Archer replaced by Assassin?

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Comments

  • Mikeymike - Harshlands
    Mikeymike - Harshlands Posts: 90 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Chronos - Raging Tide wrote: »
    Astoru and Aadi, you both said similar things.

    Yes, archers have masteries that raise damage that they do with bows and assassins dont, very true.

    Archers=Use bow which they can upgrade with masteries and they have skills that they can use to make it even more effective.

    Assassins=Use bow which they CANNOT upgrade with masteries ect. They also use daggers which they CAN upgrade with masteries ect.

    So, Archers and Assassins both have something that they can upgrade with masteries and use skills with, however Assassins CAN ALSO USE BOWS. While they cannot upgrade bows with masteries and use skills with bows, they already have a weapon that they CAN upgrade with masteries and use skills with.

    See what I'm saying?

    dude shutup god you'r an idiot archers are archers assassians are asassians. sins use daggers archers use bows now shut the hell up.
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Konariraiden - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Sin's can't be good DPS because they use LA...?

    Funny, because I thought Archers were amazing DD's...I guess I was wrong.

    i don't know what he is going on about x.x but he said fist bms are better dps cause they use heavy armor and you can't dps on a sin cause you use la

    doesn't make any sense lol
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    By this logic I shouldn't be able to hold aggro away from archers. But I tank and do. How do i do this if they have so much more dex per my str and crit than I do. Please explain and help me understand.

    if it's a same level archer and uses a proper weapon and proper ammo then unless he gives you a huge head start he should take agro

    so you tell me why he can't take agro
  • Konariraiden - Heavens Tear
    Konariraiden - Heavens Tear Posts: 6,505 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Lusca - Sanctuary wrote: »
    i don't know what he is going on about x.x but he said fist bms are better dps cause they use heavy armor and you can't dps on a sin cause you use la

    doesn't make any sense lol

    ...oh.

    Well, it's because fist BM's ARE a better DPS.

    But that doesn't exclude LA users from being good DPS. It's just...FIST BM's are RAEPFACE.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Yeah, it's me. Don't read to much into it, though; I'm only here for myself now, killin' time and chillin' when need-be. So sue me. Tch...
  • AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear
    AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,413 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Lusca - Sanctuary wrote: »
    if it's a same level archer and uses a proper weapon and proper ammo then unless he gives you a huge head start he should take agro

    so you tell me why he can't take agro

    Because I out damage.... b:kissb:victory
    Retired

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Quilue - Sanctuary
    Quilue - Sanctuary Posts: 5,787 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    fist bms have good dps because they have good spark coverage. because fists are so fast, bms can spark very often while archers cannot. archers will hit hard and crit often, but they simply don't have the attack speed (read: slowest physical weapon in the game).

    this is why fist bms can hold aggro, especially demon fist bms. (this is also why i hoped for archers to be able to use daggers b:chuckle)
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  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Because I out damage.... b:kissb:victory

    yes you out damage lvl 94 archers with gear just as good as yours, suuuure
    Konariraiden - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    ...oh.

    Well, it's because fist BM's ARE a better DPS.

    But that doesn't exclude LA users from being good DPS. It's just...FIST BM's are RAEPFACE.

    fine i give up arguing x.x my fist bm never made it past 30 anyway
    Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »
    fist bms have good dps because they have good spark coverage. because fists are so fast, bms can spark very often while archers cannot. archers will hit hard and crit often, but they simply don't have the attack speed (read: slowest physical weapon in the game).

    this is why fist bms can hold aggro, especially demon fist bms. (this is also why i hoped for archers to be able to use daggers b:chuckle)


    was fist bm vs sin not fist bm vs archer >=[
  • AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear
    AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,413 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Lusca - Sanctuary wrote: »
    yes you out damage lvl 94 archers with gear just as good as yours, suuuure

    Dragon Bane > hit > demon spark b:bye
    Retired

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Dragon Bane > hit > demon spark b:bye

    oh whatever i'm tired and really cbf'ed anymore i'll just wait till my sin hits 9x and find a fist bm with simular gear and test it x.x
  • Kedth - Sanctuary
    Kedth - Sanctuary Posts: 146 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Lusca - Sanctuary wrote: »
    i don't know what he is going on about x.x but he said fist bms are better dps cause they use heavy armor and you can't dps on a sin cause you use la

    doesn't make any sense lol

    Yeah, there's a small little detail tho... archers don't need to be hitted to DD while grinding. Sins do. So armor is important after all if u want to kill using DPS. Because the mob might not get near the archer with pure raw DPS, but its going to eat a sin only using DPS.

    So makes sense, a lot of it.
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Kedth - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yeah, there's a small little detail tho... archers don't need to be hitted to DD while grinding. Sins do. So armor is important after all if u want to kill using DPS. Because the mob might not get near the archer with pure raw DPS, but its going to eat a sin only using DPS.

    So makes sense, a lot of it.


    just cause i'm using la doesn't mean a mob will kill me before i kill it x.x
  • Kedth - Sanctuary
    Kedth - Sanctuary Posts: 146 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Nope, but u are not better at it than a BM. because the simple fact of his toughness. WHo can be hitted more? A HA BM with more HP and phys def? (a lot more of the second) or your sin?

    We are talking about being the "best" at it. Not being able to do it. U can DPS with a veno in foxform too... sucks compared to other DDs tho right?
  • MeiLin - Harshlands
    MeiLin - Harshlands Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    lol ok we have seen sin v archer and sin v fist bm. Any other classes wanna join the fight?
  • Konariraiden - Heavens Tear
    Konariraiden - Heavens Tear Posts: 6,505 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    MeiLin - Harshlands wrote: »
    lol ok we have seen sin v archer and sin v fist bm. Any other classes wanna join the fight?

    Wizards kill everything.
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  • Deceptistar - Sanctuary
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary Posts: 10,454 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Reading all the pages and this thread looks like a kiddies thread with low lvl new classes thinking they mastered everything there is to know at their lvl, and higher lvl old classes arguing about a class they havnt even seen the full potential off can or cannot outdo...
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  • Konariraiden - Heavens Tear
    Konariraiden - Heavens Tear Posts: 6,505 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Reading all the pages and this thread looks like a kiddies thread with low lvl new classes thinking they mastered everything there is to know at their lvl, and higher lvl old classes arguing about a class they havnt even seen the full potential off can or cannot outdo...

    As well as me just doin' my thing.

    b:cute
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Yeah, it's me. Don't read to much into it, though; I'm only here for myself now, killin' time and chillin' when need-be. So sue me. Tch...
  • Chronos - Raging Tide
    Chronos - Raging Tide Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Ok, so I've read over most of your responses (I didn't have time to read all of them), and I've concluded the following.

    -Archers own at long range using their bows
    -Archers suck at close range however they can still do damage
    -Assassins own at close range using their daggers
    -Assassins suck at long range however they can still do damage

    So pretty much I guess the classes have their own places and Assassins really are pretty useless at long range with bows, just as Archers are at close range. I think I see my mistakes.b:surrender

    EDIT: But what if an Assassin and Archer with equal equipment for their level fight each other? There's got to be a winner O.O
  • Ballistixz - Heavens Tear
    Ballistixz - Heavens Tear Posts: 690 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Konariraiden - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    ...oh.

    Well, it's because fist BM's ARE a better DPS.

    But that doesn't exclude LA users from being good DPS. It's just...FIST BM's are RAEPFACE.

    there not. ima give a simple reason to why. Sins are dex based and fist BMs are str based correct? as a result a sin will have a decently high crit ratio in higher lvls well well over the crit ratio of fist BMs. sins also have a skill to INCREASE there crit dmg by 30% AND crit rate by a %. a fist BM wont be able to out dps a sin at higher lvls because a sin will have to high of a crit rate and crit dmg ratio. but this is speaking as if both classes are using purely melee and no skills which is basically what u guys are making it out to be with the atk rate increases and such which is basically ur main argument.

    also we dont know demon skills for sin. u cant compare demon fist bm to a demon sin because we sins dont have/know our demon skills yet... we can very well have a skill that increases our atk rate and crit rate in demon even further.

    and are u guys REALLY trying to compare higher lvl fist BMs with low lvl sins that are not even in the 60s yet? (oracalers dont count...) u have no idea on what a sin can do in higher lvls compared to a fist BM so saying such things is not fair. but in a sins defense i will still claim that a sin can out dmg a fist BM because of there high crit ratios.
    Kedth - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Nope, but u are not better at it than a BM. because the simple fact of his toughness. WHo can be hitted more? A HA BM with more HP and phys def? (a lot more of the second) or your sin?

    We are talking about being the "best" at it. Not being able to do it. U can DPS with a veno in foxform too... sucks compared to other DDs tho right?

    thats a stupid and weak argument. ur saying just because a HA BM can tank they are better DPSers? wtf? where in the hell does tanking add to DPS in ANY ****ING MMO? also if u kill the mob faster then they can kill u what is the need for tanking at all unless ur fighting bosses? and if ur fighting bosses u should let a barb tank anyway -_- killing faster=less hit from the mob=less dying.
    Konariraiden - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    Wizards kill everything.

    psys own wizards :D (theres another argument for u guys)

    also one more thing i like to add that is from a interview straight from the directors of the game:

    What about the two new classes, the Assassin and the Psychic? How do they fit into the scheme of the game?

    In terms of the standard class archetypes for an MMORPG, the assassin will resemble a rogue class with stealth abilities and unparalleled damage. The Psychic is a magic based classed, focusing on buffs and debuffs. Both will be a great addition for grouping, and soloing. I think the Psychic especially will be a fun class to solo for the strategic player, as most of their skills depend on your ability to predict the movements and actions of your target.

    source: http://www.warcry.com/articles/view/interviews/6930-Rising-Tide-Perfect-Worlds-Latest-Expansion

    this is straight from one of the devs of PWI. so its obvious from his words that the sins in higher lvls will be among the best DDs in the game.
  • Cursedragon - Sanctuary
    Cursedragon - Sanctuary Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Lusca - Sanctuary wrote: »
    i don't know what he is going on about x.x but he said fist bms are better dps cause they use heavy armor and you can't dps on a sin cause you use la

    doesn't make any sense lol
    this guy = more stubborn than my gf before shes drunk
    = more clueless than parris hilton
    = less facts than Saturday Night Liveb:victory

    nah not completely, he made a valid point somewhere in this topic but theres some things that i guess he doesnt completely understand.

    but hey these not facts either so its not like im pouring gasoline on this fireb:chuckle
  • AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear
    AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,413 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Reading all the pages and this thread looks like a kiddies thread with low lvl new classes thinking they mastered everything there is to know at their lvl, and higher lvl old classes arguing about a class they havnt even seen the full potential off can or cannot outdo...

    At first I was just joking around. And I was being nice and asking the sin dude to prove his point but he never could. I am willing to hear and learn. But it seems as if everyone in this thread likes to just say stuff without facts...its funny. XD
    Retired

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Outlaw_Arch - Heavens Tear
    Outlaw_Arch - Heavens Tear Posts: 406 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    hmmmm archer vs sin..... this is a close call. sins have skils that can get them within attacking distance instantly. archers can increase trhier evasion and cast winged shell, giving themselves a good defece for a few seconds. during which time they could be charging one of close range attacks. seeings how they are both squishy and DDers it could very well end up in a draw. but in pvp the victor will be decided by who sees who first and attacks first if an archer sees a sin first, the sin is as good as dead:/ 2 normal shots made kill itxD if the sin sees the archer first and uses stealth, and bleed attack, it could spell death for the archer.


    but if i really had to pick i would go with archers. the mare fact that they are ranged DDer puts them at an advantage. they have sharptooth, and devastating single shot kills take aim and deadly shot they also have a stun ANF freeze and both of them have a high rate of success and have a long time of effect. and despite their squishyness, archers can have super defense in the form of winged shell. if a sin doesn't kill an archer in the first hit and the winged shell goes up, it's game over, archers have some ok close range skill that can take out a soft sin. a sins only hope is it's incradable bleed attack but with a geni skill or pot, that can easily be nagated


    but hey your taking to a guy who's sin is only level 22 i'm only basing this from what i see in the skills list.b:laugh
  • ArgentFire - Lost City
    ArgentFire - Lost City Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    I don't know if you guys notice but the move shadow jump allows the assasin to move across the map and be right next to the target.


    Since the archers have jack**** attacks from close range archer=dead
  • XXSayaXx - Lost City
    XXSayaXx - Lost City Posts: 57 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    LOL lusca u fail. ur sayin since sin same build as a archer it replaces them? so does my 81 zeal genie replace a veno? it can lure. does wizard replace ceric? its same build and has a healing spell o.O im a archer and i can tank fb 19-59 does that mean archers replace barbs?
    LOL i also went on sin killing spree today and so far there lil cloak skill fails, range sucks none of them rly hit me. so i was testing ur bow theroy and sin's r a disgrace for even trying to handel a bow.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Morty - Raging Tide
    Morty - Raging Tide Posts: 337 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    XXSayaXx - Lost City wrote: »
    LOL lusca u fail. ur sayin since sin same build as a archer it replaces them? so does my 81 zeal genie replace a veno? it can lure. does wizard replace ceric? its same build and has a healing spell o.O im a archer and i can tank fb 19-59 does that mean archers replace barbs?
    LOL i also went on sin killing spree today and so far there lil cloak skill fails, range sucks none of them rly hit me. so i was testing ur bow theroy and sin's r a disgrace for even trying to handel a bow.

    You went on a sin killing spree? and now your getting a boner over some kills?
    Your a noob and so are they. There either way lower level (Which would explain why there stealth failed) or there oracle noobs who don't know how to play. Either way you win both ways in being a noob.
    Now lets see you try to land 1 shot on a assassin of the same level, till then gtfo kthxbai.
    Is Now On Lost City Under The Name; Mortyy
  • Transcend - Lost City
    Transcend - Lost City Posts: 448 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    If you're on LC, PM me when you hit 9x please :)
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  • XXSayaXx - Lost City
    XXSayaXx - Lost City Posts: 57 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    lol didnt make myself clear enough. when i say that do u think i go kill low lvls?? uk how many high lvl sins there are? y would i say anything if all i did was kill low lvls? dnt talk **** if all u can do is call some1 a noob. O.o
    Who's the 91 sin im hearing bout? or is it more **** talkers?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Lusca - Sanctuary
    Lusca - Sanctuary Posts: 754 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Cursedragon - Sanctuary wrote: »
    this guy = more stubborn than my gf before shes drunk
    = more clueless than parris hilton
    = less facts than Saturday Night Liveb:victory

    nah not completely, he made a valid point somewhere in this topic but theres some things that i guess he doesnt completely understand.

    but hey these not facts either so its not like im pouring gasoline on this fireb:chuckle

    i shouldn't post on forums when i tired x.x lol
    AdvanceZero - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    At first I was just joking around. And I was being nice and asking the sin dude to prove his point but he never could. I am willing to hear and learn. But it seems as if everyone in this thread likes to just say stuff without facts...its funny. XD

    i can't prove it yet =[
    XXSayaXx - Lost City wrote: »
    LOL lusca u fail. ur sayin since sin same build as a archer it replaces them? so does my 81 zeal genie replace a veno? it can lure. does wizard replace ceric? its same build and has a healing spell o.O im a archer and i can tank fb 19-59 does that mean archers replace barbs?
    LOL i also went on sin killing spree today and so far there lil cloak skill fails, range sucks none of them rly hit me. so i was testing ur bow theroy and sin's r a disgrace for even trying to handel a bow.

    i never said sins will replace archers, learn to read will you >.>
    if you ever bothered to actually read you would know i don't think sins will replace archers and i think using a bow on a sin is stupid

    i just think when there are proper leveled sins that know how to use there class they are going to be a proper threat to archers
  • Ballistixz - Heavens Tear
    Ballistixz - Heavens Tear Posts: 690 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    XXSayaXx - Lost City wrote: »
    lol didnt make myself clear enough. when i say that do u think i go kill low lvls?? uk how many high lvl sins there are? y would i say anything if all i did was kill low lvls? dnt talk **** if all u can do is call some1 a noob. O.o
    Who's the 91 sin im hearing bout? or is it more **** talkers?

    U KILLED ORACLE NOOB SINS GOOD ****ING JOB MAN

    thumbs_up.png
  • toxicjesus
    toxicjesus Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    Assassin

    Pros
    • probably the strongest class in 1 on 1 situations against non-heavy armor
    • damage scales very high because of frequent and high crits and pure damage build
    • sneaky and fast because of stealth, teleport and speed skills, that somewhat compensate the melee range
    • pretty high hp for a dex class

    Cons
    • pain to play in PvE. Archer is so much more comfortable
    • melee
    • lacks AoE skills
    • lacks the ability to imbue elemental damage to attacks --> imho archers are more flexible
    • no tharptooth arrow.
    • male assassins look incredibly ****

    Archer

    pros
    • high range, frequent crits, high damage because of pure build
    • comfortable to play in PvE. Class with the second lowest need for potions behind veno, barely takes damage
    • can imbue elemental damage to physical attacks --> flexible
    • strong aoe spells + the strongest channeled aoe damage spell
    • sharptooth arrow --> archers > assassins in raids
    • not the ****** looking class anymore

    cons
    • pretty squishy
    • half damage in melee range
    • elemental damage doesn't scale withn attributes
    • kiting in this game is not really effective, because you have to decide to either use abilities and attacks OR move - at leat on PvP
    • only class that can't relly use crit arrows effectively


    Assassins will not replace archers in any way, nor will they devaluate them. They are superior in 1 on 1 PvP, but inferior in PvE.

    Edit: So the word '****' is ok, but it's superlative has to be censored?
  • Joshcja - Sanctuary
    Joshcja - Sanctuary Posts: 3,502 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    archer DPS

    sin spike

    / thread
    Gifs are hard to make work here

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