I'm not sure why people think these changes aren't new player friendly. If you are a new player using R8 and R9s your item level and stats aren't really being impacted by your enchants. Given that the Mod won't go live in over a month, the devs have signaled that players who don't have enchants R10 or higher should start saving their AD to purchase the new R1 enchants when Mod 22 goes live. New players can purchase R1 enchants for 100K from Bradda. Given that you now have 4 offensive, 4 defensive, 1 utility, 1 bonus, 1 combat, and 1 companion enchant, that means a player only needs 12 enchants to be fully geared; that comes out to 1.2M AD over the course of a month, or roughly 40K AD/day. Anyone who plays the game at all can scrounge up 40K AD/day. Do that, and the new player will be *significantly* improved in both item level and stats vs where they are now with R8 & R9 enchants.
For us veteran players, I really appreciate the opportunity to continue to grow my character. Maybe wilbur and myself are the only ones who like the change, but I doubt it....
I like some of it. I don't like the reduction of all weapon and armor enchants to 6, and using 1 instead of both. Limits many aspects of the game. Changing the runestones to only 1 type for comps is also very limiting and is beneficial only to DPS and those who run augments. Being able to grow the character is one thing, removing essential, and to many, the most important aspects in the game, is not the definition of growth.
The price of Mark of potency rank 4 dropping to under 15k, cheaper than can be bought from from bazaar w/ discount this week and max vip. People are unsure if there will be a turn in for old marks, which are still sold, and on discount right now. The enchanting stones from dread ring are also dropping quickly. These were currency that many built up over years. Please announce if there is going a turn in, or what the plan is with things that are going to be made useless, or used a fraction of what they were before. Showing the lower usage, or not having a place at all, and not letting people know what they are going to get in return for this, is causing prices on live server to tank.
The two reasons you've given for introducing this change:
1. Feedback from players about the current lack of worth for enchantments 2. The need to introduce higher ranks for future mods
On reason 1, enchantments are currently almost worthless because you reduced the stats they give. It would be much easier to reverse this than introduce a totally new system.
On reason 2, I'd have to ask why? There's no logical reason to need to introduce higher levels, especially if you put them back to their old levels old effectiveness.
The reasons given are so thin as to be unbelievable - suggesting they are excuses and the real reason is something you do not wish to discuss.
Please Do Not Feed The Trolls
Xael De Armadeon: DC
Xane De Armadeon: CW
Zen De Armadeon: OP
Zohar De Armadeon: TR
Chrion De Armadeon: SW
Gosti Big Belly: GWF
Barney McRustbucket: GF
Lt. Thackeray: HR
Lucius De Armadeon: BD
There is no point of view since Mod 16 that we can talk about character progression, since the higher your Item Level becomes with the current items, the worse your statistics will be. I went to the preview and checked, what my character will be. Around 70-72k (with full mytics everywhere), as a DPS, im havin now <30% on defensive stats, plus I lost the armor enchantment too. HP and base damage increase doesn't compensates this. 90% of the party content is scaled and u get absolutely nothing for 5-10k more hp there. The plus-minus 10-15% defensive stat is visible for everyone. Until the combined stat is lower then the IL of the item, characters will get weaker. <b class="Bold">Thats a regression. Collars giving 50% combined rating of they IL, armor and weapon enchantment givin 0, others stuffs around 80-90%. Add all this together and your character stats keep goin down and down. Combined rating must top the IL of the item, after that we can start speaking about improvement and builds and planing a character.
The two reasons you've given for introducing this change:
1. Feedback from players about the current lack of worth for enchantments 2. The need to introduce higher ranks for future mods
On reason 1, enchantments are currently almost worthless because you reduced the stats they give. It would be much easier to reverse this than introduce a totally new system.
On reason 2, I'd have to ask why? There's no logical reason to need to introduce higher levels, especially if you put them back to their old levels old effectiveness.
The reasons given are so thin as to be unbelievable - suggesting they are excuses and the real reason is something you do not wish to discuss.
Well, it's all about money, it's that simple, and i'd guess they already have several different packages with new enchantments/runestones for the ZEN shop and ready to be released with Mod. 22...
And that would also explain why they haven't added those new enchantments/runestones to lockboxes or the Tarmalune Trade Bar Store, why give players a chance of getting their characters back into shape without having to pay more ZEN for it, right?
I do believe in killing the messenger...
Want to know why?
Because it sends a message!
12
arcanjo86Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,093Arc User
Feedback : This is going to be kept as short and clear as possible.
Overall, I don't see the change to refinement bad. In the end, we do end up with more stats in terms of offensive and defensive enchantments... Or rather, we would.
1. Currently blue enchants which we use to replace our rank 15s in total give less ratings than 8x Assassin's and cost to upgrade even one is massive, unless...
2. Motes. We have no info on those. Are there going to be different ranks of motes? Because it's like deciding between 1% and 100% chance, where 1% chance costs, once again, much more than the guarantee, further inflating the 100% mote's price.
3. Combat enchantment. It's absolutely the worst. No combined rating for a very minimal upgrade. Yes, minimal. Players have to account for 5k loss (with mythic combat enchant) in defensive, offensive and utility ratings. That means DPS players definitely lose 5k in all defensive ratings with zero compensation (HP is not a compensation) and 5% total from whatever their forte is providing. Before we at least had resistances from Fireburst or Barkshield... maybe even negation, now those were taken away.
What about scaled instances in this scenario? Some players will have barely same offensive ratings, with an augment, and while their HP will be scaled down, their defenses will also remain unchanged.
Once again, Combined rating is needed. We are at 75k item level on average now and look how my defensive ratings look like:
This is in fact a 5% loss in defensive stats compared to live that I just can't cover up. 10% more HP won't work for 25% defensive stats loss.
Edit:
To make it clearer on what I mean by loss of ratings rank 15s. Yes, we do gain item level... but again, it's a combined rating loss. It can be disregarded in terms of offensive/defensive enchantments. Bonus enchantment which provides 15% speed at maximum rank is only providing 60% of what we used to gain at max rank if we choose movement speed though.
have you tried the right augment companion with the right stats for you? fighting companion got nerfed to the ground when you loose the companion rune slots to add stats, the new enchantments combined rating values seem to low
The new meta will be to create a single set of enchants + alternates and transfer them from character to character as you play.
Annoying, yes. But a lot less costly overall.
All 12 of my characters have their own enchants. The only thing I used to move was the bondings after they made that free. The only things I move now are comp gear w/runes and collars.
They should also do the same thing with mount insignias and collars.
I'm sure I'll be repeating what many others have already voiced in whole or part but here's my viewpoint
It is obvious that lots of effort has been made to ensure that a player with Max Rank in every enchantment slot does not loose any IL etc by transitioning to the new system but at present it's a kick in the crotch to new or mid level players.
A new Rank2 choice box (600IL eqv to R15x3) is 60 Ench. Medallions which is what 3 R15's trade in for. A new Rank1 choice box (300IL eqv to R10x3) cost 30 medallions but you would have to trade in 30 R10's at 1 medallion each to get enough for a single new Rank1 making it impossible for a midlevel player to transition to the new system without either a significant loss of character development or spending AD.
Using my tank as an example, current TIL 37.6k, R9 Weapon and Armour Enchants, mix of R9 and higher other enchants. Of her 23 Enchants only 7 can be traded in and will yield 32 medallions so she can get 1 Rank1 choice pack to get an entry level combat Enchant. The 16 R9's give 1440 IL so to replace that she'd have to spend 500k at the sages shop for 5 enchants but this source does not include combat or companion enchants so to get a companion enchant she'd have to buy 28 medallions at 40k each to get a 2nd green choice pack. For this example to come out the other side of this core change with minimal loss of development and no upgrading she'd have to spend 1.62mil AD! This is not fair when the change is not optional.
The temporary Legendary enchants currently given are a lovely idea and demonstrate the potential of the new higher levels that will be achievable but offer a false boost as the trade in mechanism doesn't even allow you to retain your current item level if you don't have legendary quality everything already.
My suggestion to solve this would be come in 2 parts. Part1: Rank0 common quality BTC non upgradable permanent Enchants at 90% of the values of the New Rank1. This would give everyone a set of R9 equivalents as a transition base line - NO LOSS of progress for players even if they have nothing to exchange. Part 2: Change the scale on the Trade In values so 3 R10's can give enough medallions to purchase a Rank1 choice box enabling midlevel players who are part way through their character development to get like for like replacements.
The R10 cut off on all Trade Ins also means the Rank8 Weapon Enchants that were a reward in the Levelling Adventures cannot be exchanged, this will leave many new players with no combat enchantment at all. I have seen it suggested by another that whatever that reward gets replaced with should be made available to reclaim by all players who have completed the relevant adventure which I think is an excellent idea. Another option would be to extend the Trade In scale on Weapon/Amour enchants down to Rank8 so that reward does not become worthless.
I hope the Trade In system does get an overhaul to reflect the genuine issues so many players have voiced. I fear if it goes live as it stands it will reinforce the idea that NW has ceased to be a credible F2P/Pay for Perks choice.
So what you are saying is all out rank 9s are now useless in this new money grab? So the r9 barkshield, bronzewood and elven battle i got on my alt tank, that i spend millions of AD to buy is now worthless? Thank you once again for destroying our toons. And yes we get about 5k more IL, but the stats can't keep up so we actually drop in stats. 4k IL for a combat encantment? Come on man. And once again or defense seems to drop even more for dps. Im 60k now and spend hours of grunding and some money on Zen to get 15 myth insignia to balance the stats perfectly, and now we are screwed again. You dont even put all max rank enchantments out to grab and test on preveiw so we can actually see what to aim for at end game. You are getting so greedy i understand ppl are leaving the game, and Im pretty close to join them.
...and if they're willing to rip the storylines and locations out of the game and ignoring player loss and player pain they will think nothing of completely overhauling the enchant system and won't really listen to the players either. No amount of 'I'm never spending another $' is going to affect them one iota. They just do what the F they like. We are going to have to just wear whatever happens and adapt. They've made their attitude towards us more than obvious by now.
Apparently pointing-out the bleeding obvious is a 'personal attack'.
> @arazith07 said: > As it is on live now, rank 9s are super cheap anyways and basically useless now. I suspect that the new rank 1s will be just as ubiquitous. You really aren't losing anything as a new player by refining old low rank enchants and getting the new ones. You are trying to apply value that hasn't had value in years.
Well my barkshield, bronzewood and elvenbattle r9s are not cheap. I spent millions on those on my little tank i was building up to play other than dps. Those are now worth 0!
With all this ilvl power creep lately i expect very soon changes/nerfs in ilvl mech. It looks like you don't have a "big picture" what do you want with this game. Due to that you make rush decisions.
See the image below - on the new system I can choose to protect two resources with pres ward. When the upgrade fails one resource is chosen to be consumed. The pres ward is protecting the resource which is OK - but the 2nd pres ward is also consumed even though the enchanting stone would not be destroyed in this case. This in effect means we'll need to use up to 3 times more pres wards than before. Please fix it so that a ward is consumed only if the actual protected resource would be destroyed in the process.
I have seen a few posts about wards being consumed. My understanding is that you use wards to protect any portion that you want to protect and a ward on each warded material is consumed on failure. So having two wards in protects two of the three slots, meaning both wards disappear on failure in addition to the third slots cost being used because it was not warded. If you have one ward in, then you lose on ward and the material for the other two slots. Not sure why y'all think they would have multiple ward slots and only consume a ward from one slot on failure....
I have seen a few posts about wards being consumed. My understanding is that you use wards to protect any portion that you want to protect and a ward on each warded material is consumed on failure. So having two wards in protects two of the three slots, meaning both wards disappear on failure in addition to the third slots cost being used because it was not warded. If you have one ward in, then you lose on ward and the material for the other two slots. Not sure why y'all think they would have multiple ward slots and only consume a ward from one slot on failure....
That's because it doesn't make sense... In the current system you use 1 ward to protect multiple resources. In this new system it actually burns wards for protecting nothing.
Each attempt to upgrade should not burn more than 1 ward since it can only burn only 1 resource.
Im a veteran player and I like the way this new systems introduces further progression of my toon. Being able to progress further is a far better alternative than the stalemate that is the current enchantment system.
I don't mind progression either. There's some concern about the entry point of the new system and the amount of Coalescent Wards you need. The Wards alone make the new system a lot more inconvenient than the old one, because you can't progress a lick without them.
Some maths (hopefully I've got this correct). Assumptions 1. Assume VIP12 2. Bazaar sale prices 3. Have all Enchanting Stones and RP from normal gameplay 4. Have a R7 weapon/armour enchantment at 0 cost
To upgrade a R7 to R14 = 30xMop4, 25xMop5, 25xMop6 = 4.8million
Which just so happens to be the cost of 120 medallions which you get from trading in a R14 weapon/armour.
HOWEVER, that does not include the cost of Coalescent wards. The Zen store prices theese at 800 Zen (20% discont) = 600k AD So that's 600k * 7 Coals for R7->R14. Which is another 4.2million AD
When people are complaining about the "Marks of Potency" problem.....this is why.
That's because it doesn't make sense... In the current system you use 1 ward to protect multiple resources. In this new system it actually burns wards for protecting nothing.
Each attempt to upgrade should not burn more than 1 ward since it can only burn only 1 resource.
Oh wow this is major. Depending on the drop rates of Motes you are probably going to use Coals for Enchantments most of the time anyway, but spending more Pres Wards as well is ugly.
In that case they will be dirt cheap like r9's in a few months and all alts can actually get an upgrade from enchants at a low price.
Not sure it has to be lockboxes, but there should be a way to obtain entry level enchantments (maybe even Rank 0 item level 100 or whatever) from sources within the game. Mostly thinking Adventure Rewards here.
As a whole I don't see many issues with the new system for our higher-end toons (other than the loss of ratings when using the enchants with iL but no combine rating). At present there are only single-stat enchant equivalents, so it is logical that the iL from those will be more spread to all 15 ratings than the targeted stats people are wanting from the multi-stat enchants people are using. I suspect the multi-stats will eventually get covered as well based on comments about these being only a starting point.
For weapon/armor to one combat; while I would appreciate having an offensive and defensive option, a tank doesn't actually need offensive, and a good dps that knows how to dodge and stay out of the red does not typically need a defensive (although it is nice). As a rogue main, I rarely take damage except when there is no dodging it (like multiple attacks in ToMM). That being said, Lightning and Vorpal are heavily used currently and I feel should be available in the new system. I use a lightning for mob aggro-grabbing on my tank, and vorpal is my healer's go-to. I do like that they added the DR bonus to the defensive combat enchants, to mirror the damage boost on the offensives.
For alts (and more concerningly for newer players) that only have low-level enchants, there is an issue. If they don't have rank 9s, they are likely better off spending the 900k AD to purchase the off/def/util enchants from the Sage Shop at rank 1. This will keep them at the same iL. Keep in mind that new characters get a few thousand AD just running levelling content and low campaigns, to help boost their AD. The rank 9s are practically worthless now and I feel should not be given any trade value ... they are easily obtained and most of us just convert or donate them to guild coffers anyways, and if you're hoarding something worthless then you don't need to get value from something that essentially has none now. The exchange rates for other enchants should be modified to more closely reflect the iL, because a toon with just Rank 10s cannot even buy a single new enchant. I think a more fair exchange rate would be:
This would give the ability to get at least half of ones iL back without discounting the amount of work and effort we have all put into our R15s.
I like the idea of allowing us to set aside some enchants as "Account-wide", but I feel it should be limited. You should only be able to make the R1 and R2 account-wide, and while they should be upgradeable the RCA version should not be upgraded. It would also need to be tested to ensure that you can only claim one per toon per account-wide enchant.
As for MoPs, some form of trade would be nice, but not at the full WB price (since many of the people buying bunches bought as a gamble, and at a 40% discount between VIP and sale. I feel 50% of WB value is sufficient trade-in for MoPs. I do feel that this change should have hit preview before the sale, since it would have impacted what people bought. Sales that are impacted by changes should really be analyzed when deciding when to release the change information, and I feel this was a major failing on your part (and so soon after you did the same thing with Mastercraft maps during a GM discount).
Some maths (hopefully I've got this correct). Assumptions 1. Assume VIP12 2. Bazaar sale prices 3. Have all Enchanting Stones and RP from normal gameplay 4. Have a R7 weapon/armour enchantment at 0 cost
To upgrade a R7 to R15 = 30xMop4, 25xMop5, 25xMop6 = 4.8million
Which just so happens to be the cost of 120 medallions which you get from trading in a R14 weapon/armour.
HOWEVER, that does not include the cost of Coalescent wards. The Zen store prices theese at 800 Zen (20% discont) = 600k AD So that's 600k * 7 Coals for R7->R14. Which is another 4.2million AD
When people are complaining about the "Marks of Potency" problem.....this is why.
Was thinking about upgrading some Enchants in preparation of the new system, but I don't think it makes any sense. Just trading in what you have and buy the rest with AD (exchange, Sage Shop) is almost always the better option. Or buy Enchants from the AH, which already have adjusted to the 40k per medallion exchange rate.
For alts (and more concerningly for newer players) that only have low-level enchants, there is an issue. If they don't have rank 9s, they are likely better off spending the 900k AD to purchase the off/def/util enchants from the Sage Shop at rank 1. This will keep them at the same iL. Keep in mind that new characters get a few thousand AD just running levelling content and low campaigns, to help boost their AD. The rank 9s are practically worthless now and I feel should not be given any trade value ... they are easily obtained and most of us just convert or donate them to guild coffers anyways, and if you're hoarding something worthless then you don't need to get value from something that essentially has none now. The exchange rates for other enchants should be modified to more closely reflect the iL, because a toon with just Rank 10s cannot even buy a single new enchant. I think a more fair exchange rate would be:
This would give the ability to get at least half of ones iL back without discounting the amount of work and effort we have all put into our R15s.
I like the idea of allowing us to set aside some enchants as "Account-wide", but I feel it should be limited. You should only be able to make the R1 and R2 account-wide, and while they should be upgradeable the RCA version should not be upgraded. It would also need to be tested to ensure that you can only claim one per toon per account-wide enchant.
As for MoPs, some form of trade would be nice, but not at the full WB price (since many of the people buying bunches bought as a gamble, and at a 40% discount between VIP and sale. I feel 50% of WB value is sufficient trade-in for MoPs. I do feel that this change should have hit preview before the sale, since it would have impacted what people bought. Sales that are impacted by changes should really be analyzed when deciding when to release the change information, and I feel this was a major failing on your part (and so soon after you did the same thing with Mastercraft maps during a GM discount).
I posted about how you have to "invest" way more item level at the exchange on lower levels as well and am very supportive of this idea.
Wouldn't hold my breath about MoP. Back in the day the already devalued MoPs once (I think by 50% or sth) and never even cared to respond to the playerbase about it.
The new meta will be to create a single set of enchants + alternates and transfer them from character to character as you play.
Annoying, yes. But a lot less costly overall.
The meta of running alts has died with changing from salvage/toon to salvage/acc imo. It wasn't good to have many toons for a while, I guess. When I started playing it was good to have 50 toons+, but lately (or until I stopped playing) people that went for endgame (not that I would know) didnt tinker with too many toons if they didn't want to spend 24/7 on this show In theory, this would be nice - but they change the meta of enchs way too often for this to be cool
Refinement and Enchantments are undergoing some big changes. We read the feedback on enchantments not being meaningful enough in terms of item level and stats, and how the unslot cost was a tedious aspect of changing gear. We also had a wide variety of enchantments, but many were hardly used. We took that feedback and data, looked at the refinement system, and made changes we are excited to share with you.
No More Unslot Cost In the new refinement system there is no more unslot cost for enchantments. In fact, there are no more enchantment slots on gear. Instead, players now have an enhancement page on their character sheet. Add and remove enchants from this page with no cost.
The enchantment page has the following enchantment slots: 4x Offense Enchantments 4x Defense Enchantments 1x Utility Enchantment 1x Bonus Enchantment 1x Combat Enchantment 2x Overload Enchantments And on the Companion sheet you will find a slot for a Companion Enchantment
With these new slots come all new enchantments with higher item levels and some new options. There are 5 ranks to the new enchantments. Existing enchantments can be exchanged for the new enchantments at the antiquities dealer.
There is only one type of companion enchant with this change. It will increase companion damage or if it is an augment companion, it will increase the value of the bonus stats from that companion.
Exchange Cost New Enchantment Choice Pack Cost All Enchantments - Rank 1 30 All Enchantments - Rank 2 60 Combat/Companion – Rank 3 90 Combat/Companion – Rank 4 120
The current item level of a rank 15 enchant on live is 200. A rank 2 enchantment in the new system is 600 Item Level which is why it takes 3 rank 15s to convert into a rank 2.
Don’t have a lot of high level enchantments lying around to exchange? Not a problem! You can also buy the exchange currency directly with AD to get a head start on the new enchantments.
Preservation and Coal Wards
Preservation wards in the new system are the same items they’ve always been, but they are used slightly differently than before which we will discuss in the next section.
Coalescent Wards have a new icon and are now called Coalescent Motes, but are also the same items they were before and work in the same way.
There are new Motes as well which when used will add their percentage bonus to the chance of success. These motes increase the chance by 1%, 2%, 5%, 10%. The lowest tier can be bought in the refinement sage shop in PE. The other tiers can drop in dungeon end chests.
New Upgrade UI With these changes we also reworked the upgrade UI. In the past we had several different upgrade UIs depending on the item being upgraded and what items it turned into. We have combined all of this into a single UI that is universal to all items.
Each upgrade will have up to 3 components, each of which can be protected by a preservation ward. If the upgrade fails, 1 of the components is chosen at random to be destroyed, unless it is protected by a preservation ward which will get destroyed instead.
There is a percentage chance of success and a mote can be slotted to increase that chance, with a coalescent mote still raising the chance to 100%.
With this system there is no longer partial refinement point filling of an item. All of the refinement points are needed upfront and it goes directly into a chance to upgrade. Existing items with partial refinement points in them will have the refinement points refunded to the owner on login with these changes. If you are at max refinement points of 50,000,000 then you will need to spend some of that ahead of the update to receive the refunds.
Artifacts/Artifact Equipment If every item is now using the same refinement window, what does that mean for artifacts and artifact equipment? These items are no longer upgraded by ranks and instead are upgraded in full quality tiers each time. Some items received an item level increase during this change over.
Weapon/Armor Enchant Effects With these changes we have separated weapon and armor enchant effects from the enchantments. Instead we have added new slots to the appearance tab where you can slot both a weapon and an armor visual effect. Exchanging existing armor and weapon enchantments will also give you one of these matching effect items so you both have the visuals you had access to before and have new flexibility in how your character looks.
Will I have to figure this all out before I can play again? We realize changes of this size can be disruptive and may even feel overwhelming at first. To help with this and to let people play as they normally would when the update goes live, characters will get temporary enchantments equipped automatically. These enchantment have the item level of rank 4 in the new system and give a range of balanced stats. They last 7 days before disappearing, at which point you’d want to have exchanged your old enchants for new ones to take their place.
With this release to preview work is still ongoing and some things may not function as intended or may still have adjustments to values before going live.
Refinement and Enchantments are undergoing some big changes. We read the feedback on enchantments not being meaningful enough in terms of item level and stats, and how the unslot cost was a tedious aspect of changing gear. We also had a wide variety of enchantments, but many were hardly used. We took that feedback and data, looked at the refinement system, and made changes we are excited to share with you.
No More Unslot Cost In the new refinement system there is no more unslot cost for enchantments. In fact, there are no more enchantment slots on gear. Instead, players now have an enhancement page on their character sheet. Add and remove enchants from this page with no cost.
The enchantment page has the following enchantment slots: 4x Offense Enchantments 4x Defense Enchantments 1x Utility Enchantment 1x Bonus Enchantment 1x Combat Enchantment 2x Overload Enchantments And on the Companion sheet you will find a slot for a Companion Enchantment
With these new slots come all new enchantments with higher item levels and some new options. There are 5 ranks to the new enchantments. Existing enchantments can be exchanged for the new enchantments at the antiquities dealer.
There is only one type of companion enchant with this change. It will increase companion damage or if it is an augment companion, it will increase the value of the bonus stats from that companion.
Exchange Cost New Enchantment Choice Pack Cost All Enchantments - Rank 1 30 All Enchantments - Rank 2 60 Combat/Companion – Rank 3 90 Combat/Companion – Rank 4 120
The current item level of a rank 15 enchant on live is 200. A rank 2 enchantment in the new system is 600 Item Level which is why it takes 3 rank 15s to convert into a rank 2.
Don’t have a lot of high level enchantments lying around to exchange? Not a problem! You can also buy the exchange currency directly with AD to get a head start on the new enchantments.
Preservation and Coal Wards
Preservation wards in the new system are the same items they’ve always been, but they are used slightly differently than before which we will discuss in the next section.
Coalescent Wards have a new icon and are now called Coalescent Motes, but are also the same items they were before and work in the same way.
There are new Motes as well which when used will add their percentage bonus to the chance of success. These motes increase the chance by 1%, 2%, 5%, 10%. The lowest tier can be bought in the refinement sage shop in PE. The other tiers can drop in dungeon end chests.
New Upgrade UI With these changes we also reworked the upgrade UI. In the past we had several different upgrade UIs depending on the item being upgraded and what items it turned into. We have combined all of this into a single UI that is universal to all items.
Each upgrade will have up to 3 components, each of which can be protected by a preservation ward. If the upgrade fails, 1 of the components is chosen at random to be destroyed, unless it is protected by a preservation ward which will get destroyed instead.
There is a percentage chance of success and a mote can be slotted to increase that chance, with a coalescent mote still raising the chance to 100%.
With this system there is no longer partial refinement point filling of an item. All of the refinement points are needed upfront and it goes directly into a chance to upgrade. Existing items with partial refinement points in them will have the refinement points refunded to the owner on login with these changes. If you are at max refinement points of 50,000,000 then you will need to spend some of that ahead of the update to receive the refunds.
Artifacts/Artifact Equipment If every item is now using the same refinement window, what does that mean for artifacts and artifact equipment? These items are no longer upgraded by ranks and instead are upgraded in full quality tiers each time. Some items received an item level increase during this change over.
Weapon/Armor Enchant Effects With these changes we have separated weapon and armor enchant effects from the enchantments. Instead we have added new slots to the appearance tab where you can slot both a weapon and an armor visual effect. Exchanging existing armor and weapon enchantments will also give you one of these matching effect items so you both have the visuals you had access to before and have new flexibility in how your character looks.
Will I have to figure this all out before I can play again? We realize changes of this size can be disruptive and may even feel overwhelming at first. To help with this and to let people play as they normally would when the update goes live, characters will get temporary enchantments equipped automatically. These enchantment have the item level of rank 4 in the new system and give a range of balanced stats. They last 7 days before disappearing, at which point you’d want to have exchanged your old enchants for new ones to take their place.
With this release to preview work is still ongoing and some things may not function as intended or may still have adjustments to values before going live.
We welcome all feedback and bug reports.
how did u even come up with this idea.... did u even consider the player experience ,, his hard work, his time and his energy up to this level.. let me remind you if u really want money focus on improving the game rather than making it even worse. we understand this is a money game and u guys are greedy enough to think straight.. oh and btw today's RC is bugged .. if u even care about player feedback..
I'm not sure why people think these changes aren't new player friendly. If you are a new player using R8 and R9s your item level and stats aren't really being impacted by your enchants. Given that the Mod won't go live in over a month, the devs have signaled that players who don't have enchants R10 or higher should start saving their AD to purchase the new R1 enchants when Mod 22 goes live. New players can purchase R1 enchants for 100K from Bradda. Given that you now have 4 offensive, 4 defensive, 1 utility, 1 bonus, 1 combat, and 1 companion enchant, that means a player only needs 12 enchants to be fully geared; that comes out to 1.2M AD over the course of a month, or roughly 40K AD/day. Anyone who plays the game at all can scrounge up 40K AD/day. Do that, and the new player will be *significantly* improved in both item level and stats vs where they are now with R8 & R9 enchants.
For us veteran players, I really appreciate the opportunity to continue to grow my character. Maybe wilbur and myself are the only ones who like the change, but I doubt it....
I'll help clarify since there's confusion.
A brand new player, not digging through any other source, nor signing up for VIP, can right now get through the Leveling Adventures and the postgame Adventures, and come out with about 300k in AD, and 24k IL or so with the giveaway of mounts and companions, as well as insignia drops. Let's assume the new player is somewhat savvy enough to know about the Rank 5 Enchant Stone farm, and evokes daily for Enchants R3 & R4. Now, let's also assume they at least populate the RSQ and RDQ daily, but runs solo for now (about 20k AD/day on a casual grind). On those variables, a new player, right now, can amass rank 10 enchants without too much difficulty so long as they alternate AH buys between Pres Wards and even r9/10 enchants. The extra 2000 in IL gets them slightly better stats (Because they all have Combined Rating), and access to harder campaign contents of their choice.
Now, with Mod 22, while they can still retain that 24k IL gear and the 300K AD, and the RSQ and RDQ won't adjust (hopefully) to the new 100k IL scale, their enchant options are cut severely, to a fraction of what they'd need. Sure, the IL might be higher, but the Combined Rating will not be. They'll struggle even more with Campaign content than they would have under Mod 21. They'll look at the hill they have to climb, look at the 20k AD per day versus 100k AD/base enchantment, to say nothing of the massive mountain they'd have to climb to get to Legendary, let alone mythic status.
Keep in mind, there's no longer an option for Fey's Blessing drops, Dragon Horde RP drops, Hidden Bags to bolster gold, or Quartermaster drops to bolster RP/gold. And let's assume they're SUPER green, as opposed to have joined just this last year. Facing that kind of climb, getting demolished by trash mobs all over Avernus and Vallenhas, and having no good way to move toward at least the Juma Bags at a decent clip, do you think that player's going to stick around? Or do you think they'll shrug, uninstall, and move to, say, FFXIV?
Cause I'd put my money on them picking up a Dragoon helmet instead of a set of Rogue's knives.
Stats after change on an ALT that had 41,580 IL on Live:
- Had enough to get weapon enchant and bonus enchant - Lost about 80,000 Rating/60.5% Total across all stats - Actual Drop was slightly higher (by 100-300/0.25-0.75% than those listed below) in all but 2-3 cases. - Significant loss of HP and Damage
IL Drop by 3000 HP drop by 33,000 Dam Drop by 370
Power -9000/-7.5% Accuracy -5500/-3% Combat Adv -5000/-2% Crit Strike -7000/-6.5% Crit Sev -5000/-4%
Forte -5500/-2.5% Control Bon -5000/-2% Control Resist -5000/-2% Inc Heal -5000/-2% Out Heal -5000/-2%
AP Gain +0.2% Recharge Spd No Change Movement +6% (chose movement as bonus enchant) Stamina Regen No Change Mag Dam Boost No Change Phya Dam Boost No Change Gold Bonus No Change Glory Bonus No Change
- Spent a little resources leveling this one but not a lot, which is odd cuz another alt I that got all hand me down rank 9/10 enchants fared better in some aspects (worse in other - see below):
This is an Alt that had 39,929 on Live: - Did not have enough to get any new enchants - Lost about 69,500 Rating but gained about 19.5% Total across all stats - Large drop in HP and significant drop In Damage
IL Drop by 6,500 HP drop by 75,000 Dam Drop by 700
Power -9000/-2% Accuracy -5000/Gain 1% Combat Adv -5000/Gain 2% Crit Strike -5000/Gain 2% Crit Sev -5000/Gain 2%
Forte -5500/Gain 1% Control Bon -4000/Gain 2% Control Resist -4000/Gain 2% Inc Heal -4000/Gain 2% Out Heal -4000/Gain 2%
AP Gain No Change Recharge Spd No Change Movement -2% Stamina Regen No Change Mag Dam Boost No Change Phya Dam Boost No Change Gold Bonus No Change Glory Bonus No Change
- I don't care (much) about the actual changes, they are what they are, but I would at least like my toons to perform as they did before the changes without VAST differences in how the changes impact any given toon.
- Also concerned about having to choose between defensive/offensive weapon/armor enchantment - as DPS taking offensive is standard but this will greatly reduce survivability making DPS much more reliant on Healers who are focusing on keeping the tank up
I'm not sure why people think these changes aren't new player friendly. If you are a new player using R8 and R9s your item level and stats aren't really being impacted by your enchants. Given that the Mod won't go live in over a month, the devs have signaled that players who don't have enchants R10 or higher should start saving their AD to purchase the new R1 enchants when Mod 22 goes live. New players can purchase R1 enchants for 100K from Bradda. Given that you now have 4 offensive, 4 defensive, 1 utility, 1 bonus, 1 combat, and 1 companion enchant, that means a player only needs 12 enchants to be fully geared; that comes out to 1.2M AD over the course of a month, or roughly 40K AD/day. Anyone who plays the game at all can scrounge up 40K AD/day. Do that, and the new player will be *significantly* improved in both item level and stats vs where they are now with R8 & R9 enchants.
For us veteran players, I really appreciate the opportunity to continue to grow my character. Maybe wilbur and myself are the only ones who like the change, but I doubt it....
I'll help clarify since there's confusion.
A brand new player, not digging through any other source, nor signing up for VIP, can right now get through the Leveling Adventures and the postgame Adventures, and come out with about 300k in AD, and 24k IL or so with the giveaway of mounts and companions, as well as insignia drops. Let's assume the new player is somewhat savvy enough to know about the Rank 4 Enchant Stone farm, and evokes daily for Enchant 2 & 3. Now, let's also assume they at lest populate the RSQ and RDQ daily, but runs solo for now (about 20k AD/day on a casual grind). On those variables, a new player, right now, can amass rank 10 enchants without too much difficulty so long as they alternate AH buys between Pres Wards and even r9/10 enchants. The extra 2000 in IL gets them slightly better stats (Because they all have Combined Rating), and access to harder campaign contents of their choice.
Now, with Mod 22, while they can still retain that 24k IL gear and the 300K AD, and the RSQ and RDQ won't adjust (hopefully) to the new 100k IL scale, their enchant options are cut severely, to a fraction of what they'd need. Sure, the IL might be higher, but the Combined Rating will not be. They'll struggle even more with Campaign content than they would have under Mod 21. They'll look at the hill they have to climb, look at the 20k AD per day versus 100k AD/base enchantment, to say nothing of the massive mountain they'd have to climb to get to Legendary, let alone mythic.
Keep in mind, there's no longer an option for Fey's Blessing drops, Dragon Horde RP drops, Hidden Bags to bolster gold, or Quartermaster drops to bolster RP/gold. And let's assume they're SUPER green, as opposed to have joined just this last year. Facing that kind of climb, getting demolished by trash mobs all over Avernus and Vallenhas, and having no good way to move toward at least the Juma Bags at a decent clip, do you think that player's going to stick around? Or do you think they'll shrug, uninstall, and move to, say, FFXIV?
Cause I'd put my money on them picking up a Dragoon helmet instead of a set of Rogue's knives.
There is the problem. They want the new players, but listen to no feedback from them, or the player base they expect to help get them through randoms to get RAD. One of them main ways to tell a new player to earn AD was to farm dread ring for enchanting stones...which will now, not be the case. And to say the journey will be 32 coalescent wards, 10+ more if they have to start at rank 1, is not a good way to keep new players. The players like progress, building their toon/account, not waiting for an upgrade once a month, and struggling through content unless they drop coin for a small boost every $10.
Comments
1. Feedback from players about the current lack of worth for enchantments
2. The need to introduce higher ranks for future mods
On reason 1, enchantments are currently almost worthless because you reduced the stats they give. It would be much easier to reverse this than introduce a totally new system.
On reason 2, I'd have to ask why? There's no logical reason to need to introduce higher levels, especially if you put them back to their old levels old effectiveness.
The reasons given are so thin as to be unbelievable - suggesting they are excuses and the real reason is something you do not wish to discuss.
Xael De Armadeon: DC
Xane De Armadeon: CW
Zen De Armadeon: OP
Zohar De Armadeon: TR
Chrion De Armadeon: SW
Gosti Big Belly: GWF
Barney McRustbucket: GF
Lt. Thackeray: HR
Lucius De Armadeon: BD
Member of Casual Dailies - XBox
And that would also explain why they haven't added those new enchantments/runestones to lockboxes or the Tarmalune Trade Bar Store, why give players a chance of getting their characters back into shape without having to pay more ZEN for it, right?
It is obvious that lots of effort has been made to ensure that a player with Max Rank in every enchantment slot does not loose any IL etc by transitioning to the new system but at present it's a kick in the crotch to new or mid level players.
A new Rank2 choice box (600IL eqv to R15x3) is 60 Ench. Medallions which is what 3 R15's trade in for. A new Rank1 choice box (300IL eqv to R10x3) cost 30 medallions but you would have to trade in 30 R10's at 1 medallion each to get enough for a single new Rank1 making it impossible for a midlevel player to transition to the new system without either a significant loss of character development or spending AD.
Using my tank as an example, current TIL 37.6k, R9 Weapon and Armour Enchants, mix of R9 and higher other enchants.
Of her 23 Enchants only 7 can be traded in and will yield 32 medallions so she can get 1 Rank1 choice pack to get an entry level combat Enchant. The 16 R9's give 1440 IL so to replace that she'd have to spend 500k at the sages shop for 5 enchants but this source does not include combat or companion enchants so to get a companion enchant she'd have to buy 28 medallions at 40k each to get a 2nd green choice pack. For this example to come out the other side of this core change with minimal loss of development and no upgrading she'd have to spend 1.62mil AD! This is not fair when the change is not optional.
The temporary Legendary enchants currently given are a lovely idea and demonstrate the potential of the new higher levels that will be achievable but offer a false boost as the trade in mechanism doesn't even allow you to retain your current item level if you don't have legendary quality everything already.
My suggestion to solve this would be come in 2 parts. Part1: Rank0 common quality BTC non upgradable permanent Enchants at 90% of the values of the New Rank1. This would give everyone a set of R9 equivalents as a transition base line - NO LOSS of progress for players even if they have nothing to exchange. Part 2: Change the scale on the Trade In values so 3 R10's can give enough medallions to purchase a Rank1 choice box enabling midlevel players who are part way through their character development to get like for like replacements.
The R10 cut off on all Trade Ins also means the Rank8 Weapon Enchants that were a reward in the Levelling Adventures cannot be exchanged, this will leave many new players with no combat enchantment at all. I have seen it suggested by another that whatever that reward gets replaced with should be made available to reclaim by all players who have completed the relevant adventure which I think is an excellent idea. Another option would be to extend the Trade In scale on Weapon/Amour enchants down to Rank8 so that reward does not become worthless.
I hope the Trade In system does get an overhaul to reflect the genuine issues so many players have voiced. I fear if it goes live as it stands it will reinforce the idea that NW has ceased to be a credible F2P/Pay for Perks choice.
(edits to improve clarity)
> As it is on live now, rank 9s are super cheap anyways and basically useless now. I suspect that the new rank 1s will be just as ubiquitous. You really aren't losing anything as a new player by refining old low rank enchants and getting the new ones. You are trying to apply value that hasn't had value in years.
Well my barkshield, bronzewood and elvenbattle r9s are not cheap. I spent millions on those on my little tank i was building up to play other than dps. Those are now worth 0!
See the image below - on the new system I can choose to protect two resources with pres ward.
When the upgrade fails one resource is chosen to be consumed. The pres ward is protecting the resource which is OK - but the 2nd pres ward is also consumed even though the enchanting stone would not be destroyed in this case.
This in effect means we'll need to use up to 3 times more pres wards than before.
Please fix it so that a ward is consumed only if the actual protected resource would be destroyed in the process.
In the current system you use 1 ward to protect multiple resources.
In this new system it actually burns wards for protecting nothing.
Each attempt to upgrade should not burn more than 1 ward since it can only burn only 1 resource.
1. Assume VIP12
2. Bazaar sale prices
3. Have all Enchanting Stones and RP from normal gameplay
4. Have a R7 weapon/armour enchantment at 0 cost
To upgrade a R7 to R14 = 30xMop4, 25xMop5, 25xMop6 = 4.8million
Which just so happens to be the cost of 120 medallions which you get from trading in a R14 weapon/armour.
HOWEVER, that does not include the cost of Coalescent wards. The Zen store prices theese at 800 Zen (20% discont) = 600k AD So that's 600k * 7 Coals for R7->R14. Which is another 4.2million AD
When people are complaining about the "Marks of Potency" problem.....this is why.
[EDIT] Had put R7->R15 by accident.
As a whole I don't see many issues with the new system for our higher-end toons (other than the loss of ratings when using the enchants with iL but no combine rating). At present there are only single-stat enchant equivalents, so it is logical that the iL from those will be more spread to all 15 ratings than the targeted stats people are wanting from the multi-stat enchants people are using. I suspect the multi-stats will eventually get covered as well based on comments about these being only a starting point.
For weapon/armor to one combat; while I would appreciate having an offensive and defensive option, a tank doesn't actually need offensive, and a good dps that knows how to dodge and stay out of the red does not typically need a defensive (although it is nice). As a rogue main, I rarely take damage except when there is no dodging it (like multiple attacks in ToMM). That being said, Lightning and Vorpal are heavily used currently and I feel should be available in the new system. I use a lightning for mob aggro-grabbing on my tank, and vorpal is my healer's go-to. I do like that they added the DR bonus to the defensive combat enchants, to mirror the damage boost on the offensives.
For alts (and more concerningly for newer players) that only have low-level enchants, there is an issue. If they don't have rank 9s, they are likely better off spending the 900k AD to purchase the off/def/util enchants from the Sage Shop at rank 1. This will keep them at the same iL. Keep in mind that new characters get a few thousand AD just running levelling content and low campaigns, to help boost their AD. The rank 9s are practically worthless now and I feel should not be given any trade value ... they are easily obtained and most of us just convert or donate them to guild coffers anyways, and if you're hoarding something worthless then you don't need to get value from something that essentially has none now. The exchange rates for other enchants should be modified to more closely reflect the iL, because a toon with just Rank 10s cannot even buy a single new enchant. I think a more fair exchange rate would be:
R15 - 20
R14 - 17
R13 - 14
R12 - 11
R11 - 8
R10 - 5
R9 or lower - RP
This would give the ability to get at least half of ones iL back without discounting the amount of work and effort we have all put into our R15s.
I like the idea of allowing us to set aside some enchants as "Account-wide", but I feel it should be limited. You should only be able to make the R1 and R2 account-wide, and while they should be upgradeable the RCA version should not be upgraded. It would also need to be tested to ensure that you can only claim one per toon per account-wide enchant.
As for MoPs, some form of trade would be nice, but not at the full WB price (since many of the people buying bunches bought as a gamble, and at a 40% discount between VIP and sale. I feel 50% of WB value is sufficient trade-in for MoPs. I do feel that this change should have hit preview before the sale, since it would have impacted what people bought. Sales that are impacted by changes should really be analyzed when deciding when to release the change information, and I feel this was a major failing on your part (and so soon after you did the same thing with Mastercraft maps during a GM discount).
Wouldn't hold my breath about MoP. Back in the day the already devalued MoPs once (I think by 50% or sth) and never even cared to respond to the playerbase about it.
The meta of running alts has died with changing from salvage/toon to salvage/acc imo. It wasn't good to have many toons for a while, I guess. When I started playing it was good to have 50 toons+, but lately (or until I stopped playing) people that went for endgame (not that I would know) didnt tinker with too many toons if they didn't want to spend 24/7 on this show
In theory, this would be nice - but they change the meta of enchs way too often for this to be cool Did SF even work properly
A brand new player, not digging through any other source, nor signing up for VIP, can right now get through the Leveling Adventures and the postgame Adventures, and come out with about 300k in AD, and 24k IL or so with the giveaway of mounts and companions, as well as insignia drops. Let's assume the new player is somewhat savvy enough to know about the Rank 5 Enchant Stone farm, and evokes daily for Enchants R3 & R4. Now, let's also assume they at least populate the RSQ and RDQ daily, but runs solo for now (about 20k AD/day on a casual grind). On those variables, a new player, right now, can amass rank 10 enchants without too much difficulty so long as they alternate AH buys between Pres Wards and even r9/10 enchants. The extra 2000 in IL gets them slightly better stats (Because they all have Combined Rating), and access to harder campaign contents of their choice.
Now, with Mod 22, while they can still retain that 24k IL gear and the 300K AD, and the RSQ and RDQ won't adjust (hopefully) to the new 100k IL scale, their enchant options are cut severely, to a fraction of what they'd need. Sure, the IL might be higher, but the Combined Rating will not be. They'll struggle even more with Campaign content than they would have under Mod 21. They'll look at the hill they have to climb, look at the 20k AD per day versus 100k AD/base enchantment, to say nothing of the massive mountain they'd have to climb to get to Legendary, let alone mythic status.
Keep in mind, there's no longer an option for Fey's Blessing drops, Dragon Horde RP drops, Hidden Bags to bolster gold, or Quartermaster drops to bolster RP/gold. And let's assume they're SUPER green, as opposed to have joined just this last year. Facing that kind of climb, getting demolished by trash mobs all over Avernus and Vallenhas, and having no good way to move toward at least the Juma Bags at a decent clip, do you think that player's going to stick around? Or do you think they'll shrug, uninstall, and move to, say, FFXIV?
Cause I'd put my money on them picking up a Dragoon helmet instead of a set of Rogue's knives.
- Had enough to get weapon enchant and bonus enchant
- Lost about 80,000 Rating/60.5% Total across all stats
- Actual Drop was slightly higher (by 100-300/0.25-0.75% than those listed below) in all but 2-3 cases.
- Significant loss of HP and Damage
IL Drop by 3000
HP drop by 33,000
Dam Drop by 370
Power -9000/-7.5%
Accuracy -5500/-3%
Combat Adv -5000/-2%
Crit Strike -7000/-6.5%
Crit Sev -5000/-4%
Def -8000/-5%
Awareness -5000/-4%
Crit Avoid -5000/-2%
Deflect -5000/-2%
Deflect Sev -5000/-2%
Forte -5500/-2.5%
Control Bon -5000/-2%
Control Resist -5000/-2%
Inc Heal -5000/-2%
Out Heal -5000/-2%
AP Gain +0.2%
Recharge Spd No Change
Movement +6% (chose movement as bonus enchant)
Stamina Regen No Change
Mag Dam Boost No Change
Phya Dam Boost No Change
Gold Bonus No Change
Glory Bonus No Change
- Spent a little resources leveling this one but not a lot, which is odd cuz another alt I that got all hand me down rank 9/10 enchants fared better in some aspects (worse in other - see below):
----------------------------------------------------------------------
This is an Alt that had 39,929 on Live:
- Did not have enough to get any new enchants
- Lost about 69,500 Rating but gained about 19.5% Total across all stats
- Large drop in HP and significant drop In Damage
IL Drop by 6,500
HP drop by 75,000
Dam Drop by 700
Power -9000/-2%
Accuracy -5000/Gain 1%
Combat Adv -5000/Gain 2%
Crit Strike -5000/Gain 2%
Crit Sev -5000/Gain 2%
Def -8000/-2.5%
Awareness -5000/Gain 2.5%
Crit Avoid -5000/Gain 2%
Deflect -5000/Gain 1.5%
Deflect Sev -4000/Gain 2%
Forte -5500/Gain 1%
Control Bon -4000/Gain 2%
Control Resist -4000/Gain 2%
Inc Heal -4000/Gain 2%
Out Heal -4000/Gain 2%
AP Gain No Change
Recharge Spd No Change
Movement -2%
Stamina Regen No Change
Mag Dam Boost No Change
Phya Dam Boost No Change
Gold Bonus No Change
Glory Bonus No Change
- I don't care (much) about the actual changes, they are what they are, but I would at least like my toons to perform as they did before the changes without VAST differences in how the changes impact any given toon.
- Also concerned about having to choose between defensive/offensive weapon/armor enchantment - as DPS taking offensive is standard but this will greatly reduce survivability making DPS much more reliant on Healers who are focusing on keeping the tank up