Actually. if you glance in at some of the lineups. there are 2 or 3 constitution refits you can only see under.
Negative. The screens you refer to, if they are the ones I'm thinking of are nothing more than Excelsior class ships seen from a below angle. The ONLY time we see a Connie refit after the Kirk era movies is as wreckage at Wolf 359.
That's good enough though. 359 is only about 40 years prior to the game. ;P
For all we know it was a training ship sent out of desperation. Not good enough.
DS9: (4)
"Homefront" (model)
"Paradise Lost" (model)
"Trials and Tribble-ations"
"What You Leave Behind" (corridor in montage scene)
Only times you ever see it in DS9, two models on desks, one time travel mission, and one...whatever you want to call a prophet induced thingie.
TNG: (11)
"The Naked Now" (graphic display, refit)
"Lonely Among Us" (model)
"The Battle" (model)
"Hide and Q" (model)
"Haven" (model)
"The Big Goodbye" (model)
"The Bonding" (model)
"Booby Trap" (model)
"The Best of Both Worlds" (wreckage)
"The First Duty" (model, original)
"Relics"(bridge)
In TNG, again..mostly models. One computer screen, one as wreckage, one holodeck bridge...at which point Picard SPECIFICALLY says the only time he's ever personally seen a Constitution was as a museum ship. You'd think the senior captain of the fleet, the guy running the flagship would have known and mentioned to Scotty if any were still on active duty.
Hey you were the one trying to argue canon with someone that has a near eidetic memory =P
Yeah. I broke my own rule of my thread and I apologize for it. However this thread is not entirely based off of the constitution. As I am a respectable member of this game I am pleased to have an opposer who is also as respectible. thus I will go into a little detail of where my thread comes from.
I was in a PVP in my Excelsior T5. I made it look like Sulu's. I pretty much "One Shotted" a guy in a Sovereign and he got to the point of insulting me and any ship that came before Star Trek: First Contact. It made me think how come other ships from said TWOK-ONWARD timeline don't have T5's
In my sig you will see my idea of a T5 constellation. A ship near and dear to my heart. What is your thought?
Yeah. I broke my own rule of my thread and I apologize for it. However this thread is not entirely based off of the constitution.
Still. The T0 ships we currently have ARE the compromise. Be thankful you have even those. Yes, I'll give you that these are new ships, but if they had the potential to be equal to the top tier, why would Starfleet not have done it from the start? Why would they waste time and resources building the mammoth ships when something a fraction of the size could do the job?
Occam's Razor says because they are already at or near their maximum potential.
The only thing I could see that could or should be interdependent of the ship's level is perhaps bridge officers. Let those scale but little to nothing else.
There HAS to be a reason for Starfleet to design and build the larger, or more modern ships.
I'm still more interested in seeing new ships based on the classics. Even the modern muscle cars people keep bringing up don't look exactly like the cars they are based on, but you immediately know what they came from.
Don't get me wrong, I love the old ships. I even have the NX and Connie and Excelsior and I want the Ambassador.
But there comes a point when I have to stop and think...why has Starfleet taken so many steps backwards? Who's running this war? Why are we wasting time, effort, expertise and resources on trying to cram in enough technology into a very very specific frame instead of cranking out more Defiants, or Intrepids, or any number of ship classes that are already designed and workable?
Ok so you have the lovely TMP Consititution Retrofit. [Mcdonalds Double Cheese Burger].
It really isn't that hard to cram in some extra pickles [new warp core, weapons arrays,]
Lettice[Innerds for parts unseen like Neciles, Shuttle Compartments,]
Onion[Crew Corders]
and finally
Special Sauce[Title of T5, Special Ability,]
Ok so you have the lovely TMP Consititution Retrofit. [Mcdonalds Double Cheese Burger].
It really isn't that hard to cram in some extra pickles [new warp core, weapons arrays,]
Lettice[Innerds for parts unseen like Neciles, Shuttle Compartments,]
Onion[Crew Corders]
and finally
Special Sauce[Title of T5, Special Ability,]
To make it into a Big Mac.
It would be more like trying to make a plain cheeseburger into that Big Mac. There's no room in that dinky little bun to fit the extra patty and all the fixings, and still have it look exactly like that cheeseburger.
The Big Mac (Nomad class) is already big and beefy and has everything you already want. It becomes a question of why try to make a tiny cheeseburger into something you already have in hand, in several varieties. (Galaxy, Sovereign, etc)
That's the big rub. Putting everything you want into the insides, while still having the outside identical in every way.
It would be more like trying to make a plain cheeseburger into that Big Mac. There's no room in that dinky little bun to fit the extra patty and all the fixings, and still have it look exactly like that cheeseburger.
The Big Mac (Nomad class) is already big and beefy and has everything you already want. It becomes a question of why try to make a tiny cheeseburger into something you already have in hand, in several varieties. (Galaxy, Sovereign, etc)
That's the big rub. Putting everything you want into the insides, while still having the outside identical in every way.
Bah.. If the Nomad is a Big Mac, the TOS ships are the crumbs left on the table after youre done..
I don't know about the NGE, but this forum's QQrs have been responsible for the worst nerfs. I would say the QQrs here are more QQ than any I have encountered elsewhere.
I'm glad you dont know about it, because if you did know about it and then said Cryptic should ignore what people say on the forums then you would really be crazy. But since you dont know about it, it was the huge blunder SOE made with SWG where they removed 3/4 of the professions(and playerbase) and made Jedi a starting profession. That is what happens when you have a company ignore feedback and simply do what they want, like you said Cryptic should do in your earlier post.
As far as seeing more "QQ" here than anywhere else, that just goes to show your inexperience on MMO forums and the internet in general. Ironically, QQing about QQing is still QQing, so your doing a pretty good job of that yourself
For all we know it was a training ship sent out of desperation. Not good enough.
Thats your assumption, which is not good enough as a counter argument either. The fact is, there is on screen proof a Constitution was in use in TNG. The circumstnaces are unknown, but your speculation is no better than anyone else's, and doesnt change the fact.
Look, dial back the all caps, take a deep breath, and realize that its a video game.
Sorry you don't like the old looking ships. Bummer for you that you feel make-believe ships should conform to some arbitrary make-believe science you gleaned from watching sci-fi tv shows. The real point of decision on this will be if Cryptic thinks they can make a buck or not. CBS may be able to exert some muscle but I doubt they care what tier the hero ships occupy.
Judging from just this thread, most people want the old ships at higher tiers or don't really care one way or another. That really doesn't bode well for the folks who don't want to see the oldies.
here we go again the caps represent only a dialog to the game part.
No one in this thread is saying they dont like the ship. they are fine with the ship being in game. We are saying for the most part that as the ship goes its a warp 7 capable ship and its nice for a lt and hell even a lt cmdr position. if you want to keep it on then just upgrade its parts internally. do not expect it to go up against a bigger and more advanced ship though. Starfleet saw the logic in making better and bigger ships to go faster and handle the tech of the century.
I do know what fuels this want now though, Games been out for over a year. Connie has been in the game for over a year and only now we get this wanting fuel for a T5 supper "connie". Kinda like the laugh that the federation had carriers like the klingons. You see in cryptic money scheme to want to cash in on people wants by bringing the nx class into the game even though you havent seen one on screen for over 200 years lol. People got it mixed up in their head that starfleet would bring back any ship and if they do why not make it a ubber admiral ship.
Ya see an engineer would know that these ships can not forefill the role of an admirals part because they are limited in size and capability, not to mention warp power. I do blame some of this on cryptic for giving you guys the false sense of star trek ship design as well as no penalty. An admiral would not truthfully fly in this ship. They are a great assest and to loose one is well dangerous. I mean gene did make sense when he approve these ship designs. CBS has made sense from the star trek design. I would hope cryptic would make sense when continuing on star trek ship design and abilities.
No one is against a connie being in game as it is there already, but we are against the notion that a connie should be a T5 with 8 weapon slots. That is what you guys are really arguing about. you dont want the connie you just want that ship to have 8 weapon slots 4 forward and 4 aft. You want it to have the ability of a defiant, sovey, galaxy, or interpid. Those ships desserve their part because theya re of the future and frankly way bigger then the connie in all respects.
What is this connie T5 going to do?
How is it conceived to be new when its old?
Where is it getting it power from to support T5 weapons?
You see you can upgrade the ship to mark XI gear so why cant you guys be happy with that. hmmm because its not about the ship or flying the ship. you just want it to be as bad as the sovey or any ship of its class in T5 area. No support of canon of a connie coming back into service for rear admiral use.
Where is your logical support for such a change besides i want iwhat i want and if i give money i should get what i want no matter if its logical or canon. I just want it because i am giving money for it.
Comments
Negative. The screens you refer to, if they are the ones I'm thinking of are nothing more than Excelsior class ships seen from a below angle. The ONLY time we see a Connie refit after the Kirk era movies is as wreckage at Wolf 359.
For all we know it was a training ship sent out of desperation. Not good enough.
DS9: (4)
"Homefront" (model)
"Paradise Lost" (model)
"Trials and Tribble-ations"
"What You Leave Behind" (corridor in montage scene)
Only times you ever see it in DS9, two models on desks, one time travel mission, and one...whatever you want to call a prophet induced thingie.
TNG: (11)
"The Naked Now" (graphic display, refit)
"Lonely Among Us" (model)
"The Battle" (model)
"Hide and Q" (model)
"Haven" (model)
"The Big Goodbye" (model)
"The Bonding" (model)
"Booby Trap" (model)
"The Best of Both Worlds" (wreckage)
"The First Duty" (model, original)
"Relics"(bridge)
In TNG, again..mostly models. One computer screen, one as wreckage, one holodeck bridge...at which point Picard SPECIFICALLY says the only time he's ever personally seen a Constitution was as a museum ship. You'd think the senior captain of the fleet, the guy running the flagship would have known and mentioned to Scotty if any were still on active duty.
Heres for your immersion.
http://i53.tinypic.com/2925rur.jpg
Your definition of fun is not mine.
That we can agree on.
Along with a T5 Ambassador class.
Hey you were the one trying to argue canon with someone that has a near eidetic memory =P
Yeah. I broke my own rule of my thread and I apologize for it. However this thread is not entirely based off of the constitution. As I am a respectable member of this game I am pleased to have an opposer who is also as respectible. thus I will go into a little detail of where my thread comes from.
I was in a PVP in my Excelsior T5. I made it look like Sulu's. I pretty much "One Shotted" a guy in a Sovereign and he got to the point of insulting me and any ship that came before Star Trek: First Contact. It made me think how come other ships from said TWOK-ONWARD timeline don't have T5's
In my sig you will see my idea of a T5 constellation. A ship near and dear to my heart. What is your thought?
Still. The T0 ships we currently have ARE the compromise. Be thankful you have even those. Yes, I'll give you that these are new ships, but if they had the potential to be equal to the top tier, why would Starfleet not have done it from the start? Why would they waste time and resources building the mammoth ships when something a fraction of the size could do the job?
Occam's Razor says because they are already at or near their maximum potential.
The only thing I could see that could or should be interdependent of the ship's level is perhaps bridge officers. Let those scale but little to nothing else.
There HAS to be a reason for Starfleet to design and build the larger, or more modern ships.
Don't get me wrong, I love the old ships. I even have the NX and Connie and Excelsior and I want the Ambassador.
But there comes a point when I have to stop and think...why has Starfleet taken so many steps backwards? Who's running this war? Why are we wasting time, effort, expertise and resources on trying to cram in enough technology into a very very specific frame instead of cranking out more Defiants, or Intrepids, or any number of ship classes that are already designed and workable?
It really isn't that hard to cram in some extra pickles [new warp core, weapons arrays,]
Lettice[Innerds for parts unseen like Neciles, Shuttle Compartments,]
Onion[Crew Corders]
and finally
Special Sauce[Title of T5, Special Ability,]
To make it into a Big Mac.
It would be more like trying to make a plain cheeseburger into that Big Mac. There's no room in that dinky little bun to fit the extra patty and all the fixings, and still have it look exactly like that cheeseburger.
The Big Mac (Nomad class) is already big and beefy and has everything you already want. It becomes a question of why try to make a tiny cheeseburger into something you already have in hand, in several varieties. (Galaxy, Sovereign, etc)
That's the big rub. Putting everything you want into the insides, while still having the outside identical in every way.
Bah.. If the Nomad is a Big Mac, the TOS ships are the crumbs left on the table after youre done..
Look at the last link in my sig for giggles.
Really?
rofl.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2155/3532114442_47b5010c55_o.jpg
There's why.
'Nuff said.
Regards,
I could show you this one too. This is what happens to smaller and less advanced designs. And gasp, its even a Connie
It doesnt bother me.. What bothers me is what I see when I play the game.
That said, your picture makes as much sense as a picture showing the 1701-D being destroyed by an squadron of X-Wings
Eh, it probably happened when the STO site all but dies around 6am EST. Happens every day for some reason.
But yeah. other than that. what do you think of the ship idea in my signature?
I'm glad you dont know about it, because if you did know about it and then said Cryptic should ignore what people say on the forums then you would really be crazy. But since you dont know about it, it was the huge blunder SOE made with SWG where they removed 3/4 of the professions(and playerbase) and made Jedi a starting profession. That is what happens when you have a company ignore feedback and simply do what they want, like you said Cryptic should do in your earlier post.
As far as seeing more "QQ" here than anywhere else, that just goes to show your inexperience on MMO forums and the internet in general. Ironically, QQing about QQing is still QQing, so your doing a pretty good job of that yourself
Thats your assumption, which is not good enough as a counter argument either. The fact is, there is on screen proof a Constitution was in use in TNG. The circumstnaces are unknown, but your speculation is no better than anyone else's, and doesnt change the fact.
here we go again the caps represent only a dialog to the game part.
No one in this thread is saying they dont like the ship. they are fine with the ship being in game. We are saying for the most part that as the ship goes its a warp 7 capable ship and its nice for a lt and hell even a lt cmdr position. if you want to keep it on then just upgrade its parts internally. do not expect it to go up against a bigger and more advanced ship though. Starfleet saw the logic in making better and bigger ships to go faster and handle the tech of the century.
I do know what fuels this want now though, Games been out for over a year. Connie has been in the game for over a year and only now we get this wanting fuel for a T5 supper "connie". Kinda like the laugh that the federation had carriers like the klingons. You see in cryptic money scheme to want to cash in on people wants by bringing the nx class into the game even though you havent seen one on screen for over 200 years lol. People got it mixed up in their head that starfleet would bring back any ship and if they do why not make it a ubber admiral ship.
Ya see an engineer would know that these ships can not forefill the role of an admirals part because they are limited in size and capability, not to mention warp power. I do blame some of this on cryptic for giving you guys the false sense of star trek ship design as well as no penalty. An admiral would not truthfully fly in this ship. They are a great assest and to loose one is well dangerous. I mean gene did make sense when he approve these ship designs. CBS has made sense from the star trek design. I would hope cryptic would make sense when continuing on star trek ship design and abilities.
No one is against a connie being in game as it is there already, but we are against the notion that a connie should be a T5 with 8 weapon slots. That is what you guys are really arguing about. you dont want the connie you just want that ship to have 8 weapon slots 4 forward and 4 aft. You want it to have the ability of a defiant, sovey, galaxy, or interpid. Those ships desserve their part because theya re of the future and frankly way bigger then the connie in all respects.
What is this connie T5 going to do?
How is it conceived to be new when its old?
Where is it getting it power from to support T5 weapons?
You see you can upgrade the ship to mark XI gear so why cant you guys be happy with that. hmmm because its not about the ship or flying the ship. you just want it to be as bad as the sovey or any ship of its class in T5 area. No support of canon of a connie coming back into service for rear admiral use.
Where is your logical support for such a change besides i want iwhat i want and if i give money i should get what i want no matter if its logical or canon. I just want it because i am giving money for it.