Even so, that doesn't help with ANY of the other requirements for fleet progression, such as dil, doff's, commodities, etc.. but for those of us with lives outside of the game and don't have time to grind fleet events, could still get the marks.
I'm actually in favor of helping small fleets, but you lost all credibility with this comment,
Your basically saying you want to get rewarded for doing squat. Sorry, that's pathetic. . Besides, you already can earn fleet marks for doing nothing but doff missions by converting CPX to marks.
I think what's hurting the fleet I'm in right now, is we've got that station project up that requires the white quality boffs, but won't actually allow you to contribute them. We're still waiting on that bug to be fixed.
I don't get the excitement at all. This is not EVE where your Starbase actually covers a space in a vast universe which can be dealt with freely by any other player. The STO Starbase is a minigame in an instance where people put all their ressources because they are bored. For everyone outside of your fleet, your starbase doesn't even exist. It really doesn't matter how far you advance and at what point you are doing it, relax and either be merry with it or play one of the games out there doing it better
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I'm actually in favor of helping small fleets, but you lost all credibility with this comment,
Your basically saying you want to get rewarded for doing squat. Sorry, that's pathetic. . Besides, you already can earn fleet marks for doing nothing but doff missions by converting CPX to marks.
You know what **** you, you don't know me so don't act like you do after reading one post.
Also I've never called someone a name on forum to make a point, and I'm pathetic. Go **** yourself.
I've personally sunk over 3 million Dilithium into my fleet while my fleet mates grinded the doffs, commodities, etc... and we all did the fleet mark events. But since Season 7 launched we don't have the time to grind Fleet mark events like we used to, in addition to all the new grindy events that have been added.
I'm not asking to be rewarded for doing nothing, i'm asking to take a little grind off the top of my Grind cake,
You know what F*** you, you don't know me so don't act like you do after reading one post.
Also I've never called someone a name on forum to make me feel better. So Slowclap for you.
I've personally sunk over 3 million Dilithium into my fleet while my fleet mates grinded the doffs, commodities, etc... and we all did the fleet mark events. But since Season 7 launched we don't have the time to grind Fleet mark events like we used to, in addition to all the new grindy events that have been added.
I'm not asking to be rewarded for doing nothing, i'm asking to take a little grind off the top of my Grind cake,
Theres Really not much of a grind added.. I don't even do the Repuation boosting events and I have romulan marks and omega marks Burrying me. I do the Two daily events on rommie space on my 16 characters and if you know again.. what your Doing.. Using.. Intelligence and efficiency it goes quick.
the Tau dewa Tour you can sit on one Planet and kill the 5 waves of enemies for 20% at a time, Goes Real quick if you are setup right. I have more Omega Marks and BNP's coming out of eSTF's then I know what to do with. Hell at the average rate of 6-12 BNP's per Elite STF's One STF can grant me 960 dil + if I get the double BNP drop.. another 2000 dilithium.. thats near 3000 dilithium for one eSTF.. considering they used to just give 1440. Do the Hard missions on Nakura and Defara, hell also do them during the FLARK events and you make enough Flarks to cover decent upgrades real quick.
I have a full time Job and a soon to be 7 year old Son. While he is at a friends house playing or in no interest to hang out with dad I play the game. I consider my self to have a decently full plate. Kid during the Day and work overnight. As well as having 2 Active subs on Eve Online that I handle, 2 subs on Perpetuum Online, SWtor (not worth subbing to but fun at times) and STo running in TWO fleets. I still Get projects going and so does the fleeties. You need either to figure out how to organize your time and how you get stuff done or quit playing one of the Least Grinding Games out there in the MMO community. Considering You can get to end game within 3-4 days of simple Playing and hitting Mirror Events, If you maximize your dilithium Earnings and spending the game works for you, not you work for it. You Can Curse at other players or me all you want. But from the Majority of us who have Ran or still run small Fleets, to the Larger Fleets, You won't find much pitty, Especially since it keeps getting EASIER for the Casual Base.
Proud Fleet Commander in Garfon's Renegades!
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
Theres Really not much of a grind added.. I don't even do the Repuation boosting events and I have romulan marks and omega marks Burrying me. I do the Two daily events on rommie space on my 16 characters and if you know again.. what your Doing.. Using.. Intelligence and efficiency it goes quick.
the Tau dewa Tour you can sit on one Planet and kill the 5 waves of enemies for 20% at a time, Goes Real quick if you are setup right. I have more Omega Marks and BNP's coming out of eSTF's then I know what to do with. Hell at the average rate of 6-12 BNP's per Elite STF's One STF can grant me 960 dil + if I get the double BNP drop.. another 2000 dilithium.. thats near 3000 dilithium for one eSTF.. considering they used to just give 1440. Do the Hard missions on Nakura and Defara, hell also do them during the FLARK events and you make enough Flarks to cover decent upgrades real quick.
I have a full time Job and a soon to be 7 year old Son. While he is at a friends house playing or in no interest to hang out with dad I play the game. I consider my self to have a decently full plate. Kid during the Day and work overnight. As well as having 2 Active subs on Eve Online that I handle, 2 subs on Perpetuum Online, SWtor (not worth subbing to but fun at times) and STo running in TWO fleets. I still Get projects going and so does the fleeties. You need either to figure out how to organize your time and how you get stuff done or quit playing one of the Least Grinding Games out there in the MMO community. Considering You can get to end game within 3-4 days of simple Playing and hitting Mirror Events, If you maximize your dilithium Earnings and spending the game works for you, not you work for it. You Can Curse at other players or me all you want. But from the Majority of us who have Ran or still run small Fleets, to the Larger Fleets, You won't find much pitty, Especially since it keeps getting EASIER for the Casual Base.
Your one of the last people that needs to be cursed at, you bring up a valid point and your not insulting anyone.
I don't know i'm just frustrated with the lack of dev input on the small fleet situation, a plain "We hate you and your small fleet" would at least give us some closure.
Your one of the last people that needs to be cursed at, you bring up a valid point and your not insulting anyone.
I don't know i'm just frustrated with the lack of dev input on the small fleet situation, a plain "We hate you and your small fleet" would at least give us some closure.
The thing is tho Sir, I understand your Frustrations, Honestly I do, I have been there. But, this Grind was not Hidden. Everyone Prior to Season 6 had the ability to TEST and VOICE there Concerns On Tribble Test Server. They Dev's believe it or not are decently Active on TTS. The Reason why The Dev's are not Voicing Oppinion on this is because it is not Hatred on small Fleets, But Ignorance By small Fleet Users. They have Stated Exactly how this would be well before it's release in multing Q&As. Again, Most of us are WAY ahead of the game. Tier 1 and 2 were going to be easily achievable by Small Fleets, Tiers 3-5 Were going to be harder. It was Blatantly Stated. Hell I had maybe 5 people Pushing both of my fleets, With me being the top donator amongst both Fleets. I ran the Knights That Said Ni and the Forsaken Reavers. the Knights that said Ni had maybe 5 Actives and we were a tier 3 Starbase, the Forsaken Reavers a KDF fleet was a Tier to soon to be 3 Fleet.
I did recently Can both fleets tho, Only because it ended up being a Two man fleet. At some point It either comes to recruit more, which I was having difficulty doing, or Put down the Limping Horse. To which I did. This did not have anything to do in respect to the starbases or reputation system, but due to the fact that it is not worth keeping a 2 man fleet open. I killed them and joined a friends Fleet. I am not saying this should be the action for everyone. But it was mine.
You Small Fleet Leaders just need to Calm down and remember, It is a Game in the end. You need to remember what you signed up for. Alot of people Left Larger fleets to create there own, or started the game and wanted to run there own fleets and build there own starbases. The Devs are not hating on you. You just need to understand This things are meant to go slow in small numbers. Just like in real life, small numbers can achieve Great things, but Large numbers Have the ability to do it quicker. You are building a Starbase, A massive space Structure. This should not go quick and easy. There are other games out there which players have to grind and wait months to get there skills up to even do this. The Grind in this game is not bad at all and very simple to be honest. Just RELAX and stop thinking things will be accomplished overnight. If you think the Grind is that bad, Maybe it's time to step away from STO for a little bit and try a few other games and then come back. We all Take our break periods to try out other things, If you truly like the game, you will stick to it.
Proud Fleet Commander in Garfon's Renegades!
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
I have a full time Job and a soon to be 7 year old Son. While he is at a friends house playing or in no interest to hang out with dad I play the game. I consider my self to have a decently full plate. Kid during the Day and work overnight. As well as having 2 Active subs on Eve Online that I handle, 2 subs on Perpetuum Online, SWtor (not worth subbing to but fun at times) and STo running in TWO fleets. I still Get projects going and so does the fleeties. You need either to figure out how to organize your time and how you get stuff done or quit playing one of the Least Grinding Games out there in the MMO community. Considering You can get to end game within 3-4 days of simple Playing and hitting Mirror Events, If you maximize your dilithium Earnings and spending the game works for you, not you work for it. You Can Curse at other players or me all you want. But from the Majority of us who have Ran or still run small Fleets, to the Larger Fleets, You won't find much pitty, Especially since it keeps getting EASIER for the Casual Base.
I'm guessing keeping that many games running, you more or less farm your son out to various friends. Does he even know what you look like? Or do you get to play at work?
Just kidding, kinda.
I think the problem isn't that it requires too many resources, it's that there are too many resources to collect. If I, as a casual player, manage to play for, say 5 hours per week, which is entirely possible, that gives enough time for maybe 300 Omega/Romulan marks, and probably less than half of that in Fleet Marks, assuming a little time is left for the likes of Doffing. Now imagine a small fleet of people, all of whom play this casually. Indeed the fleet is created to provide them with a home because a lot of the larger fleets insist on people playing for however long per week, or minimum requirements for starbase projects, and so on.
Now, if you were one of those casual players in one of those fleets, would you want to be able to both contribute to the fleet starbase and progress with your personal game goals (rep, STFs, or whatever they may be), or would you want to be forced into one type of content over another every time you logged into the game because the game is set up to penalise players like you? And now the Embassy system comes along and near enough doubles your grind?
What does it matter if smaller fleets can progress just as quickly as larger fleets? As you said yourself (I think, it may have been someone else in this thread), starbases are social areas, personal to a player's fleet and not really looked at by anyone else.
As I suggested in another thread, and as someone else suggested in this thread, why not scale the projects depending on how many people are in the fleet? Larger fleets require more resources but offer more rewards (ie Fleet credits), smaller fleets require less resources, but give smaller rewards. I would say I would apply this mostly to the limited time projects because it is a hell of a lot harder for a fleet of 5 players to come up with 400k spare dilithium than it is for a fleet of 50.
Doing it this way would be good for the players, since they can see progress being made on their fleet base, and it would be good for the fleets because it is encouraging people in the fleet to be active.
You know what **** you, you don't know me so don't act like you do after reading one post.
Also I've never called someone a name on forum to make a point, and I'm pathetic. Go **** yourself.
I've personally sunk over 3 million Dilithium into my fleet while my fleet mates grinded the doffs, commodities, etc... and we all did the fleet mark events. But since Season 7 launched we don't have the time to grind Fleet mark events like we used to, in addition to all the new grindy events that have been added.
I'm not asking to be rewarded for doing nothing, i'm asking to take a little grind off the top of my Grind cake,
Nah, you just implied that other people "don't have lives" because they don't follow your line of thought. Don't play that uppity *life* card nonsense if you don't want to get slapped upside the head with it. And don't get pissy because you got called out for saying exactly what you said, which is that you want something for nothing. It takes 20 minutes at most to meet your daily mark requirements to keep the Romulan reputation train running, and you can earn fleet marks while doing it. In the 15 minutes it takes to keep your Omega train running, you're also earning dilithium and loot. That leaves a whole lot of time to do fleet mark events, if that's what floats your boat.
This game's so-called grind is ridiculously easy for a casual player. I can manage to push my personal goals along and contribute to my fleet at a decent clip, and I play maybe an hour a day, and I don't even have any alts like most of the community does. The Doff system is a casual players dream, and the time-gated dilithium and reputation systems make it incredibly easy to keep up with hardcore players. What more do you want?
And if you can't fill your damned quota, who the hell cares. It's not a race. Play the damn game and donate what you can when you can. My fleet recently spent a week grinding out the fleet marks to upgrade our starbase to the next tier... did we TRIBBLE and moan about it? No, we just accepted that it's going to take a little bit longer. And yeah, it's pathetic because your making a damned mountain out of a molehill. Your asking for another exploitable clicky reward system after we finally got most of them removed from the game.
If you want to fix small fleets, then come up with an innovate idea that actually addresses the problem. Maybe some sort of alliance system that allows small fleets to share starbase evolution without giving up their small fleet status. Don't ask for nonsense exploitable handouts.
I'm guessing keeping that many games running, you more or less farm your son out to various friends. Does he even know what you look like? Or do you get to play at work?
Just kidding, kinda.
I think the problem isn't that it requires too many resources, it's that there are too many resources to collect. If I, as a casual player, manage to play for, say 5 hours per week, which is entirely possible, that gives enough time for maybe 300 Omega/Romulan marks, and probably less than half of that in Fleet Marks, assuming a little time is left for the likes of Doffing. Now imagine a small fleet of people, all of whom play this casually. Indeed the fleet is created to provide them with a home because a lot of the larger fleets insist on people playing for however long per week, or minimum requirements for starbase projects, and so on.
Now, if you were one of those casual players in one of those fleets, would you want to be able to both contribute to the fleet starbase and progress with your personal game goals (rep, STFs, or whatever they may be), or would you want to be forced into one type of content over another every time you logged into the game because the game is set up to penalise players like you? And now the Embassy system comes along and near enough doubles your grind?
What does it matter if smaller fleets can progress just as quickly as larger fleets? As you said yourself (I think, it may have been someone else in this thread), starbases are social areas, personal to a player's fleet and not really looked at by anyone else.
As I suggested in another thread, and as someone else suggested in this thread, why not scale the projects depending on how many people are in the fleet? Larger fleets require more resources but offer more rewards (ie Fleet credits), smaller fleets require less resources, but give smaller rewards. I would say I would apply this mostly to the limited time projects because it is a hell of a lot harder for a fleet of 5 players to come up with 400k spare dilithium than it is for a fleet of 50.
Doing it this way would be good for the players, since they can see progress being made on their fleet base, and it would be good for the fleets because it is encouraging people in the fleet to be active.
I don't Farm my son out LOL. Sadly at 7 tho he has already told me I crowd him to much Love my kid to death, Before him I spent most of my cash on Computer tech or other toys. Now I have actually learned how to save my cash and spend most of it on him now (which is how it should be) But before he started Kindergarten he loved spending time with me, now it's his friends already. Honestly I like it that way because he is not like me sitting infront of the PC all the time or a TV as some parents let happen. The kids he hangs out with are not console dwellers either thankfully so he is actually out running around. But back on topic.
The Problem is, the systems that you all started to build were Blantly put out infront of you. The problem with them Scalling the requirements to the size of the fleet is then all Fleets are leveling Fairly and Equally. A small Fleet should not be building at the same size as a Large Fleet. Because then The Fleetism (My form for STO racism) is reversed. Now you are punishing Large fleets for Succeeding. This is not fair as well.
What Cryptic did was build a system and Place it for everyone to Weigh in on prior to release. They have been making changes to the system based on player feed back. Perfect Example as I have stated was the Fking rediculous needs for the bartender (Honestly The cost for that idiot and what he gives is pure stupidity, I get better goods at the Captains Table). No matter what changes they do to the starbase system it has to remain Fair to the overall base of players. Going by how many players actually get on the forums and complain, this is a few people. If more logged onto the forums and voice there oppinion Cryptic Would listen more. If only a few call unfairness, but the majority stay quiet just like in real life, nothing Gets done quickly. Most of the forums Posters are well aware of who each other is, that is how small of the complaint base that actually goes out there is.
The starbase ALSO is designed to be a LONG TERM goal. Not a short term Goal like the reputation system. That can be finished in 2 maybe 2 1/2 months. I know I am in tier 3 and it's barely been alive. Once the Rep systems are done everybody will be flooding the bases again then people will be complaining (again) that they never have opportunities to donate anything to the Tabs.
Rule #1 of a MMO - The Forum Player base is NEVER happy.
Rule #2 is based off Rule #1: If they are, Give it a day they will find something to complain about.
Rule #3 No matter what you do to improve one players life it will easily TRIBBLE off 10 others.
This is easily Verifiable (the numbers might not be fully correct.. ) to check out the results of Every Patch, Hell look at Tribble Notes. You will have people Thanking the Dev for one thing AND in the next post People ******** about What is not Fixed yet. The Devs are human, they can only do so much. They have lives Also, either playing the game, OR there Families that You Players complain about not seeing due to the Grind. Well there time is Grinded on Fixing Stuff, they need breaks to. ( I know I am a heretic for thinking like this)
Proud Fleet Commander in Garfon's Renegades!
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
If Cryptic puts a 150 to 200 membership cap on fleets, they can lower the resource requirements for everyone. Instead of having only a handful of fleets consisting of 400+ members, "Star Trek: Online" will have many smaller, happier, and diverse fleets.
Smaller fleets = less resource requirements = less grinding = happier players.
Larger fleets are hording players and resources; thus, they are crushing the competition of smaller fleets.
Players have decided to join bigger fleets, for they are being lured by free provisions.
Smaller fleets cannot compete against larger fleets giving out free stuff.
I like the idea of scaling the requirements AND rewards. Sure, everyone would level more or less equally, assuming the members care the same for their bases.
Fleet sizes would regulated themselves then better.
people not joining the mega fleets needlessly for the T4/5 rewards and fleets not only recruiting for faceless donators.
The overall average leveling time would then probably be longer that what we see from the mega fleets now, although there should also be a slight advantage to really big fleets through a mild resource cap for projects.
But there are 2 problems with this system.
people temporarily kicking their members to get the small requirements after pooling their resources and then letting people rejoin for the cheaply bought rewards.
And fleet leaders being trigger happy with kicking temporarily inactive players because they start to become a drain on their fleet mates.
time a moderator shut this thread down, too much negativity in here
* blinks* This is way to mild for it to get shut down. Let's reserve the closing of threads to those with an actual necessity. People are still for the most part discussing situations to improve the ways. Only a few not worth reading have popped up.
Proud Fleet Commander in Garfon's Renegades!
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
wait wait wait where is this year and a half to two years for smaller fleet to reach tier 5 coming from??
It was stated pre season 6 launch that the AVERAGE fleet size was around 20 members, again average not the large "who cares about you, you're just a number to brag about" mega fleets. We were assured that while it would take longer for smaller fleets to progress that the system was being designed for the average sized fleet, and really that is the real issue here. There was a huge amount of concern about this during the tribble testing phase as well.
Mega Fleets can pretty easily keep a constant grind going on the fleet projects, embassy projects and now their own personal rep projects and still hit tier 5 starbase WAY WAY faster than anyone else. Now with the added grind of personal systems people aren't contributing to fleet projects as much, to a mega fleet this doesn't matter, but to a Average or smaller fleet this can be disastrous.
I would be happy as hell to have 20 solid, active, friendly fleetmates who actually give a TRIBBLE about being social rather than be in a mega fleet where it's nothing about being social it's all about the grind and the bragging rights.
I would give a flying $#*^ if my fleet ever hit tier 5 for the base or anything with the embassy, EXCEPT That's where all the newest updated and upgraded gear and stuff is.
Fleets 50 and under should get a groundbase fleets 51 and over should get the starbase. Scale those based on the different size ranges for the projects and problem solved. if a fleet under 50 reaches max then they get transfered to a starbase will their current progress level but then the high project costs and visa versa.
Why should we average/smaller fleets either have to disband or spend all our ingame time trying to recruit new members who never end up staying because they want the higher tier gear faster.
this isn't about punishing average/smaller fleets or about punishing larger fleets it just about scaling for the gear really.
I'm not entirely sure how small fleets are dying. Fleets live or die based on the policies and the opportunities presented by the leadership. They live or die because of the passion that the members share for the game, the fleet, and the IP. Mine, is thriving, even growing. If your fleet is dying it's because you're not doing something that your niche market desires. If you figure out what that is, nothing less than a content drought is going to torpedo you, and lets face it, that drought is over.
I don't Farm my son out LOL. Sadly at 7 tho he has already told me I crowd him to much Love my kid to death, Before him I spent most of my cash on Computer tech or other toys. Now I have actually learned how to save my cash and spend most of it on him now (which is how it should be) But before he started Kindergarten he loved spending time with me, now it's his friends already. Honestly I like it that way because he is not like me sitting infront of the PC all the time or a TV as some parents let happen. The kids he hangs out with are not console dwellers either thankfully so he is actually out running around. But back on topic.
The Problem is, the systems that you all started to build were Blantly put out infront of you. The problem with them Scalling the requirements to the size of the fleet is then all Fleets are leveling Fairly and Equally. A small Fleet should not be building at the same size as a Large Fleet. Because then The Fleetism (My form for STO racism) is reversed. Now you are punishing Large fleets for Succeeding. This is not fair as well.
My scaling system reflects this. You wouldn't be punishing larger fleets because each member would be contributing less, yet getting better rewards. For example, take 2 fleets, one of 50 players, one of 5. At the moment, the fleet with 5 players is having to contribute 10x the amount of resources per person as the fleet with 50 players. The result is, those 5 players have piles and piles of unusable fleet credits, whereas the 50 players probably have slightly too few fleet credits for what they want (hence the reason for the 'bonus' missions in the fleet project list, specifically designed to help a larger fleet generate fleet credits while giving a worthless boost to your starbase xp).
With a scaling system, I'm not asking for an exact scale or anything. Maybe a 20% scale, so the smaller fleet is still having to contribute more per person (approximately double), yet they are still progressing at a reasonable pace, where the larger fleets would still contribute the same resources as they always have, yet get a greater return on fleet credits. This will still funnel most players into large fleets, which is what Cryptic seem to want, but will still leave smaller fleets as a viable option for those who don't want to join a large fleet.
What Cryptic did was build a system and Place it for everyone to Weigh in on prior to release. They have been making changes to the system based on player feed back. Perfect Example as I have stated was the Fking rediculous needs for the bartender (Honestly The cost for that idiot and what he gives is pure stupidity, I get better goods at the Captains Table). No matter what changes they do to the starbase system it has to remain Fair to the overall base of players. Going by how many players actually get on the forums and complain, this is a few people. If more logged onto the forums and voice there oppinion Cryptic Would listen more. If only a few call unfairness, but the majority stay quiet just like in real life, nothing Gets done quickly. Most of the forums Posters are well aware of who each other is, that is how small of the complaint base that actually goes out there is.
The starbase ALSO is designed to be a LONG TERM goal. Not a short term Goal like the reputation system. That can be finished in 2 maybe 2 1/2 months. I know I am in tier 3 and it's barely been alive. Once the Rep systems are done everybody will be flooding the bases again then people will be complaining (again) that they never have opportunities to donate anything to the Tabs.
A long term goal, yes, but not an unreachable goal. If you have a small fleet of casual friends contributing what the can when they can, it could possibly take a month or two to do a single project (using tier 2 as an example as that is what we are working on currently). At that kind of timescale, suddenly building a starbase takes longer than the Enterprise's original (5-year) mission. Even if a larger fleet is expected to take 2 and a half years, would you really want to deny the smaller fleets access to all of the top notch gear that the larger fleets can now buy for the extra two and a half years it would take them to catch up? Given how much focus a lot of MMO players put on gear advancement, this will probably end up either destroying smaller fleets outright, or driving their players from the game as they can simply no longer compete with their better equipped counterparts from the larger fleets.
Rule #1 of a MMO - The Forum Player base is NEVER happy.
Rule #2 is based off Rule #1: If they are, Give it a day they will find something to complain about.
Rule #3 No matter what you do to improve one players life it will easily TRIBBLE off 10 others.
This is easily Verifiable (the numbers might not be fully correct.. ) to check out the results of Every Patch, Hell look at Tribble Notes. You will have people Thanking the Dev for one thing AND in the next post People ******** about What is not Fixed yet. The Devs are human, they can only do so much. They have lives Also, either playing the game, OR there Families that You Players complain about not seeing due to the Grind. Well there time is Grinded on Fixing Stuff, they need breaks to. ( I know I am a heretic for thinking like this)
Your 3 rules are spot on. An excellent example for your last paragraph is S7's Dilithium changes, Dev Blog #22 (I think it is, maybe 23 or 21), and the forum goer's reaction to that.
* blinks* This is way to mild for it to get shut down. Let's reserve the closing of threads to those with an actual necessity. People are still for the most part discussing situations to improve the ways. Only a few not worth reading have popped up.
Actually Baudl, I agree with Darius here.
This is a good opportunity to examine the fleet size/project resources grind issue from both sides of the argument.
Just, do us all a favour everyone. Keep it civil, and keep it constructive. Just bashing a person and their ideas is no help. Explain why you bash their ideas, and suggest ideas of your own.
So far, mine is the only idea I actually like with regards to starbase projects. It keeps smaller fleets happy, it keeps players in larger fleets happy, maybe even happier as they might be tempted to leave their giant megafleet where they know no-one but are only in it for the gear, and join a smaller fleet and make some friends there.
I can't help noticing that there's a lot of players who belong to giant fleets and think everybody else should do.
I'm in a small fleet. I like being in a small fleet. We have about 10 members who are heavily active and there's some variation of a Skype session almost every night. We just started our Tier 3 fabricator, so I think we're doing awfully well for our size (largely due to one member who I think is a STO-playing cyborg, but anyway). My fleet has almost no KDF presence so I ended up signing on to a mega-fleet there. They were already solidly into tier 4, and projects would have all their materials supplied literally within minutes of becoming available. It was a bit of a culture shock.
My confusion here, is why large fleets "deserve" to be so far ahead? If it's a question of effort, shouldn't individual effort be what matters? I mean, 10 guys really cranking on the starbase should be at the same level as 200 people who are really cranking on their starbase. Yeah, there's more drama in a big fleet, but drama is a BAD thing. We don't have drama. Everything runs smoothly. Shouldn't that mean we deserve to be further ahead because we are a better team??
I don't get it. Cryptic may want players to be in fleets for the social retention value, but I don't see how fleet SIZE figures into that. In the mega-fleet I casually signed up to, I don't know a single player. Nobody cares about me. I got a casual "Welcome" and not one person has spoken to me since then. Where's the social retention? Versus my micro-fleeties who will generally welcome me by name shortly after I log in, actively inquire if I'm available to run team activities, ask for opinions or help, share game stories and links...
My point is that my micro-fleet has vastly more grip on me when it comes to getting me to keep playing, and yet we're expected to run waaaay behind the curve because we haven't got 200 members. It feels like we're being punished. And the reward for our hard grinding? We get to grind MORE so that we can actually buy something from the base store. Yay. We're only into tier 3 and we're already kind of losing enthusiasm for the starbase because it just takes too freaking long.
Cue troll reply by a "You're impatient and a weakling" player who hails from a mega-fleet in 3...2...
So far, mine is the only idea I actually like with regards to starbase projects. It keeps smaller fleets happy, it keeps players in larger fleets happy, maybe even happier as they might be tempted to leave their giant megafleet where they know no-one but are only in it for the gear, and join a smaller fleet and make some friends there.
Well sir, Let me be the first to simply state the fact You are bases of liking the idea is biased do to the Fact you Created it :P Of course It's the best Idea here, It is yours :P
Personally, I think the Slow changes Cryptic is doing are fine, they are not hammering To much Drastic changes to the system that will TRIBBLE off people like me that Started the Fleet system Day One. Gradual changes to the system I can accept, but suddenly Nerfing to the system (I sware if they nerf anything more like they did the bartender mission I might have to goto Cryptics Headquarters and an Angry giant will be knocking on there door. I am Warning you TacoFangs ((I know you have nothing to do with this.. at least I think, but your named after food..)) I will Find you first.. You will be Breakfast.. the rest Will be snacks, lunch and dinner with blood wine to quench my thirst!) I will not tolerate as well.
As for the 2 year Statement, It was in one of DStahls Q&A's. Might of been on the Raptr Q&A can't remember. I know it was Posted to the STO site as well.
Proud Fleet Commander in Garfon's Renegades!
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
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F large fleets. If I wanted to be a nameless faceless number, I'd be in one already. I like(d) my small fleet, we were comrades in arms and it was fun.
I have a large fleet and I can name off about 100 of our players in it without looking. And there not numbers and I'm sure the leader you would work under would know your name. So don't make blanket statements when you don't know every fleet in the game
-"There is no such thing as an I win button!""Um, Sir. Whats this button that says (I win) for then?"
This is a good opportunity to examine the fleet size/project resources grind issue from both sides of the argument.
Just, do us all a favour everyone. Keep it civil, and keep it constructive. Just bashing a person and their ideas is no help. Explain why you bash their ideas, and suggest ideas of your own.
So far, mine is the only idea I actually like with regards to starbase projects. It keeps smaller fleets happy, it keeps players in larger fleets happy, maybe even happier as they might be tempted to leave their giant megafleet where they know no-one but are only in it for the gear, and join a smaller fleet and make some friends there.
Actually no, again this is coming from someone who pushed two small fleets. If you are 10 people building a Military Base, Would you be able to build it as quick as say 100-200 people? No, you would not. Sure you will put in more effort to get it done, but you would still not have the material gathering nor the manpower to be as efficient time wise as a larger group constructing it. This is how the Starbases are designed. The factor that you do not or can not grow your fleet, or grind as hard to get the same materials for your base does not mean you should be on the same playing field as a group that is. There would be no incentive for people to Grow there fleets if they wanted to in this case. Just the same as sadly, if your are in a smaller fleet many people will not see the incentive to be in one. But the closer personal relationship you have with your player base would be why people like the smaller fleet Size. There Stay small and family like mindset should not Cripple the Industrious fleets out there. If they are able to maintain fleet size and keep fleet politics together that things are getting accomplished, people feel they are being treated fairly and like they way things are going, they should not be put onto the same field as a small fleet.
This is not Biased against small Fleets, It's simple Common sense, More manpower = More things get done. This is a realistic Concept in life. Five people can't build a village in the same time frame Fifty people Can. Same with the Bases.
Proud Fleet Commander in Garfon's Renegades!
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
I disagree, giving away too much easy fleet marks outside of fleet mark events is a bad idea.
It kills the ques and makes it harder to earn fleet marks by actually playing the game.
Comments
I'm actually in favor of helping small fleets, but you lost all credibility with this comment,
Your basically saying you want to get rewarded for doing squat. Sorry, that's pathetic. . Besides, you already can earn fleet marks for doing nothing but doff missions by converting CPX to marks.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Currently we have Three lots of marks and now theres a daft winter event
Fleet members do not have the Time to grind for thousands and thousands of fleet marks
You know what **** you, you don't know me so don't act like you do after reading one post.
Also I've never called someone a name on forum to make a point, and I'm pathetic. Go **** yourself.
I've personally sunk over 3 million Dilithium into my fleet while my fleet mates grinded the doffs, commodities, etc... and we all did the fleet mark events. But since Season 7 launched we don't have the time to grind Fleet mark events like we used to, in addition to all the new grindy events that have been added.
I'm not asking to be rewarded for doing nothing, i'm asking to take a little grind off the top of my Grind cake,
Founder and Current CO of Gamma Strike Force
Player since December 2009
Theres Really not much of a grind added.. I don't even do the Repuation boosting events and I have romulan marks and omega marks Burrying me. I do the Two daily events on rommie space on my 16 characters and if you know again.. what your Doing.. Using.. Intelligence and efficiency it goes quick.
the Tau dewa Tour you can sit on one Planet and kill the 5 waves of enemies for 20% at a time, Goes Real quick if you are setup right. I have more Omega Marks and BNP's coming out of eSTF's then I know what to do with. Hell at the average rate of 6-12 BNP's per Elite STF's One STF can grant me 960 dil + if I get the double BNP drop.. another 2000 dilithium.. thats near 3000 dilithium for one eSTF.. considering they used to just give 1440. Do the Hard missions on Nakura and Defara, hell also do them during the FLARK events and you make enough Flarks to cover decent upgrades real quick.
I have a full time Job and a soon to be 7 year old Son. While he is at a friends house playing or in no interest to hang out with dad I play the game. I consider my self to have a decently full plate. Kid during the Day and work overnight. As well as having 2 Active subs on Eve Online that I handle, 2 subs on Perpetuum Online, SWtor (not worth subbing to but fun at times) and STo running in TWO fleets. I still Get projects going and so does the fleeties. You need either to figure out how to organize your time and how you get stuff done or quit playing one of the Least Grinding Games out there in the MMO community. Considering You can get to end game within 3-4 days of simple Playing and hitting Mirror Events, If you maximize your dilithium Earnings and spending the game works for you, not you work for it. You Can Curse at other players or me all you want. But from the Majority of us who have Ran or still run small Fleets, to the Larger Fleets, You won't find much pitty, Especially since it keeps getting EASIER for the Casual Base.
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
Your one of the last people that needs to be cursed at, you bring up a valid point and your not insulting anyone.
I don't know i'm just frustrated with the lack of dev input on the small fleet situation, a plain "We hate you and your small fleet" would at least give us some closure.
Founder and Current CO of Gamma Strike Force
Player since December 2009
The thing is tho Sir, I understand your Frustrations, Honestly I do, I have been there. But, this Grind was not Hidden. Everyone Prior to Season 6 had the ability to TEST and VOICE there Concerns On Tribble Test Server. They Dev's believe it or not are decently Active on TTS. The Reason why The Dev's are not Voicing Oppinion on this is because it is not Hatred on small Fleets, But Ignorance By small Fleet Users. They have Stated Exactly how this would be well before it's release in multing Q&As. Again, Most of us are WAY ahead of the game. Tier 1 and 2 were going to be easily achievable by Small Fleets, Tiers 3-5 Were going to be harder. It was Blatantly Stated. Hell I had maybe 5 people Pushing both of my fleets, With me being the top donator amongst both Fleets. I ran the Knights That Said Ni and the Forsaken Reavers. the Knights that said Ni had maybe 5 Actives and we were a tier 3 Starbase, the Forsaken Reavers a KDF fleet was a Tier to soon to be 3 Fleet.
I did recently Can both fleets tho, Only because it ended up being a Two man fleet. At some point It either comes to recruit more, which I was having difficulty doing, or Put down the Limping Horse. To which I did. This did not have anything to do in respect to the starbases or reputation system, but due to the fact that it is not worth keeping a 2 man fleet open. I killed them and joined a friends Fleet. I am not saying this should be the action for everyone. But it was mine.
You Small Fleet Leaders just need to Calm down and remember, It is a Game in the end. You need to remember what you signed up for. Alot of people Left Larger fleets to create there own, or started the game and wanted to run there own fleets and build there own starbases. The Devs are not hating on you. You just need to understand This things are meant to go slow in small numbers. Just like in real life, small numbers can achieve Great things, but Large numbers Have the ability to do it quicker. You are building a Starbase, A massive space Structure. This should not go quick and easy. There are other games out there which players have to grind and wait months to get there skills up to even do this. The Grind in this game is not bad at all and very simple to be honest. Just RELAX and stop thinking things will be accomplished overnight. If you think the Grind is that bad, Maybe it's time to step away from STO for a little bit and try a few other games and then come back. We all Take our break periods to try out other things, If you truly like the game, you will stick to it.
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
I'm guessing keeping that many games running, you more or less farm your son out to various friends. Does he even know what you look like? Or do you get to play at work?
Just kidding, kinda.
I think the problem isn't that it requires too many resources, it's that there are too many resources to collect. If I, as a casual player, manage to play for, say 5 hours per week, which is entirely possible, that gives enough time for maybe 300 Omega/Romulan marks, and probably less than half of that in Fleet Marks, assuming a little time is left for the likes of Doffing. Now imagine a small fleet of people, all of whom play this casually. Indeed the fleet is created to provide them with a home because a lot of the larger fleets insist on people playing for however long per week, or minimum requirements for starbase projects, and so on.
Now, if you were one of those casual players in one of those fleets, would you want to be able to both contribute to the fleet starbase and progress with your personal game goals (rep, STFs, or whatever they may be), or would you want to be forced into one type of content over another every time you logged into the game because the game is set up to penalise players like you? And now the Embassy system comes along and near enough doubles your grind?
What does it matter if smaller fleets can progress just as quickly as larger fleets? As you said yourself (I think, it may have been someone else in this thread), starbases are social areas, personal to a player's fleet and not really looked at by anyone else.
As I suggested in another thread, and as someone else suggested in this thread, why not scale the projects depending on how many people are in the fleet? Larger fleets require more resources but offer more rewards (ie Fleet credits), smaller fleets require less resources, but give smaller rewards. I would say I would apply this mostly to the limited time projects because it is a hell of a lot harder for a fleet of 5 players to come up with 400k spare dilithium than it is for a fleet of 50.
Doing it this way would be good for the players, since they can see progress being made on their fleet base, and it would be good for the fleets because it is encouraging people in the fleet to be active.
Nah, you just implied that other people "don't have lives" because they don't follow your line of thought. Don't play that uppity *life* card nonsense if you don't want to get slapped upside the head with it. And don't get pissy because you got called out for saying exactly what you said, which is that you want something for nothing. It takes 20 minutes at most to meet your daily mark requirements to keep the Romulan reputation train running, and you can earn fleet marks while doing it. In the 15 minutes it takes to keep your Omega train running, you're also earning dilithium and loot. That leaves a whole lot of time to do fleet mark events, if that's what floats your boat.
This game's so-called grind is ridiculously easy for a casual player. I can manage to push my personal goals along and contribute to my fleet at a decent clip, and I play maybe an hour a day, and I don't even have any alts like most of the community does. The Doff system is a casual players dream, and the time-gated dilithium and reputation systems make it incredibly easy to keep up with hardcore players. What more do you want?
And if you can't fill your damned quota, who the hell cares. It's not a race. Play the damn game and donate what you can when you can. My fleet recently spent a week grinding out the fleet marks to upgrade our starbase to the next tier... did we TRIBBLE and moan about it? No, we just accepted that it's going to take a little bit longer. And yeah, it's pathetic because your making a damned mountain out of a molehill. Your asking for another exploitable clicky reward system after we finally got most of them removed from the game.
If you want to fix small fleets, then come up with an innovate idea that actually addresses the problem. Maybe some sort of alliance system that allows small fleets to share starbase evolution without giving up their small fleet status. Don't ask for nonsense exploitable handouts.
I don't Farm my son out LOL. Sadly at 7 tho he has already told me I crowd him to much
The Problem is, the systems that you all started to build were Blantly put out infront of you. The problem with them Scalling the requirements to the size of the fleet is then all Fleets are leveling Fairly and Equally. A small Fleet should not be building at the same size as a Large Fleet. Because then The Fleetism (My form for STO racism) is reversed. Now you are punishing Large fleets for Succeeding. This is not fair as well.
What Cryptic did was build a system and Place it for everyone to Weigh in on prior to release. They have been making changes to the system based on player feed back. Perfect Example as I have stated was the Fking rediculous needs for the bartender (Honestly The cost for that idiot and what he gives is pure stupidity, I get better goods at the Captains Table). No matter what changes they do to the starbase system it has to remain Fair to the overall base of players. Going by how many players actually get on the forums and complain, this is a few people. If more logged onto the forums and voice there oppinion Cryptic Would listen more. If only a few call unfairness, but the majority stay quiet just like in real life, nothing Gets done quickly. Most of the forums Posters are well aware of who each other is, that is how small of the complaint base that actually goes out there is.
The starbase ALSO is designed to be a LONG TERM goal. Not a short term Goal like the reputation system. That can be finished in 2 maybe 2 1/2 months. I know I am in tier 3 and it's barely been alive. Once the Rep systems are done everybody will be flooding the bases again then people will be complaining (again) that they never have opportunities to donate anything to the Tabs.
Rule #1 of a MMO - The Forum Player base is NEVER happy.
Rule #2 is based off Rule #1: If they are, Give it a day they will find something to complain about.
Rule #3 No matter what you do to improve one players life it will easily TRIBBLE off 10 others.
This is easily Verifiable (the numbers might not be fully correct.. ) to check out the results of Every Patch, Hell look at Tribble Notes. You will have people Thanking the Dev for one thing AND in the next post People ******** about What is not Fixed yet. The Devs are human, they can only do so much. They have lives Also, either playing the game, OR there Families that You Players complain about not seeing due to the Grind. Well there time is Grinded on Fixing Stuff, they need breaks to. ( I know I am a heretic for thinking like this)
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
Smaller fleets = less resource requirements = less grinding = happier players.
Larger fleets are hording players and resources; thus, they are crushing the competition of smaller fleets.
Players have decided to join bigger fleets, for they are being lured by free provisions.
Smaller fleets cannot compete against larger fleets giving out free stuff.
Reduce ALL dilithium costs for fleet projects by 90%
Allow fleets to be "Associate" with each other and share resources
Oh and remove all numbering from fleets
make them ALL the same age and same size
no more "we are the largest fleet join us or die"
its as bad as the borg
Fleet sizes would regulated themselves then better.
people not joining the mega fleets needlessly for the T4/5 rewards and fleets not only recruiting for faceless donators.
The overall average leveling time would then probably be longer that what we see from the mega fleets now, although there should also be a slight advantage to really big fleets through a mild resource cap for projects.
But there are 2 problems with this system.
people temporarily kicking their members to get the small requirements after pooling their resources and then letting people rejoin for the cheaply bought rewards.
And fleet leaders being trigger happy with kicking temporarily inactive players because they start to become a drain on their fleet mates.
Ignoring the rest of your condescending BS, there is nothing offered by a tier 5 fleet base that is worth two years of work.
If small fleets are unworthy and undeserving, then I guess they don't want those small fleet subscription dollars.
Because someone has got it in his prissy little head that fleet size is proof of superiority, to be lorded over everyone else. :rolleyes:
* blinks* This is way to mild for it to get shut down. Let's reserve the closing of threads to those with an actual necessity. People are still for the most part discussing situations to improve the ways. Only a few not worth reading have popped up.
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
It was stated pre season 6 launch that the AVERAGE fleet size was around 20 members, again average not the large "who cares about you, you're just a number to brag about" mega fleets. We were assured that while it would take longer for smaller fleets to progress that the system was being designed for the average sized fleet, and really that is the real issue here. There was a huge amount of concern about this during the tribble testing phase as well.
Mega Fleets can pretty easily keep a constant grind going on the fleet projects, embassy projects and now their own personal rep projects and still hit tier 5 starbase WAY WAY faster than anyone else. Now with the added grind of personal systems people aren't contributing to fleet projects as much, to a mega fleet this doesn't matter, but to a Average or smaller fleet this can be disastrous.
I would be happy as hell to have 20 solid, active, friendly fleetmates who actually give a TRIBBLE about being social rather than be in a mega fleet where it's nothing about being social it's all about the grind and the bragging rights.
I would give a flying $#*^ if my fleet ever hit tier 5 for the base or anything with the embassy, EXCEPT That's where all the newest updated and upgraded gear and stuff is.
Fleets 50 and under should get a groundbase fleets 51 and over should get the starbase. Scale those based on the different size ranges for the projects and problem solved. if a fleet under 50 reaches max then they get transfered to a starbase will their current progress level but then the high project costs and visa versa.
Why should we average/smaller fleets either have to disband or spend all our ingame time trying to recruit new members who never end up staying because they want the higher tier gear faster.
this isn't about punishing average/smaller fleets or about punishing larger fleets it just about scaling for the gear really.
Ah, they grow up so fast, lol.
My scaling system reflects this. You wouldn't be punishing larger fleets because each member would be contributing less, yet getting better rewards. For example, take 2 fleets, one of 50 players, one of 5. At the moment, the fleet with 5 players is having to contribute 10x the amount of resources per person as the fleet with 50 players. The result is, those 5 players have piles and piles of unusable fleet credits, whereas the 50 players probably have slightly too few fleet credits for what they want (hence the reason for the 'bonus' missions in the fleet project list, specifically designed to help a larger fleet generate fleet credits while giving a worthless boost to your starbase xp).
With a scaling system, I'm not asking for an exact scale or anything. Maybe a 20% scale, so the smaller fleet is still having to contribute more per person (approximately double), yet they are still progressing at a reasonable pace, where the larger fleets would still contribute the same resources as they always have, yet get a greater return on fleet credits. This will still funnel most players into large fleets, which is what Cryptic seem to want, but will still leave smaller fleets as a viable option for those who don't want to join a large fleet.
A long term goal, yes, but not an unreachable goal. If you have a small fleet of casual friends contributing what the can when they can, it could possibly take a month or two to do a single project (using tier 2 as an example as that is what we are working on currently). At that kind of timescale, suddenly building a starbase takes longer than the Enterprise's original (5-year) mission. Even if a larger fleet is expected to take 2 and a half years, would you really want to deny the smaller fleets access to all of the top notch gear that the larger fleets can now buy for the extra two and a half years it would take them to catch up? Given how much focus a lot of MMO players put on gear advancement, this will probably end up either destroying smaller fleets outright, or driving their players from the game as they can simply no longer compete with their better equipped counterparts from the larger fleets.
Your 3 rules are spot on. An excellent example for your last paragraph is S7's Dilithium changes, Dev Blog #22 (I think it is, maybe 23 or 21), and the forum goer's reaction to that.
Actually Baudl, I agree with Darius here.
This is a good opportunity to examine the fleet size/project resources grind issue from both sides of the argument.
Just, do us all a favour everyone. Keep it civil, and keep it constructive. Just bashing a person and their ideas is no help. Explain why you bash their ideas, and suggest ideas of your own.
So far, mine is the only idea I actually like with regards to starbase projects. It keeps smaller fleets happy, it keeps players in larger fleets happy, maybe even happier as they might be tempted to leave their giant megafleet where they know no-one but are only in it for the gear, and join a smaller fleet and make some friends there.
I'm in a small fleet. I like being in a small fleet. We have about 10 members who are heavily active and there's some variation of a Skype session almost every night. We just started our Tier 3 fabricator, so I think we're doing awfully well for our size (largely due to one member who I think is a STO-playing cyborg, but anyway). My fleet has almost no KDF presence so I ended up signing on to a mega-fleet there. They were already solidly into tier 4, and projects would have all their materials supplied literally within minutes of becoming available. It was a bit of a culture shock.
My confusion here, is why large fleets "deserve" to be so far ahead? If it's a question of effort, shouldn't individual effort be what matters? I mean, 10 guys really cranking on the starbase should be at the same level as 200 people who are really cranking on their starbase. Yeah, there's more drama in a big fleet, but drama is a BAD thing. We don't have drama. Everything runs smoothly. Shouldn't that mean we deserve to be further ahead because we are a better team??
I don't get it. Cryptic may want players to be in fleets for the social retention value, but I don't see how fleet SIZE figures into that. In the mega-fleet I casually signed up to, I don't know a single player. Nobody cares about me. I got a casual "Welcome" and not one person has spoken to me since then. Where's the social retention? Versus my micro-fleeties who will generally welcome me by name shortly after I log in, actively inquire if I'm available to run team activities, ask for opinions or help, share game stories and links...
My point is that my micro-fleet has vastly more grip on me when it comes to getting me to keep playing, and yet we're expected to run waaaay behind the curve because we haven't got 200 members. It feels like we're being punished. And the reward for our hard grinding? We get to grind MORE so that we can actually buy something from the base store. Yay. We're only into tier 3 and we're already kind of losing enthusiasm for the starbase because it just takes too freaking long.
Cue troll reply by a "You're impatient and a weakling" player who hails from a mega-fleet in 3...2...
Until they start selling subscriptions to fleets instead of individuals, the answer to that is an unequivocal YES.
Indeed.
Well sir, Let me be the first to simply state the fact You are bases of liking the idea is biased do to the Fact you Created it :P Of course It's the best Idea here, It is yours :P
Personally, I think the Slow changes Cryptic is doing are fine, they are not hammering To much Drastic changes to the system that will TRIBBLE off people like me that Started the Fleet system Day One. Gradual changes to the system I can accept, but suddenly Nerfing to the system (I sware if they nerf anything more like they did the bartender mission I might have to goto Cryptics Headquarters and an Angry giant will be knocking on there door. I am Warning you TacoFangs ((I know you have nothing to do with this.. at least I think, but your named after food..)) I will Find you first.. You will be Breakfast.. the rest Will be snacks, lunch and dinner with blood wine to quench my thirst!) I will not tolerate as well.
As for the 2 year Statement, It was in one of DStahls Q&A's. Might of been on the Raptr Q&A can't remember. I know it was Posted to the STO site as well.
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
I said nothing about 'deserve' and implied no-one was stupid. I merely asked people to keep things civil and constructive.
I have a large fleet and I can name off about 100 of our players in it without looking. And there not numbers and I'm sure the leader you would work under would know your name. So don't make blanket statements when you don't know every fleet in the game
Actually no, again this is coming from someone who pushed two small fleets. If you are 10 people building a Military Base, Would you be able to build it as quick as say 100-200 people? No, you would not. Sure you will put in more effort to get it done, but you would still not have the material gathering nor the manpower to be as efficient time wise as a larger group constructing it. This is how the Starbases are designed. The factor that you do not or can not grow your fleet, or grind as hard to get the same materials for your base does not mean you should be on the same playing field as a group that is. There would be no incentive for people to Grow there fleets if they wanted to in this case. Just the same as sadly, if your are in a smaller fleet many people will not see the incentive to be in one. But the closer personal relationship you have with your player base would be why people like the smaller fleet Size. There Stay small and family like mindset should not Cripple the Industrious fleets out there. If they are able to maintain fleet size and keep fleet politics together that things are getting accomplished, people feel they are being treated fairly and like they way things are going, they should not be put onto the same field as a small fleet.
This is not Biased against small Fleets, It's simple Common sense, More manpower = More things get done. This is a realistic Concept in life. Five people can't build a village in the same time frame Fifty people Can. Same with the Bases.
Proud Leader of the Massive Chaos Group
Proud Listener of Subspace-Radio.net The Voice of Star Trek Online.
[SIGPIC]http://massivechaos.enjin.com/[/SIGPIC]
It kills the ques and makes it harder to earn fleet marks by actually playing the game.