Caster Nirvana Talismans Qq V 2.0
Comments
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I'm just going to throw this out there and say...
The time difference is probably due to normal APS Nirvy squads have HF, Subsea and Tangling Mire. Yes casters have debuffs like Undine, EP, Cleric mag def seal thingy, the genie skill to increase fire damage that I cannot remember the name of and veno amp (if you can find one) and most likely if casters had 5.0 CPS they would be as fast.
Michael_Dark has just proved that a run can be done in under 10 minutes although not many squads have a 105 R9 wizard (most likely +10/12) hitting 118k crits QQ
You just have to remember: When YOU picked a caster, YOU already knew about the slow cast times and how slow they were.
Although I'm not happy about the caster nirvana glitch being fixed, I'm putting up with it because QQ'ing won't bring it back and if we get a glitch like this back people will demand that goons have their exp reinstated (which I wouldn't mind since leveling has become slower without full FF runs and the goons exp) but I would like a system where we as casters can do caster nirvana runs without having to need the talisman or still needing the talisman but take the timer off.
And before anyone starts to moan, I have all casters (apart from a nublet barb and seeker) and no APS characters.0 -
Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »It's not about refining it's about APS. Unrefined APS do much more damage, than unrefined caster.
And refined APS do 10x more damage than refined caster.
If it wasn't about refines, I would not see wc looking for people asking for +10 weapon links for both caster and normal.
If it wasn't about refines, I would not spend over 100 mil to just to link my +10 weapon for squads.
If it wasn't about refines, I would have stopped at +5 on my weapon.
If it wasn't about refines, I would not have bms/sins leave squad to go "shopping" because the person who formed only had a +6 weapon, and 2 minutes later ask if I want to go with them.
If it wasn't about refines, I would not see unrefined aps toons spend over half the time getting off the floor and getting ready to dd just to get killed by a random agro attack once they do come back.
If it wasn't about refines, I would see unrefined aps toons that could play agro tag with me.
-Chance of me surviving all the bosses in a +10 3 man aps squad 90%.
-Chance of me surviving all the bosses in a +6 5 man aps squad with me as the only +10 30%.
If it wasn't about refines, I would not skip Wurlord in 2-3 when I solo.
If it wasn't about refines, I would solo farm 3-2 and 3-3.
So yes it is about refines, yes it is about everyone being able to pull their own weight, yes you may call me an elitist for thinking that I want to run with people +6 5aps or on par with me at least if not better, but you can't call me a fool.
Also just because a person hit 5 aps does not mean money pours out of our *** when we sit down. We still have to work for it it's just easier to get.
On another note, earlier someone said **** caster squads take 45 mins am I correct?. Well guess what? **** normal nirvy squads can take longer then that so **** about it. They don't get increased drop rates and also take full squads to boot.0 -
Mr_Punkster - Dreamweaver wrote: »This is true...but aren't there less bosses to kill in a caster Nirvy?
Sure. But only 5 players do DD. Cleric healing.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Now imagine how fast it would be 5 +1 BM(5APS) 4APS sins with R9+12 daggers. Running to teleport NPC would be longer then killing boss.b:chuckleMrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »I'm just going to throw this out there and say...
The time difference is probably due to normal APS Nirvy squads have HF, Subsea and Tangling Mire. Yes casters have debuffs like Undine, EP, Cleric mag def seal thingy, the genie skill to increase fire damage that I cannot remember the name of and veno amp (if you can find one) and most likely if casters had 5.0 CPS they would be as fast.
Michael_Dark has just proved that a run can be done in under 10 minutes although not many squads have a 105 R9 wizard (most likely +10/12) hitting 118k crits QQ
You just have to remember: When YOU picked a caster, YOU already knew about the slow cast times and how slow they were.
Although I'm not happy about the caster nirvana glitch being fixed, I'm putting up with it because QQ'ing won't bring it back and if we get a glitch like this back people will demand that goons have their exp reinstated (which I wouldn't mind since leveling has become slower without full FF runs and the goons exp) but I would like a system where we as casters can do caster nirvana runs without having to need the talisman or still needing the talisman but take the timer off.
And before anyone starts to moan, I have all casters (apart from a nublet barb and seeker) and no APS characters.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »Now imagine how fast it would be 5 +1 BM(5APS) 4APS sins with R9+12 daggers. Running to teleport NPC would be longer then killing boss.b:chuckle
Running to the tele npc takes like 5 seconds if not less for insta kill squads.
Spark 3 seconds, 2 seconds for all the debuffs, 5 seconds to kill 10 seconds to kill if there is no hf?
We can assume 10-15 seconds a boss.
So ha I disproved your hypothesis.0 -
FanFon - Dreamweaver wrote: »Running to the tele npc takes like 5 seconds if not less for insta kill squads.
Spark 3 seconds, 2 seconds for all the debuffs, 5 seconds to kill 10 seconds to kill if there is no hf?
We can assume 10-15 seconds a boss.
So ha I disproved your hypothesis.
You are the reasons I dislike sins :P0 -
btw i think you are missing the main point: the main reason of these threads is that while non casters can log-in 5min each day, get the keys and do the runs any time they want (
2x) casters, not only have to do all the runs each day but also do 2 bh to get the last 2 keys.
so I think that when we are talking about profitability, you might want to multiple the non-caster profits by two...
for the record, I do believe that fixing the glitch was the right thing to doyou only purge once #yopo0 -
PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »so far my experiences were really nice
ofc there were a couple of runs with people with not so decent gear but there were also runs with r9+12s so on average it's ok. tbh, a challenging run once in a while can be fun.
ps: i love using my sage BoL ^^
ps2: i think that the main problem with ivy's run was skill and not gear; fortunately i havent run with a cleric that didnt know where the IH/BB button is XD
ps3: vampire boss can be a real pain, especially if people aoe like crazy, and you cant even see what's going on (lag doesnt help either). pretty chaotic
I was being sarcastic about the IH/BB button thing--this cleric rather played metal mage more than helping the other cleric when it was needed. If BB goes down, I think the smart thing to do to help the squad if you are a cleric is to have sparks ready to put another one up. Alternate the damn BB's, HEAL THE ****ING TANK! (I was tank for a good chunk of that run, outside of BB heals, I hardly got any--even BoL couldn't help me much as it's a 30 sec cooldown x.x)Censorship is the bane of creativity. Censorship is the bane of personality. Most of all...censorship is the bane of identity.
My main is Ivy_. I'm better known as Destini. Also known as _Yvi. Yes, I have an identity crisis. b:chuckle
Looking for a signature for this character. Wanna make me one?0 -
PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »btw i think you are missing the main point: the main reason of these threads is that while non casters can log-in 5min each day, get the keys and do the runs any time they want ( 2x) casters, not only have to do all the runs each day but also do 2 bh to get the last 2 keys.
so I think that when we are talking about profitability, you might want to multiple the non-caster profits by two...
for the record, I do believe that fixing the glitch was the right thing to do
A reasonable post at last!
Side by side the regular nirvana wins in all aspects. Casters do get better drop rates but with less boss's that take longer to kill and no ability to do a 99 key run at all. With that said, the timer on the talismans is the only real problem I think caster truely have.
(as I say that I did shake my head because we are a community of idiots and people would probably still complain about something)0 -
MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »You are the reasons I dislike sins :P
You are one of the reasons I made one0 -
FanFon - Dreamweaver wrote: »You are one of the reasons I made one
Then my work here is complete b:scorn0 -
MrMelvin - Heavens Tear wrote: »Then my work here is complete b:scorn
yes it isA reasonable post at last!
Side by side the regular nirvana wins in all aspects. Casters do get better drop rates but with less boss's that take longer to kill and no ability to do a 99 key run at all. With that said, the timer on the talismans is the only real problem I think caster truely have.
(as I say that I did shake my head because we are a community of idiots and people would probably still complain about something)
99 key quest plus increase drop rate......
i say drop the talis altogether and nerf the drop rates0 -
FanFon - Dreamweaver wrote: »yes it is
99 key quest plus increase drop rate......
i say drop the talis altogether and nerf the drop rates
How you want to decrease drop rate. Sometimes from 5 bosses we don't get even 5 cannies. So how you want to decrease? To 2 cannies per run to satisfy our ego?
And i don't like sin also. Huge of them are just totally morons. Fortunately as a physic I'm killing them quite easily comparing to mage.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »How you want to decrease drop rate. Sometimes from 5 bosses we don't get even 5 cannies. So how you want to decrease? To 2 cannies per run to satisfy our ego?
And i don't like sin also. Huge of them are just totally morons. Fortunately as a physic I'm killing them quite easily comparing to mage.
Whats a Physic, or a Mage for that matter?0 -
Digitalbleh - Sanctuary wrote: »I guess you never played before aps was big back when the tideborn patch came in. When you had to do a 30min+ nirvana, when uncannys where worth like 1m each.
And market prices are still dictated by merchants, who buy/sell gold, and set prices other merchants have to compete with. Not by normal everyday players trying todo nirvana to get coins or make gear.
As i said tho, the moral of my story is that this is a game, you do what you enjoy doing.. you can claim as much as you want that caster cant get into a normal nirvana. But the truth is they can and many do.
+1.. People take this game as if its real life and forget that its a game which is meant to have fun and be a stress buster away from real life, maybe they would realise it one day.0 -
TheDendra - Harshlands wrote: »You aren't that smart ain't ya? Because this was already explained in detail earlier. It has nothing to do with greed.
Problem is that it takes us 45mins to do what aps squad does in 5mins and the prices for that work are dictated by the aps classes. Nobody is stupid enough to waste time on such a run that brings virtually no profit.
Even if you are stupid enough to try doing normal nirvanas with casters, you will spend most of your time trying to find more stupid people to join your run. So no, normal nirvana is not an option for us, not even remotely. If you think it's us being lazy or greedy, why don't you play a caster for a few months and let me know how many normal nirvanas you managed to do+how much money you made - and then you'll realize you made less money in those x months than an aps class makes in less than an hour.
Only time a caster can do normal nirvana is if he has aps friends who are bored and bring him along. Other option is a bored old barbarian player who has all the time in this world to waste accompanied with his family members who don't mind wasting 1hour on a nirvana. Those are pretty much the only rare cases in which you'll actually do a normal nirvana as caster - and yes, you're better of grinding DQ or making money selling fc heads because both of those solutions will bring you more profit per hour, go figure (and obviously profit in both cases is pathetic, but hey that's the life of a caster in pwi!)
really? saying I am not that smart? have you read my posts? I don't run aps runs I run normal nirvana with casters I don't mind that a run takes longer and yes I have played a Caster in Caster Nirvana and you guys over exaggerate the problem with caster nirvana anymore is that most players don't know how to play their damn class and feel they should make up for that by swiping a credit card so people think that gear is the problem. b:bye
again read I am an aps bm but I prefer by far to play on my seeker infact I don't really play my bm anymore I just use it as an avatar for the forums.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ty Nowitsawn
Everything has its beginnings, but it doesn't start at one. It starts long before that... The world is born From zero. The moment zero becomes one is the moment the world springs to life. One becomes 2. 2 becomes 10. 10 becomes 100. taking it all back to one solves nothing. so long as zero remains... One.. Will eventually grow to 100 again.0 -
Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »How you want to decrease drop rate. Sometimes from 5 bosses we don't get even 5 cannies. So how you want to decrease? To 2 cannies per run to satisfy our ego?
And i don't like sin also. Huge of them are just totally morons. Fortunately as a physic I'm killing them quite easily comparing to mage.
Yeah but from what I hear average caster during 2x gets 3-5 raps. The average normal squad gets 1 rap during 2x and maybe sometimes 2. If you want spam able runs you should deal with normal amount of drops. I've done normal nirvys during normal rates and we got 3 cannies and a bunch of ****. Sounds like to me you want to have your cake and eat it to. What next do you want a special 99 key quest where you get 8 raptures and 20 cannies to make things fair?0 -
Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »How you want to decrease drop rate. Sometimes from 5 bosses we don't get even 5 cannies. So how you want to decrease? To 2 cannies per run to satisfy our ego?
And i don't like sin also. Huge of them are just totally morons. Fortunately as a physic I'm killing them quite easily comparing to mage.
You must not realize, it is not the sin that is the moron, its the one controling the sin that is the moron. If they are a moron as a sin they are on any char. On a side note, I have seen less than 5 cannies during a 2x run before, it was fail, but meh.
On to other things, I asked this before but got no reply or it was buried in qqness. If you take all the coins you make during 2x off time and add it up with coins you make during 2x, I think it will be pretty close to what melee's make during 2x which is when most fast squads run, which is what most of you compaire it to. I would like to see real numbers pls b:chuckle if you even canMarine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz0 -
FanFon - Dreamweaver wrote: »Yeah but from what I hear average caster during 2x gets 3-5 raps. The average normal squad gets 1 rap during 2x and maybe sometimes 2. If you want spam able runs you should deal with normal amount of drops. I've done normal nirvys during normal rates and we got 3 cannies and a bunch of ****. Sounds like to me you want to have your cake and eat it to. What next do you want a special 99 key quest where you get 8 raptures and 20 cannies to make things fair?
I agree with this. I would trade the extra drops for being able to do caster nirvy whenever i want and organize my squads. And well, normal nirvy with super 5aps squads may be faster and more profitable but caster nirvy will still be comparable and you can improve the profitability by improving your gear. In the end, 5aps follow a very specific build, with specific limitations and often have other armor for pvp; that should give them a pve farming advantage.you only purge once #yopo0 -
Salari - Raging Tide wrote: »You must not realize, it is not the sin that is the moron, its the one controling the sin that is the moron. If they are a moron as a sin they are on any char. On a side note, I have seen less than 5 cannies during a 2x run before, it was fail, but meh.
On to other things, I asked this before but got no reply or it was buried in qqness. If you take all the coins you make during 2x off time and add it up with coins you make during 2x, I think it will be pretty close to what melee's make during 2x which is when most fast squads run, which is what most of you compaire it to. I would like to see real numbers pls b:chuckle if you even can
Or maybe you're too much of a moron to figure out logic. I know dumb people struggle to understand simple cause and effects and see what they actually do, but have no fear they guy who posted right under you understood.
Oh qq you have a chance of getting ****, but you also have the chance to get a ridiculous amount of drops also. Outliers are always put aside because of their rarity. If it was a common thing that happened almost every other run I would not even bother changing the drop rate. Even if you did **** on drops the caster run can be spammed for more drops instead of having to dissolve your squad if my suggestion did happen.
Fuzzy made that point later on in this thread and I do agree with him.
This is a hypothetical number response though so do bear with me
Lets say 1 caster run during normal is = to 1 normal nirvy during 2x.
Therefor 1 caster run during 2x = to 2 normal nirvy runs during 2x.
The time between 2x events is about 1-2 months so lets say 6 weeks.
The average 2x even it 1-3 weeks long so lets say 2 weeks.
Lets assume this is a lazy caster (cause it is soooo hard to find a squad during normal rates) that does on average 1.25 (5 caster runs in 4 days)
Within 42 days a caster has done the equivalent of 52.5 normal 2x nirvy runs and then add that to the 2-3 runs a day they would do during 2x (using 2.5 as the average amount of runs) would add another 70 normal 2x equivalent runs runs.
You also have spare keys for 99 key quest.
You would do 87.5 runs and get the equivalent of 122.5 normal runs during 2x
These are some very conservative numbers. Casters that qq that they get less then a normal 2x run should shove it and take it as an average.
PotatoHeadQR - Dreamweaver wrote: »I agree with this. I would trade the extra drops for being able to do caster nirvy whenever i want and organize my squads. And well, normal nirvy with super 5aps squads may be faster and more profitable but caster nirvy will still be comparable and you can improve the profitability by improving your gear. In the end, 5aps follow a very specific build, with specific limitations and often have other armor for pvp; that should give them a pve farming advantage.
+10 -
Michael_Dark - Lost City wrote: »/facepalm
Not this idiocy again.
Comparing your horribly geared nubo squads to a 5 minute APS run is pure stupidity. What are you running it with a +2 90 weapon?
Caster Nirvana 7.5 minutes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fP7RCHq5ah4
Gear up and stop whining.
can u stop trolling????
THEY ARE ALL ****** +12 R9SSSSSS IDIOT.
IF U TAKE R9 +12 4 APS SINS IN NIRVANA U DO IT IN LESS THAN 4 MIN SO PLZ b:shutup . I don know how u got lvled up, maybe by glitch from 0-102 ...0 -
BlackMorder - Raging Tide wrote: »can u stop trolling????
THEY ARE ALL ****** +12 R9SSSSSS IDIOT.
IF U TAKE R9 +12 4 APS SINS IN NIRVANA U DO IT IN LESS THAN 4 MIN SO PLZ b:shutup . I don know how u got lvled up, maybe by glitch from 0-102 ...
maybe you should stop trolling? i see atleast 3 characters in there that aren't rank 9. b:bye[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
ty Nowitsawn
Everything has its beginnings, but it doesn't start at one. It starts long before that... The world is born From zero. The moment zero becomes one is the moment the world springs to life. One becomes 2. 2 becomes 10. 10 becomes 100. taking it all back to one solves nothing. so long as zero remains... One.. Will eventually grow to 100 again.0 -
BlackMorder - Raging Tide wrote: »can u stop trolling????
THEY ARE ALL ****** +12 R9SSSSSS IDIOT.
IF U TAKE R9 +12 4 APS SINS IN NIRVANA U DO IT IN LESS THAN 4 MIN SO PLZ b:shutup . I don know how u got lvled up, maybe by glitch from 0-102 ...
What language is this?
Goo goo gaa gaa? Nappy time for baby talker?
I may in fact be a troll but you are illiterate. As a troll, I can disappear, however, you can't fix your stupidity.
b:bye
P.S. You should feel lucky I even responded to you.I post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.0 -
b:laugh ROFL
I prefer to be unlucky and don't see your posts b:victory , you dont have to respond us here :P
go make a topic about how to kill a psychic b:laugh0 -
You can't even remotely compare 5aps squads to r9 squads in casters, why? Because a full 5aps char costs roughly 30-40mill more than a very good r8 caster gear does.
When you compare their money making capabilities, it's obvious aps is 10 times superior to casters.
Even if you get an op squad of r9s to do casters, they still won't do as many nirv runs as aps chars because they need to spend talismans - and even when it was glitched, you still had to spend 1talisman per run and after several runs you had to start looking for people with talisman so that you can do more runs.
So either way you look at it, we're at a serious disadvantage.
P.S. Price of one r9 covers an entire squad of 5aps chars, so how does that even compare? And even those r9s don't do normal nirvanas because they're ten times slower than a 5aps 4men runs, so go figure the ****** balance in this game.0 -
FanFon - Dreamweaver wrote: »Or maybe you're too much of a moron to figure out logic. I know dumb people struggle to understand simple cause and effects and see what they actually do, but have no fear they guy who posted right under you understood.
Just wow you trolled yourself on that remark b:chuckleMarine - Marshall - Raging Tides - Retired
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
DEMHEALSMAN - Dreamweaver
Yes, because people really need 900+ dex or 1000+ magic just for the lulz0 -
Try again b:bye If you add refines for caster r8 and 5 aps which also needs r8, the costs are significantly more for apsers.TheDendra - Harshlands wrote: »Because a full 5aps char costs roughly 30-40mill more than a very good r8 caster gear does.[SIGPIC]http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=14516063001&dateline=1364756666[/SIGPIC] Ty Silvy
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BlackMorder - Raging Tide wrote: »can u stop trolling????
THEY ARE ALL ****** +12 R9SSSSSS IDIOT.
IF U TAKE R9 +12 4 APS SINS IN NIRVANA U DO IT IN LESS THAN 4 MIN SO PLZ b:shutup . I don know how u got lvled up, maybe by glitch from 0-102 ...
Look closer.
The cleric running into the screen clearly has an R8 weapon. The other cleric is R9. Here you can see the human form veno who also clearly has an R8 weapon.I am Olba. Not Ol, not Baze nor Blaze. And even less would I go by Olblaze. Please, take a second to read a person's username.
If you see b:cute be sure to take a second, calm look at anything I said.0 -
most aps user's would take casters to normal nirvana (2-4apser's +2-4 caster and the runs are still quick) if the majority of caster knew how to play their toon properly in a normal nirvana run.
seriously why do casters feel the need to spread themselves all around the room, as far as they can from the boss so he just random agros to the 4 points of the compass, making everyone else spend more time chasing the boss than actually killing it and then they wonder why it takes a while or no one wants to take them0 -
Olbaze - Sanctuary wrote: »Look closer.
The cleric running into the screen clearly has an R8 weapon. The other cleric is R9. Here you can see the human form veno who also clearly has an R8 weapon.
This is just proof that people who watch that video don't know what they're talking about and don't play the game enough to even see that.
All they can do is QQ because they're horribly undergeared and bad players that others refuse to party with.idiot casters wrote:I gots +2 99 Glaive and I can't get VANNAH!!11! Damn those 2 minute APS runs! b:angryb:cryb:angryI post in forums. This one and others. That's why I post.0
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