And while some guy 'proved' CWs OPness by posting a video of a 4 CW and GF combo failing, the perma TR soloed the dungeon on his own, while the group or rightous and faithful DCs basked in their immortal glory while they stood in their empowered astral shield and burned the mobs down.
Did not happen? IMO more likely than a successful 5 CW combo.
Or as some ppl here like to post 'prove me wrong' the new state of the game seems to be 'make bolt claims and ask the other ones to prove you wrong'.
Maybe I should ask a BIS armor swapping SW with 5 epic companions to do some ATC on preview, do the same with my 22k CW, unslot augm and other companions, change all radiants to dark enchants and post the results claiming, that SW is OP in MOD 6. You say, that this is no valid source? But one post of a guy saying, that this 17k lvl 60 CW did double the dmg of his 17k lvl 60 SW on preview is enough to cause all the fuss. Did they have dps build, augmenting pets, HV set or dmg boosting companions? Who cares, they were lvl 60 and had 17k GS.
With the new "hard type" content, class balance goes even further out the window. The slow melee classes, i.e tanks, cant really take a hit from these insane mobs regardless of what kind of gear they have equipped. However, if the devs buff the tanks to a point where they can reliable handle hits from these monsters, then these same tanks will be OP in PVP 'cause nobody would be able to take them down, not even the rogues. So you see, its all broken beyond repair at this point.
note: like you can see, i dont want can tank with my destroyer. i want do a good damage (far superior to cw, of couse) AND HAVE SOME CLASS TO PROTECTME.
notes above: to me range classes dont have dodge (including dc) and stealth is just a big aggro reductor+damage bonus.
but dc/rogue dont represent a supremacy, is a temporary advantage. that kind of game dont will work.
Here's my idea (to increase survivability) in dungeons:
Two DC's can do almost perma astral shield.
One DC could be faithful. Other DC could be Virtuous or buff/debuff/dps righteous DC (because all DC can put down astral shield).
With two DC, there can be frequent hallowed ground, which is good protection and excellent damage buff.
2 DC's (or 1 DC + 1 OP or maybe 2 OP) + 1 or 2 GF/GWF/OP + 0 or 1 CW to groups adds together (especially archers) and for some control + 0 or 1 trapper HR (can spam fox cunning and root mobs) + 0 or 1 TR for smoke bomb and boss dps + 0 or 1 SW for dps and ?
Most of us CWees would be happy to give up that healing. That healing is so random and tiny that you can not depend on it. And being a CW is all about planning how much hits you can take before you need to move, how many spells you can cast before the mobs get to you or what mobs you can not control.
You wouldn't even need to give anything to replace the healing ability... just take the chance of it away and allmost all of us would be happy for it.
Most of us CWees would be happy to give up that healing. That healing is so random and tiny that you can not depend on it.
Its not tiny . Right now its 30k and on test 120k hp, its hardly random, you can spam storm pillar even wthout target. And that chaotic buffs dont have sync cooldown.. Thats pretty funny in pvp. I got beat up with 5k left (60k max on pvp) renegate run near and spams SP. Here you go buddy thats a CW healer for you
I don't quite understand why so many people get soooooo upset from the heal from Chaos Magic. I don't think anyone picked Renegade in Mod 4/5 because "OMG now my CW can heal!!!!" They picked it because the Renegade path overall was substantially buffed. The heal from Chaos Magic is a proc gated behind two layers of RNG (first the capstone has to proc, then you have 1/3 chance to get the heal proc). I suppose you can just spam Storm Pillar until you get the proc that you want, but I have never seen any CW just sit there spamming Storm Pillar because "OMG our team needs healz now!!!" They would be, you know, instead trying to control/kill the mobs that are hurting the team.
Incidentally CW is not the only DPS class that has group heals - HR's Oak Skin for example. Sure the heal is smaller but it is still "OMG DPS class has heals!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
This game is not based on a rigid class role structure. Every class has the capacity to do a little bit of everything. CWs and HRs have heal capabilities. GFs and DCs have DPS capabilities. TRs have CC capabilities. I think people need to realize this before getting totally outraged that a certain class doesn't fall within a person's rigid boundaries of what that class ought to be.
I suppose you can just spam Storm Pillar until you get the proc that you want,.
No, in combat situation you just do what you do and you proc it every 20 sec if im not mistaken. Dont pretend you are stupid. Cant you see 2 renegates and 1 dps dc on mid in Dom? I am suprised that no1 invented it before. Epic troll.
about the lasts posts i have some problem to understand if is a serious argument or just troll
every time have a different argument - liars and dishonest <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> - protecting cw. and aways diferent. cw is a fragile class? ia a tough class when need be tough? respond everthing just create a paralel discussion.
sooooooooooooo. lets back to the facts and the indivisible of this discussion: what class reign in this game since beta and NEVER have a bad module in pve?
the end. what is the cw playerbase/devs point? protecting this class even if cost the entire game?
i really can against this. the good sense is my limit.
I dont think so almost all of CW encounter and at-will have those its not lacking. Its range caster so whats the complain with the GWF and TR
but it cant be easy enough they should be able to cc lock ppl till they die after ,they should be able to ignore cc imune and dodge if cw can be so superior to everyone pve why it should not be the same in pvp? ......
People still comparing aok skin heals to 120k heals...
You are the second one in the forum i have to put in ignore for my health pointsman
So are DPS classes allowed to have the ability to do group heals, or not?
Because all I see are people running around saying OMG CW HEALS THAT'S NOT RIGHT. So what is not right about it if other DPS classes also have the ability to do group heals?
If your problem is with the MAGNITUDE of the heals and not with the ABILITY to heal, then that is a different question. So what amount of CW healing would you believe is appropriate, and why?
And the 4xCW 1xGF video from Mod 6 Gray Wolf Den only shows that if CW's attempt to do Mod 6 content playing in the style of Mod5 glass cannons, that they will struggle a lot and die often. That is all this shows.
Try it again with 1xGF, 1xMoF Oppressor CW, 1xSS Renegade CW, 1xTrapper HR and 1xFaithful DC. I bet you will have a much easier time.
So are DPS classes allowed to have the ability to do group heals, or not?
Because all I see are people running around saying OMG CW HEALS THAT'S NOT RIGHT. So what is not right about it if other DPS classes also have the ability to do group heals?
If your problem is with the MAGNITUDE of the heals and not with the ABILITY to heal, then that is a different question. So what amount of CW healing would you believe is appropriate, and why?
You go to a restaurant to eat delicious chef made food, this does not mean you cant eat <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> at home.
Don't make assumptions about a class you don't play and don't understand.
CW healing is not consistent enough to depend upon. It procs semi-randomly. If you purely rely on it to survive, you won't survive.
If stormspell is removed, CWs only source of damage goes bye bye. You are making these requests from a PVP standpoint, because you're a diehard PVPer. You need to understand that your requests should not have priority over those of PVE players. This is a PVE game, and should be balanced from a PVE standpoint. I really don't understand why any hardcore PVP player or guild would situate itself in this game, as its been stated that PVP is not a focus. If stormspell is nerfed, CWs will struggle to deal any damage at all in PVE, and with all the control immune and resistant mobs in the game, we wouldn't have a chance.
Your selfish and obnoxious PVP memememe first agenda has pissed off countless players, and has landed you on my list of "Players that don't care about the well-being of the game". And that list is quite short, it isn't easy to make it on.
Don't make assumptions about a class you don't play and don't understand.
CW healing is not consistent enough to depend upon. It procs semi-randomly. If you purely rely on it to survive, you won't survive.
If stormspell is removed, CWs only source of damage goes bye bye. You are making these requests from a PVP standpoint, because you're a diehard PVPer. You need to understand that your requests should not have priority over those of PVE players. This is a PVE game, and should be balanced from a PVE standpoint. I really don't understand why any hardcore PVP player or guild would situate itself in this game, as its been stated that PVP is not a focus. If stormspell is nerfed, CWs will struggle to deal any damage at all in PVE, and with all the control immune and resistant mobs in the game, we wouldn't have a chance.
Your selfish and obnoxious PVP memememe first agenda has pissed off countless players, and has landed you on my list of "Players that don't care about the well-being of the game". And that list is quite short, it isn't easy to make it on.
Enough said.
false assumption. i do play everyclass except gf and sw with at least 18k gs.
the ones listed below are the pvp only those for which im more or less known
said so, requests still unchanged
wait ... reduce the damage of a "non main striker class" and heal to a feat - not a encounter - is not only a demand for pvp. is a demand for pve. PVE
in terms of damage and utility, cw should be secondary IN PVE. P.V.E
a party with cws should have a poor/meh damage and a meh/ok survive to BEGGINING to speak abour balance IN PVE
And why should an AoE Damage/Control Hybrid class have poor damage in PVE? Where is it stated that CWs are not supposed to have high damage in PVE. I don't recall any official post stating that.
man its not hard ! storm spell must not crit and cw must not heal.
let s give aoe heals and critting shadow of demise to trickster rogue fun right?
right now cws have bugged multiproccing 100% crit storm spell which lead to very high damage while actively doing nothing for it.
while doing nothing stuffs get controlled.
always while doing nothing something procd healing a whole party for 120k each member or giving 30% critical chance and armor pen and so on.
so with minimal button smashing we have a class that is a striker, a controller, 20 seconds out of 30 a buffer, 10 seconds out of 30 a healer.
no downtime in all of this.
no internal cooldowns.
the class with the higher number of encounters without target cap.
and everything is ok and balanced..
now wait for mod 6, on demand ice knife namely disintegrate hitting every 5 seconds and it will be even one of the best single target damage dealer.
"Control Wizards primarily focus on controlling the battlefield and dealing damage to a large number of creatures simultaneously. Because of the wizard's role as a controller, they possess more crowd control options than any other class. Their ability to deal high amounts of damage gives them the secondary role of striker. "
your damage should come to the "big cap", not big damage per target. the big acces to multiple targets, thanks to the controll <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>, HAVE THE DAMAGE CONSEQUENCE.
rogues: primary dps/secundary controller
"A rogue is a martial class with primary role of attacker. This rogue build relies on deception to attack enemies - slipping out of shadows - to deadly effect. The Trickster's unique combination of skills sets up this Rogue build to have a secondary role of controller."
Chaos Magic is overpowered.
Renegade CW is overpowered because CW should not heal
Let's change (nerf) Chaos magic to be same as righteous DC:
When you enter combat, you gain "Renegade". Renegade increases your damage by 40% and increases your cooldown by 40% for 25 seconds. After you have activated Renegade, you cannot benefit from it again for 60 seconds. Renengade will reactivate automatically when it is ready. Leaving combat cancels renegade and resets its cooldown.
How funny this is that there we have almost 40 pages about CWs who can be killed by every class during TRs enjoy their OP class for all module 5 and still will be op in mod 6
where is the part where not understood that the cw Heal is the simbol of a situation that has become ridiculous, and not only what making the cw itself ridiculous?
Comments
Did not happen? IMO more likely than a successful 5 CW combo.
Or as some ppl here like to post 'prove me wrong' the new state of the game seems to be 'make bolt claims and ask the other ones to prove you wrong'.
Maybe I should ask a BIS armor swapping SW with 5 epic companions to do some ATC on preview, do the same with my 22k CW, unslot augm and other companions, change all radiants to dark enchants and post the results claiming, that SW is OP in MOD 6. You say, that this is no valid source? But one post of a guy saying, that this 17k lvl 60 CW did double the dmg of his 17k lvl 60 SW on preview is enough to cause all the fuss. Did they have dps build, augmenting pets, HV set or dmg boosting companions? Who cares, they were lvl 60 and had 17k GS.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?866751-Correcting-some-CW-myths-Part-1-Shield/page29
in my last post i show how do a omelet about that (not a good omelet, but is a omelet).
oh, but destroyers will be op:
forget stacks and think about that kind of mechanical.
http://dnd4.wikia.com/wiki/Battle_fury_stance
note: like you can see, i dont want can tank with my destroyer. i want do a good damage (far superior to cw, of couse) AND HAVE SOME CLASS TO PROTECTME.
notes above: to me range classes dont have dodge (including dc) and stealth is just a big aggro reductor+damage bonus.
but dc/rogue dont represent a supremacy, is a temporary advantage. that kind of game dont will work.
Two DC's can do almost perma astral shield.
One DC could be faithful. Other DC could be Virtuous or buff/debuff/dps righteous DC (because all DC can put down astral shield).
With two DC, there can be frequent hallowed ground, which is good protection and excellent damage buff.
2 DC's (or 1 DC + 1 OP or maybe 2 OP) + 1 or 2 GF/GWF/OP + 0 or 1 CW to groups adds together (especially archers) and for some control + 0 or 1 trapper HR (can spam fox cunning and root mobs) + 0 or 1 TR for smoke bomb and boss dps + 0 or 1 SW for dps and ?
You wouldn't even need to give anything to replace the healing ability... just take the chance of it away and allmost all of us would be happy for it.
Its not tiny
Steel and Magic
Incidentally CW is not the only DPS class that has group heals - HR's Oak Skin for example. Sure the heal is smaller but it is still "OMG DPS class has heals!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
This game is not based on a rigid class role structure. Every class has the capacity to do a little bit of everything. CWs and HRs have heal capabilities. GFs and DCs have DPS capabilities. TRs have CC capabilities. I think people need to realize this before getting totally outraged that a certain class doesn't fall within a person's rigid boundaries of what that class ought to be.
No, in combat situation you just do what you do and you proc it every 20 sec if im not mistaken. Dont pretend you are stupid. Cant you see 2 renegates and 1 dps dc on mid in Dom? I am suprised that no1 invented it before. Epic troll.
Steel and Magic
every time have a different argument - liars and dishonest <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> - protecting cw. and aways diferent. cw is a fragile class? ia a tough class when need be tough? respond everthing just create a paralel discussion.
sooooooooooooo. lets back to the facts and the indivisible of this discussion: what class reign in this game since beta and NEVER have a bad module in pve?
the end. what is the cw playerbase/devs point? protecting this class even if cost the entire game?
i really can against this. the good sense is my limit.
I dont think so almost all of CW encounter and at-will have those its not lacking. Its range caster so whats the complain with the GWF and TR
but it cant be easy enough they should be able to cc lock ppl till they die after ,they should be able to ignore cc imune and dodge if cw can be so superior to everyone pve why it should not be the same in pvp? ......
- just like all the melee classes have an ICD on their temp HP feats.
Severe Reaction: When struck 15% chance to repel and fill 10% of stamina. Can only happen once per 30 seconds.
Boom. Now CWs can still be "tankier" via shield, and can keep control HOWEVER they lose the ability to perma dodge via shift.
You are the second one in the forum i have to put in ignore for my health pointsman
So are DPS classes allowed to have the ability to do group heals, or not?
Because all I see are people running around saying OMG CW HEALS THAT'S NOT RIGHT. So what is not right about it if other DPS classes also have the ability to do group heals?
If your problem is with the MAGNITUDE of the heals and not with the ABILITY to heal, then that is a different question. So what amount of CW healing would you believe is appropriate, and why?
Try it again with 1xGF, 1xMoF Oppressor CW, 1xSS Renegade CW, 1xTrapper HR and 1xFaithful DC. I bet you will have a much easier time.
You go to a restaurant to eat delicious chef made food, this does not mean you cant eat <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> at home.
My request is still the same,
Remove healing
Nerf stormspell
Dont let choas magic bonuses stack
Wont change
My request to you:
Don't make assumptions about a class you don't play and don't understand.
CW healing is not consistent enough to depend upon. It procs semi-randomly. If you purely rely on it to survive, you won't survive.
If stormspell is removed, CWs only source of damage goes bye bye. You are making these requests from a PVP standpoint, because you're a diehard PVPer. You need to understand that your requests should not have priority over those of PVE players. This is a PVE game, and should be balanced from a PVE standpoint. I really don't understand why any hardcore PVP player or guild would situate itself in this game, as its been stated that PVP is not a focus. If stormspell is nerfed, CWs will struggle to deal any damage at all in PVE, and with all the control immune and resistant mobs in the game, we wouldn't have a chance.
Your selfish and obnoxious PVP memememe first agenda has pissed off countless players, and has landed you on my list of "Players that don't care about the well-being of the game". And that list is quite short, it isn't easy to make it on.
Enough said.
|| Axios Guild Leader || Neverwinter Trade Forum Moderator || Infernal Paragons ||
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false assumption. i do play everyclass except gf and sw with at least 18k gs.
the ones listed below are the pvp only those for which im more or less known
said so, requests still unchanged
in terms of damage and utility, cw should be secondary IN PVE. P.V.E
a party with cws should have a poor/meh damage and a meh/ok survive to BEGGINING to speak abour balance IN PVE
And why should an AoE Damage/Control Hybrid class have poor damage in PVE? Where is it stated that CWs are not supposed to have high damage in PVE. I don't recall any official post stating that.
|| Axios Guild Leader || Neverwinter Trade Forum Moderator || Infernal Paragons ||
Check out my foundry, titled "Akro's Gone Wacko", featuring our ex-CM Akromatik!: NW-DL8J7BY5T
Erza Moonstalker | Lara Moonstalker | Julie Marvell | Erza Moonhunter | Annie Hellangel | Jenn Moonstalker
Thaumaturge's Time To Shine: A Complete Guide
let s give aoe heals and critting shadow of demise to trickster rogue fun right?
right now cws have bugged multiproccing 100% crit storm spell which lead to very high damage while actively doing nothing for it.
while doing nothing stuffs get controlled.
always while doing nothing something procd healing a whole party for 120k each member or giving 30% critical chance and armor pen and so on.
so with minimal button smashing we have a class that is a striker, a controller, 20 seconds out of 30 a buffer, 10 seconds out of 30 a healer.
no downtime in all of this.
no internal cooldowns.
the class with the higher number of encounters without target cap.
and everything is ok and balanced..
now wait for mod 6, on demand ice knife namely disintegrate hitting every 5 seconds and it will be even one of the best single target damage dealer.
but it s ok its ok
your damage should come to the "big cap", not big damage per target. the big acces to multiple targets, thanks to the controll <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>, HAVE THE DAMAGE CONSEQUENCE.
rogues: primary dps/secundary controller
"A rogue is a martial class with primary role of attacker. This rogue build relies on deception to attack enemies - slipping out of shadows - to deadly effect. The Trickster's unique combination of skills sets up this Rogue build to have a secondary role of controller."
see the dam difference?
Only i think that SS should proc from encounters only?
Steel and Magic
Renegade CW is overpowered because CW should not heal
Let's change (nerf) Chaos magic to be same as righteous DC:
When you enter combat, you gain "Renegade". Renegade increases your damage by 40% and increases your cooldown by 40% for 25 seconds. After you have activated Renegade, you cannot benefit from it again for 60 seconds. Renengade will reactivate automatically when it is ready. Leaving combat cancels renegade and resets its cooldown.
Regards for Neverwinte community d(^.^)b