Subscription would be the way to go. Look at LOTRO they have a perfect balance of people who ride the F2P wagon and those who pay the $15 a month to not be limited at all. Was hoping for the same thing here.
Couldn't agree more...let the consumer decide how to spend their money...I would much rather pay up front, get everything, and know what I'm getting for that cash; than being nickel and dimed for every little bit of "extra" (that in reality, should already be a part of the game)
There's a difference between paying gold to get run through and dibs on gear and just splurging cash on AD to buy end game gear without having to step foot in a dungeon. It will ultimately lead to those not accustomed to PWE's cashgrab greed to abandon ship.
I know I play mmo's to get max level, hit end game, get geared and feel like i've achieved something not rush to the AH to look up if I can buy my gear that way.
Acquiring loot should be a unique experience for everyone not something that is done via cash.
It'll make those who grind out dungeons feel like what theyre doing is pointless to the point they will stop playing.
I agree, but the point I was trying to make is people will still pay for gear regardless if it's sanctioned or not. Somewhere in Asia there would be a warehouse full of computers with kids in front of them, playing clients' accounts, getting that gear for them. The best thing would be to allow players to create gear in the Foundry, and seed it into their content.
Foundry on the other hand needs it's own loot/rewards to merit continuous playing of user created content. Unless of course you're a die hard lore fan or something I doubt once you're decked out in epics/end game gear i'm pretty sure nobody will bother picking up the random unidentified <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> loot that drops.
No no no. I really, really hope you're wrong. We don't need another "rush to max level and then grind endless tiers of loot" game. There are plenty of those to choose from already, and it's a dying formula. D&D is about questing with your friends. It's about stories. It's about progressing your character not through gear, but through experiences.
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thevlakaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Cryptic should've taken a page from GW2's book.
Fair enough GW2 is b2p but at least it's cashgrab is nowhere near as limiting/greedy as it is in NWO.
You start off with a decent size bank and can choose to buy gems to unlock more, bag space too isn't stingy and you're given the choice to unlock extra bag slots AND craft your own bags to boot.
What do we have in NWO? $10 bucks for something that gets bound to one character and that's it. I havent even bothered to look at my bank tab to be honest. It sickened me seeing just 10 slots...
Dodgy practice is dodgy.
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sasajs860Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 1Arc User
Couldn't agree more...let the consumer decide how to spend their money...I would much rather pay up front, get everything, and know what I'm getting for that cash; than being nickel and dimed for every little bit of "extra" (that in reality, should already be a part of the game)
Exactly. And this is a fresh new game, albeit its nothing new, but the game-play is fun. The story is nostalgic, the foundry is a brilliant idea! TBH it seems like the days of large group play is going by the wayside, for me and my friends at least. People are sick of it and some OG MMO'ers have grown tired of Raid Times and having to get groups of 10-40 people together. A game that offers sort of the same feel with end game content that only has to be done in groups of 5 people, or less with companions seems to be a breath of fresh air. They really should think about a subscription and do something about SOME, not all, of the items in the cash shop. Don't even get me started on the crack that is nightmare boxes, I'll admit I am a dumby and have opened about 8 of them. No horse so far of course but thats almost $10 worth of Zen right there....
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thevlakaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I agree, but the point I was trying to make is people will still pay for gear regardless if it's sanctioned or not. Somewhere in Asia there would be a warehouse full of computers with kids in front of them, playing clients' accounts, getting that gear for them. The best thing would be to allow players to create gear in the Foundry, and seed it into their content.
No no no. I really, really hope you're wrong. We don't need another "rush to max level and then grind endless tiers of loot" game. There are plenty of those to choose from already, and it's a dying formula. D&D is about questing with your friends. It's about stories. It's about progressing your character not through gear, but through experiences.
I agree with you 110%. It's up to Cryptic as to how they handle things I guess.
I hope they are reading most of the early criticism and complaints and taking some of them to heart. The pw2 model and the cashgrabbing needs to be retuned if they hope to keep players interested and playing.
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skirge66Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 31Arc User
edited May 2013
it wouldn't be nearly so bothersome to me if things were more reasonably priced...$10 for a single bag? $30 for a companion? Are they trying to make this game implode so they can move on to the next money grab project, leaving this one to wither and die?
maybe the prices are a little high, but when you have a game you can just download and play without buying it, they do have to make money somehow. They have to pay their employees, and they are out to make money.
Really as long as people keep buying things at the price they are at, it will stay there. If no one buys, the prices would drop. Basic rule of supply and demand.
Hm, I semi agree with you.
Solid launch, solid gameplay, very enjoyable and I think the Foundry is going to be enormous in this game. You guys rock at creating some quests btw..(you guys meaning the players). Loved it. My time spent in the game is very rewarding..30 minutes of a foundry quest and I get a level out of it.
Yeah, I haven't seen the cash shop yet but from what I hear its outrageous. You say 10$ for a bag? How many slots? depending on how many slots, I may not think thats outrageous. Remember, you paid 0$ to play. I know people keep saying it, but its true.
Consider the comp, GW2:
Pay $60, at the very least.
The diffference between NW and GW2, in terms of things you get, is GW2 offers up more(I think 4?) bag space for no cost in game(you craft, find, etc). GW2 offers up 3 more character slots in game. Thats what 60$ there gets you.
Now, depending on how many slots the bags are that you can purchase, maybe you can get away with only buying one or two more for 20 dollars. I am not sure how much a char slot is, but fill out the rest of the 60 bucks and you might be pretty close to what GW2 offers you. And that is IF..IF you want more bags or chars. If you are not an altaholic, nothing to worry about.
I played 3 hours last night, level 6 I think. Picked up everything in sight. Not once was I close to filling up that bag.
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sinisterccMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 9Arc User
The inventory limitation is a disgusting cash grab. Why do these developers think this is a good business model? F2P was the worse thing to happen to MMOs. If a game is good, people will pay 15 bucks a month to play. Stop making medoicre games and having pay to win cash shops to fund them. It sucks. I cant wait for this free to play fad to pass. Paying money for in game items is just stupid.
The only games that are free to play and done right are Dota 2 and Path of Exile. This is because all the cash shop items are cosmetic and add no gameplay value. If a game is going to be free to play then this is how it needs to be done. Otherwise its going to fail.
While it is a limitation, you will receive several bags as quest rewards throughout your travels. By level 30 you will have 3 bags.
That's kind of my point PWTHEBEST and Lightonwater. I think the very hig price on some of these essential items will turn off many from purchasing them, whereas they could bundle say a 16 slot bag, profession pack and 5 lockbox keys into a $15 package and sell a whole lot of them.
The "standard" 15$ a month for a subscription is something I think many people got used to paying, and if these FTP games would set their cash shops up so that they had some nice items in bundles for around that amount I bet they'd see a lot better steady income and not peaks and valleys based on "specials" and "sales".
How would you base it on $15 a month? Do you assume the player will play five years? So the average would be $900 per person. So what would prices on the items be $30-$50 a piece for every little thing? You can probably do $10 per major item if it only unlocks on one character. Because the problem with buying stuff is it becomes permanently unlocked and can no longer generate money.
While it is a limitation, you will receive several bags as quest rewards throughout your travels. By level 30 you will have 3 bags.
Have to agree with Sin here, at 60 I've never felt the need through the leveling to HAVE to have an extra bag. Sure I got an extra 12 slot from HotN, but most of the time, just selling whenever I was sent back to the quest hub between groups of missions I had plenty of storage. Actually, keeping to level appropriate potions and the like and selling anything not level appropriate or any gear received as rewards that I didn't use I usually had plenty of empty bag space. Just make sure you don't keep unnecessary lower level potions and sell any drops you aren't using and you're fine. And before anyone goes "but, but I want to auction my gear", the gear you get is the same/comparable to everyone else that is doing those quests get as drops, works equally well, and flows like water so there really is no need to auction off any gear that drops prior to the 60s is not necessary.
This isn't like other games when it comes to gear where it is hard to get drops for it, it's laying all over the place after battles much of the time.
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hydrahamMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Agreed. I feel bad for people that paid money for the game. Perfect world has what ? 10 mmorpgs? And they are all fail. I mean they do not know how to run a successful MMORPG. the cash shop is horrible and even if I end up really liking the gameplay, I will never play this game for any significant amount of time because of the horrible business model.
You dislike the company so much you continue to give them traffic on their forums and post?
Agreed. I feel bad for people that paid money for the game. Perfect world has what ? 10 mmorpgs? And they are all fail. I mean they do not know how to run a successful MMORPG. the cash shop is horrible and even if I end up really liking the gameplay, I will never play this game for any significant amount of time because of the horrible business model.
Not sure I would say "all fail", they've tripled their profit year over year, or so they say. If true then something must be working.
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thevlakaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
nevertheless $10 for one bag which gets bound to the toon using it is still ridiculous. Now if that same bag was account bound it wouldn't be a bother.
Look at the default bank slots...tell me that doesn't reek of forced cashgrab.
At least allow players to pay to unlock tabs with AD (much like GW2 used gems, but then again you can exchange gold for gems in GW2) and craft their own freaking bags!!!
I don't mind paying 60 bucks for a game or even if there are cash shops, but what is annoying is all the nickel and dime <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> that is done. I understand they need the money for payroll but the pricing does seem a bit high, maybe it will be reduced as time goes on. I would pay the 60 bucks but you don't seem to get anything decent from it either... meh
That's kind of my point PWTHEBEST and Lightonwater. I think the very hig price on some of these essential items will turn off many from purchasing them, whereas they could bundle say a 16 slot bag, profession pack and 5 lockbox keys into a $15 package and sell a whole lot of them.
The "standard" 15$ a month for a subscription is something I think many people got used to paying, and if these FTP games would set their cash shops up so that they had some nice items in bundles for around that amount I bet they'd see a lot better steady income and not peaks and valleys based on "specials" and "sales".
It's a marketing ploy far and simple. Any marketing expert can tell you that it's easier to get someone to spend $5 a week than it is to get them to pay $15 a month. People will spend more if it's in small amounts than in one large sum.
The beauty of this system (from the companies point of view) is that they have your money from the moment you transfer the Zen into Neverwinter, so if you pay $5 a week too save up for a $40 mount, they have your money the moment it's transferred in, not from the moment you purchase your item.
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thevlakaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
now if someone could please explain to me the purpose of having 3 different currencies in game maybe my feeble brain won't implode.
Gold can't be exchanged for anything and only buys <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> which drops off mobs anyways thus is ultimately useless.
AD for Zen.
Zen for things that should be purchased via AD but isn't.
Correct me if i'm wrong.
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sinisterccMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 9Arc User
now if someone could please explain to me the purpose of having 3 different currencies in game maybe my feeble brain won't implode.
Gold can't be exchanged for anything and only buys <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> which drops off mobs anyways thus is ultimately useless.
AD for Zen.
Zen for things that should be purchased via AD but isn't.
Correct me if i'm wrong.
There are more like 6 currencies, actually However, gold is used to purchase potions and crafting items which are both very necessary. You can convert AD and Zen both ways btw, and you are able to receive AD in game by doing daily quests and such. So, theoretically, you could spend forever grinding dailies to purchase X item you wanted from the Zen store. Although, they do cap the amount of ADs you can get this way at 24k per day, which makes it very difficult to accomplish.
Totally agree. I want to spend money on this game, but I won't ever be caught paying for bag space, it's just dumb.
Not that I want to defend them (because, hey, lower prices would certainly be nice)....
...if you want to see "pathetically obvious cash grab"/etc, you should check out Aeria games. Was bored the other week (waiting for this) so I tried their latest gratuitous-nudity game (yeah, yeah :rolleyes:)
You want obvious cashgrab?
Multiple types of random lockboxes to buy, up to $5 each.
Only way to get permanent inventory expansions (yes, the cheap ones - $3 each - only last a month) is in random boxes, ultra rare.
Only way to get permanent bank expansions, is in random box, ultra rare.
Once, after people complained about inventory & boxes being random prizes only, they made a package with a costume, a bag, and a bank, no randoms..... it was $200.
They have weekend sales "events" where if you spend enough money, you a bonus (with increasing "tiers" of prizes, as you spend more). Some of them have topped out at $150+.
Oh, and there's no way to buy/earn their cash shop currency in-game.
So, yeah. While it would be nice if the prices here were lower? There's infinitely worse out there.
re: "I won't ever be caught paying for bag space"..... honestly? It's utility stuff like that, and costumes, that I'm most likely to buy. Inventory space, character slots - permanent stuff that's good value, compared to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> like temporary buffs or consumables. I really wish there was an account bank you could buy. Although the mail system isn't bad.
...hmm, there's a thought. 2 character slots for $5. Make a "mule", play it up through Blacklake for the first bag, and just mail all the useful & tradable extra bits (bounty marks, etc) to them
So, theoretically, you could spend forever grinding dailies to purchase X item you wanted from the Zen store. Although, they do cap the amount of ADs you can get this way at 24k per day, which makes it very difficult to accomplish.
In Star Trek Online, the daily dilithium cap seems (to me at least) to have kept inflation down on the market. Of course, you use the gold-equivalent in the auction house, so that's a complication here. The other thing throwing a wrench in the works is the vast amount of loose AD thrown into the market by people who bought the starter packs - that's got to twist up the exchange a bit right now. Wonder how long it'll take to find a semi-stable trade rate.
(I've done quite well in STO - yeah, I've put real money into the game, but I've also gained 6-8k zen over time off the dilithium exchange. Helped that I played during a market slump where the rate was 100-130 dil / zen)
Well , PWI also has one bag and u need to buy a stone from the CS to increase it.Same with bank, account stash , etc.So it is a regular thing for perfect world, altho i think is still bad, it isnt something they havent done before :S
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thevlakaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
There are more like 6 currencies, actually However, gold is used to purchase potions and crafting items which are both very necessary. You can convert AD and Zen both ways btw, and you are able to receive AD in game by doing daily quests and such. So, theoretically, you could spend forever grinding dailies to purchase X item you wanted from the Zen store. Although, they do cap the amount of ADs you can get this way at 24k per day, which makes it very difficult to accomplish.
Even so, you could just go farm for pots and crafting items right?
The whole cashgrab argument wouldn't be so bad if they didnt enforce all these restrictions and absurd systems in the first place.
So realistically Gold is a dead currency and AD/Zen is where it's at.
No Gold exchange for anything apart from pots and other things we can farm off mobs.
I will forever be amazed at how well GW2 uses it cash shop. Gold for gems, gems for gold. Gems unlock bag slots, bank slots and if I remember correctly respecs? BUT the player is given the opportunity to craft their own bags. This is how it should be done. CHOICE.
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kendokkenMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 15Arc User
Lots of sane comments, thanks for the additional feedback everyone. I'm hearing some of you say that since people are paying the high prices, then those prices must be OK. While that's true, it doesn't mean it will be valid for the long haul. We only have a handfull of classes right now, with many more slated to be released. You get an abysmally low number of character slots, 2, for a regular player. How many of those people do you think are going to be happy spending $10 just to get a new character slot, and then whatever horrendously high price PWI puts on the new classes when they are released? You know they aren't just going to put them out for free if the current cash shop strategy is any example.
On to the respecs... So they are Zen only items. Not sure about the other classes, but the Control Wizard has only one paragon path to chose from, but "more are on the way". So when we get those new paragon paths, will we be forced to cash buy a respec token to chose them? Or will we get free respecs every time a new paragon path is released?
My big concern is for the longevity of the game. As the cash shop currently stands, I just don't see this game as being able to maintain any degree of great success. Sure, it may be able to eek out a modicum of profit with a small player base and high prices, but if we the players can convince them to keep the prices reasonable and appropriate for the long haul then this game may well be what it is capable of being. A great FTP beer and peanuts DND game.
I think it was a bad move on PW's part to sell respecs.
reasoning? It takes all of 48 hours to get to 60. So it is much better to just reroll than spend 6bucks to respec. Hell it's cheaper to buy char slots at 5bucks for 2 slots and make 2 diiferent versions of your class so you don't need to keep respeccing. I.E. PvP vs. PvE spec, and I have yet to see any game not require different specs. Hell, most games require a respec at level cap just from a PVE aspect (solo leveling vs. forced group gear treadmills ad-naseum).
Now, with that in mind, I won't ever buy ANYTHING for my characters because they will most likely get deleted to reroll at some point and all those VIRTUAL items i paid REAL money for are permanently gone. So only account upgrades like char slots for me thanks.
So in effect they are hurting the sales of other items by implementing this ridiculous respec cost. I believe this will also hurt the longevity of the game, because of no real attachment being formed with your characters.
The inventory limitation is a disgusting cash grab. Why do these developers think this is a good business model? F2P was the worse thing to happen to MMOs. If a game is good, people will pay 15 bucks a month to play. Stop making medoicre games and having pay to win cash shops to fund them. It sucks. I cant wait for this free to play fad to pass. Paying money for in game items is just stupid.
The only games that are free to play and done right are Dota 2 and Path of Exile. This is because all the cash shop items are cosmetic and add no gameplay value. If a game is going to be free to play then this is how it needs to be done. Otherwise its going to fail.
Unfortunately, f2p is not going anywhere. I actually read an article the other day that US based f2p games make double the amount of money in a year than they would off of a sub based game. It works, because there are a lot of players willing to pay the prices. For many of us, especially those of us that started off MMO's in the sub based era, its going to be a big adjustment. We are used to paying 15 bucks a month and getting all these things in game through means of our own. So seeing a game only giving us the option to buy, with real money, a bag....its a "woah" moment.
Like people have said time and time again, talk with your wallet, if people dont pay those prices...then the prices will go down because they wont be making any money.
However, they do have a wide array of prices for cosmetic items, mounts, fashion..etc. Some are 12 up to 30, mounts are 5 up to 40. I, for the moment, will believe that over time they will come out with more reasonable prices, bundles, whatever. I think, this is also the reason its still labeled as Open Beta. To get feedback on everything, including the cash shop. Time will tell, I guess.
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thevlakaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
Unfortunately, f2p is not going anywhere. I actually read an article the other day that US based f2p games make double the amount of money in a year than they would off of a sub based game. It works, because there are a lot of players willing to pay the prices. For many of us, especially those of us that started off MMO's in the sub based era, its going to be a big adjustment. We are used to paying 15 bucks a month and getting all these things in game through means of our own. So seeing a game only giving us the option to buy, with real money, a bag....its a "woah" moment.
Like people have said time and time again, talk with your wallet, if people dont pay those prices...then the prices will go down because they wont be making any money.
However, they do have a wide array of prices for cosmetic items, mounts, fashion..etc. Some are 12 up to 30, mounts are 5 up to 40. I, for the moment, will believe that over time they will come out with more reasonable prices, bundles, whatever. I think, this is also the reason its still labeled as Open Beta. To get feedback on everything, including the cash shop. Time will tell, I guess.
if what you say is true in regards to feedback then prhaps they shouldve given everyone who participates in the 'open beta' a **** tonne of AD to play with.
again I will reiterate my argument that GW2 does it right. We have choices which make the b2p option much more appealing in the long run.
reading this, I lost my desire to play,
I thought they were going to get a balanced business model. Before investing money in the game wanted to make sure it was not a pay to pay to play to win and pay. hopefully the company improves this. ... Real money to respec .. my god ..
sorry for my english!
i read this from other user
"It's INSANELY expensive to alter the appearance of your gear with astral diamonds, and the cost isn't tired by level either."
+1 This game is all about making money through the Zen shop. If things aren't changed, not just prices of the shop, the game is just gonna be another typical distraction.
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cihuacoatlMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited May 2013
I agree that items are a bit expensive. However there are not a lot of items in the store in the first place. Only a few companions even worth looking at... costumes are neat but not for me. Mounts... already purchased one. Wards I am sure will have their day. Nightmare boxs are nice but they could do more with them... see Atlantica Online. Their box system is a beast and very addictive.
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thevlakaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I agree that items are a bit expensive. However there are not a lot of items in the store in the first place. Only a few companions even worth looking at... costumes are neat but not for me. Mounts... already purchased one. Wards I am sure will have their day. Nightmare boxs are nice but they could do more with them... see Atlantica Online. Their box system is a beast and very addictive.
The New trend in gaming are that they expect a small percentage of the players to cover up the loss of subscription.
You see the same thing in World of Tanks as well, where they have even gone Pay to Win With Premium ammo and gold tanks.
You should expect these games to go belly up, but they dont, because of that percentage that really dont care what it costs.
I have alot of Money if i wanted too, i just dont like beeing held Ransom over my wallet, and thats what it feels like sometimes.
Ill do the Math and see if i can get what i need to enjoy the game without getting robbed. If i do ill play.
You can always subtract a Box price + a few months Worth and see what you get for it.
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Couldn't agree more...let the consumer decide how to spend their money...I would much rather pay up front, get everything, and know what I'm getting for that cash; than being nickel and dimed for every little bit of "extra" (that in reality, should already be a part of the game)
No no no. I really, really hope you're wrong. We don't need another "rush to max level and then grind endless tiers of loot" game. There are plenty of those to choose from already, and it's a dying formula. D&D is about questing with your friends. It's about stories. It's about progressing your character not through gear, but through experiences.
Fair enough GW2 is b2p but at least it's cashgrab is nowhere near as limiting/greedy as it is in NWO.
You start off with a decent size bank and can choose to buy gems to unlock more, bag space too isn't stingy and you're given the choice to unlock extra bag slots AND craft your own bags to boot.
What do we have in NWO? $10 bucks for something that gets bound to one character and that's it. I havent even bothered to look at my bank tab to be honest. It sickened me seeing just 10 slots...
Dodgy practice is dodgy.
Exactly. And this is a fresh new game, albeit its nothing new, but the game-play is fun. The story is nostalgic, the foundry is a brilliant idea! TBH it seems like the days of large group play is going by the wayside, for me and my friends at least. People are sick of it and some OG MMO'ers have grown tired of Raid Times and having to get groups of 10-40 people together. A game that offers sort of the same feel with end game content that only has to be done in groups of 5 people, or less with companions seems to be a breath of fresh air. They really should think about a subscription and do something about SOME, not all, of the items in the cash shop. Don't even get me started on the crack that is nightmare boxes, I'll admit I am a dumby and have opened about 8 of them. No horse so far of course but thats almost $10 worth of Zen right there....
I agree with you 110%. It's up to Cryptic as to how they handle things I guess.
I hope they are reading most of the early criticism and complaints and taking some of them to heart. The pw2 model and the cashgrabbing needs to be retuned if they hope to keep players interested and playing.
Really as long as people keep buying things at the price they are at, it will stay there. If no one buys, the prices would drop. Basic rule of supply and demand.
Solid launch, solid gameplay, very enjoyable and I think the Foundry is going to be enormous in this game. You guys rock at creating some quests btw..(you guys meaning the players). Loved it. My time spent in the game is very rewarding..30 minutes of a foundry quest and I get a level out of it.
Yeah, I haven't seen the cash shop yet but from what I hear its outrageous. You say 10$ for a bag? How many slots? depending on how many slots, I may not think thats outrageous. Remember, you paid 0$ to play. I know people keep saying it, but its true.
Consider the comp, GW2:
Pay $60, at the very least.
The diffference between NW and GW2, in terms of things you get, is GW2 offers up more(I think 4?) bag space for no cost in game(you craft, find, etc). GW2 offers up 3 more character slots in game. Thats what 60$ there gets you.
Now, depending on how many slots the bags are that you can purchase, maybe you can get away with only buying one or two more for 20 dollars. I am not sure how much a char slot is, but fill out the rest of the 60 bucks and you might be pretty close to what GW2 offers you. And that is IF..IF you want more bags or chars. If you are not an altaholic, nothing to worry about.
I played 3 hours last night, level 6 I think. Picked up everything in sight. Not once was I close to filling up that bag.
While it is a limitation, you will receive several bags as quest rewards throughout your travels. By level 30 you will have 3 bags.
How would you base it on $15 a month? Do you assume the player will play five years? So the average would be $900 per person. So what would prices on the items be $30-$50 a piece for every little thing? You can probably do $10 per major item if it only unlocks on one character. Because the problem with buying stuff is it becomes permanently unlocked and can no longer generate money.
Have to agree with Sin here, at 60 I've never felt the need through the leveling to HAVE to have an extra bag. Sure I got an extra 12 slot from HotN, but most of the time, just selling whenever I was sent back to the quest hub between groups of missions I had plenty of storage. Actually, keeping to level appropriate potions and the like and selling anything not level appropriate or any gear received as rewards that I didn't use I usually had plenty of empty bag space. Just make sure you don't keep unnecessary lower level potions and sell any drops you aren't using and you're fine. And before anyone goes "but, but I want to auction my gear", the gear you get is the same/comparable to everyone else that is doing those quests get as drops, works equally well, and flows like water so there really is no need to auction off any gear that drops prior to the 60s is not necessary.
This isn't like other games when it comes to gear where it is hard to get drops for it, it's laying all over the place after battles much of the time.
Logic bro. You don't have it.
Not sure I would say "all fail", they've tripled their profit year over year, or so they say. If true then something must be working.
Look at the default bank slots...tell me that doesn't reek of forced cashgrab.
At least allow players to pay to unlock tabs with AD (much like GW2 used gems, but then again you can exchange gold for gems in GW2) and craft their own freaking bags!!!
It's a marketing ploy far and simple. Any marketing expert can tell you that it's easier to get someone to spend $5 a week than it is to get them to pay $15 a month. People will spend more if it's in small amounts than in one large sum.
The beauty of this system (from the companies point of view) is that they have your money from the moment you transfer the Zen into Neverwinter, so if you pay $5 a week too save up for a $40 mount, they have your money the moment it's transferred in, not from the moment you purchase your item.
Gold can't be exchanged for anything and only buys <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> which drops off mobs anyways thus is ultimately useless.
AD for Zen.
Zen for things that should be purchased via AD but isn't.
Correct me if i'm wrong.
There are more like 6 currencies, actually
Not that I want to defend them (because, hey, lower prices would certainly be nice)....
...if you want to see "pathetically obvious cash grab"/etc, you should check out Aeria games. Was bored the other week (waiting for this) so I tried their latest gratuitous-nudity game (yeah, yeah :rolleyes:)
You want obvious cashgrab?
Multiple types of random lockboxes to buy, up to $5 each.
Only way to get permanent inventory expansions (yes, the cheap ones - $3 each - only last a month) is in random boxes, ultra rare.
Only way to get permanent bank expansions, is in random box, ultra rare.
Once, after people complained about inventory & boxes being random prizes only, they made a package with a costume, a bag, and a bank, no randoms..... it was $200.
They have weekend sales "events" where if you spend enough money, you a bonus (with increasing "tiers" of prizes, as you spend more). Some of them have topped out at $150+.
Oh, and there's no way to buy/earn their cash shop currency in-game.
So, yeah. While it would be nice if the prices here were lower? There's infinitely worse out there.
re: "I won't ever be caught paying for bag space"..... honestly? It's utility stuff like that, and costumes, that I'm most likely to buy. Inventory space, character slots - permanent stuff that's good value, compared to <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> like temporary buffs or consumables. I really wish there was an account bank you could buy. Although the mail system isn't bad.
...hmm, there's a thought. 2 character slots for $5. Make a "mule", play it up through Blacklake for the first bag, and just mail all the useful & tradable extra bits (bounty marks, etc) to them
In Star Trek Online, the daily dilithium cap seems (to me at least) to have kept inflation down on the market. Of course, you use the gold-equivalent in the auction house, so that's a complication here. The other thing throwing a wrench in the works is the vast amount of loose AD thrown into the market by people who bought the starter packs - that's got to twist up the exchange a bit right now. Wonder how long it'll take to find a semi-stable trade rate.
(I've done quite well in STO - yeah, I've put real money into the game, but I've also gained 6-8k zen over time off the dilithium exchange. Helped that I played during a market slump where the rate was 100-130 dil / zen)
Even so, you could just go farm for pots and crafting items right?
The whole cashgrab argument wouldn't be so bad if they didnt enforce all these restrictions and absurd systems in the first place.
So realistically Gold is a dead currency and AD/Zen is where it's at.
No Gold exchange for anything apart from pots and other things we can farm off mobs.
I will forever be amazed at how well GW2 uses it cash shop. Gold for gems, gems for gold. Gems unlock bag slots, bank slots and if I remember correctly respecs? BUT the player is given the opportunity to craft their own bags. This is how it should be done. CHOICE.
I think it was a bad move on PW's part to sell respecs.
reasoning? It takes all of 48 hours to get to 60. So it is much better to just reroll than spend 6bucks to respec. Hell it's cheaper to buy char slots at 5bucks for 2 slots and make 2 diiferent versions of your class so you don't need to keep respeccing. I.E. PvP vs. PvE spec, and I have yet to see any game not require different specs. Hell, most games require a respec at level cap just from a PVE aspect (solo leveling vs. forced group gear treadmills ad-naseum).
Now, with that in mind, I won't ever buy ANYTHING for my characters because they will most likely get deleted to reroll at some point and all those VIRTUAL items i paid REAL money for are permanently gone. So only account upgrades like char slots for me thanks.
So in effect they are hurting the sales of other items by implementing this ridiculous respec cost. I believe this will also hurt the longevity of the game, because of no real attachment being formed with your characters.
Unfortunately, f2p is not going anywhere. I actually read an article the other day that US based f2p games make double the amount of money in a year than they would off of a sub based game. It works, because there are a lot of players willing to pay the prices. For many of us, especially those of us that started off MMO's in the sub based era, its going to be a big adjustment. We are used to paying 15 bucks a month and getting all these things in game through means of our own. So seeing a game only giving us the option to buy, with real money, a bag....its a "woah" moment.
Like people have said time and time again, talk with your wallet, if people dont pay those prices...then the prices will go down because they wont be making any money.
However, they do have a wide array of prices for cosmetic items, mounts, fashion..etc. Some are 12 up to 30, mounts are 5 up to 40. I, for the moment, will believe that over time they will come out with more reasonable prices, bundles, whatever. I think, this is also the reason its still labeled as Open Beta. To get feedback on everything, including the cash shop. Time will tell, I guess.
if what you say is true in regards to feedback then prhaps they shouldve given everyone who participates in the 'open beta' a **** tonne of AD to play with.
again I will reiterate my argument that GW2 does it right. We have choices which make the b2p option much more appealing in the long run.
I thought they were going to get a balanced business model. Before investing money in the game wanted to make sure it was not a pay to pay to play to win and pay. hopefully the company improves this. ... Real money to respec .. my god ..
sorry for my english!
i read this from other user
"It's INSANELY expensive to alter the appearance of your gear with astral diamonds, and the cost isn't tired by level either."
thats right?
like making the keys a rare drop for example.
You see the same thing in World of Tanks as well, where they have even gone Pay to Win With Premium ammo and gold tanks.
You should expect these games to go belly up, but they dont, because of that percentage that really dont care what it costs.
I have alot of Money if i wanted too, i just dont like beeing held Ransom over my wallet, and thats what it feels like sometimes.
Ill do the Math and see if i can get what i need to enjoy the game without getting robbed. If i do ill play.
You can always subtract a Box price + a few months Worth and see what you get for it.