A hollow sphere will, regardless of mass, have zero net gravity inside. You'll need some artificial means regardless of how heavy the sphere is. Atificial means are, at least, pretty much Trivial in Star Trek.
All matter in space pulls on other matter proportionately to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the distance between them. An object on the surface of a sphere of that size would definitely be influenced by its mass, thus the sphere would have gravity because it's warping the spacetime that surrounds it.
Imagine you had a giant ring laid on a giant sheet of fabric. The ring would pull the fabric down, creating a well. Now, the center of the fabric would go with the surrounding fabric because the fabric isn't elastic enough and is also effected by the gravity in the room. We could simulate how real spacetime behaves by placing a post in the center at the same height as the fabric. Now, just like spacetime, the fabric would have a ring-shaped well. So when you place a bearing anywhere on the fabric, it would be attracted to the ring. This would be the same for a hollow sphere of sufficient mass. Spacetime would be warped towards the surface of the sphere and all objects within its well would be attracted to the surface of the sphere.
Go here and show your support for a better Foundry!
All matter in space pulls on other matter proportionately to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the distance between them. An object on the surface of a sphere of that size would definitely be influenced by its mass, thus the sphere would have gravity because it's warping the spacetime that surrounds it.
Imagine you had a giant ring laid on a giant sheet of fabric. The ring would pull the fabric down, creating a well. Now, the center of the fabric would go with the surrounding fabric because the fabric isn't elastic enough and is also effected by the gravity in the room. We could simulate how real spacetime behaves by placing a post in the center at the same height as the fabric. Now, just like spacetime, the fabric would have a ring-shaped well. So when you place a bearing anywhere on the fabric, it would be attracted to the ring. This would be the same for a hollow sphere of sufficient mass. Spacetime would be warped towards the surface of the sphere and all objects within its well would be attracted to the surface of the sphere.
In the case of a spherically symmetric mass distribution we can conclude (by using a spherical Gaussian surface) that the field strength at a distance r from the center is inward with a magnitude of G/r2 times only the total mass within a smaller distance than r. All the mass at a greater distance than r from the center can be ignored.
For example, a hollow sphere does not produce any net gravity inside. The gravitational field inside is the same as if the hollow sphere were not there (i.e. the resultant field is that of any masses inside and outside the sphere only).
Although this follows in one or two lines of algebra from Gauss's law for gravity, it took Isaac Newton several pages of cumbersome calculus to derive it directly using his law of gravity; see the article shell theorem for this direct derivation.
All matter exerts gravity, however, if the gravitational forces on an object balance in all directions, the net force is zero. Examples include lagrange points and, as per the link, any point inside a hollow sphere.
According to the Memory Alpha wiki, a single Omega Particle had enough destructive force to destroy 29 Borg vessels. The Dyson Sphere's produce millions of the little suckers. Raw power is not an issue.
Hmm, somehow my lowly Attack Pattern Omega looks a lot less significant now. :P
On-Topic: It's pretty easy, really: just change the gravitational constant of the universe, thereby altering the mass of the Dyson Sphere... Oh wait, we were gonna leave Q out of it.
And now completely serious, I don't expect a Dyson Sphere to have Impulse Thrusters. If it uses some sort of space-folding technology, the mass of the Sphere would be irrelevant (as it wouldn't be truly moving itself, but rather energy would have to go to the space-folding device).
Gravity is what holds the "air" down. There's no steam between Earth, and the sun, because it escapes into space, on account of there's no Dyson Sphere holding it in.
I was pointing out the necessity of a forcefield in your model, between breathable air (atmosphere), and the "space" above it, because the only gravity well in a Dyson Sphere is the one the star itself, sits in.
Inertial dampeners are a fiction that's never quite fully explained. Suffice to say it's a major technological achievement, equal, if not greater than warp drives. Being that there is no outside force of gravity allowing people to walk on the inside walls of the sphere, you'd have to have inertial dampeners cover, every inch of the inside of the sphere. Or have the thing spinning enough to generate centrifugal force, in which case they'd need gyroscopic stabilization to move parallel to the axis. Or magnetic boots. Otherwise people would just float of the surface into the sun. You follow?
Highlighted the bad science. Steam or evaporation of water rises as it is lighter than the air pressure around it. As it rises it spreads and also cools. It will then condense into large masses we call clouds. These when cooled will return the surface as precipitation. It does not escape the gravity well.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
All matter exerts gravity, however, if the gravitational forces on an object balance in all directions, the net force is zero. Examples include lagrange points and, as per the link, any point inside a hollow sphere.
I think I see it now. The gravity on the outside act as if the center of mass is in the center of the sphere and the inner surface acts on an object as if the entire surface is the center of mass. So you have the center of the object and the surface both acting like the center of mass. So no matter where you are, the forces pulling toward the center and toward the surface are equal. That nets you zero gravity inside the sphere. So the only way to create the effect of gravity would be to give the sphere sufficient angular moment so that the inertia of objects would cause them to settle on the surface of the sphere.
Go here and show your support for a better Foundry!
I really do not understand this debate. Are we suggesting that a species could create a Dyson Sphere but would be incapable of also creating gravity plating to keep the continents and people on the interior surface? Heck, starships have gravity plating to keep everyone from floating around.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
I really do not understand this debate. Are we suggesting that a species could create a Dyson Sphere but would be incapable of also creating gravity plating to keep the continents and people on the interior surface? Heck, starships have gravity plating to keep everyone from floating around.
Oh yeah, this thread went to Crazytown a looooong time ago...
...talking to players is like being a mall Santa. Everyone immediately wants to tell you all of the things they want, and you are absolutely powerless to deliver 99% of them.
I really do not understand this debate. Are we suggesting that a species could create a Dyson Sphere but would be incapable of also creating gravity plating to keep the continents and people on the interior surface? Heck, starships have gravity plating to keep everyone from floating around.
Exactly. Forcefields and Artificial Gravity is something that Star Trek had since the beginning and they go a long way in making a Dyson Sphere feasible. If a race is capable of building a Dyson Sphere, then they are capable of solving any problem that might arise from creating the Dyson Sphere.
If I were to build a Dyson Sphere, then I would go with a modular approach. Each section of the Dyson Sphere would be a self-contained module that contains energy generation systemss and means to support an ecosystem which would include propulsion systems, forcefields, and gravity generators. Therefore, the Dyson Sphere would be livable after the first section is done and moved to its appropriate location instead of waiting thousands of years for the entire Sphere to be completed. Each section would be capable with docking with the other sections so eventually the sections would be a completely enclosed system. This method would have greater safety than other Dyson Sphere setups since devastating one side of the Sphere won't endanger the other side and this system is capable of being created by the 25th Century Federation since they can already create a module.
On a related note, I just finished watching "relics". The non existence of "omega particles", isn't the only continuity error. Why does Scotty behave as if Kirk is still alive, when he was there when Kirk got sucked into the Nexus?
1. Generations was created years after Relics.
2. Unless there is a body, then expect that the "deceased" will show up eventually. Scott was stuck in the Transporter 1 year after Kirk disappeared. So he could have assumed that Kirk somehow was saved or appeared somewhere else while he was indisposed. After all, Kirk survived worse than disappearing through the Nexus.
3. Scotty was stuck in a transporter for 75 years. If forgetting that Kirk vanished in the Nexus is the extent of surviving that, then he should consider himself lucky.
I think you're gonna need considerably more than is contained on all the ships in Starfleet, Ace. And unless you believe that they are magical gravity plates that don't require a power source, or don't ever burn out, who maintains them? How big is the engineering department on a starship? How big would it have to be for a Dyson Sphere?
Well, Deuce, since they are harvesting 100% of the energy output of a star - not to mention the potential for Omega Particles - I really do not believe energy requirements are that big of a deal. YMMV.
STO is about my Liberated Borg Federation Captain with his Breen 1st Officer, Jem'Hadar Tactical Officer, Liberated Borg Engineering Officer, Android Ops Officer, Photonic Science Officer, Gorn Science Officer, and Reman Medical Officer jumping into their Jem'Hadar Carrier and flying off to do missions for the new Romulan Empire. But for some players allowing a T5 Connie to be used breaks the canon in the game.
I think you're gonna need considerably more than is contained on all the ships in Starfleet, Ace. And unless you believe that they are magical gravity plates that don't require a power source, or don't ever burn out, who maintains them? How big is the engineering department on a starship? How big would it have to be for a Dyson Sphere?
Aliens built the Dyson Sphere not the Federation so they would have better gravity plates, power sources, and automated maintenance systems than anything the Federation has. Just because creating a Dyson Sphere that supports life and has been around for thousands of years is beyond the capability of the 25th Century Federation, doesn't been it is beyond the capabilities of more advanced races.
Yeah, and after so many modules in, you'd have to go back and replace worn out modules. Time marches on, even in the 25th century. Something that's 200,000,000 in diameter would be built over thousands of years.
And how is that any different than building the Dyson Sphere the standard way? Thousands of years will have passed for the first section and would have to be replaced. At least with my method, there is immediate benefit to the Dyson Sphere unlike the standard model.
The biggest thing with moving the spheres isn't the spheres or the masses themselves, atleast not in trek, a big enough drive and enough power could move anything any distance....
its the stars that they're surrounding that would indeed be the biggest trek and physics problem, unless the stars are left behind and they just move to a different star, but from what I've gathered from the episode that's not what happened. Moving the stars in trek science is the biggest part of those things moving, though I'd imagine they can bs their way something through it with the amount of omegas that are being generated.
Something for the op to remember, that on the shows, the only times they approached things with that kind of advanced tech or power abilities (iconian gateway, borg transwarp, caretaker, the gateway) it was always something that they could easily show on the show, but you think if they did a star trek show with todays graphic abilities and the advanced tech they wouldn't do stuff like moving an entire dyson sphere? After some of the stuff they had Q do, come on, if they set a show in the 24 or 2500, or even jumping ahead slightly further like the temporal division enterprise j stuff.... with the even further advanced tech they'd be pulling a stargate and flying cities and stuff around, who knows what else. All of it would be explained by some massive new drive or subspace doodad...
And how is that any different than building the Dyson Sphere the standard way? Thousands of years will have passed for the first section and would have to be replaced. At least with my method, there is immediate benefit to the Dyson Sphere unlike the standard model.
a better question is: How many Solanae were working on the project? We really don't know how many there were or how long it took at all....
I think you're gonna need considerably more than is contained on all the ships in Starfleet, Ace. And unless you believe that they are magical gravity plates that don't require a power source, or don't ever burn out, who maintains them? How big is the engineering department on a starship? How big would it have to be for a Dyson Sphere?
Hold on, so in TNG Riker explains why you never see anyone with a vacuum or duster (ship can clean itself).
In TNG you see the Exocomps. Little machines that can go fix other machines and do repair work and replacements.
In DS9 we see a mine field where the mines can "reproduce" (replace themselves, that just sounds funny )
And YOU want to question, if a species is capable of building a Dyson Sphere, would they be able to look after it, long after they were dead ?????
Really ????
Now I know for sure you are trolling.
Everything you have stated has been countered or shot down, you are just grasping at straws now.
Hold on, so in TNG Riker explains why you never see anyone with a vacuum or duster (ship can clean itself).
In TNG you see the Exocomps. Little machines that can go fix other machines and do repair work and replacements.
In DS9 we see a mine field where the mines can "reproduce" (replace themselves, that just sounds funny )
And YOU want to question, if a species is capable of building a Dyson Sphere, would they be able to look after it, long after they were dead ?????
Really ????
Now I know for sure you are trolling.
Everything you have stated has been countered or shot down, you are just grasping at straws now.
Yeah, for all we know the swarmers are really Robotic custodians that just happen to be shielded and lightly armed.....
Bad science? There's no air pressure in space! Byproducts of helium combustion are shed into space from the heat generated by thermal currents. They continue in the direction they were going unless another force acts upon them. And there are no liquid vapor clouds in the sun's corona either, it's too hot. If this is all bad science to you, then what is good science? Let me guess, a Dyson Sphere?
On a related note, I just finished watching "relics". The non existence of "omega particles", isn't the only continuity error. Why does Scotty behave as if Kirk is still alive, when he was there when Kirk got sucked into the Nexus?
You are the one that brought up steam. I am assuming you meant from the inner surface of the dyson sphere going toward the star. And it should not reach. The atmosphere should thin to effectively nothing leaving vacuum between the habitat area and the star. You were also the one mentioning steam escaping gravity.
As to Relics. . I liked that episode, but I agree the writers never consider continuity when they write later things. (Either make it seem Scotty did not know Kirk was lost or not use him for Generations. Heck the best place for him in Generations should have been him boarding the Jenolan as Kirk and Chekov went to see the Enterprise B.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
It's not. They're an impossibility, more suited to Mother Goose stories, than science fiction. That's all I'm saying.
So in other words because someone couldn't imagine that space travel and manned flight was possible 1000 years ago, then they are impossibilities and we are just hallucinating that air travel is a common occurrence and some people traveled to the moon? We don't know enough to be able to determine if Dyson Spheres are an impossibility or not since the Dyson Sphere is dependent on various technologies. Our knowledge about what is possible and what is not possible is practically non-existent. Obviously we can't do it with our technology at this point in time and probably for another few hundred years, but millions of years from now if we still exist, then creating a Dyson Sphere could be child's play.
Obviously, you should be looking for some other game to play since Star Trek is all about "impossibilities". In fact, all soft science fiction is about "impossibilities". Q, Prophets, Warp Travel, Teleporters, Apollo, space creatures, and tons of other Star Trek content are "impossibilities" that may be proven or not.
You are the one that brought up steam. I am assuming you meant from the inner surface of the dyson sphere going toward the star. And it should not reach. The atmosphere should thin to effectively nothing leaving vacuum between the habitat area and the star. You were also the one mentioning steam escaping gravity.
As to Relics. . I liked that episode, but I agree the writers never consider continuity when they write later things. (Either make it seem Scotty did not know Kirk was lost or not use him for Generations. Heck the best place for him in Generations should have been him boarding the Jenolan as Kirk and Chekov went to see the Enterprise B.)
MY personal head canon explanation for Scotty's behaviour is that Scotty came to the conclusion that Kirk wasn't dead at some point after the past part of Generations was done. how/why? Well... he's a genius engineer. He's got the brainpower to analyze the data acquired from the incident.
Heck... he might have come to that conclusion while trying to figure out a way to enhance the transporters to overcome the type of interference he struggled with when beaming people off those transport ships.
I agree with the OP, it is simply NOT possible. The other side to this is that a lot of whats going on in the dyson sphere is complete rubbish, when they first came up with the release, i was expecting an exploration mission that turns into a rescue mission of the original habitants of the sphere, coupled together with an attempt by the klingons to try and steal the sphere from the feds, and we (as the captains) have to stop this from happening, and then to throw a spanner in the works you learn that the sun is about to go supernova.
something along them kinda lines. Not this complete made up stuff. and yes sci-fi and fantasy are SIMILAR. but the difference is sci-fi is based on science that is POSSIBLE either now or in the future, and fantasy is COMPLETE make believe.
They need to pack it in. If they are struggling for ideas then there are always the trek books to turn to such as the invasion books etc. Im sure there are loads of stories they can take and then tweek slightly to fit into this game. Vanguard with the shedi creature would be a great one to have. Dreams of the raven, would be another, the Furies (out of the invasion books) would be an amazing enemy and be a great on going story line for over the year.
jeffel82 is right in that most Treknology is ludicrous. But I would amend that to say that most Treknology starts out as ludicrous, until it becomes REAL!!!
MY personal head canon explanation for Scotty's behaviour is that Scotty came to the conclusion that Kirk wasn't dead at some point after the past part of Generations was done. how/why? Well... he's a genius engineer. He's got the brainpower to analyze the data acquired from the incident.
Heck... he might have come to that conclusion while trying to figure out a way to enhance the transporters to overcome the type of interference he struggled with when beaming people off those transport ships.
I read one of the star trek books and it explained in there that scotty went back with a fed ship and scanned the area looking and for kirk and he never believed that he was dead. and he backed this up by saying that there was NO remains at ALL. no debris from the ships or anything. so your idea is kinda accurate when compared to the books.
But then it boils down to if you believe the books are cannon or not. (i kinda count them as cannon) lol
The easiest explanation to me for Scotty's confusion is that, before putting himself in transporter stasis, he finished off all the booze on the ship and was still blitzed when they pulled him back out.
Comments
All matter in space pulls on other matter proportionately to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the distance between them. An object on the surface of a sphere of that size would definitely be influenced by its mass, thus the sphere would have gravity because it's warping the spacetime that surrounds it.
Imagine you had a giant ring laid on a giant sheet of fabric. The ring would pull the fabric down, creating a well. Now, the center of the fabric would go with the surrounding fabric because the fabric isn't elastic enough and is also effected by the gravity in the room. We could simulate how real spacetime behaves by placing a post in the center at the same height as the fabric. Now, just like spacetime, the fabric would have a ring-shaped well. So when you place a bearing anywhere on the fabric, it would be attracted to the ring. This would be the same for a hollow sphere of sufficient mass. Spacetime would be warped towards the surface of the sphere and all objects within its well would be attracted to the surface of the sphere.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauss's_law_for_gravity#Spherically_symmetric_mass_distribution
All matter exerts gravity, however, if the gravitational forces on an object balance in all directions, the net force is zero. Examples include lagrange points and, as per the link, any point inside a hollow sphere.
Hmm, somehow my lowly Attack Pattern Omega looks a lot less significant now. :P
On-Topic: It's pretty easy, really: just change the gravitational constant of the universe, thereby altering the mass of the Dyson Sphere... Oh wait, we were gonna leave Q out of it.
And now completely serious, I don't expect a Dyson Sphere to have Impulse Thrusters.
Highlighted the bad science. Steam or evaporation of water rises as it is lighter than the air pressure around it. As it rises it spreads and also cools. It will then condense into large masses we call clouds. These when cooled will return the surface as precipitation. It does not escape the gravity well.
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
I think I see it now. The gravity on the outside act as if the center of mass is in the center of the sphere and the inner surface acts on an object as if the entire surface is the center of mass. So you have the center of the object and the surface both acting like the center of mass. So no matter where you are, the forces pulling toward the center and toward the surface are equal. That nets you zero gravity inside the sphere. So the only way to create the effect of gravity would be to give the sphere sufficient angular moment so that the inertia of objects would cause them to settle on the surface of the sphere.
It could, but that gravity would only run perpendicular to the axis of rotation - along the "Equator," for lack of a better term.
Oh yeah, this thread went to Crazytown a looooong time ago...
Exactly. Forcefields and Artificial Gravity is something that Star Trek had since the beginning and they go a long way in making a Dyson Sphere feasible. If a race is capable of building a Dyson Sphere, then they are capable of solving any problem that might arise from creating the Dyson Sphere.
If I were to build a Dyson Sphere, then I would go with a modular approach. Each section of the Dyson Sphere would be a self-contained module that contains energy generation systemss and means to support an ecosystem which would include propulsion systems, forcefields, and gravity generators. Therefore, the Dyson Sphere would be livable after the first section is done and moved to its appropriate location instead of waiting thousands of years for the entire Sphere to be completed. Each section would be capable with docking with the other sections so eventually the sections would be a completely enclosed system. This method would have greater safety than other Dyson Sphere setups since devastating one side of the Sphere won't endanger the other side and this system is capable of being created by the 25th Century Federation since they can already create a module.
1. Generations was created years after Relics.
2. Unless there is a body, then expect that the "deceased" will show up eventually. Scott was stuck in the Transporter 1 year after Kirk disappeared. So he could have assumed that Kirk somehow was saved or appeared somewhere else while he was indisposed. After all, Kirk survived worse than disappearing through the Nexus.
3. Scotty was stuck in a transporter for 75 years. If forgetting that Kirk vanished in the Nexus is the extent of surviving that, then he should consider himself lucky.
Aliens built the Dyson Sphere not the Federation so they would have better gravity plates, power sources, and automated maintenance systems than anything the Federation has. Just because creating a Dyson Sphere that supports life and has been around for thousands of years is beyond the capability of the 25th Century Federation, doesn't been it is beyond the capabilities of more advanced races.
And how is that any different than building the Dyson Sphere the standard way? Thousands of years will have passed for the first section and would have to be replaced. At least with my method, there is immediate benefit to the Dyson Sphere unlike the standard model.
its the stars that they're surrounding that would indeed be the biggest trek and physics problem, unless the stars are left behind and they just move to a different star, but from what I've gathered from the episode that's not what happened. Moving the stars in trek science is the biggest part of those things moving, though I'd imagine they can bs their way something through it with the amount of omegas that are being generated.
Something for the op to remember, that on the shows, the only times they approached things with that kind of advanced tech or power abilities (iconian gateway, borg transwarp, caretaker, the gateway) it was always something that they could easily show on the show, but you think if they did a star trek show with todays graphic abilities and the advanced tech they wouldn't do stuff like moving an entire dyson sphere? After some of the stuff they had Q do, come on, if they set a show in the 24 or 2500, or even jumping ahead slightly further like the temporal division enterprise j stuff.... with the even further advanced tech they'd be pulling a stargate and flying cities and stuff around, who knows what else. All of it would be explained by some massive new drive or subspace doodad...
My character Tsin'xing
Hold on, so in TNG Riker explains why you never see anyone with a vacuum or duster (ship can clean itself).
In TNG you see the Exocomps. Little machines that can go fix other machines and do repair work and replacements.
In DS9 we see a mine field where the mines can "reproduce" (replace themselves, that just sounds funny
And YOU want to question, if a species is capable of building a Dyson Sphere, would they be able to look after it, long after they were dead ?????
Really ????
Now I know for sure you are trolling.
Everything you have stated has been countered or shot down, you are just grasping at straws now.
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic." - Arthur C. Clarke
My character Tsin'xing
You are the one that brought up steam. I am assuming you meant from the inner surface of the dyson sphere going toward the star. And it should not reach. The atmosphere should thin to effectively nothing leaving vacuum between the habitat area and the star. You were also the one mentioning steam escaping gravity.
As to Relics. . I liked that episode, but I agree the writers never consider continuity when they write later things. (Either make it seem Scotty did not know Kirk was lost or not use him for Generations. Heck the best place for him in Generations should have been him boarding the Jenolan as Kirk and Chekov went to see the Enterprise B.)
Originally Posted by pwlaughingtrendy
Network engineers are not ship designers.
Nor should they be. Their ships would look weird.
So in other words because someone couldn't imagine that space travel and manned flight was possible 1000 years ago, then they are impossibilities and we are just hallucinating that air travel is a common occurrence and some people traveled to the moon? We don't know enough to be able to determine if Dyson Spheres are an impossibility or not since the Dyson Sphere is dependent on various technologies. Our knowledge about what is possible and what is not possible is practically non-existent. Obviously we can't do it with our technology at this point in time and probably for another few hundred years, but millions of years from now if we still exist, then creating a Dyson Sphere could be child's play.
Obviously, you should be looking for some other game to play since Star Trek is all about "impossibilities". In fact, all soft science fiction is about "impossibilities". Q, Prophets, Warp Travel, Teleporters, Apollo, space creatures, and tons of other Star Trek content are "impossibilities" that may be proven or not.
Heck... he might have come to that conclusion while trying to figure out a way to enhance the transporters to overcome the type of interference he struggled with when beaming people off those transport ships.
My character Tsin'xing
something along them kinda lines. Not this complete made up stuff. and yes sci-fi and fantasy are SIMILAR. but the difference is sci-fi is based on science that is POSSIBLE either now or in the future, and fantasy is COMPLETE make believe.
They need to pack it in. If they are struggling for ideas then there are always the trek books to turn to such as the invasion books etc. Im sure there are loads of stories they can take and then tweek slightly to fit into this game. Vanguard with the shedi creature would be a great one to have. Dreams of the raven, would be another, the Furies (out of the invasion books) would be an amazing enemy and be a great on going story line for over the year.
I read one of the star trek books and it explained in there that scotty went back with a fed ship and scanned the area looking and for kirk and he never believed that he was dead. and he backed this up by saying that there was NO remains at ALL. no debris from the ships or anything. so your idea is kinda accurate when compared to the books.
But then it boils down to if you believe the books are cannon or not. (i kinda count them as cannon) lol
This is entirely in keeping with his character.