I am worried that this type of attitude and this type of play in Ker'rat is what keeps many Feds out of the FvK Q's
I would much rather them make Ker'rat a neutral zone where Feds can farm free if they want - and instead have the Q's pop on a much faster and more consitent basis.
As someone pointed out most of the Feds are doing FvF - maybe they have been scared off of FvK PvP
This needs to change or PvP is dead in STO(more so for the KDF)
AS a fed who goes to kerrat to PVP not farm im telling you know FEDS if you come there to farm and not fight I will not come to your rescue when you are attacked I will let them bomb you over and over again there are other places to farm !!! it pisses me off to no end when we load in and the side are about even then I look around and its usually me and like one other stying to fight the klinks as I watch the feds run away to farm .....so klinks seriously please go into the zone and squash the famers!!! we will make this a pvp zone like it should be and farmers you don't wanna die ? stay out of kerrat !!! go farm somewhere else.....(grumbles something about carebears).......ty
I really think in a game where PvP isn't the focus, the ideal is invariably something like WoW's AV.
There's lots of unpredictable PvP that goes on through a map like that but pretty much every aspect of the design and every redesign Bluzz did was to push people into PvE goals and avoid turtling.
The core idea is this: to win efficiently, you actually need 3/4ths of your side working together on PvE. Mindless kills and breaking from the group will cost your team the match. But a handful of PvP stragglers can turn the match.
If maybe 1 in 5 players PvP, you need match designs around the idea of 20% engaged in strategic upsets and player killing.
There are a number of playstyles I'd propose for this but none of them just involve dropping two teams in a match and having them duke it out. Setup a private duel if you want that. Cryptic scenarios need to be more engaging to more player types.
One idea I've had is to adapt the mafia/werewolf party game. 10 players on a map. The lights go out. Nameplates go blank. One player gets flagged as the killer and gets to go on a spree. The lights come back up. Everyone tries to guess the killer. The match ends when they do or when the killer has killed everyone.
Another idea is to have a Redjac themed scenario where one player is made the killer but is given dramatically boosted stats and takes on 4 players. When that player dies, another one gets picked and everyone hunts them. It goes on until one player remains.
I only PvP for the daily missions. And even then I might do it once a month. I dont like the crazy elitist Pvpers that are out there. I just fly in and die to end the match.
STO is my only MMO so I don't know how others work.
Can you cross the other factions area without getting attacked? Like you can go to Sol/qo'nos if you have diplo immunity or Mauruading?
Are most areas neutral grounds where waring factions hang out like in STO?
How do the other Big MMO's work?
It varies. A lot.
But a couple of popular approaches seem to involve two things:
Designated areas where everyone PvPs.
A flagging system. When your flag is on, PvP combat is enabled. As a general rule, this flag is disabled in key social hubs for everyone. And then things like server type or special instances can force it on. In many games or server types for example, you may have it disabled by default but doing things like attacking guards or entering certain enemy cities without permission would force it on.
In many respects, it can be a bit like threat level in Grand Theft Auto only with the native population of players assisting the police.
And then on PvP servers, effectively, your threat level never goes down to zero.
That would be another fairly novel approach to PvP, if they actually had an open zone with some Grand Theft Auto style mechanics. Only made it three sided, effectively with the default being an untargetable neutral but options to go multiple stages into threat and zone defense and reasons for anyone to go any direction.
Tried it, expecting to lose for being new to it. Didn't disappoint when jumped by 4 guys and lasted not quite 30 seconds on my longest life once the shooting started. Really what am I supposed to do with that many people coordinating and unloading on me? However then came all the insulting PMs. Completely unnecessary, just poor sportsmanship. Pricks.
Tried again a few days later. Different people, same slaughter, same attitude after the fact.
A few days later, give it a third try. See above.
I knew I was going to lose, but I expected the people involved to behave like adults, not poster-children for GIFT. Based on that and so many comments around here of snobs who talk down to anyone not part of their little club, TRIBBLE it. Having to associate with such people simply isn't worth my time.
Don't get mad, get even. Become the ganker, the spawn camper. Get a B'rel and learn how to fustrate people endlessly and laugh as they can do nothing about you constanly firing and sci spamming while cloaked. Mine the spawn in Kerrat to get all the trash talkers back on reset. You always die a lot when starting out, just more motivation to come up with something to get even. Put a sci in a B'rel and follow trash talkers in kerrat cloaked, don't try to kill them, just keep subnuccing and sci spamming them while cloaked for lulz, there is so much fun to be had in pvp and in kerrat especially.
Don't get mad, get even. Become the ganker, the spawn camper. Get a B'rel and learn how to fustrate people endlessly and laugh as they can do nothing about you constanly firing and sci spamming while cloaked. Mine the spawn in Kerrat to get all the trash talkers back on reset. You always die a lot when starting out, just more motivation to come up with something to get even.
Actually firing off any sci skill in a B'rel causes you to de-cloak just like firing torps does. flying a B'rel is fun but very tricky - there are so many ways you can be de-cloaked - then you are left with the same amount of hull and shilds as a Yellowstone Runabout.
Its interesting to me how this game has all the safety-net features and yet people still dont want to do it. No item-loss on death, heck you can even re-enter the same zone right away. In theory its got the same low-noise combat as COD or the like, just run and gun, respawn and repeat. But people stay away from it.
Few reasons why. The biggest thing for the game as a whole is that combat is noob-hostile with all the abilities and timers and modifier values. I have a good idea about them now, but I am still learning, most PVPers are way past me on all this stuff and its embarrassing to watch me fight them. With COD you pick up a gun and go fight, here you have to manage an orchestra just to survive past the alpha.
Another big reason (for me personally) is the lack of item balance, IE you get some ships/consoles/abilities that just TRIBBLE over everything else (JHAS and JHAC are obvious examples-, but there are more), and whether you think this is a P2W game or not, where there are superior items for sale there are wallet warriors buying them.
So yeah, I PVP with newb ships that have limited weapon and console slots, because I'm able to keep track of those, and I'm not worried about somebody flying a bug ship at level 15.
Actually firing off any sci skill in a B'rel causes you to de-cloak just like firing torps does. flying a B'rel is fun but very tricky - there are so many ways you can be de-cloaked - then you are left with the same amount of hull and shilds as a Yellowstone Runabout.
Yeah I know it reveals for a couple secs again since they fixed the subterfuge boff, but still easy as long as you are out of firing arc and use hull resist abilities like aux2sif, Ph, and/or abilities like jam or AMS if needed. I still rarely die in mine.
I think lots of people need to play both factions to get into pvp to really enjoy it. I used to play fed only first and didn't pvp much at first, and especially avoided kerrat and FvK at first due to B'rels firing while cloaked, and DBB/torp bop spikers. Once I level up my first KDF alt I got better at pvp by being the hunter in kerrat, and when I would play my fed again I never avoided FvK or kerrat due to knowing the BOP and other abilities/consoles KDF has and what to expect.
Maybe if some of these feds would just level up their KDF alt only to play around with the BOP a little they could learn to play their fed better afterward.
Don't get mad, get even. Become the ganker, the spawn camper. Get a B'rel and learn how to fustrate people endlessly and laugh as they can do nothing about you constanly firing and sci spamming while cloaked. Mine the spawn in Kerrat to get all the trash talkers back on reset. You always die a lot when starting out, just more motivation to come up with something to get even. Put a sci in a B'rel and follow trash talkers in kerrat cloaked, don't try to kill them, just keep subnuccing and sci spamming them while cloaked for lulz, there is so much fun to be had in pvp and in kerrat especially.
Oh it was over a year ago. Anger is long gone, and I'm much better now than I was then anyways. But skill isn't the problem; I know if I dived into a ring where a reaction time of less than a second makes the difference between life or death, I'd improve further. I'd have to. But I'd have spent my time and effort on something that grants me no reward and lowered me to the level of those sorts of morons. They're not worth it. That's the crux of my post. Its not the losing or the difficulty or the time or the faction (love my Odyssey and Fleet Vor'cha both), its the people. Let 'em rot.
AS a fed who goes to kerrat to PVP not farm im telling you know FEDS if you come there to farm and not fight I will not come to your rescue when you are attacked I will let them bomb you over and over again there are other places to farm !!!
They make it one of the dailies. That brings people there to actually complete the mission. That being said, it's not a big deal. The mission reset puts everyone back in their corner. Spawn camping's not as bad as I've seen it in other games.
Also, you can't blame people for wanting to "farm" the one zone that for years has dropped the best items in the game randomly. Cryptic made it that way.
You're all Kerrat Farmers who got jumped by the KDF. Bothered because you can't farm in peace in a PVP zone For shame on PVPers seeking PVP in a PVP zone!
It's funny, because even when I PUG PVP in the queues, the atmosphere between players is pretty mellow. Sure, there's the poor sport here and there, but by and large, it's mellow.
PVP is the only bonafide challenge in this game. You encounter a variety of builds and player skills. And combat against a player is far more exciting than anything the PVE portion of the game offers. Players can be predictable or not. PVE? The only reason why there's any sort of challenge in PVE is due to cheap game design:
Pvp needs to be fun and worth while to do, I think if they open up pvp more in bigger areas the balance issues will be less of a problem that it is in small arena fights. Territory control pvp would be a good way of making pvp interesting again. I have some ideas on how it could work in STO for both space and ground pvp. If Elder Scrolls Online ends being successful with territory control pvp being a big part of it, Cryptic could cash in on the success of it by bringing that kind of game play into STO. Can pvp be saved? I think so, the interest is still there but as it stands now pvp sucks and the queues reflect that.
You're all Kerrat Farmers who got jumped by the KDF. Bothered because you can't farm in peace in a PVP zone For shame on PVPers seeking PVP in a PVP zone!
It's funny, because even when I PUG PVP in the queues, the atmosphere between players is pretty mellow. Sure, there's the poor sport here and there, but by and large, it's mellow.
PVP is the only bonafide challenge in this game. You encounter a variety of builds and player skills. And combat against a player is far more exciting than anything the PVE portion of the game offers. Players can be predictable or not. PVE? The only reason why there's any sort of challenge in PVE is due to cheap game design:
[AI Death Ray of One Shotting Mk XIII [LOLz]x3]
The rest of this game is faceroll.
That is why I am Arguing that they dev's do something about Ker'rat - it gives PvP a bad name in STO.
Almost never in Instanced PvP, whether capture or Arena do you get a lot of the trash talk and bad attitude you find in Ker'rat. Q'd PvP is very civilized on the whole and there is almost no camping and name- calling.
If there is a situation where almost all Feds are dead - most PvPers won't go too close to the spawns and will wait for most players to respawn - unless there are afkers or so that won't respawn - then it's just kill them to get it over with - which most Feds are fine with that - who wants to fight 2 on 5.
Many times when it has been 3 on 5 - several KDF players will just sit out and hang there - I saw a well known KDF bug player do that just the other day - rather than go in and faceroll the 3 feds still fighting.
Pvp needs to be fun and worth while to do, I think if they open up pvp more in bigger areas the balance issues will be less of a problem that it is in small arena fights. Territory control pvp would be a good way of making pvp interesting again.
I agree territory control maps would be good for the game, but it would be hard to implement that kind of map in the zone/instance model that this game uses, and I dont see how it would do anything for balance.
I don't PvP because it attracts the worst element of video game players in every other major gaming release over the last quarter century so after reading a lot of the gibberish some of the more tin foil hat wearing PvPers on this forum spew out, I stepped way out on a limb and took a guess that the same was likely true here.
Also, as someone that was in a FED fleet with a bunch of PvPers, the idea that KDF dominates PvP may be the single worst told lie in STO.
"We are smart." - Grebnedlog
Member of Alliance Central Command/boq botlhra'ghom
Enterprise in orbit around some rock...
Capt. Kirk: Oh no, the Klingon challenged me to PvP!
K9: We are in a starship.
Capt.: I haven't trained up for this!
K9: We are in a STARSHIP!
Capt.: I don't have a sword!
K9: Conn, fire the photons, full spread, continuous, toast that rock!
I agree territory control maps would be good for the game, but it would be hard to implement that kind of map in the zone/instance model that this game uses, and I dont see how it would do anything for balance.
I was thinking of something that was done in warhammer online. Create a sub map on the galaxy map that has either systems or bases that give benefits to the faction that control it. Each system will have a space and ground map that are instance and players can queue there. Each system will have a point value that is needed to take control of it, and wins in the instance matches contribute points for each faction. All levels of players can help in the point pool to take the system/base. That is the basic idea that can work with the current queue system that Cryptic has. I would make the matches big at least 20 vs 20 for space and ground battles.
What % of Feds PvP on a regular basis? What percent PvP ever?
Feds out number KDF at least 4 to 1 in the game - but in the PvP Q's - for Fed vs KDF it is usually 1 fed waiting and 5 KDF waiting.
So if you are a Fed why don't you come out and play with the KDF?
Have you ever joined Instanced PvP(the Q's - vs Ker'rat)?
Have you given up PvP?
You don't like PvP?
Other reasons?
Also added any suggestion you might think that would get you interested - or to come back?
I "retired" from PVP shortly before F2P's launch. I got tired of fighting hardcore teams in PuGs (and losing), Cryptic ignored PvP balance (which they are finally getting around over a year later, with no results), and I got seriously tired of playing on the same maps for 2 years (which no new maps since then).
I still PvP, but only in Private queues for farming marks and accolades.
I sort of liked STO PVP in the old days, when things were kept simple. Nowdays you got so many kinds of buffs and 1-shot kills that it just makes it completely unfun.
Even if they finally get around to adding Territorial Control, it would be too late. PvP in STO is so much of a joke it's better to find another game to do PvPing.
Tried it, expecting to lose for being new to it. Didn't disappoint when jumped by 4 guys and lasted not quite 30 seconds on my longest life once the shooting started. Really what am I supposed to do with that many people coordinating and unloading on me? However then came all the insulting PMs. Completely unnecessary, just poor sportsmanship. Pricks.
Tried again a few days later. Different people, same slaughter, same attitude after the fact.
A few days later, give it a third try. See above.
I knew I was going to lose, but I expected the people involved to behave like adults, not poster-children for GIFT. Based on that and so many comments around here of snobs who talk down to anyone not part of their little club, TRIBBLE it. Having to associate with such people simply isn't worth my time.
The attitude part is very much uncalled for. I will gladly trash talk someone if they start a good fight and then run away or do something else obviously cowardly but not in PM's and if I just blew them up repeatedly without them trying to really start anything I am not going to get on their case at all. Honestly, more good PvP'ers should try to give the folks they utterly destroy some tips and help after the fact.
As for me though, I PvP infrequently. I test builds in PvP a lot and I do the Instanced PvP sometimes. I rarely do Q'ed PvP unless I am grinding up a character and do not feel like doing the same story mission a hundred more times. The main reason though is that in the Q's it is usually you with a random assortment of folks who have no ability to coordinate and often little talent against a premade who obviously will defeat you regardless of how powerful you as a single ship are.
I don't PvP because it attracts the worst element of video game players in every other major gaming release over the last quarter century so after reading a lot of the gibberish some of the more tin foil hat wearing PvPers on this forum spew out, I stepped way out on a limb and took a guess that the same was likely true here.
Also, as someone that was in a FED fleet with a bunch of PvPers, the idea that KDF dominates PvP may be the single worst told lie in STO.
Hah, I can say the same with the elitist mentality in portions of the "main" part of a game, PVE.
You ever screwed things up in an STF? Or any raid, high-end PVE mission / quest? Mess up with a boss? Most especially in PUGs? This occurs in any mutiplayer game and MMORPG.
This has to be the most divided thread I have ever seen. We have an almost equal number for and against, I am so excited. What is not exciting me is that the people who are for pvp seem to be quite reasonable and fair while the people against are just coming off as a bunch of whiners.
Now I love pvp, I have always loved testing my skills against other players to see how I am doing both gear and general skill wise and it is an unfortunate truth that in many games the majority of pvpers are a bunch of jacked up yahoos who throw out insults at those they can't beat and cruelly mock those they one or two hit.
Fortunately in STO I have noticed the reverse, most of the pvpers I have met are a good bunch and are quick to offer advice if asked and are pleasant in general. Granted there are a few...ummm....well lets just say rude people I have bumped into but I never add pvpers to my ignore lists, I just frag them some more, that's the nice thing about pvp.
Now in regards to Ker'rat, well last week I was hanging out and everyone was having a good time, playful barbs being slung back and forth between the Fed and Kdf players. Then came the Fed who starting capping (yelling) at people because he was there to farm, not for a mission, he specifically said farm. Well I tried to offer some friendly advice on better places/ways to farm and next thing I know I get a slew of insulting pms.
Well naturally I did the right thing and immediately fragged his TRIBBLE. This resulted in several more pms. Well I guess I wasn't the only one he was beaking off because every Kdf in the zone locked on and scrapped him over and over. Eventually her moved to a different instance, well he ran into the same problems there and just kept freaking out.
Eventually he phased back into my zone, but I did not attack him, I just went about my business....until he decided to try and take revenge, well he just ended up as an expanding cloud of vapor.
Moral of the story. Don't like to pvp? Avoid the freaking pvp zones. Want to do some farming? Do your damn research, there are plenty of easier ways to farm then Ker'rat. Because if you come to Ker'rat and then whine and moan then you will end up being the target of every opposing player in the area. I have even seen a few people switch sides just to frag the whiners.
So stop complaining. Pvers have plenty of areas to do their thing. We Pvpers have ONE open space zone where we are able to have unrestricted pvp combat. 'Nuff said.
Hah, I can say the same with the elitist mentality in portions of the "main" part of a game, PVE.
You ever screwed things up in an STF? Or any raid, high-end PVE mission / quest? Mess up with a boss? Most especially in PUGs? This occurs in any mutiplayer game and MMORPG.
Yeah, thought so...
Tools exist in any part of any multiplayer game.
Exactly, you can find the same bad attitudes in pve gameplay.
except in PVP its more than just tools, its that thought that becuase you beat me at PVP you win at life, which is honestly the most sad, misguided thought I've ever heard. I have no interest in it myself, I had my competitive days back in 2006 and 2007 playing Semi-Pro CSS. These days I don't care if your better than me because there was a time I was in the top 500 players world wide on a game.
Comments
AS a fed who goes to kerrat to PVP not farm im telling you know FEDS if you come there to farm and not fight I will not come to your rescue when you are attacked I will let them bomb you over and over again there are other places to farm !!! it pisses me off to no end when we load in and the side are about even then I look around and its usually me and like one other stying to fight the klinks as I watch the feds run away to farm .....so klinks seriously please go into the zone and squash the famers!!! we will make this a pvp zone like it should be and farmers you don't wanna die ? stay out of kerrat !!! go farm somewhere else.....(grumbles something about carebears).......ty
There's lots of unpredictable PvP that goes on through a map like that but pretty much every aspect of the design and every redesign Bluzz did was to push people into PvE goals and avoid turtling.
The core idea is this: to win efficiently, you actually need 3/4ths of your side working together on PvE. Mindless kills and breaking from the group will cost your team the match. But a handful of PvP stragglers can turn the match.
If maybe 1 in 5 players PvP, you need match designs around the idea of 20% engaged in strategic upsets and player killing.
There are a number of playstyles I'd propose for this but none of them just involve dropping two teams in a match and having them duke it out. Setup a private duel if you want that. Cryptic scenarios need to be more engaging to more player types.
One idea I've had is to adapt the mafia/werewolf party game. 10 players on a map. The lights go out. Nameplates go blank. One player gets flagged as the killer and gets to go on a spree. The lights come back up. Everyone tries to guess the killer. The match ends when they do or when the killer has killed everyone.
Another idea is to have a Redjac themed scenario where one player is made the killer but is given dramatically boosted stats and takes on 4 players. When that player dies, another one gets picked and everyone hunts them. It goes on until one player remains.
Can you cross the other factions area without getting attacked? Like you can go to Sol/qo'nos if you have diplo immunity or Mauruading?
Are most areas neutral grounds where waring factions hang out like in STO?
How do the other Big MMO's work?
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
It varies. A lot.
But a couple of popular approaches seem to involve two things:
Designated areas where everyone PvPs.
A flagging system. When your flag is on, PvP combat is enabled. As a general rule, this flag is disabled in key social hubs for everyone. And then things like server type or special instances can force it on. In many games or server types for example, you may have it disabled by default but doing things like attacking guards or entering certain enemy cities without permission would force it on.
In many respects, it can be a bit like threat level in Grand Theft Auto only with the native population of players assisting the police.
And then on PvP servers, effectively, your threat level never goes down to zero.
That would be another fairly novel approach to PvP, if they actually had an open zone with some Grand Theft Auto style mechanics. Only made it three sided, effectively with the default being an untargetable neutral but options to go multiple stages into threat and zone defense and reasons for anyone to go any direction.
Since beta they haven't added anything to make it worth while for people to join pvp. In the golden ages you could lvl up just by pvping.
Yes, us pvp'er can pve too. We tend to do STF infected space with shuttles :P A bot can do a better job at pve then a "capt kirk" pver.
I digress, I made the fire now. Who has the marshmallows and popcorn.
Veni Vidi Vici
Confucius says "A Panda is most dangerous when Sad".
I don't want it in the sub forum - because that's where the people who DO PvP hang out!
I want to hear from the people that DON"T PvP !!
And are there reasons/ways to change/fix or just let it die?
Don't get mad, get even. Become the ganker, the spawn camper. Get a B'rel and learn how to fustrate people endlessly and laugh as they can do nothing about you constanly firing and sci spamming while cloaked. Mine the spawn in Kerrat to get all the trash talkers back on reset. You always die a lot when starting out, just more motivation to come up with something to get even. Put a sci in a B'rel and follow trash talkers in kerrat cloaked, don't try to kill them, just keep subnuccing and sci spamming them while cloaked for lulz, there is so much fun to be had in pvp and in kerrat especially.
Actually firing off any sci skill in a B'rel causes you to de-cloak just like firing torps does. flying a B'rel is fun but very tricky - there are so many ways you can be de-cloaked - then you are left with the same amount of hull and shilds as a Yellowstone Runabout.
Few reasons why. The biggest thing for the game as a whole is that combat is noob-hostile with all the abilities and timers and modifier values. I have a good idea about them now, but I am still learning, most PVPers are way past me on all this stuff and its embarrassing to watch me fight them. With COD you pick up a gun and go fight, here you have to manage an orchestra just to survive past the alpha.
Another big reason (for me personally) is the lack of item balance, IE you get some ships/consoles/abilities that just TRIBBLE over everything else (JHAS and JHAC are obvious examples-, but there are more), and whether you think this is a P2W game or not, where there are superior items for sale there are wallet warriors buying them.
So yeah, I PVP with newb ships that have limited weapon and console slots, because I'm able to keep track of those, and I'm not worried about somebody flying a bug ship at level 15.
Yeah I know it reveals for a couple secs again since they fixed the subterfuge boff, but still easy as long as you are out of firing arc and use hull resist abilities like aux2sif, Ph, and/or abilities like jam or AMS if needed. I still rarely die in mine.
I think lots of people need to play both factions to get into pvp to really enjoy it. I used to play fed only first and didn't pvp much at first, and especially avoided kerrat and FvK at first due to B'rels firing while cloaked, and DBB/torp bop spikers. Once I level up my first KDF alt I got better at pvp by being the hunter in kerrat, and when I would play my fed again I never avoided FvK or kerrat due to knowing the BOP and other abilities/consoles KDF has and what to expect.
Maybe if some of these feds would just level up their KDF alt only to play around with the BOP a little they could learn to play their fed better afterward.
Oh it was over a year ago. Anger is long gone, and I'm much better now than I was then anyways. But skill isn't the problem; I know if I dived into a ring where a reaction time of less than a second makes the difference between life or death, I'd improve further. I'd have to. But I'd have spent my time and effort on something that grants me no reward and lowered me to the level of those sorts of morons. They're not worth it. That's the crux of my post. Its not the losing or the difficulty or the time or the faction (love my Odyssey and Fleet Vor'cha both), its the people. Let 'em rot.
They make it one of the dailies. That brings people there to actually complete the mission. That being said, it's not a big deal. The mission reset puts everyone back in their corner. Spawn camping's not as bad as I've seen it in other games.
Also, you can't blame people for wanting to "farm" the one zone that for years has dropped the best items in the game randomly. Cryptic made it that way.
You're all Kerrat Farmers who got jumped by the KDF. Bothered because you can't farm in peace in a PVP zone
It's funny, because even when I PUG PVP in the queues, the atmosphere between players is pretty mellow. Sure, there's the poor sport here and there, but by and large, it's mellow.
PVP is the only bonafide challenge in this game. You encounter a variety of builds and player skills. And combat against a player is far more exciting than anything the PVE portion of the game offers. Players can be predictable or not. PVE? The only reason why there's any sort of challenge in PVE is due to cheap game design:
[AI Death Ray of One Shotting Mk XIII [LOLz]x3]
The rest of this game is faceroll.
That is why I am Arguing that they dev's do something about Ker'rat - it gives PvP a bad name in STO.
Almost never in Instanced PvP, whether capture or Arena do you get a lot of the trash talk and bad attitude you find in Ker'rat. Q'd PvP is very civilized on the whole and there is almost no camping and name- calling.
If there is a situation where almost all Feds are dead - most PvPers won't go too close to the spawns and will wait for most players to respawn - unless there are afkers or so that won't respawn - then it's just kill them to get it over with - which most Feds are fine with that - who wants to fight 2 on 5.
Many times when it has been 3 on 5 - several KDF players will just sit out and hang there - I saw a well known KDF bug player do that just the other day - rather than go in and faceroll the 3 feds still fighting.
Ker'rat is this games achilles heel.
Two words: Orbital Bombardment
Also, as someone that was in a FED fleet with a bunch of PvPers, the idea that KDF dominates PvP may be the single worst told lie in STO.
"We are smart." - Grebnedlog
Member of Alliance Central Command/boq botlhra'ghom
Capt. Kirk: Oh no, the Klingon challenged me to PvP!
K9: We are in a starship.
Capt.: I haven't trained up for this!
K9: We are in a STARSHIP!
Capt.: I don't have a sword!
K9: Conn, fire the photons, full spread, continuous, toast that rock!
I was thinking of something that was done in warhammer online. Create a sub map on the galaxy map that has either systems or bases that give benefits to the faction that control it. Each system will have a space and ground map that are instance and players can queue there. Each system will have a point value that is needed to take control of it, and wins in the instance matches contribute points for each faction. All levels of players can help in the point pool to take the system/base. That is the basic idea that can work with the current queue system that Cryptic has. I would make the matches big at least 20 vs 20 for space and ground battles.
I "retired" from PVP shortly before F2P's launch. I got tired of fighting hardcore teams in PuGs (and losing), Cryptic ignored PvP balance (which they are finally getting around over a year later, with no results), and I got seriously tired of playing on the same maps for 2 years (which no new maps since then).
I still PvP, but only in Private queues for farming marks and accolades.
I sort of liked STO PVP in the old days, when things were kept simple. Nowdays you got so many kinds of buffs and 1-shot kills that it just makes it completely unfun.
Even if they finally get around to adding Territorial Control, it would be too late. PvP in STO is so much of a joke it's better to find another game to do PvPing.
The attitude part is very much uncalled for. I will gladly trash talk someone if they start a good fight and then run away or do something else obviously cowardly but not in PM's and if I just blew them up repeatedly without them trying to really start anything I am not going to get on their case at all. Honestly, more good PvP'ers should try to give the folks they utterly destroy some tips and help after the fact.
As for me though, I PvP infrequently. I test builds in PvP a lot and I do the Instanced PvP sometimes. I rarely do Q'ed PvP unless I am grinding up a character and do not feel like doing the same story mission a hundred more times. The main reason though is that in the Q's it is usually you with a random assortment of folks who have no ability to coordinate and often little talent against a premade who obviously will defeat you regardless of how powerful you as a single ship are.
Hah, I can say the same with the elitist mentality in portions of the "main" part of a game, PVE.
You ever screwed things up in an STF? Or any raid, high-end PVE mission / quest? Mess up with a boss? Most especially in PUGs? This occurs in any mutiplayer game and MMORPG.
Yeah, thought so...
Tools exist in any part of any multiplayer game.
Now I love pvp, I have always loved testing my skills against other players to see how I am doing both gear and general skill wise and it is an unfortunate truth that in many games the majority of pvpers are a bunch of jacked up yahoos who throw out insults at those they can't beat and cruelly mock those they one or two hit.
Fortunately in STO I have noticed the reverse, most of the pvpers I have met are a good bunch and are quick to offer advice if asked and are pleasant in general. Granted there are a few...ummm....well lets just say rude people I have bumped into but I never add pvpers to my ignore lists, I just frag them some more, that's the nice thing about pvp.
Now in regards to Ker'rat, well last week I was hanging out and everyone was having a good time, playful barbs being slung back and forth between the Fed and Kdf players. Then came the Fed who starting capping (yelling) at people because he was there to farm, not for a mission, he specifically said farm. Well I tried to offer some friendly advice on better places/ways to farm and next thing I know I get a slew of insulting pms.
Well naturally I did the right thing and immediately fragged his TRIBBLE. This resulted in several more pms. Well I guess I wasn't the only one he was beaking off because every Kdf in the zone locked on and scrapped him over and over. Eventually her moved to a different instance, well he ran into the same problems there and just kept freaking out.
Eventually he phased back into my zone, but I did not attack him, I just went about my business....until he decided to try and take revenge, well he just ended up as an expanding cloud of vapor.
Moral of the story. Don't like to pvp? Avoid the freaking pvp zones. Want to do some farming? Do your damn research, there are plenty of easier ways to farm then Ker'rat. Because if you come to Ker'rat and then whine and moan then you will end up being the target of every opposing player in the area. I have even seen a few people switch sides just to frag the whiners.
So stop complaining. Pvers have plenty of areas to do their thing. We Pvpers have ONE open space zone where we are able to have unrestricted pvp combat. 'Nuff said.
Exactly, you can find the same bad attitudes in pve gameplay.