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OFFICIAL: Refinement Changes

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  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User
    edited December 2021
    stark760 said:
    T he combat enchant replacing weapon/armor, is 4k IL in the rank 4 box and 5k IL maxed, and gives no combined rating.

    Weapon and armor enchants don't have combined ratings now...why would they randomly add it now?
  • wilbur626wilbur626 Member Posts: 1,002 Arc User

    wilbur626 said:

    If your damage/damage resistance/threat generation/healing is increased, does it really matter what %s are shown in your character sheet ?

    Yes it matters, TIL unlocks the gates to content, particularly End Game content but it's your Total % Values that determine how effective your Chr is in scaled content which is basically everywhere else
    The fact that the combat enchantment adds more damage/damage resistance than the stat loss is not relevant ?
    Elite Whaleboy
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    wilbur626 said:

    wilbur626 said:

    If your damage/damage resistance/threat generation/healing is increased, does it really matter what %s are shown in your character sheet ?

    Yes it matters, TIL unlocks the gates to content, particularly End Game content but it's your Total % Values that determine how effective your Chr is in scaled content which is basically everywhere else
    The fact that the combat enchantment adds more damage/damage resistance than the stat loss is not relevant ?
    I'd rather keep my negation, which has more damage resist, and the option on weapon enchant at same time of bronzewood, frost, etc.
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    stark760 said:
    T he combat enchant replacing weapon/armor, is 4k IL in the rank 4 box and 5k IL maxed, and gives no combined rating.
    Weapon and armor enchants don't have combined ratings now...why would they randomly add it now?

    1.6k IL hurts, but you got both enchants and what they did. Now it's 5k IL, and effectively does less in my opinion. So you lose 3.4k there(or 3.4% on each stat), the 160 combined rating on each of 6 runestones(960 combined rating), and the addition of the bonus, that has no combined either. I couldn't see at work that weapon/armor enchant. Also the enchants give 150 more IL than combined rating on each. Altogether, you lose 1.35k there, 1.5 on runestone, 1.5k on bonus, and 3.4k more on combat. So that's 7.75k IL more than rating(we lose % from that spread), and we get 18k more stat across 10 stats to balance, or 1.8k each on avg. That means we're in the hole 5.95% on each stat.


  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User
    Again, why would they randomly add combined ratings to something that never has had it in the first place?

  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    Again, why would they randomly add combined ratings to something that never has had it in the first place?



    Fair enough, why take them away from runestone?
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User
    stark760 said:

    arazith07 said:

    Again, why would they randomly add combined ratings to something that never has had it in the first place?

    Or raise it from 1.6k IL with none to 5k with none, and making the player lose 3.4% more stat.

    Ok...Let's add Combined rating to everything so that stats on gear mean absolutely nothing. Who cares about balance and choice?
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    stark760 said:

    arazith07 said:

    Again, why would they randomly add combined ratings to something that never has had it in the first place?

    Or raise it from 1.6k IL with none to 5k with none, and making the player lose 3.4% more stat.
    Ok...Let's add Combined rating to everything so that stats on gear mean absolutely nothing. Who cares about balance and choice?

    And what choice, the enchants are a fraction of the choice of what they were(no more 3 way split or working your build for fine tuning), the weapon/armor enchants are 6 total now and we get to pick 1, runestones don't help healers or tanks anymore if they trying to get awareness, etc. Making items stronger they are doing(and we pay), with less choice and flexibility, and at same time making DPS squishier, tanks do less damage, and heals get nothing.
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User
    You can chose to use the higher ilevel item, gaining in damage and HP, or use a lower one (or have nothing) and not lose your other stats. Also if everything has the same item level as Combined rating, all the stats will just hit the cap, making the addition stats on gear/enchantments useless.
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    You can chose to use the higher ilevel item, gaining in damage and HP, or use a lower one (or have nothing) and not lose your other stats. Also if everything has the same item level as Combined rating, all the stats will just hit the cap, making the addition stats on gear/enchantments useless.

    Cause you smart
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    @arazith07
    why no comment on removal of combined rating off runestones? Just curious.
  • arazith07arazith07 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,508 Arc User
    stark760 said:

    @arazith07
    why no comment on removal of combined rating off runestones? Just curious.

    Oh idk, because it falls under the same argument we've been having? And no I don't think that combined rating should be removed from everything. However with runestones, they now act like weapon/armor enchants and mount collars in where they give something that isn't just a stat.
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    @arazith07
    why no comment on removal of combined rating off runestones? Just curious.

    Wouldnt it be better if you showed an actual example of the stat loss you are so worried about instead of making claims without any form of documentation ?
    And fudge a screenshot like you did by stacking 1 enchant...sure...not in game, youll get your screen shots, just like last one for chart, glad you ignored.
  • wilbur626wilbur626 Member Posts: 1,002 Arc User
    edited December 2021
    stark760 said:

    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    @arazith07
    why no comment on removal of combined rating off runestones? Just curious.

    Wouldnt it be better if you showed an actual example of the stat loss you are so worried about instead of making claims without any form of documentation ?
    And fudge a screenshot like you did by stacking 1 enchant...sure...not in game, youll get your screen shots, just like last one for chart, glad you ignored.
    What do you mean "fudge a screenshot stacking 1 enchant" ? I can teach you how to work with the new system if you want ?
    Elite Whaleboy
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    arazith07 said:

    stark760 said:

    @arazith07
    why no comment on removal of combined rating off runestones? Just curious.

    Oh idk, because it falls under the same argument we've been having? And no I don't think that combined rating should be removed from everything. However with runestones, they now act like weapon/armor enchants and mount collars in where they give something that isn't just a stat.
    So to you it makes sense to remove from runestone combined rating and not add to bonus enchant...which makes dps squishier, tanks hold less threat, and healers best to not upgrade, as nothing helps them. I never said add combined rating equal to IL. I don't think it's right with changes, to make it so we're suddenly short from runestone, bonus, and combat(even more now than before) and it does less and restricts choice, and we get to pay coal wards to experience.
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    How bout that chart
  • wilbur626wilbur626 Member Posts: 1,002 Arc User
    edited December 2021
    stark760 said:

    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    @arazith07
    why no comment on removal of combined rating off runestones? Just curious.

    Wouldnt it be better if you showed an actual example of the stat loss you are so worried about instead of making claims without any form of documentation ?
    And fudge a screenshot like you did by stacking 1 enchant...sure...not in game, youll get your screen shots, just like last one for chart, glad you ignored.
    What do you mean "fudge a screenshot stacking 1 enchant" ? I can teach you how to work with the new system if you want ?
    I'm good man, I don't want thread closed due to moderator, which i know is your goal. Still curious on threat generation...if tanks go up 15000 IL and get 1.5 base damage, thats great...dps also go up 15k IL and get 1.8k base damage, but that helps tanks.
    I dont think the moderators will close the thread for me offering to help you.

    How does tank base threat generation compare to DPS base threat generation ?

    Are you trying to tell me that increasing item level is not increasing threat generation ?
    Elite Whaleboy
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    @arazith07
    why no comment on removal of combined rating off runestones? Just curious.

    Wouldnt it be better if you showed an actual example of the stat loss you are so worried about instead of making claims without any form of documentation ?
    And fudge a screenshot like you did by stacking 1 enchant...sure...not in game, youll get your screen shots, just like last one for chart, glad you ignored.
    What do you mean "fudge a screenshot stacking 1 enchant" ? I can teach you how to work with the new system if you want ?
    I'm good man, I don't want thread closed due to moderator, which i know is your goal. Still curious on threat generation...if tanks go up 15000 IL and get 1.5 base damage, thats great...dps also go up 15k IL and get 1.8k base damage, but that helps tanks.
    I dont think the moderators will close the thread for me offering to help you.

    How does tank base threat generation compare to DPS base threat generation ?

    Are you trying to tell me that increasing item level is not increasing threat generation ?
    Increasing that does help, but DPS also go up that same amount, and get a .2 multiplier also. If they go up as much as tanks, and get squishier, losing def stats. Also going to lose % on offense stats if tank, working on your screenshots.
  • olocancom#0595 olocancom Member Posts: 89 Arc User
    Have you been on preview and played around with things? Acquired some of the new gear? Because I've been over there quite a bit and I'm not struggling at all even though I don't have any stats at 90% right now. (Not that I do on live, but it's never stopped me from running any of the content successfully, often as top paingiver and I'm a wizard.) I've done the first leg of the campaign twice now. Once with my normal gear and only exchanged enchantments and once with upgraded enchantments and new gear. I didn't feel like either build was lacking, but the 75k does feel good.

    @noworries#8859 is obviously paying attention. Legitimate concerns like rank 8 & 9 armor/weapon enchants being able to convert to illusions, trading in MoP's for AD (hope you don't plan to get zen from the exchange any time next year) and creating account mythic enchants so your alts don't fall behind (not like they were ahead with rank 9 enchants) are pretty good resolutions imo. But you're just beating a dead horse with this combined rating on 3 enchants. Your feedback has been read, it's why he acknowledged combined rating in his post. Arguing isn't going to change anything.

    I'm not some Cryptic boot licker. I'm sure Julia is sick of me bitching about VoS RNG every other week (still waiting for that reply @nitocris83 ). But this change isn't all the doom and gloom some people are making it out to be. If you're reading this and haven't copied over your character, go do it. Copy it over a couple of times. And play with the new system. If your best enchants are rank 9, vendor is in the Adventurer's Guild. 100k for a rank 1, not the 1 million as stated in another post.
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    How bout that chart

    That is a very nice chart! How do you use that information to calculate your damage when base damage increases but ratings decrease ?

    I made a chart that will help you just as much with that calculation as the one you posted :


    You know rainer, why not ask him. Im guessing you already did, and you are the company, so do you.
  • wilbur626wilbur626 Member Posts: 1,002 Arc User
    stark760 said:

    wilbur626 said:

    stark760 said:

    How bout that chart

    That is a very nice chart! How do you use that information to calculate your damage when base damage increases but ratings decrease ?

    I made a chart that will help you just as much with that calculation as the one you posted :


    You know rainer, why not ask him. Im guessing you already did, and you are the company, so do you.
    You use a chart to prove a point, but you are unable to use the chart to prove the point ?

    I dont know if I understand that company part ?
    Elite Whaleboy
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    edited December 2021
    You dont understand math then, and you know exactly what i mean, cause you had rainer and mod jump inthread after you said something you shouldnt have. That sum it up
  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    Not in guild yet, as i just copied, to verify not been tinkered with.
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