I'm having a great time reading those in Colm Meaney's voice.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
mix betwen a number of star trek "characters" in no specific order.
1. wesley crusher. shut up wesley!
2. jj abrams. no comment!
3. janeway. reckless beyond reason.
best?
1. Lwaxana Troi. especially when hunting picard as a boyfriend .
2. Garak. just because.
3. Jeffery Combs. such a cool recurring feature of trek.
4. Charles Tucker. by far the best actor on trek, he showed a lot of flair and skill with his acting the best he could make it, better then any of the wooden acting trek has had the last 50 years.
T6 Miranda Hero Ship FTW. Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Best: Spock, Scotty, Riker, Picard, Data, LaForge, Q, O'Brien
Worst: Neelix, Dax, Janeway.
Disclaimer: I dimly remember latter DS9/Voyager episodes, and I have not seen Enterprise.
Current Server:Mindflayer
History Class in the Realms: "Elves did it better first. Also, magic was probably involved somehow and maybe gods. Or godly magic. Now go outside so the orcs and bandits have someone to menace."
Worst: every one-off female character in TOS, particularly those that Kirk...courted. Remember Turnabout Intruder? *facepalm*
My Old Blog about things that could and should have been added when I wrote it. Not sure what I want to do with it now. I'll just keep it available now that most of it is outdated.
I finally figured out what they use nelix for, he just runs his butt around the ship doing chores for the senior officers.
Trio was annoying, as Q put it she was doing a continuous physicobabble. When she went to talk to the other officers about their feelings it was only because Dr. Phil wasn't on. I really like Quark, Sisko, Data, Picard, Jadzia, Worf, and of course Morn because he's Morn.
I don't like Janeway because she helped the Borg fight the Undine.
Spock: Leonard Nimoy pretty much invented playing a regularly recurring alien on television. He invented all things Vulcan. When you think of the first Klingons you can see the actors did very little work inventing a species. Director's have ONE WEEK to get an episode from nothing to "in the can", so you can hardly blame them.
Shran. Again, I'm pretty much picking at actor's portrayals here, but the guy should teach an master class on acting while wearing prosthetics.
Khan: Ricardo, that is. Everything about his charater was over the top...it had to be.
Commissioner Bele: Frank Gorshin had a masterful way of bringing Tony-like performances to the screen without overdoing the theatricality. He was even like that in Batman.
Worst List:
Mayweather: there are a couple episodes (especially the last season, when everyone knew the show was over) where you can actually see his lips moving to the other charater's lines and he has this blank stare like "who cares, I'm just waiting for my queue".
Q. John de Lancie is a good actor...I just couldn't get into the whole Q character. There was just something about the contiuum paying so much attention to Picard without (what I would call) sufficently valid reason.
The Doctor. What kind of Doctor would get away with so continusously infringing upon patient confidentiality. "Oh, that Lt. Barkley has a variety of ailments, such as holo-addiction..." etc. etc. Why did Robert Picardo never say anything about this during production meetings???
Tores. Only because she has an AMAZING singing voice (watch "A Chorus Line"). It would have been a nice nod to TOS episodes gione by that featured music. They could have invented a female Klingon ritual that involved singing.
Well, at least some/most of them had character. NOT Rom though - no; he was literally a walking clich?. The 'geek who gets the girl' thing was just ridiculous - it felt forced. It felt unnatural. It was, in my opinion, the most uninteresting and pointless relationship in Trek. And aside from occasionally spouting 'I love my brother' clich?s, what did he do?
Sorry - I know some may have liked him, but I never found anything interesting about him and his character was, to me, nothing more than a dumping ground for clich?s that unimaginative writers threw around because they didn't know what else to do with him.
Totally agree, Rom did nothing but irritate me... It's not like the writers couldn't write Ferengis well, Brunt, Nog, Quark, all awesome... Rom going from idiot minion to qualified engineer was ludicrous. Now if he could have been assigned to fix that faulty airlock on the docking ring, and be seen floating past Ops sans EVA suit, that would have been his best scene, and about all his character deserved...
I agree. To write a strong woman, take Picard and switch Dame Judi Dench for Sir Patrick Stewart. Easy.
I disagree. To write a strong women write an interesting and strong character, let this character be played by any good actress and let her act like a human being.
Kate Mulgrew was actually a more then capable enough actress and could have been awesome, if they hadn't over stressed her.
She always had to be right (in the writers opinion), because "the strong female lead" could not make mistakes, that wo be a bad female cliche. She always had to be filmed in a way standing higher then every one else.
Sisko, Picard and Kirk never needed that kind of treatment. Even Archer didn't.
The reason why Sisko as "the black captain" worked and Janeway as "the female Captain" didn't is the fact that (most times) Sisko was "just" a Captain that happened to be black, which is something that doesn't matter in the 24th century.
Janeway always needed that special treatment, she was not a Captain that happened to be female, that fact had to be stressed again and again, in almost every scene in some way.
For best and worst.
The Probably best is Picard, although my favorite is clearly (and will ever be) Worf.
the worst is clearly Neelix. not even Wesley was that annoying.
I disagree. To write a strong women write an interesting and strong character, let this character be played by any good actress and let her act like a human being.
Kate Mulgrew was actually a more then capable enough actress and could have been awesome, if they hadn't over stressed her.
She always had to be right (in the writers opinion), because "the strong female lead" could not make mistakes, that wo be a bad female cliche. She always had to be filmed in a way standing higher then every one else.
Exactly. Picard makes mistakes; hell, he had to beg Q for help once. Even the Sisko makes mistakes, and the Sisko is literally a god. Janeway is a Mary Sue writers' pet who does things that IRL would be classified as utterly insane.
Sisko, Picard and Kirk never needed that kind of treatment. Even Archer didn't.
The reason why Sisko as "the black captain" worked and Janeway as "the female Captain" didn't is the fact that (most times) Sisko was "just" a Captain that happened to be black, which is something that doesn't matter in the 24th century.
Janeway always needed that special treatment, she was not a Captain that happened to be female, that fact had to be stressed again and again, in almost every scene in some way.
This exactly. The obvious repressed homosexuality was icing on the cake, but the shoddy writing and "Janeway-is-perfect" mentality among the writers caused the bulk of the problems.
For best and worst.
The Probably best is Picard, although my favorite is clearly (and will ever be) Worf.
the worst is clearly Neelix. not even Wesley was that annoying.
Agreed. Picard is best, maybe Data. Worf is my fave, too, though.
Wesley gets a reprieve in my book because he was only on for one season and a few episodes after that, and because I'm a huge Wil Wheaton fanboy. Neelix, though...he was on for all seven interminable seasons. My friends call him the "spotty ******". Why they keep him on board, when his cooking is actively hazardous to the ship, is a mystery.
Wesley gets a reprieve in my book because he was only on for one season and a few episodes after that, and because I'm a huge Wil Wheaton fanboy. Neelix, though...he was on for all seven interminable seasons. My friends call him the "spotty ******". Why they keep him on board, when his cooking is actively hazardous to the ship, is a mystery.
I'm kind of disappointed that will Wheaton doesn't want to make Wesley cameo/VoiceOver in sto. I agree that he's an awesome guy and could redeem the weseley character a bit more.
And after all, I actually liked Wesley in prety much all cameos he made after he left the series as a regular.
Even as a regular I didn't have that much of an issue with him after he got a real uniform and I was able to ignore the incredibly dump backstory of him beeing a honor caused officer with no real academy education outranking more experienced and trained people and ultimately beeing a senior officer on the flagship (a post lots of more qualified people would gladly give their hand for...)
And after all he left the series early, and even without him early tng would not have been gold.
Neelix the pedophile hedgehog on the other hand.... We had to suffer through seeing him being insufferable in general, commanding arround superiors, claiming to be an expert at everything while failing at everything and even getting people killed with his false expertise while still everyone cosidered him... Expert at everything.
And neither back then nor now I ever met a person liking him. He was just as hated as jar jar binks. The only difference: after episode 1 George Lucas understood that fans did not like jar jar, despite it beeing Lucas favorite. So he at least kept jar jars appearances to a minimum in episode 2 and 3.
But Neelix was not tone down or anything. He stood arround for almost 7 seasons...
Like I said, sometimes when the other officers need their TRIBBLE done they always tell neelix to do it for them and he couldn't care less. He is the perfect way to not keep the crew tired from doing chores. Plus that's about all he was good for anyways.
I disagree. To write a strong women write an interesting and strong character, let this character be played by any good actress and let her act like a human being.
Something they talked about in episode 32 of The Foundry Roundtable when they asked Terilynn about writing strong female characters. In a military setting like Starfleet, a "strong female character" is just a strong character that incidentally happens to have TRIBBLE. If you could switch the character's gender without affecting the script outside of romance plots (and with homosexuality becoming less and less taboo, even that's starting to change), you've hit the sweet spot.
Take Samantha Carter from Stargate SG-1. With the exception of her being half in love with Jack O'Neill, she could've been Samuel Carter and the scripts would have needed no changes (apart from that cringeworthy "reproductive organs" bit in the pilot). Heck, they even joke about that once, with an alien asking what "Sam" means and her wisecracking that it means "that my dad wanted a boy."
Exactly. Picard makes mistakes; hell, he had to beg Q for help once. Even the Sisko makes mistakes, and the Sisko is literally a god. Janeway is a Mary Sue writers' pet who does things that IRL would be classified as utterly insane.
Not to mention things that are capital crimes in real-life militaries, like aiding the enemy in "Scorpion" as I've been arguing in the General Discussion forum. But no, since she's our wonderful protagonist who can do no wrong, she gets away scot free when Chakotay, or frankly anyone else on the command crew, should have relieved her of command right then and there and thrown her into the brig for the rest of the trip.
"Great War! / And I cannot take more! / Great tour! / I keep on marching on / I play the great score / There will be no encore / Great War! / The War to End All Wars"
— Sabaton, "Great War"
starswordc is right; to write a strong female character, write a strong character who happens to be female.
If I were to retcon all of my stories with Three and make her male, the only thing that would change is that she'd be dating someone other than her first officer. She'd act the same way, grow her hair stupidly long the same way, flip off important people the same way...
In the same vein, you could make Jean-Luc Picard into Jeanne Picard, and it wouldn't change a thing. Just switch Sir Patrick Stewart out for Dame Judi Dench, and you have a powerfully epic female character.
Janeway is...well, not the most stable person. She's addicted to a mind-altering substance, makes phenomenally bad decisions, allies with known enemies of the Federation--the f*cking BORG, no less--and trades Federation technology to random species in flagrant violation of the Prime Directive. She's outright unfit for command, at best.
Voyager needs a maaaaaaaaaaaajor rewrite. I could write a better plot in my sleep, TBH.
Worst: every one-off female character in TOS, particularly those that Kirk...courted. Remember Turnabout Intruder? *facepalm*
Damar had some great lines.
Weyoun: The Founder, she wishes to see me. She has to be told about this.
Damar: Oh, I'm sure she'll understand. But if she doesn't, I look forward to meeting Weyoun 9.
You're going to have to comment. Elaborate on what it was in Abrams' performance that caused you to rate him the worst. I mean all he did was provide the voice over for a stuntman's scene. What made that "the worst" ?
starswordc is right; to write a strong female character, write a strong character who happens to be female.
Janeway is...well, not the most stable person.
I think the only other weaker female character in the same theme, is Lt.Commander Joanne Galloway in A Few Good Men... Her need for Kaffee's approval was embarrassing and painful, not to mention the numerous times he displayed disrespect toward her as a superior officer, yet she never called him on it... Janeway's almost a mirror of that personality, but just as flawed...
Starfleet and the Federation seem to agree with that since she was promoted to Admiral.
She was made Admiral, because it was a way of giving her a desk job and off active service, so she couldn't inflict herself on the galaxy anymore... They might have increased her rank, but I certainly wouldn't consider it as a promotion
She was made Admiral, because it was a way of giving her a desk job and off active service, so she couldn't inflict herself on the galaxy anymore... They might have increased her rank, but I certainly wouldn't consider it as a promotion
If they thought she was such a threat, they wouldn't have promoted her to Vice Admiral. They'd have let her rot at Rear Admiral or have discharged her.
Comments
I'm having a great time reading those in Colm Meaney's voice.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
mix betwen a number of star trek "characters" in no specific order.
1. wesley crusher. shut up wesley!
2. jj abrams. no comment!
3. janeway. reckless beyond reason.
best?
1. Lwaxana Troi. especially when hunting picard as a boyfriend
2. Garak. just because.
3. Jeffery Combs. such a cool recurring feature of trek.
4. Charles Tucker. by far the best actor on trek, he showed a lot of flair and skill with his acting the best he could make it, better then any of the wooden acting trek has had the last 50 years.
Been around since Dec 2010 on STO and bought LTS in Apr 2013 for STO.
Worst: Neelix, Dax, Janeway.
Disclaimer: I dimly remember latter DS9/Voyager episodes, and I have not seen Enterprise.
Worst: every one-off female character in TOS, particularly those that Kirk...courted. Remember Turnabout Intruder? *facepalm*
Trio was annoying, as Q put it she was doing a continuous physicobabble. When she went to talk to the other officers about their feelings it was only because Dr. Phil wasn't on. I really like Quark, Sisko, Data, Picard, Jadzia, Worf, and of course Morn because he's Morn.
I don't like Janeway because she helped the Borg fight the Undine.
My best list has to be
Spock: Leonard Nimoy pretty much invented playing a regularly recurring alien on television. He invented all things Vulcan. When you think of the first Klingons you can see the actors did very little work inventing a species. Director's have ONE WEEK to get an episode from nothing to "in the can", so you can hardly blame them.
Shran. Again, I'm pretty much picking at actor's portrayals here, but the guy should teach an master class on acting while wearing prosthetics.
Khan: Ricardo, that is. Everything about his charater was over the top...it had to be.
Commissioner Bele: Frank Gorshin had a masterful way of bringing Tony-like performances to the screen without overdoing the theatricality. He was even like that in Batman.
Worst List:
Mayweather: there are a couple episodes (especially the last season, when everyone knew the show was over) where you can actually see his lips moving to the other charater's lines and he has this blank stare like "who cares, I'm just waiting for my queue".
Q. John de Lancie is a good actor...I just couldn't get into the whole Q character. There was just something about the contiuum paying so much attention to Picard without (what I would call) sufficently valid reason.
The Doctor. What kind of Doctor would get away with so continusously infringing upon patient confidentiality. "Oh, that Lt. Barkley has a variety of ailments, such as holo-addiction..." etc. etc. Why did Robert Picardo never say anything about this during production meetings???
Tores. Only because she has an AMAZING singing voice (watch "A Chorus Line"). It would have been a nice nod to TOS episodes gione by that featured music. They could have invented a female Klingon ritual that involved singing.
Worst: The entire cast of Enterprise.
worst-- old Troi
Point, that.
Totally agree, Rom did nothing but irritate me... It's not like the writers couldn't write Ferengis well, Brunt, Nog, Quark, all awesome... Rom going from idiot minion to qualified engineer was ludicrous. Now if he could have been assigned to fix that faulty airlock on the docking ring, and be seen floating past Ops sans EVA suit, that would have been his best scene, and about all his character deserved...
I disagree. To write a strong women write an interesting and strong character, let this character be played by any good actress and let her act like a human being.
Kate Mulgrew was actually a more then capable enough actress and could have been awesome, if they hadn't over stressed her.
She always had to be right (in the writers opinion), because "the strong female lead" could not make mistakes, that wo be a bad female cliche. She always had to be filmed in a way standing higher then every one else.
Sisko, Picard and Kirk never needed that kind of treatment. Even Archer didn't.
The reason why Sisko as "the black captain" worked and Janeway as "the female Captain" didn't is the fact that (most times) Sisko was "just" a Captain that happened to be black, which is something that doesn't matter in the 24th century.
Janeway always needed that special treatment, she was not a Captain that happened to be female, that fact had to be stressed again and again, in almost every scene in some way.
For best and worst.
The Probably best is Picard, although my favorite is clearly (and will ever be) Worf.
the worst is clearly Neelix. not even Wesley was that annoying.
What do you have against porthos?! :mad:
Which is exactly what I'm suggesting.
Exactly. Picard makes mistakes; hell, he had to beg Q for help once. Even the Sisko makes mistakes, and the Sisko is literally a god. Janeway is a Mary Sue writers' pet who does things that IRL would be classified as utterly insane.
This exactly. The obvious repressed homosexuality was icing on the cake, but the shoddy writing and "Janeway-is-perfect" mentality among the writers caused the bulk of the problems.
Agreed. Picard is best, maybe Data. Worf is my fave, too, though.
Wesley gets a reprieve in my book because he was only on for one season and a few episodes after that, and because I'm a huge Wil Wheaton fanboy. Neelix, though...he was on for all seven interminable seasons. My friends call him the "spotty ******". Why they keep him on board, when his cooking is actively hazardous to the ship, is a mystery.
I'm kind of disappointed that will Wheaton doesn't want to make Wesley cameo/VoiceOver in sto. I agree that he's an awesome guy and could redeem the weseley character a bit more.
And after all, I actually liked Wesley in prety much all cameos he made after he left the series as a regular.
Even as a regular I didn't have that much of an issue with him after he got a real uniform and I was able to ignore the incredibly dump backstory of him beeing a honor caused officer with no real academy education outranking more experienced and trained people and ultimately beeing a senior officer on the flagship (a post lots of more qualified people would gladly give their hand for...)
And after all he left the series early, and even without him early tng would not have been gold.
Neelix the pedophile hedgehog on the other hand.... We had to suffer through seeing him being insufferable in general, commanding arround superiors, claiming to be an expert at everything while failing at everything and even getting people killed with his false expertise while still everyone cosidered him... Expert at everything.
And neither back then nor now I ever met a person liking him. He was just as hated as jar jar binks. The only difference: after episode 1 George Lucas understood that fans did not like jar jar, despite it beeing Lucas favorite. So he at least kept jar jars appearances to a minimum in episode 2 and 3.
But Neelix was not tone down or anything. He stood arround for almost 7 seasons...
Something they talked about in episode 32 of The Foundry Roundtable when they asked Terilynn about writing strong female characters. In a military setting like Starfleet, a "strong female character" is just a strong character that incidentally happens to have TRIBBLE. If you could switch the character's gender without affecting the script outside of romance plots (and with homosexuality becoming less and less taboo, even that's starting to change), you've hit the sweet spot.
Take Samantha Carter from Stargate SG-1. With the exception of her being half in love with Jack O'Neill, she could've been Samuel Carter and the scripts would have needed no changes (apart from that cringeworthy "reproductive organs" bit in the pilot). Heck, they even joke about that once, with an alien asking what "Sam" means and her wisecracking that it means "that my dad wanted a boy."
Not to mention things that are capital crimes in real-life militaries, like aiding the enemy in "Scorpion" as I've been arguing in the General Discussion forum. But no, since she's our wonderful protagonist who can do no wrong, she gets away scot free when Chakotay, or frankly anyone else on the command crew, should have relieved her of command right then and there and thrown her into the brig for the rest of the trip.
— Sabaton, "Great War"
Check out https://unitedfederationofpla.net/s/
If I were to retcon all of my stories with Three and make her male, the only thing that would change is that she'd be dating someone other than her first officer. She'd act the same way, grow her hair stupidly long the same way, flip off important people the same way...
In the same vein, you could make Jean-Luc Picard into Jeanne Picard, and it wouldn't change a thing. Just switch Sir Patrick Stewart out for Dame Judi Dench, and you have a powerfully epic female character.
Janeway is...well, not the most stable person. She's addicted to a mind-altering substance, makes phenomenally bad decisions, allies with known enemies of the Federation--the f*cking BORG, no less--and trades Federation technology to random species in flagrant violation of the Prime Directive. She's outright unfit for command, at best.
Voyager needs a maaaaaaaaaaaajor rewrite. I could write a better plot in my sleep, TBH.
Damar had some great lines.
Weyoun: The Founder, she wishes to see me. She has to be told about this.
Damar: Oh, I'm sure she'll understand. But if she doesn't, I look forward to meeting Weyoun 9.
Worst: Archer, Neelix, Janeway
You're going to have to comment. Elaborate on what it was in Abrams' performance that caused you to rate him the worst. I mean all he did was provide the voice over for a stuntman's scene. What made that "the worst" ?
Hold up. How can the Enterprise cast be the worst in all of Trek if it includes this man?
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Thy'lek_Shran
I really really REALLY wish the next time they do a Shon scene in STO, they have him call Admiral Quinn pink skin. Just as a nod to Shran.
I think the only other weaker female character in the same theme, is Lt.Commander Joanne Galloway in A Few Good Men... Her need for Kaffee's approval was embarrassing and painful, not to mention the numerous times he displayed disrespect toward her as a superior officer, yet she never called him on it... Janeway's almost a mirror of that personality, but just as flawed...
She was made Admiral, because it was a way of giving her a desk job and off active service, so she couldn't inflict herself on the galaxy anymore... They might have increased her rank, but I certainly wouldn't consider it as a promotion
If they thought she was such a threat, they wouldn't have promoted her to Vice Admiral. They'd have let her rot at Rear Admiral or have discharged her.
Trials of Blood and Fire
Moving On Parts 1-3 - Part 4
In Cold Blood
Shran is made of 100% awesome. He's the reason I have an Andorian character in STO and I'm positive he's the reason Captain Shon even exists.