which is why i think cryptic should have a "Buy Zen. Nothing to buy here" sign on the webpage. There is no reason to get zen to buy anything since there is nothing to buy.
edit: I would like to point out that I only play kdf
Hence the reason that I play both KDF and Fed - but still running out of stuff.
which is why i think cryptic should have a "Buy Zen. Nothing to buy here" sign on the webpage. There is no reason to get zen to buy anything since there is nothing to buy.
edit: I would like to point out that I only play kdf
ROFL, the forumite posting nothing to buy to which you replied, had mentioned having more than 15 c-store ships and fleet ships presumably bought with zen fleet modules, before saying oh, theres nothing to buy.
Well there had been about 25-50k of zen of items to buy prior to that at least, yeah thats 'nothing'.
I agree that that the KDF setup is just screwy and should be avalible from ensign lvl as is Fed side.
ROFL, the forumite posting nothing to buy to which you replied, had mentioned having more than 15 c-store ships and fleet ships presumably bought with zen fleet modules, before saying oh, theres nothing to buy.
Well there had been about 25-50k of zen of items to buy prior to that at least, yeah thats 'nothing'.
I agree that that the KDF setup is just screwy and should be avalible from ensign lvl as is Fed side.
the only ship i haven't purchased was the gurumba and the shuttle.
I have everything else including skins for ships i never played and I don't even think are available now.
ROFL, the forumite posting nothing to buy to which you replied, had mentioned having more than 15 c-store ships and fleet ships presumably bought with zen fleet modules, before saying oh, theres nothing to buy.
Well there had been about 25-50k of zen of items to buy prior to that at least, yeah thats 'nothing'.
I agree that that the KDF setup is just screwy and should be avalible from ensign lvl as is Fed side.
I believe i was refering to the fact that older players - or players who had been around for a long time had nothing "left" to buy because they have gotten everything worth getting.
Over the last year the game has moved mostly to lock-box or starbase/rep system content to get things.
The KDF situation is even worse with no ships released since the flying brick a year ago. And costumes for the KDF - what costumes? Fed side has like 10000000(exaggration) and the KDF has 1 - ONE
which is why i think cryptic should have a "Buy Zen. Nothing to buy here" sign on the webpage. There is no reason to get zen to buy anything since there is nothing to buy.
edit: I would like to point out that I only play kdf
It's not Cryptic's problem for having nothing in the store left for you. Go take your ZEN and turn it into dil or EC, then get anything else you can get in the game. Problem solved.
stardestroyer001, Admiral, Explorers Fury PvE/PvP Fleet | Retired PvP Player
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9 My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
Well I will take the new KDF fleet that I have been in for over a month now as an example. I have donated 0 dilthium but enough fleet marks to get me 400k fleet credit. Now there are some people who could go to work for a few hours(2-4) and make the $$$ to get that 400k fleet credit with a dilthium donation. So in fact they have put 0 hours effort in on the game but donated 400k dilthium. I on the other hand, I have put in 20x the amount of hours to get those fleet marks - so who has worked harder? Me by donating the marks- which are needed more in relative terms? or the person buying dilthium on the exchange and donating it?
As a lot of dil available content also includes fleet marks, then id say that you can work on getting the dil for yourself and donate the otherwise useless fleet marks. big dig, daily, gorn minefield, foundry etc, etc.... So your still doing the work for yourself, just utilising a nice side bonus.
Please don't feel self conscious that I was replying to your comments. I would point out I wasn't inferreing that you were a leach, words used just a few posts previous btw and in no way my veiw. I also doubt your in anyway unique within the STO gaming community, I would flatly state you are not. I'm not telling you what you should do, merely an effect within a fleet of such a model of behavior.
It is as stated by someone a model done by cryptic, its the inbalance and the lockdown approach from the Devs that is angering people. It has been clear with examples of the bartender and chef fleet projects that starbase design seems to have been done without an eye on the way the game works, or the way people interact with it. Those errors have been corrected, others remain.
I would also ask, the last time you had a fleet upgrade project such as shipyard, what stalled, the fleet credits, or the dil, or did someone 'have to' buy the dil to get it moving?
As for that person who works, what if they with their limited and one might therefore say even more valuable game time are still donating dilithium to the fleet. I work and I donate dil to the fleet projects, even on days when its clear who isn't. Whose making the greater sacrifice?
I believe i was refering to the fact that older players - or players who had been around for a long time had nothing "left" to buy because they have gotten everything worth getting.
Over the last year the game has moved mostly to lock-box or starbase/rep system content to get things.
The KDF situation is even worse with no ships released since the flying brick a year ago. And costumes for the KDF - what costumes? Fed side has like 10000000(exaggration) and the KDF has 1 - ONE
The evils of assumption, you'd said about running out of stuff, rather than perhaps clearer Running out of new stuff.
I'm not a KDF player, though have a character, prefer how the Fed side like the TV shows works. Its the environment, i'm sure Q'onus is spot on, but I prefer crisp clean walls and carpet to the well imagined, dark and dubious corners, just as when Picard took a trip out and got ambushed by assasins.
As I said, I agree, I've seen myself, that other then revamped fleet ships, it has been pretty much lock boxes. Till maybe the 3rd anniversary. only costume u got was the Space suit, and Time ship uniform?
The sense of frustration of KDF as a poor relation in game terms is clear and I can only sympathise and think there have been fair comment.
Originally Posted by mijjestic: Ultimately, though, MMO players throwing stones at each other in this fashion is basically one nerd pointing and laughing at another nerd whose glasses are thicker.
As a lot of dil available content also includes fleet marks, then id say that you can work on getting the dil for yourself and donate the otherwise useless fleet marks. big dig, daily, gorn minefield, foundry etc, etc.... So your still doing the work for yourself, just utilising a nice side bonus.
Please don't feel self conscious that I was replying to your comments. I would point out I wasn't inferreing that you were a leach, words used just a few posts previous btw and in no way my veiw. I also doubt your in anyway unique within the STO gaming community, I would flatly state you are not. I'm not telling you what you should do, merely an effect within a fleet of such a model of behavior.
It is as stated by someone a model done by cryptic, its the inbalance and the lockdown approach from the Devs that is angering people. It has been clear with examples of the bartender and chef fleet projects that starbase design seems to have been done without an eye on the way the game works, or the way people interact with it. Those errors have been corrected, others remain.
I would also ask, the last time you had a fleet upgrade project such as shipyard, what stalled, the fleet credits, or the dil, or did someone 'have to' buy the dil to get it moving?
As for that person who works, what if they with their limited and one might therefore say even more valuable game time are still donating dilithium to the fleet. I work and I donate dil to the fleet projects, even on days when its clear who isn't. Whose making the greater sacrifice?
This will be my last response on this matter because this thread is taking a negative turn. In the Fleet I was talking about it is almost impossible to donate anything as the projects fill up as soon as they open. However, prior to the most recent changes to the game most fleet marks had to be earned without any dilthium rewards. I actually don't do any of the things that you mentioned. With 400+ active members - being ABLE to contribute is this fleets problem - and we just recently got rid of people who have not been active since Nov - to make room for some new people as the 500 cap keeps getting hit. Of course most fleets don't have this "problem".
My personal belief is that the whole starbase thing is a crock - a shame that keeps content locked behind a system where access is gated. So now everyone in the game if they want certain content must be in a fleet and the fleet must be at a certain level of starbase construction. People are talking about the elite fleet weapons - well I can tell you our base will have it soon - but most people in the game will never have it or take a long time - only super fleets will make it to Tier 5 - and then you have 300+ people who will want to gear up first before anyone outside the fleet could be invited to "buy" and leave. That makes the game a closed imbalance system.
This will be my last response on this matter because this thread is taking a negative turn. In the Fleet I was talking about it is almost impossible to donate anything as the projects fill up as soon as they open. However, prior to the most recent changes to the game most fleet marks had to be earned without any dilthium rewards. I actually don't do any of the things that you mentioned. With 400+ active members - being ABLE to contribute is this fleets problem - and we just recently got rid of people who have not been active since Nov - to make room for some new people as the 500 cap keeps getting hit. Of course most fleets don't have this "problem".
My personal belief is that the whole starbase thing is a crock - a shame that keeps content locked behind a system where access is gated. So now everyone in the game if they want certain content must be in a fleet and the fleet must be at a certain level of starbase construction. People are talking about the elite fleet weapons - well I can tell you our base will have it soon - but most people in the game will never have it or take a long time - only super fleets will make it to Tier 5 - and then you have 300+ people who will want to gear up first before anyone outside the fleet could be invited to "buy" and leave. That makes the game a closed imbalance system.
There really wasn't as I kept trying to say a need for a war of words, and you've reiterated the point I was putting forward. The bad starbase design already clearly highlighted re Chefs n Bartenders, and the excellent phrase, gated system.
Too gated, dilithium isn't something that should be an issue, it is because of the weight design has given it with both personal reputation projects and requirements for fleet holdings for those pursuing that. Its bad design to build into a system that is going to go from challenge to frustration. Something Cryptic are being slow to respond to.
The price of dilithium is merely a symptom not the cause of the animosity arising around dilithium and the conversion rates. I don't recall dilithium being a subject of such hot debate prior to 3 months ago, with the exception of the fleet vanity projects being overcosted. Continually these are refered to as nice but not for that much dil, every week they come out.
I'm also aware of the big fleet and provisioning problems that I've heard from others.
As I also said, and as you stated, most fleets probably wont make it to top tier, yes how many fledging fleets have died because of this.
Noooo! The economy is broken! I have keys to gather for my inevitable winning of the latest super ship and I can't do it with the Zen costs at such a painful rate!
With 400+ active members - being ABLE to contribute is this fleets problem
When my fleet hit this problem several ideas were thrown out there :
- out of 3 projects , only 2 were to be allowed to contribute to by "the whales" (players w/lots of materials) , and one was for "the small fish" .
- create an alt. fleet / starbase , to which you move toons that need FC .
no toon that has more than 500.000-1 mil FC is allowed to join .
- befriend a small fleet and temporarily move your toon that needs FC there and contribute there . It's a two sided win .
(with the knowladge of your and their fleet leaders)
Of the 3 ideas , we eventually went with the first , and it sort of works for us (we don't have 500 members tho) -- and for example , one of our biggest "whales" has recently quit donating to the Fed side in order to donate to our slower KDF base .
My personal belief is that the whole starbase thing is a crock
Well maybe the idea is not that , but much of the implementation & the lack of individuality & functionality certainly leave much to be desired .
only super fleets will make it to Tier 5 - and then you have 300+ people who will want to gear up first
I won't be clamoring to be first in line 4 stuff .
Not as long as my current stuff is more than adequate , and no new content & serious challenge is in sight .
ISE for the 2000th time , now w/better torp's ? Oh boy , I'm excited now ... . :rolleyes: :P
I won't be clamoring to be first in line 4 stuff .
Not as long as my current stuff is more than adequate , and no new content & serious challenge is in sight .
ISE for the 2000th time , now w/better torp's ? Oh boy , I'm excited now ... . :rolleyes: :P
But imagine the possiblities this system offers people - after spending more of their life grinding and paying rediculous sums of dilthium/ec/$$$/zen - you will be able to spent more money and resources to buy that gear which will let you finish ISE 20 seconds faster than had you not wasted 400 hours on the fleet system!!
so in another 1600 ISE you could see a positive time benfit to the starbase system!!!
But imagine the possiblities this system offers people - after spending more of their life grinding and paying rediculous sums of dilthium/ec/$$$/zen - you will be able to spent more money and resources to buy that gear which will let you finish ISE 20 seconds faster than had you not wasted 400 hours on the fleet system!!
so in another 1600 ISE you could see a positive time benfit to the starbase system!!!
No that's something to work hard for!
Well, there's a common fault with gamers that also is the crux of F2P games profitability:
Impatience.
Must have best gear possible; now.
Nobody is going to fault people for it, but it's not the most efficient route to take in most games; and afterwards you can't complain if the rewards for further effort are minimal; it's exactly what you were working on.
Personally, I really try to moderate myself in that regard (and I gotta say it's not always easy) but I didn't get a noteworthy amount of Advanced fleet weapons, for example - or exceptionally good weapons in general on some of the younger chars - yet, simply because I know in the end I'm getting Elite fleet weapons (or whatever the character is planning on).
Same goes for my tactical consoles. I can stick with a 24% for a long time before moving directly to a 30% console, instead of using each iteration in turn when I have the chance.
People only have themselves to blame if they grinded too much because of their impatience.
So what if it takes your fleet 3 months from T4 to T5? You don't have to buy that dilithium.
It's not Cryptic's problem for having nothing in the store left for you. Go take your ZEN and turn it into dil or EC, then get anything else you can get in the game. Problem solved.
Personally, I really try to moderate myself in that regard (and I gotta say it's not always easy) but I didn't get a noteworthy amount of Advanced fleet weapons, for example - or exceptionally good weapons in general on some of the younger chars - yet, simply because I know in the end I'm getting Elite fleet weapons (or whatever the character is planning on).
Same goes for my tactical consoles. I can stick with a 24% for a long time before moving directly to a 30% console, instead of using each iteration in turn when I have the chance..
Ditto, I'm still using Mk XI blue consoles on most of my ships, with the exception of my main who has two blue Mk XII plasma consoles bought before season 7 at a symbolic price. Instead i spend my ****loads of EC on lockbox ships and stuff. I won't bother with fleet gear too, even if i have one fleet pulsewave somewhere on a random char. Anyway, the lockbox gear with dual procs you get on the exchange is far better than the fleet one.
When we learnt more about season 7 on tribble, i also decided to save all my dilithium so that i could buy the reputation sets and items i wanted. Now i've been able to buy Mk XII maco sets for my kdfs (space and ground), a couple of borg sets, space and ground HG sets for my Feds, a full rommie plaspa weapons set and all my toons are happy with their new toys while i've bought absolutely no dil from the dilithium exchange.
Still, i'm gold, which means i'm not reluctant to get my credit card some fresh air when i think it's worth it, and in-game currencies aren't on the list. I would add being unable to save ressources as the flaw of most players, along with impatience.
To get that rich, i've been saving ECs for months to be able to make significant, highly rewarding but speculative and risky deals, and now i have all i want, even if i still think purple consoles are a pure waste of ressources. I found the right balance between what i really need and what i want, and if people were able to do that there would be no issue regarding dilithium and zen expenses.
a shame that keeps content locked behind a system where access is gated.
I see this every so often but I have yet to see anyone list any actual content that the Starbase unlocks.
Weapons are not content, they're weapons. The Romulan rep system actually does have content locked away, but the Starbase system does not. So the only crock is this idea that somehow people are being punished because they won't get their starbase to T5 in the next 2 months.
As far as the weapons and other toys go. This is not any thing new. Such things have always been gated. You have be X level, and have to had done Y activities to stand a chance at getting some of these items. STO is hardly something new this way.
I see this every so often but I have yet to see anyone list any actual content that the Starbase unlocks.
There are several fleet actions or PvE queue activities that require fleet membership to participate in. And since the PvE queues appear to be where most of the action is these days, that can be an issue.
The starbase / embassy themselves also unlock a few daily missions for fleet credits, but they're just "go here and press f" type things, so I don't think anyone should be heartbroken about missing out on those.
There are several fleet actions or PvE queue activities that require fleet membership to participate in. And since the PvE queues appear to be where most of the action is these days, that can be an issue.
Yes but you don't need a T5 starbase to do those, which is my point. People commenting about how content is gated behind Tx, yet there is no mission that's unlocked by having a T3 or T5 star base that I know of.
So yes you miss out on some weapons and a uniform if you don't advance your starbase, but uniforms and weapons are not content.
Also yes, you do miss out on some content if you don't belong to a fleet. But you don't need anything other then being a member of a fleet to get access to those fleet events.
BUT you do need a T5 starbase to fight particular enemies, and achieve the resulting accolades
Missing out on a few 'kill named ship' accolades is hardly the same thing as missing out on actual content. Plus you don't need to have your SB of tier X. It's based on the tier of the randomly chosen star base.
Yes but you don't need a T5 starbase to do those, which is my point. People commenting about how content is gated behind Tx, yet there is no mission that's unlocked by having a T3 or T5 star base that I know of.
I agree however, getting a new ship or access to new equipment serves as content in STO - primarily because so little actual playable content has been introduced since F2P.
People get bored doing the same stuff with the same characters in the same ships - Fleet ships, weapons and now consoles and Kits allow you to mix things up a little and (if you have access to them) provide you with new ways to tackle old content.
Most of the gains are minimal but some of them (like the Omega Torpedo/Cutting Beam) offer interesting new mechanics which you can potentially respec and build around and lots of people find that fun.
The point is, for those that have done everything there is to do, access to an interesting new Fleet (or C-Store, or lockbox) ship is a starting point to some enjoyable, if short-lived tinkering and refining of builds.
If you don't have access to those things then that's content (of a sort) that's locked away from you.
Some people are in huge fleets.
Some people have lots of time on their hands (and patience) to grind.
And some people have lots of cash to spend on Zen or Dilithium.
But some people play STO because it's free, and because it's 'casual' and perhaps they don't want to be in a large Fleet or can't compete with the 'whales' - and these people are getting penalized.
If you don't have access to those things then that's content (of a sort) that's locked away from you.
Missing out on a ship is not the same thing as missing out on content. I simply don't buy this line of thinking that somehow doing the same mission with a slightly different ship is somehow the same as doing new content.
Fighting in a T4 escort is hardly a massive difference than fighting in a T5 escort.
and these people are getting penalized.
No they're not, they made a choice on how to play and what to do, they have the same option as everyone else.
Missing out on a ship is not the same thing as missing out on content. I simply don't buy this line of thinking that somehow doing the same mission with a slightly different ship is somehow the same as doing new content.
I won't disagree, others feel differently though - hence the numerous arguments we've had in these forums over what constitutes 'content'.
Fighting in a T4 escort is hardly a massive difference than fighting in a T5 escort.
I guess you don't PvP or do many Elite STFs then? The jump from a Tier 4/5 ship to a Fleet one is significant - typically you'll gain a console slot which might increase your DPS noticeably (Fleet Defiant) or perhaps allow you to slot an additional Uni Console like the Theta Vents or the Plasmonic Leech (or whatever). You've also got better shields, hull and a new material (if that's your thing).
Hardly the same thing as what I said. If someone chooses to not get involved, then they have only themselves to blame.
As far as the T4 to T5 thing. Yes a T5 ship is much better then a T4, but it's not like the game plays differently then it did before. Going from a Cruiser to a Escort is a big change in game play, but going from a T4 to T5 ship is not much more then increased DPS, Shields, hull ect...
Holy thread derail batman! Changing the subject back to the original one, the value of dilithium relative to c-points is going up again. I could purchase c-points at 85di/c-point about 4-5 days ago. As of yesterday, the cheapest deal for purchasing c-points was 90 di/cpoint. Once people finish their rep projects, the exchange rate will drop again to around 85 di/cpoint hopefully. We'll just have to wait and see.
Holy thread derail batman! Changing the subject back to the original one, the value of dilithium relative to c-points is going up again. I could purchase c-points at 85di/c-point about 4-5 days ago. As of yesterday, the cheapest deal for purchasing c-points was 90 di/cpoint. Once people finish their rep projects, the exchange rate will drop again to around 85 di/cpoint hopefully. We'll just have to wait and see.
An expected increase considering there's a sale on keys and the release of the new lock boxes, poor souls dumping hard earned cash into empty dreams....of course the constant in-game announcement of 'So-and-so got a uber-special ship, noob!!' would compel you to think otherwise.
Content, at least in this game, seems to depend on shiny boxes with RNG inside them these days and giant timers that predict dispensing of your 'quest' rewards after paying off the Gods. In an extreme effort to prevent gold sellers, Cryptic has become it's own gold spammer and locked the game down so hard with these ridiculous exchange systems there's no joy in anything.
Comments
Hence the reason that I play both KDF and Fed - but still running out of stuff.
ROFL, the forumite posting nothing to buy to which you replied, had mentioned having more than 15 c-store ships and fleet ships presumably bought with zen fleet modules, before saying oh, theres nothing to buy.
Well there had been about 25-50k of zen of items to buy prior to that at least, yeah thats 'nothing'.
I agree that that the KDF setup is just screwy and should be avalible from ensign lvl as is Fed side.
the only ship i haven't purchased was the gurumba and the shuttle.
I have everything else including skins for ships i never played and I don't even think are available now.
I believe i was refering to the fact that older players - or players who had been around for a long time had nothing "left" to buy because they have gotten everything worth getting.
Over the last year the game has moved mostly to lock-box or starbase/rep system content to get things.
The KDF situation is even worse with no ships released since the flying brick a year ago. And costumes for the KDF - what costumes? Fed side has like 10000000(exaggration) and the KDF has 1 - ONE
It's not Cryptic's problem for having nothing in the store left for you. Go take your ZEN and turn it into dil or EC, then get anything else you can get in the game. Problem solved.
Missing the good ol' days of PvP: Legacy of Romulus to Season 9
My List of Useful Links, Recently Updated November 25 2017!
As a lot of dil available content also includes fleet marks, then id say that you can work on getting the dil for yourself and donate the otherwise useless fleet marks. big dig, daily, gorn minefield, foundry etc, etc.... So your still doing the work for yourself, just utilising a nice side bonus.
Please don't feel self conscious that I was replying to your comments. I would point out I wasn't inferreing that you were a leach, words used just a few posts previous btw and in no way my veiw. I also doubt your in anyway unique within the STO gaming community, I would flatly state you are not. I'm not telling you what you should do, merely an effect within a fleet of such a model of behavior.
It is as stated by someone a model done by cryptic, its the inbalance and the lockdown approach from the Devs that is angering people. It has been clear with examples of the bartender and chef fleet projects that starbase design seems to have been done without an eye on the way the game works, or the way people interact with it. Those errors have been corrected, others remain.
I would also ask, the last time you had a fleet upgrade project such as shipyard, what stalled, the fleet credits, or the dil, or did someone 'have to' buy the dil to get it moving?
As for that person who works, what if they with their limited and one might therefore say even more valuable game time are still donating dilithium to the fleet. I work and I donate dil to the fleet projects, even on days when its clear who isn't. Whose making the greater sacrifice?
lol. what?
It isn't? Are they not publicly traded? Do they not have shareholders?
The evils of assumption, you'd said about running out of stuff, rather than perhaps clearer Running out of new stuff.
I'm not a KDF player, though have a character, prefer how the Fed side like the TV shows works. Its the environment, i'm sure Q'onus is spot on, but I prefer crisp clean walls and carpet to the well imagined, dark and dubious corners, just as when Picard took a trip out and got ambushed by assasins.
As I said, I agree, I've seen myself, that other then revamped fleet ships, it has been pretty much lock boxes. Till maybe the 3rd anniversary. only costume u got was the Space suit, and Time ship uniform?
The sense of frustration of KDF as a poor relation in game terms is clear and I can only sympathise and think there have been fair comment.
They probably pay out dividends in Zen...
:P
M-O-O-N, that spells @Rhyatt
Originally Posted by mijjestic: Ultimately, though, MMO players throwing stones at each other in this fashion is basically one nerd pointing and laughing at another nerd whose glasses are thicker.
Laws yes!
This will be my last response on this matter because this thread is taking a negative turn. In the Fleet I was talking about it is almost impossible to donate anything as the projects fill up as soon as they open. However, prior to the most recent changes to the game most fleet marks had to be earned without any dilthium rewards. I actually don't do any of the things that you mentioned. With 400+ active members - being ABLE to contribute is this fleets problem - and we just recently got rid of people who have not been active since Nov - to make room for some new people as the 500 cap keeps getting hit. Of course most fleets don't have this "problem".
My personal belief is that the whole starbase thing is a crock - a shame that keeps content locked behind a system where access is gated. So now everyone in the game if they want certain content must be in a fleet and the fleet must be at a certain level of starbase construction. People are talking about the elite fleet weapons - well I can tell you our base will have it soon - but most people in the game will never have it or take a long time - only super fleets will make it to Tier 5 - and then you have 300+ people who will want to gear up first before anyone outside the fleet could be invited to "buy" and leave. That makes the game a closed imbalance system.
There really wasn't as I kept trying to say a need for a war of words, and you've reiterated the point I was putting forward. The bad starbase design already clearly highlighted re Chefs n Bartenders, and the excellent phrase, gated system.
Too gated, dilithium isn't something that should be an issue, it is because of the weight design has given it with both personal reputation projects and requirements for fleet holdings for those pursuing that. Its bad design to build into a system that is going to go from challenge to frustration. Something Cryptic are being slow to respond to.
The price of dilithium is merely a symptom not the cause of the animosity arising around dilithium and the conversion rates. I don't recall dilithium being a subject of such hot debate prior to 3 months ago, with the exception of the fleet vanity projects being overcosted. Continually these are refered to as nice but not for that much dil, every week they come out.
I'm also aware of the big fleet and provisioning problems that I've heard from others.
As I also said, and as you stated, most fleets probably wont make it to top tier, yes how many fledging fleets have died because of this.
Cryptic isn't.
But Perfect World, Co. is.
PWE is the N. American branch of PWC. Cryptic not having a ton of stuff in the c-store is less important than the money from lock-boxes.
Not much of a strong move.
When my fleet hit this problem several ideas were thrown out there :
- out of 3 projects , only 2 were to be allowed to contribute to by "the whales" (players w/lots of materials) , and one was for "the small fish" .
- create an alt. fleet / starbase , to which you move toons that need FC .
no toon that has more than 500.000-1 mil FC is allowed to join .
- befriend a small fleet and temporarily move your toon that needs FC there and contribute there . It's a two sided win .
(with the knowladge of your and their fleet leaders)
Of the 3 ideas , we eventually went with the first , and it sort of works for us (we don't have 500 members tho) -- and for example , one of our biggest "whales" has recently quit donating to the Fed side in order to donate to our slower KDF base .
Well maybe the idea is not that , but much of the implementation & the lack of individuality & functionality certainly leave much to be desired .
I won't be clamoring to be first in line 4 stuff .
Not as long as my current stuff is more than adequate , and no new content & serious challenge is in sight .
ISE for the 2000th time , now w/better torp's ? Oh boy , I'm excited now ... . :rolleyes: :P
But imagine the possiblities this system offers people - after spending more of their life grinding and paying rediculous sums of dilthium/ec/$$$/zen - you will be able to spent more money and resources to buy that gear which will let you finish ISE 20 seconds faster than had you not wasted 400 hours on the fleet system!!
so in another 1600 ISE you could see a positive time benfit to the starbase system!!!
No that's something to work hard for!
Well, there's a common fault with gamers that also is the crux of F2P games profitability:
Impatience.
Must have best gear possible; now.
Nobody is going to fault people for it, but it's not the most efficient route to take in most games; and afterwards you can't complain if the rewards for further effort are minimal; it's exactly what you were working on.
Personally, I really try to moderate myself in that regard (and I gotta say it's not always easy) but I didn't get a noteworthy amount of Advanced fleet weapons, for example - or exceptionally good weapons in general on some of the younger chars - yet, simply because I know in the end I'm getting Elite fleet weapons (or whatever the character is planning on).
Same goes for my tactical consoles. I can stick with a 24% for a long time before moving directly to a 30% console, instead of using each iteration in turn when I have the chance.
People only have themselves to blame if they grinded too much because of their impatience.
So what if it takes your fleet 3 months from T4 to T5? You don't have to buy that dilithium.
He's dead, Jim.
He can also buy keys. :cool:
Ditto, I'm still using Mk XI blue consoles on most of my ships, with the exception of my main who has two blue Mk XII plasma consoles bought before season 7 at a symbolic price. Instead i spend my ****loads of EC on lockbox ships and stuff. I won't bother with fleet gear too, even if i have one fleet pulsewave somewhere on a random char. Anyway, the lockbox gear with dual procs you get on the exchange is far better than the fleet one.
When we learnt more about season 7 on tribble, i also decided to save all my dilithium so that i could buy the reputation sets and items i wanted. Now i've been able to buy Mk XII maco sets for my kdfs (space and ground), a couple of borg sets, space and ground HG sets for my Feds, a full rommie plaspa weapons set and all my toons are happy with their new toys while i've bought absolutely no dil from the dilithium exchange.
Still, i'm gold, which means i'm not reluctant to get my credit card some fresh air when i think it's worth it, and in-game currencies aren't on the list. I would add being unable to save ressources as the flaw of most players, along with impatience.
To get that rich, i've been saving ECs for months to be able to make significant, highly rewarding but speculative and risky deals, and now i have all i want, even if i still think purple consoles are a pure waste of ressources. I found the right balance between what i really need and what i want, and if people were able to do that there would be no issue regarding dilithium and zen expenses.
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
I see this every so often but I have yet to see anyone list any actual content that the Starbase unlocks.
Weapons are not content, they're weapons. The Romulan rep system actually does have content locked away, but the Starbase system does not. So the only crock is this idea that somehow people are being punished because they won't get their starbase to T5 in the next 2 months.
As far as the weapons and other toys go. This is not any thing new. Such things have always been gated. You have be X level, and have to had done Y activities to stand a chance at getting some of these items. STO is hardly something new this way.
There are several fleet actions or PvE queue activities that require fleet membership to participate in. And since the PvE queues appear to be where most of the action is these days, that can be an issue.
The starbase / embassy themselves also unlock a few daily missions for fleet credits, but they're just "go here and press f" type things, so I don't think anyone should be heartbroken about missing out on those.
That's what the half hour mini projects are specifically designed for.
Yes but you don't need a T5 starbase to do those, which is my point. People commenting about how content is gated behind Tx, yet there is no mission that's unlocked by having a T3 or T5 star base that I know of.
So yes you miss out on some weapons and a uniform if you don't advance your starbase, but uniforms and weapons are not content.
Also yes, you do miss out on some content if you don't belong to a fleet. But you don't need anything other then being a member of a fleet to get access to those fleet events.
Missing out on a few 'kill named ship' accolades is hardly the same thing as missing out on actual content. Plus you don't need to have your SB of tier X. It's based on the tier of the randomly chosen star base.
I agree however, getting a new ship or access to new equipment serves as content in STO - primarily because so little actual playable content has been introduced since F2P.
People get bored doing the same stuff with the same characters in the same ships - Fleet ships, weapons and now consoles and Kits allow you to mix things up a little and (if you have access to them) provide you with new ways to tackle old content.
Most of the gains are minimal but some of them (like the Omega Torpedo/Cutting Beam) offer interesting new mechanics which you can potentially respec and build around and lots of people find that fun.
The point is, for those that have done everything there is to do, access to an interesting new Fleet (or C-Store, or lockbox) ship is a starting point to some enjoyable, if short-lived tinkering and refining of builds.
If you don't have access to those things then that's content (of a sort) that's locked away from you.
Some people are in huge fleets.
Some people have lots of time on their hands (and patience) to grind.
And some people have lots of cash to spend on Zen or Dilithium.
But some people play STO because it's free, and because it's 'casual' and perhaps they don't want to be in a large Fleet or can't compete with the 'whales' - and these people are getting penalized.
Missing out on a ship is not the same thing as missing out on content. I simply don't buy this line of thinking that somehow doing the same mission with a slightly different ship is somehow the same as doing new content.
Fighting in a T4 escort is hardly a massive difference than fighting in a T5 escort.
No they're not, they made a choice on how to play and what to do, they have the same option as everyone else.
I won't disagree, others feel differently though - hence the numerous arguments we've had in these forums over what constitutes 'content'.
I guess you don't PvP or do many Elite STFs then? The jump from a Tier 4/5 ship to a Fleet one is significant - typically you'll gain a console slot which might increase your DPS noticeably (Fleet Defiant) or perhaps allow you to slot an additional Uni Console like the Theta Vents or the Plasmonic Leech (or whatever). You've also got better shields, hull and a new material (if that's your thing).
Let them eat cake eh? :rolleyes:
Hardly the same thing as what I said. If someone chooses to not get involved, then they have only themselves to blame.
As far as the T4 to T5 thing. Yes a T5 ship is much better then a T4, but it's not like the game plays differently then it did before. Going from a Cruiser to a Escort is a big change in game play, but going from a T4 to T5 ship is not much more then increased DPS, Shields, hull ect...
An expected increase considering there's a sale on keys and the release of the new lock boxes, poor souls dumping hard earned cash into empty dreams....of course the constant in-game announcement of 'So-and-so got a uber-special ship, noob!!' would compel you to think otherwise.
Content, at least in this game, seems to depend on shiny boxes with RNG inside them these days and giant timers that predict dispensing of your 'quest' rewards after paying off the Gods. In an extreme effort to prevent gold sellers, Cryptic has become it's own gold spammer and locked the game down so hard with these ridiculous exchange systems there's no joy in anything.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
The o3 - Killed you good
+1
I've tested the waters over the past couple of weeks by offering 1 Zen for 100 Dilithium. It's takes a few days, but I get the Dilithium I ask for.
So, the market has officially crashed and I'm ok with that