cos I see 5 updates in the first 2 hours. There's then a break of about 4 hours (which I was asleep for) which I agree is poor because they had set the expectation of only a further 2 hours downtime (though they will weasel out by saying that they did say 'at least 2 hours'). I was asleep at the time for all I know they did make other posts in between. I know from the follow up update that their twitter feed was active however, and having read a bit of their twitter feed they do have more up to date information there, probably once an hour something meaningful beyond the usual 'we love you!!! keep posting!!!! There arent' enough exclamation marks to show how excited we are!!!!'.
In any case, while there may have been a break in the middle - which from the sounds of it was more of a planning break (probably with a little bit of testing / proof of concepting of various alternatives and which IS NOT EASY to do in a crisis, by the way) - they were back with solid information at the end of it, and then went back to really very frequent updates.
The people who where complaining about this remind me of the bratty people who you see in restaurant who think the world revolves around them because they're spending $20, so of course all the cooks, servers, and manager needs to tend to their every need.
Worse, actually. They're asking for all the patrons to have all their tables wiped clean in the interest of fairness to themselves, the complainers.
I would hate to see the world through that sort of sociopathic perspective.
_
[SIGPIC]Captain Electric and the Sapien Spider[/SIGPIC]
My hat is off to the folks that were patient and understanding.
But most of all, my hat is off to the people at Cryptic. They handled this situation as well as anyone could have expected them to handle it, and they supplied updates on a regular basis in order to keep the community informed. Something many game developers shy away from.
You set a very low bar there.
There is proof that this exploit has been going on since the gateway went live. At most a few percent of the damage is going to be resolved and the people who paid for the big AD packages are going to get bent over big time, regular players are going to be set far far back in their ability to buy items on the auction house.
And all of these problems are happening because the developers covered their eyes and ears and went around saying "I see nothing, I hear nothing, I know nothing" all the while people were telling them there were problems. Then when fit hit the shan, they went into crisis/spin mode.
Doesn't strike me as handling something as well as could be expected
I wonder how many of the ragers actually lost anything due to this and how many just want to be indignant because they can. I'm willing to bet there are a lot of people like me who were just busy levelling and having fun (never touched the AH etc) and only know about this because they had to go back to PE during the cat spam.
Even then I had to actively check Reddit and these forums to find out WTF was going on.
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carrotpakMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Had some down time at work last night, so I was able to monitor this situation from my phone. I have to say that this incident brought out both the best and the worst of the community. One slogan I try to live by is this: How you handle yourself in a crises is what truly defines your character.
Having been a long time member of the NW community, I have seen some malicious comments on the forums, but never anything like I saw last night. There was so much hate and spitefulness that I was almost ashamed to be a part of the NW community. Hate directed at both Cryptic and each other.
My hat is off to the folks that were patient and understanding.
But most of all, my hat is off to the people at Cryptic. They handled this situation as well as anyone could have expected them to handle it, and they supplied updates on a regular basis in order to keep the community informed. Something many game developers shy away from.
ha.. you are only saying this cause u spent 200+++ on this game
Had some down time at work last night, so I was able to monitor this situation from my phone. I have to say that this incident brought out both the best and the worst of the community. One slogan I try to live by is this: How you handle yourself in a crises is what truly defines your character.
Having been a long time member of the NW community, I have seen some malicious comments on the forums, but never anything like I saw last night. There was so much hate and spitefulness that I was almost ashamed to be a part of the NW community. Hate directed at both Cryptic and each other.
My hat is off to the folks that were patient and understanding.
But most of all, my hat is off to the people at Cryptic. They handled this situation as well as anyone could have expected them to handle it, and they supplied updates on a regular basis in order to keep the community informed. Something many game developers shy away from.
all this, after ignoring all the reports that this was happening right from the get go. classy customer service and developer/publisher ethics right there.
I feel utterly embarrased at your attempt to self-justify the $200 you just threw down the drain. The worst blind is the one who doesn't want to see
ha.. you are only saying this cause u spent 200+++ on this game
I'm confused as to how that would remotely effect my opinion on this issue. If anything, the founders are the ones that will get the shaft if the economy is indeed broken because all the AD that was included in the founders packs would be useless now.
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kajiwhtMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 38
edited May 2013
I didnt like the... we are gonna get it fixed in a few minutes... "REPEAT sentence over 10 hours"...
just say... THE GAME WILL NOT BE ON UNTIL TOMORROW... and I wouldnt hav wasted my time waiting lol XD
My hat is off to them for hiding this exploit for so long that many many more players didn't use it despite it being there and reported well before the game went live. Goo yob mon
It's why I try to stay away from forums. People are terrible and tend not to even think. If they want something, they want it now with no actual consideration to other people. :rolleyes:
My hat is off to them for hiding this exploit for so long that many many more players didn't use it despite it being there and reported well before the game went live. Goo yob mon
Yeah I keep reading that over and over and over. Yet none of you have supplied any proof that it was intentionally disregarded. All I see are a bunch of hateful people spewing hateful comments based on rumor.
Yeah I keep reading that over and over and over. Yet none of you have supplied any proof that it was intentionally disregarded. All I see are a bunch of hateful people spewing hateful comments based on rumor.
it was disregarded. you may attribute it to incompetence, I attribute it to malice. the fact that when the situation got really out of hand they dealt with it in but a couple hours points away from incompetence and towards malice. but as I said your hellbent in justifying your spending on a game which anyone with a bare minimum of MMO experience and previous knowledge of the parties involved (PWE & Cryptic) knew it was a Hindenburg waiting to happen
it was disregarded. you may attribute it to incompetence, I attribute it to malice. the fact that when the situation got really out of hand they dealt with it in but a couple hours points away from incompetence and towards malice. but as I said your hellbent in justifying your spending on a game which anyone with a bare minimum of MMO experience and previous knowledge of the parties involved (PWE & Cryptic) knew it was a Hindenburg waiting to happen
I was here criticizing Cryptic on other issues almost a full year before you even joined us here. I haven't been afraid nor ashamed to criticize them in the past, nor in the future. My view point on how they handled this situation is completely irrelevant to HotN. The blue title doesn't mean instant fanboy. And I still haven't seen any proof that Cryptic intentionally disregarded the exploit.
Still about 8 hours after it went viral and everyone knew there was a problem.
Ah. I was referring to the quality of PW's communication once they decided to do something about it. This was the only conclusion I could draw about what people were complaining about when they were saying things like 'communication was terrible'. I cannot comment on the quality of communications before that point, because although apparently "everyone" knew about it, I (and the other chap at work I spoke to this morning who plays) did not know about it. I'm not sure what conclusion should be drawn about that particularly. Either someone is using hyperbole to make their point, thereby undermining it, or me and my friend simply don't exist. They can't both be true.
Nevertheless I will say that it certainly appears true (wtihout resorting to accusations of photoshop or calling people liars) that the bug was reported a fair while ago. This means PW's response to the issue has been wholly inadequate. It does not mean, as some have been claiming, that communications are poor. Reaction times, judgement on the seriousness of such an exploit, these can all be called into question entirely fairly. But if you are expecting more from a game company communications-wise than we have been getting, or if you think PW/Cryptic are particularly troublesome based on the evidence of the last 24 hours then I can only assume you don't have a wide ranging experience of game companies in general, and MMO providers particularly.
Honestly, compared to anyone except Blizzard (another comms:great, service: poor company) who have meeeellions to throw at... well at everything, PW have been like unto Gods of Communication this last 24 hrs. I haven't liked the comms, and I loathe everything about Twitter and resent even having to visit the page... but claiming that there have been no communications, or that it's been like trying to pull teeth, or that they haven't been communicating updates is nonsense.
Ah. I was referring to the quality of PW's communication once they decided to do something about it. This was the only conclusion I could draw about what people were complaining about when they were saying things like 'communication was terrible'. I cannot comment on the quality of communications before that point, because although apparently "everyone" knew about it, I (and the other chap at work I spoke to this morning who plays) did not know about it. I'm not sure what conclusion should be drawn about that particularly. Either someone is using hyperbole to make their point, thereby undermining it, or me and my friend simply don't exist. They can't both be true.
Nevertheless I will say that it certainly appears true (wtihout resorting to accusations of photoshop or calling people liars) that the bug was reported a fair while ago. This means PW's response to the issue has been wholly inadequate. It does not mean, as some have been claiming, that communications are poor. Reaction times, judgement on the seriousness of such an exploit, these can all be called into question entirely fairly. But if you are expecting more from a game company communications-wise than we have been getting, or if you think PW/Cryptic are particularly troublesome based on the evidence of the last 24 hours then I can only assume you don't have a wide ranging experience of game companies in general, and MMO providers particularly.
Honestly, compared to anyone except Blizzard (another comms:great, service: poor company) who have meeeellions to throw at... well at everything, PW have been like unto Gods of Communication this last 24 hrs. I haven't liked the comms, and I loathe everything about Twitter and resent even having to visit the page... but claiming that there have been no communications, or that it's been like trying to pull teeth, or that they haven't been communicating updates is nonsense.
Anyone who's ever worked in IT will tell you that communication and speedy resolution is barely ever the norm. Unless a large number of people are actively reporting the problem and people higher up the chain are being made aware of it and forcing the tech monkeys to fix it quick 8 hours is pretty fair.
We've had entire systems going down in my place that haven't been sorted for the better part of four days sometimes and this isn't some Mickey Mouse company either, it's a very large multi billion dollar maker. Compared to Cryptic/PWE who probably don't have half the amount of support staff.
Am I saying it's right or been handled well, not really. I'm just saying all the ragers are blowing things out of proportion over nothing and if you spent money on a game that you knew was in open beta then you only have yourself to blame. No playing the "but it's not really open beta, they're just saying that to cover their asses in case stuff like this happenes." It may be true but if people were that smart they would have realised that and not spent the money, now suddenly everyone is Captain Hindsight.
As for the real money implication of this the only post I've seen people quoting about this is some guy on Reddit who claims to have made $7000 with the exploit with exactly zero evidence to back it up and the odd person who bought a founders pack and feels cheated now. In the latter case tough ****. You paid money knowingly for a game you couldn't know was going to be worth it and you don't deserve a refund because you're butt hurt. You can't pre order a game in a store, take it home and play it til you're bored and then ask for a refund - well ok you can because it's probably covered by statutory rights but it doesn't mean you're not a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for doing it.
People who bought founders packs got exactly what they paid for.
It's why I try to stay away from forums. People are terrible and tend not to even think. If they want something, they want it now with no actual consideration to other people. :rolleyes:
Newsflash. People are terrible on and off the forums. People are terrible in real life, in your face. And it's not just terrible people that do not think. It's the ones defending this entire debacle and actually think they have a logical and intelligent argument.
Cryptic handled it well and I am glad they are able to stand up to some of the comments that were being flung around the forms, facebook, and twitter. I am glad other people know what to expect and that no one is a miracle worker.
Multiple Personas, only 'One' me
"Why should one devolve themselves to try and entertain those of a lesser mindset around them?"
Newsflash. People are terrible on and off the forums. People are terrible in real life, in your face. And it's not just terrible people that do not think. It's the ones defending this entire debacle and actually think they have a logical and intelligent argument.
Duh people are terrible on and off the forums because.. people. Just because they're offline on online doesn't stop making them a person, but game forums hold a regular dose of nutritional hate, animosity, drama, and selfishness from what I've viewed over the years. Which is why I stand by mostly averting them. Man, it would be a shame if people actually acted like this on a daily basis offline though. Personally I haven't had experiences but that would just blow.
Regarding who's right and wrong in defending and raging I won't get into that. Not sure if there really is a right and wrong over how people just plain feel. All I know is there's certain ways to act and I hope no one is dumb enough not to know how, since knowing and doing are quite different.
Well, after seeing this fiasco, I have to ask: what could they have done worse? I mean it's not like they did something outstanding for all the people who play this game, they merely acted to protect their zen shop after they royally ****ed up in the first place, do you expect people to say "good job guys, carry on" for this now?
But I wonder why it was so long after the exploit was posted before something was done about it?
I suppose it's possible someone was being clever.
They maybe figured they were going to roll back anyway so let it continue for a while and monitored and recorded behavior so there could be a "punish" aspect to go with any "fix" measures they implement.
Only thing is, by leaving such a flagrant, widespread, illicit and tempting fruit right there to be so easily plucked, maybe many people who never would have considered doing such a thing may have made a poor choice yesterday.
Is that their own fault? Yes.
But with such a long gap between the public knowledge and mods activity I am hard pressed to hand out gratz on how they handled it. I guess it was Sunday and folks were at sea or at a picnic or something.
It could have been worse and they didn't do poorly IMO. I'll give them that much.
Comments
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?262972-Astral-Diamond-Exchange-and-Auction-House-Offline
cos I see 5 updates in the first 2 hours. There's then a break of about 4 hours (which I was asleep for) which I agree is poor because they had set the expectation of only a further 2 hours downtime (though they will weasel out by saying that they did say 'at least 2 hours'). I was asleep at the time for all I know they did make other posts in between. I know from the follow up update that their twitter feed was active however, and having read a bit of their twitter feed they do have more up to date information there, probably once an hour something meaningful beyond the usual 'we love you!!! keep posting!!!! There arent' enough exclamation marks to show how excited we are!!!!'.
In any case, while there may have been a break in the middle - which from the sounds of it was more of a planning break (probably with a little bit of testing / proof of concepting of various alternatives and which IS NOT EASY to do in a crisis, by the way) - they were back with solid information at the end of it, and then went back to really very frequent updates.
The comms - they were fine.
Worse, actually. They're asking for all the patrons to have all their tables wiped clean in the interest of fairness to themselves, the complainers.
I would hate to see the world through that sort of sociopathic perspective.
[SIGPIC]Captain Electric and the Sapien Spider[/SIGPIC]
"YES, PLEASE"
Vote YES for the Foundry in Champions Online.
@Captain-Electric | CoH/Virtue veteran | Proud new Champion
You set a very low bar there.
There is proof that this exploit has been going on since the gateway went live. At most a few percent of the damage is going to be resolved and the people who paid for the big AD packages are going to get bent over big time, regular players are going to be set far far back in their ability to buy items on the auction house.
And all of these problems are happening because the developers covered their eyes and ears and went around saying "I see nothing, I hear nothing, I know nothing" all the while people were telling them there were problems. Then when fit hit the shan, they went into crisis/spin mode.
Doesn't strike me as handling something as well as could be expected
Even then I had to actively check Reddit and these forums to find out WTF was going on.
ha.. you are only saying this cause u spent 200+++ on this game
If this is ironic then well played. If not, ........
all this, after ignoring all the reports that this was happening right from the get go. classy customer service and developer/publisher ethics right there.
I feel utterly embarrased at your attempt to self-justify the $200 you just threw down the drain. The worst blind is the one who doesn't want to see
I'm confused as to how that would remotely effect my opinion on this issue. If anything, the founders are the ones that will get the shaft if the economy is indeed broken because all the AD that was included in the founders packs would be useless now.
just say... THE GAME WILL NOT BE ON UNTIL TOMORROW... and I wouldnt hav wasted my time waiting lol XD
Yeah I keep reading that over and over and over. Yet none of you have supplied any proof that it was intentionally disregarded. All I see are a bunch of hateful people spewing hateful comments based on rumor.
it was disregarded. you may attribute it to incompetence, I attribute it to malice. the fact that when the situation got really out of hand they dealt with it in but a couple hours points away from incompetence and towards malice. but as I said your hellbent in justifying your spending on a game which anyone with a bare minimum of MMO experience and previous knowledge of the parties involved (PWE & Cryptic) knew it was a Hindenburg waiting to happen
Seriously? This isn't drama club, get over yourself!
[SIGPIC]Captain Electric and the Sapien Spider[/SIGPIC]
"YES, PLEASE"
Vote YES for the Foundry in Champions Online.
@Captain-Electric | CoH/Virtue veteran | Proud new Champion
I was here criticizing Cryptic on other issues almost a full year before you even joined us here. I haven't been afraid nor ashamed to criticize them in the past, nor in the future. My view point on how they handled this situation is completely irrelevant to HotN. The blue title doesn't mean instant fanboy. And I still haven't seen any proof that Cryptic intentionally disregarded the exploit.
Ah. I was referring to the quality of PW's communication once they decided to do something about it. This was the only conclusion I could draw about what people were complaining about when they were saying things like 'communication was terrible'. I cannot comment on the quality of communications before that point, because although apparently "everyone" knew about it, I (and the other chap at work I spoke to this morning who plays) did not know about it. I'm not sure what conclusion should be drawn about that particularly. Either someone is using hyperbole to make their point, thereby undermining it, or me and my friend simply don't exist. They can't both be true.
Nevertheless I will say that it certainly appears true (wtihout resorting to accusations of photoshop or calling people liars) that the bug was reported a fair while ago. This means PW's response to the issue has been wholly inadequate. It does not mean, as some have been claiming, that communications are poor. Reaction times, judgement on the seriousness of such an exploit, these can all be called into question entirely fairly. But if you are expecting more from a game company communications-wise than we have been getting, or if you think PW/Cryptic are particularly troublesome based on the evidence of the last 24 hours then I can only assume you don't have a wide ranging experience of game companies in general, and MMO providers particularly.
Honestly, compared to anyone except Blizzard (another comms:great, service: poor company) who have meeeellions to throw at... well at everything, PW have been like unto Gods of Communication this last 24 hrs. I haven't liked the comms, and I loathe everything about Twitter and resent even having to visit the page... but claiming that there have been no communications, or that it's been like trying to pull teeth, or that they haven't been communicating updates is nonsense.
Anyone who's ever worked in IT will tell you that communication and speedy resolution is barely ever the norm. Unless a large number of people are actively reporting the problem and people higher up the chain are being made aware of it and forcing the tech monkeys to fix it quick 8 hours is pretty fair.
We've had entire systems going down in my place that haven't been sorted for the better part of four days sometimes and this isn't some Mickey Mouse company either, it's a very large multi billion dollar maker. Compared to Cryptic/PWE who probably don't have half the amount of support staff.
Am I saying it's right or been handled well, not really. I'm just saying all the ragers are blowing things out of proportion over nothing and if you spent money on a game that you knew was in open beta then you only have yourself to blame. No playing the "but it's not really open beta, they're just saying that to cover their asses in case stuff like this happenes." It may be true but if people were that smart they would have realised that and not spent the money, now suddenly everyone is Captain Hindsight.
As for the real money implication of this the only post I've seen people quoting about this is some guy on Reddit who claims to have made $7000 with the exploit with exactly zero evidence to back it up and the odd person who bought a founders pack and feels cheated now. In the latter case tough ****. You paid money knowingly for a game you couldn't know was going to be worth it and you don't deserve a refund because you're butt hurt. You can't pre order a game in a store, take it home and play it til you're bored and then ask for a refund - well ok you can because it's probably covered by statutory rights but it doesn't mean you're not a <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for doing it.
People who bought founders packs got exactly what they paid for.
Newsflash. People are terrible on and off the forums. People are terrible in real life, in your face. And it's not just terrible people that do not think. It's the ones defending this entire debacle and actually think they have a logical and intelligent argument.
Multiple Personas, only 'One' me
"Why should one devolve themselves to try and entertain those of a lesser mindset around them?"
Duh people are terrible on and off the forums because.. people. Just because they're offline on online doesn't stop making them a person, but game forums hold a regular dose of nutritional hate, animosity, drama, and selfishness from what I've viewed over the years. Which is why I stand by mostly averting them. Man, it would be a shame if people actually acted like this on a daily basis offline though. Personally I haven't had experiences but that would just blow.
Regarding who's right and wrong in defending and raging I won't get into that. Not sure if there really is a right and wrong over how people just plain feel. All I know is there's certain ways to act and I hope no one is dumb enough not to know how, since knowing and doing are quite different.
Hate is bad.
But I wonder why it was so long after the exploit was posted before something was done about it?
I suppose it's possible someone was being clever.
They maybe figured they were going to roll back anyway so let it continue for a while and monitored and recorded behavior so there could be a "punish" aspect to go with any "fix" measures they implement.
Only thing is, by leaving such a flagrant, widespread, illicit and tempting fruit right there to be so easily plucked, maybe many people who never would have considered doing such a thing may have made a poor choice yesterday.
Is that their own fault? Yes.
But with such a long gap between the public knowledge and mods activity I am hard pressed to hand out gratz on how they handled it. I guess it was Sunday and folks were at sea or at a picnic or something.
It could have been worse and they didn't do poorly IMO. I'll give them that much.