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deistik
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 658 Bounty Hunter
Seriously? How many pots do I use in that compared to everyone else? How come when I'm specced for pure healing, I still can't heal myself very well?
I really feel like in a group, we should NOT have a debuff on ourselves, and we should NOT be the one class that has to use the MOST potions. Things get so chaotic in the later dungeons.
I just want a mechanic so that the more people you have in your group, the less the healing debuff is. I get that they don't want me to go solo a dungeon. But this is pretty detrimental to making people want to play a cleric.
I feel like I should be running 2 clerics always so I don't die... that's what I'm supposed to be for though.
Give players an appliable heal debuff so PvP takes skill to kill a cleric instead of "lol I can't heal myself, guess I die." Health stones shouldn't be the only way to heal myself, and currently, that's it.
Thoughts?
edit: as of 5/14/13 I've mostly respecced to as much Damage Resistance as possible. Why? Because we don't get <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in the DR department. DR just makes so much more sense over healing, since healing is really only helping the people that can take full advantage of it (every party member but yourself). DR doesn't have a pointless debuff on it, so that's what I'll stack until this is fixed.
I really feel like in a group, we should NOT have a debuff on ourselves, and we should NOT be the one class that has to use the MOST potions. Things get so chaotic in the later dungeons.
I just want a mechanic so that the more people you have in your group, the less the healing debuff is. I get that they don't want me to go solo a dungeon. But this is pretty detrimental to making people want to play a cleric.
I feel like I should be running 2 clerics always so I don't die... that's what I'm supposed to be for though.
Give players an appliable heal debuff so PvP takes skill to kill a cleric instead of "lol I can't heal myself, guess I die." Health stones shouldn't be the only way to heal myself, and currently, that's it.
Thoughts?
edit: as of 5/14/13 I've mostly respecced to as much Damage Resistance as possible. Why? Because we don't get <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> in the DR department. DR just makes so much more sense over healing, since healing is really only helping the people that can take full advantage of it (every party member but yourself). DR doesn't have a pointless debuff on it, so that's what I'll stack until this is fixed.
Post edited by deistik on
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In practice I felt this debuff degraded Healing Word as an altar / campfire replacement when levelng solo. At the same time at least divinity mode Forgemaster's Flame and Astral Shield still feel useful enough when solo. I hope this is not a bug and both spells are by design not affected.
Beholder
What Class Are You?
works as intended
As of now, I have a hard time saying if it's a problem. On the one hand I've rarely used potions while solo questing, but in dungeons and skirmishes I regularly end up at less than 50% health after a big fight while everyone else in the party is topped off from all my heals. With heals generating aggro on everything within a radius I'm always pulling add aggro, and people so rarely pay any attention to that fact as I dodge all over the fight. I don't mind tanking adds, but with the self-healing debuff continuing to do so later in the game (level 38 atm) will be untenable.
At first I felt the idea of "reduction by party size" a rather strange idea, but I can't think of any other way to address this issue.
It does happen. DPS Clerics are insane! Super glass cannons.
Clerics should have to use pots when they need a burst heal, not on cooldown. The heal debuff is too much.
You gain a +60% bonus to heal your allies.
Same effect, but quite the difference in initial perception.
I see absolutely 0 reason why the debuff should exist in PVE though, especially if they're going to leave the threat mechanics as they are currently.
This thread is about the mandatory debuff you get for -40% heals on yourself, regardless of which one you use.
It makes me sad
??
Beholder
What Class Are You?
Honestly the "Clerics have more gold" complaint is stupid anyway. Would anyone who is level 60 care in the slightest little bit if every cleric in the game was running around with 5,000,000 gold but they only had 50 gold?
I didn't think so.
Gold is useless except for potions, injury kits, and some crafting related stuff. Every level 60 I know has an abundance of gold and no use for it.
It would be interesting to see what dps players would say if all of their abilities were suddenly 40% less effective for no real reason.
Then make it a pvp only thing.
But in my experience in every game there is always more damage than healing, always more dps players than support players. So the healing has to be able to significantly outpace damage, otherwise the healer is just a punching bag and there's no point to being one in the first place.
I'm just going to start running 2 clerics and 3 rogues and just roflstomp everything since we all get healed!
So, 2 clerics are unkillable (since they don't get -40% heals on each other)?
Something like this would be fine for PvP only though.
after doing the epic grey wolf den boss tonight in a pug i'm pretty close to shelving my cleric. that fight is almost 100% unpuggable. the fact that 3 of the people in my group were all from the same guild is what saved us. you cant stop for a second to cast anything to build divine power, and the black dogs were hitting me for 14-18k each.
could only heal myself with pots. everything else too weak.
There's your answer. Solo content isn't hard enough to require health stones for any class and group content at high level requires a Cleric, which essentially means the other players in the party can do without the health stones. If you nerf Cleric self healing by a drastic number it creates a scenario where they are working their tail off to keep the group alive and need the health stones for themselves, which means more cash shop transactions.
This is the only possible reason I can think of for this debuff. I have been playing MMOs since UO and I can't recall a single time EVER in ANY of those games that a healer had a self-debuff on their heals - even in PvP. The way other games handled it was that damage outpaced healing so you had to constantly be on the defensive as a healer which meant you couldn't roflstomp everything in PvE or PvP. Sure, you could play the outlast game in PvP in some cases but that simply wasn't true in anything but 1v1s really and it took so long it wasn't even worth it in most cases.
That said, if they feel it is necessary for PvP balance, fine, do what you need to do, but it has no place at all in PvE content. Seriously, if I can solo dungeons as a Cleric how is that hurting anyone (not that I think you'd be able to solo high level dungeons even without the debuff, but I digress...). Actually, now that I think about it, I suppose that has something to do with it as well. They probably don't want geared Clerics going through and soloing dungeons to farm items they can sell on the AH which would possibly create an "imbalance" in the AD market which would in turn screw up their profits.
The more I think about it, the more I feel that the only reason this debuff exists, in PvE anyway, is monetary on their part. Personally, as much as I enjoy playing healer/support classes, this debuff is actually making me consider shelving the Cleric and just going with a Wizard or Rogue.
I'm not going to quit or whatever over it, I just feel like it's a completely unfair debuff that needs a second looking at. Meanwhile, guess I'll be buying more health stones.
*sigh*