Brandon asked me for some more information, so here it is.
We have listened to the feedback of the Foundry author community, and have taken steps to encourage our players to play some of the missions created by their fellow players. To that end, we have made some changes to the Investigate Officer Reports daily mission:
Fast "clickie" missions are not eligible for daily because they discourage exploring the community authored stories.
Longer, well-crafted missions have always granted XP and EC at the end, and will continue to do so. Missions with no combat will also still grant diplomacy points.
These longer, well-crafted missions are the ones that will be eligible for the Foundry Daily.
Fast, Kill-One-Guy or Click-One-Console missions will not give credit for the daily.
Non-combat missions are still eligible for the daily.
A nice side effect of this will be to make the Hot filter more useful, as it will no longer be so dense with short "clickie" missions.
Hope this clarifies things for all of you. And now I have to get back into my hidey-hole, preparing Season 7 patch notes and builds and stuff.
It does to some extent, but what defines the difference? Is it a time calculated formula or... :P
Just out of interest really, also, do the rewards scale?
Foundry Enthusiast
Machinima Person
Did some things back in the day
Brandon asked me for some more information, so here it is.
We have listened to the feedback of the Foundry author community, and have taken steps to encourage our players to play some of the missions created by their fellow players. To that end, we have made some changes to the Investigate Officer Reports daily mission:
Fast "clickie" missions are not eligible for daily because they discourage exploring the community authored stories.
Longer, well-crafted missions have always granted XP and EC at the end, and will continue to do so. Missions with no combat will also still grant diplomacy points.
These longer, well-crafted missions are the ones that will be eligible for the Foundry Daily.
Fast, Kill-One-Guy or Click-One-Console missions will not give credit for the daily.
Non-combat missions are still eligible for the daily.
A nice side effect of this will be to make the Hot filter more useful, as it will no longer be so dense with short "clickie" missions.
Hope this clarifies things for all of you. And now I have to get back into my hidey-hole, preparing Season 7 patch notes and builds and stuff.
Thanks for the details. So here is my question: there are certain missions that are not exploits, but are designed to be pretty quick specifically for completing the daily without exploiting. For example, killing a couple of enemy groups, but they have an actual plot. Would these types of missions qualify?
Thanks for the details. So here is my question: there are certain missions that are not exploits, but are designed to be pretty quick specifically for completing the daily without exploiting. For example, killing a couple of enemy groups, but they have an actual plot. Would these types of missions qualify?
Zero .... Lets get down to specifics ... Do the Grand Nagus dailies make the pass or not work with this new system?
They are a more than a one shot kill and have a little bit more behind them and do NOT exploit the system.
As a side note ... Those that were clicking before will still not play the Foundry. Those that did play the Foundry (like me once a week) will continue to do so.
Longer, well-crafted missions have always granted XP and EC at the end, and will continue to do so. Missions with no combat will also still grant diplomacy points.
These longer, well-crafted missions are the ones that will be eligible for the Foundry Daily.
The original patch note said "Now, only projects that normally reward XP and EC will count towards completion."
So all this did is restate what was already said. It does nothing to help us understand the meaning of the original statement. The only new vague tidbit is the word 'longer', so there appears to be a time based component to this of some type.
If a foundry author wants to craft a mission that can be used for a daily, how do they know they have satisfied this 'magic' formula? Can this be quickly determined as soon as the mission is published?
Path to 2409: Martok made the definitive statement of the Klingon Empire's view of the Romulan Star Empire in 2388. "
The Klingons will offer no treaty, no aid, and no hand that is not holding a blade"
Zero .... Lets get down to specifics ... Do the Grand Nagus dailies make the pass or not work with this new system?
They are a more than a one shot kill and have a little bit more behind them and do NOT exploit the system.
Seriously, an answer to this before Tuesday would be nice. Because if they don't, I've gotta find a new source of dilithium and fleet marks that I can actually fit into my day.
The opinions expressed in my posts are not necessarily those of my employer or Subspace Radio.
Host of the Borg Boombox, 0300 GMT on Fridays on Subspace Radio
Well, it looks like my latest version of Gates of Sto'vo'kor mission which was designed as an experimental mission and it appears that now it won't be eligible for rewards. It has a completely custom map with dozens of interactable objects and emotes. However, the mission has no objectives, no combat, and no story. It's is merely a place for people to bring their friends to hang out in and experience the environment and tell their own stories without the trolling that many social zones have become known for. This makes me sad.
Seriously, an answer to this before Tuesday would be nice. Because if they don't, I've gotta find a new source of dilithium and fleet marks that I can actually fit into my day.
Fear not. I'm sure that anyone who had made missions like this will only have to add a few more enemies to make them qualify. Whatever the minimum # is will be common knowledge soon enough.
Brandon asked me for some more information, so here it is.
We have listened to the feedback of the Foundry author community, and have taken steps to encourage our players to play some of the missions created by their fellow players. To that end, we have made some changes to the Investigate Officer Reports daily mission:
Fast "clickie" missions are not eligible for daily because they discourage exploring the community authored stories.
Longer, well-crafted missions have always granted XP and EC at the end, and will continue to do so. Missions with no combat will also still grant diplomacy points.
These longer, well-crafted missions are the ones that will be eligible for the Foundry Daily.
Fast, Kill-One-Guy or Click-One-Console missions will not give credit for the daily.
Non-combat missions are still eligible for the daily.
A nice side effect of this will be to make the Hot filter more useful, as it will no longer be so dense with short "clickie" missions.
Hope this clarifies things for all of you. And now I have to get back into my hidey-hole, preparing Season 7 patch notes and builds and stuff.
This justification and the idea behind this is superb, but I think we're all still confused on the mechanics of it. I get that you may not want to reveal the mechanics of it.
But hopefully it's based on a timer or something and not a dev that has to individually tag clickers as clickers.
But I still don't understand:
Longer, well-crafted missions have always granted XP and EC at the end, and will continue to do so.
I've played lots of Foundry, and I can't, for the life of me, recall getting ECs for it. I assumed that I was getting some XP while playing the mission, but it was so small that it's not noticeable.
Can someone clarify here? How much ECs are foundry missions secretly giving me when playing them?
We have listened to the feedback of the Foundry author community, and have taken steps to encourage our players to play some of the missions created by their fellow players.
Pure B.S. This was 100% to kill a way of circumventing the obnoxious fleet base grind. I don't know who you people think you're fooling with statements like that.
You do realize that if they give out the exact criteria for what makes a mission count for the daily, you'll just have a bunch of people use that to make the shortest possible missions that still count for the daily and put those up?
Brandon asked me for some more information, so here it is.
We have listened to the feedback of the Foundry author community, and have taken steps to encourage our players to play some of the missions created by their fellow players. To that end, we have made some changes to the Investigate Officer Reports daily mission:
Fast "clickie" missions are not eligible for daily because they discourage exploring the community authored stories.
Longer, well-crafted missions have always granted XP and EC at the end, and will continue to do so. Missions with no combat will also still grant diplomacy points.
These longer, well-crafted missions are the ones that will be eligible for the Foundry Daily.
Fast, Kill-One-Guy or Click-One-Console missions will not give credit for the daily.
Non-combat missions are still eligible for the daily.
A nice side effect of this will be to make the Hot filter more useful, as it will no longer be so dense with short "clickie" missions.
Hope this clarifies things for all of you. And now I have to get back into my hidey-hole, preparing Season 7 patch notes and builds and stuff.
Well congrats... you've just given me my final reason to stop playing this game. With all the dilithium needed in Season 7, and the absurd cost of fleet projects for smaller fleets, I dont see any reason to keep playing.
You guys havent realized that if a person doesn't want to play a "long, well-crafted" foundry mission, they aren't going to. No amount of prodding by the devs is going to make them.
So instead what you've done is neutered dilithium and fleet mark acquisition, for players who get limited time to play.
You do realize that if they give out the exact criteria for what makes a mission count for the daily, you'll just have a bunch of people use that to make the shortest possible missions that still count for the daily and put those up?
Pure B.S. This was 100% to kill a way of circumventing the obnoxious fleet base grind. I don't know who you people think you're fooling with statements like that.
I with him, Cryptic is removing all stuff we are getting for free (our time they don't care for) and put more grind in place for it. Now they will remover the dilitium and fleet-marks and don't say they are still there.
Nice way to kill this game, fleet-base, Ambasady will be killed-off by this, whats left the Personal system.
When we done with that we will be done with the game.
You was already making the game into a rediculous grind fest and you found a way to make it even worse. If you have all the data you know that the people that do the 1 click missions don't do lots of foundry missions, you now think they will play those missions when it will take 1 hour ???
Look at your data, how many people still does B'tran we can get 2880 dil there for 20 minutes play and it is always empty.
1) Zen will cost about 100 dil each in a month or so.
2) Well crafted foundry missions will not see any significant change in number of players who partake in them. However with the re-defining of what a well crafted foundry mission is (ie fastest way to earn the daily) then it might.
3) At giant thread of small fleet grievances in general discussion by the end of the month.
Well congrats... you've just given me my final reason to stop playing this game. With all the dilithium needed in Season 7, and the absurd cost of fleet projects for smaller fleets, I dont see any reason to keep playing.
You guys havent realized that if a person doesn't want to play a "long, well-crafted" foundry mission, they aren't going to. No amount of prodding by the devs is going to make them.
So instead what you've done is neutered dilithium and fleet mark acquisition, for players who get limited time to play.
Come December 12th, when my sub is up... Im out.
You realize people will do that anyway.
As I said in another thread, 1440 dil for watering the admiral's prized bush at SFA was not the original intention of this particular daily mission. If that's truly what's been keeping you in-game this whole time, then quite frankly, you've been walking that line for a while.
I've played lots of Foundry, and I can't, for the life of me, recall getting ECs for it. I assumed that I was getting some XP while playing the mission, but it was so small that it's not noticeable.
Can someone clarify here? How much ECs are foundry missions secretly giving me when playing them?
That's what I want to know. I don't recall ever getting Diplomacy XP for non-combat missions, either. Is this a change for S7?
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
You do realize that if they give out the exact criteria for what makes a mission count for the daily, you'll just have a bunch of people use that to make the shortest possible missions that still count for the daily and put those up?
People are going to try to figure that out as soon as possible, anyways. As soon as they do, the new type of min. criteria missions will spread like wildfire, unless there is a reliable mechanic to prevent that.
So, maybe asking for the specifics is unreasonable, but asking for something specific that reassures us that it will actually work might help.
That foundry daily was probably the best source of dilithium and fleet marks for small fleets that change will totally kill small fleet base progression together with the absurd dilithium requirements that comes with s7.
I can barely be bothered to play one "well crafted foundry mission" all few weeks.. i can't see me playing two a day for all of my alts.. so yea, way to go to kill one of the few casual/small fleet friendly dailies in the game for good.
As I said in another thread, 1440 dil for watering the admiral's prized bush at SFA was not the original intention of this particular daily mission. If that's truly what's been keeping you in-game this whole time, then quite frankly, you've been walking that line for a while.
No... youre right... it wasnt the devs intention for that... but if they were too stupid to see it coming when they introduced the mission then it isnt exactly my fault.
Well, it looks like my latest version of Gates of Sto'vo'kor mission which was designed as an experimental mission and it appears that now it won't be eligible for rewards. It has a completely custom map with dozens of interactable objects and emotes. However, the mission has no objectives, no combat, and no story. It's is merely a place for people to bring their friends to hang out in and experience the environment and tell their own stories without the trolling that many social zones have become known for. This makes me sad.
The thing is, was that ever really a mission? or just a foundry created role playing zone? Not saying there's anything wrong with that, but is that any more valid for XP/Dil than hanging out on ESD or the Captain's table? [/Devils Advocate]
(Seperate note, fan of the work)
Pure B.S. This was 100% to kill a way of circumventing the obnoxious fleet base grind. I don't know who you people think you're fooling with statements like that.
No, sadly you're mistaken on that, there's actually been quite a bit of demand for this in the past. It won't be popular with all (I have very mixed feelings on it) but it does bring that foundry daily back to what it was originally meant to be.
No... youre right... it wasnt the devs intention for that... but if they were too stupid to see it coming when they introduced the mission then it isnt exactly my fault.
So you knowingly took advantage of a non-intended function of the game in order to benefit yourself, and now that that benefit is being removed, you're throwing in the towel and taking your baseball home? Come on now.
I get that it's frustrating that some additional effort needs to be exerted now that wasn't otherwise the case, but it's like being upset that an ATM stops spitting out money.
So you knowingly took advantage of a non-intended function of the game in order to benefit yourself, and now that that benefit is being removed, you're throwing in the towel and taking your baseball home? Come on now.
I get that it's frustrating that some additional effort needs to be exerted now that wasn't otherwise the case, but it's like being upset that an ATM stops spitting out money.
If thats they way you want to look at it then yes... but this isnt the sole reason... this has been a long time coming. Fleet project gouging for small fleets, the personal reputation system not grandfather those who worked hard for MkXII STF sets. This is just the last straw.
Its not so much the effort... the the fact that I dont have the time to run longer missions every day... so the mission let me get a small amount of dilithium each day... and now I'll only get less dilithium from playing STFs on the weekends (because oh yeah... they reduced the rewards for those too..)
So Im done.
If the devs didnt want this they should have seen it coming and fixed it before the daily went live... not months later when its sure to anger people.
It won't be popular with all (I have very mixed feelings on it) but it does bring that foundry daily back to what it was originally meant to be.
That really is the bottom line. If the grinders feel that they need more sources of dilithium and that there is something wrong with the levels of what is needed for these various projects... it's an entirely different issue.
But this mission is designed to reward players for playing actual Foundry missions, not checking flight departures at ESD. The folks who play it as intended should be rewards. They have to pay for the candy bar. It's not fair for them to pay, while everyone else is robbing the place for the prize.
So good job Cryptic, if it works.
Now, ahem...
Perhaps (if it works) the prize could be increased so that it matches the 2-3 hours of time it takes to play 3 real foundry missions?
Comments
There's going to be a lot of complaining about the clickie's being removed but in the end it's the right decision.
Foundry Mission Database
Check out my Foundry missions:
Standalone - The Great Escape - The Galaxy's Fair - Purity I: Of Denial - Return to Oblivion
Untitled Series - Duritanium Man - The Improbable Bulk - Commander Rihan
It does to some extent, but what defines the difference? Is it a time calculated formula or... :P
Just out of interest really, also, do the rewards scale?
Machinima Person
Did some things back in the day
Now a Games Developer and Researcher
Thanks for the details. So here is my question: there are certain missions that are not exploits, but are designed to be pretty quick specifically for completing the daily without exploiting. For example, killing a couple of enemy groups, but they have an actual plot. Would these types of missions qualify?
Zero .... Lets get down to specifics ... Do the Grand Nagus dailies make the pass or not work with this new system?
They are a more than a one shot kill and have a little bit more behind them and do NOT exploit the system.
As a side note ... Those that were clicking before will still not play the Foundry. Those that did play the Foundry (like me once a week) will continue to do so.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
And THAT is why people don't play true Foundry missions for the dailies and why it needs to be tiered with each one getting something.
And I think the latter is what Neverwinter is supposed to do ... correct?
So nothing is yet being solved with this other than the hole closed.
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
The original patch note said "Now, only projects that normally reward XP and EC will count towards completion."
So all this did is restate what was already said. It does nothing to help us understand the meaning of the original statement. The only new vague tidbit is the word 'longer', so there appears to be a time based component to this of some type.
If a foundry author wants to craft a mission that can be used for a daily, how do they know they have satisfied this 'magic' formula? Can this be quickly determined as soon as the mission is published?
Path to 2409: Martok made the definitive statement of the Klingon Empire's view of the Romulan Star Empire in 2388. "
The Klingons will offer no treaty, no aid, and no hand that is not holding a blade"
Seriously, an answer to this before Tuesday would be nice. Because if they don't, I've gotta find a new source of dilithium and fleet marks that I can actually fit into my day.
Host of the Borg Boombox, 0300 GMT on Fridays on Subspace Radio
Fear not. I'm sure that anyone who had made missions like this will only have to add a few more enemies to make them qualify. Whatever the minimum # is will be common knowledge soon enough.
Ya specifics would be nice
Foundry Mission Database
Check out my Foundry missions:
Standalone - The Great Escape - The Galaxy's Fair - Purity I: Of Denial - Return to Oblivion
Untitled Series - Duritanium Man - The Improbable Bulk - Commander Rihan
Machinima Person
Did some things back in the day
Now a Games Developer and Researcher
This justification and the idea behind this is superb, but I think we're all still confused on the mechanics of it. I get that you may not want to reveal the mechanics of it.
But hopefully it's based on a timer or something and not a dev that has to individually tag clickers as clickers.
But I still don't understand:
I've played lots of Foundry, and I can't, for the life of me, recall getting ECs for it. I assumed that I was getting some XP while playing the mission, but it was so small that it's not noticeable.
Can someone clarify here? How much ECs are foundry missions secretly giving me when playing them?
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Could this mean drops that can be sold for EC? ... I know when I ran the Nagus Dailies earlier I get gear drops with those.
Don't know beyond that thought ...
U.S.S. Maelstrom, NCC-71417 (Constitution III-class/flagship) --- Fleet Admiral Hauk' --|-- Dahar Master Hauk --- I.K.S. qu'In 'an bortaS (D7-class / flagship)
Pure B.S. This was 100% to kill a way of circumventing the obnoxious fleet base grind. I don't know who you people think you're fooling with statements like that.
She said that foundry missions have always given ECs "at the end" of the mission. Since when? Have I just never noticed?
It's also the first time I've heard of non-combat missions granting Diplomacy XP. How much does it grant?
Well congrats... you've just given me my final reason to stop playing this game. With all the dilithium needed in Season 7, and the absurd cost of fleet projects for smaller fleets, I dont see any reason to keep playing.
You guys havent realized that if a person doesn't want to play a "long, well-crafted" foundry mission, they aren't going to. No amount of prodding by the devs is going to make them.
So instead what you've done is neutered dilithium and fleet mark acquisition, for players who get limited time to play.
Come December 12th, when my sub is up... Im out.
You realize people will do that anyway.
I with him, Cryptic is removing all stuff we are getting for free (our time they don't care for) and put more grind in place for it. Now they will remover the dilitium and fleet-marks and don't say they are still there.
Nice way to kill this game, fleet-base, Ambasady will be killed-off by this, whats left the Personal system.
When we done with that we will be done with the game.
You was already making the game into a rediculous grind fest and you found a way to make it even worse. If you have all the data you know that the people that do the 1 click missions don't do lots of foundry missions, you now think they will play those missions when it will take 1 hour ???
Look at your data, how many people still does B'tran we can get 2880 dil there for 20 minutes play and it is always empty.
1) Zen will cost about 100 dil each in a month or so.
2) Well crafted foundry missions will not see any significant change in number of players who partake in them. However with the re-defining of what a well crafted foundry mission is (ie fastest way to earn the daily) then it might.
3) At giant thread of small fleet grievances in general discussion by the end of the month.
As I said in another thread, 1440 dil for watering the admiral's prized bush at SFA was not the original intention of this particular daily mission. If that's truly what's been keeping you in-game this whole time, then quite frankly, you've been walking that line for a while.
That's what I want to know. I don't recall ever getting Diplomacy XP for non-combat missions, either. Is this a change for S7?
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
People are going to try to figure that out as soon as possible, anyways. As soon as they do, the new type of min. criteria missions will spread like wildfire, unless there is a reliable mechanic to prevent that.
So, maybe asking for the specifics is unreasonable, but asking for something specific that reassures us that it will actually work might help.
I can barely be bothered to play one "well crafted foundry mission" all few weeks.. i can't see me playing two a day for all of my alts.. so yea, way to go to kill one of the few casual/small fleet friendly dailies in the game for good.
No... youre right... it wasnt the devs intention for that... but if they were too stupid to see it coming when they introduced the mission then it isnt exactly my fault.
The thing is, was that ever really a mission? or just a foundry created role playing zone? Not saying there's anything wrong with that, but is that any more valid for XP/Dil than hanging out on ESD or the Captain's table? [/Devils Advocate]
(Seperate note, fan of the work)
No, sadly you're mistaken on that, there's actually been quite a bit of demand for this in the past. It won't be popular with all (I have very mixed feelings on it) but it does bring that foundry daily back to what it was originally meant to be.
So you knowingly took advantage of a non-intended function of the game in order to benefit yourself, and now that that benefit is being removed, you're throwing in the towel and taking your baseball home? Come on now.
I get that it's frustrating that some additional effort needs to be exerted now that wasn't otherwise the case, but it's like being upset that an ATM stops spitting out money.
If thats they way you want to look at it then yes... but this isnt the sole reason... this has been a long time coming. Fleet project gouging for small fleets, the personal reputation system not grandfather those who worked hard for MkXII STF sets. This is just the last straw.
Its not so much the effort... the the fact that I dont have the time to run longer missions every day... so the mission let me get a small amount of dilithium each day... and now I'll only get less dilithium from playing STFs on the weekends (because oh yeah... they reduced the rewards for those too..)
So Im done.
If the devs didnt want this they should have seen it coming and fixed it before the daily went live... not months later when its sure to anger people.
That really is the bottom line. If the grinders feel that they need more sources of dilithium and that there is something wrong with the levels of what is needed for these various projects... it's an entirely different issue.
But this mission is designed to reward players for playing actual Foundry missions, not checking flight departures at ESD. The folks who play it as intended should be rewards. They have to pay for the candy bar. It's not fair for them to pay, while everyone else is robbing the place for the prize.
So good job Cryptic, if it works.
Now, ahem...
Perhaps (if it works) the prize could be increased so that it matches the 2-3 hours of time it takes to play 3 real foundry missions?