STO is doing fine with both the same chat system and lack of support. Support costs money. That's all they care about and they don't think lack of support is costing them money.
EDITED TO ADD: people who report spam are not 'self-appointed' - they are using the chat facilities to report spam, as the designers intended with the report Spam option.
It's funny that you say STO Is fine. I suggest you go search their forums for "chat ban." I have several links that I could post for you, but I'm not*at my computer.
Come back with your findings. It's anything but "fine"
Support costs money, but also pulls a profit. This has been covered in the thread, no reason to teach another business class just to get flamed by people that don't understand. However for reference, look up Amazon's business structure, their profit margins, and their core competencies that support their insanely low profit margins.
I have also searched a lot and have yet to find an official response that this abuse is "working as intended" the threads go completely ignored. However, it makes me question these "working as intended" kids when a Cm posts in the thread that they will look into it. Why look into it or post anything of the sort, if it's working as intended?
I have complete faith in PW to fix this before their "official" release. The other games that face these issues were very niche. This is also niche, but to a broader scale with a lot more coverage and people watching.
Auctions is down (for 4 days again obviously), posted couple "WTB" messages with ~2 minutes interval - BAM! - 24 hours chat ban. Minus 12k GS cleric in the game.
System doesn't work because people are stupid. And the game is borken to no extent.
Well, I'll just quote something said in another thread: "The people have spoken that this is considered spam to them and is unacceptable."
Well 10x more people have spoken and said this system is unacceptable.. not just in this game either.
The bottom line is blocking /whisper and /guild is completely dumb. Now your upsetting other guild members because they think you are ignoring them. Or preventing guild events because members can't even communicate.
I've been playing games since MUDs over my 300bps modem and this is the single dumbest thing I've ever seen a company do.
Why have /ignore at all then? /ignore seems to work fine in all those big box successful MMO's...
/doublefacepalm
I have zero confidence in Cryptic/PWE's ability to implement and manage a successful MMO at this point. Absolutely zero.
This was nothing but a quick cash grab for them. Like Diablo 3, 90% of the people will be gone from this game by the end of the year.
It's funny that you say STO Is fine. I suggest you go search their forums for "chat ban." I have several links that I could post for you, but I'm not*at my computer.
Come back with your findings. It's anything but "fine"
Support costs money, but also pulls a profit. This has been covered in the thread, no reason to teach another business class just to get flamed by people that don't understand. However for reference, look up Amazon's business structure, their profit margins, and their core competencies that support their insanely low profit margins.
I have also searched a lot and have yet to find an official response that this abuse is "working as intended" the threads go completely ignored. However, it makes me question these "working as intended" kids when a Cm posts in the thread that they will look into it. Why look into it or post anything of the sort, if it's working as intended?
I have complete faith in PW to fix this before their "official" release. The other games that face these issues were very niche. This is also niche, but to a broader scale with a lot more coverage and people watching.
I know right.. Anyone that says STO is doing fine instantly loses any credibility with me and is henceforth summarily ignored.
It's obvious there are enough spoiled children with mommy's credit card to keep games like this from Cyptic/PWE afloat. It will be funny though when Cryptic/PWE release their next game... I don't think this many people will be fooled again. I know I won't be.
Unless its broken you did something to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> 20 people off. People want to enjoy the game and they don't want to be irritated, whether it be with your laundry list of things to sell in Zone, your irritating cryptic Game Boy abbreviations or whatever it might be.
Take it as a hint to cut your chatter in zone down to a minimum. Maybe there are people who have seen your name filling their screen over the last few weeks. Maybe people are sending in a silence request on anyone whos name looks familiar. Take it as a hint that your annoying people and keep your broadcasting to a minimum.
All I know is that you can't even have the Zone on your screen if you want to communicate with anyone due to the never ending stream of garbage that comes through.. trying to whisper or communicate with anyone is impossible, unless you completely get rid of the zone channel. I don't think it was designed to be like that.. where everyone needs to get rid of it, just so it can accomodate your laundry list of items to sell.
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coolarsonistMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 24Arc User
edited May 2013
Anyone who protects this system is simply put an idiot. I've been chat blocked for asking one question. They need to either change it to only blocked in zone or get rid of this system completely.
Anyone who protects this system is simply put an idiot. I've been chat blocked for asking one question. They need to either change it to only blocked in zone or get rid of this system completely.
Anyone who protects this system is simply put an idiot. I've been chat blocked for asking one question. They need to either change it to only blocked in zone or get rid of this system completely.
No its not broken. It means shut the hell up and think before you broadcast something in the zone. I've asked some important questions in zone in the last day and not only have I not been silenced, I also recieved an answer which helped me, and the people who answered weren't silenced either. Take it as a clue to think before you speak and seriously consider just not saying anything if its not going to be something appropriate. If you think its broken then its clue to simply stop speaking into the Zone. Your like a deaf person talking into a microphone and 1000's of people are trying to give you the hint to stop talking.
0
wildswannMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
The spam in zone chat in Enclave is insane no-one can ask a question or have a chance to read anything at all.. it scrolls so fast.. it's like gold sellers post 12 times in a row and so everyone else has to post 3 times in a row every 5 secs with CAPS ***'s !!!!!! and numerous other stuff. Trade channel would be great but half the ppl wouldn't use it so I'd rather they kept this system than did nothing.
No its not broken. It means shut the hell up and think before you broadcast something in the zone. I've asked some important questions in zone in the last day and not only have I not been silenced, I also recieved an answer which helped me, and the people who answered weren't silenced either. Take it as a clue to think before you speak and seriously consider just not saying anything if its not going to be something appropriate. If you think its broken then its clue to simply stop speaking into the Zone. Your like a deaf person talking into a microphone and 1000's of people are trying to give you the hint to stop talking.
I wish the forums had a similar function so we could block ignorance like this for 24hs a pop.
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bpphantomMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Ah zone chat. I had that enabled once.
- bpphantom
Grace, Tiefling Devoted Cleric
"Do what you can, with what you have, where you are. Then leave the rest to Batman."
Unless its broken you did something to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> 20 people off. People want to enjoy the game and they don't want to be irritated, whether it be with your laundry list of things to sell in Zone, your irritating cryptic Game Boy abbreviations or whatever it might be.
Take it as a hint to cut your chatter in zone down to a minimum. Maybe there are people who have seen your name filling their screen over the last few weeks. Maybe people are sending in a silence request on anyone whos name looks familiar. Take it as a hint that your annoying people and keep your broadcasting to a minimum.
All I know is that you can't even have the Zone on your screen if you want to communicate with anyone due to the never ending stream of garbage that comes through.. trying to whisper or communicate with anyone is impossible, unless you completely get rid of the zone channel. I don't think it was designed to be like that.. where everyone needs to get rid of it, just so it can accomodate your laundry list of items to sell.
This is an MMO, every single MMO's main city's zone chat is filled with spam. Most use real solutions like rate limiters.
You're telling people not to use zone chat for trading, but there's no auction house right now and even before that, how would they sell items for gold?
Here's a solution for your zone spam problem: Create a simple tab just for tells, party chat, guild chat, and any other chat that isn't zone. Then when you're in the main city open that.
The gripe I have isn't with a zone chat ban, it's with an entire chat ban for 24 hours. I will make that clear again.
Take it as a hint to cut your chatter in zone down to a minimum. Maybe there are people who have seen your name filling their screen over the last few weeks. Maybe people are sending in a silence request on anyone whos name looks familiar. Take it as a hint that your annoying people and keep your broadcasting to a minimum.
If someone is annoying someone, why use report spam? There's an ignore function that works well. People use report spam because it exists with no repercussions for a report on someone doing nothing wrong.
Also you're telling people to keep chatter down in zone???? This is an MMO, not a single player game.
This is an MMO, every single MMO's main city's zone chat is filled with spam. Most use real solutions like rate limiters.
You're telling people not to use zone chat for trading, but there's no auction house right now and even before that, how would they sell items for gold?
Here's a solution for your zone spam problem: Create a simple tab just for tells, party chat, guild chat, and any other chat that isn't zone. Then when you're in the main city open that.
The gripe I have isn't with a zone chat ban, it's with an entire chat ban for 24 hours. I will make that clear again.
You've commonly posted that people who disagree aren't understanding the issue. The part of the issue you are not understanding is that if they make the ban something spammers don't care about, like simply a zone silence, they will just keep spamming. Make it something spammers do care about and they either stop spamming, or they keep getting silenced.
What needs to happen is this - they need to make an actual auction house that is its own zone. You walk into the auction house, auction spam is what you expect. You leave the auction house, and there should not be any auction spam whatsoever. Everyone who actually wants to see auction spam will be in the separate auction house zone. -fixed.
You've commonly posted that people who disagree aren't understanding the issue. The part of the issue you are not understanding is that if they make the ban something spammers don't care about, like simply a zone silence, they will just keep spamming. Make it something spammers do care about and they either stop spamming, or they keep getting silenced.
What needs to happen is this - they need to make an actual auction house that is its own zone. You walk into the auction house, auction spam is what you expect. You leave the auction house, and there should not be any auction spam whatsoever. Everyone who actually wants to see auction spam will be in the separate auction house zone. -fixed.
If they are spamming zone, and get banned from zone for 24 hours, the spamming stops. I fail to see how you need to ban them from every form of chat possible. Unless you're actually suggesting they would invite people to a party just to spam them? Seriously?
Also do you really believe the way it is now discourages people from spamming? Because it doesn't, the same people that spam will spam after the ban. However the people that really want to use zone chat for positive reasons might reconsider if they've been banned previously (myself included)
This is an MMO, every single MMO's main city's zone chat is filled with spam. Most use real solutions like rate limiters.
You're telling people not to use zone chat for trading, but there's no auction house right now and even before that, how would they sell items for gold?
Here's a solution for your zone spam problem: Create a simple tab just for tells, party chat, guild chat, and any other chat that isn't zone. Then when you're in the main city open that.
The gripe I have isn't with a zone chat ban, it's with an entire chat ban for 24 hours. I will make that clear again.
If someone is annoying someone, why use report spam? There's an ignore function that works well. People use report spam because it exists with no repercussions for a report on someone doing nothing wrong.
Also you're telling people to keep chatter down in zone???? This is an MMO, not a single player game.
I get what your saying.... this is an "MMO" and its supposed to be like the back alley of a 3rd world flea market. I get it. I just think I and many others, those being the 20+ people who are silencing you.. don't agree with you. Sounds to me like there are at least 20 people across the 20,000 people in the enclave who want you to be quiet. I really don't think there is any abuse of the system going on at all. I asked some questions and I got answers... all systems seem to be working fine on this end.
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ph4ng4nMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 14Arc User
edited May 2013
1. Trade Chat
2. LFG Chat
2. Multiples Undockable Chat Windows
3. Report should only mute general and tell. who spam party and guild chat really?
If they are spamming zone, and get banned from zone for 24 hours, the spamming stops. I fail to see how you need to ban them from every form of chat possible. Unless you're actually suggesting they would invite people to a party just to spam them? Seriously?
Yes, third party web site gold sellers will whisper, blind invite, hit up channels, etc....
If the penalty isn't steep enough, they will keep doing it. Its not hard to understand.
A separate auction zone will fix this. People who WANT to trade will be there, everyone else wont be. Simple enough,
Haha, this is perfect. The Cryptic and PWE puppet masters pull all the strings and make the proles tear at each other's throats with this stuff.
Fellas, this is Cryptic's fault. They don't give us the right chat channels. Then they make a barbaric chat ban system. So everyone is frustrated and noone is happy.
We shouldn't be fighting with each other, we should be yelling at Cryptic.
I also want to pose this question for the people who still think this type of ban is reasonable.
A new player to the game, or MMOs in general, enters the main city and sees other people listing items for sale. He has found this super awesome level 20 item that he lists for gold. People report him for "spam" when in fact he only listed the item once, because he doesn't understand all the currencies and how the auction house works yet.
This new player is now royally screwed. People are messaging him to help him out and he has no way of responding. He's confused.
Now, if that **** happened to you, how would you feel about the game? How would you feel about MMOs in general? Would you want to keep playing this game?
Yes, third party web site gold sellers will whisper, blind invite, hit up channels, etc....
If the penalty isn't steep enough, they will keep doing it. Its not hard to understand.
A separate auction zone will fix this. People who WANT to trade will be there, everyone else wont be. Simple enough,
Or.... IGNORE. BOOM. You are making an argument that it stops gold spammers. They email you anyway, ban or not. Gold spammers aren't going away, they have been in every MMO spamming since the dawn of creation.
This hurts legitimate users.... Gold spammers just make new accounts.
There are FAR better options that other MMOs use to get rid of gold spam.
Haha, this is perfect. The Cryptic and PWE puppet masters pull all the strings and make the proles tear at each other's throats with this stuff.
Fellas, this is Cryptic's fault. They don't give us the right chat channels. Then they make a barbaric chat ban system. So everyone is frustrated and noone is happy.
We shouldn't be fighting with each other, we should be yelling at Cryptic.
Agreed. +1
0
randomone777Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 28Arc User
edited May 2013
I get what the initial poster is saying; it is pretty inequitable to be banned from ALL chat for this. What I think the inital poster doesn't realize is that they are suffering the unilateral punishment because gold spammers and the like CAN and WILL just switch to /tell spam, /party spam, etc.
Ultimately, the "problem" is that there is no real community on these servers as yet. Were such a thing present, each server would have already defined, socialized, and taken to rigid enforcement of channel use:
- trade for buy/sell/trade messages
- lfg for groups and raids
- roleplay for public roleplay
etc.
Frankly, PWE/Cryptic should have instituted these channels from the "get go" to make things easier. But, as they have not, it's up to each of US to do it.
Beholder has a trade channel [trade] and it is largely ignored. If you're on Beholder, you should use this channel and encourage your friends and guild mates to do the same.
I'd recommend this for the other servers as well. That way, /zone chat could be for help, questions, and related stuff and everyone would be much happier.
As it stands, I only /report gold sell spam and, when it gets too much, I just turn off zone chat entirely; this is not the optimum outcome, but since I really don't have time to do more...
Recap:
1. Guild Leaders - encourage your members to use /trade and NOT /zone
2. Players - use /trade and not /zone; do your best to popularize /trade on your server
3. Understand that /report, if consistently misused such as seen in this thread, will ultimately lead to us losing it. That is NOT the result you want, I promise.
My $0.02 worth.
Maniacal mage making magical messes; mercifully, made mostly of menaces.
Comments
It's funny that you say STO Is fine. I suggest you go search their forums for "chat ban." I have several links that I could post for you, but I'm not*at my computer.
Come back with your findings. It's anything but "fine"
Support costs money, but also pulls a profit. This has been covered in the thread, no reason to teach another business class just to get flamed by people that don't understand. However for reference, look up Amazon's business structure, their profit margins, and their core competencies that support their insanely low profit margins.
I have also searched a lot and have yet to find an official response that this abuse is "working as intended" the threads go completely ignored. However, it makes me question these "working as intended" kids when a Cm posts in the thread that they will look into it. Why look into it or post anything of the sort, if it's working as intended?
I have complete faith in PW to fix this before their "official" release. The other games that face these issues were very niche. This is also niche, but to a broader scale with a lot more coverage and people watching.
System doesn't work because people are stupid. And the game is borken to no extent.
P.S. Can't wait for Rift.
Well 10x more people have spoken and said this system is unacceptable.. not just in this game either.
The bottom line is blocking /whisper and /guild is completely dumb. Now your upsetting other guild members because they think you are ignoring them. Or preventing guild events because members can't even communicate.
I've been playing games since MUDs over my 300bps modem and this is the single dumbest thing I've ever seen a company do.
Why have /ignore at all then? /ignore seems to work fine in all those big box successful MMO's...
/doublefacepalm
I have zero confidence in Cryptic/PWE's ability to implement and manage a successful MMO at this point. Absolutely zero.
This was nothing but a quick cash grab for them. Like Diablo 3, 90% of the people will be gone from this game by the end of the year.
I know right.. Anyone that says STO is doing fine instantly loses any credibility with me and is henceforth summarily ignored.
It's obvious there are enough spoiled children with mommy's credit card to keep games like this from Cyptic/PWE afloat. It will be funny though when Cryptic/PWE release their next game... I don't think this many people will be fooled again. I know I won't be.
I myself plan to not say a word until AH is back up.
I expect this same response a lot in the coming days.
The Spam Sheriffs are going to have a field day with the AH being down but at least it creates awareness for the issue.
lol i didn't even typed anything in any of the chats
come on sort it out
Take it as a hint to cut your chatter in zone down to a minimum. Maybe there are people who have seen your name filling their screen over the last few weeks. Maybe people are sending in a silence request on anyone whos name looks familiar. Take it as a hint that your annoying people and keep your broadcasting to a minimum.
All I know is that you can't even have the Zone on your screen if you want to communicate with anyone due to the never ending stream of garbage that comes through.. trying to whisper or communicate with anyone is impossible, unless you completely get rid of the zone channel. I don't think it was designed to be like that.. where everyone needs to get rid of it, just so it can accomodate your laundry list of items to sell.
^ This.
/10char
No its not broken. It means shut the hell up and think before you broadcast something in the zone. I've asked some important questions in zone in the last day and not only have I not been silenced, I also recieved an answer which helped me, and the people who answered weren't silenced either. Take it as a clue to think before you speak and seriously consider just not saying anything if its not going to be something appropriate. If you think its broken then its clue to simply stop speaking into the Zone. Your like a deaf person talking into a microphone and 1000's of people are trying to give you the hint to stop talking.
I wish the forums had a similar function so we could block ignorance like this for 24hs a pop.
Grace, Tiefling Devoted Cleric
"Do what you can, with what you have, where you are. Then leave the rest to Batman."
This is an MMO, every single MMO's main city's zone chat is filled with spam. Most use real solutions like rate limiters.
You're telling people not to use zone chat for trading, but there's no auction house right now and even before that, how would they sell items for gold?
Here's a solution for your zone spam problem: Create a simple tab just for tells, party chat, guild chat, and any other chat that isn't zone. Then when you're in the main city open that.
The gripe I have isn't with a zone chat ban, it's with an entire chat ban for 24 hours. I will make that clear again.
If someone is annoying someone, why use report spam? There's an ignore function that works well. People use report spam because it exists with no repercussions for a report on someone doing nothing wrong.
Also you're telling people to keep chatter down in zone???? This is an MMO, not a single player game.
Yup this has happened often, I wonder how many people that have left and havent played in weeks are chat banned just now
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
You've commonly posted that people who disagree aren't understanding the issue. The part of the issue you are not understanding is that if they make the ban something spammers don't care about, like simply a zone silence, they will just keep spamming. Make it something spammers do care about and they either stop spamming, or they keep getting silenced.
What needs to happen is this - they need to make an actual auction house that is its own zone. You walk into the auction house, auction spam is what you expect. You leave the auction house, and there should not be any auction spam whatsoever. Everyone who actually wants to see auction spam will be in the separate auction house zone. -fixed.
If they are spamming zone, and get banned from zone for 24 hours, the spamming stops. I fail to see how you need to ban them from every form of chat possible. Unless you're actually suggesting they would invite people to a party just to spam them? Seriously?
Also do you really believe the way it is now discourages people from spamming? Because it doesn't, the same people that spam will spam after the ban. However the people that really want to use zone chat for positive reasons might reconsider if they've been banned previously (myself included)
I get what your saying.... this is an "MMO" and its supposed to be like the back alley of a 3rd world flea market. I get it. I just think I and many others, those being the 20+ people who are silencing you.. don't agree with you. Sounds to me like there are at least 20 people across the 20,000 people in the enclave who want you to be quiet. I really don't think there is any abuse of the system going on at all. I asked some questions and I got answers... all systems seem to be working fine on this end.
2. LFG Chat
2. Multiples Undockable Chat Windows
3. Report should only mute general and tell. who spam party and guild chat really?
Yes, third party web site gold sellers will whisper, blind invite, hit up channels, etc....
If the penalty isn't steep enough, they will keep doing it. Its not hard to understand.
A separate auction zone will fix this. People who WANT to trade will be there, everyone else wont be. Simple enough,
Fellas, this is Cryptic's fault. They don't give us the right chat channels. Then they make a barbaric chat ban system. So everyone is frustrated and noone is happy.
We shouldn't be fighting with each other, we should be yelling at Cryptic.
A new player to the game, or MMOs in general, enters the main city and sees other people listing items for sale. He has found this super awesome level 20 item that he lists for gold. People report him for "spam" when in fact he only listed the item once, because he doesn't understand all the currencies and how the auction house works yet.
This new player is now royally screwed. People are messaging him to help him out and he has no way of responding. He's confused.
Now, if that **** happened to you, how would you feel about the game? How would you feel about MMOs in general? Would you want to keep playing this game?
Or.... IGNORE. BOOM. You are making an argument that it stops gold spammers. They email you anyway, ban or not. Gold spammers aren't going away, they have been in every MMO spamming since the dawn of creation.
This hurts legitimate users.... Gold spammers just make new accounts.
There are FAR better options that other MMOs use to get rid of gold spam.
Ultimately, the "problem" is that there is no real community on these servers as yet. Were such a thing present, each server would have already defined, socialized, and taken to rigid enforcement of channel use:
- trade for buy/sell/trade messages
- lfg for groups and raids
- roleplay for public roleplay
etc.
Frankly, PWE/Cryptic should have instituted these channels from the "get go" to make things easier. But, as they have not, it's up to each of US to do it.
Beholder has a trade channel [trade] and it is largely ignored. If you're on Beholder, you should use this channel and encourage your friends and guild mates to do the same.
I'd recommend this for the other servers as well. That way, /zone chat could be for help, questions, and related stuff and everyone would be much happier.
As it stands, I only /report gold sell spam and, when it gets too much, I just turn off zone chat entirely; this is not the optimum outcome, but since I really don't have time to do more...
Recap:
1. Guild Leaders - encourage your members to use /trade and NOT /zone
2. Players - use /trade and not /zone; do your best to popularize /trade on your server
3. Understand that /report, if consistently misused such as seen in this thread, will ultimately lead to us losing it. That is NOT the result you want, I promise.
My $0.02 worth.
Helpful links:
Morbic's channel list - Guide - Custom Channels and List