay. Looks a lot more like the ones we see on screen then most of the others in the game.
It's not myfault ifyoufeel trolledbymyDisco ball...Sorry'boutit.
Hate the new ESD, reminds me of the first station in TOR but much much much smaller. Looks too clinical. The ramps are just annoying and there are too many, and make no sense in a space station. I thought the idea was to make the locations closer together and therefore easier to get to. Seems to me about the same size, but with all the door ways and corners you have to go through much harder to get places. Do you remember the uproar about the new icons in ESD, but Cryptic stated it was to help new players get around, your going to need a lot here then. Don't like the trees in the main area. I guess K7 will be my home from now on, that's basically how a good station should be laid out.
I kind of get the impression that you don't want to do *any* walking in the game at all. So I guess you'd just want a blank map with a menu... which sounds lame.
So now that I've slept on it and processed it a bit after running around like a mad man in the new ESD last night, I really, really like it.
The one thing that really sticks out to me is that it makes ESD feel large like a space station of that size should. What I mean is, the ESD on holodeck right now is a circle which I think is supposed to represent the entire outer hull of the station. It's so much smaller on the inside than it is on the outside. It never made much sense to me. This new ESD though really drives home how large the base is by being only a small cutout section of the circle.
So I would say on the aspect of making the player feel like they're on a massive starbase, you guys nailed it. Absolutely nailed it.
Could we get the small, medium and large ship interiors retrofitted to use the new ESD aesthetic at some point? After visiting the tailor area I would really like to see something similar used for ours ships too.
Loving the new ESD, mighty fine piece of work. Realising its incomplete I won't comment on missing or misplaced consoles, instead here are the issues I feel need addressing;
Move Pag the Ferengi Trader to join the other Ferengi outside the Tailor
Railings need a smoother transition on angle changes
NPCs are clipping on benches
Raise the sun so that it shines thought the ceiling windows yet still visible from the command section
Align the angle of Dry Docks outside the command windows
Shuttlebay needs more Danubes and less Yellowstones
Remove the glowy plants and replace with Earth ones
Water appears green and not blue
There is no ceremony location, I take it this will get removed
Chairs are Starship Captain Chairs, replace with more standard type
place a security gate or security officers at the transporter to at least give the impression its a secure area
Medical is fantastic but a few consoles are too low and like benches
By far the most glorious changes is the lack of a disco, THANK YOU THANK YOU! Going to ESD and hearing dance music on an operating starbase was the biggest immersion killer ever!
Keep in mind guys that the map is broken and unfinished. They really just wanted to throw us a nice pick-me-up to show what they've been up to!
Yes, but also keep in mind that they asked for bug reports and feedback on it, in more than one location (so that they don't miss anything), before it goes live.
I kind of get the impression that you don't want to do *any* walking in the game at all. So I guess you'd just want a blank map with a menu... which sounds lame.
I didn't say a blank map with menu's, but it would be better than being a rat in a maze, which this new ESD feels like. I thought the idea was to make ESD easier to use and navigate, all it is now is a new layout and cosmetic overhaul, all of which will be changed in a couple of years, if STO is still going. Yes some of it looks good, but when you come to use the new ESD you will find it not as convenient as you first thought it was.
I didn't say a blank map with menu's, but it would be better than being a rat in a maze, which this new ESD feels like. I thought the idea was to make ESD easier to use and navigate, all it is now is a new layout and cosmetic overhaul, all of which will be changed in a couple of years, if STO is still going. Yes some of it looks good, but when you come to use the new ESD you will find it not as convenient as you first thought it was.
I think you're severely overestimating how confusing this new layout is and underestimating how confusing the current one is. Plus, you're forgetting that you've probably had years to get used to how things are.
Symmetrical designs aren't that great for new players - everything merges into one when you try and remember what is where.
By far the most glorious changes is the lack of a disco, THANK YOU THANK YOU! Going to ESD and hearing dance music on an operating starbase was the biggest immersion killer ever!
That's because the club isn't finished yet. It will be there, and this time it's a 2 story club. You can see the space it will be at behind the transporter.
Bloody Hell Taco!!!
You and the team have out done your selves on the ESD, I understand the unfinished nature of it so far, but it looks fantastic.
However Could you add a bit more consistency with uniforms, like making sure all the NPC's in certain roles have the correct department colours and appropriate ranks.
I don't mind players in kits and armour but seeing it on the ESD (safe in Fed space) covered in grenade satchels and wearing armour is a bit disconcerting.
If you need it why not have the security teams in MACO armour?
My final point on uniforms is consistency, I think that it's the Sierra and Antares uniforms in ESD, however some NPC's are wearing Jupiter uniforms, or the Veteran uniform (Such as Quinn's aid).
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Looks really great and promissing. Some NPC contacts seem to be missing (didn't see any security officer) and some consoles are out of place, but that's the kind of work I'm happy to see in STO.
Bugs and issues (some of which are most probably work in progress, but still...):
Looks really great and promissing. Some NPC contacts seem to be missing (didn't see any security officer) and some consoles are out of place, but that's the kind of work I'm happy to see in STO.
The security officer is there, but for some reason she is marked as "Ensign Medic."
It's not myfault ifyoufeel trolledbymyDisco ball...Sorry'boutit.
I kind of get the impression that you don't want to do *any* walking in the game at all. So I guess you'd just want a blank map with a menu... which sounds lame.
Actually, while I love, love, love the new ESD, one thing I think would make sense in MMOs would be what I'd call "taxi paths". That is to say, you state where you want to go from a menu (in well trafficked hubs) and your character auto-walks there along a pre-defined path at a low speed, kinda like how taxi mounts work in ********. These could be setup as information consoles around ESD, Qo'noS, etc.
Then you can focus on DOffing while your character auto-pilots between destinations. This simulates the real life experience of walking between points that you know well while reading a book or using a smart phone. The tradeoff would be that you are reduced to a slow walking speed while your character plays an animation of walking slowly and reviewing a data padd. If you want to go somewhere fast, you go there manually.
Ensign Medic NPC near Sulu - Meant to be security Officer (deals wit contraband/prisoners etc).
Console by Ensign Medic - just says interact - it actually gives out a fed combat environmental suit (so what exactly is this meant to do)?
Numerous sound cut outs almost certainly based on where the camera is located rather than the person - too numerous/random to specify each case. Sound cutouts in Sickbay area also. Another is Club 47.
Exchange consoles on the ceiling.
Players being able to use their powers in ESD Interior - if you want to avoid a drama cryptic you'd better fix this. This also makes it really hard to tell if NPC's are broken in ANY way as they could be reacting to events around them.
e.g run up to the tailor window and look along the glass - the sound cuts out and when you enter the tailors office.
Going in the water grants no wet animation.
Bank/Account bank console - just says interact (would help if it said Bank Access or something more helpful).
Voth Medic - his interaction box says Open Door and asks you to pick 2 Boffs.
Console outside Club 47 floating in mid air.
Can't find Commander Hilo/Stateroom for the promotion stuff.
Map looks incomplete.
Oddly acting NPCs. ALL of them still have thie old background in the dialogue windows. Some you can brush off as no need to change but some clearly are old and have no relevance in the new ESD (i.e. Quin and NCP that gives Tour mission, Sulu).
[*]CAUTION: Most NPC are at a very very low level - unless you can guarantee no 'KDF visitors' you might want to raise their levels.
Linnea - sitting in an invisible seat.
Assignment Officer - interacting emote where there is no obvious console she's interacting with.
Sulu interacting with console where here is no console.
Commander Burgess - appears to be interacting with someone....who isn't there unless he's talking aloud/to himself.
Lieutenant Commander Okret (skill trainer) - interacting with a console which is behind him (wrong emote or wrong alignment?).
Bridge Officer Trainer and Elsa Mora (Boff req officer)- reckon they could be placed better than just standing in front of a desk.
Ensign Lessa - holding a phaser pistol - also a sign that NPC's might be reacting to events - yo have been warned.
Lieutenant Commander Arut (dil req officer) - standing out of a sensible place and holding a weapon - another sign NPCs might roam free if provoked.
2 Rock em Sock em robots in exchange room.
Chief engineer officer - interacting with console where no console is present.
Lt Laurel - keeps going in to console interact mode where no console is present if she isn't spoken to by anyone.
Shalah (ec req officer) - interacting with console where no console is active when people stop talking to her.
Ensign Byarnez- uncertain if she's misplaced.
Captain Yim is....holding a drink and socialising with no one - looking out across the ships. Also his dialogue box is from the old club 47.
Ensign Tessmer - stuck in 'meaning against wall emote near sickbay holding a weapon.
lt Yaris and lt Jotun - talking to no one in front of them - also Lt Jotun is holding a weapon.
DJ Zuza - no idea how they are meant ot be a DJ with no equipment.
Ensign Velde - no means to serve food and drinks.
Lt Commander Ophlim - pointing to no one.
Golos Vell (by transporter - interacting with console that isnt there.
Really like the new ESD though - it's an example of where Cryptic has really done it's work and should use this to take care of elements that are buggy and really need a going over.
I have a feeling that might be an intentional omission. Doesn't really add anything to the game.
In that case it shouldn't be mentioned as a place to go - which it was intentionally added so can only assume they've yet to add the area. Put it this way,m when people get the optional mission they won't have a clue where to go.
What I don't like about it at all is it's layout. The whole station gives a very chill out and holiday themed atmosphere. And in the midst of that you can suddenly switch all your ships etc. To me that kind of disturbes the immersion. It looks like a park, not like some place where you'd actually do such kind of business.
If your looking for commander hilo, he is by the new water feature stuck half way through a bench, he still gives you a " attended promotion ceremony " mini mission but where?
My feedback: Thank you. Seriously, thank you. This is a beautiful change for the game and will go down as my absolutely favorite artistic update. Well done, Cryptic!
What I don't like about it at all is it's layout. The whole station gives a very chill out and holiday themed atmosphere. And in the midst of that you can suddenly switch all your ships etc. To me that kind of disturbes the immersion. It looks like a park, not like some place where you'd actually do such kind of business.
I'd have to go looking, but I recall in a post by Taco (?) that his idea of a new ESD would make it more civilian than military to play up the idea that ESD is an open starbase; people from all over are coming and going--it's not just a Starfleet facility.
Plus one of the complaints levied at TNG's interior design was that it all felt a bit too relaxed and hotel-like. It's sort of nice to have something similar to that without it being an exact replica of it.
Actually, while I love, love, love the new ESD, one thing I think would make sense in MMOs would be what I'd call "taxi paths". That is to say, you state where you want to go from a menu (in well trafficked hubs) and your character auto-walks there along a pre-defined path at a low speed, kinda like how taxi mounts work in ********. These could be setup as information consoles around ESD, Qo'noS, etc.
Then you can focus on DOffing while your character auto-pilots between destinations. This simulates the real life experience of walking between points that you know well while reading a book or using a smart phone. The tradeoff would be that you are reduced to a slow walking speed while your character plays an animation of walking slowly and reviewing a data padd. If you want to go somewhere fast, you go there manually.
BRILLIANT idea. Though I'd like to think that by the 25th century we've become detached from our smart devices. Or that there's a Starfleet regulation against walking whilst using a PADD.
What I don't like about it at all is it's layout. The whole station gives a very chill out and holiday themed atmosphere. And in the midst of that you can suddenly switch all your ships etc. To me that kind of disturbes the immersion. It looks like a park, not like some place where you'd actually do such kind of business.
Imagine what's gonna happen when Q shows up again.
Plus one of the complaints levied at TNG's interior design was that it all felt a bit too relaxed and hotel-like. It's sort of nice to have something similar to that without it being an exact replica of it.
I can understand those complaints on the Enterprise-D to a certain degree (The E-E's interior was perfect), but in Spacedock especially I have a different view.
Wide open space, water, trees and plant life. These things give a sense of life. Having spent several six month deployments on an Aircraft Carrier let me tell you, that when you get off the ship, it's the trees and life that really gets you. An all steel ship is....sterile. Lifeless and that is something that Starfleet would seek to avert. Especially if you're going on a five to seven + year mission where you won't see home for a long time, the Starship does need to be comfortable. And Spacedock with all of that space also has a need to be a welcoming environment. Think about it, it's a port. For some people it's the last piece of the Federation they're going to see for a long time, and for others it's the first piece of the Federation they might see ever. It's the front door to Earth the UFP capitol.
Besides you have all that space, why would you clutter it up with every scrap of military materiel you can when you can leave it open and beautiful and keep everyone's stress down with big vistas of Earth and the ships in the bay.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
Comments
Man, am I ever thrilled with this... so much awesome it's difficult to put into words! Love it... great job! Now onto ship interiors maybe?
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
I kind of get the impression that you don't want to do *any* walking in the game at all. So I guess you'd just want a blank map with a menu... which sounds lame.
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
The one thing that really sticks out to me is that it makes ESD feel large like a space station of that size should. What I mean is, the ESD on holodeck right now is a circle which I think is supposed to represent the entire outer hull of the station. It's so much smaller on the inside than it is on the outside. It never made much sense to me. This new ESD though really drives home how large the base is by being only a small cutout section of the circle.
So I would say on the aspect of making the player feel like they're on a massive starbase, you guys nailed it. Absolutely nailed it.
I love it.
Mine Trap Supporter
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
By far the most glorious changes is the lack of a disco, THANK YOU THANK YOU! Going to ESD and hearing dance music on an operating starbase was the biggest immersion killer ever!
Yes, but also keep in mind that they asked for bug reports and feedback on it, in more than one location (so that they don't miss anything), before it goes live.
I hope they find a place for the ceremonies again, twas one of my favorite RP things to do on ESD.
peter
I didn't say a blank map with menu's, but it would be better than being a rat in a maze, which this new ESD feels like. I thought the idea was to make ESD easier to use and navigate, all it is now is a new layout and cosmetic overhaul, all of which will be changed in a couple of years, if STO is still going. Yes some of it looks good, but when you come to use the new ESD you will find it not as convenient as you first thought it was.
I think you're severely overestimating how confusing this new layout is and underestimating how confusing the current one is. Plus, you're forgetting that you've probably had years to get used to how things are.
Symmetrical designs aren't that great for new players - everything merges into one when you try and remember what is where.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzBxpfcXh28
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
It looks like a shop that sells guns. Unless maybe that was the point. Either way, it just feels off.
Maybe add some security officers guarding it?
Also the vendor is wearing a science/medical uniform.
That's because the club isn't finished yet. It will be there, and this time it's a 2 story club. You can see the space it will be at behind the transporter.
Mine Trap Supporter
You and the team have out done your selves on the ESD, I understand the unfinished nature of it so far, but it looks fantastic.
However Could you add a bit more consistency with uniforms, like making sure all the NPC's in certain roles have the correct department colours and appropriate ranks.
I don't mind players in kits and armour but seeing it on the ESD (safe in Fed space) covered in grenade satchels and wearing armour is a bit disconcerting.
If you need it why not have the security teams in MACO armour?
My final point on uniforms is consistency, I think that it's the Sierra and Antares uniforms in ESD, however some NPC's are wearing Jupiter uniforms, or the Veteran uniform (Such as Quinn's aid).
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
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- Help info text from the initial transporter NPC needs to be updated, as it still gives the old directions
- All NPCs still use the old ESD background images
- Some doors are missing (1), (2)
- The upper area next to the transporter could use some railings. It doesn't look particuarly safe
- Not sure why, but some NPCs have their weapons drawn out.
- This one is supporting an invisible wall
- That's some really ugly Miranda featured here...
- NPCs need some consoles to work with
- Especially these ones, it's just weird for them to be standing there
Suggestions:
- Add the Excelsior class to the ESD interior. For the nostalgia factor, which I guess is one of your goals here. The excelsior, along with the Enterprise, was the first ship to be seen inside the ESD in two movies. It was also one of the first ship models to be featured behind the window of the "old" ESD, to eventually disappear completely from sight, for no apparent reason. Think about it.
- Partially related to the one above, add some life to the "lounge" area near the window. Once again, nostalgia factor.
Here's how it looks currently (kind of empty and bland)
Here's what we've seen in the movie, in a very similar area.
Add some plant life, some tables and such and it would look really nice in my opinion.
Feedback:
Looks really great and promissing. Some NPC contacts seem to be missing (didn't see any security officer) and some consoles are out of place, but that's the kind of work I'm happy to see in STO.
Sidenote:
Voyager style sickbay? Things to come? :P
The security officer is there, but for some reason she is marked as "Ensign Medic."
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
Actually, while I love, love, love the new ESD, one thing I think would make sense in MMOs would be what I'd call "taxi paths". That is to say, you state where you want to go from a menu (in well trafficked hubs) and your character auto-walks there along a pre-defined path at a low speed, kinda like how taxi mounts work in ********. These could be setup as information consoles around ESD, Qo'noS, etc.
Then you can focus on DOffing while your character auto-pilots between destinations. This simulates the real life experience of walking between points that you know well while reading a book or using a smart phone. The tradeoff would be that you are reduced to a slow walking speed while your character plays an animation of walking slowly and reviewing a data padd. If you want to go somewhere fast, you go there manually.
Console by Ensign Medic - just says interact - it actually gives out a fed combat environmental suit (so what exactly is this meant to do)?
Numerous sound cut outs almost certainly based on where the camera is located rather than the person - too numerous/random to specify each case. Sound cutouts in Sickbay area also. Another is Club 47.
Exchange consoles on the ceiling.
Players being able to use their powers in ESD Interior - if you want to avoid a drama cryptic you'd better fix this. This also makes it really hard to tell if NPC's are broken in ANY way as they could be reacting to events around them.
e.g run up to the tailor window and look along the glass - the sound cuts out and when you enter the tailors office.
Going in the water grants no wet animation.
Bank/Account bank console - just says interact (would help if it said Bank Access or something more helpful).
Voth Medic - his interaction box says Open Door and asks you to pick 2 Boffs.
Console outside Club 47 floating in mid air.
Can't find Commander Hilo/Stateroom for the promotion stuff.
Map looks incomplete.
Oddly acting NPCs. ALL of them still have thie old background in the dialogue windows. Some you can brush off as no need to change but some clearly are old and have no relevance in the new ESD (i.e. Quin and NCP that gives Tour mission, Sulu).
[*]CAUTION: Most NPC are at a very very low level - unless you can guarantee no 'KDF visitors' you might want to raise their levels.
I have a feeling that might be an intentional omission. Doesn't really add anything to the game.
R.I.P. Leonard Nimoy
In that case it shouldn't be mentioned as a place to go - which it was intentionally added so can only assume they've yet to add the area. Put it this way,m when people get the optional mission they won't have a clue where to go.
What I don't like about it at all is it's layout. The whole station gives a very chill out and holiday themed atmosphere. And in the midst of that you can suddenly switch all your ships etc. To me that kind of disturbes the immersion. It looks like a park, not like some place where you'd actually do such kind of business.
Also, where is Malcolm?
The Armada
Original join date: Feb 5, 2010
Twitter: @davejl_99, & @STO_BBArmada
I'd have to go looking, but I recall in a post by Taco (?) that his idea of a new ESD would make it more civilian than military to play up the idea that ESD is an open starbase; people from all over are coming and going--it's not just a Starfleet facility.
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
I can understand those complaints on the Enterprise-D to a certain degree (The E-E's interior was perfect), but in Spacedock especially I have a different view.
Wide open space, water, trees and plant life. These things give a sense of life. Having spent several six month deployments on an Aircraft Carrier let me tell you, that when you get off the ship, it's the trees and life that really gets you. An all steel ship is....sterile. Lifeless and that is something that Starfleet would seek to avert. Especially if you're going on a five to seven + year mission where you won't see home for a long time, the Starship does need to be comfortable. And Spacedock with all of that space also has a need to be a welcoming environment. Think about it, it's a port. For some people it's the last piece of the Federation they're going to see for a long time, and for others it's the first piece of the Federation they might see ever. It's the front door to Earth the UFP capitol.
Besides you have all that space, why would you clutter it up with every scrap of military materiel you can when you can leave it open and beautiful and keep everyone's stress down with big vistas of Earth and the ships in the bay.