i tested soulforge is based on base hp of 21600, at greater, it has 5200 heal or so + 1080x3 heal. so the total is about 8500 = a pot when you die. I like it a lot... for me it is better than 4 sec immunity. I am happy with it!
pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2013
On my CW, normal SF just went from cool to have to complete <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. I tested it with mobs and each time I got instagibbed after being resurrected.
I am so underwhelmed it's hard to describe. I needed the immunity so I can drink a pot and run the hell away, not an insta-revive on the same place where I died with angry mobs/players waiting to deal me another blow.
On my CW, normal SF just went from cool to have to complete <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>. I tested it with mobs and each time I got instagibbed after being resurrected.
I am so underwhelmed it's hard to describe. I needed the immunity so I can drink a pot and run the hell away, not an insta-revive on the same place where I died with angry mobs/players waiting to deal me another blow.
COMPLETE <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>.
Removing it and selling.
in pve maybe since i think it may be affected by minor injury thus your stats take a nerf, however for pvp, it is going to be super nice. I am hype by this; and i am worry, the last time i am this hyped was tranguil, that didnt end well
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pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
in pve maybe since i think it may be affected by minor injury thus your stats take a nerf, however for pvp, it is going to be super nice. I am hype by this; and i am worry, the last time i am this hyped was tranguil, that didnt end well
Not sure about PvP yet, but please understand that you will be, predictably:
- resurrected at the same place you died
- immediately after death
- with very low HP
- hence in an extremely vulnerable position
Now, compare this with 3 full seconds of invulnerability.
Even a moron player will wait to kick you again to death. As for the mobs in PvE... you gonna be swarmed to instadeath, now this part I've tested.
This is from a GWF perspective; when you die, especially from a high dmg daily / encounter, you will have high determination, so once you resurrected, you can pop instoppable, then you are pretty much immune for 4-8 secs, then your regen kicks in, then your 1080*3 heal kicks in, then your temp hp kicks in from unstoppable. From any other class, when you die, i hope you get a dodge rdy to get the heck out of the crowded area and do whatever that is needed for you.
Again, from a gwf perspective, i am afraid they will nerf this already.
Don't forget reviving and using ITC. Then there is also gear swapping which is something Cryptic haven't fixed, if you have multiple SF sets you'll be immortal.
pers3phoneBanned Users, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited October 2013
Well, they made SF kinda useless for CWs, one of the classes that needed it the most. There were no huge 80 pages long topics about "OMG that DC healed to full in his Perfect SF", yet Cryptic felt like appeasing the disgruntled tene users somehow... and the only method they found...
Gannicus, more or less OP than before for a Sentinel?
don't forget gwf now will have ferocious reaction...
plus new soulforged
and all the new boons
plus some artefacts seems to heal insane hp..
idk if i am happy or sad with this update. a lot new content seems to be interesting to make the chars even more unique (thing i didnt like in the game is that your char can be easily copied).
however, i dont know how all these crazy healings stuff will perform on pvp, i hope we dont have premades of 4 hours...
Dovahkiin Gannicus, GWF Sentinel- Enemy Team Guild
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
Soulforge is VERY, HIGHLY unbalanced ..it creates godlike DC's, GWF's and Rogues who with armor swapping can create chains of immunity and healing while other classes like CW are insta murdered twice in the same spot.
This change should NOT make it live.
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Soulforge is VERY, HIGHLY unbalanced ..it creates godlike DC's, GWF's and Rogues who with armor swapping can create chains of immunity and healing while other classes like CW are insta murdered twice in the same spot.
This change should NOT make it live.
Sadly, Cryptic isn't know for testing changes before implemented. No doubt it will be fixed four to five months after implementation. In the meantime, us squishies will have to improvise.
Sadly, Cryptic isn't know for testing changes before implemented. No doubt it will be fixed four to five months after implementation. In the meantime, us squishies will have to improvise.
GWF is absolutely unkillable... Everything about the GWF needs reworked.
GWF Running Indomitable Strength + Frontline Surge with a Soulforge is just unkillable
If your giving GWF these 2 you MUST strip Unstoppable away and make SERIOUS drastic other changes,
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
GWF is absolutely unkillable... Everything about the GWF needs reworked.
GWF Running Indomitable Strength + Frontline Surge with a Soulforge is just unkillable
If your giving GWF these 2 you MUST strip Unstoppable away and make SERIOUS drastic other changes,
I. Strength is actually less powerful than Crescendo, and has similar CC time. Frontline Surge will act like Roar, so not much difference there. F. Reaction has a five minute cool down. I'm not as concerned with mixing powers as I am with the Soulforge. We'll see how it plays out.
Messed around with the Ranger Class. Me likes! :cool:
It's 3 if specced, but same difference. I haven't played a GWF with the new changes, but like Trace said...Soulforged sounds more scary than the "new" abilities given to the class.
* Notorious Dwarven Bear Cavalry Leader *
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
It's 3 if specced, but same difference. I haven't played a GWF with the new changes, but like Trace said...Soulforged sounds more scary than the "new" abilities given to the class.
My primary concern is that it could make GFs null in PVP. If GWFs have Unstoppable and the same CC as a GF, why even run a GF? Unstoppable is superior to Block in regard to longevity. Perhaps we've seen the days numbered for GFs?
I reckon that the change to Tenebrous, brings along a huge wave of changes in PvP. If Tenebrous don't boost damage in the way they did, then GFs, GWFs, and up to a lesser extend TRs (with appropriate builds), can not rely to them for doing the job...while boosting their defensive skills.
So, given that the people that want to deal damage will do it in the "old-fashioned" way of stacking Crit/ArmPen , then everything that prolongs the life of a tanky character needs careful monitoring.
Extending your concern, if a tanky character gets ressurected and healed, then it will mean a major gameplay change for squihy classes.
Imagine kiting a GWF as a DC, managing to take him down and then he resurrects to Unstoppable, getting to full health. Scary.
I. Strength is actually less powerful than Crescendo, and has similar CC time. Frontline Surge will act like Roar, so not much difference there. F. Reaction has a five minute cool down. I'm not as concerned with mixing powers as I am with the Soulforge. We'll see how it plays out.
Messed around with the Ranger Class. Me likes! :cool:
actually it is 2 minutes if they make the fear rank 3.
i am very concerned about all this.
someone tested tenes? because if tenes sux, that huge "boost" to tankers longevity may explain why:p
Dovahkiin Gannicus, GWF Sentinel- Enemy Team Guild
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
I reckon that the change to Tenebrous, brings along a huge wave of changes in PvP. If Tenebrous don't boost damage in the way they did, then GFs, GWFs, and up to a lesser extend TRs (with appropriate builds), can not rely to them for doing the job...while boosting their defensive skills.
So, given that the people that want to deal damage will do it in the "old-fashioned" way of stacking Crit/ArmPen , then everything that prolongs the life of a tanky character needs careful monitoring.
Extending your concern, if a tanky character gets ressurected and healed, then it will mean a major gameplay change for squihy classes.
Imagine kiting a GWF as a DC, managing to take him down and then he resurrects to Unstoppable, getting to full health. Scary.
ihave similar feeling againt some DC haha, and it was before the patch LOL
Dovahkiin Gannicus, GWF Sentinel- Enemy Team Guild
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
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degraafinationMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
actually it is 2 minutes if they make the fear rank 3.
i am very concerned about all this.
someone tested tenes? because if tenes sux, that huge "boost" to tankers longevity may explain why:p
Yeouch. 2 min cooldown F. Reaction + Soulforge 90 sec cooldown + regen + Unstoppable + much more point control with Bull Rush and FL Surge = Sentinels being ultimate point cappers.
Yeouch. 2 min cooldown F. Reaction + Soulforge 90 sec cooldown + regen + Unstoppable + much more point control with Bull Rush and FL Surge = Sentinels being ultimate point cappers.
:eek:
bull charge is not paragon;x
but still seems that all this new survivality is "OP" i dont know yet on practical, if because without tenes gwf will have trouble killing people or what. we shall see how it will be. i have been 1 day without logging bored from game, hope they bring the update soon.
Dovahkiin Gannicus, GWF Sentinel- Enemy Team Guild
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
Correct me if i'm wrong: what GWFs get are Frontline Surge, Ferocious reaction, Threatening Rush, Trample the fallen, Indomitable strenght and trample the fallen?
All these powers are pretty much useless for a destroyer or a hybrid (destroyers do not need tanking abilities, hybrids need mobility and don't have monster HP, so FR is a bit useless even for them). Only good powers are Frontline Surge and ferocious reaction, for sentinel tanks. Along with new soulforged, as Gannicus said, this will improve only the survivability of the sentinel path.
And sentinel regeneration tanks DO NOT need a improved survivability. Really. They survive enough as they are right now.
Sentinels that want good attack, after tene nerf, if going for crit and ArP, will have to sacrifice survivability, but what if a sentinel goes full tank, with new SF and the 2 paragon from GF? They are already able to keep a point contested against multiple enemies. Now, if they can push enemies away with Frontline surge, and improve survivability with new SF and FR, i see just a UN-NEEDED buff in survivability.
I don't think that ignoring destroyers is a good idea. Any other class gets something useful, while destroyers are getting nothing from this update to improve themselves in PvE. So they are basically being left behind even more. GWFs are most likely forced to go sentinel, cause the only good things they get, are for tanking.
I really don't know what to think. I just see GWFs being left behind as usual.
This crossover between GFs and GWFs is a cheap, poor move.
I really don't know what to think. I just see GWFs being left behind as usual.
Are you high? GWF will be the strongest class in PVP hands down. Since youll get artifacts and boons that give alot of regen, now you can swap out other gear of offensive stats and also look at going more arp/crit in slots too....
Frontline surge is amazing, takedown ontop of that + indom str?! talk about perma proned. YOu can then slot IBS instead of roar again for more damage... With threat rush, no more kiting... AND sprint, AND unstoppable....
Not to mention the new SF is completely broken on a GWF, if you die and Sf bring you back up, you should LOST all your determination... Thats just stupid.
Not to mention the artifact that restores 100% of your lost HP. so SF + GWF + artifact means that tanky sent you just killed... Just got brought back to life and 100% HP...
frontline cooldown for gwf is 18sec... to much i think. we still have to see how it will be.
i think gwf will be stronger, but without tenes I have my doubts if we are going to kill rogues/cws or even others fights. so I am not so sure if they are going to be "op", or a wall that don't die and dont kill.
you can only use one artefact at time.
Dovahkiin Gannicus, GWF Sentinel- Enemy Team Guild
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
other class will have to time well when use artefact. there is one that does 2 hits of 6k dmg.
it is best to be used hen the gwf comes back from death with soulforged to finish him for once and for all
Dovahkiin Gannicus, GWF Sentinel- Enemy Team Guild
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
frontline cooldown for gwf is 18sec... to much i think. we still have to see how it will be.
i think gwf will be stronger, but without tenes I have my doubts if we are going to kill rogues/cws or even others fights. so I am not so sure if they are going to be "op", or a wall that don't die and dont kill.
you can only use one artefact at time.
Well I wont share my "theory craft" but lets just say Heimdall (my GWF) may come out of retirement...
I think there are ALOT of possibilities here. And since youll be able to unsocket regen gear, try throwing recovery in there. Frontline is a long CD for both GF and GWF hwoever its still easily an AMAZING encounter.
You have to think of the amazing synergy youll have with indom str, takedown, frontline... Your basically a GF but way herder to kill...
As for dealing damage, I went on my non enchanted retired GWF and was seeing pretty nice numbers in testing.... excited to do more testing tonight.
I tried to copy my char on neverwinter preview shard, but i don't get how it works.
Tried to restat, but after confirmation, it basically says i have points not spent, and it gets nullified. Didn't see new GF powers available and basically it works as a normal shard, you've to farm AD to restat and build gear...
May be i miss something, cause i can't test anything this way...
Would love to preview the artifacts and the new powers and test them, but where can i do it?
I tried to copy my char on neverwinter preview shard, but i don't get how it works.
Tried to restat, but after confirmation, it basically says i have points not spent, and it gets nullified. Didn't see new GF powers available and basically it works as a normal shard, you've to farm AD to restat and build gear...
May be i miss something, cause i can't test anything this way...
Would love to preview the artifacts and the new powers and test them, but where can i do it?
use this guide when u come to copy character w8 a bit and when launching the game choose Preview and wait for it to update after that login and your copied char should be there if not you have missed somethin, about respecin use the coins u can buy 1 for free in the Zen shop utility and use that on your character sheet to respec... Do not use feat respec instead buy a token from zen market and do full respec its free on the Preview
Also retraining tokens are FREE in preview. You can just retrain your toon with the new paragon path.
I agree the synergy between the new cc skills and tankiness of GWF is as good as you can hope for. I am afraid they will nerf it before the thing goes live. I can already think of take down on a target, then rush in using the mark at will (mark feated for 15% more dmg), then use I Strength, then IBS since your opponent is still prone (or slot restoring strke if you want some heal; the dmg on restoring strike is also pretty sweet when crit). This is just off the top of my head for 1 set of rotation.
Comments
Haha! Regen Sentinels will never die! :cool:
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
I am so underwhelmed it's hard to describe. I needed the immunity so I can drink a pot and run the hell away, not an insta-revive on the same place where I died with angry mobs/players waiting to deal me another blow.
COMPLETE <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>.
Removing it and selling.
in pve maybe since i think it may be affected by minor injury thus your stats take a nerf, however for pvp, it is going to be super nice. I am hype by this; and i am worry, the last time i am this hyped was tranguil, that didnt end well
Not sure about PvP yet, but please understand that you will be, predictably:
- resurrected at the same place you died
- immediately after death
- with very low HP
- hence in an extremely vulnerable position
Now, compare this with 3 full seconds of invulnerability.
Even a moron player will wait to kick you again to death. As for the mobs in PvE... you gonna be swarmed to instadeath, now this part I've tested.
So don't be hyped.
Oh, did I mentioned the longer 90 secs proc CD?
Again, from a gwf perspective, i am afraid they will nerf this already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v= http://www.youtube.com/user/moegoodtime
... was to nerf yet another enchant.
At least this is what I think happened.
GG.
plus new soulforged
and all the new boons
plus some artefacts seems to heal insane hp..
idk if i am happy or sad with this update. a lot new content seems to be interesting to make the chars even more unique (thing i didnt like in the game is that your char can be easily copied).
however, i dont know how all these crazy healings stuff will perform on pvp, i hope we dont have premades of 4 hours...
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
Ran some tests last night with the following:
Whisperknife Rogue
Sentinel GWF
Conq. GF
Executioner Rogue
Destroyer GWF
Faithful DC
Soulforge is VERY, HIGHLY unbalanced ..it creates godlike DC's, GWF's and Rogues who with armor swapping can create chains of immunity and healing while other classes like CW are insta murdered twice in the same spot.
This change should NOT make it live.
Sadly, Cryptic isn't know for testing changes before implemented. No doubt it will be fixed four to five months after implementation. In the meantime, us squishies will have to improvise.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
GWF is absolutely unkillable... Everything about the GWF needs reworked.
GWF Running Indomitable Strength + Frontline Surge with a Soulforge is just unkillable
If your giving GWF these 2 you MUST strip Unstoppable away and make SERIOUS drastic other changes,
I. Strength is actually less powerful than Crescendo, and has similar CC time. Frontline Surge will act like Roar, so not much difference there. F. Reaction has a five minute cool down. I'm not as concerned with mixing powers as I am with the Soulforge. We'll see how it plays out.
Messed around with the Ranger Class. Me likes! :cool:
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
It's 3 if specced, but same difference. I haven't played a GWF with the new changes, but like Trace said...Soulforged sounds more scary than the "new" abilities given to the class.
My primary concern is that it could make GFs null in PVP. If GWFs have Unstoppable and the same CC as a GF, why even run a GF? Unstoppable is superior to Block in regard to longevity. Perhaps we've seen the days numbered for GFs?
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
So, given that the people that want to deal damage will do it in the "old-fashioned" way of stacking Crit/ArmPen , then everything that prolongs the life of a tanky character needs careful monitoring.
Extending your concern, if a tanky character gets ressurected and healed, then it will mean a major gameplay change for squihy classes.
Imagine kiting a GWF as a DC, managing to take him down and then he resurrects to Unstoppable, getting to full health. Scary.
i am very concerned about all this.
someone tested tenes? because if tenes sux, that huge "boost" to tankers longevity may explain why:p
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
ihave similar feeling againt some DC haha, and it was before the patch LOL
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
Yeouch. 2 min cooldown F. Reaction + Soulforge 90 sec cooldown + regen + Unstoppable + much more point control with Bull Rush and FL Surge = Sentinels being ultimate point cappers.
:eek:
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
but still seems that all this new survivality is "OP" i dont know yet on practical, if because without tenes gwf will have trouble killing people or what. we shall see how it will be. i have been 1 day without logging bored from game, hope they bring the update soon.
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
All these powers are pretty much useless for a destroyer or a hybrid (destroyers do not need tanking abilities, hybrids need mobility and don't have monster HP, so FR is a bit useless even for them). Only good powers are Frontline Surge and ferocious reaction, for sentinel tanks. Along with new soulforged, as Gannicus said, this will improve only the survivability of the sentinel path.
And sentinel regeneration tanks DO NOT need a improved survivability. Really. They survive enough as they are right now.
Sentinels that want good attack, after tene nerf, if going for crit and ArP, will have to sacrifice survivability, but what if a sentinel goes full tank, with new SF and the 2 paragon from GF? They are already able to keep a point contested against multiple enemies. Now, if they can push enemies away with Frontline surge, and improve survivability with new SF and FR, i see just a UN-NEEDED buff in survivability.
I don't think that ignoring destroyers is a good idea. Any other class gets something useful, while destroyers are getting nothing from this update to improve themselves in PvE. So they are basically being left behind even more. GWFs are most likely forced to go sentinel, cause the only good things they get, are for tanking.
I really don't know what to think. I just see GWFs being left behind as usual.
This crossover between GFs and GWFs is a cheap, poor move.
Are you high? GWF will be the strongest class in PVP hands down. Since youll get artifacts and boons that give alot of regen, now you can swap out other gear of offensive stats and also look at going more arp/crit in slots too....
Frontline surge is amazing, takedown ontop of that + indom str?! talk about perma proned. YOu can then slot IBS instead of roar again for more damage... With threat rush, no more kiting... AND sprint, AND unstoppable....
Not to mention the new SF is completely broken on a GWF, if you die and Sf bring you back up, you should LOST all your determination... Thats just stupid.
Not to mention the artifact that restores 100% of your lost HP. so SF + GWF + artifact means that tanky sent you just killed... Just got brought back to life and 100% HP...
GG
i think gwf will be stronger, but without tenes I have my doubts if we are going to kill rogues/cws or even others fights. so I am not so sure if they are going to be "op", or a wall that don't die and dont kill.
you can only use one artefact at time.
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
it is best to be used hen the gwf comes back from death with soulforged to finish him for once and for all
Gannicus Destroyer, GWF Destroyer retired
Kate Beckinsale NB DC, Link NB GF
"There is only one way to be a champion..., Never ...ing lose"
Well I wont share my "theory craft" but lets just say Heimdall (my GWF) may come out of retirement...
I think there are ALOT of possibilities here. And since youll be able to unsocket regen gear, try throwing recovery in there. Frontline is a long CD for both GF and GWF hwoever its still easily an AMAZING encounter.
You have to think of the amazing synergy youll have with indom str, takedown, frontline... Your basically a GF but way herder to kill...
As for dealing damage, I went on my non enchanted retired GWF and was seeing pretty nice numbers in testing.... excited to do more testing tonight.
Tried to restat, but after confirmation, it basically says i have points not spent, and it gets nullified. Didn't see new GF powers available and basically it works as a normal shard, you've to farm AD to restat and build gear...
May be i miss something, cause i can't test anything this way...
Would love to preview the artifacts and the new powers and test them, but where can i do it?
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?330011-Welcome-to-NeverwinterPreview!
use this guide when u come to copy character w8 a bit and when launching the game choose Preview and wait for it to update after that login and your copied char should be there if not you have missed somethin, about respecin use the coins u can buy 1 for free in the Zen shop utility and use that on your character sheet to respec... Do not use feat respec instead buy a token from zen market and do full respec its free on the Preview
I agree the synergy between the new cc skills and tankiness of GWF is as good as you can hope for. I am afraid they will nerf it before the thing goes live. I can already think of take down on a target, then rush in using the mark at will (mark feated for 15% more dmg), then use I Strength, then IBS since your opponent is still prone (or slot restoring strke if you want some heal; the dmg on restoring strike is also pretty sweet when crit). This is just off the top of my head for 1 set of rotation.