I mean we been asking for Long coast and Mek'leth since day one. They both in game? Also there slash the warrior is wearing with the long coat, what about the coat com badge as well, that I yet to see players able to wear?
Perhaps these be in Season 4 as surprise?
If you think about it ... They likely held off on the additional melee weapons to get the first person shooter mode into the game as well as ground combat changes.
Otherwise, they would just have to put them in and turn right around and redo them.
They will come as will additional ships, etc.
What you see in those release notes are far from everything.
If you had a sibling that was younger than you, say 2 years difference, would he be as tall as you? As strong? As smart? No. In this case, the KDF can be seen as the Fed's younger sibling - not as large or as well developed. I share your concerns about the lack of content, but the fact of the matter is that things take time. Given the fact that the KDF is younger, and the team being used to develop the factions themselves is smaller because of distribution between other projects, it's going to take more time. As I said above, just because the entire team isn't focused on it doesn't mean it's not happening.
Plus, if you don't like how the KDF is being handled, you can always make a Fed character and play that.
The KDF isn't the younger sibling,the KDF and Feds are twins......mommy just gave our food to the Feds,and now we are starving and the Feds are morbidly obese.
If you had a sibling that was younger than you, say 2 years difference, would he be as tall as you? As strong? As smart? No. In this case, the KDF can be seen as the Fed's younger sibling - not as large or as well developed. I share your concerns about the lack of content, but the fact of the matter is that things take time. Given the fact that the KDF is younger, and the team being used to develop the factions themselves is smaller because of distribution between other projects, it's going to take more time. As I said above, just because the entire team isn't focused on it doesn't mean it's not happening.
Plus, if you don't like how the KDF is being handled, you can always make a Fed character and play that.
Your example is inaccurate.
Fed and KDF are fraternal twins. After being born, Fed was nourished while KDF was given whatever Fed didn't want (which wasn't much). Fed grew and flourished while KDF was left stunted and starving. Fed got all the toys and all the attention. KDF got nothing. It seemed that Fed's appetite for anything and everything was insatiable. After two years, they were both allowed out to play with others.
Most people liked Fed. He was well-rounded, good looking and usually fun. You could play with Fed for hours and hours and not do the same thing. KDF was a different story. He was socially underdeveloped, repetitive, and visually haphazard. You had to play with Fed for a little while before you could even talk to KDF, and when you did start playing with KDF you quickly found yourself doing the same things over and over again. KDF needed other people to be fun for him because he was never taught how. KDF was codependent.
Over time Fed's circle of friends grew while KDF's social circle dwindled. The few that saw the potential in KDF would ask his parents to do something to help him, and they agreed. 'When?', KDF's friends asked. 'Soon', his parents would say. But KDF always seemed to be forgotten when his parents bought new clothes or toys. Fed always got more. And if KDF did get anything, the clothes didn't fit right or the toys didn't work right.
'But you promised...!' KDF's friends would say to his parents. 'Yes, we know. But we meant next time...' his parents would say. Soon, however, KDF's parents started blaming KDF's friends. 'You are so few' KDF's parents said to his friends. 'If there were more of you we could justify teaching KDF to be fun like Fed, and giving him more clothes and toys.' KDF's friends responded by saying, 'How can KDF have more friends if he doesn't know how to be fun in the first place? If he doesn't have nice clothes and toys to play with?' KDF's parents had no answer.
Now, again, KDF's parents have promised to give KDF more. They promised many new and exciting things. They promised that this time KDF will be more fun and his friends would be happy.
Lord Ice makes a compelling point. Essentially we should be grateful that the overhaul and revamp of the ground combat system is faction neutral and includes the KDF as well. Because as PFalcon points out with the Com Code thing, there was a big chance that the KDF may have been forgotten.
You are a LTS, as am I. I don't know when you bought yours, or how much you paid, but I bought mine pre-launch because we were led to believe by multiple interviews and press releases in the beginning that indicated two full factions.
I paid $350 USD for two factions, not one and a quarter. If I was paying for one and a quarter I would not have bought LTS at that price (maybe $100-$175 USD, but not $350 USD).
You also paid for two factions, and you, like me, have gotten one and a quarter Factions.
Even if you are a purely Fed player, even if you hate and loath the KDF, even if you have no desire to ever roll a KDF toon, even out of curiosity, you should be outraged that we have been short-changed like this.
And you should be outraged that when pro-KDf players make threads and requests for all of us to get what we've paid for (or, in the case of monthly/biannually/annual subs, are paying for), that Fed-centric players come in and tell them to, in effect, shut up, sit down, and be happy for what scraps are thrown their way.
You, and your attitude that the KDF for whatever reason should be the way it is, is part of the problem, and you are acting against your own self interest.
If WoW can have two full and healthy factions at $15 USD/month, there's no reason STO should be one and a quarter Factions at the same monthly price. No reason, that is, except the actions and demands of shortsighted subscribers demanding that the inequality continue and that they continue to get less then they're paying for.
When have I EVER stated the way bthe KDF faction is, is the way is should be? You can look at my posting history, and see I've NEVER sauid or intimated such a postition. I honestly DO wish this game had two equal and full factions at launch - but it didn't.
In 2008 after they got the rights to the IP they stated there would be two full factions. In December 2009 was the first inkling that this was not going to be the case. I've also NEVER stated that "The KDF was designed and envisioned as 'PvP only' either; as I do know the history, and know it before peregrine Falcons excellect post detailing the majority of Dev comments regarding the KDF.
What my particulatr beef is - everytime there's a patch, no matter what it contains for the KDF; a lot of KDF players suddenly believe there's nothig in there for the KDF; or they're upset that somehow, the KDF haven't been immedialtely made into a full faction.
If you've read the Dev posts, they've stated many times:
1) The KDF (and any other player faction created in the future) will never have the amount of content the Fed faction has. Period (And do I like that? Honestly no, but given what I know of Dev team size, I understand why that is.)
2) The majority of any future PvE content will be 'faction agnostic' (ie most new PvE missions will be from mthe 'Featured Episode' series.) Why? It gives the devs more bang for their development buck, and is honestly how most MMOs do content past any starting zones. Future STFs will also be designed as faction agnostic.
Now, do I think the KDF should have more than the 8 KDF story missions? Yes. However, while the Devs haven't said this will never increase they have stated again, that they are now focused on faction agnostic contemnt that all factions present and future will have access to.
Am I against them getting more ships and other items, no. But again, I understand the situation in that the majority of canon Klingon ship are in the game - while there are still a number of Federation canon designs that aren't. Given that they have stated (and I believe it), that canon designs are easier to make, and get approval on from CBS; I can see why the Feds have more ships and more are coming.
Also, I've never been outraged at KDF player requests. What I don't understand is tearing down whatever the Devs DO add to the KDF and say, "It's really nothing yet again.." which is how a lot of the posts come across.
BTW - I was in closed beta, and had been following the game development since the Perpetual days. I bought my LTS knowing the state of the KDF during beta and at launch; and honestly, it was WELL advertisede by the majority of gaming sites that did any articles on STO beta; and the open beta was online before the LTS was offered too; and the state of the KDF again was well known.
My point is saying the above: If you claim to have followed the STO game developed from at least open beta on, and bought an LTS; unless you hadn't read any articles of the state of the game - nor any forum posts, it's hard to believe you bpught the LTS thinking there would be two full PVE factions - because from December 2009 to launch, the word was out on the state of the KDF.
Lastly, do I hate the KDF? No, I have a KDF toon, and play him, and plan to do one of each type for both KDF and FED. I am indeed more of a Fed player then a KDF player, can't deny that - but I don't 'hate the KDF".
BTW - if you bought your LTS 'pre-launch' you paid $240.00 like I did. The $350.00 price was post launch day. (And yes, I don't know why they upped it if you didn't buy it prior to 2/2/10 as you'd think they would have had a grace period.
But, sorry, I stated I would saty out fof KDF threads, and I should have stuck with that here; as I do realize that - for a vocal minority, if you're not down 100% with the:
"Cryptic sucks and should be crucified and burned at the stake for not dropping EVERYTHING else until there's faction parity" line of thought
You obviously must hate the KDF faction.
Again, I'm NOT telling anyone to 'shut up and be happy'. What I am saying is, at least give them credit when thney DO add something that you like; BUT keep after them to continue the work. Don't write everything the do for the KDF as 'nothing' or 'more scraps'., etc. If people think threads constantly telling the Devs they must hate the KDF factionand everyone that plays it somehow inspires them to want to do more for it, I think you'll be in for a rude awakening.
Again, I not saying blow sunshine and roses up their <redacted>. The KDF ISN'T complete by any means and I have NEVER stated it was, or KDF only players should feign satisfaction. But I often read a lot of vield contempt for the STO Devs with regard to the KDF, no matter what's done for the KDF. If people think that's going to get the Devs to do more work on the KDF faction, and faster; I think they need to take a breath, and do a quick reality check.
If people think that's going to get the Devs to do more work on the KDF faction, and faster; I think they need to take a breath, and do a quick reality check.
Armsman, I'm speaking only for myself in this post, as I always do, I don't know if the other pro-KDF players feel this same way. Hopefully some of them will chime in and tell us that they agree with my point of view, or that they think I'm full of it. Either way, here's what I think.
Yes, I believe that the devs are working hard to improve the KDF faction. I understand, and even agree with, their stance on putting more work into the Federation side than the Empire. It just makes good business sense. All emotional comments about "quick cash grabs" aside, which you'll notice that I never make, a good businessman goes where the money is.
And I'm not even going to talk about what happened at launch. To be blunt about it, that's over and done with, and people need to get over that.
The problem that I really have is that the Empire still lacks basic game functionality. We have no kit and armor visuals, bugs that have been fixed for the Federation are still rampant in KDF missions. The Federation has combat buff pets (Tribbles), but not the Empire. In addition to the huge imbalance in uniforms, Empire females don't even get skirts. Heck, our TOS uniform isn't even half finished. The male version consists solely of the shirt, and the female version doesn't exist in game.
Three of our five races lack female versions, and two of the five don't even exist as bridge officers.
I'm not even complaining about content, i.e. missions, I'm talking about just being able to play the game. I'm perfectly happy to play Foundry missions in between dailies and "Empire Defense" missions.
We keep getting these contradictory messages from the developers. That they're working things for the Empire, but then those things repeatedly fail to materialize.
Dstahl saying that KDF C-Store items don't sell well enough for them to justify making more of them, but the amount of C-Store items for the Empire is so small that they don't have a valid statistical sample from which to even make that claim. For example; how does dstahl know that KDF uniforms wouldn't sell? They're aren't any KDF uniforms on the C-Store.
So that's the real problem that I have, if they're not going to add those things to the Empire faction then fine, but then I wish they'd just stop saying that they're going to. I don't feel anger about this, only disappointment. Repeated disappointment. And I suspect that I'm not the only one.
I know that you're tired of seeing threads and posts complaining about KDF content, but people are going to post about what they care about. So I'm undoubtedly going to have to put up with seeing more "Control Ship from the Bridge" and "T-5 Connie" and "Federation Carrier" threads, and you're just going tolerate "KDF Content" threads.
At least until we finally get what the developers have told us that we'd be getting.
I agree with everything you said there PF, a good post. In the end we´ll have to wait until Season 4 arrives (completely) to judge on it´s KDF content.
Sometimes I get the impression that some people wait for the big KDF patch that suddenly brings the KDF to the same content level as the Federation. That will never happen.
Step by Step is the most reasonable way to expect the KDF to grow. I would be happy with one or two new PvE missions here and there. Of yourse I would be even happier with more than that, I just don´t expect it anymore
There really should be an 'Order of the Peregrine Falcon' to honour all the hard work PF has done to defend the Empire from duplicity and disinformation. And once again I agree with everything said.
I know that you're tired of seeing threads and posts complaining about KDF content, but people are going to post about what they care about. So I'm undoubtedly going to have to put up with seeing more "Control Ship from the Bridge" and "T-5 Connie" and "Federation Carrier" threads, and you're just going tolerate "KDF Content" threads.
At least until we finally get what the developers have told us that we'd be getting.
Again, I not tired of seeing posts complaining about KDF content per se. What I don't unsderstand is why, when new stuff is added or updated for the KDF, there are a lot of posts of "That's nothing!!" or "Who cares about that?" (When weeks or months before some were on a rant about getting'that" added.)
Again, I get the dissatifaction, and understand why it's there; and again, as I've said, Yes, take them to task for what the KDF still needs (which is a lot); but don't dismiss things that ARE done for the KDF when they are.
I don't see tearing them down for things they added to the KDF as inspiring them to want to do more. And that happens a lot in the KDF complaint threads I've seen; and that's honestly an attitude I don't understand or agree with.
I'd like to cite something more complex, but honestly, that's what it boils down to is human nature. It's human nature to complain when we feel that we're not being treated fairly, even if that perception doesn't measure up to reality.
Look, some people are still upset and like to rant about the problems during launch. That makes no sense to me either, because you can't change the past.
But some of us are paying a subscription (or have paid for one) because we want to play Klingons. So we're being charged for something that we were told we were going to get, but we're not getting. And we're repeatedly told that we're going to get it, we just need to wait for it, but then repeatedly we don't get it.
And admittedly some people just don't like to wait, or have unrealistic expectations about how fast the developers can add things to the game.
Some people can just unsubscribe and come back a year later, but some of us can't. So we're still here and still waiting for what we paid for.
Again, I not tired of seeing posts complaining about KDF content per se. What I don't unsderstand is why, when new stuff is added or updated for the KDF, there are a lot of posts of "That's nothing!!"
I think the Gorn Revamp is a good example to use to explain the reaction.
We were introduced to the Gorn revamp last year.
It's just now going in.
That's why reception is lukewarm. It doesn't really feel like an item that's for season 4. But to then be told be excited about it as part of some season 4 KDF focus? Meh.
The fact is, human nature and ranting, in the end, don't measure up to simple statistics. The fact is, the majority of players do not play KDF, and that is NOT because the majority of players do not WANT to play an alternate faction. There are far too many MMOs with alternate factions for that to be a legitimate claim.
So it is clear that the lack of Klingon content HAS crippled the Klingon player base. Unless you can come up with an alternate explanation, there is no arguing that. The question is what do we do now. Bringing the KDF up to a point where it is equal to the Fed is not the goal. Bringing the KDF up to a point WHERE IT CAN SUPPORT A HEALTHY AND SUSTAINABLE PLAYER BASE is.
If the devs, or Fed players, want to blame the lack of KDF players on lack of interest, that's fine. But the fact is, simple logic dictates that you cannot increase the player base without making SOME committment to the expectation of players to be added in the future.
I am at the point where I can take whatever I can get from the devs for the KDF. If it means having to share most of the new stuff coming out, then so be it. It's at least something. While I would very much prefer having two different experiences, I can see where this might not be possible, at least in the short run.
What I do have a problem with is that the devs have repeatedly promised us this or that and then either postpone, water down, or just outright scrap these promises. As Superchum said, we were promised MONTHS ago the Gorn revamp. We're just getting it now. Yawn. And to add salt to the wounds, Dan had the gall to say that the reason that we're not getting stuff (using the latest Ask Cryptic's question regarding C-Store KDF stuff) because there's no demand for it is shear and utter BS. I'm sure most of us would buy up stuff hoping to fund future development whether we use said item or not (I've bought every single bridge pack and I doubt I'd use any of them for exactly this reason alone).
For me, my "complaining" is more out of frustration than anti-Cryptic hate speech. I know that they're trying to patch up the holes from launch and I do believe that in some ways they're trying their damnedest to get it out quickly, but history has proven that the Feds always get priority no matter how well fed they are (compared to the starving KDF).
I have to disagree. Look at what was done it makes what was done to esd look like childs play. I can understand why they waited. New grapic in the game make a big diferene. It possible that the new tech is part of what behind the look. Either way the city looks great. The Gorn look great. A little disapoint that that there are no harness or strap like tops for the gorn. No gorn uniquie outfits that i can see per say. But First city looks great.
would I like more. Of ourse. I want the klingons to be done. But these changes are big step in the right direction.
I have to disagree. Look at what was done it makes what was done to esd look like childs play. I can understand why they waited. New grapic in the game make a big diferene. It possible that the new tech is part of what behind the look. Either way the city looks great. The Gorn look great. A little disapoint that that there are no harness or strap like tops for the gorn. No gorn uniquie outfits that i can see per say. But First city looks great.
would I like more. Of ourse. I want the klingons to be done. But these changes are big step in the right direction.
You miss my point. The city could be paved with latinum, but if there's nothing but empty wasteland and a beyond it, who cares? Is there glorious battle in this great city? Or is it merely a comfort spot for mewling politicians and merchants that don't know one end of a disruptor from the other?
The lack of answers to what was told was going to happen and didn't is another problem I mean yea if they just say yea we messed up there would be far less issues that we are all having. But instead its just dealt with every one who complains weather it be against the code of conduct or not being banned. If we aren't allowed to voice are opinions freely then why bother with the forums at all. I suppose I'll be banned after I post this myself .
The First City and the Gorn options are not the only new things that Klingons have. Head to the shipyard and look at the new skins some of the BoP have. I know what my B'rel retrofit will look like. Those new skins are jut gorgeous. Too bad when can't use them just yet.
Like Stahl said. If folks are unhappy with the game, you do have a recourse. A way to make your voice heard. Quit playing. Quit giving them money. They have a small team and they are busting their collective asses to make good on the KDF side.
The KDF was supposed to primarily be a PvP faction. And no, player posts on this forum are not a sufficient counter argument. Neither is a video of some guy who looks strung out and barely understands english.
I followed this game since it was announced, followed the original community forums from day 1. The Klingons were always intended to be a sub-faction in the game. It wasn't until launch that this Dev team decided to make them full on equals.
These guys are busting their asses to put this together and all you people do is complain rant and rave that it's not happening on your time table. The KDF gets the Lion's Share of Season 4. As for complaining that those other line items aren't in this patch? Did you ever stop to consider that maybe those other items will come in AFTER this patch, but still in Season 4? Go have a smoke or something and relax. it's just a video game.
Like Stahl said. If folks are unhappy with the game, you do have a recourse. A way to make your voice heard. Quit playing. Quit giving them money. They have a small team and they are busting their collective asses to make good on the KDF side.
The KDF was supposed to primarily be a PvP faction. And no, player posts on this forum are not a sufficient counter argument. Neither is a video of some guy who looks strung out and barely understands english.
I followed this game since it was announced, followed the original community forums from day 1. The Klingons were always intended to be a sub-faction in the game. It wasn't until launch that this Dev team decided to make them full on equals.
These guys are busting their asses to put this together and all you people do is complain rant and rave that it's not happening on your time table. The KDF gets the Lion's Share of Season 4. As for complaining that those other line items aren't in this patch? Did you ever stop to consider that maybe those other items will come in AFTER this patch, but still in Season 4? Go have a smoke or something and relax. it's just a video game.
And your comment about players having a recourse....some have a Lifetime sub and are stuck,and many have already left.... And those of us that stayed are hoping and fighting for a better game,with our support.
I followed this game since it was announced, followed the original community forums from day 1. The Klingons were always intended to be a sub-faction in the game. It wasn't until launch that this Dev team decided to make them full on equals.
I'd suggest you read the history thread in this forum that was recently closed that shows this not to be the case.
I'd also disagree that the "lion's share" of Season 4 is for Klingons. The biggest items in this season are the ground combat revamp and the Doff system. Qo'Nos is the other big feature, but that is in response to the ESD revamp that came for the Federation in Season 3. I too suspect we'll see more of the Klingon features in future Tribble builds. However, to say that Season Four, as advertised, is heavy for Klingons is inaccurate. The follolwing isn't comprehensive, but it does include many of the features for Season Four:
Ground Comabt--both factions
Doff System--both factions
New Ships--bothfactions (but the Federation is the only faction that actually has ships namd in the last Engineering Report
New Gorn Customization--KDF
New Federation Badges, Skirts, Boots--Fedeation Only
New Academies--both factions, but not to be released at the start of Season Four
New In the Neighborhood Missions--both factions
Releveling progression for Klingons--not confirmed for launch of Season Four, but planned at some point
New Planets for the Sol System--I'm not sure this is definite for Season Four
Qo'Nos Revamp--KDF
It doesn't look like the KDF is getting any more attention than the Federation to me.
The First City and the Gorn options are not the only new things that Klingons have. Head to the shipyard and look at the new skins some of the BoP have. I know what my B'rel retrofit will look like. Those new skins are jut gorgeous. Too bad when can't use them just yet.
There are 2 new skins for the T6 BoP refit, no others....
I'm more impressed with the shipyard now...
And your comment about players having a recourse....some have a Lifetime sub and are stuck,and many have already left.... And those of us that stayed are hoping and fighting for a better game,with our support.
Like Stahl said. If folks are unhappy with the game, you do have a recourse. A way to make your voice heard. Quit playing. Quit giving them money. They have a small team and they are busting their collective asses to make good on the KDF side.
The KDF was supposed to primarily be a PvP faction. And no, player posts on this forum are not a sufficient counter argument. Neither is a video of some guy who looks strung out and barely understands english.
I followed this game since it was announced, followed the original community forums from day 1. The Klingons were always intended to be a sub-faction in the game. It wasn't until launch that this Dev team decided to make them full on equals.
These guys are busting their asses to put this together and all you people do is complain rant and rave that it's not happening on your time table. The KDF gets the Lion's Share of Season 4. As for complaining that those other line items aren't in this patch? Did you ever stop to consider that maybe those other items will come in AFTER this patch, but still in Season 4? Go have a smoke or something and relax. it's just a video game.
First off, some of us are lifers. We DON'T have the luxury of giving Cryptic any more money outside of a C-Store boycott. And most of the KDF-specific players have already left out of frustration or disgust. Those left are lifers and those still fighting for a better faction...plenty of us are both.
Secondly, and I REALLY hate repeating myself, the KDF was NOT a PvP-centric faction from start. Read through the thread linked below in my signature and you'll see where all the frustrations lie.
Yes, the KDF is getting better, albeit slowly. However, we were promised things for EVERY SINGLE SEASON. We got little in each.
Comments
If you think about it ... They likely held off on the additional melee weapons to get the first person shooter mode into the game as well as ground combat changes.
Otherwise, they would just have to put them in and turn right around and redo them.
They will come as will additional ships, etc.
What you see in those release notes are far from everything.
The KDF isn't the younger sibling,the KDF and Feds are twins......mommy just gave our food to the Feds,and now we are starving and the Feds are morbidly obese.
Your example is inaccurate.
Fed and KDF are fraternal twins. After being born, Fed was nourished while KDF was given whatever Fed didn't want (which wasn't much). Fed grew and flourished while KDF was left stunted and starving. Fed got all the toys and all the attention. KDF got nothing. It seemed that Fed's appetite for anything and everything was insatiable. After two years, they were both allowed out to play with others.
Most people liked Fed. He was well-rounded, good looking and usually fun. You could play with Fed for hours and hours and not do the same thing. KDF was a different story. He was socially underdeveloped, repetitive, and visually haphazard. You had to play with Fed for a little while before you could even talk to KDF, and when you did start playing with KDF you quickly found yourself doing the same things over and over again. KDF needed other people to be fun for him because he was never taught how. KDF was codependent.
Over time Fed's circle of friends grew while KDF's social circle dwindled. The few that saw the potential in KDF would ask his parents to do something to help him, and they agreed. 'When?', KDF's friends asked. 'Soon', his parents would say. But KDF always seemed to be forgotten when his parents bought new clothes or toys. Fed always got more. And if KDF did get anything, the clothes didn't fit right or the toys didn't work right.
'But you promised...!' KDF's friends would say to his parents. 'Yes, we know. But we meant next time...' his parents would say. Soon, however, KDF's parents started blaming KDF's friends. 'You are so few' KDF's parents said to his friends. 'If there were more of you we could justify teaching KDF to be fun like Fed, and giving him more clothes and toys.' KDF's friends responded by saying, 'How can KDF have more friends if he doesn't know how to be fun in the first place? If he doesn't have nice clothes and toys to play with?' KDF's parents had no answer.
Now, again, KDF's parents have promised to give KDF more. They promised many new and exciting things. They promised that this time KDF will be more fun and his friends would be happy.
'But they promised...!'
Z
When have I EVER stated the way bthe KDF faction is, is the way is should be? You can look at my posting history, and see I've NEVER sauid or intimated such a postition. I honestly DO wish this game had two equal and full factions at launch - but it didn't.
In 2008 after they got the rights to the IP they stated there would be two full factions. In December 2009 was the first inkling that this was not going to be the case. I've also NEVER stated that "The KDF was designed and envisioned as 'PvP only' either; as I do know the history, and know it before peregrine Falcons excellect post detailing the majority of Dev comments regarding the KDF.
What my particulatr beef is - everytime there's a patch, no matter what it contains for the KDF; a lot of KDF players suddenly believe there's nothig in there for the KDF; or they're upset that somehow, the KDF haven't been immedialtely made into a full faction.
If you've read the Dev posts, they've stated many times:
1) The KDF (and any other player faction created in the future) will never have the amount of content the Fed faction has. Period (And do I like that? Honestly no, but given what I know of Dev team size, I understand why that is.)
2) The majority of any future PvE content will be 'faction agnostic' (ie most new PvE missions will be from mthe 'Featured Episode' series.) Why? It gives the devs more bang for their development buck, and is honestly how most MMOs do content past any starting zones. Future STFs will also be designed as faction agnostic.
Now, do I think the KDF should have more than the 8 KDF story missions? Yes. However, while the Devs haven't said this will never increase they have stated again, that they are now focused on faction agnostic contemnt that all factions present and future will have access to.
Am I against them getting more ships and other items, no. But again, I understand the situation in that the majority of canon Klingon ship are in the game - while there are still a number of Federation canon designs that aren't. Given that they have stated (and I believe it), that canon designs are easier to make, and get approval on from CBS; I can see why the Feds have more ships and more are coming.
Also, I've never been outraged at KDF player requests. What I don't understand is tearing down whatever the Devs DO add to the KDF and say, "It's really nothing yet again.." which is how a lot of the posts come across.
BTW - I was in closed beta, and had been following the game development since the Perpetual days. I bought my LTS knowing the state of the KDF during beta and at launch; and honestly, it was WELL advertisede by the majority of gaming sites that did any articles on STO beta; and the open beta was online before the LTS was offered too; and the state of the KDF again was well known.
My point is saying the above: If you claim to have followed the STO game developed from at least open beta on, and bought an LTS; unless you hadn't read any articles of the state of the game - nor any forum posts, it's hard to believe you bpught the LTS thinking there would be two full PVE factions - because from December 2009 to launch, the word was out on the state of the KDF.
Lastly, do I hate the KDF? No, I have a KDF toon, and play him, and plan to do one of each type for both KDF and FED. I am indeed more of a Fed player then a KDF player, can't deny that - but I don't 'hate the KDF".
BTW - if you bought your LTS 'pre-launch' you paid $240.00 like I did. The $350.00 price was post launch day. (And yes, I don't know why they upped it if you didn't buy it prior to 2/2/10 as you'd think they would have had a grace period.
But, sorry, I stated I would saty out fof KDF threads, and I should have stuck with that here; as I do realize that - for a vocal minority, if you're not down 100% with the:
"Cryptic sucks and should be crucified and burned at the stake for not dropping EVERYTHING else until there's faction parity" line of thought
You obviously must hate the KDF faction.
Again, I'm NOT telling anyone to 'shut up and be happy'. What I am saying is, at least give them credit when thney DO add something that you like; BUT keep after them to continue the work. Don't write everything the do for the KDF as 'nothing' or 'more scraps'., etc. If people think threads constantly telling the Devs they must hate the KDF factionand everyone that plays it somehow inspires them to want to do more for it, I think you'll be in for a rude awakening.
Again, I not saying blow sunshine and roses up their <redacted>. The KDF ISN'T complete by any means and I have NEVER stated it was, or KDF only players should feign satisfaction. But I often read a lot of vield contempt for the STO Devs with regard to the KDF, no matter what's done for the KDF. If people think that's going to get the Devs to do more work on the KDF faction, and faster; I think they need to take a breath, and do a quick reality check.
Yes, I believe that the devs are working hard to improve the KDF faction. I understand, and even agree with, their stance on putting more work into the Federation side than the Empire. It just makes good business sense. All emotional comments about "quick cash grabs" aside, which you'll notice that I never make, a good businessman goes where the money is.
And I'm not even going to talk about what happened at launch. To be blunt about it, that's over and done with, and people need to get over that.
The problem that I really have is that the Empire still lacks basic game functionality. We have no kit and armor visuals, bugs that have been fixed for the Federation are still rampant in KDF missions. The Federation has combat buff pets (Tribbles), but not the Empire. In addition to the huge imbalance in uniforms, Empire females don't even get skirts. Heck, our TOS uniform isn't even half finished. The male version consists solely of the shirt, and the female version doesn't exist in game.
Three of our five races lack female versions, and two of the five don't even exist as bridge officers.
I'm not even complaining about content, i.e. missions, I'm talking about just being able to play the game. I'm perfectly happy to play Foundry missions in between dailies and "Empire Defense" missions.
We keep getting these contradictory messages from the developers. That they're working things for the Empire, but then those things repeatedly fail to materialize.
Dstahl saying that KDF C-Store items don't sell well enough for them to justify making more of them, but the amount of C-Store items for the Empire is so small that they don't have a valid statistical sample from which to even make that claim. For example; how does dstahl know that KDF uniforms wouldn't sell? They're aren't any KDF uniforms on the C-Store.
But the biggest problem that I have is when Dstahl tells us that Season 4 will have; "KDF costume customization options, new Gorn, new KDF tutorial, Start as a KDF with your first toon, KDF Duty Officer Assignments, releveleved KDF PVE content", but notice how only one of the items on that list is on the Tribble patch notes for Season 4?
So that's the real problem that I have, if they're not going to add those things to the Empire faction then fine, but then I wish they'd just stop saying that they're going to. I don't feel anger about this, only disappointment. Repeated disappointment. And I suspect that I'm not the only one.
I know that you're tired of seeing threads and posts complaining about KDF content, but people are going to post about what they care about. So I'm undoubtedly going to have to put up with seeing more "Control Ship from the Bridge" and "T-5 Connie" and "Federation Carrier" threads, and you're just going tolerate "KDF Content" threads.
At least until we finally get what the developers have told us that we'd be getting.
I agree with everything you said there PF, a good post. In the end we´ll have to wait until Season 4 arrives (completely) to judge on it´s KDF content.
Sometimes I get the impression that some people wait for the big KDF patch that suddenly brings the KDF to the same content level as the Federation. That will never happen.
Step by Step is the most reasonable way to expect the KDF to grow. I would be happy with one or two new PvE missions here and there. Of yourse I would be even happier with more than that, I just don´t expect it anymore
Again, I not tired of seeing posts complaining about KDF content per se. What I don't unsderstand is why, when new stuff is added or updated for the KDF, there are a lot of posts of "That's nothing!!" or "Who cares about that?" (When weeks or months before some were on a rant about getting'that" added.)
Again, I get the dissatifaction, and understand why it's there; and again, as I've said, Yes, take them to task for what the KDF still needs (which is a lot); but don't dismiss things that ARE done for the KDF when they are.
I don't see tearing them down for things they added to the KDF as inspiring them to want to do more. And that happens a lot in the KDF complaint threads I've seen; and that's honestly an attitude I don't understand or agree with.
I'd like to cite something more complex, but honestly, that's what it boils down to is human nature. It's human nature to complain when we feel that we're not being treated fairly, even if that perception doesn't measure up to reality.
Look, some people are still upset and like to rant about the problems during launch. That makes no sense to me either, because you can't change the past.
But some of us are paying a subscription (or have paid for one) because we want to play Klingons. So we're being charged for something that we were told we were going to get, but we're not getting. And we're repeatedly told that we're going to get it, we just need to wait for it, but then repeatedly we don't get it.
And admittedly some people just don't like to wait, or have unrealistic expectations about how fast the developers can add things to the game.
Some people can just unsubscribe and come back a year later, but some of us can't. So we're still here and still waiting for what we paid for.
I think the Gorn Revamp is a good example to use to explain the reaction.
We were introduced to the Gorn revamp last year.
It's just now going in.
That's why reception is lukewarm. It doesn't really feel like an item that's for season 4. But to then be told be excited about it as part of some season 4 KDF focus? Meh.
So it is clear that the lack of Klingon content HAS crippled the Klingon player base. Unless you can come up with an alternate explanation, there is no arguing that. The question is what do we do now. Bringing the KDF up to a point where it is equal to the Fed is not the goal. Bringing the KDF up to a point WHERE IT CAN SUPPORT A HEALTHY AND SUSTAINABLE PLAYER BASE is.
If the devs, or Fed players, want to blame the lack of KDF players on lack of interest, that's fine. But the fact is, simple logic dictates that you cannot increase the player base without making SOME committment to the expectation of players to be added in the future.
What I do have a problem with is that the devs have repeatedly promised us this or that and then either postpone, water down, or just outright scrap these promises. As Superchum said, we were promised MONTHS ago the Gorn revamp. We're just getting it now. Yawn. And to add salt to the wounds, Dan had the gall to say that the reason that we're not getting stuff (using the latest Ask Cryptic's question regarding C-Store KDF stuff) because there's no demand for it is shear and utter BS. I'm sure most of us would buy up stuff hoping to fund future development whether we use said item or not (I've bought every single bridge pack and I doubt I'd use any of them for exactly this reason alone).
For me, my "complaining" is more out of frustration than anti-Cryptic hate speech. I know that they're trying to patch up the holes from launch and I do believe that in some ways they're trying their damnedest to get it out quickly, but history has proven that the Feds always get priority no matter how well fed they are (compared to the starving KDF).
It took cryptic 1 1/2 years to
1) Make the STO Game engine,
2) Make the fed content.
3) The vague outline of the kdf faction
But 1 1/2 years after release i don't see even a vague timetable or a vision for KDF.
"one year from today we will have remastered all fed episodes"
vs
"We will give the kdf more content one day".
The people who were told to 'be patient' by cryptic deserve something concrete. It doesn't cost cryptic anything to be honest.
The unfortunate thing is,if too many people do this,there may not be a game to come back to ...
TOP post by the way PF , as always.
I give crtyptic a 20 out 10 for it.
The signs. Well they are just great.
A guilded cage is still just a cage.
I have to disagree. Look at what was done it makes what was done to esd look like childs play. I can understand why they waited. New grapic in the game make a big diferene. It possible that the new tech is part of what behind the look. Either way the city looks great. The Gorn look great. A little disapoint that that there are no harness or strap like tops for the gorn. No gorn uniquie outfits that i can see per say. But First city looks great.
would I like more. Of ourse. I want the klingons to be done. But these changes are big step in the right direction.
You miss my point. The city could be paved with latinum, but if there's nothing but empty wasteland and a beyond it, who cares? Is there glorious battle in this great city? Or is it merely a comfort spot for mewling politicians and merchants that don't know one end of a disruptor from the other?
The KDF was supposed to primarily be a PvP faction. And no, player posts on this forum are not a sufficient counter argument. Neither is a video of some guy who looks strung out and barely understands english.
I followed this game since it was announced, followed the original community forums from day 1. The Klingons were always intended to be a sub-faction in the game. It wasn't until launch that this Dev team decided to make them full on equals.
These guys are busting their asses to put this together and all you people do is complain rant and rave that it's not happening on your time table. The KDF gets the Lion's Share of Season 4. As for complaining that those other line items aren't in this patch? Did you ever stop to consider that maybe those other items will come in AFTER this patch, but still in Season 4? Go have a smoke or something and relax. it's just a video game.
Just read this..... http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=217322
now you know where all the discontent comes from.
And your comment about players having a recourse....some have a Lifetime sub and are stuck,and many have already left.... And those of us that stayed are hoping and fighting for a better game,with our support.
I'd suggest you read the history thread in this forum that was recently closed that shows this not to be the case.
I'd also disagree that the "lion's share" of Season 4 is for Klingons. The biggest items in this season are the ground combat revamp and the Doff system. Qo'Nos is the other big feature, but that is in response to the ESD revamp that came for the Federation in Season 3. I too suspect we'll see more of the Klingon features in future Tribble builds. However, to say that Season Four, as advertised, is heavy for Klingons is inaccurate. The follolwing isn't comprehensive, but it does include many of the features for Season Four:
Ground Comabt--both factions Doff System--both factions New Ships--bothfactions (but the Federation is the only faction that actually has ships namd in the last Engineering Report New Gorn Customization--KDF New Federation Badges, Skirts, Boots--Fedeation Only New Academies--both factions, but not to be released at the start of Season Four New In the Neighborhood Missions--both factions Releveling progression for Klingons--not confirmed for launch of Season Four, but planned at some point New Planets for the Sol System--I'm not sure this is definite for Season Four Qo'Nos Revamp--KDF
It doesn't look like the KDF is getting any more attention than the Federation to me.
There are 2 new skins for the T6 BoP refit, no others....
I'm more impressed with the shipyard now...
Notice that thread is now closed...
Really? Hm, the S4 Tribble release notes only mention the 2 T6 retrofit BoP skins.
First off, some of us are lifers. We DON'T have the luxury of giving Cryptic any more money outside of a C-Store boycott. And most of the KDF-specific players have already left out of frustration or disgust. Those left are lifers and those still fighting for a better faction...plenty of us are both.
Secondly, and I REALLY hate repeating myself, the KDF was NOT a PvP-centric faction from start. Read through the thread linked below in my signature and you'll see where all the frustrations lie.
Yes, the KDF is getting better, albeit slowly. However, we were promised things for EVERY SINGLE SEASON. We got little in each.