No wipe or no rollback means they lost this legit, paying customer.
The economy is ruined. People converted their unlimited AD to gold, handed out a HAMSTER ton of items (none of which I took, I just logged on today to read all the drama), cats, gold, etc. Just banning some people isn't fixing it.
Bye! Good riddance. I guess you didnt pay much attention in grade school economics did you. Ever hear of the US dollar? Japanese Yen? Governments print new money all the time and economy stabilize at a new equilibrium. The game economy will settle out at a new AD/Zen supply/demand level with no additional steps past removing the exploit.
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sickenme56Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 9Arc User
Wow. I guess you will never be IT. Maybe you should go to college. Ever heard of NAT (Network Address Translation)? 100's of thousands can share the same public IP.
I could be wrong, but....isn't there STATIC and DYNAMIC NAT? ... rofl... Wouldn't have said anything, but since you're trying to make someone else look stupid I guess I can help you look even more HAMSTER. By the way...you're welcome..I'll be expecting a Christmas Card.
No wipe or no rollback means they lost this legit, paying customer.
The economy is ruined. People converted their unlimited AD to gold, handed out a HAMSTER ton of items (none of which I took, I just logged on today to read all the drama), cats, gold, etc. Just banning some people isn't fixing it.
LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You do know this game has only been released for less than a month..... Almost every MMO in the history of MMOS has a bad economy at the start, and it takes them months and some even years to settle down.
If they wipe, we'll just have to deal with another huge exploit after the wipe. It'll never end because too many players suck and simply don't belong in a gaming community, or likely any community because their parents obviously failed to bring them in a manner that includes respecting others. I wish the day would come when a company would be able to file criminal charges against players who break the terms of service and exploit content. Legitimate players invest time and money in these products.. where is their protection when bad apples ruin everything?
But, like I said, a wipe is just a short term solution. At the same time, I just don't see how they can every truly repair the damage done by this without one. Exploited currency has changed hands and forms so many times since launch.. where does it end? You can never get it all, never catch all the ways it impacted the game. No amount of bans or rollback will fix this without going all the way back to the beginning.
But then it would just start again with the next exploit some cheater is sitting on.
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leyentMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 3Arc User
edited May 2013
In a "perfect world" this **** would be wiped off and flushed.
This is the first time I've ever supported a wipe, and that's because I honestly hope to continue playing this game for a while. I know that if it isn't wiped, I wouldn't be able to look at it quite the same.
BY the way - no love for old slasher flicks?
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druftiexMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 10Arc User
edited May 2013
Would be best to just please all. Do what you can about the exploiters, removed the exploited stuff as best as you can and then open another new server for people who are willing to start again in an economy that is not totally ****ed for months.
Its being taken care of. But btw does anyone realize that all MMO players who actually rage on forums are : Astronauts, doctors, lawyers, cowboys, ninjas, Buddhist priests, shaolin monks, physicists, economists, philosopher, prophets, gun-experts, combat veterans (that defy normal combat veterans and boast about exploits), politicians, business majors, and super star athletes all wrapped into one person?
THERE will most likely be a rollback and banning of the most heinous exploiters, NO they won't provide you names or addresses to lynch them, NO the supreme court will not hear any cases about how PWI refunded your Zen and you don't feel spiritually whole or complete.
THE ECONOMY will easily recover, this has happened before in STO about 9 times, on a much larger scale and has been dealt with rapidly and the economy stabilized after 2 weeks. 120-200 AD for Zen is a normal price so dont get worked up about it, you simply just reached that point sooner than it normally would have been.
THE DEVS are awesome and this game is in transition to the full live status, its not bug free and with modern MMOs consisting of over 15-20 million lines of code, bugs and exploits will always be part of the game.
THE SUN will rise tomorrow and the day after and the day after that for around 4-5 billion years. IT IS NOT THE END OF YOUR EXISTENCE. So chill, and if still you are not satisfied that the people who exploited aren't burned, crucified, lynched, beaten, stoned, shot, curb stomped, permanently banned and you feel the need to quit, by all means don't let the door hit you on the way out. This is by far one of the smoothest transitions from open beta to live processes that PWI and other companies have had. If you disagree clearly you weren't paying attention or your new, and if you are new, you stop getting worked up after your 5th or 6th beta so...deep breaths.
Snow
Dragon Server
I was there for the opening of 6 different MMOs ... this is by far not the smoothest.
IMHO, there is nothing wrong with wanting the exploiters permanently banned. They have done tremendous damage to the game and the enjoyment of honest players.
I am a Lawyer in real life, but I try to roleplay an honorable character
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lishyaakMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 4Arc User
Bye! Good riddance. I guess you didnt pay much attention in grade school economics did you. Ever hear of the US dollar? Japanese Yen? Governments print new money all the time and economy stabilize at a new equilibrium all the time. The game economy will settle out at a new AD/Zen supply/demand level with no additional steps past removing the exploit.
Matter of fact, the devs have even more control over the economy than those governments, so fixing it should be easier. Not easy ofcourse, I'm hoping they have an economist on staff, and some proper data analysts (although PW has a position open for one of them), so they can properly analyse their actions.
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murpalMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 6Arc User
edited May 2013
Would appreciate a real update...been a while since they told us "we are looking into the problem"
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tredoMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
They won't wipe. They will selectively rollback and ban individuals exploiting the bug, and remove the duped AD from the market.
In the long run, the economy will fix itself once these actions have been taken. It's a far better solution than to do a complete wipe, because they will lose a LOT of players who don't want to have to grind up totally new characters all over again. Time=money.
Its already been proven they CANT find all the guilty accounts... you don't see that these exploiters are smarter than the dev team.. this has been going on in STO for some time now... they have all their fake IP's, secondary accounts, mule toons, they CANT and WONT find the accounts. At this point, yes the game is fubar, just like the economy! Wipe is only way, after the exploit is fixed!! Oh here is my source for the claim about not being able to find the accounts; http://www.reddit.com/r/Neverwinter/comments/1eebyi/an_exploiter_claims_to_have_made_almost_six/
Wow. I guess you will never be IT. Maybe you should go to college. Ever heard of NAT (Network Address Translation)? 100's of thousands can share the same public IP.
Wow, guess you will never be in IT either other than a level one script monkey advising users to reboot their modems. Glad you learned what NAT is, try to find a better venue to flaunt your common knowledge. You have missed the mark here by quite a margin.
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shaithis714Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 5Arc User
Its already been proven they CANT find all the guilty accounts... you don't see that these exploiters are smarter than the dev team.. this has been going on in STO for some time now... they have all their fake IP's, secondary accounts, mule toons, they CANT and WONT find the accounts. At this point, yes the game is fubar, just like the economy! Wipe is only way, after the exploit is fixed!! Oh here is my source for the claim about not being able to find the accounts; http://www.reddit.com/r/Neverwinter/comments/1eebyi/an_exploiter_claims_to_have_made_almost_six/
They don't have to find ALL the exploiters, they just have to find the people who benefitted most from it (or lost most), and deal with them (ban, rollback, value reduction/increase). And ofcourse fix the exploit
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desoroMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Sit back and enjoy the game. Arguing whether its BETA or not in your opinions is pointless. Because the game developers and maintainers say it is BETA. Case closed. Moan and groan all day if you want, you just look sad and ignorant. Its BETA, the community found a major currency glitch and now it is being fixed within 24 hours. Awesome in my opinion. Thank god it was found before official release and thank god it will only take a day. Blizzard(WoW), Riot(LoL), or EA(Lots) teams would have taken a lot longer and probably wouldn't officially comment on the glitch, they would just fix it and act like it never happened while masking the patch with the title "minor balancing patch".
Now I am going to do the three Ss (Sh**, Shower, and Shave) then go eat. By the time I am done, I will probably be able to sneak some gaming time in. Act civilized and do something similar rather then sitting on the forums pointless flaming.
Its being taken care of. But btw does anyone realize that all MMO players who actually rage on forums are : Astronauts, doctors, lawyers, cowboys, ninjas, Buddhist priests, shaolin monks, physicists, economists, philosopher, prophets, gun-experts, combat veterans (that defy normal combat veterans and boast about exploits), politicians, business majors, and super star athletes all wrapped into one person?
THERE will most likely be a rollback and banning of the most heinous exploiters, NO they won't provide you names or addresses to lynch them, NO the supreme court will not hear any cases about how PWI refunded your Zen and you don't feel spiritually whole or complete.
THE ECONOMY will easily recover, this has happened before in STO about 9 times, on a much larger scale and has been dealt with rapidly and the economy stabilized after 2 weeks. 120-200 AD for Zen is a normal price so dont get worked up about it, you simply just reached that point sooner than it normally would have been.
THE DEVS are awesome and this game is in transition to the full live status, its not bug free and with modern MMOs consisting of over 15-20 million lines of code, bugs and exploits will always be part of the game.
THE SUN will rise tomorrow and the day after and the day after that for around 4-5 billion years. IT IS NOT THE END OF YOUR EXISTENCE. So chill, and if still you are not satisfied that the people who exploited aren't burned, crucified, lynched, beaten, stoned, shot, curb stomped, permanently banned and you feel the need to quit, by all means don't let the door hit you on the way out. This is by far one of the smoothest transitions from open beta to live processes that PWI and other companies have had. If you disagree clearly you weren't paying attention or your new, and if you are new, you stop getting worked up after your 5th or 6th beta so...deep breaths.
Snow
Dragon Server
1. Put the pom poms down and back away.
2. This is NOT a beta. It's "full live status" already. They sell zen. End of story.
3. As someone who has participated in quite a few PWE betas (closed and open), I can tell you're a first timer. Nice try, but... no this is not their smoothest roll out yet. Saying that proves you haven't been in other PWE betas.
4. The company name is Perfect World Entertainment... PWI is one of their games... Perfect World International. Another dead give away that you don't know what your talking about.
If you've done PWE betas you'd already know that their idea of Open Beta is a full launch. It's not beta mode. lol
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kimberixMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
If you're not going to do a full wipe, could I have a cat as well please as I haven't been online all day?
I'll gladly take a 3 day ban in exchange for a 900k AD item.
I could be wrong, but....isn't there STATIC and DYNAMIC NAT? ... rofl... Wouldn't have said anything, but since you're trying to make someone else look stupid I guess I can help you look even more HAMSTER. By the way...you're welcome..I'll be expecting a Christmas Card.
Wow. You are an idiot too. All this points to what? Many people behind the same public IP address(s)? You are only helping prove my point. Wait. I will bet you are one of those cool people with the static IP address on your iPhone?!?!
I wasn't really trying to antagonize anyone, or make them defensive, but I suppose I failed in that goal. I'll try to explain myself, and once again, I'll use bullet points :
1) I play single-player games. I love them. I spend far more time on them than I should. Here's a little secret for you, though: sometime you beat a game...then you beat it another way, or with another character...and so on. Then, if it's a game you REALLY enjoyed, you have to stop and wait for an expansion to get more content. Sometimes, and I know a multi-player guru such as yourself will find this hard to believe, there IS no expansion or sequel!!! Oh no!
2) Within the constructs of the games themselves, I tend to pay for play. I'm an adult. I make money. I have no problem spending that money on things I enjoy. If I decide to spend all my time in this game at level 2, dropping cash (or not) on dye packs, how does that impinge on your enjoyment? In fact, how does that not enable the devs to produce more and better content for those of you who advance past level 2? In your world of "compete-or-die", I'm only benefitting you.
3) Speaking of competition, I'm as competitive as they come....in the real world. I play video games for a change of pace. Where do you get the idea that your conception of what I should do with my free time is any concern of mine? In my day-to-day job, losing means death; not just for me, but for quite a few other people whom I respect very much. It's very refreshing to enter a virtual world where that's not the case.
4) If everyone played/thought like me, they'd have an almost limitless budget and would be able to develop games you couldn't even dream of. The last "free-to-play" game I played (SW:KOTOR), received over 1k in microtransactions from me as well as dual subscriptions (me and my son). We quit that game for this one.
A sincere thanks for your posts. There's more than one way to enjoy life, and gaming. You gave a moderate answer to a thoughtless post and further explained why many, many people game. I think you need to have worked hard and experience a lot of pressure during the work day to understand how a MMO like Neverwinter is actually quite relaxing and enjoyable and why us working folks don't mind dropping some money on it to enjoy it to the fullest.
Spent the price of a good bottle of whisky on this game, just got to 60 and now I can't play. I was addicted to WoW for years, broke the habit, stopped smoking (twice, this time for real) wasted more time on SWTOR as I kept telling myself it WILL get better then finally I 'fessed up and thought yeah find another interest. So walking away for me and others will be easy.
The game is full of bugs but it's was fun but in light of my previous I don't think I will invest much more time/any money on such an ill conceived product, shame loved paper AD&D back in the 80's.
Well done cryptic, perfect example of, "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory."
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masarykMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
I wonder if the devs can fix the initial post fail at the beginning of this thread?
I know but a lot of these clowns don't have the brains to figure this out themselves
I'm halfway tempted to /tinfoilhat and say the people clamoring for a wipe WANT the game to fail. What possible motivations could nameless faceless individuals have to desire to sabotage a FTP MMO? hmmmm competition?
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cutegayMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 24Arc User
Its already been proven they CANT find all the guilty accounts... you don't see that these exploiters are smarter than the dev team.. this has been going on in STO for some time now... they have all their fake IP's, secondary accounts, mule toons, they CANT and WONT find the accounts. At this point, yes the game is fubar, just like the economy! Wipe is only way, after the exploit is fixed!! Oh here is my source for the claim about not being able to find the accounts; http://www.reddit.com/r/Neverwinter/comments/1eebyi/an_exploiter_claims_to_have_made_almost_six/
If they don't wipe the game I don't think I'm coming back.
People who exploited will still get to keep there purple epic items. f^%$ that. Time to find another game.
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xdprophetMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 15Arc User
Wow, guess you will never be in IT either other than a level one script monkey advising users to reboot their modems. Glad you learned what NAT is, try to find a better venue to flaunt your common knowledge. You have missed the mark here by quite a margin.
Yep. You are another of the idiots that think they can ban by IP address.
Wow, guess you will never be in IT either other than a level one script monkey advising users to reboot their modems. Glad you learned what NAT is, try to find a better venue to flaunt your common knowledge. You have missed the mark here by quite a margin.
Awesome
But banning by IP address IS quite useless, for people who want to bypass it. It's not hard to receive a new IP from your provider. At least, some providers. In my country they are handed out dynamically, so by using knowledge of the DHCP lease timer, and perhaps a 2nd modem (or just put it in bridge mode) you WILL receive a new IP. Sometimes you can just reboot your modem and you'll get one (not a DHCP expert, so no idea why this sometimes happens and sometimes doesn't).
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carlitakosMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 3Arc User
Wow. I guess you will never be IT. Maybe you should go to college. Ever heard of NAT (Network Address Translation)? 100's of thousands can share the same public IP.
NAT got nothing to do outside a router. NAT works inside a LAN, translating the public IP to LAN IP. No two or more routers can share the same Internet/Public IP at the same time.
The problem is that most of internet connections are dsl, which most of the time use dynamic IP. This means that every time you disconnect/reconnect to the internet, you get a new public IP.
When you try to correct someone, make sure to stand correct yourself!
Comments
Bye! Good riddance. I guess you didnt pay much attention in grade school economics did you. Ever hear of the US dollar? Japanese Yen? Governments print new money all the time and economy stabilize at a new equilibrium. The game economy will settle out at a new AD/Zen supply/demand level with no additional steps past removing the exploit.
I could be wrong, but....isn't there STATIC and DYNAMIC NAT? ... rofl... Wouldn't have said anything, but since you're trying to make someone else look stupid I guess I can help you look even more HAMSTER. By the way...you're welcome..I'll be expecting a Christmas Card.
LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You do know this game has only been released for less than a month..... Almost every MMO in the history of MMOS has a bad economy at the start, and it takes them months and some even years to settle down.
But, like I said, a wipe is just a short term solution. At the same time, I just don't see how they can every truly repair the damage done by this without one. Exploited currency has changed hands and forms so many times since launch.. where does it end? You can never get it all, never catch all the ways it impacted the game. No amount of bans or rollback will fix this without going all the way back to the beginning.
But then it would just start again with the next exploit some cheater is sitting on.
This is the first time I've ever supported a wipe, and that's because I honestly hope to continue playing this game for a while. I know that if it isn't wiped, I wouldn't be able to look at it quite the same.
BY the way - no love for old slasher flicks?
I was there for the opening of 6 different MMOs ... this is by far not the smoothest.
IMHO, there is nothing wrong with wanting the exploiters permanently banned. They have done tremendous damage to the game and the enjoyment of honest players.
Matter of fact, the devs have even more control over the economy than those governments, so fixing it should be easier. Not easy ofcourse, I'm hoping they have an economist on staff, and some proper data analysts (although PW has a position open for one of them), so they can properly analyse their actions.
Its already been proven they CANT find all the guilty accounts... you don't see that these exploiters are smarter than the dev team.. this has been going on in STO for some time now... they have all their fake IP's, secondary accounts, mule toons, they CANT and WONT find the accounts. At this point, yes the game is fubar, just like the economy! Wipe is only way, after the exploit is fixed!! Oh here is my source for the claim about not being able to find the accounts; http://www.reddit.com/r/Neverwinter/comments/1eebyi/an_exploiter_claims_to_have_made_almost_six/
"The harder the game, the better."
Wow, guess you will never be in IT either other than a level one script monkey advising users to reboot their modems. Glad you learned what NAT is, try to find a better venue to flaunt your common knowledge. You have missed the mark here by quite a margin.
They don't have to find ALL the exploiters, they just have to find the people who benefitted most from it (or lost most), and deal with them (ban, rollback, value reduction/increase). And ofcourse fix the exploit
Now I am going to do the three Ss (Sh**, Shower, and Shave) then go eat. By the time I am done, I will probably be able to sneak some gaming time in. Act civilized and do something similar rather then sitting on the forums pointless flaming.
1. Put the pom poms down and back away.
2. This is NOT a beta. It's "full live status" already. They sell zen. End of story.
3. As someone who has participated in quite a few PWE betas (closed and open), I can tell you're a first timer. Nice try, but... no this is not their smoothest roll out yet. Saying that proves you haven't been in other PWE betas.
4. The company name is Perfect World Entertainment... PWI is one of their games... Perfect World International. Another dead give away that you don't know what your talking about.
If you've done PWE betas you'd already know that their idea of Open Beta is a full launch. It's not beta mode. lol
I'll gladly take a 3 day ban in exchange for a 900k AD item.
Thanks.
Wow. You are an idiot too. All this points to what? Many people behind the same public IP address(s)? You are only helping prove my point. Wait. I will bet you are one of those cool people with the static IP address on your iPhone?!?!
A sincere thanks for your posts. There's more than one way to enjoy life, and gaming. You gave a moderate answer to a thoughtless post and further explained why many, many people game. I think you need to have worked hard and experience a lot of pressure during the work day to understand how a MMO like Neverwinter is actually quite relaxing and enjoyable and why us working folks don't mind dropping some money on it to enjoy it to the fullest.
The game is full of bugs but it's was fun but in light of my previous I don't think I will invest much more time/any money on such an ill conceived product, shame loved paper AD&D back in the 80's.
Well done cryptic, perfect example of, "snatching defeat from the jaws of victory."
I'm halfway tempted to /tinfoilhat and say the people clamoring for a wipe WANT the game to fail. What possible motivations could nameless faceless individuals have to desire to sabotage a FTP MMO? hmmmm competition?
If they don't wipe the game I don't think I'm coming back.
People who exploited will still get to keep there purple epic items. f^%$ that. Time to find another game.
Yep. You are another of the idiots that think they can ban by IP address.
But banning by IP address IS quite useless, for people who want to bypass it. It's not hard to receive a new IP from your provider. At least, some providers. In my country they are handed out dynamically, so by using knowledge of the DHCP lease timer, and perhaps a 2nd modem (or just put it in bridge mode) you WILL receive a new IP. Sometimes you can just reboot your modem and you'll get one (not a DHCP expert, so no idea why this sometimes happens and sometimes doesn't).
NAT got nothing to do outside a router. NAT works inside a LAN, translating the public IP to LAN IP. No two or more routers can share the same Internet/Public IP at the same time.
The problem is that most of internet connections are dsl, which most of the time use dynamic IP. This means that every time you disconnect/reconnect to the internet, you get a new public IP.
When you try to correct someone, make sure to stand correct yourself!