While the CW(s) complaining about sing from one in terms of their personal dps was wrong in my opinion, that should not mean nerfing CW's who need DPS for pvp or who provide DPS support in pve instances.
1 - the "defensive" cw control this time was not so high. he was more logistical. consisted to agroup enemies in a point and keep them there (nuke situation). one gwf with your off tank (some ranger with roots) aggregated as secondary reinforcement in this situation (I said secondary).
2 - cw damage were basically frontal. you could, and it was inconvenient when it did, losing a shard.
3 - the heroic cw feets were giving much more damage than was supposed. the problem is that the dev rushed a nerf and then ... well, you know.
4 - when I speak of a stack system for cw - ironically - I refer to some system, lengthy, inconvenient to the cw climb the mitigated a ridiculous basis damage (give cap/arc) for a competitive basis.
I refer to create a large "delay" in the performance in cw.
See 12:00+ first, then 13:46 (31K hit followed by 20K), 20K non crit at 18:40, and there is a 46230 crit at 14:55!
Get good, or pretty much shut up.
forget this guy, he is the kind of guy that just want that is choice to be the best choice and he probably think he is the best player in the world and when he lost it just because dev make unfair choice. if a feat was you loose 90% of your damage and get a purple estetic aura, he will take it a come here to complain that other do better than him.
Check is reasoning point GWF sentinell have better resist and do better damage with intimidation than gwf destroyer that is suppose to have higher DPS. = nerf CW.
high defensive and HP player are actually what on the top of PVP: nerf CW
he is like a poor car driver, that have tuned is car poorly, goes on run and pass his time criying about other that don't have right to tune their car like they are doing, that player should not have right to turn their steering wheel since he don't know how to do it
i have toughness + GWF lvl94 artifact + PvP artifact lvl 74 to get a bit over 26k hp
GWF CANT afford to waste points in HP since we need every last point in DPS to do at least some damage
i could post ss where i do 5~6mil dmg in normal sot(over half of total damage done), that doesnt change the fact that GWF needs a buff
no, thats GF
GWF is mainly a dps
"The Great Weapon Fighter is an unstoppable force of damage and steel, skilled in using the weight of a greatsword to dispatch those that stand in the way. The epitome of strength, the Great Weapon Fighter is also resilient enough to defend allies in need." ?
Role:
Damage Dealer(Destro and Inst)
Secondary Defender(Sent)
have you ever check how many DPS you win from passing to let say 9000 power to 10000. it's less than 2% . On the opposite how many dps you loose when you lie on the floor or when you need to drink potion to restore HP or moving away because you need to reup a little your HP. I passed countless hour taking info taking damage formula stat evolving graphic to check where to put point (which lvl is better to put on critic or power or armor neutra or retab). I analyse every bit of stat trying to understand how thing works. have you ever check what lvl of defense/ hp you need to be able to handle the one shot hit from etuern final boss
and mainly gwf is a single target dps. not an Aoe DPS. he have a great sword not a bomb
what did u tryed to prove its just broken intimidation build lol.
you know nothing about GWF just give up on trying to find false and pointless arguments.
Dante, it's indeed broken, but it's what people run in premades, and you know it just as good as I do. Just as an HR will run Red glyphs and 50K HP and be almost immortal with huge DPS.
I don't want to destroy your class, I want only that people stop asking for further buffs when the GWF can actually perform at this level, one-shotting BiS TR and doing just fine in PvE - a tank spec that deals almost as much damage as the best pure DPS class.
I want people to stop claiming the class is weak, when probably they are running non-FOTM builds. It's like me going Renegade CW or Trapper HR and then coming to complain I'm not good.
Oh. And these other GWFs are busy asking nerfs to CW basically in each of their posts. As CWs now barely have the damage to try and kill BiS GWFs, GFs and HRs (won't happen 1vs1), I'd like them to stop them to ask further damaging nerfs to my class such as:
zacazu: "cut CW damage in half".
No more of this thing and I will gladly go and eat my share of one shots of Intimidation and shut up, but I don't wanna see this "nerf CW" HAMSTER all the time.
See 12:00+ first, then 13:46 (31K hit followed by 20K), 20K non crit at 18:40, and there is a 46230 crit at 14:55!
Get good, or pretty much shut up.
See 13:40that is still happening even in preview. a 15% nerf is not even near to avoid stuffs like that.
46k at 14:55 is hilarious ! in mod 5 it will be 32k still hilarious.
just to make an example: the super complained TR to deal 40k lashing blade should be executioner, slot first strike, have full AP bar and however it will be able to do it just entering in combat...
intimidation dmg is just way too high for tank tree it should be changed to 20% at max rank not a single % more.
im tired of all those GWF wannabes once again coz of 1 broken feat.
the GWF can actually perform at this level, one-shotting BiS TR and doing just fine in PvE - a tank spec that deals almost as much damage as the best pure DPS class.
No. What you write is somehow the tooltip by Cryptic in their page Yunno, ""The Great Weapon Fighter is an unstoppable force of damage and steel.." and so on.
Not trying to convince you, you know you're wrong. I am just making sure no one reading the thread might get deceived by what you say. So, once and again, whine as much as you want but the statement stands: the GWF is a nerfed class that does not have the DPS it should have, and also does not have the tankyness he should have.
ToD = ..........
Tired of Dailies/Tyranny of Dailies/Timers of Doom/Tricked Or Duped/Tremendously Obnoxious Dailies/Try Otherwise, Devs
have you ever check how many DPS you win from passing to let say 9000 power to 10000. it's less than 2% . On the opposite how many dps you loose when you lie on the floor or when you need to drink potion to restore HP or moving away because you need to reup a little your HP. I passed countless hour taking info taking damage formula stat evolving graphic to check where to put point (which lvl is better to put on critic or power or armor neutra or retab). I analyse every bit of stat trying to understand how thing works. have you ever check what lvl of defense/ hp you need to be able to handle the one shot hit from etuern final boss
and mainly gwf is a single target dps. not an Aoe DPS. he have a great sword not a bomb
GWF is aoe and single target DPS, huge HAMSTER sword cuts through stuff
and what do i get from sacrificing 1k power ? 3k hp yea thats a 3rd of trash it, will help so much
I want people to stop claiming the class is weak, when probably they are running non-FOTM builds. It's like me going Renegade CW or Trapper HR and then coming to complain I'm not good.
2 changes occurred in the preview, devs. 2 changes.
intimidation received a nerf: The feet of cwplayer use to justify the quality of the class and giveme a "checkmate".
the instigator rework follow the destroyer mechanics (worst version/pve side). that for a cw, was compared to a trapper / renegade.
you are reading this, dev? If you guys want the unbiased feedback of a player from another class, i forced one. lets work this changes? dont believe me, believe magiquepurse.
No. What you write is somehow the tooltip by Cryptic in their page Yunno, ""The Great Weapon Fighter is an unstoppable force of damage and steel.." and so on.
Not trying to convince you, you know you're wrong. I am just making sure no one reading the thread might get deceived by what you say. So, once and again, whine as much as you want but the statement stands: the GWF is a nerfed class that does not have the DPS it should have, and also does not have the tankyness he should have.
Dude you even watched the twitch video I posted lol???
The GWF there hits a 47K hit from a PROC, from "tank" spec, on a full r10s, 5 legendaries BiS TR.
so devs what about GWFs?we ill have the worst dmg output in m5, even clerics ill outdmg us .
GWF should get base dmg incrased by 20-30%.
STR stat on GWF should give 2-4% damage bonus per point spend.
focused destroyer feat should give 100% chance at max rank to stack while hiting any amount of targets and incrased buff duration by 5 seconds.
destroyer purpose should have 4 stacks which of 1 stack provide 10% dmg bonus.
unstoppable gain and resistance should be brought back to it prevorious form.
with every class dealing so much dmg there is no way GWF ill survive in mod 5.
come on devs being a stack based class is not fun.
1 - the "defensive" cw control this time was not so high. he was more logistical. consisted to agroup enemies in a point and keep them there (nuke situation). one gwf with your off tank (some ranger with roots) aggregated as secondary reinforcement in this situation (I said secondary).
2 - cw damage were basically frontal. you could, and it was inconvenient when it did, losing a shard.
3 - the heroic cw feets were giving much more damage than was supposed. the problem is that the dev rushed a nerf and then ... well, you know.
4 - when I speak of a stack system for cw - ironically - I refer to some system, lengthy, inconvenient to the cw climb the mitigated a ridiculous basis damage (give cap/arc) for a competitive basis.
I refer to create a large "delay" in the performance in cw.
what you don't get is the V4 CW was still a possible way to play in v3. icy terrain have not change that much between v3-v4. in total damage v4 CW is still inferior to v3 and if you don't use orb and the SOA you also have less control possiblity since that the only two power that get buffed in term of control between v3 and v4 (and in dongeon i can assure you that most high gs CW do not use orb). ANd the reduced damage and the limited target on orb + the bug make it often non used in dongeon prefering lighting.
How ever, there is no need to continue this with you, you are just passing time messing around and showing a step explaining that the china great wall and that impossible to jump it and that god should hammer every other personn that cross it.
And all that because you canno't get two base principe when using an aoe power on multiple target it should do more total damage than a single target power. dev gave the ratio on v4 beta around 1.6.
And the second point is that excepted the jump power GWF is mainly a single target shooter and their fiew aoe power have low area so the amount of target hit is lower (on opposite they have other advantage). Unless you break AOe power to a non usable step this won't change what ever the system you put in place since in old dongeon aoe from CW often hit more than 5 target
no. the "correct" would be reduce the cw damage mercilessly, and then gradually build it into a system stacks (arcane?). control should be a parallel attribute like defense.
this **** pile, original cw thing, was worsened and transferred to the destroyer (and now for instigator; the most contraditory and stupid pve stack system ever).
ps: one cw say "mimimi you want only class x viable", is more ofensive than the gentlemancrunch notion of balance"
You can wield the nerf hammer against them that but SWs and HRs still outdps your GWf...
Last week I was running Malabog's Castle in a group with two CWs. One of them was using Singularity during the first mob fights. The other CW asked him to stop using Singularity because it was messing with his DPS.... I think that the Control Wizard is losing its identity in this game and just becoming a sort of D&D sorcerer spamming area damage spells. I would prefer to have back more control and less damage. The arcane striker should be the Warlock.
Thats because singu doesn't worth anymore. Only 8 targets.
what you don't get is the V4 CW was still a possible way to play in v3. icy terrain have not change that much between v3-v4. in total damage v4 CW is still inferior to v3 and if you don't use orb and the SOA you also have less control possiblity since that the only two power that get buffed in term of control between v3 and v4 (and in dongeon i can assure you that most high gs CW do not use orb). ANd the reduced damage and the limited target on orb + the bug make it often non used in dongeon prefering lighting.
How ever, there is no need to continue this with you, you are just passing time messing around and showing a step explaining that the china great wall and that impossible to jump it and that god should hammer every other personn that cross it
sorry, what is v3/v4? well, I already got what I wanted here. no problems to cw now. i just want a dev change.
magique, intimidation feat will do around 12-20k damage on targets that have at least 3k defense and 2k deflect
so i repeat again, if hit him with 2 encounters of huge cooldowns i will not know if i critt everytime.
even at 50% out of power, if the enemy has 3k defense and 2k deflect, a gwf will not crit over 20k MAX.
nevermind... gwf in mod5 will still pawn ***.
what we need for instigator are 2-3 tweaks and that will be the paragon that all gwf will go.
just give more surviability or someth like that.
no, dragons can one shot me (iam a off tank... destroyer tank and thau control have the same level and utility?), i need a lot of stacks to do a inferior damage and your class is supoused to be nerfed in pve. the pve become this madness because:
bring gwf to cw pve level (m2/) create a pvp demand (m2/m3), and now, bring other classes to overvalued "gwf level" (and nerf gwf). for this the pve is broken now. before you needed to shed more difficult versions of the same dungeon. now you need a general nerf (or a REAL rework).
proud, revenge? yes, since the last module i hate cw (not because of the class itself, or the class friends; cw friends for me is rangers.) . but nothing I say is false or unfair (unlike others)
Seems to me that some ppl is seeing that every problem source in nwn are cws.
You can nerf CWs in pvp HRs will still massacre your GWF...
You can nerf CWs in pve HRs and SWs still outdps your GWF...
Seems to me that some ppl is seeing that every problem source in nwn are cws.
You can nerf CWs in pvp HRs will still massacre your GWF...
You can nerf CWs in pve HRs and SWs still outdps your GWF...
no, is not. the problem now is general. since m2 i dont care about pvp (give my solution to change a lot to this damage bonus to damage bonus based on the amount of the enemy hp . for me, feets should define playstyle and "anti playstyle".)
for pve, i can not say NOTHING especific about sw because i dont have one, well, i have a lvl9 (seems unbalanced, but I do not know why) and the ranger, for what i see and test, is not so easy to play and dont bring all that utility (this guy deserve the damage IF proposes to not make war with other classes.). if iam wrong, need a nerf too.
Seems to me that some ppl is seeing that every problem source in nwn are cws.
You can nerf CWs in pvp HRs will still massacre your GWF...
You can nerf CWs in pve HRs and SWs still outdps your GWF...
cw is control > dps class, HR and SW are pure dps classes, just like GWF
cw wanted gwf to chose between tank and dps, we lost dr on unstoppable cause of that, now cw should make same choice, do sh.. dmg and have cc or do decent damage and dont cc
Paladin Master Race
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blazious11Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 331Arc User
edited October 2014
Well, you posted a video about a sentinel gwf using intimidation feat. Now, mod4 changes were intended to seperate the gwf dps and gwf survior/tank paths. As I can see, Destroyer has neither (if you are not at lest 20k with legendary weap etc) and Sentinel has both, with just one (maybe broken) intimidation feat (and mark damage bonus). That does not seems as a balance.
My story is truly a grand tale! Of course, any story about me is going to be grand simply by virtue of the main character.
Well, you posted a video about a sentinel gwf using intimidation feat. Now, mod4 changes were intended to seperate the gwf dps and gwf survior/tank paths. As I can see, Destroyer has neither (if you are not at lest 20k with legendary weap etc) and Sentinel has both, with just one (maybe broken) intimidation feat (and mark damage bonus). That does not seems as a balance.
that s different from saying GWF needs buffs.
so trapper sucks and still suck: HR need more tankiness and healing. No doesnt work like that.
or CW oppressor does few damage: CWs need 30% more base damage +5% damage bonus on INT and a prone on icy rays....NO
you got the point.
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gabrieldourdenMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,212Arc User
While the CW(s) complaining about sing from one in terms of their personal dps was wrong in my opinion, that should not mean nerfing CW's who need DPS for pvp or who provide DPS support in pve instances.
Thank you.
I´m not asking for a nerf to CW dps. I personally don´t care about who´s doing the most damage in a run as long as I see that competent and sufficiently geared rainbow parties can clear dungeons. I think that the curent overall DPS of a CW is more or less ok given the dungeons we have. I fully understand that a CW with similar gear and skill should vastely outdamage me in CN, and currently see that my Archer HR typically outdamages a similarly-geared CW when fighting Lostmauth or Garakas, which I believe is ok. By the way I don´t play PvP, only did that in Mod3 mostly to advance in the PvP campaign (got to page 72 of the Leaderboard with my squishy 24k HP ranger).
What I don´t like is the fact that the current mechanics force the CW to get his damage in a way that tends to upset players of other classes in dungeons. CWs are front-loading damage and vaporize mobs, so what you see are CWs running through mobs and the rest of the group tagging along until you get to a boss fight. This is deadly boring for the other players and leads to silly situation like the one I described.
My suggestions would be:
Reduce the impact of front-loading damage through passives. I feel in general that the impact of passives is too high. Prey is basically a passive for my ranger and altough it is quite effective it´s boring as hell. When fighting Lostmauth I can just drop Rain of Arrows on him and rake the benefits of my best "passive" and my highest DPS skill, but that isn´t fun and that´s why I´ll move to Trapper if Mod5 will be as on preview (having to switch stances, manage Aspect of the Serpent and combine root control with area powers makes the gameplay far more interesting).
Bring back damage to CW skills, especially single target ones, so that CWs can keep their capability in PvP and still provide reasonable single target damage in PvE for boss fights.
Also for mob fights it would be good to have a CW passive that sinergizes with the rest of the party, like something that deals extra damage (credited to the CW) everytime somebody else deals damage to a monster controlled by the CW.
Mechanics should encourage team play and try to make the game fun for everybody.
Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
magique, intimidation feat will do around 12-20k damage on targets that have at least 3k defense and 2k deflect
so i repeat again, if hit him with 2 encounters of huge cooldowns i will not know if i critt everytime.
even at 50% out of power, if the enemy has 3k defense and 2k deflect, a gwf will not crit over 20k MAX.
nevermind... gwf in mod5 will still pawn ***.
what we need for instigator are 2-3 tweaks and that will be the paragon that all gwf will go.
just give more surviability or someth like that.
Yes you're not gonna hit that much each time - of course.
Thing is, and you saw in the videos, Intimidation annihilates players. Repeatedly, the GWF hit incredible bursts on the TR. How much more can you ask from the TR? He tried Bi gear, he tried Profound. He is BiS and a good player.
What I'm trying to say, this is fine with me. If I die to this, so be it, I die to Red Glyph HRs as well.
But please, stop asking further CW nerfs... that is all. Cutting CW damage in half like zacazu wants is an INSULT.
so trapper sucks and still suck: HR need more tankiness and healing. No doesnt work like that.
or CW oppressor does few damage: CWs need 30% more base damage +5% damage bonus on INT and a prone on icy rays....NO
you got the point.
ahhhhhhhhhhhhh, my good sir. that is the point. destroyer is not the hipster tree. is the dps tree of the dps class. the most ordinary choose possible. when the class received a "rework" only destroyer received a "rework". for what? to isolate a quality brought by bleed. destroyer feet.
instigator fallow the same way and sentinel receive a damage nerf (no utility buffs?). still good in pvp? maybe.
gabriel
just to explain the main two reason why CW now run into the mob pack is not because we do huge massive damage, it because we are doing over time damage due to random proc. and since is random the spell that do the most amount of hit (not the biggest damage ) is icy terrain that do 1 hit / second. since launching it is surrounding you , you doN,t have the choice but going into the mob back.
Mainly the most common start is tabbed ice conduct, going inside the mob pack icy terrain and then steal time and hoping to not be killed before steal time finish. then you are doing let say 4k/ second per mob. we are far from V3 lighting or SOA that were able to one kill 3 bar life mob on epic dongeon.
Since i also stop PVP as same as you i do not care neither goes asking nerf on other class. Neither i'M found of new CW system since it offer so little possibility that every good CW run with same build and feat. How ever it make me react when i see bad player comming and crying for nerf CW with the 2 main arguments CW is on top leader board and i don't know how to build my own class so dev should do my own build the best build, or saying that the change done on GWF on v4 are due to CW player( this part not for you since you're the only one explaining with good argument and not asking for nerf but a rebuild)
Yes you're not gonna hit that much each time - of course.
Thing is, and you saw in the videos, Intimidation annihilates players. Repeatedly, the GWF hit incredible bursts on the TR. How much more can you ask from the TR? He tried Bi gear, he tried Profound. He is BiS and a good player.
What I'm trying to say, this is fine with me. If I die to this, so be it, I die to Red Glyph HRs as well.
But please, stop asking further CW nerfs... that is all. Cutting CW damage in half like zacazu wants is an INSULT.
if i ask for a CW nerfs on a pvp opinion, i would like to get CW at the point where he is using at least 2 dodges fighting a GWF, not killing him in 1 rotation. you know what i mean m8 , by sayin this.
i mean that they dont need to kill us fast without even put any efforts.
thats why i didn't like the feedback from gwf, there are alots of GWF players on our side that want BALANCE, never posted something or intended something makin us overpowered, but there are people like you who come to that part of our feedback and whined about nerfs.. so they wrecked us very bad, so for that reason i hate you, but i still i am ethical enough to mind my own(class) buisness.
the changes on each class dont need to be BIG , some small tweaks and they will bring balance.
thats why if you want to bring a good feedback, tell about your own class real problems, not keepin who knows what build that isn't working as intended. Look at Hrs, i dont see any Hrs posting in this feedback at all... seems they dont see any problem with their op class
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gabrieldourdenMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,212Arc User
gabriel
just to explain the main two reason why CW now run into the mob pack is not because we do huge massive damage, it because we are doing over time damage due to random proc. and since is random the spell that do the most amount of hit (not the biggest damage ) is icy terrain that do 1 hit / second. since launching it is surrounding you , you doN,t have the choice but going into the mob back.
Mainly the most common start is tabbed ice conduct, going inside the mob pack icy terrain and then steal time and hoping to not be killed before steal time finish. then you are doing let say 4k/ second per mob. we are far from V3 lighting or SOA that were able to one kill 3 bar life mob on epic dongeon.
Since i also stop PVP as same as you i do not care neither goes asking nerf on other class. Neither i'M found of new CW system since it offer so little possibility that every good CW run with same build and feat. How ever it make me react when i see bad player comming and crying for nerf CW with the 2 main arguments CW is on top leader board and i don't know how to build my own class so dev should do my own build the best build, or saying that the change done on GWF on v4 are due to CW player( this part not for you since you're the only one explaining with good argument and not asking for nerf but a rebuild)
Even worse then. Transforming the control wizard into a melee blaster is really going against the archetype. It really starts to look similar to the Dragon Pact Warlock they made during the playtest of 5th edition.
Le-Shan: HR level 80 (main)
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
if i ask for a CW nerfs on a pvp opinion, i would like to get CW at the point where he is using at least 2 dodges fighting a GWF, not killing him in 1 rotation. you know what i mean m8 , by sayin this.
i mean that they dont need to kill us fast without even put any efforts.
thats why i didn't like the feedback from gwf, there are alots of GWF players on our side that want BALANCE, never posted something or intended something makin us overpowered, but there are people like you who come to that part of our feedback and whined about nerfs.. so they wrecked us very bad, so for that reason i hate you, but i still i am ethical enough to mind my own(class) buisness.
the changes on each class dont need to be BIG , some small tweaks and they will bring balance.
thats why if you want to bring a good feedback, tell about your own class real problems, not keepin who knows what build that isn't working as intended. Look at Hrs, i dont see any Hrs posting in this feedback at all... seems they dont see any problem with their op class
I play CW and HR. I posted against Storm Spell and Assailant and Piercing Blades NUMEROUS times, it can be seen in my post history.
It was a mistake. I checked logs from fighting a BiS GWF these days, my Storm Spell was doing 1500 (9000) damage and when I tried Storm Fury, it was 900 (3800) or something. Assailant is not much better, and fighting HRs is the same, like hitting a wall.
And I am talking from a 20K GS CW with 6K unbuffed Power and BiS gear, r10s/9s using those **** Red Glyphs that I hate.
CW damage is insane against pugs and players that aren't tanky and don't know to CC. CW damage is mostly insignificant against GFs, HRs and GWFs. You will only get burned in 1vs2 situations when the CW can spam RoF on you.
In these conditions, CW damage is to be LEFT UNTOUCHED. People have 40-65K Hp in PvP. I need tools to burn them or there's no purpose for me playing.
As for CC?
You know very well CWs can only do good CC on other CWs and mediocre HRs. GFs, GWFs, TRs are out of our touch.
So people should know when to stop requesting nerfs to classes.
Comments
While the CW(s) complaining about sing from one in terms of their personal dps was wrong in my opinion, that should not mean nerfing CW's who need DPS for pvp or who provide DPS support in pve instances.
Thank you.
cw "v3" is cw in module 3? ok, let a point.
1 - the "defensive" cw control this time was not so high. he was more logistical. consisted to agroup enemies in a point and keep them there (nuke situation). one gwf with your off tank (some ranger with roots) aggregated as secondary reinforcement in this situation (I said secondary).
2 - cw damage were basically frontal. you could, and it was inconvenient when it did, losing a shard.
3 - the heroic cw feets were giving much more damage than was supposed. the problem is that the dev rushed a nerf and then ... well, you know.
4 - when I speak of a stack system for cw - ironically - I refer to some system, lengthy, inconvenient to the cw climb the mitigated a ridiculous basis damage (give cap/arc) for a competitive basis.
I refer to create a large "delay" in the performance in cw.
forget this guy, he is the kind of guy that just want that is choice to be the best choice and he probably think he is the best player in the world and when he lost it just because dev make unfair choice. if a feat was you loose 90% of your damage and get a purple estetic aura, he will take it a come here to complain that other do better than him.
Check is reasoning point GWF sentinell have better resist and do better damage with intimidation than gwf destroyer that is suppose to have higher DPS. = nerf CW.
high defensive and HP player are actually what on the top of PVP: nerf CW
he is like a poor car driver, that have tuned is car poorly, goes on run and pass his time criying about other that don't have right to tune their car like they are doing, that player should not have right to turn their steering wheel since he don't know how to do it
have you ever check how many DPS you win from passing to let say 9000 power to 10000. it's less than 2% . On the opposite how many dps you loose when you lie on the floor or when you need to drink potion to restore HP or moving away because you need to reup a little your HP. I passed countless hour taking info taking damage formula stat evolving graphic to check where to put point (which lvl is better to put on critic or power or armor neutra or retab). I analyse every bit of stat trying to understand how thing works. have you ever check what lvl of defense/ hp you need to be able to handle the one shot hit from etuern final boss
and mainly gwf is a single target dps. not an Aoe DPS. he have a great sword not a bomb
Dante, it's indeed broken, but it's what people run in premades, and you know it just as good as I do. Just as an HR will run Red glyphs and 50K HP and be almost immortal with huge DPS.
I don't want to destroy your class, I want only that people stop asking for further buffs when the GWF can actually perform at this level, one-shotting BiS TR and doing just fine in PvE - a tank spec that deals almost as much damage as the best pure DPS class.
I want people to stop claiming the class is weak, when probably they are running non-FOTM builds. It's like me going Renegade CW or Trapper HR and then coming to complain I'm not good.
Oh. And these other GWFs are busy asking nerfs to CW basically in each of their posts. As CWs now barely have the damage to try and kill BiS GWFs, GFs and HRs (won't happen 1vs1), I'd like them to stop them to ask further damaging nerfs to my class such as:
zacazu: "cut CW damage in half".
No more of this thing and I will gladly go and eat my share of one shots of Intimidation and shut up, but I don't wanna see this "nerf CW" HAMSTER all the time.
See 13:40 that is still happening even in preview. a 15% nerf is not even near to avoid stuffs like that.
46k at 14:55 is hilarious ! in mod 5 it will be 32k still hilarious.
just to make an example: the super complained TR to deal 40k lashing blade should be executioner, slot first strike, have full AP bar and however it will be able to do it just entering in combat...
this is what instead happens in pve
http://youtu.be/j61ZR6vZI1U
good right?
im tired of all those GWF wannabes once again coz of 1 broken feat.
No. What you write is somehow the tooltip by Cryptic in their page Yunno, ""The Great Weapon Fighter is an unstoppable force of damage and steel.." and so on.
Not trying to convince you, you know you're wrong. I am just making sure no one reading the thread might get deceived by what you say. So, once and again, whine as much as you want but the statement stands: the GWF is a nerfed class that does not have the DPS it should have, and also does not have the tankyness he should have.
Tired of Dailies/Tyranny of Dailies/Timers of Doom/Tricked Or Duped/Tremendously Obnoxious Dailies/Try Otherwise, Devs
GWF is aoe and single target DPS, huge HAMSTER sword cuts through stuff
and what do i get from sacrificing 1k power ? 3k hp yea thats a 3rd of trash it, will help so much
but your post bring a excellent point here. something that definitely deserves to be answered as playful feedback.
2 changes occurred in the preview, devs. 2 changes.
intimidation received a nerf: The feet of cwplayer use to justify the quality of the class and giveme a "checkmate".
the instigator rework follow the destroyer mechanics (worst version/pve side). that for a cw, was compared to a trapper / renegade.
you are reading this, dev? If you guys want the unbiased feedback of a player from another class, i forced one. lets work this changes? dont believe me, believe magiquepurse.
Dude you even watched the twitch video I posted lol???
The GWF there hits a 47K hit from a PROC, from "tank" spec, on a full r10s, 5 legendaries BiS TR.
And it's not enough for you?
It's like I am talking with the walls.
come on devs being a stack based class is not fun.
what you don't get is the V4 CW was still a possible way to play in v3. icy terrain have not change that much between v3-v4. in total damage v4 CW is still inferior to v3 and if you don't use orb and the SOA you also have less control possiblity since that the only two power that get buffed in term of control between v3 and v4 (and in dongeon i can assure you that most high gs CW do not use orb). ANd the reduced damage and the limited target on orb + the bug make it often non used in dongeon prefering lighting.
How ever, there is no need to continue this with you, you are just passing time messing around and showing a step explaining that the china great wall and that impossible to jump it and that god should hammer every other personn that cross it.
And all that because you canno't get two base principe when using an aoe power on multiple target it should do more total damage than a single target power. dev gave the ratio on v4 beta around 1.6.
And the second point is that excepted the jump power GWF is mainly a single target shooter and their fiew aoe power have low area so the amount of target hit is lower (on opposite they have other advantage). Unless you break AOe power to a non usable step this won't change what ever the system you put in place since in old dongeon aoe from CW often hit more than 5 target
You can wield the nerf hammer against them that but SWs and HRs still outdps your GWf...
Thats because singu doesn't worth anymore. Only 8 targets.
sorry, what is v3/v4? well, I already got what I wanted here. no problems to cw now. i just want a dev change.
so i repeat again, if hit him with 2 encounters of huge cooldowns i will not know if i critt everytime.
even at 50% out of power, if the enemy has 3k defense and 2k deflect, a gwf will not crit over 20k MAX.
nevermind... gwf in mod5 will still pawn ***.
what we need for instigator are 2-3 tweaks and that will be the paragon that all gwf will go.
just give more surviability or someth like that.
Seems to me that some ppl is seeing that every problem source in nwn are cws.
You can nerf CWs in pvp HRs will still massacre your GWF...
You can nerf CWs in pve HRs and SWs still outdps your GWF...
no, is not. the problem now is general. since m2 i dont care about pvp (give my solution to change a lot to this damage bonus to damage bonus based on the amount of the enemy hp . for me, feets should define playstyle and "anti playstyle".)
for pve, i can not say NOTHING especific about sw because i dont have one, well, i have a lvl9 (seems unbalanced, but I do not know why) and the ranger, for what i see and test, is not so easy to play and dont bring all that utility (this guy deserve the damage IF proposes to not make war with other classes.). if iam wrong, need a nerf too.
cw is control > dps class, HR and SW are pure dps classes, just like GWF
cw wanted gwf to chose between tank and dps, we lost dr on unstoppable cause of that, now cw should make same choice, do sh.. dmg and have cc or do decent damage and dont cc
so trapper sucks and still suck: HR need more tankiness and healing. No doesnt work like that.
or CW oppressor does few damage: CWs need 30% more base damage +5% damage bonus on INT and a prone on icy rays....NO
you got the point.
I´m not asking for a nerf to CW dps. I personally don´t care about who´s doing the most damage in a run as long as I see that competent and sufficiently geared rainbow parties can clear dungeons. I think that the curent overall DPS of a CW is more or less ok given the dungeons we have. I fully understand that a CW with similar gear and skill should vastely outdamage me in CN, and currently see that my Archer HR typically outdamages a similarly-geared CW when fighting Lostmauth or Garakas, which I believe is ok. By the way I don´t play PvP, only did that in Mod3 mostly to advance in the PvP campaign (got to page 72 of the Leaderboard with my squishy 24k HP ranger).
What I don´t like is the fact that the current mechanics force the CW to get his damage in a way that tends to upset players of other classes in dungeons. CWs are front-loading damage and vaporize mobs, so what you see are CWs running through mobs and the rest of the group tagging along until you get to a boss fight. This is deadly boring for the other players and leads to silly situation like the one I described.
My suggestions would be:
Reduce the impact of front-loading damage through passives. I feel in general that the impact of passives is too high. Prey is basically a passive for my ranger and altough it is quite effective it´s boring as hell. When fighting Lostmauth I can just drop Rain of Arrows on him and rake the benefits of my best "passive" and my highest DPS skill, but that isn´t fun and that´s why I´ll move to Trapper if Mod5 will be as on preview (having to switch stances, manage Aspect of the Serpent and combine root control with area powers makes the gameplay far more interesting).
Bring back damage to CW skills, especially single target ones, so that CWs can keep their capability in PvP and still provide reasonable single target damage in PvE for boss fights.
Also for mob fights it would be good to have a CW passive that sinergizes with the rest of the party, like something that deals extra damage (credited to the CW) everytime somebody else deals damage to a monster controlled by the CW.
Mechanics should encourage team play and try to make the game fun for everybody.
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
Yes you're not gonna hit that much each time - of course.
Thing is, and you saw in the videos, Intimidation annihilates players. Repeatedly, the GWF hit incredible bursts on the TR. How much more can you ask from the TR? He tried Bi gear, he tried Profound. He is BiS and a good player.
What I'm trying to say, this is fine with me. If I die to this, so be it, I die to Red Glyph HRs as well.
But please, stop asking further CW nerfs... that is all. Cutting CW damage in half like zacazu wants is an INSULT.
ahhhhhhhhhhhhh, my good sir. that is the point. destroyer is not the hipster tree. is the dps tree of the dps class. the most ordinary choose possible. when the class received a "rework" only destroyer received a "rework". for what? to isolate a quality brought by bleed. destroyer feet.
instigator fallow the same way and sentinel receive a damage nerf (no utility buffs?). still good in pvp? maybe.
and unstoppable DR being nerferd to sh.. ?
intimidation is an easy fix, but other gwf trees need quite a large buff
just to explain the main two reason why CW now run into the mob pack is not because we do huge massive damage, it because we are doing over time damage due to random proc. and since is random the spell that do the most amount of hit (not the biggest damage ) is icy terrain that do 1 hit / second. since launching it is surrounding you , you doN,t have the choice but going into the mob back.
Mainly the most common start is tabbed ice conduct, going inside the mob pack icy terrain and then steal time and hoping to not be killed before steal time finish. then you are doing let say 4k/ second per mob. we are far from V3 lighting or SOA that were able to one kill 3 bar life mob on epic dongeon.
Since i also stop PVP as same as you i do not care neither goes asking nerf on other class. Neither i'M found of new CW system since it offer so little possibility that every good CW run with same build and feat. How ever it make me react when i see bad player comming and crying for nerf CW with the 2 main arguments CW is on top leader board and i don't know how to build my own class so dev should do my own build the best build, or saying that the change done on GWF on v4 are due to CW player( this part not for you since you're the only one explaining with good argument and not asking for nerf but a rebuild)
if i ask for a CW nerfs on a pvp opinion, i would like to get CW at the point where he is using at least 2 dodges fighting a GWF, not killing him in 1 rotation. you know what i mean m8 , by sayin this.
i mean that they dont need to kill us fast without even put any efforts.
thats why i didn't like the feedback from gwf, there are alots of GWF players on our side that want BALANCE, never posted something or intended something makin us overpowered, but there are people like you who come to that part of our feedback and whined about nerfs.. so they wrecked us very bad, so for that reason i hate you, but i still i am ethical enough to mind my own(class) buisness.
the changes on each class dont need to be BIG , some small tweaks and they will bring balance.
thats why if you want to bring a good feedback, tell about your own class real problems, not keepin who knows what build that isn't working as intended. Look at Hrs, i dont see any Hrs posting in this feedback at all... seems they dont see any problem with their op class
Even worse then. Transforming the control wizard into a melee blaster is really going against the archetype. It really starts to look similar to the Dragon Pact Warlock they made during the playtest of 5th edition.
Born of Black Wind: SW Level 80
It was a mistake. I checked logs from fighting a BiS GWF these days, my Storm Spell was doing 1500 (9000) damage and when I tried Storm Fury, it was 900 (3800) or something. Assailant is not much better, and fighting HRs is the same, like hitting a wall.
And I am talking from a 20K GS CW with 6K unbuffed Power and BiS gear, r10s/9s using those **** Red Glyphs that I hate.
CW damage is insane against pugs and players that aren't tanky and don't know to CC. CW damage is mostly insignificant against GFs, HRs and GWFs. You will only get burned in 1vs2 situations when the CW can spam RoF on you.
In these conditions, CW damage is to be LEFT UNTOUCHED. People have 40-65K Hp in PvP. I need tools to burn them or there's no purpose for me playing.
As for CC?
You know very well CWs can only do good CC on other CWs and mediocre HRs. GFs, GWFs, TRs are out of our touch.
So people should know when to stop requesting nerfs to classes.