Those people who keep thinking Paladin is going to be some alternate healer. Are setting themselves up for disappointment. 4e Paladins are defenders not leaders.
Those people who keep thinking Paladin is going to be some alternate healer. Are setting themselves up for disappointment. 4e Paladins are defenders not leaders.
True, they are defender, but I believe the official text is divine defender, so they do possess buffing and healing (like lay on hands), so I think those of us who choose Paladin want a sword and board tank that makes it viable and wanted for parties because sadly, the GF just doesn't get any love these days since the GWF got the Iron Vanguard Paragon path as well.
Also, if a Paladin was a class, my personal choices for the player's options of Paragon Paths would be Avenging Cavalier (based on Strength and offense) and Protecting Knight (based on Charisma/defense/healing).
Someone in the forum once said that during the pre-alpha, the Guardian Fighter actually was the prototype for a Paladin class, but it somehow worked awfully bad and then it got scrapped and then turned into what we see today: A 'Sword and Board' Fighter-like.
Leanan Sidhe(not "The Dresde Files" fairy!)- NW Legit Channel Moderator
Someone in the forum once said that during the pre-alpha, the Guardian Fighter actually was the prototype for a Paladin class, but it somehow worked awfully bad and then it got scrapped and then turned into what we see today: A 'Sword and Board' Fighter-like.
Good, paladin is winning atm~~ If devs take this into account paladin will be the next class to be released after M3.
Since GWF and GF got their paragon crossed, i hope paladin will have our cleric's AC paragon, really useful and signature powers and skills for a paladin (immune ball, slow casting DR buff at will, high defensive class feature as well as temp hp to nearby allies). So good these powers if they are on the new paladin class. Waiting for it!!!! I WANT PALADIN!!!!
Warlock (likely the next due to assets/programming already witnessed as in game), Paladin (iconic D&D), Druid (iconic D&D) and Bard (iconic D&D and my vote ) should be the "next up" classes IMO. After that fill in with any of the 4th edition classes that aren't represented.
I voted Druid. We have 3-4 dps already (depending if you count the gwf), 2 tanks (though the gf seems more proficient at this than gwf), but only 1 healer and 2 magic users. We're pretty even between close and long range attackers, but out of the 6 classes, 4 use physical attacks and 5 aren't healers at all. I realize the Druid would be a support healer, but I'm fairly certain they have buffs as well and are definitely magic users.
Druid seems the obvious choice to me. That and I like Druids and Shaman because of their primal/tribal nature ;p I actually might prefer Shaman personally, but the game could really use the Druid for more heals and buffs.
"One day I will leave this world and dream myself to reality"--Chief Crazy Horse
"Do what thou Whilt shall be the whole of the Law. Love is the Law, Love under Will."--Aleister Crowley
Those people who keep thinking Paladin is going to be some alternate healer. Are setting themselves up for disappointment. 4e Paladins are defenders not leaders.
Ok that makes sense. What would be the point in having a healer Paladin when we already have the cleric? I would assume that it would be good to have the next class as something a bit different from the others, but I guess we would have something similar at some point.
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tluceanMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 28Arc User
edited April 2014
The "original" Druid in 4E is not a leader, it's a Controller, with either Striker or Leader as secondary role. And I dearly hope that they don't bring the Sentinel variant of the Essentials line, which is a Leader, but not good at that role.
So only the Bard is a Leader among the "most wanted", and if we get another Leader class, it surely will be the Bard.
The psionic power source (excluding the Monk) has a completely different power structure in 4E with no real encounter attack powers. So I think implementing the Psion could be too much of a hassle.
TL;DR:
If we get another controller: Druid
If we get another leader: Bard
If we get another defender: Paladin
If we get another Striker: Warlock
Only when these are filled I see any chance of other classes coming.
Ok that makes sense. What would be the point in having a healer Paladin when we already have the cleric? I would assume that it would be good to have the next class as something a bit different from the others, but I guess we would have something similar at some point.
Paladin has never been a 'healer' class, not in any edition. They have a couple emergency heals, but that's it. They were never originally designed to be 'tanks', as traditional D&D didn't have that in the same way MMO's do. In an MMO environment I would classify them as leaders and give them buffing auras. They should have a paragon tree that makes them more tanky, one that makes them more healy, and one that further emphasizes buffing)
I am not sure why everyone is jonesing so hard on bard. I think it must be a vocal minority. In most gamer (D&D) circles bard is the last class of choice. I know a few people like bards and that fine. But there are other classes that would appeal to a much wider audience, like,....
Monk.
It would be far more popular, and much more likely to be purchased as a pay-to-use class. Simple economics here, reguardless of what individuals would like to see.
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tluceanMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 28Arc User
It would be far more popular, and much more likely to be purchased as a pay-to-use class. Simple economics here, reguardless of what individuals would like to see.
But at the same time there are lots of people openly opposed to Monks, whereas others just don't care about Bards.
And 4E did a very good job in making the Bard a very fun class to play, by being a very versatile leader.
PS: See above for another reason for Bard > Monk: Their role in a party.
If the Paladin acts like a GF but applies a team buff with a cooldown in "block" mode RMB and Team Heal LMB it will lose aggro.(At-Wills)
Generating enough threat to use block+buff/heal, then repeating this process means it will likely do less damage overall than a GF. Anyone want to grind that out?
I picked SW as it's most likely nearly ready for testing and I'm indifferent. The community choice will be easily noticeable in the list.
Bard does look alright, but if it uses Lute's and Books there will be some negative consequences.
The SS/BSinge(r) - is it Singe'r or sing-er?
Focusing on hitting 2 mobs at once? (like tab Icy rays).... what's it's 'thing'?
I have no problem with any of the new classes listed, except the single target DPS ones. There's no need for them. The one we have is underused as it is.
It's sad to see that. A class should have some special abilities so that players want it to be in their groups.
Rouge are supposed to be able to disable traps and unlock so that it is welcomed. But unless they introduce Skill system, that unfortunately won't happen.
It's sad to see that. A class should have some special abilities so that players want it to be in their groups.
Rouge are supposed to be able to disable traps and unlock so that it is welcomed. But unless they introduce Skill system, that unfortunately won't happen.
I wish you would stop saying that. That is not a fix for rogue. In a game that is mainly about combat. Forcing non-combat utility on a character as its only usefulness, does not make it useful, just required. The rogue class needs to be fixed. Not turned into a between combat side show act.
I wish you would stop saying that. That is not a fix for rogue. In a game that is mainly about combat. Forcing non-combat utility on a character as its only usefulness, does not make it useful, just required. The rogue class needs to be fixed. Not turned into a between combat side show act.
Ofc non-combat utility is useless in a game which is mainly about combat. Have you realized the point yet?
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darigaaz87Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 12Arc User
edited May 2014
I'd really like to see all the Classes from the 4th edition as playable in this game.
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dardoveMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I just don't want this to be a single class or a 2 class addition. This game needs a serious number of classes because the IP demands that it has alot of class choices, it's what made the IP fun and different from other types of tabletop games out there diversity.
When you don't have the diversity you don't have a DnD game.
relistic goals or not this should have been the focus of the game in the beginning. 1 class per 2 months for the next year should give this game the number of classes that it should have launched with being a DnD IP imo.
Yeah, I know. Well, at least I hope to see the old Core Classes from 3.5 in the game, like Barbarian, Bard, Druid, Monk, Paladin, and Sorcerer (although this last one would probably be changed in Warlock).
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grogthemagnifMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,651Arc User
I'm pretty sure at some point the devs will get around to making the bard, however I just wanted to make a request. I was looking at the lilend healer and I got the feeling the bard might be based on it, in other words the wizard uses an orb and a cleric uses a holy symbol therefore a bard will use a musical instrument.
I don't think all bards use musical instruments, if they don't they will use their voice to focus their magic. Anyway when you get to doing the bard please don't let the animations just show him using a musical instrument (if you decide to give him one), bards are the most versatile class and can fight as well as use magic. So in the same way that the Ranger doesn't just use a bow could we have the bard also have sword strikes (or something else cool) as well as the musical instrument.
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guille23mxMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 340Arc User
edited May 2014
I would like a only fist kind of fighter...
Imagine a RYU, OR KEN , kicking and dragon punching a great weapon fighter....
That would be awesome.
Thats why i would do if i bought this company.
But as i imagine that would not happen in the near future....i suggest a monk street fighter kind of guy as the next class... That would be so awesome!!!
It's sad to see that. A class should have some special abilities so that players want it to be in their groups.
Rouge are supposed to be able to disable traps and unlock so that it is welcomed. But unless they introduce Skill system, that unfortunately won't happen.
I agree with you since less and less rogues in dungeons care about traps saying "it's the healer's job to fix injuries so no need to disarm"...
About the classes, you have to remember that there are some very similar that will not be made. For example, as there is already a "Great weapon fighter" the barbarians are not needed anymore. I'm afraid that would also be the case for paladins because of the defensive warrior. There will probably be a more "offensive priest" but that's all.
Concerning the "evil" classes, such as necromancers or blackguards, you have also to remember the alignment of the main campaign which is clearly neutral-good. Why a necromancer would like to help neverwinter whereas he could join Valindra and reach his goal. If there was a pvp based on alignments maybe but it looks like it will be more about cities allegiances (which is ideal in the context of the Forgotten Kingdoms)
In their videos, the devs talked about how they wished to be closer to the tabletop game but we have to be realistic. It is a MMORPG, and they can't bring the 20 classes from the books. The fact that they brought so many races is already so great.
To come back to the real topic, the classes, i will say that it will be most likely an healing or controlling class. Sorry for those who expect to see the warlock, but the Hunter ranger fulfills already the role of dps distance.
To come back to the real topic, the classes, i will say that it will be most likely an healing or controlling class. Sorry for those who expect to see the warlock, but the Hunter ranger fulfills already the role of dps distance.
And the Control Wizard did before there was a Ranger. And it can be easily argued that wizards still do a better job in that role. That didn't stop ranger from happening.
Warlock is a given. Simply because a large part of is already done. Warlock items have been data mined as in the game, from as far back as beta. Warlock powers are also in the game and in use by NPCs. There is no reason at all, for all that work to simply evaporate. There will be a warlock class, the only real debate is when.
As far as the rest, only Druid has been commented on directly as being an option.
Comments
Also, if a Paladin was a class, my personal choices for the player's options of Paragon Paths would be Avenging Cavalier (based on Strength and offense) and Protecting Knight (based on Charisma/defense/healing).
That is completely incorrect.
1. Monk
2. War Wizard or Sorcerer, since it seems like the idea for War Wizard has been scrapped
3. Paladin
2.runepriest
3.swordmage
Since GWF and GF got their paragon crossed, i hope paladin will have our cleric's AC paragon, really useful and signature powers and skills for a paladin (immune ball, slow casting DR buff at will, high defensive class feature as well as temp hp to nearby allies). So good these powers if they are on the new paladin class. Waiting for it!!!! I WANT PALADIN!!!!
Just my 2 cp
Druid seems the obvious choice to me. That and I like Druids and Shaman because of their primal/tribal nature ;p I actually might prefer Shaman personally, but the game could really use the Druid for more heals and buffs.
"Do what thou Whilt shall be the whole of the Law. Love is the Law, Love under Will."--Aleister Crowley
Ok that makes sense. What would be the point in having a healer Paladin when we already have the cleric? I would assume that it would be good to have the next class as something a bit different from the others, but I guess we would have something similar at some point.
So only the Bard is a Leader among the "most wanted", and if we get another Leader class, it surely will be the Bard.
The psionic power source (excluding the Monk) has a completely different power structure in 4E with no real encounter attack powers. So I think implementing the Psion could be too much of a hassle.
TL;DR:
If we get another controller: Druid
If we get another leader: Bard
If we get another defender: Paladin
If we get another Striker: Warlock
Only when these are filled I see any chance of other classes coming.
Paladin has never been a 'healer' class, not in any edition. They have a couple emergency heals, but that's it. They were never originally designed to be 'tanks', as traditional D&D didn't have that in the same way MMO's do. In an MMO environment I would classify them as leaders and give them buffing auras. They should have a paragon tree that makes them more tanky, one that makes them more healy, and one that further emphasizes buffing)
I am not sure why everyone is jonesing so hard on bard. I think it must be a vocal minority. In most gamer (D&D) circles bard is the last class of choice. I know a few people like bards and that fine. But there are other classes that would appeal to a much wider audience, like,....
Monk.
It would be far more popular, and much more likely to be purchased as a pay-to-use class. Simple economics here, reguardless of what individuals would like to see.
But at the same time there are lots of people openly opposed to Monks, whereas others just don't care about Bards.
And 4E did a very good job in making the Bard a very fun class to play, by being a very versatile leader.
PS: See above for another reason for Bard > Monk: Their role in a party.
Generating enough threat to use block+buff/heal, then repeating this process means it will likely do less damage overall than a GF. Anyone want to grind that out?
I picked SW as it's most likely nearly ready for testing and I'm indifferent. The community choice will be easily noticeable in the list.
Bard does look alright, but if it uses Lute's and Books there will be some negative consequences.
The SS/BSinge(r) - is it Singe'r or sing-er?
Focusing on hitting 2 mobs at once? (like tab Icy rays).... what's it's 'thing'?
Rouge are supposed to be able to disable traps and unlock so that it is welcomed. But unless they introduce Skill system, that unfortunately won't happen.
I wish you would stop saying that. That is not a fix for rogue. In a game that is mainly about combat. Forcing non-combat utility on a character as its only usefulness, does not make it useful, just required. The rogue class needs to be fixed. Not turned into a between combat side show act.
That isn't a realistic goal however.
I just don't want this to be a single class or a 2 class addition. This game needs a serious number of classes because the IP demands that it has alot of class choices, it's what made the IP fun and different from other types of tabletop games out there diversity.
When you don't have the diversity you don't have a DnD game.
relistic goals or not this should have been the focus of the game in the beginning. 1 class per 2 months for the next year should give this game the number of classes that it should have launched with being a DnD IP imo.
Yeah, I know. Well, at least I hope to see the old Core Classes from 3.5 in the game, like Barbarian, Bard, Druid, Monk, Paladin, and Sorcerer (although this last one would probably be changed in Warlock).
I don't think all bards use musical instruments, if they don't they will use their voice to focus their magic. Anyway when you get to doing the bard please don't let the animations just show him using a musical instrument (if you decide to give him one), bards are the most versatile class and can fight as well as use magic. So in the same way that the Ranger doesn't just use a bow could we have the bard also have sword strikes (or something else cool) as well as the musical instrument.
Imagine a RYU, OR KEN , kicking and dragon punching a great weapon fighter....
That would be awesome.
Thats why i would do if i bought this company.
But as i imagine that would not happen in the near future....i suggest a monk street fighter kind of guy as the next class... That would be so awesome!!!
I agree with you since less and less rogues in dungeons care about traps saying "it's the healer's job to fix injuries so no need to disarm"...
About the classes, you have to remember that there are some very similar that will not be made. For example, as there is already a "Great weapon fighter" the barbarians are not needed anymore. I'm afraid that would also be the case for paladins because of the defensive warrior. There will probably be a more "offensive priest" but that's all.
Concerning the "evil" classes, such as necromancers or blackguards, you have also to remember the alignment of the main campaign which is clearly neutral-good. Why a necromancer would like to help neverwinter whereas he could join Valindra and reach his goal. If there was a pvp based on alignments maybe but it looks like it will be more about cities allegiances (which is ideal in the context of the Forgotten Kingdoms)
In their videos, the devs talked about how they wished to be closer to the tabletop game but we have to be realistic. It is a MMORPG, and they can't bring the 20 classes from the books. The fact that they brought so many races is already so great.
To come back to the real topic, the classes, i will say that it will be most likely an healing or controlling class. Sorry for those who expect to see the warlock, but the Hunter ranger fulfills already the role of dps distance.
And the Control Wizard did before there was a Ranger. And it can be easily argued that wizards still do a better job in that role. That didn't stop ranger from happening.
Warlock is a given. Simply because a large part of is already done. Warlock items have been data mined as in the game, from as far back as beta. Warlock powers are also in the game and in use by NPCs. There is no reason at all, for all that work to simply evaporate. There will be a warlock class, the only real debate is when.
As far as the rest, only Druid has been commented on directly as being an option.