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Dilthium HAS Officially crashed

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    bluegeekbluegeek Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Wait. You're saying it's not valuable because it's too scarce? How does that make sense? It may not be a good value for the money but that's a different question than whether it's valuable. (And it shouldn't be a separate question but it is.)

    As far as my wallet is concerned, it's the same. If it's not good value for the money, to the point where I'm unwilling to spend money to get it, then it's not that valuable.

    I don't disagree that Dilithium is important in the sense of what you can get for it in-game. But it's not real, it's entertainment. If extracting the money from my wallet starts to hurt, it's no longer entertaining.

    Dilithium is artificially valuable in-game because Cryptic dribbles it out with an eyedropper and sucks it up with a firehose. I personally can't earn enough of it to exchange it for Zen, buy a lot of stuff from the Dil store, or complete projects quickly, so it's less valuable to me than it might be otherwise.

    And I will reiterate that I will NEVER spend 1 Zen to get a lousy 25 Dilithium, EVER. You can't buy anything worth buying with 25 Dilithium, and you pretty much need at least 1000X that. If it drops below about 140, I won't even consider it.

    So I'm not willing to pay for it, and I can't earn enough of it in the short run to exchange it for goods from the Zen store or otherwise significantly enhance my gaming experience. Hence, it is both scarce and non-valuable.

    The way things work right now, it only encourages hoarding Dilithium. I spend as little of it as I can get away with, because I don't know when I'm going to need it or how much.

    What Cryptic really needs to do is to improve the value of the C-Store and get people to put their leftover Zen into the exchange through the way they price things -- so that when you buy something you usually have Zen left over that you can't really spend on anything, so you buy Dilithium with it instead of sitting on it.
    My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here
    Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
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    walshicuswalshicus Member Posts: 1,314 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    I'm still a bit baffled why the price of Dilithium hasn't gone down now that supply has increased. I can get my 8k per character limit in no time, providing I use the mark/bnp > dil projects.
    http://mmo-economics.com - analysing the economic interactions in MMOs.
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    logicalspocklogicalspock Member Posts: 836 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    All I can say is that, if you are smart, you will sell all the dilithium you earn now. When the market goes back up, cash out.
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    born2bwild1born2bwild1 Member Posts: 1,329 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    bluegeek wrote: »
    As far as my wallet is concerned, it's the same. If it's not good value for the money, to the point where I'm unwilling to spend money to get it, then it's not that valuable.

    I don't disagree that Dilithium is important in the sense of what you can get for it in-game. But it's not real, it's entertainment. If extracting the money from my wallet starts to hurt, it's no longer entertaining.

    Dilithium is artificially valuable in-game because Cryptic dribbles it out with an eyedropper and sucks it up with a firehose. I personally can't earn enough of it to exchange it for Zen, buy a lot of stuff from the Dil store, or complete projects quickly, so it's less valuable to me than it might be otherwise.

    And I will reiterate that I will NEVER spend 1 Zen to get a lousy 25 Dilithium, EVER. You can't buy anything worth buying with 25 Dilithium, and you pretty much need at least 1000X that. If it drops below about 140, I won't even consider it.

    So I'm not willing to pay for it, and I can't earn enough of it in the short run to exchange it for goods from the Zen store or otherwise significantly enhance my gaming experience. Hence, it is both scarce and non-valuable.

    The way things work right now, it only encourages hoarding Dilithium. I spend as little of it as I can get away with, because I don't know when I'm going to need it or how much.

    What Cryptic really needs to do is to improve the value of the C-Store and get people to put their leftover Zen into the exchange through the way they price things -- so that when you buy something you usually have Zen left over that you can't really spend on anything, so you buy Dilithium with it instead of sitting on it.

    Good to see some of the community mods posting again - was thinking you guys had gone awol
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    bluegeekbluegeek Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    adrianm63 wrote: »
    You mean those people who pay even more zen after s7 for dilithium are fools who dont know the true value :rolleyes:

    I'm sure some people are reading what I'm saying and laughing at me. That's fine.

    I will respectfully submit that people who overpay real money to get imaginary money might not be thinking very wisely.

    Once the price of anything exceeds a buyer's comfort level, they should stop buying. That's just common sense.

    When I measure how much Dilithium I would need to buy just to keep up with all of the sinks I could be spending it on, I realize that it's cost-prohibitive for me. So why do it? I'm way better off taking my time and hoarding what I can earn over the long haul (through gameplay) toward what's really important to me. I don't have to have the best gear right now or complete a starbase in the shortest amount of time possible. It's all fluff.

    I'm already getting my entertainment from the game from what I'm already doing. I don't need to buy a lot of extra Dilithium and I refuse to consider it more valuable than not being broke out here in the real world. I'm definitely not going to cause discontent in my household by overspending on a game that won't make me happy if my homelife is in shambles from making bad decisions with real money.
    My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here
    Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
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    sollvaxsollvax Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Wise is the Blue one
    Live long and Prosper
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    atomictikiatomictiki Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    walshicus wrote: »
    I'm still a bit baffled why the price of Dilithium hasn't gone down now that supply has increased. I can get my 8k per character limit in no time, providing I use the mark/bnp > dil projects.

    Because the "increase" is, by design, still far less than what was generated by players in prior seasons and the sinks are still hideously deep.
    Leave nerfing to the professionals.
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    sekritagentsekritagent Member Posts: 510 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    bluegeek wrote: »
    What Cryptic really needs to do is to improve the value of the C-Store and get people to put their leftover Zen into the exchange through the way they price things -- so that when you buy something you usually have Zen left over that you can't really spend on anything, so you buy Dilithium with it instead of sitting on it.

    Unlikely to happen because of the following:
    • Fleet ships now outgun Z-Store ships. There's precious little reason to buy any of the sub-T5 Z-Store ships anymore, unless it's for the console and maybe only 5 of those are worth it.
    • Z-Store sales are way too few and far between. I don't think the majority buy ships at full price but there's a decent number who do.
    • Too many per-character items now. People who roll a lot of alts aren't encouraged to buy things.
    • Z-Store ships are rapidly approaching saturation point. The only canon and high-demand ships left are Ambassador, K'Vort, T5 Connie (never happening), Norway, New Orleans, and the Andorian Vaporware Cruiser.
    • We're running out of lockbox ships too. All that's left is Romulan warbird (promised only for Romulan faction), Breen ship, any of the Borg or Iconian ships. Would have to have something way OP at this point (Xindi Aquatic carrier?)
    Delta Rising is the best expansion ever and the players love it! No, seriously! ...Why are you laughing so hard? :(
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    curs0rcurs0r Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Unlikely to happen because of the following:
    • Fleet ships now outgun Z-Store ships. There's precious little reason to buy any of the sub-T5 Z-Store ships anymore, unless it's for the console and maybe only 5 of those are worth it.
    • Z-Store sales are way too few and far between. I don't think the majority buy ships at full price but there's a decent number who do.
    • Too many per-character items now. People who roll a lot of alts aren't encouraged to buy things.
    • Z-Store ships are rapidly approaching saturation point. The only canon and high-demand ships left are Ambassador, K'Vort, T5 Connie (never happening), Norway, New Orleans, and the Andorian Vaporware Cruiser.
    • We're running out of lockbox ships too. All that's left is Romulan warbird (promised only for Romulan faction), Breen ship, any of the Borg or Iconian ships. Would have to have something way OP at this point (Xindi Aquatic carrier?)

    I think your point sort of interplays with what bluegeek was saying. It is especially because of the factors you list that the store is of limited appeal to many. A price reduction to offset the diminished value of those items could be just the trick. I have long felt that they would move more Zen if they added more items in the 25-75 Zen range. A consumable that works just like the fleet operational assets to spawn a couple of cruisers in a fight would probably be well received at 30 Zen for uncommon (1 ship), 50 Zen for rare (2 ships), and 70 Zen for very rare (3 ships). That's of course just off the top of my head. There are a lot of fairly basic consumable items that low level alts and new players could benefit from. They just don't need to cost as much as the items like skill boosts cost.
    I'll sell you some weapons from New Romulus. Never fired, only dropped once.
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    kiralynkiralyn Member Posts: 1,576 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    walshicus wrote: »
    I'm still a bit baffled why the price of Dilithium hasn't gone down now that supply has increased. I can get my 8k per character limit in no time, providing I use the mark/bnp > dil projects.


    Depends on how much the "supply has increased" for the average user. What % of players spam out elite STFs and have 1000's of extra marks on hand to blow on Dil? How many newbie f2p players don't even cap out their 8k dil a day?

    Don't know. Can only (like you) see my own example. (I'm one of the people who is baffled by people saying - in other threads - that they can make their daily dil cap in an hour of dailies. I don't think I've hit the 8k cap once, and doing the Tau Dewa radiation & patrol dailies yesterday by themselves took me an hour. But I don't have a tricked out ship with all the best gear, and can't just blow through combat missions in 30 seconds. /shrug And I'm not doing STFs at all, because I've no confidence that I can do it and refuse to waste four other people's time to find out by TRIBBLE up their pug.)

    Yeah, I'm not the "average player". But are you? Or is it somewhere in between?
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    thratch1thratch1 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    kiralyn wrote: »
    And I'm not doing STFs at all, because I've no confidence that I can do it and refuse to waste four other people's time to find out by TRIBBLE up their pug.)

    Don't be afraid to try something. There are great posts to prepare you for Normals, and then you can jump into Elites when you feel like you're ready. It's really nothing to be afraid of, as long as you pay attention to what you're doing, and google strategies. After one or two successful runs in Elites, it'll feel like old hat.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    maarkeanmaarkean Member Posts: 116 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    kiralyn wrote: »
    Depends on how much the "supply has increased" for the average user. What % of players spam out elite STFs and have 1000's of extra marks on hand to blow on Dil? How many newbie f2p players don't even cap out their 8k dil a day?

    Don't know. Can only (like you) see my own example. (I'm one of the people who is baffled by people saying - in other threads - that they can make their daily dil cap in an hour of dailies. I don't think I've hit the 8k cap once, and doing the Tau Dewa radiation & patrol dailies yesterday by themselves took me an hour. But I don't have a tricked out ship with all the best gear, and can't just blow through combat missions in 30 seconds. /shrug And I'm not doing STFs at all, because I've no confidence that I can do it and refuse to waste four other people's time to find out by TRIBBLE up their pug.)

    Yeah, I'm not the "average player". But are you? Or is it somewhere in between?

    I do have a fully tricked out ship and I'm in the same boat. I've hit the 8k on a few rare occasions but only when I made a concentrated effort to only grind for Dilithium. For normal game play, I'll run a fleet action for the daily fleet marks (480-620 Dil), do 1-2 STF's (960-1920), turn in DOFF missions (few hundred usual, with is sometimes over 2000 if I do a contraband turn in) and then the Romulan daily which awards nothing. This takes me over an hour and equals 5k at the extreme, but usually around 2k.

    If I happen to have more time, I'll run an exploration daily or Defera for another bit. But even doing both of those, another hours worth of work, only nets 4k. That would get me to 8k but only after 2hrs+ of work.

    And yes, I call gaining Dilithium work because I have to do extra effort beyond what I consider fun to acquire it.

    Maybe some people can gain 8k+ every day but who cares? There's a refinement cap. Make the cap per account, remove dilithium from everything and just add a daily mission that awards 8k, just for logging in and completely one Cryptic mission. Then, we can go play the game without having to grind.
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    born2bwild1born2bwild1 Member Posts: 1,329 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    kiralyn wrote: »
    Depends on how much the "supply has increased" for the average user. What % of players spam out elite STFs and have 1000's of extra marks on hand to blow on Dil? How many newbie f2p players don't even cap out their 8k dil a day?

    Don't know. Can only (like you) see my own example. (I'm one of the people who is baffled by people saying - in other threads - that they can make their daily dil cap in an hour of dailies. I don't think I've hit the 8k cap once, and doing the Tau Dewa radiation & patrol dailies yesterday by themselves took me an hour. But I don't have a tricked out ship with all the best gear, and can't just blow through combat missions in 30 seconds. /shrug And I'm not doing STFs at all, because I've no confidence that I can do it and refuse to waste four other people's time to find out by TRIBBLE up their pug.)

    Yeah, I'm not the "average player". But are you? Or is it somewhere in between?

    Probably because you are not playing KDF - with all the dailies that the KDF has + all the Marauding missions you can make millions per hour

    Was just in Ker`rat having a blast blowing up Feds in my B`rel - and for every 10 Feds I blow up I get 480 dilth + running 3 instances of Ker`rat I get another 480 + there is also the daily kill 50 Npc`s that I can pick up there for more dilthium.

    Then there are 4 empire defense missions you can run for 1440 dilthium EACH!

    Plus PvP dailies

    Plus some fleet actions + all the other things that the Feds have. You hardly ever hear a KDF player saying they can`t meet the daily cap.
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    curs0rcurs0r Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Probably because you are not playing KDF - with all the dailies that the KDF has + all the Marauding missions you can make millions per hour

    Was just in Ker`rat having a blast blowing up Feds in my B`rel - and for every 10 Feds I blow up I get 480 dilth + running 3 instances of Ker`rat I get another 480 + there is also the daily kill 50 Npc`s that I can pick up there for more dilthium.

    Then there are 4 empire defense missions you can run for 1440 dilthium EACH!

    Plus PvP dailies

    Plus some fleet actions + all the other things that the Feds have. You hardly ever hear a KDF player saying they can`t meet the daily cap.

    You don't even need to do all that to hit the daily cap in under an hour. KDF is not required either.
    I'll sell you some weapons from New Romulus. Never fired, only dropped once.
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    latinumbarlatinumbar Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Probably because you are not playing KDF - with all the dailies that the KDF has + all the Marauding missions you can make millions per hour

    Was just in Ker`rat having a blast blowing up Feds in my B`rel - and for every 10 Feds I blow up I get 480 dilth + running 3 instances of Ker`rat I get another 480 + there is also the daily kill 50 Npc`s that I can pick up there for more dilthium.

    Then there are 4 empire defense missions you can run for 1440 dilthium EACH!

    Plus PvP dailies

    Plus some fleet actions + all the other things that the Feds have. You hardly ever hear a KDF player saying they can`t meet the daily cap.

    Is there enough dilithium to be had to make the cap? Of course. But the problem is TIME. Your Ker'rat info is misleading. Killing 10 ships will net you 480, but it is a daily just like the others. You can't repeat it ad infinitum. If you don't do it everyday, you might get to do it twice, but that's it. And killing feds can be hit or miss. I've been in instances where there were only 2 klinks vs a whole mess of feds just flying around in a fed ball. Getting 10 kills in that situation is difficult to say the least. You can still do it with some effort, but it won't be 'time efficient'. Quicker to run an SB24 on fed side than to spend 30 min trying to get 10 kills. Plus, some people don't like PVP. To them, it's 'grind' or 'work', ie doing something they don't like in order to get dilithium.
    _____________________
    Come join the 44th Fleet.
    startrek.44thfleet.com[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    born2bwild1born2bwild1 Member Posts: 1,329 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    latinumbar wrote: »
    Is there enough dilithium to be had to make the cap? Of course. But the problem is TIME. Your Ker'rat info is misleading. Killing 10 ships will net you 480, but it is a daily just like the others. You can't repeat it ad infinitum. If you don't do it everyday, you might get to do it twice, but that's it. And killing feds can be hit or miss. I've been in instances where there were only 2 klinks vs a whole mess of feds just flying around in a fed ball. Getting 10 kills in that situation is difficult to say the least. You can still do it with some effort, but it won't be 'time efficient'. Quicker to run an SB24 on fed side than to spend 30 min trying to get 10 kills. Plus, some people don't like PVP. To them, it's 'grind' or 'work', ie doing something they don't like in order to get dilithium.

    Actually the Kill 10 Feds is a daily and I do run them back to back for efficiency - and usually in the evening when there are lots more KDF and Feds looking for a Fight.

    Tonight was a blast - there were like 9 KDF and 15 Fed in 1 instance - about 5 Feds running the borg stuff and the other 10 coming over and over again for a pounding.

    but yes it`s certainly not always that busy.

    If it`s not busy i just switch toons to do something else or do something else with that toon. I don`t bother waiting around.
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    twg042370twg042370 Member Posts: 2,312 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Then there are 4 empire defense missions you can run for 1440 dilthium EACH!

    Three repeats per zone means you're doing the same thing twelve times and that is damned boring. I'd rather go park over DS9 and turn in contraband.
    <3
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    born2bwild1born2bwild1 Member Posts: 1,329 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    twg042370 wrote: »
    Three repeats per zone means you're doing the same thing twelve times and that is damned boring. I'd rather go park over DS9 and turn in contraband.

    Well the that`s what most KDF do - and supply Feds with contraband on the exchange. Price of contraband went up at least 15% after all the dilthium nerfs.
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    latinumbarlatinumbar Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Well the that`s what most KDF do - and supply Feds with contraband on the exchange. Price of contraband went up at least 15% after all the dilthium nerfs.

    I have 3 KDFs. It's not what I do. In fact, I haven't done empire defense since I leveled my last toon - for the same reason the other poster mentioned. It's extremely boring. I'd rather do STFs, or doff. Sometimes I'll pop into Kerrat if the daily is available. And now I'm spending time doing the romulan rep system. That pretty much uses up all my playtime. If I DO have time for something else, I'd rather do Pi Canis sorties.
    _____________________
    Come join the 44th Fleet.
    startrek.44thfleet.com[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    born2bwild1born2bwild1 Member Posts: 1,329 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    latinumbar wrote: »
    I have 3 KDFs. It's not what I do. In fact, I haven't done empire defense since I leveled my last toon - for the same reason the other poster mentioned. It's extremely boring. I'd rather do STFs, or doff. Sometimes I'll pop into Kerrat if the daily is available. And now I'm spending time doing the romulan rep system. That pretty much uses up all my playtime. If I DO have time for something else, I'd rather do Pi Canis sorties.

    I was refering to all the doffing on the KDF side that rewards boatloads on Contraband and gear.
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    cameltoe77cameltoe77 Member Posts: 21 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Right now there is 30k at 131 and 60k at 130 - then nothing like 2k down to 127 - who knows what is below that

    on the ohter side it's stacked up with zen to sell

    Forget dilithium ... go farm eppohhs
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    topsettopset Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    cameltoe77 wrote: »
    Forget dilithium ... go farm eppohhs


    Are you seriously going to post this on every thread in "Discussion"?

    Once was enough.

    Once was more than enough.

    You can stop now...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Kirk's Protege.
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    atomictikiatomictiki Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    cameltoe77 wrote: »
    Forget dilithium ... go farm eppohhs

    Frak those derpy targs.
    Leave nerfing to the professionals.
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    theultimatextheultimatex Member Posts: 489 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    bareel wrote: »
    It is not your standard average player who is making a much smaller amount. It is those players who farmed 20+ alts for the 'investigate' daily. That takes a huge amount off of the market. But I could be wrong.



    Actually when I farmed that daily with my 16 characters, I did not put any of the Dil on the market. I acutally bought MORE dilthium with Zen bought with cas as I was using Dil for Starbases projects for a fleet of 1. Now I hoard both my Zen and my Dilth religiously like everyone else after season 7. I can't afford to waste either one.
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    stark2kstark2k Member Posts: 1,467 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    truth is folks are holding on to both their Zen and Dilithium, especially Dilithium. This is because we now have to be more selective in where we spend our Dilithium. If you are sitting on a mountain of Dilithium and want to solely exchange it to Zen, now is the time to buy Zen while the market is low.

    However; if you are like me, and people like me that contribute to starbase projects etc... Horde your "D" and wisely spend it on well worth projects.
    StarTrekIronMan.jpg
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    born2bwild1born2bwild1 Member Posts: 1,329 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    100 is almost IN SIGHT!

    Can see 104 on the board

    now trading at 108
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    born2bwild1born2bwild1 Member Posts: 1,329 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    Last thread was started when dilthium to Zen was at 131 and I said it WAS crashing to 100

    I hoped it would not get there but now it has.

    So you people who bought dilthium with real money - will you now??

    What is your cut off price?
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    squishkinsquishkin Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    As someone who has stockpiled a million dilithium on multiple occasions, I heartily applaud this note. :D

    Eventually I plan to buy out the entire C-store with dilithium.
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    lordmalak1lordmalak1 Member Posts: 4,681 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    squishkin wrote: »
    As someone who has stockpiled a million dilithium on multiple occasions, I heartily applaud this note. :D

    Eventually I plan to buy out the entire C-store with dilithium.

    NICE !

    This is good for cryptic.
    KBF Lord MalaK
    Awoken Dead
    giphy.gif

    Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
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    atomictikiatomictiki Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited December 2012
    C'mon bear market! Go go go!
    Leave nerfing to the professionals.
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