If you only looked at the hitpoints alone then you can easily say it was an even fight. They are doing almost the same amount of damage as you are, and your even using shield and lots of freeze stacks
Nonsense. Those fights are way out of whack and any honest CW could see it. The over-buffing of Storm Spell has basically broken any CW build that takes it.
I think the onoy class who could compete with tye new cw on PTR would be the current LIVE GWF... Now THAT would be interesting fight.
But this new CW <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> is just insane. Im REALLY hoping the DEVS are quiet because they are too busy working/fixing bugs to post stuff here.....
To be honest here, balancing classes is not that difficult, if you use the correct methods.
Here is an example for pvp only based on regular 5 vs 5 pvp.
Lets proceed on the assumption that we have a homogenous player pool, where aspects like personal cash spending and individual skill are irrelevant. This sounds simplistic but its not, since we are not comparing 2 players but two 2 player groups from the same pool representing their respective class. I think everyone will agree that the "average" wizard is neither more stupid nor more averse towards cash spending than the "average" HR or the "average" GF.
Now since we created a logical fundament lets conclude possible steps to balance out things.
1. For the time being create a database only for non-premade pvp . This way we get a better image of the reality, excluding most of the factors falsifying the picture.
-> players will only be included in that list, if they at least have finished 100+ games and have a gear score between x and y (not to low and not too high)
-> kill/death ratios can often be misleading, so a better option to rate the performance is via points. (1 dealed damage unit =1 point, 1 prevented/absorbed/blocked/evaded damage unit = 1 point, 1 damage unit healed through class intern abilities= 1 point. All points are summed up into one score). Control is purposely not included here, since control= damage, if you couldnt convert control into damage then control would be pointless.
2. After you have gathered enough information, form 7 groups (one for each class), calculate averages for each group and start carrying out minor changes. Then refresh the database, compare the averages of each class once again and if necessary carry out another sequence of adaptations. Repeat these steps until you reached the needed balance.
This is nothing like the ultimate solution, certain factors are not considered. But this way you will create a "reliable" source of data to operate on and this will also safe efforts for identical problems in the future.
If you only looked at the hitpoints alone then you can easily say it was an even fight. They are doing almost the same amount of damage as you are, and your even using shield and lots of freeze stacks
Only 2 of the fights has about the same HP, so not sure where you are going with that.
Honestly when i saw the result of some info i was thinking it absolutly over the top. and then i saw the video. Honestly the CW got his soulforge practicaly proc in most of battle. it was nearly an even fight in most case. reverte too much change and you have the opposite result. CW lie on the ground on each battle. But i know that most player think an even fight with CW is 1 gf gwf with 90% life remain when CW goes down. The only thing missing in this video is how much damage come from storm spell and move cursor between actual lvl and on test server lvl
Honestly when i saw the result of some info i was thinking it absolutly over the top. and then i saw the video. Honestly the CW got his soulforge practicaly proc in most of battle. it was nearly an even fight in most case. reverte too much change and you have the opposite result. CW lie on the ground on each battle. But i know that most player think an even fight with CW is 1 gf gwf with 90% life remain when CW goes down. The only thing missing in this video is how much damage come from storm spell and move cursor between actual lvl and on test server lvl
dude again. that CW was running with a pve spec and 0 tenacity ! let s see what tempzy can do ??? i think the video card would crash in the attempt to record the murder.
dude again. that CW was running with a pve spec and 0 tenacity ! let s see what tempzy can do ??? i think the video card would crash in the attempt to record the murder.
0 tenacity give 10% by default 1000 tenactiy give 20%. but then post a video with a pvp player and see if result is big difference. else that only show that pvp spec are not big deal. + i will be honest with the fact that they correct DR bug for CW spell HV set is an especially f. good set to pvp mixed with a spell plague enchant since both will practicaly reduce defense value to 0 for most case (ex 3k def 45% less from spell plague = 1700 and then -1350 from HV set = 350 remain
I seriously cannot believe people keep posting post after post complaining about Storm spell , it's clearly very much overpowered and will almost certainly get dialled back significantly this week when GC gets back into the office , whining , complaining and crying over the same well known issue for page after page after page is getting pretty tedious now , we all know how OP it is at the moment , I'm pretty sure it is safe to stop whining about it now , sheesh....
I seriously cannot believe people keep posting post after post complaining about Storm spell , it's clearly very much overpowered and will almost certainly get dialled back significantly this week when GC gets back into the office , whining , complaining and crying over the same well known issue for page after page after page is getting pretty tedious now , we all know how OP it is at the moment , I'm pretty sure it is safe to stop whining about it now , sheesh....
Eh I wouldn't be so sure about that. There's people defending it and there's honestly no telling what the Devs are going to do.
A fight between a Master of Flame and Storm is unfair. Smolder does not reach the feet of the absurd damage from the Storm. I ask equality between the two Paragorns. As I see developers only like Storm.
I do not want to be forced to change Paragorn to participate in pvp.
Good luck.
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aulduronMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,351Arc User
A fight between a Master of Flame and Storm is unfair. Smolder does not reach the feet of the absurd damage from the Storm. I ask equality between the two Paragorns. As I see developers only like Storm.
I do not want to be forced to change Paragorn to participate in pvp.
Fix for Storm Spell: Should only proc on base Encounter/At-Will/Daily damage, not on Chill stacks/DoTs. This is the main reason why it procs so often.Once the new changes have been tested, should it still provide too much damage, the next step would be to only let Encounters and Dailies proc Storm Spell. But I don't think it would be necessary. The "one-shotting" comes from the Chill stacks.
Again. This would solve the problem for everyone and make Storm Spell special for Renegades while making it much less effective for Thaums.
Fix for Storm Spell: Should only proc on base Encounter/At-Will/Daily damage, not on Chill stacks/DoTs. This is the main reason why it procs so often.Once the new changes have been tested, should it still provide too much damage, the next step would be to only let Encounters and Dailies proc Storm Spell. But I don't think it would be necessary. The "one-shotting" comes from the Chill stacks.
Quoting this because it would be like doing damage for every arcane stack you gain as a renegade. You must be interested in more viable builds, so this is imo the best way to fix that
A fight between a Master of Flame and Storm is unfair. Smolder does not reach the feet of the absurd damage from the Storm. I ask equality between the two Paragorns. As I see developers only like Storm.
I do not want to be forced to change Paragorn to participate in pvp.
Sorry but most of second path in all classes is just hopeless look :
-GWF- only vanguard
-TR -Master infiltrator
-GF- Only vanguard
-CW- Spellstorm
-DC- i dont know exactly which path but usually i saw dc with this new path where dc can have more class armor than GF ^.^
-HR- i dont know but....
Like i said, it doesn't change the fact that the most of classes have only 1 playable path and this is really sad. Cant wait mod 4 in live...
lol guys, come back to earth one second, dev made a move on storm spell to make *6.6 more damage than what they were doing previously. now your complain and making purpose to put this feat on a destroyed lvl where every other choice will be better. A spot between is original point and the new point is only what is require.
For MOF /storm comparition : mof power provide debuf that help for party. they also have power to proc more often assaillant and any other power. Storm power should do then more damage than mof way else choice will always goes on MOF. so to speak if mof damage is 1000 to compensate the debuf bonus provide by MOF power, storm power should do around 1200-1300 damage.
And things are to goes around that are plain and simple you just need to move back storm spell as 1/10 chance to proc but with the actual damage lvl on previous. And for other class player,as gwf and HR goes on your own class correct your own abused feat like the perma CC immun or the god regen power because actual version of storm spell is actually our only chance to beat HR : goes back to before change lvl and victory come 100% to HR
Arcane enhancement: considering all buffs to chill attacks and chill-focused changes to CWs, arcane enhancement should be reworked. Give it 3/6/9% (up from 1/2/3%) more damage to arcane powers. It would help Renegade tree, but also give a bit more damage to overkilled Shard we all care for very much.
Feedback
i am with the idea of more effective builds variety but cw hit tooo hard atm, if you want to hit harder then a lot of things or at least on effective thing you have needs to the effectiveness lowered, to maintain balance in the game so that every class can have a good shot at winning a 1v1
Comments
Aelar Hawkwind - Archer
Karrin Feywinter - Mistress of Flame
Errin Duskwalker - Executioner
Darquess - Soulbinder
But this new CW <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> is just insane. Im REALLY hoping the DEVS are quiet because they are too busy working/fixing bugs to post stuff here.....
Tempzy
Here is an example for pvp only based on regular 5 vs 5 pvp.
Lets proceed on the assumption that we have a homogenous player pool, where aspects like personal cash spending and individual skill are irrelevant. This sounds simplistic but its not, since we are not comparing 2 players but two 2 player groups from the same pool representing their respective class. I think everyone will agree that the "average" wizard is neither more stupid nor more averse towards cash spending than the "average" HR or the "average" GF.
Now since we created a logical fundament lets conclude possible steps to balance out things.
1. For the time being create a database only for non-premade pvp . This way we get a better image of the reality, excluding most of the factors falsifying the picture.
-> players will only be included in that list, if they at least have finished 100+ games and have a gear score between x and y (not to low and not too high)
-> kill/death ratios can often be misleading, so a better option to rate the performance is via points. (1 dealed damage unit =1 point, 1 prevented/absorbed/blocked/evaded damage unit = 1 point, 1 damage unit healed through class intern abilities= 1 point. All points are summed up into one score). Control is purposely not included here, since control= damage, if you couldnt convert control into damage then control would be pointless.
2. After you have gathered enough information, form 7 groups (one for each class), calculate averages for each group and start carrying out minor changes. Then refresh the database, compare the averages of each class once again and if necessary carry out another sequence of adaptations. Repeat these steps until you reached the needed balance.
This is nothing like the ultimate solution, certain factors are not considered. But this way you will create a "reliable" source of data to operate on and this will also safe efforts for identical problems in the future.
Right...
Contradicting yourself?
Only 2 of the fights has about the same HP, so not sure where you are going with that.
0 tenacity give 10% by default 1000 tenactiy give 20%. but then post a video with a pvp player and see if result is big difference. else that only show that pvp spec are not big deal. + i will be honest with the fact that they correct DR bug for CW spell HV set is an especially f. good set to pvp mixed with a spell plague enchant since both will practicaly reduce defense value to 0 for most case (ex 3k def 45% less from spell plague = 1700 and then -1350 from HV set = 350 remain
feedback https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEPdzUD8zTM&feature=youtu.be
that cw that was using the skill was 17k gear score.
Lukcy for him maybe he wont be considered a pug anymore
cause everyone will be a pug rolling a face-roll class!
Funny that mostly gwf reply in this thread
https://www.youtube.com/edit?video_id=CXpKpEnsXHg&video_referrer=watch
Sure!
People change opinions. Often
I find it amusing too how they are the most concerned about CW changed w/o even a main cw...
Eh I wouldn't be so sure about that. There's people defending it and there's honestly no telling what the Devs are going to do.
Good luck.
And I don't want to change paths for PvE.
Again. This would solve the problem for everyone and make Storm Spell special for Renegades while making it much less effective for Thaums.
This ! so much this
Quoting this because it would be like doing damage for every arcane stack you gain as a renegade. You must be interested in more viable builds, so this is imo the best way to fix that
Sorry but most of second path in all classes is just hopeless look :
-GWF- only vanguard
-TR -Master infiltrator
-GF- Only vanguard
-CW- Spellstorm
-DC- i dont know exactly which path but usually i saw dc with this new path where dc can have more class armor than GF ^.^
-HR- i dont know but....
Like i said, it doesn't change the fact that the most of classes have only 1 playable path and this is really sad. Cant wait mod 4 in live...
For MOF /storm comparition : mof power provide debuf that help for party. they also have power to proc more often assaillant and any other power. Storm power should do then more damage than mof way else choice will always goes on MOF. so to speak if mof damage is 1000 to compensate the debuf bonus provide by MOF power, storm power should do around 1200-1300 damage.
And things are to goes around that are plain and simple you just need to move back storm spell as 1/10 chance to proc but with the actual damage lvl on previous. And for other class player,as gwf and HR goes on your own class correct your own abused feat like the perma CC immun or the god regen power because actual version of storm spell is actually our only chance to beat HR : goes back to before change lvl and victory come 100% to HR
Feedback
i am with the idea of more effective builds variety but cw hit tooo hard atm, if you want to hit harder then a lot of things or at least on effective thing you have needs to the effectiveness lowered, to maintain balance in the game so that every class can have a good shot at winning a 1v1