wurlipusMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 5Arc User
edited May 2013
Supports the wipe , for the fact that not clearing 100% of the dup'd AD and ZEN / Item gotten from the AD will just effect the game later down the road. Inflation will occur either way but why let an exploit cause it right way. any bought item ad/zen/ Found packs would have to be reimbursed/ or refunded as part of the purchase agreement. i doubt a 7hour wipe or ever 168 hour wipe would clear 100% being that this exploit was around since open beta was released.
They promised no wipe so people would feel safe investing time and money into the game, wiping now breaks that promise and its called fruad.
Most people can go to banks/CC companys and tell them and those companys will do charge backs costing them more then just players but money as well.
So anyone who thinks they will do anything more then a roll back and deluding themselfs.
Maybe they can get around it by not making a complete wipe. Something like currency and equipment only. Replacing equipment with Uncommon items that are the item level for the first epic dungeon and gold related to your level.
Completing all story content nets you around 40 gold when you hit 60.
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cameirusMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 29Arc User
They promised no wipe so people would feel safe investing time and money into the game, wiping now breaks that promise and its called fruad.
Most people can go to banks/CC companys and tell them and those companys will do charge backs costing them more then just players but money as well.
So anyone who thinks they will do anything more then a roll back and deluding themselfs.
Its not fraud at all. And where do you draw the line between roll back and wipe?
Seriously. Where?
A 7hour wipe is a rollback.
What about a 7day wipe, is that still a roll back
What about a rollback to 1 min after beta started? its not wiped, its just rolled back.....
Its semantics, we have had a partial wipe. They could extend that as long as they wanted and still term it a roll back. And you have no recourse whatsoever.
I personally support a wipe. Or alternatively a voluntary wipe (and reset of all founders and zen purchases), and let those players re-roll on a brand new server which does not and will never allow transfers.
I'm amazed they only did a rollback with this many votes for full wipe.
I think refunds are in order.
If people want refunds they are free to contact customer support and get the ball rolling.
But yeah with all the people playing the game.. 1150 people is a clear majority of the population!
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tropicaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 17Arc User
edited May 2013
There should be no full wipe.
There could be a volontary account wipe, and a new server, where these people that wiped their account, could go play on, and re-obtain any ZEN AND FOUNDER packs obtained.
Instead of a full-wipe, what about a softer currency wipe option?
* All currency and non-bound (including unbindable) items removed from the game.
* All Zen refunded. (Except zen spent on bound items you retain, of course.)
* Levels remain: characters and professions. I'd say undo specs just to help people out a bit.
Of course there are other tweaks and ways to do it. Maybe absolutely all gear must go because of the fuzzy bound-unbound lines in this game. However, people could receive a set of gear based on their gear-score; obviously you can't just spawn in nekkid.
I'm very new at this game, so I expect there to be flaws with what I've laid out. Still, I'd think those who are more knowledgeable than I could come up with a solid plan to do a hard fix on the economy without wiping out all progress.
Just make a new server, why do you have to wipe anything.
Then when you merge the existing 3 shards, don't include the new one.
That way people who want to stay and not lose anything can, those who want a full wipe get that also.
How freaking hard is that for people to understand and stop asking for a wipe as it won't keep everyone happy, where as a new server THAT'S NOT MERGED WITH THE OTHERS IN THE FUTURE would.
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rapticorMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,078Arc User
Sorry, but this seems like an uninformed, fanboi kind of statement. They are running multiple servers now... certainly they have the tech, hardware, operations and experience to run multiple servers.
Yes.. Because posting what they have actually stated they intend to do obviously makes me a "fanboi". We all know they are running multiple servers at the moment but the plan is to go down to a single server. Not two single servers. Since obviously that's no longer single.
Just make a new server, why do you have to wipe anything.
Then when you merge the existing 3 shards, don't include the new one.
That way people who want to stay and not lose anything can, those who want a full wipe get that also.
How freaking hard is that for people to understand and stop asking for a wipe as it won't keep everyone happy, where as a new server THAT'S NOT MERGED WITH THE OTHERS IN THE FUTURE would.
Because on shard won't have the population needed to support for long and the two will eventually merge anyways. Why do you think they are merging the other three already?
While it would be brutal, a full wipe would put confidence back into me and many others that we are playing a game fairly and on equal terms, which to me would be far more enjoyable then what crytpic has done as of right now with the 7 hour rollback, as it stand I do not intend to log in unless they make a new server where we can start fresh from these exploits or a wipe as playing in a cheaters paradise is not fun or rewarding for me.
As it currently stands it looks like neither are likely to happen from the actions cryptic has taken so far. But only time will tell of course if PWE and cryptic do the community a favor on the matter be it a new server or some sort of wipe currency preferred so people don't lose their characters but still....
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darkbladessMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 57
edited May 2013
While i dont really want to level to 60 on my main again,
I agree they need to wipe all the servers and start from scratch again,
I was wondering where all this crazy priced gear was coming from , so fast from the start of open beta.
Either that or make all tier 1 and tier 2 epic gear BOP instead of BOE , so people have to earn there gear.
As far as AD goes, anyone with crazy amounts of AD ban them , 50 million AD 20 days in, you have been doing something wrong.
I started with 2 million AD and i have about 1.2 million AD left now,spent $80.00 on Zen for keys and bank slots.
Because on shard won't have the population needed to support for long and the two will eventually merge anyways. Why do you think they are merging the other three already?
The reason is they planned to merge all three from the start.
There is enough people to sustain 2 healthy servers.
And new players would more than likely choose the new shard over an older merged one, where exploit after exploit over ruined economy.
Not doing anything, just makes it worse, 7hrs does jack.
I know of plenty who brag they lost an alt through the exploit, bit still have the bulk of their AD.
The economy will still be majorly broken, and when people see that (once the AH/exchange is back up) they will quit, and then merging 3xfeck all playing on broken shards into one, won't fix anything.
Once again, game developers aren't in touch with the player base, and yet another mmo that joins the rest of the failures.
I still have a job when this fails, loads of staff at PW won't.
/golf clap at not learning from others mistakes.
Also i suggest this not be called open BETA... To change that to open ALPHA
I not only support a full wipe, but I also seem to be spending more time on the forums than in a broken game. Most of the things posted here doesn't bother me, it's more like playing a game developed by a broken company. I cant see myself logging in after the way they have handled all of this.
The reason is they planned to merge all three from the start.
There is enough people to sustain 2 healthy servers.
And new players would more than likely choose the new shard over an older merged one, where exploit after exploit over ruined economy.
Not doing anything, just makes it worse, 7hrs does jack.
I know of plenty who brag they lost an alt through the exploit, bit still have the bulk of their AD.
The economy will still be majorly broken, and when people see that (once the AH/exchange is back up) they will quit, and then merging 3xfeck all playing on broken shards into one, won't fix anything.
Once again, game developers aren't in touch with the player base, and yet another mmo that joins the rest of the failures.
I still have a job when this fails, loads of staff at PW won't.
/golf clap at not learning from others mistakes.
Yep, because that means if all new players go to the new shard old shard will eventually die and be merged into new shard. More point still stands that they will eventually be merged. Your logic is faulty.
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valondonMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I'm still a little on the fence about this, both sides are saying that doing/not doing a wipe would kill the game. That being said over zone chat I saw a couple of players going "I lost a few levels.. I quit!" so I would expect PW to be against a full wipe.
On the other hand I ask myself just how long players are going to keep playing anyway if they don't enjoy anything bar the end-game content, but leveling is also boring it is rather linear, you have pvp and quests and that's about it so I understand that.
Looking at the future, when a new player first logs into the game and sees nothing but "Selling <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for 500k+ AD" then looks at the daily quest rewards, well.. I don't see that going down well. I know a horrible economy has put me off so many games in the past, especially when I look at a market such as Zen for AD. It makes it feel like the only way to play.
That could be a flaw in the system though, one that even a wipe wouldn't fix, but it would buy the economy more than a few weeks (Ideally anyway) this time.
If people are correct and saying this happened from day one then either a ton of AD is going to be removed from the game (Providing PWE actually get it all which, no offense, I find highly improbable if for no other reason than they are still human and have massive pressure from stakeholders) or the market is going to be as it was before the exploit went viral - Still less than ideal.
Even worse though is if they miss a bunch, it'll be horribly damaging for everybody who doesn't have a ton of AD.
Hmm.. Partial wipe could work I suppose, wipe everything bar levels, recredit zen/founders packs and add in a box item (Like the one you get when you start) that can be opened at certain level intervals that contains suitable (green/blue/whatever) starter equipment for that level bracket - This would be credited only to the characters created before the date and time of the wipe. Less than perfect, but least the AD would be gone and nobody would have to relevel.
Anyway, back to the fence for me - At least until the AH and zen market are back up and I can see things for myself.
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rapticorMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,078Arc User
Bloody hilarious ! Would you be offended if I appended this to my signature ? This is what all the people demanding a wipe sound like in my head
Bori - Renegade Drow - 40 Trickster Rogue - Mindflayer Elocin - Renegade Drow - 39 Devoted Cleric of Selune - Mindflayer
Looking for some Dust of Forum Troll Disappearance? Sprinkle this on any troll to phase shift them out of your plane of existence.
I'm still a little on the fence about this, both sides are saying that doing/not doing a wipe would kill the game. That being said over zone chat I saw a couple of players going "I lost a few levels.. I quit!" so I would expect PW to be against a full wipe.
As the old saying goes; you made your bed and now you have to sleep in it. This was all preventable, they have had other games with the same issues, and speedy delivery of the ZEN market before actually BETA testing the game didn't help anything but their check books. Their failure to plan accordingly has not only caused all of this drama, but has torn the community in half. I know a lot of us are pointing fingers at each other, but the real failure here isn't on us , it's on them. I think a lot of people need to re-acquire their target and stop defending a broken company, wipe or no wipe. Bottom line is, they screwed it up and now they have to make a decision to which 1/2 of the community they want to keep.
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akikisaragiMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 1Arc User
As the old saying goes; you made your bed and now you have to sleep in it. This was all preventable, they have had other games with the same issues, and speedy delivery of the ZEN market before actually BETA testing the game didn't help anything but their check books. Their failure to plan accordingly has not only caused all of this drama, but has torn the community in half. I know a lot of us are pointing fingers at each other, but the real failure here isn't on us , it's on them. I think a lot of people need to re-acquire their target and stop defending a broken company, wipe or no wipe. Bottom line is, they screwed it up and now they have to make a decision to which 1/2 of the community they want to keep.
Half the forum community could go away and nobody would notice in game.
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angelxeyeMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 1
As the old saying goes; you made your bed and now you have to sleep in it. This was all preventable, they have had other games with the same issues, and speedy delivery of the ZEN market before actually BETA testing the game didn't help anything but their check books. Their failure to plan accordingly has not only caused all of this drama, but has torn the community in half. I know a lot of us are pointing fingers at each other, but the real failure here isn't on us , it's on them. I think a lot of people need to re-acquire their target and stop defending a broken company, wipe or no wipe. Bottom line is, they screwed it up and now they have to make a decision to which 1/2 of the community they want to keep.
I agree with you, plus a lot of people posting seem to have missed the point of what a Beta test is and seem to be treating NW as a live game thats out of the testing phase. I can understand a lot of the moaning if it was a live game, but its a test. It just happens that the store was enabled and people helped test the in game store by purchasing items from it.
Half the forum community could go away and nobody would notice in game.
I'm not sure if you assume that because a lot people don't post on the forums they are some how unable to form an opinion, or that somehow only the 1,800ish people that voted on this poll knows whats going on. Regardless, it's going to affect the game, even major website authors are writing articles about the cluster----. Will that some how help the game in the future? The point was, no matter what wrist they decide to slash, they will lose some blood over this one.
wow almost %70 of people want this but the refuse to fix the problem as we see it, they rather screw us and take our money while doing it gg. Not spending any more money in this game sorry I would be dumb to do so.
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freyarhMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 2Arc User
edited May 2013
This is the one chance they have in the first place. They're in beta, **** happens. It seems like they're choosing to not take this issue seriously, jeopardizing long term play in what is supposed to be a testing phase.
Comments
I think refunds are in order.
Maybe they can get around it by not making a complete wipe. Something like currency and equipment only. Replacing equipment with Uncommon items that are the item level for the first epic dungeon and gold related to your level.
Completing all story content nets you around 40 gold when you hit 60.
Its not fraud at all. And where do you draw the line between roll back and wipe?
Seriously. Where?
A 7hour wipe is a rollback.
What about a 7day wipe, is that still a roll back
What about a rollback to 1 min after beta started? its not wiped, its just rolled back.....
Its semantics, we have had a partial wipe. They could extend that as long as they wanted and still term it a roll back. And you have no recourse whatsoever.
I personally support a wipe. Or alternatively a voluntary wipe (and reset of all founders and zen purchases), and let those players re-roll on a brand new server which does not and will never allow transfers.
If people want refunds they are free to contact customer support and get the ball rolling.
But yeah with all the people playing the game.. 1150 people is a clear majority of the population!
There could be a volontary account wipe, and a new server, where these people that wiped their account, could go play on, and re-obtain any ZEN AND FOUNDER packs obtained.
* All currency and non-bound (including unbindable) items removed from the game.
* All Zen refunded. (Except zen spent on bound items you retain, of course.)
* Levels remain: characters and professions. I'd say undo specs just to help people out a bit.
Of course there are other tweaks and ways to do it. Maybe absolutely all gear must go because of the fuzzy bound-unbound lines in this game. However, people could receive a set of gear based on their gear-score; obviously you can't just spawn in nekkid.
I'm very new at this game, so I expect there to be flaws with what I've laid out. Still, I'd think those who are more knowledgeable than I could come up with a solid plan to do a hard fix on the economy without wiping out all progress.
Then when you merge the existing 3 shards, don't include the new one.
That way people who want to stay and not lose anything can, those who want a full wipe get that also.
How freaking hard is that for people to understand and stop asking for a wipe as it won't keep everyone happy, where as a new server THAT'S NOT MERGED WITH THE OTHERS IN THE FUTURE would.
Yes.. Because posting what they have actually stated they intend to do obviously makes me a "fanboi". We all know they are running multiple servers at the moment but the plan is to go down to a single server. Not two single servers. Since obviously that's no longer single.
As it currently stands it looks like neither are likely to happen from the actions cryptic has taken so far. But only time will tell of course if PWE and cryptic do the community a favor on the matter be it a new server or some sort of wipe currency preferred so people don't lose their characters but still....
I agree they need to wipe all the servers and start from scratch again,
I was wondering where all this crazy priced gear was coming from , so fast from the start of open beta.
Either that or make all tier 1 and tier 2 epic gear BOP instead of BOE , so people have to earn there gear.
As far as AD goes, anyone with crazy amounts of AD ban them , 50 million AD 20 days in, you have been doing something wrong.
I started with 2 million AD and i have about 1.2 million AD left now,spent $80.00 on Zen for keys and bank slots.
The reason is they planned to merge all three from the start.
There is enough people to sustain 2 healthy servers.
And new players would more than likely choose the new shard over an older merged one, where exploit after exploit over ruined economy.
Not doing anything, just makes it worse, 7hrs does jack.
I know of plenty who brag they lost an alt through the exploit, bit still have the bulk of their AD.
The economy will still be majorly broken, and when people see that (once the AH/exchange is back up) they will quit, and then merging 3xfeck all playing on broken shards into one, won't fix anything.
Once again, game developers aren't in touch with the player base, and yet another mmo that joins the rest of the failures.
I still have a job when this fails, loads of staff at PW won't.
/golf clap at not learning from others mistakes.
Also i suggest this not be called open BETA... To change that to open ALPHA
I not only support a full wipe, but I also seem to be spending more time on the forums than in a broken game. Most of the things posted here doesn't bother me, it's more like playing a game developed by a broken company. I cant see myself logging in after the way they have handled all of this.
Ok I am against full wipe but comments like that don't help. Threatening to quit is just silly.
On the other hand I ask myself just how long players are going to keep playing anyway if they don't enjoy anything bar the end-game content, but leveling is also boring it is rather linear, you have pvp and quests and that's about it so I understand that.
Looking at the future, when a new player first logs into the game and sees nothing but "Selling <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> for 500k+ AD" then looks at the daily quest rewards, well.. I don't see that going down well. I know a horrible economy has put me off so many games in the past, especially when I look at a market such as Zen for AD. It makes it feel like the only way to play.
That could be a flaw in the system though, one that even a wipe wouldn't fix, but it would buy the economy more than a few weeks (Ideally anyway) this time.
If people are correct and saying this happened from day one then either a ton of AD is going to be removed from the game (Providing PWE actually get it all which, no offense, I find highly improbable if for no other reason than they are still human and have massive pressure from stakeholders) or the market is going to be as it was before the exploit went viral - Still less than ideal.
Even worse though is if they miss a bunch, it'll be horribly damaging for everybody who doesn't have a ton of AD.
Hmm.. Partial wipe could work I suppose, wipe everything bar levels, recredit zen/founders packs and add in a box item (Like the one you get when you start) that can be opened at certain level intervals that contains suitable (green/blue/whatever) starter equipment for that level bracket - This would be credited only to the characters created before the date and time of the wipe. Less than perfect, but least the AD would be gone and nobody would have to relevel.
Anyway, back to the fence for me - At least until the AH and zen market are back up and I can see things for myself.
Like that's any different than the "Full wipe or I quit" posts.
Bloody hilarious ! Would you be offended if I appended this to my signature ? This is what all the people demanding a wipe sound like in my head
Elocin - Renegade Drow - 39 Devoted Cleric of Selune - Mindflayer
Looking for some Dust of Forum Troll Disappearance ? Sprinkle this on any troll to phase shift them out of your plane of existence.
As the old saying goes; you made your bed and now you have to sleep in it. This was all preventable, they have had other games with the same issues, and speedy delivery of the ZEN market before actually BETA testing the game didn't help anything but their check books. Their failure to plan accordingly has not only caused all of this drama, but has torn the community in half. I know a lot of us are pointing fingers at each other, but the real failure here isn't on us , it's on them. I think a lot of people need to re-acquire their target and stop defending a broken company, wipe or no wipe. Bottom line is, they screwed it up and now they have to make a decision to which 1/2 of the community they want to keep.
Half the forum community could go away and nobody would notice in game.
I agree with you, plus a lot of people posting seem to have missed the point of what a Beta test is and seem to be treating NW as a live game thats out of the testing phase. I can understand a lot of the moaning if it was a live game, but its a test. It just happens that the store was enabled and people helped test the in game store by purchasing items from it.
I'm not sure if you assume that because a lot people don't post on the forums they are some how unable to form an opinion, or that somehow only the 1,800ish people that voted on this poll knows whats going on. Regardless, it's going to affect the game, even major website authors are writing articles about the cluster----. Will that some how help the game in the future? The point was, no matter what wrist they decide to slash, they will lose some blood over this one.