Alright, so personally I don't really enjoy the fact that people have the ability to boot people for drops, but on the other hand I don't really care if they fix boot & loot. pretty much 99% of the people I associate with boot & loots. Like for instance one of my friends was running lostmauth 2 days ago with 2 of his friends and a horn dropped. They obviously had majority vote and they booted out the other 2 players so they could split the astral diamonds they will get from the horn between the three of them.
I think the majority people who complain about boot & looting are being cry babies to be honest. I run solo pretty much 60% of the time I have only been boot n looted once over the past month and that was because i was helping out this 4 man squad beat the dracolich, because they were begging me and they booted me as soon as he died, which was expected and fair play to them I guess. I'm smart enough to realize that when I see three people in the same guild or three people who look like they are in the same party to leave, because why risk wasting my time on running a dungeon with them if i'm only going to get booted for the drop? time is money my friends. it's honestly not that hard to find a guild of people to run with, because people are advertising for people to join their guild all the time. stop complaining and make some friends geez.
This person is the epiphany of what is wrong with the game. You shouldn't be allowed to play the game, and I consider why your parents bought you an xbox, because anyone who abuses social skills that badly, has a horrid social ability when dealing with people outside of your Summertime basement. If such a scenario existed on the street, you would be crying mama after someone removes a few teeth.
The comment above about a 10k minimum 'buy-in' and them dropping fast... yeah it terrible being that 10k GS. I am working to scrape together more GS and it takes time to build it in-game. Please be patient with me.
I have to confess, I was booted twice this past weekend. Better than the prior weekend. But the changes did not take affect. I was booted in less than 15 seconds of joining.
Off topic: Was disappointed to discover the Drake seals I am after were not in the dungeon run even though the description stated Drake but were in fact Pegasus, I think.
> @masteroga said: > My friends and I thought up a much better fix weeks ago, after 1 minute of brainstorming lol. > > 1) Can't initiate a VTK during combat > 2) Can't initiate a VTK while there is a loot roll going. > 3) Can't initiate a VTK after final boss is dead
At least start with this. If a person has not been in combat for the last 60 seconds, then enable to VTK them on point #1. This means anyone that doesn't want to be kicked can simply keep fighting and contributing DPS. I would add that the devs should also make it require a bit more action on the part of anyone to vote to kick also. Make sure it's not something that can be done accidentally (which I'm pretty sure my g/f and I have both accidentally agreed to kick people thinking it was a loot window or something).
sweet now I only have to wait for longer periods of time in between getting booted and for loot! thanks arc games for having 4 of my friends quit and soon to be me! ( now we can go play a game where the dev's actually care about us)
Why not just remove VTK altogether? All it does is cause problems. If you don't like your group composition from the start, leave. As for afkers, implement the pvp afk kick. Not that they're even an issue but people standing around not contributing could be auto kicked with a time since last combat check, or x amount of damage/healing/damage taken in x amount of time check.
I was loot kicked a couple days ago and lodged a complaint with Arc. A GM responded, but he basically said "sorry to hear that. Tough luck." Their ambivalence toward this problem is disturbing. If they are not willing to permanently repair the exploit itself, can't they discipline the abusers? They are rewarding the loot kickers by taking no action.
There are times when VTK is useful (perhaps even needed), however like anything that allows anonymity, abuse is going to happen, and folk will use it to there own advantage.
I have used it to kick a guy whose microphone was firing an awful grating noise. He was asked in chat and over the comms to turn off his mic, but didn't. The only time it lost the grating noise when he spoke, so he could talk. After a bit it got really really annoying so VTK was needed.
I have been kicked because "GS too low lol", "Never kill boss with your GS", "GS Lol, Enjoy Loading Screen" many times, despite having completed the delve before.
I have not as yet been loot booted, but look forward to that experience.
The biggest problem really is not the one who initiates the kick, but the sheep that follow. If there isn't a proper reason on why kick then I always select NO, but so many get kicked for "yyyy" reason.
I understand if you have wiped 2-3 times on a boss and perhaps the person getting kicked has been insta-floored every time, and frustrations are creeping in. So there is a reason to VTK (or perceived reason at least).
Browntj007 has a decent suggestion, though that seems like book keeping, perhaps have cooldowns on kicking rather than daily limits. The cooldown would reset to normal daily .
First VTK in an instance there is a 3 min CD before it can be used again. 2nd a 15 min CD, 3rd use 30 min CD, 4th use 1 hr CD, 5th 2 hr CD etc .
There are times when VTK is useful (perhaps even needed), however like anything that allows anonymity, abuse is going to happen, and folk will use it to there own advantage.
I have used it to kick a guy whose microphone was firing an awful grating noise. He was asked in chat and over the comms to turn off his mic, but didn't. The only time it lost the grating noise when he spoke, so he could talk. After a bit it got really really annoying so VTK was needed.
Or you could just mute them, the VTK actually wasn't necessary in your example there.
I understand if you have wiped 2-3 times on a boss and perhaps the person getting kicked has been insta-floored every time, and frustrations are creeping in. So there is a reason to VTK (or perceived reason at least).
This is the only real argument I can see for keeping VTK in place, and it's really somewhat of a self-solving problem. When you die, you're wasting gold (on injury kits) and time you could be spending actually doing a run. Not many people would stay that long knowing they're going to fail and waste more and more of their limited supplies. Then there's the fact that most dungeons can be done four manned anyway, one guy getting floored every time isn't too much of an issue.
Or you could just mute them, the VTK actually wasn't necessary in your example there.
/quote]
couldn't find the mute option from the player tile, so maybe it hidden somewhere in the game main menus.
> Or you could just mute them, the VTK actually wasn't necessary in your example there.
How do you mute a player?! I have been looking for that option and haven't been able to find it. I VTKed a player who was blasting music so loud I couldn't hear the game.
I do wish they would implement a no VTK during boss, only at campfire. I spent 2 hours only to be booted after boss death twice.
Although I have been looking at players and if there are 2 in the same guild I have been dropping the Dungeon. That has reduced my booting occurrence.
To reiterate what ambisinisterr mentioned, we are still actively discussing the vote kick situation. I know there are a lot of suggestions that are being submitted in regards to how we can improve the system. Our initial fix that adjusted the queue system and the kick mechanics were to address the situation where the system was being abused by a particular group that would vote kick profusely.
It's important that we make sure that system works as intended. I can't give any specifics on what will we be changed, but I wanted to make sure that you know we are listening to the comments on the forums, Twitter, Reddit, etc. Once we can confirm details, we'll definitely make sure the community is aware.
Call me Andy (or Strum, or Spider-Man)! Follow Neverwinter on Twitter: NeverwinterGame Like Neverwinter on Facebook: Neverwinter Follow me on Twitter: StrumSlinger
Press the View button (select) and select the party member, open up their xbl profile and select mute.
It would be nice to have something ingame rather than going that route though. It seems like it takes forever to load up the dashboard interface and be able to mute them. Something like, pressing A and having an option in the first menu to mute rather than having to go through player profile to mute.
Press the View button (select) and select the party member, open up their xbl profile and select mute.
It would be nice to have something ingame rather than going that route though. It seems like it takes forever to load up the dashboard interface and be able to mute them. Something like, pressing A and having an option in the first menu to mute rather than having to go through player profile to mute.
I agree, Castle Never isn't the best place to be zooming through screens and suchlike, a simple profile option to mute from the party member screen is what is needed.
To reiterate what ambisinisterr mentioned, we are still actively discussing the vote kick situation. I know there are a lot of suggestions that are being submitted in regards to how we can improve the system. Our initial fix that adjusted the queue system and the kick mechanics were to address the situation where the system was being abused by a particular group that would vote kick profusely.
It's important that we make sure that system works as intended. I can't give any specifics on what will we be changed, but I wanted to make sure that you know we are listening to the comments on the forums, Twitter, Reddit, etc. Once we can confirm details, we'll definitely make sure the community is aware.
A quick fix for the issue that requires no, zero, zip, zilch coding or anything changing on the developers end. Solicit the community to send in video proof of anyone kicking people when loot drops. From these videos DELETE their characters and BAN their Xbox Accounts. Get about a dozen or so of these tools and the rest of the community will be so scared to kick anyone that the VTK issue will disappear. As of right now these tools are only benefitting from kicking people since there is absolutely no repercussions for their actions. If they are severely punished for their actions they themselves will no longer be a problem since they are deleted and banned, but also their "friends" will be too fearful to do it themselves. And if they do.... Delete and Ban them too. I would think any reputable company would only want good quality people in their community anyways. So Deleting and Banning these tools would be no real loss to anyone that matters. And Xbox has a wonderful tool for recording the last 30seconds or so of what took place so the video proof would easily be available. And once again - Requires no additional coding by the company -
And let's be honest here. I'm sure more people would be happy that loot kickers were getting banned, resulting in many people returning to play, than people would leave because they were solving the issue.
what you may call stupidity i call take advantage of the situation with the cards dealt. i thought being in the military would make you smart to that tactic.
Don't place fault else where, it clearly reads you're contributing to the problem. So if the kick option is the card dealt, we are wrong for not taking advantage of it? And you take a crack at a prior military member. Warped!
My rules for using it follow:
Sitting idle for more than a minute.
Sitting at the start for more than a minute.
Running to the end and sitting at the end for more than a minute.
If someone shows disconnected and the server does not boot.
A minute is justifiable, to me, since so much ground can be covered in that minute but often it is longer than a minute when I initiate a kick.
Get the trend... no other reason for me to use kick. I will leave the game if its not my scene before I boot someone who might be having a grand time dying and trying.
> @snarfaholic said: > masteroga wrote: » > > My friends and I thought up a much better fix weeks ago, after 1 minute of brainstorming lol. > > 1) Can't initiate a VTK during combat > 2) Can't initiate a VTK while there is a loot roll going. > 3) Can't initiate a VTK after final boss is dead (This one is likely pointless, but I have been booted once before after loot roll was completed, but before getting chest...I mean...why? lol) > > THAT'S IT!!!! Fixes everything everything except people being jerks (Like booting you right outside the final bosses room or something), but so long as there's a boot system at all...there will still be jerks. I know there are channels on Twitch devoted to just booting people to make people mad.... > > > > > This guy, right here is genius. Penman solved. > > I was going to suggest a disclaimer at boss. "Players cannot be kicked from this point". > > If they fail the boss, VTK resumes. Some groups just suck and finding new players tend to be needed. > > I don't mind.... Okay I do. I hate being kicked period. But I don't mind, before the boss. > Booting me, to further your chance at getting the loot is to far. > > This is what developers need to work on. Because player base stats to drop at this type of thing. If I can't do a dungeon, I can't advance my gear score. If I can't do that, I'm eventually going to give up and quit. > Not me personally, but allot of people are easily defeated.
This^^^^. 1, 2, and 3 above will go a long way to solving this problem...just do it devs. It certainly can't be worse than the useless "fix" that was implemented. What are the valid arguments against this proposed fix? Anyone?
VTK system is ruining this game. I wish I wouldn't have spent money on Zen for mounts and companions before leveling up high enough to realize the VTK system won't let you progress further. HUGE ISSUE! Maybe a law suit against ARC is needed! Spent an hour just trying to get into one dungeon last night and got kicked at final boss loot drop twice!!! Time to switch to elder scrolls and enjoy gaming again!
1. They are clueless about their character and don't know how to build it right.
2. They are in a guild I know boot n loots a lot so i got to be safe
3. They are straight detriments
4. They constantly pick up green stuff.
5. they have music blasting through there headphones.
6. they spawn in right when an item is gonna drop and they did zero work.
7. we have a terribly built squad of lets say too much single target or too much aoe
8. they have too low gs to even attempt the dungeon.
9. they have boot n looted me in the past
10. they pull too much stuff. like in frozen heart these guys decided to be smart and pull the whole room and they ended up dying like 7 times each and i died once i was like omg these morons.
1. You don't get to decide how anyone else plays their character.
2. Trying to stop the problem by being the problem?
3. And you think kicking would solve that?
4. Green stuff is decent for refinement, once again, you don't get to decide how anyone else plays their character.
5. Muting is a thing.
6. Maybe you shouldn't have kicked the guy that did do work.
7. Nothing in this game requires a specific set up.
8. If they got in they have enough GS to attempt the dungeon.
9. Trying to stop the problem by being the problem?
10. Talk to them then, communication is key.
what you may call stupidity i call take advantage of the situation with the cards dealt. i thought being in the military would make you smart to that tactic.
Don't place fault else where, it clearly reads you're contributing to the problem. So if the kick option is the card dealt, we are wrong for not taking advantage of it? And you take a crack at a prior military member. Warped!
My rules for using it follow:
Sitting idle for more than a minute.
Sitting at the start for more than a minute.
Running to the end and sitting at the end for more than a minute.
If someone shows disconnected and the server does not boot.
A minute is justifiable, to me, since so much ground can be covered in that minute but often it is longer than a minute when I initiate a kick.
Get the trend... no other reason for me to use kick. I will leave the game if its not my scene before I boot someone who might be having a grand time dying and trying.
Lmao I've been playing solo all day. I can easily name 10 other thing to kick people for.
1. They are clueless about their character and don't know how to build it right.
2. They are in a guild I know boot n loots a lot so i got to be safe
3. They are straight detriments
4. They constantly pick up green stuff.
5. they have music blasting through there headphones.
6. they spawn in right when an item is gonna drop and they did zero work.
7. we have a terribly built squad of lets say too much single target or too much aoe
8. they have too low gs to even attempt the dungeon.
9. they have boot n looted me in the past
10. they pull too much stuff. like in frozen heart these guys decided to be smart and pull the whole room and they ended up dying like 7 times each and i died once i was like omg these morons.
And then there are these reasons...
For the majority of these, they don't affect me. Someone else's progression methods is not my concern unless it singles me out like a VTK. #5 is an easy fix so why list it. Much of what is listed is frustrating but it is the same for everyone else in Neverwinter/the room. If an attempt to help others help you does not work, I back out after trying to make it work. I will TRY and have gone through four or five lives before deciding I have contributed enough resources and time. There is a point you realize it will not work.
Communication is key and not talking does burden the experience.
For instance, last night someone was asking me to 'shop' via in-game chat. What the heck is that? I asked but the person had a fear of mics cause he/she would not talk back. The in game text chat irritates me, too slow for me.
#10, for me this is often the case. It is fun and challenging providing support. Yeah, pulling the entire scene is crazy. When I see it happen I know what I am up against and slide fully into the support role. What su cks is when everyone breaks up and having to support four clusters in a large scene will test your character's abilities.
[quote="scullarcher;12600443"][quote="singlesrvingfrnd;12600371"]VTK system is ruining this game. I wish I wouldn't have spent money on Zen for mounts and companions before leveling up high enough to realize the VTK system won't let you progress further. HUGE ISSUE! Maybe a law suit against ARC is needed! Spent an hour just trying to get into one dungeon last night and got kicked at final boss loot drop twice!!! Time to switch to elder scrolls and enjoy gaming again! [/quote]Neverwinter doesn't bad players like you who doesn't have the common sense to join a guild.
[/quote]
Why should I have to join a guild? Then make being in the guild part of the game. Some of us don't have countless hours a day to sit on NW form guilds just to play the game. We are busy being productive members of society who play video games to relax and have fun, not be forced to join a guild to avoid idiots like you.
You are all wasting your time typing to trollface, it's not going to do anything but keep spewing out its inane nonsense trollbait noise. While it may seem obvious it doesn't know anything, it's more obvious it's just trying to be inflammatory with the goal of making you argue with it. Either way, the best advice is don't argue with tards. Just like a lot of the bootnlooters; total trash that add nothing to the game, unless you're looking for greedy scum that if they can't be greedy, they kick you to make you angry. They're a waste. Don't bother. Just wait for Neverwinter to remove the exploits in the kick and loot bid systems so the slime can't abuse them any longer, and in the meantime just stop replying to this thing's pitifully transparent attempts.
Comments
This person is the epiphany of what is wrong with the game. You shouldn't be allowed to play the game, and I consider why your parents bought you an xbox, because anyone who abuses social skills that badly, has a horrid social ability when dealing with people outside of your Summertime basement. If such a scenario existed on the street, you would be crying mama after someone removes a few teeth.
I have to confess, I was booted twice this past weekend. Better than the prior weekend. But the changes did not take affect. I was booted in less than 15 seconds of joining.
Off topic: Was disappointed to discover the Drake seals I am after were not in the dungeon run even though the description stated Drake but were in fact Pegasus, I think.
.. Teucer (HR) / Maximus Decimus (DC) .. GT: ApexDemon
> My friends and I thought up a much better fix weeks ago, after 1 minute of brainstorming lol.
>
> 1) Can't initiate a VTK during combat
> 2) Can't initiate a VTK while there is a loot roll going.
> 3) Can't initiate a VTK after final boss is dead
At least start with this. If a person has not been in combat for the last 60 seconds, then enable to VTK them on point #1. This means anyone that doesn't want to be kicked can simply keep fighting and contributing DPS. I would add that the devs should also make it require a bit more action on the part of anyone to vote to kick also. Make sure it's not something that can be done accidentally (which I'm pretty sure my g/f and I have both accidentally agreed to kick people thinking it was a loot window or something).
I have used it to kick a guy whose microphone was firing an awful grating noise. He was asked in chat and over the comms to turn off his mic, but didn't. The only time it lost the grating noise when he spoke, so he could talk. After a bit it got really really annoying so VTK was needed.
I have been kicked because "GS too low lol", "Never kill boss with your GS", "GS Lol, Enjoy Loading Screen" many times, despite having completed the delve before.
I have not as yet been loot booted, but look forward to that experience.
The biggest problem really is not the one who initiates the kick, but the sheep that follow. If there isn't a proper reason on why kick then I always select NO, but so many get kicked for "yyyy" reason.
I understand if you have wiped 2-3 times on a boss and perhaps the person getting kicked has been insta-floored every time, and frustrations are creeping in. So there is a reason to VTK (or perceived reason at least).
Browntj007 has a decent suggestion, though that seems like book keeping, perhaps have cooldowns on kicking rather than daily limits. The cooldown would reset to normal daily .
First VTK in an instance there is a 3 min CD before it can be used again. 2nd a 15 min CD, 3rd use 30 min CD, 4th use 1 hr CD, 5th 2 hr CD etc .
Or you could just mute them, the VTK actually wasn't necessary in your example there.
This is the only real argument I can see for keeping VTK in place, and it's really somewhat of a self-solving problem. When you die, you're wasting gold (on injury kits) and time you could be spending actually doing a run. Not many people would stay that long knowing they're going to fail and waste more and more of their limited supplies. Then there's the fact that most dungeons can be done four manned anyway, one guy getting floored every time isn't too much of an issue.
How do you mute a player?! I have been looking for that option and haven't been able to find it. I VTKed a player who was blasting music so loud I couldn't hear the game.
I do wish they would implement a no VTK during boss, only at campfire. I spent 2 hours only to be booted after boss death twice.
Although I have been looking at players and if there are 2 in the same guild I have been dropping the Dungeon. That has reduced my booting occurrence.
To reiterate what ambisinisterr mentioned, we are still actively discussing the vote kick situation. I know there are a lot of suggestions that are being submitted in regards to how we can improve the system. Our initial fix that adjusted the queue system and the kick mechanics were to address the situation where the system was being abused by a particular group that would vote kick profusely.
It's important that we make sure that system works as intended. I can't give any specifics on what will we be changed, but I wanted to make sure that you know we are listening to the comments on the forums, Twitter, Reddit, etc. Once we can confirm details, we'll definitely make sure the community is aware.
Call me Andy (or Strum, or Spider-Man)!
Follow Neverwinter on Twitter: NeverwinterGame
Like Neverwinter on Facebook: Neverwinter
Follow me on Twitter: StrumSlinger
It would be nice to have something ingame rather than going that route though. It seems like it takes forever to load up the dashboard interface and be able to mute them. Something like, pressing A and having an option in the first menu to mute rather than having to go through player profile to mute.
I agree, Castle Never isn't the best place to be zooming through screens and suchlike, a simple profile option to mute from the party member screen is what is needed.
A quick fix for the issue that requires no, zero, zip, zilch coding or anything changing on the developers end. Solicit the community to send in video proof of anyone kicking people when loot drops. From these videos DELETE their characters and BAN their Xbox Accounts. Get about a dozen or so of these tools and the rest of the community will be so scared to kick anyone that the VTK issue will disappear. As of right now these tools are only benefitting from kicking people since there is absolutely no repercussions for their actions. If they are severely punished for their actions they themselves will no longer be a problem since they are deleted and banned, but also their "friends" will be too fearful to do it themselves. And if they do.... Delete and Ban them too. I would think any reputable company would only want good quality people in their community anyways. So Deleting and Banning these tools would be no real loss to anyone that matters. And Xbox has a wonderful tool for recording the last 30seconds or so of what took place so the video proof would easily be available. And once again - Requires no additional coding by the company -
And let's be honest here. I'm sure more people would be happy that loot kickers were getting banned, resulting in many people returning to play, than people would leave because they were solving the issue.
Don't place fault else where, it clearly reads you're contributing to the problem. So if the kick option is the card dealt, we are wrong for not taking advantage of it? And you take a crack at a prior military member. Warped!
My rules for using it follow:
Sitting idle for more than a minute.
Sitting at the start for more than a minute.
Running to the end and sitting at the end for more than a minute.
If someone shows disconnected and the server does not boot.
A minute is justifiable, to me, since so much ground can be covered in that minute but often it is longer than a minute when I initiate a kick.
Get the trend... no other reason for me to use kick. I will leave the game if its not my scene before I boot someone who might be having a grand time dying and trying.
.. Teucer (HR) / Maximus Decimus (DC) .. GT: ApexDemon
> masteroga wrote: »
>
> My friends and I thought up a much better fix weeks ago, after 1 minute of brainstorming lol.
>
> 1) Can't initiate a VTK during combat
> 2) Can't initiate a VTK while there is a loot roll going.
> 3) Can't initiate a VTK after final boss is dead (This one is likely pointless, but I have been booted once before after loot roll was completed, but before getting chest...I mean...why? lol)
>
> THAT'S IT!!!! Fixes everything everything except people being jerks (Like booting you right outside the final bosses room or something), but so long as there's a boot system at all...there will still be jerks. I know there are channels on Twitch devoted to just booting people to make people mad....
>
>
>
>
> This guy, right here is genius. Penman solved.
>
> I was going to suggest a disclaimer at boss. "Players cannot be kicked from this point".
>
> If they fail the boss, VTK resumes. Some groups just suck and finding new players tend to be needed.
>
> I don't mind.... Okay I do. I hate being kicked period. But I don't mind, before the boss.
> Booting me, to further your chance at getting the loot is to far.
>
> This is what developers need to work on. Because player base stats to drop at this type of thing. If I can't do a dungeon, I can't advance my gear score. If I can't do that, I'm eventually going to give up and quit.
> Not me personally, but allot of people are easily defeated.
This^^^^. 1, 2, and 3 above will go a long way to solving this problem...just do it devs. It certainly can't be worse than the useless "fix" that was implemented. What are the valid arguments against this proposed fix? Anyone?
1. You don't get to decide how anyone else plays their character.
2. Trying to stop the problem by being the problem?
3. And you think kicking would solve that?
4. Green stuff is decent for refinement, once again, you don't get to decide how anyone else plays their character.
5. Muting is a thing.
6. Maybe you shouldn't have kicked the guy that did do work.
7. Nothing in this game requires a specific set up.
8. If they got in they have enough GS to attempt the dungeon.
9. Trying to stop the problem by being the problem?
10. Talk to them then, communication is key.
And then there are these reasons...
For the majority of these, they don't affect me. Someone else's progression methods is not my concern unless it singles me out like a VTK. #5 is an easy fix so why list it. Much of what is listed is frustrating but it is the same for everyone else in Neverwinter/the room. If an attempt to help others help you does not work, I back out after trying to make it work. I will TRY and have gone through four or five lives before deciding I have contributed enough resources and time. There is a point you realize it will not work.
Communication is key and not talking does burden the experience.
For instance, last night someone was asking me to 'shop' via in-game chat. What the heck is that? I asked but the person had a fear of mics cause he/she would not talk back. The in game text chat irritates me, too slow for me.
#10, for me this is often the case. It is fun and challenging providing support. Yeah, pulling the entire scene is crazy. When I see it happen I know what I am up against and slide fully into the support role. What su cks is when everyone breaks up and having to support four clusters in a large scene will test your character's abilities.
...
.. Teucer (HR) / Maximus Decimus (DC) .. GT: ApexDemon
[/quote]
Why should I have to join a guild? Then make being in the guild part of the game. Some of us don't have countless hours a day to sit on NW form guilds just to play the game. We are busy being productive members of society who play video games to relax and have fun, not be forced to join a guild to avoid idiots like you.