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OFFICIAL: Refinement Changes



  • stark760stark760 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 588 Arc User
    Also wondering, should players that have unbound enchants, get a little more on turning for medallions.
    arazith07 said:

    I would also like to say 28 characters of which 21 on one account and 7 on the other and yes when I was naïve and stupid I bought coal wards and made weapon and armor enchants because I was stupid and bought campaign starter packs that gave me three coal wards so I have cash invested in many of my characters in form of rank 8 and 9 weapons and armor enchants and I doubt I am the only one, and because you can only refine 100k ad a day I had to buy stuff like that from Zen store to outfit my alts, as well as the slots for those alts, and now my investment is worth a visual effect, please look at what you are saying and if people you do this to are going to want to spend money to keep you in a job.

    So now instead of having 21 different sets of enchantments, you can just work on upgrading ONE set and then trade them for the account set and all your 21 alts on the one account will be set.
    If i wanted to slot that many enchants, at rank 9 or so, not that much. If you have to spend 32 coal wards and the 7 mil in glyphs to achieve "account-wide" set of the 12, and not all classes are going to need same ones, i'd rather not have to commit 40+ mil AD to have account wide. I'd rather have my unbound enchants, which is another issue. Will unbound enchants pull more value?
  • tamtoucantamtoucan Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 64 Arc User
    edited December 2021
    Disclaimer: This is the view a "general" player, not a min-maxer, or end-gamer. Yes I run VoS (give my my Healer ring! 100s runs and still....) Anyway, those players have very different concerns about the changes.

    Some more feedback.

    I think you are going to cause a lot of confusion by saying the new system gives players more options. The reality on Live is that R9 stat enchantments are fine. I always tell players that higher ranks are for 1) Item Level 2) End game tweaking of ratings.

    Example. If I switch my 5xR9 Darks, for R15s I gain less than 2% forte, which is less than 1% power, and so less than 1% damage. My DPS main is 52k, and still has 10xR9 enchantments.

    On Preview I lose A LOT of percents (7% power, 4% off EVERY stat, and that's with the 2xR2 I could buy). You say the system gives us options. I wanted defense so I added a R2 Defense (cost 2.4m AD) for 1.7% more defense. As with Live stat enchantments don't matter, Combat, Companion and Utility are the more useful.

    This isn't being made clear, and the 7day enchantments will make it even worse.
    Players (dps) toons will be fine with no stat enchantments

    Caveat to all of this is I haven't tried real content yet. My toon is doing more damage with the Item Level and Combat enchant, but until I run content to check that it's enough to compensate for no teneborous, lightning etc. I can't be sure. However if I'm not ok, stat enchantments aren't the solutions e.g. the 1.7% Defense for 2.4m AD.

    No doubt I shall be posting again when I try my other mains (tank and healer). I suspect the stat loss will be much more significant (augment may fix the tank, we'll see).
    Post edited by tamtoucan on
  • mamalion1234mamalion1234 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 3,379 Arc User
    combat enchantments do not give combined rating like the other enchants.
  • lucadamingolucadamingo Member Posts: 48 Arc User
    edited December 2021
    I played Perfect World for years and iirc the closed beta on this because of Perfect World. I work too much to have all my characters fully maxed or have time to learn all the constant drastic changes. It's crazy that every mod ends up being a negative thing and when people like me that can't play all day everyday finally get back in the swing of things it's another drastic change. Especially because I always take a few months off after a mod so all the bugs, problems and prices for stuff can get somewhat organized.

    It's like getting divorced all the time and losing half your stuff. I played D&D and games like Dragon Warrior growing up, I don't mind grinding and earning it, but this is like grinding gold golem's, finally get your 7,700 gold for the magic armor and the Nintendo freezes, except it's all the time with you guys and your "improvements". I know it's obviously about money, don't hate the player hate the game right (no pun intended)...I'm just happy I never put a single dollar into this game :D It's mostly new players which sucks. I have left for a year multiple times, it's just a weird business model. Playing in the dungeons is funny these days with so many new players, they are like 12 year olds in a strip club, they have no clue what's going on. Keep the damage going I guess, money looks good in the pocket.
  • rylar#4555 rylar Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    I think people are overlooking the real big issue, Stat Caps!! Item level means nothing if you can't cap your stats. Also, they changed the artifact weapon modifications to default. This means having to purchase a couple hundred cubes of augmentation to reset the values we had on the live server. I mean come on!! We should not have to reset our weapons modifications. Currently on the live server I have capped all my stats that I need for a dps class. Your new system is unfair. But as I said before you will most likely at the launch of the changes, have packs that will run $200ea. I bet it will require several purchases to get even close to what we have in terms of item level and STAT CAPS!!! I would encourage players to really look at what changes are made after you exchange your enchantments and also look at you weapon modifications to see how they have changed. Item level is important but also look at your stat caps and look for ninja nerfs to companions as well!!
  • rylar#4555 rylar Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    If they mean nothing then we should not worry about them and having 65% caps should be fine for any content.
  • Weapon and Armor enchants really need added combined rating. It would be a good idea to make the higher qualities get closer to the Item Level as they level up.
  • rubytruerubytrue Member Posts: 565 Arc User
    Feedback: You mentioned in the other thread:
    *Variety of Combat enchants. 6 is the planned number to start with, but we will almost certainly add more over time.

    Will we be able to use the exchange vendor for future combat enchants? Some of us have all/most of the weapon and armor enchants currently. It would be nice to be able to trade in those enchants for future analogs as they become available.
  • fritz#8093 fritz Member Posts: 194 Arc User
    edited December 2021
    Bug / Feedback: Account Reclaims
    Thanks a lot. This is one of the most important features for alt play in recent memory and it derived directly from feedback within this very thread. Kudos to all players and devs!
    Reclaiming only works if you have no Account Enchant on the character. This is not much of an issue because you can discard all and then reclaim the quantity you need. But ideally you should be able to claim any quantity at any time.

    Feedback: MoP Compensation
    The compensation for old Mark of Potencies is up and fine I guess. Think the prices on live will quickly adjust as well. I would still prefer an exchange to the new Glyph of Potency, even with the same 60% AD loss.
  • erevel09erevel09 Member Posts: 161 Arc User
    I must repeat that was already said about combined rating for combat, bonus and companion enchantments: please add it to them. 80% of IL value is reasonable enough if you don't want to have it at 90% (to be the same as other enchantments), but this needs to be there. In current system only armor/weapon enchantments do not have it, but their IL is not 5000.

    Also, about illusions (the visual effects of armor/weapon enchantments): can you please make them account-wide unlocks? It's only visual, but buying same enchantment many times and exchanging it seems to be somewhat not right just to get visual from it. It needs to apply to r8 and r9 too, since the former are still expensive and latter were given in zen store.
  • mordekai#7296 mordekai Member Posts: 30 Arc User

    If they mean nothing then we should not worry about them and having 65% caps should be fine for any content.

    I infer from what you are saying is that stats need to be capped to not be useless?
    That's not the case.
    They are modifiers to base scores.

    It's factually incorrect to state that, "Item level means nothing if you can't cap your stats..."

    Stats are a factor in a mathematical equation.
    a) If your stats goes down and your IL remains the same, the result will diminish.
    b) If your IL goes up by a factor that cancels out the drop in stats, the result will remain the same.
    c) If your IL goes up by a higher relative factor the result will be higher.

    Basic examples of above.
    a) 9IL x 10stat = 90, switches to 9IL x 9stat = 81 (Bad change!)
    b) 9IL x 10stat = 90, switches to 10IL x 9stat = 90 (no difference)
    c) 9IL x 10stat = 90, switches to 11IL x 9stat = 99 (Good change!)

    So without taking into account the Item Level variance, stats (capped or otherwise) have little meaning on their own.
    They NEED the IL to measure their effectiveness, because their effectiveness is directly decided by the Item Level.

    IF the IL increases by more than it takes to offset the drop in stats, you are better off, because guess what! You then get to add even MORE to your stats from new sources allowing that very basic multiplication to yield even higher totals.

    If I'm doing the same or more DPS with LOWER stat totals I'm going to be happy because there is scope to get even better.

    And if the increase in IL gives you sleepless nights over not having a raft of green 90s, and you genuinely... TRULY... believe that "Item level means nothing if you can't cap your stats..." just go away and dump some IL from somewhere else and you can go back to where you were before, with your oh so important capped stats.

    If you can show that the drop in stats is not covered by the increased IL, then you have a different argument you are able to make as to why the system is bad.
    But simply dismissing IL in a discussion about Stats is just weird.
    Like wondering about how fast a new saddle will go without considering the horse.
  • silente07#2597 silente07 Member Posts: 367 Arc User
    It’s the new item level reducing what stats people have with now LESS ways to adjust them. I’m not saying all 90 I’m saying try not to dip below 60. Andifyou don’t have the stats to get the items whatdoyourothen?
    They made this “system” we are just trying to play it. AGAIN.
    Some folks just made it into VOS. Will this knock them out? How much harder will it be AGAIN.

    How as a Tank can I compensate for the new DPS?
    As a healer, the gear doesn’t exist to balance the new item level.
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