And I say to both sides "get a grip". Its going to fluctuate, its going to go up and go down.
Having been part of this thread most of the way through, trust me on this: It's not the dilithium sellers who are in need grip getting as they are well aware of the swings.
For the penny-pinchers at Cryptic/PWE: Increasing the need for dilithium will NOT increase the perceived "value" of zen -> dilithium. The only way you're going to get more people spending money again is to make dilithium easier to get again, thereby increasing the exchange value.
Obviously not, as lots of folks are spending a lot of zen to buy dil. You are in the very small minority. The market shows this.
You are, of course, entitled to do whatever you want. I would probably do the same thing in your position. But there are a lot of people that feel it's worth it to spend $1 to get more than a day ahead in refined dil (and that's assuming getting a full 8000 dil refined every day per toon), for whatever they are doing, so they can play the way they want.
I'm squarely in the #3 category. I occasionally have money to spend, and HATE grinding. :mad: I'd rather spend a small amount of my real-world cash to get dilithium and be done with it. With the exchange rate being so low, though, it simply is not worth the expense.
I used to spend $5-10 every couple weeks or so just for dilithium. Those purchases have stopped entirely until it becomes worth my investment again.
For the penny-pinchers at Cryptic/PWE: Increasing the need for dilithium will NOT increase the perceived "value" of zen -> dilithium. The only way you're going to get more people spending money again is to make dilithium easier to get again, thereby increasing the exchange value.
Or just release the Dominion Lock Box...
I suspect that large amounts of Zen will be flowing toward Keys again soon.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I'm squarely in the #3 category. I occasionally have money to spend, and HATE grinding. :mad: I'd rather spend a small amount of my real-world cash to get dilithium and be done with it. With the exchange rate being so low, though, it simply is not worth the expense.
I used to spend $5-10 every couple weeks or so just for dilithium. Those purchases have stopped entirely until it becomes worth my investment again.
For the penny-pinchers at Cryptic/PWE: Increasing the need for dilithium will NOT increase the perceived "value" of zen -> dilithium. The only way you're going to get more people spending money again is to make dilithium easier to get again, thereby increasing the exchange value.
That's nothing. Try $50 to 60 every 30 to 45 days.
I'm squarely in the #3 category. I occasionally have money to spend, and HATE grinding. :mad: I'd rather spend a small amount of my real-world cash to get dilithium and be done with it. With the exchange rate being so low, though, it simply is not worth the expense.
I used to spend $5-10 every couple weeks or so just for dilithium. Those purchases have stopped entirely until it becomes worth my investment again.
For the penny-pinchers at Cryptic/PWE: Increasing the need for dilithium will NOT increase the perceived "value" of zen -> dilithium. The only way you're going to get more people spending money again is to make dilithium easier to get again, thereby increasing the exchange value.
Actually, it WILL has long as people spend.
People NEVER spend money they don't think is worth it at the time of sale.
That raises two questions:
- Will people have too much regret after spending to repeat spend? If so, you adjust and try to plan better.
- Are the marginal returns higher?
Look. If you've got one guy who will spend $250 for 1000 dilithium and he wants 200k dilithium and he has the cash to blow, that's where the price should be. It doesn't matter that nobody else takes part in the market. That guy is subsidizing the whole game for a year and anybody else who wants dilithium can go earn it.
Buying dilithium should, ideally, be for wealthy players who are indiscriminate with their money. Not something that should have to be accessible for all players.
If you are a cash spender that is willing to buy in-game credits I'd say chances are you going to spend that money on something else.
It's not like you are the most demanding, conservative spender on the planet...
The only problem I currently have is there isn't anything in the game I want. Exchange, c-store, fleet - anywhere.
In the past I would have simply continued to play stf to earn and maybe switch the weapons out on a ship for fun. Just like I could easily have completed ground on a new character.
Now however, as predicted, I am entirely dependent on having a concrete item to play for to put in any work. And I am very conservative about what I get. Like I use all old stf weapons just to get out of grinding and my latest alt, who is post 7, isn't doing reputation at all and so he is done - I don't play him at all.
I'd buy zen for 200 if there were an item I wanted.
But since s. 7 I only play for specific items and no longer put in any work - because of the way they set it up. In addition to that I'd simply rather not have the item at all in exchange for not grinding.
You play stf for reputation now, you don't play stf for stf. Once you are done with reputation you are done.
To me before s. 7 I'd continue to play stf no matter what drops I got. So to me the idea of prolonging gameplay actually had the reversed effect and mixed in with the whole "you are saving time parole" the whole thing is just... beyond the meassure of words.
That being said, only developers can say if they increased their in-come which is the only buttom line.
guess people will continue to throw their money into the dilthium pit at any price.
Agreed, and I agree with the poster above you as well. Once you break from the grind, you realize it's not very appealing to go back. I worked my way up in a great Fleet with great people, got my Fleet ships/weapons for them and have had much fun watching things go boom with those new toys. Beyond that, there is not much that I find appealing here at all anymore. Ground anything still stinks, the Reputation system is here to stay according to Dstahl, and you know they will just butcher a Romulan playable species worse than KDF if that ever happens.
Agreed, and I agree with the poster above you as well. Once you break from the grind, you realize it's not very appealing to go back. I worked my way up in a great Fleet with great people, got my Fleet ships/weapons for them and have had much fun watching things go boom with those new toys. Beyond that, there is not much that I find appealing here at all anymore. Ground anything still stinks, the Reputation system is here to stay according to Dstahl, and you know they will just butcher a Romulan playable species worse than KDF if that ever happens.
The forums reflect the lack of interest in the state of the game just by being fairly quiet. Not too much going on. Perhaps the next lock-box and anniversary which should happen around the same time will revive the game and price of zen - but some how I don't think by a lot.
Am I the only one who is glad to see the price of Zen going down?
Of course, I am biased, as I am hoping to eventually scrounge enough dilithium to buy the 2.5K Zen needed for an Assault Cruiser Refit, but still...
(Said task would've been a lot easier had I not splurged a ton of dil for 2K Zen and then bought the Fleet Ship modules for a ship (Fleet AC) I can't get until my fleet reaches Tier 5, but that is neither here nor there.)
No i know many people who are fine with that, including occasional zen buyers or gold members like myself. Farming dil can be somewhat profitable now, it's not a worthless currency like it used to be prior to season 7. I often neglected to reach my refinment cap before season 7, now it's one of my daily focuses, with doffing and making at least a couple of millions or more of EC. If the exchange rate is higher than 1:100 it's not even worth reaching the cap and making ECs is far more important, now, it makes sense.
Am I the only one who is glad to see the price of Zen going down?
No; contented people are less likely to go to the forums and post about being contented. If the situation was reversed, you'd be hearing from a different mix of people.
Mind you, some of the most vocal would be the same. They'd also be the ones complaining if the price was smack in the middle.
Former moderator of these forums. Lifetime sub since before launch. Been here since before public betas. Foundry author of "Franklin Drake Must Die".
Am I the only one who is glad to see the price of Zen going down?
Of course, I am biased, as I am hoping to eventually scrounge enough dilithium to buy the 2.5K Zen needed for an Assault Cruiser Refit, but still...
(Said task would've been a lot easier had I not splurged a ton of dil for 2K Zen and then bought the Fleet Ship modules for a ship (Fleet AC) I can't get until my fleet reaches Tier 5, but that is neither here nor there.)
You could try to get the SB Tier 3 Fleet Excelsior. Its only real noticeable downside is not having an Ensign Tactical boff (most people still use the Lt. Uni as sci).
No; contented people are less likely to go to the forums and post about being contented. If the situation was reversed, you'd be hearing from a different mix of people.
Mind you, some of the most vocal would be the same. They'd also be the ones complaining if the price was smack in the middle.
Too true, I really don't care which way the wind blows on the exchange, it's not like the exchange rate is going to be Earth shattering. I bought Zen when it cost 300 dilithium when I needed it, I buy it at 85 when I need it now. My stipend gives me mostly what I need for the game.
If you calculate the amount of real $ a person could earn per day on a character in dilithium, the level the game at now is a bit high right now. Compare to other F2P games and see how much free currency they hand out, usually less than $1/day, while STO is at the $1 mark and rising.
The problem isn't so drastic in the exchange price then as compared to excessive cost of everything in the game. The free t4 ships are $14? But the premium are $20 or $25? That isn't right. The tier 2 embassy upgrade, $90? This is criminal. How much is a t5 starbase worth? $1000s? A single set of XII gear is $12.
The c-store is reasonable, the ability for F2Pers to play for free is pretty easy, the in game costs of everything are beyond ridiculous. The fix seems pretty clear, but it won't happen.
The problem isn't so drastic in the exchange price then as compared to excessive cost of everything in the game. The free t4 ships are $14? But the premium are $20 or $25? That isn't right. The tier 2 embassy upgrade, $90? This is criminal. How much is a t5 starbase worth? $1000s? A single set of XII gear is $12.
The c-store is reasonable, the ability for F2Pers to play for free is pretty easy, the in game costs of everything are beyond ridiculous. The fix seems pretty clear, but it won't happen.
$1,000 for a top-tier station is pretty cheap. A fleet-ready Titan in EVE is over $7,000 in real-world equivalent, and that's a comparable achievement AND YOU WILL PROBABLY LOSE IT with no refund. Starbases are optional, and intended to be spread across many players in a fleet. If you don't like their cost, don't build one.
Former moderator of these forums. Lifetime sub since before launch. Been here since before public betas. Foundry author of "Franklin Drake Must Die".
The problem isn't so drastic in the exchange price then as compared to excessive cost of everything in the game. The free t4 ships are $14? But the premium are $20 or $25? That isn't right. The tier 2 embassy upgrade, $90? This is criminal. How much is a t5 starbase worth? $1000s?
No, a T5 base costs 0 and an ambassy 0 too. The only way to create dilithium is to refine it and you have to do it for free. If you want to trade real money with other players to take a shortcut it's your buisness/problem, but technically dilithium can't be bought; you can trade if when it's refined but you can't create dilithium with real money.
I bought all my endgame stuff on 2 chars and a 3rd one is on the way. I spent nothing, i just saved 1M dil or so. It took me 2 months to refine but at least i could get all i want and spent nothing on the dil exchange. I've even been able to trade some dil to buy more zen!
The price is pretty reasonable at the moment. There's some real point to grinding Dil, and zen is worth exactly what it always was otherwise.
If Dil ever goes up to like 250 per Zen or something goofy again, most people that can count would hopefully walk out on the game on the spot. That nonsense is totally indefensible to anyone that isn't just trying to be rich on the internetz.
If you're going to have a Free 2 Play game, there's got to be a point to playing. You can't TRIBBLE on people and tell them it's raining and expect no one to notice. No one is going to grind for 8000/250 = 32 Zen a day, unless they're a complete moron.
Current prices are quite fair for grinding. The game is now just no longer in a position where a tiny, whiny minority who want the game handed to them on a plate can exploit everyone else and sit on their giant pile of ore while smoking a cigar.
I won't lose a second of sleep over that.
"We are smart." - Grebnedlog
Member of Alliance Central Command/boq botlhra'ghom
The problem isn't so drastic in the exchange price then as compared to excessive cost of everything in the game. The free t4 ships are $14? But the premium are $20 or $25? That isn't right. The tier 2 embassy upgrade, $90? This is criminal. How much is a t5 starbase worth? $1000s? A single set of XII gear is $12.
One thing you are not accounting for is that the overall higher prices are balanced by the fact that it is relatively easy to get the real money currency through playing the game. This effectively allows each player to set their own price for the item, which is actually a great free to play monetization model. Each player can price each item what they want to by playing the game. The premium ship may have an expensive sticker price of $20.00, but at the current dil exchange rate you can get it for absolutely free after 21 days of hitting the dilithium cap. If you want to pay $5.00 for the ship, you can do so by hitting the dil cap 15 days, etc. etc.
The overall effect is that the monetization model is much more flexible then you get in a lot of games, which theoratically should benefit everyone. Players are not priced out of certain items they want because they are cost prohibitive, and Cryptic can sell a lot more stuff at optimal prices because the players will buy anything they want to buy at the maximum price they are willing to pay for it. Obviously, theory and practice arent the same thing, but I like it.
Am I the only one who is glad to see the price of Zen going down?
Of course, I am biased, as I am hoping to eventually scrounge enough dilithium to buy the 2.5K Zen needed for an Assault Cruiser Refit, but still...
(Said task would've been a lot easier had I not splurged a ton of dil for 2K Zen and then bought the Fleet Ship modules for a ship (Fleet AC) I can't get until my fleet reaches Tier 5, but that is neither here nor there.)
I have accumulated 30k Zen for the third time. Used the last time to buy 300 keys during the last key sale and sell them.
So now I have about $700 million EC and 30k Zen - I have over 15 c-store ships and several fleet ships.
My problem with the whole situation is there is virtually nothing in the Z-store for players to buy that have been here for awhile. The whole game now is geared toward churring the 1-3 month players.
I think Zen will rebound quite a bit with the new lockbox coming.
Maybe, but then again there's still a ton of stuff you need Dil for in game. While it may very well go back up, I'd be surprised if it goes up past 100 just because of the new lockboxes. If it does that says rather plainly just how popular those really are.
The base costs are comparative, dil to zen, so the cost nothing is just an idiotic answer. If a single upgrade is $90, I'm betting the base as a whole would be above $1000, in fact a quick calculation is showing me it is over $5500 to get to tier 5. Add the embassy.... Eve seems to be pretty average? But I bet whatever you get in Eve is at least a benefit to you, not a generic uncustomized base with features available everywhere else.
Of course I've accounted for the ability to get in game currency, the equivalent of dilithium exists in nearly all F2P games, the relationship of the free to the payers is a known thing, and its how the game makes money. The minority are supposed to pay, the majority are supposed to leach off them. If you make either end too lucrative then you fall out of the most profitable zone for the game.
Whats sad is that the dilithium market is attempting to climb since the announcement but yet there are some people who seem to be trying to keep it where it is.
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"You Best Make Peace With Your Dear & Fluffy Lord" - Malcolm Reynolds
Whats sad is that the dilithium market is attempting to climb since the announcement but yet there are some people who seem to be trying to keep it where it is.
Nothing wrong with that. I'm still hoping the cost for Zen drops to 50 - I've had a standing order to buy 1000 Zen at 50 dil since the exchange opened.
I have accumulated 30k Zen for the third time. Used the last time to buy 300 keys during the last key sale and sell them.
So now I have about $700 million EC and 30k Zen - I have over 15 c-store ships and several fleet ships.
My problem with the whole situation is there is virtually nothing in the Z-store for players to buy that have been here for awhile. The whole game now is geared toward churring the 1-3 month players.
Please do not take this as a personal attack or criticism. but as an example I would like to throw another perspective on. I'm sure yours is not an uncommon story, oowww look how well I've, me, myself, I have done.
I can only imagine that fleets with members keeping their own dil to such a level as you descibed, are proud a member is doing so well for himself, whilst merely chipping in fleet marks till able to get the fleet goodies that the others have left the few in the fleet that do contribute in your stead with dil, or having to buy it to cover the rest of the members whose behavouir is rather like that. Hell who knows maybe some of the dil that got bought and donated WAS the dil selling members. So your fleet have kinda helped you out twice.
This is what, months and months and months later is still the issue, that you should be able to do as you've described without an undue effect on the fleet (which as 90%+ of players are in one I have assumed by the numbers your a typical example. Fact is Cryptic have made dil so central to starbase construction its crippling and a cause of much of the frustration and anger felt, especially by those who are subscibers and lifetime members who have put there hand in there pocket already to enjoy a game without undue restrictions.
I've seen posts about people saying there fleet has 25 members on at a time, why are only 25% donating . This is also counter productive and undermines social aspects growing in a healthy fashion, instead of which it can foster resentment and anger, certainly it is a state of affairs that is demotivating for individuals and has no doubt been the demise of more than one fledling fleet.
My problem with the whole situation is there is virtually nothing in the Z-store for players to buy that have been here for awhile. The whole game now is geared toward churring the 1-3 month players.
which is why i think cryptic should have a "Buy Zen. Nothing to buy here" sign on the webpage. There is no reason to get zen to buy anything since there is nothing to buy.
edit: I would like to point out that I only play kdf
Please do not take this as a personal attack or criticism. but as an example I would like to throw another perspective on. I'm sure yours is not an uncommon story, oowww look how well I've, me, myself, I have done.
I can only imagine that fleets with members keeping their own dil to such a level as you descibed, are proud a member is doing so well for himself, whilst merely chipping in fleet marks till able to get the fleet goodies that the others have left the few in the fleet that do contribute in your stead with dil, or having to buy it to cover the rest of the members whose behavouir is rather like that. Hell who knows maybe some of the dil that got bought and donated WAS the dil selling members. So your fleet have kinda helped you out twice.
This is what, months and months and months later is still the issue, that you should be able to do as you've described without an undue effect on the fleet (which as 90%+ of players are in one I have assumed by the numbers your a typical example. Fact is Cryptic have made dil so central to starbase construction its crippling and a cause of much of the frustration and anger felt, especially by those who are subscibers and lifetime members who have put there hand in there pocket already to enjoy a game without undue restrictions.
I've seen posts about people saying there fleet has 25 members on at a time, why are only 25% donating . This is also counter productive and undermines social aspects growing in a healthy fashion, instead of which it can foster resentment and anger, certainly it is a state of affairs that is demotivating for individuals and has no doubt been the demise of more than one fledling fleet.
Well I will take the new KDF fleet that I have been in for over a month now as an example. I have donated 0 dilthium but enough fleet marks to get me 400k fleet credit. Now there are some people who could go to work for a few hours(2-4) and make the $$$ to get that 400k fleet credit with a dilthium donation. So in fact they have put 0 hours effort in on the game but donated 400k dilthium. I on the other hand, I have put in 20x the amount of hours to get those fleet marks - so who has worked harder? Me by donating the marks- which are needed more in relative terms? or the person buying dilthium on the exchange and donating it?
Comments
Having been part of this thread most of the way through, trust me on this: It's not the dilithium sellers who are in need grip getting as they are well aware of the swings.
Obviously not, as lots of folks are spending a lot of zen to buy dil. You are in the very small minority. The market shows this.
You are, of course, entitled to do whatever you want. I would probably do the same thing in your position. But there are a lot of people that feel it's worth it to spend $1 to get more than a day ahead in refined dil (and that's assuming getting a full 8000 dil refined every day per toon), for whatever they are doing, so they can play the way they want.
Or just release the Dominion Lock Box...
I suspect that large amounts of Zen will be flowing toward Keys again soon.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
That's nothing. Try $50 to 60 every 30 to 45 days.
No more though.
Actually, it WILL has long as people spend.
People NEVER spend money they don't think is worth it at the time of sale.
That raises two questions:
- Will people have too much regret after spending to repeat spend? If so, you adjust and try to plan better.
- Are the marginal returns higher?
Look. If you've got one guy who will spend $250 for 1000 dilithium and he wants 200k dilithium and he has the cash to blow, that's where the price should be. It doesn't matter that nobody else takes part in the market. That guy is subsidizing the whole game for a year and anybody else who wants dilithium can go earn it.
Buying dilithium should, ideally, be for wealthy players who are indiscriminate with their money. Not something that should have to be accessible for all players.
It's not like you are the most demanding, conservative spender on the planet...
The only problem I currently have is there isn't anything in the game I want. Exchange, c-store, fleet - anywhere.
In the past I would have simply continued to play stf to earn and maybe switch the weapons out on a ship for fun. Just like I could easily have completed ground on a new character.
Now however, as predicted, I am entirely dependent on having a concrete item to play for to put in any work. And I am very conservative about what I get. Like I use all old stf weapons just to get out of grinding and my latest alt, who is post 7, isn't doing reputation at all and so he is done - I don't play him at all.
I'd buy zen for 200 if there were an item I wanted.
But since s. 7 I only play for specific items and no longer put in any work - because of the way they set it up. In addition to that I'd simply rather not have the item at all in exchange for not grinding.
You play stf for reputation now, you don't play stf for stf. Once you are done with reputation you are done.
To me before s. 7 I'd continue to play stf no matter what drops I got. So to me the idea of prolonging gameplay actually had the reversed effect and mixed in with the whole "you are saving time parole" the whole thing is just... beyond the meassure of words.
That being said, only developers can say if they increased their in-come which is the only buttom line.
1)dilthium had fallen to 82
2)and I did not miss the daily grind 1 bit:P
guess people will continue to throw their money into the dilthium pit at any price.
Agreed, and I agree with the poster above you as well. Once you break from the grind, you realize it's not very appealing to go back. I worked my way up in a great Fleet with great people, got my Fleet ships/weapons for them and have had much fun watching things go boom with those new toys. Beyond that, there is not much that I find appealing here at all anymore. Ground anything still stinks, the Reputation system is here to stay according to Dstahl, and you know they will just butcher a Romulan playable species worse than KDF if that ever happens.
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The forums reflect the lack of interest in the state of the game just by being fairly quiet. Not too much going on. Perhaps the next lock-box and anniversary which should happen around the same time will revive the game and price of zen - but some how I don't think by a lot.
Of course, I am biased, as I am hoping to eventually scrounge enough dilithium to buy the 2.5K Zen needed for an Assault Cruiser Refit, but still...
(Said task would've been a lot easier had I not splurged a ton of dil for 2K Zen and then bought the Fleet Ship modules for a ship (Fleet AC) I can't get until my fleet reaches Tier 5, but that is neither here nor there.)
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
No; contented people are less likely to go to the forums and post about being contented. If the situation was reversed, you'd be hearing from a different mix of people.
Mind you, some of the most vocal would be the same. They'd also be the ones complaining if the price was smack in the middle.
You could try to get the SB Tier 3 Fleet Excelsior. Its only real noticeable downside is not having an Ensign Tactical boff (most people still use the Lt. Uni as sci).
Too true, I really don't care which way the wind blows on the exchange, it's not like the exchange rate is going to be Earth shattering. I bought Zen when it cost 300 dilithium when I needed it, I buy it at 85 when I need it now. My stipend gives me mostly what I need for the game.
The complaining is much to do about nothing.
The problem isn't so drastic in the exchange price then as compared to excessive cost of everything in the game. The free t4 ships are $14? But the premium are $20 or $25? That isn't right. The tier 2 embassy upgrade, $90? This is criminal. How much is a t5 starbase worth? $1000s? A single set of XII gear is $12.
The c-store is reasonable, the ability for F2Pers to play for free is pretty easy, the in game costs of everything are beyond ridiculous. The fix seems pretty clear, but it won't happen.
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Nothing to do anymore.
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$1,000 for a top-tier station is pretty cheap. A fleet-ready Titan in EVE is over $7,000 in real-world equivalent, and that's a comparable achievement AND YOU WILL PROBABLY LOSE IT with no refund. Starbases are optional, and intended to be spread across many players in a fleet. If you don't like their cost, don't build one.
No, a T5 base costs 0 and an ambassy 0 too. The only way to create dilithium is to refine it and you have to do it for free. If you want to trade real money with other players to take a shortcut it's your buisness/problem, but technically dilithium can't be bought; you can trade if when it's refined but you can't create dilithium with real money.
I bought all my endgame stuff on 2 chars and a 3rd one is on the way. I spent nothing, i just saved 1M dil or so. It took me 2 months to refine but at least i could get all i want and spent nothing on the dil exchange. I've even been able to trade some dil to buy more zen!
God, lvl 60 CW. 17k.
If Dil ever goes up to like 250 per Zen or something goofy again, most people that can count would hopefully walk out on the game on the spot. That nonsense is totally indefensible to anyone that isn't just trying to be rich on the internetz.
If you're going to have a Free 2 Play game, there's got to be a point to playing. You can't TRIBBLE on people and tell them it's raining and expect no one to notice. No one is going to grind for 8000/250 = 32 Zen a day, unless they're a complete moron.
Current prices are quite fair for grinding. The game is now just no longer in a position where a tiny, whiny minority who want the game handed to them on a plate can exploit everyone else and sit on their giant pile of ore while smoking a cigar.
I won't lose a second of sleep over that.
"We are smart." - Grebnedlog
Member of Alliance Central Command/boq botlhra'ghom
One thing you are not accounting for is that the overall higher prices are balanced by the fact that it is relatively easy to get the real money currency through playing the game. This effectively allows each player to set their own price for the item, which is actually a great free to play monetization model. Each player can price each item what they want to by playing the game. The premium ship may have an expensive sticker price of $20.00, but at the current dil exchange rate you can get it for absolutely free after 21 days of hitting the dilithium cap. If you want to pay $5.00 for the ship, you can do so by hitting the dil cap 15 days, etc. etc.
The overall effect is that the monetization model is much more flexible then you get in a lot of games, which theoratically should benefit everyone. Players are not priced out of certain items they want because they are cost prohibitive, and Cryptic can sell a lot more stuff at optimal prices because the players will buy anything they want to buy at the maximum price they are willing to pay for it. Obviously, theory and practice arent the same thing, but I like it.
I have accumulated 30k Zen for the third time. Used the last time to buy 300 keys during the last key sale and sell them.
So now I have about $700 million EC and 30k Zen - I have over 15 c-store ships and several fleet ships.
My problem with the whole situation is there is virtually nothing in the Z-store for players to buy that have been here for awhile. The whole game now is geared toward churring the 1-3 month players.
Maybe, but then again there's still a ton of stuff you need Dil for in game. While it may very well go back up, I'd be surprised if it goes up past 100 just because of the new lockboxes. If it does that says rather plainly just how popular those really are.
The base costs are comparative, dil to zen, so the cost nothing is just an idiotic answer. If a single upgrade is $90, I'm betting the base as a whole would be above $1000, in fact a quick calculation is showing me it is over $5500 to get to tier 5. Add the embassy.... Eve seems to be pretty average? But I bet whatever you get in Eve is at least a benefit to you, not a generic uncustomized base with features available everywhere else.
Of course I've accounted for the ability to get in game currency, the equivalent of dilithium exists in nearly all F2P games, the relationship of the free to the payers is a known thing, and its how the game makes money. The minority are supposed to pay, the majority are supposed to leach off them. If you make either end too lucrative then you fall out of the most profitable zone for the game.
Completed Starbase, Embassy, Mine, Spire and No Win Scenario
Nothing to do anymore.
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Joined - 9/2011
"You Best Make Peace With Your Dear & Fluffy Lord" - Malcolm Reynolds
Nothing wrong with that. I'm still hoping the cost for Zen drops to 50 - I've had a standing order to buy 1000 Zen at 50 dil since the exchange opened.
Please do not take this as a personal attack or criticism. but as an example I would like to throw another perspective on. I'm sure yours is not an uncommon story, oowww look how well I've, me, myself, I have done.
I can only imagine that fleets with members keeping their own dil to such a level as you descibed, are proud a member is doing so well for himself, whilst merely chipping in fleet marks till able to get the fleet goodies that the others have left the few in the fleet that do contribute in your stead with dil, or having to buy it to cover the rest of the members whose behavouir is rather like that. Hell who knows maybe some of the dil that got bought and donated WAS the dil selling members. So your fleet have kinda helped you out twice.
This is what, months and months and months later is still the issue, that you should be able to do as you've described without an undue effect on the fleet (which as 90%+ of players are in one I have assumed by the numbers your a typical example. Fact is Cryptic have made dil so central to starbase construction its crippling and a cause of much of the frustration and anger felt, especially by those who are subscibers and lifetime members who have put there hand in there pocket already to enjoy a game without undue restrictions.
I've seen posts about people saying there fleet has 25 members on at a time, why are only 25% donating
which is why i think cryptic should have a "Buy Zen. Nothing to buy here" sign on the webpage. There is no reason to get zen to buy anything since there is nothing to buy.
edit: I would like to point out that I only play kdf
Well I will take the new KDF fleet that I have been in for over a month now as an example. I have donated 0 dilthium but enough fleet marks to get me 400k fleet credit. Now there are some people who could go to work for a few hours(2-4) and make the $$$ to get that 400k fleet credit with a dilthium donation. So in fact they have put 0 hours effort in on the game but donated 400k dilthium. I on the other hand, I have put in 20x the amount of hours to get those fleet marks - so who has worked harder? Me by donating the marks- which are needed more in relative terms? or the person buying dilthium on the exchange and donating it?