I read the wall of text and everything in there confirms that many many people are abusing the officer daily report to farm massive amounts of dilthium.
I keep hearing over and over in your post fleets will collapse if Starbase production stops. But fleets existed long before Starbases. If a fleet exists just for the starbase then my post from just before Starbases were launched has come true:
On and on and on and on of similar posts - with the same reaction from posters - no dilth will always be easy to get - no starbases won't have more drama - no you are imagining things Cryptic would never do that!
The poster who wrote this post I am quoting has 40+ alts(stark2K) so stark how long would it take you in season 7 to do just the 1440 mission on all those alts with the new system where you don't log out? - My calculation if each one is sitting at the clicker location - 2 min max - so that gives you almost 60,000 dilth for less than 1 1/2 hours - do you think that is an exploit?
How long would it take you to do the explore mission for 1440 - per alt 12 min? or 7 hours?
Seems like the console clicker is still an exploit to me. If Cryptic wants to leave it in place - fine i will make full use of it myself. The question I have asked is will they get rid of if - a question i have not had answered yet.
It's a happy exploit that Cryptic should consider integrating into their design philosophy by transferring the rewards to Officer of the Watch, which under-rewards at present.
Just because dilithium is a "time currency" doesn't mean that all time is equal. In general, a good design for this kind of thing is to have the first few minutes be worth more and the value of player time to dwindle the more they play.
On this election day, I think we can all agree that one of the sad truths about life is the fact that people are always overly eager to tell other people how to live, how to spend their time, and how to spend their money.
Dilithium that is easy to get for one person via time or money may not be easy to get for another. We need to respect all players commitments to the game regardless of whether they are big or small.
I must tip my hat and give a nod to Levi3. I read his backposts and he made some tough calls before they happened. Im not a fan of second guessing after the fact so I appreciate his words. I did not think there would be as much drama with fleets as there has been. But it seems that every fleet is trying to purge the great many inactive players that have quit playing, and recruit active players that will contribute to projects. Several once great fleets with hundreds of quality players have died, split, ended, or been left for dead. And there is the very real issue in virtually every fleet about who should get to buy what from the stores and who should not.
The happy exploit comment is succinct. It is a happy exploit. Everyone is happy except the few frumpy people that dont want others to have more dilithium than they do. It costs 300,000 dili to buy a yellow EVA suit with zero game play value except for costuming and/or fashion shows. It would take a person with 10 alts over 3 weeks of logging on and doing the clicker mission with every alt to earn this item. And its useless except for the fact that it looks good.
One of my big pet peeves in the game is that respecs should be free. If people do not enjoy their characters then they just quit playing them. Cryptic changes and nerfs skills so often that one good build one week turns into a horrid build the next through no fault of the player. If people are doing clicker missions to buy zen and get respec tokens then its good for the game. Removing dilithium from the game makes the process harder for players that dont like their toons, dont want to play them, and need to respec.
The clicker missions are popular. People do them. People like them. Removing them would be like taking a favorite roller coaster out of a theme park. Cryptic does not need to be pulling things from the game that players like. They cant afford it.
I think Cryptic desperately wants to reduce the amount of dilithium in the game. I think they will "eventually" remove this exploit and try to replace it with something that will be far less popular. A few will come to these boards and cheer them on and many will leave and fleets will do more purges.
You look at the trend. Cryptic stole millions of dilithium from players on conversion. They are doing another conversion and I doubt unspent salvage will hold the same value. Cryptic has raised the price of the contraband turn in mission, lowered the value of sold duty officers, lowered payouts of dilithium missions, and bent over backwards to reduce dilithium in the game. At the start of season 6, dilithium was selling for 400ish on the exchange and now its down to 150. Some of this was converting from Cryptic points to Zen but some of it was forced downward via supply and demand. Players that choose to do so may in the future look at a $10 zen card at Wal-Mart and decide if they are only getting 50000 dilithium from the deal that its not worth it. Right now they can get 150,000 for a bit of an impact purchase.
Again, reduced dilithium, reduces the value of zen in the game. Cryptic is destroying the value of the only product they have left to sell. They would be defacing their own merchandise.
Lock box sales are drying up. Duty officer packs seem to be less sexy and Im not seeing huge numbers of people winning Jem ships on the flash messages like I did the first two promotions. Theyve lost 2 million a month in paid revenues from subscribers. Zen / dilithium conversion is huge to them. Making people spend more for less product would not make anybody happy. It might have a short term effect of raising demand for product but long term its just a horrifically bad idea. I cant think of many enterprises in the history of the world that improved their prospects by raising taxes, revenue costs, or prices.
Indeed it is a happy exploit and it should be left alone. This thread is 14 pages long and not one person has come here and said if you remove this the game would be more fun for me. Even the people who think it should be removed admit using it happily as long as its around.
Are we going to end up with a game that has fun and fair play? The Trekkies are watching the Gamers find other games. This is Trek and die hard trekkies play here because of lack of options. But dang it cant we at least pretend that we could someday have a fun game instead of more and more grind based content to keep people occupied.
It seems like customers dont care if Cryptic makes money and stays in business. And Cryptic doesnt care if customers enjoy their game. If anybody is exploiting anything, its Cryptic taking money players invest in this game and spending it on NWN which nobody really wants. I love Trek so very much and am so burned out about a wonderful uplifting concept of goodness and truth in the future turning into a churn and burn player greed fest that I doubt I will ever put any money into a future PWE or Cryptic game. I will play NWN because I feel I invested enough in Cryptic that I paid for it. But Cryptic will not see much if any future revenues from me on that product. Im not giving them another chance till they fix STO and make it fun.
Clickers are happy exploits. Game needs more happiness, and fun. Leave it alone.
Seems like the console clicker is still an exploit to me. If Cryptic wants to leave it in place - fine i will make full use of it myself. The question I have asked is will they get rid of if - a question i have not had answered yet.
Then I give a question back:
Can anyone here REALLY answer that?
I truly mean that. I don't believe anyone could answer that question, since we don't know. We can give opinions on why or why not, but not really answer it.
Another thought I have is that...if Cryptic didn't want people doing 'console clicker' missions, they wouldn't have those as normal dailies in the first place. Like the Academy dailies, Exploration missions (most of which are little more than console clicking, scanning anomalies, or killing ships), the Officer of the Watch, and so on.
My point is that people are used to those kinds of missions, in turn, they do a console clicker for the foundry daily, and there you go, free dil and Fleet marks. If it's removed, it'd be more a hurt than a help. In my thread the other day, I felt like all the huge amounts of dil earned was skewing how Cryptic adjusted prices on things. With them removing dil requirements to level rep with, at least that means dil will be still mostly focused on:
1. Buying equipment (be it from the Dil-store, Starbase, or Rep system)
2. Making it into Zen
3. Dropping it into a Starbase.
I remain empathetic to the concerns of my community, but do me a favor and lay off the god damn name calling and petty remarks. It will get you nowhere.
I must admit, respect points to Trendy for laying down the law like that.
I must tip my hat and give a nod to Levi3. I read his backposts and he made some tough calls before they happened. Im not a fan of second guessing after the fact so I appreciate his words. I did not think there would be as much drama with fleets as there has been. But it seems that every fleet is trying to purge the great many inactive players that have quit playing, and recruit active players that will contribute to projects. Several once great fleets with hundreds of quality players have died, split, ended, or been left for dead. And there is the very real issue in virtually every fleet about who should get to buy what from the stores and who should not.
You have lots to say and that is generally good - for posts on a forum "wall-o-text" as they call generally causes people to skip over it.
Although i think this is a exploit - I use it too - on many alts - so if I am truely against it I am shooting myself in the foot for a lot of dilth every day. I believe that i have said that I think they should leave it. But I kind of swing back and forth - I am a very Bi-poloar poster - if you check my back post i go from Rah rah- pro cryptic to - F-this anti Cryptic all the time.
One thing though has never changed: I LOVE this GAME - I am additcted to this game - and am behind anything that Cryptic does that is 100% necessary to keep the game going. (even though my posts flip back and forth - Brandon and the others know this and propbaly why they put up with a lot of my TRIBBLE.)
That said i was hoping to get an official answer on whether ot not the neverwinter system is coming.
Nothing yet means 2 things:
1)they don't care too much about the issue yet,
or
2) they plan to introduce it after season 7 but don't want to have to many shocks to the system yet(this is my belief)
And with that this will be my last post in this thread. it has more than run it's course.
Cryptic already HAS the new system that would eliminate this - if you read the OP and the link - they are using on Neverwinter - it's a brand new system that is time based - the question I am asking is will it be moved to STO as well?
The arguement tha this console clicker has been around for X amount of time and they have done nothing is MUTE:
The Neverwinter system that eliminates this is brand new and has only been used in Beta - so it's not like they had the same solution before that they have now.
So instead of quickly clicking to get the reward the neverwinter system lets you log in, find a safe place to park so you can raid the fridge, the complete to get a reward ?
Whats the difference other than wasting my time ? OMG- Zenmaggedon
So instead of quickly clicking to get the reward the neverwinter system lets you log in, find a safe place to park so you can raid the fridge, the complete to get a reward ?
Whats the difference other than wasting my time ? OMG- Zenmaggedon
Nope. NW's reward will be based on average completion time, not your own personal time. So there is nothing you can personally do to get a better reward.
Nope. NW's reward will be based on average completion time, not your own personal time. So there is nothing you can personally do to get a better reward.
Then that's a fail system, if it's just virtual socialism.
There is something you can do: Play it faster. So you get the 1000 dil in 10min, while others get the 1000 dil in 20min. Which means you get double the reward. Even though everybody gets 1000 dil.
There is something you can do: Play it faster. So you get the 1000 dil in 10min, while others get the 1000 dil in 20min. Which means you get double the reward. Even though everybody gets 1000 dil.
You MUST be a accountant, or an economics teacher.
So instead of quickly clicking to get the reward the neverwinter system lets you log in, find a safe place to park so you can raid the fridge, the complete to get a reward ?
Whats the difference other than wasting my time ? OMG- Zenmaggedon
The NW system is based on the average completion time, not the individual completion time. So, if you want to just hang out in a mission, you're wasting your time and not getting a reward for the time wasted.
You have to complete the quest. If the quest is click a console, then you get a bad reward based on the average time it takes players to click that console.
Again, we have no proof that this system is coming to STO. I hope it does. It's not without issues, but it's a lot better than this exploit.
The NW system is based on the average completion time, not the individual completion time. So, if you want to just hang out in a mission, you're wasting your time and not getting a reward for the time wasted.
You have to complete the quest. If the quest is click a console, then you get a bad reward based on the average time it takes players to click that console.
Again, we have no proof that this system is coming to STO. I hope it does. It's not without issues, but it's a lot better than this exploit.
Well how is that any different than what we have now ? If a simple mission takes 20 seconds to complete you still get the reward, right ?
Unless you take 25 seconds to complete it, then you get less.
:P
The system is based on average time to complete the mission, it does NOTHING to keep instant win missions from being created. It just means you'll need to run the mission with a stopwatch in hand.
Well how is that any different than what we have now ? If a simple mission takes 20 seconds to complete you still get the reward, right ?
Unless you take 25 seconds to complete it, then you get less.
:P
The system is based on average time to complete the mission, it does NOTHING to keep instant win missions from being created. It just means you'll need to run the mission with a stopwatch in hand.
No, it doesn't prevent console clickers, but the reward for playing a 5 minute mission would be nothing compared to the reward for playing a real mission. So, you could still do a console clicker but it would be like trying to earn millions of ECs by farming alien artifacts v. particle traces.
It's completely different from spend 2 minutes to get 1440 dil v. spend 2 hours to get 1440 dil.
It would be like: spend 2 minutes to get 5 dilithium or spend 2 hours to get 1000. Or, you could spend the 2 hours running 60 console clickers back to back. I'd wager that actually playing a mission would be more fun.
No, it doesn't prevent console clickers, but the reward for playing a 5 minute mission would be nothing compared to the reward for playing a real mission. So, you could still do a console clicker but it would be like trying to earn millions of ECs by farming alien artifacts v. particle traces.
It's completely different from spend 2 minutes to get 1440 dil v. spend 2 hours to get 1440 dil.
It would be like: spend 2 minutes to get 5 dilithium or spend 2 hours to get 1000. Or, you could spend the 2 hours running 60 console clickers back to back. I'd wager that actually playing a mission would be more fun.
You said in a previous post that the system was based on average completion time NOT the individual completion time.
So NW's system does BOTH ?
If an average academy event nets 60 samples (I've gone 100+ on occasion) then the average foundry mission time should be less than 10 min each to make it worthwhile. I won't spend 2 hours to get 1440 dilith from foundry missions when I can do path of the warrior sorte's almost 2 times each in that 2 hours for 960 each sorte, or 3840 dilith.
You wanna kill the foundry ? Kill the incentive to try missions.
You said in a previous post that the system was based on average completion time NOT the individual completion time.
So NW's system does BOTH ?
sigh.
NW mission rewards are based on the average play time of the mission being played. If the mission is:
"My Koolz Console Clicker" with an average play time of 2 minutes, meaning that is what it takes most players to play that specific mission, then you'd get a reward worth the 2 minute average play time of that mission.
"My Real Foundry Mission" with an average play time of 30 minutes = a reward comparable to that average play time.
The reward is based on the average completion time of an individual mission, not the time of an individual playing the mission.
By my estimate, 100 dilith per minute is about right for game missions, so your 30 minute foundry mission could be attractive at 3k, but for 1440 dilith NO WAY I'm doing 3 30 minute foundry missions.
By my estimate, 100 dilith per minute is about right for game missions, so your 30 minute foundry mission could be attractive at 3k, but for 1440 dilith NO WAY I'm doing 3 30 minute foundry missions.
Well, if the play 3 to earn 1440 mission goes away, then you don't have play 3. We also don't know what the rewards will be.
You don't have to play any of my rather short missions (compared to most foundry authors).
Bottom line though: If they take out the exploit and reward you properly for playing a foundry mission, then you're not going to get 1440 dilithium by clicking a console.
Maybe whatever the rewards are will give you a break from grinding every once in awhile.
Or..you could be like me, and just play foundry missions for FUN..ya know the thing a game is supposed to be? I dont play foundry missions for rewards. I play them to do something new, and enjoy the content. We have many great authors out there, though most dont know cuz they just do clickies..
You are limited to a 8k refinement limit. That's not going anywhere. The way I think it should work is EVERY legitimate mission in the game rewards 8k Dilithium. So to get your cap just for playing one mission (STF, story, PVP match, whatever). The kicker is, after that 8k, you don't get anymore Dilithium from anything.
This works for hardcore and casual equally well. Because of the refinement cap, the hardcores don't suffer, because they are already limited in their daily intake. And it benefits the casuals because now they can get the dilithium they need and still have time to play whatever they want. When you have an hour to play each day, and gathering 8k dilithium takes an hour, you're either screwed out of doing what you want (Fleet mark missions for example) or your screwed out of dilithium.
You are limited to a 8k refinement limit. That's not going anywhere. The way I think it should work is EVERY legitimate mission in the game rewards 8k Dilithium. So to get your cap just for playing one mission (STF, story, PVP match, whatever). The kicker is, after that 8k, you don't get anymore Dilithium from anything.
This works for hardcore and casual equally well. Because of the refinement cap, the hardcores don't suffer, because they are already limited in their daily intake. And it benefits the casuals because now they can get the dilithium they need and still have time to play whatever they want. When you have an hour to play each day, and gathering 8k dilithium takes an hour, you're either screwed out of doing what you want (Fleet mark missions for example) or your screwed out of dilithium.
You are limited to a 8k refinement limit. That's not going anywhere. The way I think it should work is EVERY legitimate mission in the game rewards 8k Dilithium. So to get your cap just for playing one mission (STF, story, PVP match, whatever). The kicker is, after that 8k, you don't get anymore Dilithium from anything.
This works for hardcore and casual equally well. Because of the refinement cap, the hardcores don't suffer, because they are already limited in their daily intake. And it benefits the casuals because now they can get the dilithium they need and still have time to play whatever they want. When you have an hour to play each day, and gathering 8k dilithium takes an hour, you're either screwed out of doing what you want (Fleet mark missions for example) or your screwed out of dilithium.
This way would be much better for everyone.
I might not go quite that far, but I do think that if Dilithium is a "time-based currency" then just about everything we do in the game should be worth at least a little bit of Dilithium.
The DOFF system pretty much takes this approach and rewards a little over 5 Dil per assignment on average. Every single non-Foundry mission ought to reward it, and once STO's been upgraded to Neverwinter's reward system those should too.
Heck, they could even apply NW's reward system to many of the Cryptic-built story missions. Base the Dilithium reward on average playtime for those, too.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Heck, they could even apply NW's reward system to many of the Cryptic-built story missions. Base the Dilithium reward on average playtime for those, too.
Well, we don't know if it's a dilithium based reward for the NW foundry. But, I agree in principle, especially now that the doff system means that a player is very likely getting sub-par rewards playing Cryptic missions after Lt. 8.
A few days of doffing and suddenly, you're a Rear Admiral playing captain level missions, due to doff rewards.
About the question if these kind of foundry missions are exploiting. I don't know. Indeed it is easy money, eh dilithium, but the other day I did the Explore the B'Tran cluster for vice admiral and on two missions I only had to ckick on items. In fact getting all the anomalies for data samples was more challenging.
Altogether you have to do more than clicking on one and the same item three times, but you can combine it with that mission where you have to explore three worlds, you can make 2880 dilithium in a couple of minutes.
BTW, good luck with fixing this exploit. I am no computer expert but to get that into the software doesn't look like something that is easy. One of the things I like about this game is the grind friendlyness; the missions are too simple for words, but that is no problem if you are only interested in the reward or they are fast paced and fun to do. I say here, don't fix something that ain't broken.
The truth is that the "Console Clickers" doesn't really hurt anyone or anything, and its a minor issue in the greater scheme of things.
I say do not touch it, sure its an easy Dilithium source, but it benefits more the casual players than it does any other player. The Hardcore players are few and far between, simply because there aren't many folks that own more than 5 to 6 toons.
Here is some numbers:
I own now almost 40+ toons (Alts) - I tried the clicker a few times on them, and I simply couldn't stomach the amount of time it took me to cycle through all my alts.
With 40+ toons, cycling through the click console, it literally took me a little over 4hrs of boredom. I don't have that amount of time in my hands, with family, work, and my daily responsibilities, there is no way I can do it.
I now only do it with 4 or 5 toons and I move on to STFs for Mk XII gear and Dilithium. The only reason I log on to STO now is to farm doff and Dilithium to help my Fleet starbase. Content is scarce, so there really is NO reason to login except farm for my fleet.
I'll be more concern with season 7 Grind heavy updates that will make Dilithium more scarce and will force us to spend more of it. We now have to "PAY" for our end game gear that once dropped for free, and at a huge Dilithium cost - 100k Dilithium for one set, one.
POINT of INTEREST:
In an indirect way, CRYPTIC has effected the "Daily Officer Rewards."
You say how? Let me explain;
The Dilithium reward you get for doing the report can now be used to purchase the Academy doff pack. The nerfing of the FREE Starfleet Academy doff pack is now forcing players to spend Dilithium on those packs.
This effects me, because what little Dilithium I earn from the Daily Officer Report reward will now have to go to buying the Academy doff pack - I have to do this in order to maintain a steady supply of doff that is needed for these starbase Projects. Taking any other venue to earn Dilithium will take me far too long, and I simply do not have that much time to farm. I only now have at least 4 to 5hrs tops, and that is even "iffy" now.
GREAT POST
I find myself in the same situation you are while on a slightly smaller scale.
I have 13 characters and once felt all happy to have found that way to make some quick Dilithium everyday.... Well, it was fun for about 2 weeks until i started growing bored of logging in and out, switching character and clicking for minutes...
So i ended grabbing the Officer Report mission only on the 3-4 main characters i played during a day and stopped bothering with it... I really prefered actually playing the game and doing STF for Dilithium AND a chance at good loot ( which will be gone in Season 7 sadly ).
I simply cannot see myself doing STF without getting a random reward.. I don't know what i am gonna do... I have no starbase to catter to and the Duty Officer farming even starts becoming a chore every day...
Comments
Holy Cow what a wall of text :eek:
I read the wall of text and everything in there confirms that many many people are abusing the officer daily report to farm massive amounts of dilthium.
I keep hearing over and over in your post fleets will collapse if Starbase production stops. But fleets existed long before Starbases. If a fleet exists just for the starbase then my post from just before Starbases were launched has come true:
"Starbases - the begining of the END" - June 29th
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=288621
Funny just a few days before that:
"So dilthium is going to become harder to get" June 26th
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=279541
On and on and on and on of similar posts - with the same reaction from posters - no dilth will always be easy to get - no starbases won't have more drama - no you are imagining things Cryptic would never do that!
The poster who wrote this post I am quoting has 40+ alts(stark2K) so stark how long would it take you in season 7 to do just the 1440 mission on all those alts with the new system where you don't log out? - My calculation if each one is sitting at the clicker location - 2 min max - so that gives you almost 60,000 dilth for less than 1 1/2 hours - do you think that is an exploit?
How long would it take you to do the explore mission for 1440 - per alt 12 min? or 7 hours?
Seems like the console clicker is still an exploit to me. If Cryptic wants to leave it in place - fine i will make full use of it myself. The question I have asked is will they get rid of if - a question i have not had answered yet.
This is a move I could get behind.
Dilithium that is easy to get for one person via time or money may not be easy to get for another. We need to respect all players commitments to the game regardless of whether they are big or small.
I must tip my hat and give a nod to Levi3. I read his backposts and he made some tough calls before they happened. Im not a fan of second guessing after the fact so I appreciate his words. I did not think there would be as much drama with fleets as there has been. But it seems that every fleet is trying to purge the great many inactive players that have quit playing, and recruit active players that will contribute to projects. Several once great fleets with hundreds of quality players have died, split, ended, or been left for dead. And there is the very real issue in virtually every fleet about who should get to buy what from the stores and who should not.
The happy exploit comment is succinct. It is a happy exploit. Everyone is happy except the few frumpy people that dont want others to have more dilithium than they do. It costs 300,000 dili to buy a yellow EVA suit with zero game play value except for costuming and/or fashion shows. It would take a person with 10 alts over 3 weeks of logging on and doing the clicker mission with every alt to earn this item. And its useless except for the fact that it looks good.
One of my big pet peeves in the game is that respecs should be free. If people do not enjoy their characters then they just quit playing them. Cryptic changes and nerfs skills so often that one good build one week turns into a horrid build the next through no fault of the player. If people are doing clicker missions to buy zen and get respec tokens then its good for the game. Removing dilithium from the game makes the process harder for players that dont like their toons, dont want to play them, and need to respec.
The clicker missions are popular. People do them. People like them. Removing them would be like taking a favorite roller coaster out of a theme park. Cryptic does not need to be pulling things from the game that players like. They cant afford it.
I think Cryptic desperately wants to reduce the amount of dilithium in the game. I think they will "eventually" remove this exploit and try to replace it with something that will be far less popular. A few will come to these boards and cheer them on and many will leave and fleets will do more purges.
You look at the trend. Cryptic stole millions of dilithium from players on conversion. They are doing another conversion and I doubt unspent salvage will hold the same value. Cryptic has raised the price of the contraband turn in mission, lowered the value of sold duty officers, lowered payouts of dilithium missions, and bent over backwards to reduce dilithium in the game. At the start of season 6, dilithium was selling for 400ish on the exchange and now its down to 150. Some of this was converting from Cryptic points to Zen but some of it was forced downward via supply and demand. Players that choose to do so may in the future look at a $10 zen card at Wal-Mart and decide if they are only getting 50000 dilithium from the deal that its not worth it. Right now they can get 150,000 for a bit of an impact purchase.
Again, reduced dilithium, reduces the value of zen in the game. Cryptic is destroying the value of the only product they have left to sell. They would be defacing their own merchandise.
Lock box sales are drying up. Duty officer packs seem to be less sexy and Im not seeing huge numbers of people winning Jem ships on the flash messages like I did the first two promotions. Theyve lost 2 million a month in paid revenues from subscribers. Zen / dilithium conversion is huge to them. Making people spend more for less product would not make anybody happy. It might have a short term effect of raising demand for product but long term its just a horrifically bad idea. I cant think of many enterprises in the history of the world that improved their prospects by raising taxes, revenue costs, or prices.
Indeed it is a happy exploit and it should be left alone. This thread is 14 pages long and not one person has come here and said if you remove this the game would be more fun for me. Even the people who think it should be removed admit using it happily as long as its around.
Are we going to end up with a game that has fun and fair play? The Trekkies are watching the Gamers find other games. This is Trek and die hard trekkies play here because of lack of options. But dang it cant we at least pretend that we could someday have a fun game instead of more and more grind based content to keep people occupied.
It seems like customers dont care if Cryptic makes money and stays in business. And Cryptic doesnt care if customers enjoy their game. If anybody is exploiting anything, its Cryptic taking money players invest in this game and spending it on NWN which nobody really wants. I love Trek so very much and am so burned out about a wonderful uplifting concept of goodness and truth in the future turning into a churn and burn player greed fest that I doubt I will ever put any money into a future PWE or Cryptic game. I will play NWN because I feel I invested enough in Cryptic that I paid for it. But Cryptic will not see much if any future revenues from me on that product. Im not giving them another chance till they fix STO and make it fun.
Clickers are happy exploits. Game needs more happiness, and fun. Leave it alone.
Then I give a question back:
Can anyone here REALLY answer that?
I truly mean that. I don't believe anyone could answer that question, since we don't know. We can give opinions on why or why not, but not really answer it.
Another thought I have is that...if Cryptic didn't want people doing 'console clicker' missions, they wouldn't have those as normal dailies in the first place. Like the Academy dailies, Exploration missions (most of which are little more than console clicking, scanning anomalies, or killing ships), the Officer of the Watch, and so on.
My point is that people are used to those kinds of missions, in turn, they do a console clicker for the foundry daily, and there you go, free dil and Fleet marks. If it's removed, it'd be more a hurt than a help. In my thread the other day, I felt like all the huge amounts of dil earned was skewing how Cryptic adjusted prices on things. With them removing dil requirements to level rep with, at least that means dil will be still mostly focused on:
1. Buying equipment (be it from the Dil-store, Starbase, or Rep system)
2. Making it into Zen
3. Dropping it into a Starbase.
You have lots to say and that is generally good - for posts on a forum "wall-o-text" as they call generally causes people to skip over it.
Although i think this is a exploit - I use it too - on many alts - so if I am truely against it I am shooting myself in the foot for a lot of dilth every day. I believe that i have said that I think they should leave it. But I kind of swing back and forth - I am a very Bi-poloar poster - if you check my back post i go from Rah rah- pro cryptic to - F-this anti Cryptic all the time.
One thing though has never changed: I LOVE this GAME - I am additcted to this game - and am behind anything that Cryptic does that is 100% necessary to keep the game going. (even though my posts flip back and forth - Brandon and the others know this and propbaly why they put up with a lot of my TRIBBLE.)
That said i was hoping to get an official answer on whether ot not the neverwinter system is coming.
Nothing yet means 2 things:
1)they don't care too much about the issue yet,
or
2) they plan to introduce it after season 7 but don't want to have to many shocks to the system yet(this is my belief)
And with that this will be my last post in this thread. it has more than run it's course.
Good luck to us all.
And with that this will be my last post in this thread. it has more than run it's course.
Good luck to us all.[/QUOTE]
Good news.
So instead of quickly clicking to get the reward the neverwinter system lets you log in, find a safe place to park so you can raid the fridge, the complete to get a reward ?
Whats the difference other than wasting my time ? OMG- Zenmaggedon
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
Nope. NW's reward will be based on average completion time, not your own personal time. So there is nothing you can personally do to get a better reward.
You MUST be a accountant, or an economics teacher.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
And the 1 click missions arent? Riiight :rolleyes:
The NW system is based on the average completion time, not the individual completion time. So, if you want to just hang out in a mission, you're wasting your time and not getting a reward for the time wasted.
You have to complete the quest. If the quest is click a console, then you get a bad reward based on the average time it takes players to click that console.
Again, we have no proof that this system is coming to STO. I hope it does. It's not without issues, but it's a lot better than this exploit.
Well how is that any different than what we have now ? If a simple mission takes 20 seconds to complete you still get the reward, right ?
Unless you take 25 seconds to complete it, then you get less.
:P
The system is based on average time to complete the mission, it does NOTHING to keep instant win missions from being created. It just means you'll need to run the mission with a stopwatch in hand.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
this. removing them would do more harm then good.
it all goes into dilithium sinks anyway.
No, it doesn't prevent console clickers, but the reward for playing a 5 minute mission would be nothing compared to the reward for playing a real mission. So, you could still do a console clicker but it would be like trying to earn millions of ECs by farming alien artifacts v. particle traces.
It's completely different from spend 2 minutes to get 1440 dil v. spend 2 hours to get 1440 dil.
It would be like: spend 2 minutes to get 5 dilithium or spend 2 hours to get 1000. Or, you could spend the 2 hours running 60 console clickers back to back. I'd wager that actually playing a mission would be more fun.
You said in a previous post that the system was based on average completion time NOT the individual completion time.
So NW's system does BOTH ?
If an average academy event nets 60 samples (I've gone 100+ on occasion) then the average foundry mission time should be less than 10 min each to make it worthwhile. I won't spend 2 hours to get 1440 dilith from foundry missions when I can do path of the warrior sorte's almost 2 times each in that 2 hours for 960 each sorte, or 3840 dilith.
You wanna kill the foundry ? Kill the incentive to try missions.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
sigh.
NW mission rewards are based on the average play time of the mission being played. If the mission is:
"My Koolz Console Clicker" with an average play time of 2 minutes, meaning that is what it takes most players to play that specific mission, then you'd get a reward worth the 2 minute average play time of that mission.
"My Real Foundry Mission" with an average play time of 30 minutes = a reward comparable to that average play time.
The reward is based on the average completion time of an individual mission, not the time of an individual playing the mission.
Awoken Dead
Now shaddup about the queues, it's a BUG
Well, if the play 3 to earn 1440 mission goes away, then you don't have play 3. We also don't know what the rewards will be.
You don't have to play any of my rather short missions (compared to most foundry authors).
Bottom line though: If they take out the exploit and reward you properly for playing a foundry mission, then you're not going to get 1440 dilithium by clicking a console.
Maybe whatever the rewards are will give you a break from grinding every once in awhile.
This works for hardcore and casual equally well. Because of the refinement cap, the hardcores don't suffer, because they are already limited in their daily intake. And it benefits the casuals because now they can get the dilithium they need and still have time to play whatever they want. When you have an hour to play each day, and gathering 8k dilithium takes an hour, you're either screwed out of doing what you want (Fleet mark missions for example) or your screwed out of dilithium.
This way would be much better for everyone.
I like this idea, you got my vote :>
I might not go quite that far, but I do think that if Dilithium is a "time-based currency" then just about everything we do in the game should be worth at least a little bit of Dilithium.
The DOFF system pretty much takes this approach and rewards a little over 5 Dil per assignment on average. Every single non-Foundry mission ought to reward it, and once STO's been upgraded to Neverwinter's reward system those should too.
Heck, they could even apply NW's reward system to many of the Cryptic-built story missions. Base the Dilithium reward on average playtime for those, too.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
Well, we don't know if it's a dilithium based reward for the NW foundry. But, I agree in principle, especially now that the doff system means that a player is very likely getting sub-par rewards playing Cryptic missions after Lt. 8.
A few days of doffing and suddenly, you're a Rear Admiral playing captain level missions, due to doff rewards.
I think its pretty safe to say there will be no dilithium in NW.
Altogether you have to do more than clicking on one and the same item three times, but you can combine it with that mission where you have to explore three worlds, you can make 2880 dilithium in a couple of minutes.
BTW, good luck with fixing this exploit. I am no computer expert but to get that into the software doesn't look like something that is easy. One of the things I like about this game is the grind friendlyness; the missions are too simple for words, but that is no problem if you are only interested in the reward or they are fast paced and fun to do. I say here, don't fix something that ain't broken.
GREAT POST
I find myself in the same situation you are while on a slightly smaller scale.
I have 13 characters and once felt all happy to have found that way to make some quick Dilithium everyday.... Well, it was fun for about 2 weeks until i started growing bored of logging in and out, switching character and clicking for minutes...
So i ended grabbing the Officer Report mission only on the 3-4 main characters i played during a day and stopped bothering with it... I really prefered actually playing the game and doing STF for Dilithium AND a chance at good loot ( which will be gone in Season 7 sadly ).
I simply cannot see myself doing STF without getting a random reward.. I don't know what i am gonna do... I have no starbase to catter to and the Duty Officer farming even starts becoming a chore every day...
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?p=6467241#post6467241