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37k + HP GWF with 50% deflect . aka Sentinel build. Do you love it?

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  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    you described less than one percent of situations.when any normal decent class does a combo on you all matters. sure when max pimped out tene build hits combo its the same no unsstopable can save you if you dont pack tene hp build...k butt how often you play max pimped out tene build and how often regular folks where this would count....as i said i played them like 3,4 times(tene build gf) in i dont know had my bloodthirsty mont ago .lol

    This is so painfully incoherent it's like getting hit by a pure stream of consciousness. There is no telling where one of your thoughts ends and the other begins. Can you at least break up your sentences please?
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • llantissllantiss Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    rabbinicus wrote: »
    By short cooldown, do you mean how easy it is to fill the determination bar when you're taking (or if specced for it, dealing) damage? I'm not seeing how this is a problem since the mechanic seems to be WAI and is what lets a GWF be a very effective class.

    I mean by how easy it is to abuse it, all you have to do is activate it when opponent is doing their combo rotation, by the time their cooldown is off for a second round, you already built another unstoppable without losing any HP because of sent feats (you have high deflection / defense when not in unstoppable).

    This doesn't matter with other specs, I already mentioned why.
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    cribstaxxx wrote: »
    Lol bring your full dps GWF against my full tank, battle will last 4 minutes but I will kill you with 75%+ health remaining. Does number of kills win pvp? No capping and holding points does, so if I can sit on enemies 3 and hold it until they send 3-4 players (therefore losing 2) I just won the game for my team. Whereas you might kill 2 people and then die, and then those 2 respawn 10 seconds later and are right back in the fight.

    the battle would last 1 my combo with daily 10 sec
    have 2700 arm pen plus 16 con, greater plaq arm pen 34 crit 4000 power 25hp....sent build lol
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    gctrl wrote: »
    This is so painfully incoherent it's like getting hit by a pure stream of consciousness. There is no telling where one of your thoughts ends and the other begins. Can you at least break up your sentences please?

    it matters if unnstopables nerfed when playing normal folks.not when playing max pimped tene build.but you never play agains those plain enough
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    the battle would last 1 my combo with daily 10 sec
    have 2700 arm pen plus 16 con, greater plaq arm pen 34 crit 4000 power 25hp....sent build lol

    And I have almost 37k HP, 53% deflect, 1700+ regen ticks, my unstoppable heals me and I slot restoring strike. I guarantee you will lose, I have never been killed 1v1. I had a domination game where I fought another GWF on his #1 point just the 2 of us for about 5 minutes, I was still at 80% health and he was finally at 20% when my teammates came in and finished him. We spent 3/4 of the game just hitting each other at 1, really boring actually.
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • pando83pando83 Member Posts: 2,564 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    cribstaxxx wrote: »
    And I have almost 37k HP, 53% deflect, 1700+ regen ticks, my unstoppable heals me and I slot restoring strike. I guarantee you will lose, I have never been killed 1v1. I had a domination game where I fought another GWF on his #1 point just the 2 of us for about 5 minutes, I was still at 80% health and he was finally at 20% when my teammates came in and finished him. We spent 3/4 of the game just hitting each other at 1, really boring actually.

    How much do you have in regen? around 900-1k? If so, you should be in the range of 9%-10% regeneration, which means when it starts to heal for 1700, you're at 20k hp, right? (around 60% of your health).

    What's you power and armor penetration? How much damage from restoring strike?

    Also, since you're probably con/str, where the deflection comes from? How much in stats and skills to reach such value?

    (just trying to figure out the build since all the big guns who come here talking never care about explaining anything).
    So we can try to figure out what exactly could be adjusted to make the sentinel build more balanced (not unkillable), without affecting the Whole class.
  • aurorusborealusaurorusborealus Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    What really should be fixed is the dungeon exploit of pushing the mobs out of the map to rush to victory. That alone already kills the end-game PvE for GWFs, and should be fixed.[/QUOTE]


    I agree completely. All team builds for pve for many dungeons are just builds to get mobs pushed off cliffs faster and i TR to kill boss and smoke bomb.
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    cribstaxxx wrote: »
    And I have almost 37k HP, 53% deflect, 1700+ regen ticks, my unstoppable heals me and I slot restoring strike. I guarantee you will lose, I have never been killed 1v1. I had a domination game where I fought another GWF on his #1 point just the 2 of us for about 5 minutes, I was still at 80% health and he was finally at 20% when my teammates came in and finished him. We spent 3/4 of the game just hitting each other at 1, really boring actually.

    you would never hit me more than twice with no dps i will chain you all 4 or 3 hits every time you will fell them trust me...and you play the most boring type there is one trick pony i would even buff that type sent coz no one likes to play them
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    pando83 wrote: »
    How much do you have in regen? around 900-1k? If so, you should be in the range of 9%-10% regeneration, which means when it starts to heal for 1700, you're at 20k hp, right? (around 60% of your health).

    What's you power and armor penetration? How much damage from restoring strike? (just trying to figure out the build since all the big guns who come here talking never care about explaining anything).

    I will admit I do some quite low damage as I stacked all hp/regen jewelry/belt, am using reavers edge for hp/defense stats, and am using mostly defense slots with radiants. However I still have 24% crit with 29% on sure strike and flourish (feated flourish for extra stun) and with knockdown, flourish, restoring I usually take any squishy target to half or below. I usually crit restoring strike for about 4-5k, I still have decent ArP b/c I stacked con so I get 12% resistance ignored just from that. I think once I save up and get rank 8 radiants I can switch out reavers edge and titans knot for ancient's and get a decent damage boost.

    I fought a DC, CW and TR for about 2-3 minutes my last PvP and they finally just gave up and accepted that they weren't going to keep their 3 lol. I couldn't kill them either with constant DC heals, astral shield, and cc but with me keeping 3 of them busy my team easily capped and held 1 and 2.

    Edit: I have a little over 1200 regen, the only way I can see to get more is with the iceshard axe but again I don't want to lose the hp/defense unless I'm upgrading to ancient for more damage.
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • rabbinicusrabbinicus Member Posts: 1,822 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    What really should be fixed is the dungeon exploit of pushing the mobs out of the map to rush to victory. That alone already kills the end-game PvE for GWFs, and should be fixed.

    I agree completely. All team builds for pve for many dungeons are just builds to get mobs pushed off cliffs faster and i TR to kill boss and smoke bomb.

    That's not broken, there have been dev comments that tactical use of ledges and knockbacks is WAI.
    The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.


  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    it matters if unnstopables nerfed when playing normal folks.not when playing max pimped tene build.but you never play agains those plain enough

    You do not need BIS or max tenes to make the Sentinel GWF effective, the fact that you don't understand this shows your lack of experience and insight.

    And why do you keep saying "tene hp build"? Tenebrouses have nothing to do with this conversation and they have nothing to do with the survivability of a Sentinel GWF.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    gctrl wrote: »
    You do not need BIS or max tenes to make the Sentinel GWF effective, the fact that you don't understand this shows your lack of experience and insight.

    And why do you keep saying "tene hp build"? Tenebrouses have nothing to do with this conversation and they have nothing to do with the survivability of a Sentinel GWF.


    of course is effective all know me on server lol.but you want to nerf it how it would be effective then lol.

    "And why do you keep saying "tene hp build"? Tenebrouses have nothing to do with this conversation and they have nothing to do with the survivability of a Sentinel GWF. "


    of course they have you can only survive if you deal high dps agains gear maxed opponent.hp sent without tenes cant do that ever...in other words if you dont kill your opponent fast enough you are dead.
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    of course is effective all know me on server lol.but you want to nerf it how it would be effective then lol.

    "And why do you keep saying "tene hp build"? Tenebrouses have nothing to do with this conversation and they have nothing to do with the survivability of a Sentinel GWF. "


    of course they have you can only survive if you deal high dps agains gear maxed opponent.hp sent without tenes cant do that ever...in other words if you dont kill your opponent fast enough you are dead.

    Do you live in some magical land where number of kills win PvP? I would love to take my CW there...

    Point is holding points win PvP and sent with or without tene's is the very best spec to do that.

    A high damage GF could easily prone juggle your 25k HP with much less than BiS gear, but no GF (except maybe 7 gtene, don't know) can kill a well built sent spec from full to dead alone before he gets a chance to get up, unstoppable and heal.

    Knight's challenge, prone daily, lunging, frontline, cleave - Pop goes the GWF, even if you had 100% armor pen and a million power...
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • rabbinicusrabbinicus Member Posts: 1,822 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    "And why do you keep saying "tene hp build"? Tenebrouses have nothing to do with this conversation and they have nothing to do with the survivability of a Sentinel GWF. "

    Of course they do! A GWF who maxes HP at the expense of DPS and depends on multiple tene procs to compensate is one of the things I have seen people complaining about. Stacking HP at the expense of everything else gives GWF's very high survivability and the tenebrous damage is based off of HP. So high HP = high Tenebrous damage.
    The right to command is earned through duty, the privilege of rank is service.


  • pando83pando83 Member Posts: 2,564 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    rabbinicus wrote: »
    That's not broken, there have been dev comments that tactical use of ledges and knockbacks is WAI.

    Then here's my thought:

    GWF Worth in PvE, to me, is mostly his ability to deal AoE damage and AoE debuff. As said, rogues are the preferred single target DPS.
    Now, making purposely a mechanic that allow players to clear mob crowds just pushing them out of the map, clearly kills most of the GWF role in PvE. And this indeed caused the GWFs to be left out of the PvE end-game content. You can wait for ours and not being invited in any dungeon. And most people in chat recruit for parties composed of a CW, 2 DC, 1 rogue and 1 GF.

    Now, if it's not broken, it's indeed a very... not smart choice, to kill purposely the PvE role of a class.

    I've been in such a party before i hit 60 (when people were still inviting GWFs in dungeons): it was a speedrun with mobs being pushed to Death. Few fights in the parts of the map where there were no edges.

    Some people says "it's not true, GWFs still have a use in dungeons". Ok. Now then tell me why the common rule for dungeons has become the above party formation, to just "tactically" push mobs to Death and then let the rogue tank the boss.
    It's a fact that GWFs are generally left out of high level dungeons. It's really rare, not impossible but very rare, that a GWF is invited in a random dungeon run (may be if you have a guild it's different. But not everyone has a guild or a Group of friends that invite him to dungeons).

    If it's made on purpose, then how do they plan to do, to make the GWF useful in dungeons again?
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    I heard some of the new content is going to not be able to be tossed of ledges and have to be killed, perhaps GWF will excel in feywild dungeon
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    rabbinicus wrote: »
    Of course they do! A GWF who maxes HP at the expense of DPS and depends on multiple tene procs to compensate is one of the things I have seen people complaining about. Stacking HP at the expense of everything else gives GWF's very high survivability and the tenebrous damage is based off of HP. So high HP = high Tenebrous damage.

    He was quoting me, and the problem with Sent gwfs is not their damage from Tenebs, that is just icing on the cake.

    The problem is their survivability, which allows them to contest points solo and survive damage from multiple opponents at once, not to mention the fact that they can already get away with high mobility in dire situations (so even if you manage to bring them down to a life threatening state, they will still be alive and you've just sent a significant portion of your team to kill 1 person at 1 point <- basically the equivalent of forfeiting the game). Then they come back, rinse and repeat. You now have a player that directs the entire flow of the game and controls 1/3 of the map single handedly.

    This is why bringing up Tenebs is irrelevant to the conversation, contesting and holding points wins games, not damage potential or kills.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    gctrl wrote: »
    He was quoting me, and the problem with Sent gwfs is not their damage from Tenebs, that is just icing on the cake. The problem is their survivability, which allows them to contest points solo and survive damage from multiple opponents at once, get away with high mobility in dire situations (which rarely occur because sending multiple people to kill 1 person at 1 point is basically forfeiting the game), recover and come back to the point. Rinse and repeat.[/QUO


    grtenes is not the problem in hp sent build lol....you lost credibility right there
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    of course they have you can only survive if you deal high dps agains gear maxed opponent.hp sent without tenes cant do that ever...in other words if you dont kill your opponent fast enough you are dead.
    skenderija wrote: »
    grtenes is not the problem in hp sent build lol....you lost credibility right there

    So without greater Tenes the Sent build is nothing? but... tenes are not the problem with sent build?

    and you want to talk about credibility lol?
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    "grtenes is not the problem in hp sent build" lol....you lost credibility right there

    I will say this one more time: Holding and contesting points is what wins games, Damage potential and kills DO NOT.

    What allows a GWF to contest and hold a point by himself? BEING OVERLY TANKY.

    What makes a GWF overly tanky? Going Sentinel build and spamming Unstoppable.

    Do Tenebrouses allow someone with a lot of hp to do insane damage? YES.

    Does doing insane damage allow you to tank multiple attacks from multiple people without dying? NO.

    So, what do Tenebrouses have anything to do with being overly tanky? NOTHING.

    THE END.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • yokanaanyokanaan Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 151 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    Try to survive any dungeon without Unstoppable:rolleyes:
    And why my PvE GWF should be nerfed because of PvP?

    I never played PvP and never intend, I feel just fine with my PvE build - sometimes I survive, sometimes I don't. If you nerf Unstoppable what I'm gonna do as a melee damage dealer?

    Attacking any boss will result in dying so I will be even less valuable in party.

    Dungeons and Dragons was never meant to be a PvP game - its mostly PvE. And I have enough problems of surviving dungeons even with unstoppable. If GWF is so HAMSTER and epic why do we have problems to get into T2 dungeons?

    Unstoppable is my only reliable way to break free from some spells and survive when I'm taking too much damage from adds - and as we know every boss has billions of adds. Our only way of avoiding damage is Sprint (no comment...) or Unstoppable.

    If you really have so many problems with PvP GWF why don't you nerf Sentinel tree and some enchantments. TR got slight nerf, now you want to nerf GWF. And then you will think about GF and CW.
    Maybe DC will survive your critic. Maybe. There will be always something to nerf.
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    cribstaxxx wrote: »
    So without greater Tenes the Sent build is nothing? but... tenes are not the problem with sent build?

    and you want to talk about credibility lol?

    y thats what i said no problem at all this is the first thing and seckond there are no such builds for the 100 time maybe 3 guys on 2 servers on beholder is non if so he can say his name and i beat him one on one in 2 rotations
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    gctrl wrote: »
    I will say this one more time: Holding and contesting points is what wins games, Damage potential and kills DO NOT.

    What allows a GWF to contest and hold a point by himself? BEING OVERLY TANKY.

    What makes a GWF overly tanky? Going Sentinel build and spamming Unstoppable.

    What do Tenebrouses have anything to do with being overly tanky? NOTHING.

    THE END.


    LOL YOU dont get to say when it ends dude.how many gwf hp sent you have in a premades without tenes lol when they are not that important.only way to stay alive is to kill before gett killed who can you kill with no tenes lol.
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    y thats what i said no problem at all this is the first thing and seckond there are no such builds for the 100 time maybe 3 guys on 2 servers on beholder is non if so he can say his name and i beat him one on one in 2 rotations

    Oh wow you're on beholder? lol I would be happy to laugh while you try to kill me. I just assumed you were on a different server b/c all self proclaimed PvP kings seem to not be on beholder heh. my handle is @cribstaxxx

    Also my build is certainly not complete, I could get well over 38k HP, more damage, and better enchants but I'm still confident you won't be able to kill me
    skenderija wrote: »
    LOL YOU dont get to say when it ends dude.how many gwf hp sent you have in a premades without tenes lol when they are not that important.only way to stay alive is to kill before gett killed who can you kill with no tenes lol.

    Pretty much all classes except other GWF's, they just die so slowly with unstoppable. But even GF's go down fairly quickly once I get up from triple prone with 75% hp still.
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    only way to stay alive is to kill before gett killed who can you kill with no tenes lol.

    LOL, ok everyone we have a genius over here, apparently the way Sent GWFs stay alive is by killing people, not by tanking enormous amounts of damage. Common man, you just went full HAMSTER, never go full HAMSTER.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    gctrl wrote: »
    LOL, ok everyone we have a genius over here, apparently the way Sent GWFs stay alive is by killing people, not by tanking enormous amounts of damage.

    You are either delusional or being willfully ignorant at this point.

    you are delusional man coz everybody stays allive by killing its a dead match lollolololol and sent hp cant kill
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    you are delusional man coz everybody stays allive by killing its a dead match lollolololol and sent hp cant kill

    I stay alive vs. 2 players by /dancing and funny or distracting /say comments since my regen ticks for more health than they are removing.

    I generally have to do a few restoring strikes or unstoppable when it's 3+, but I can still throw out some witty comments...
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
  • gctrlgctrl Member Posts: 459 Arc User
    edited August 2013
    skenderija wrote: »
    you are delusional man coz everybody stays allive by killing its a dead match lollolololol and sent hp cant kill

    -_- Im done with you. You're either a brilliant troll or the most clueless person currently playing this game.

    I suggest everyone else not respond to this guy.
    Guild: Lemonade Stand | Server: Dragon (Original) | PvP Forever | 1og0s
    * TWITCH * YOUTUBE * MY GUIDES *
  • skenderijaskenderija Member Posts: 87
    edited August 2013
    cribstaxxx wrote: »
    Oh wow you're on beholder? lol I would be happy to laugh while you try to kill me. I just assumed you were on a different server b/c all self proclaimed PvP kings seem to not be on beholder heh. my handle is @cribstaxxx

    Also my build is certainly not complete, I could get well over 38k HP, more damage, and better enchants but I'm still confident you won't be able to kill me





    Pretty much all classes except other GWF's, they just die so slowly with unstoppable. But even GF's go down fairly quickly once I get up from triple prone with 75% hp still.


    see ya on beholder im so happy now
  • cribstaxxxcribstaxxx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 1,300 Bounty Hunter
    edited August 2013
    I will be on around 2-3 eastern time. That's a little over an hour from now. shoot me a PM or mail if you're on right now
    Guild Master of <Enemy Team>
    We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
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