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CDP Topic: VIP

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  • hades#2194 hades Member Posts: 38 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    Vip currency sounds good if its a no BTC but BTA
    We want more keys from vip 2 or 3 per day would be cool +lockboxes packs back
    How about a health stone instead of potions, if not daily at least weekly
    Changing loadouts out of campfire is good idea
    What we have from vip like posting fee.....all those we would like to keep
    Update to AD store and Trade bar store every mod
    Post edited by hades#2194 on
  • modestmouse75modestmouse75 Member Posts: 61 Arc User
    • Feedback Overview: Yes VIP should be updated but not at the cost of losing what current VIP members have paid for over
    the years and earned IE: Rank 12s

    • Feedback Goal: Prevent losing players from changing to much or making changes in the wrong directs for VIP rewards

    • Feedback Functionality: I am hoping that the advice and feedback I give will help you understand and upgrade the “quality”
    of game life and game-play for your current and future players

    • Risks & Concerns: I hope in the end we all can come to similar conclusions and be able to work together to solve and or
    help them find ways to make this better for all of us without too much “blood” shed

    The rate of free keys

    • If you reduce the amount of keys VIP gets or put them in a store you will more than likely lose a lot of people buying it. It
    doesn’t matter if you increase the rate of drops from boxes.
    • You should also consider, really consider what your putting in these lock-boxes. At this point in game rank 8s are nothing
    but RP and this current lock-box I am sorry but is a joke.

    Current Benefits

    • Signpost, mail, travel post, bonus hp, and injury immunity, no posting AH, Wondrous Bazaar reduced 25% are my most
    valued benefits

    Auction House

    • Honestly anyone looking to buy items are looking for the best cost. So, everyone posts a price lower than the next. Yes, it
    sucks when you get major undercut, but it happens. So, preventing people to withdraw their items may suck we do have
    the option of 5,3, and 1 day. So, we would need to reconsider our time frame if you prevented us from doing as we have
    been.

    VIP Example that you provided I had something to say about.

    • If you want to change the re-roll tokens, then give more
    • The keys, again they are great, but the boxes have been lacking a lot and only having one key a day really isn’t making a
    difference so if you want to change that to perhaps wards or stones great.
    • Changing the drop rate of boxes is very tricky so I am unsure if this should be a thing
    • Higher AD cap percentage would love this, make it very nice for those that pay for VIP
    • Ability for VIP to change load-outs away from campfires would replace moonstone mask teleport
    • Additional HP of course that is a good thing along with the injury immunity we have already, invocation, mailbox, signpost,
    discounts etc
    • Removal of VIP ranks would be foolish very foolish

    Side-not: I do like that you are trying to find ways to improve things and bring in new people but you as I am sure you know, need to keep in mind your veterans players when making changes. I assume this is why you are asking the opinions of what we think and how it will affect us. But I would highly recommend not changing the Rank system of VIP.

    image
    SW:Mouse
    OP:MisfitMouse
  • shrineerune#9386 shrineerune Member Posts: 48 Arc User
    Feedback Overview: Improve VIP so that it is more useful for players throughout their entire life as a citizen of Neverwinter, but do not take anything away from what you've already sold. Show additional rewards are available for continuous VIP ownership over time, with those being ranked as well.

    Feedback Goal: Encourage models that incentivize loyal customers and make them feel appreciated over time, rather than just involve them in single transaction models or devalue their time/money sink.

    Feedback Functionality: You would need a way to track continuous VIP membership that linked to access to perks. I have zero knowledge of what is required to do that on your end, but imagine that it basically exists within your capacity now.

    Risks & Concerns: Some people will want all the perks without investing time, and may be upset that they can't purchase *every* benefit in the game and must wait for them. Folks that have breaks in VIP membership may want to argue with customer service about how their break in membership shouldn't count.

    Example of what ranked loyalty over time bonuses might look like:
    VIP remains as it is, ranks and all.
    No new currencies and no auction house changes.
    Current rewards are polished (such as trade bar purchases).
    Folks that buy VIP get additional perks added to their rank of VIP for each month (or whatever time period) that they remain a continuous VIP member. These are minor perks like getting a discount on changing equipment appearances, removing enchants, or purchasing workshop supplies. Lower rank VIP perks over time are best for newer players, while higher rank VIP perks over time are better for veterans. At VIP 12, in addition to all the loyalty perks of the lower levels you'd receive slightly better odds on lockboxes and have those odds increase every month a very small amount. The odds (without perk) should be clearly listed, and then the odds should increase over time at a slight rate over time of unbroken VIP membership. That rate of change should also be transparent.
  • arkai#8115 arkai Member Posts: 172 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    My still 378 day vip i ve since 4+years the think let me love vip is

    ++++++Not pay ah tax++++++ this is lovely with a broken economy yu know if i pay 10% every time how many ad ive lost in 4 year is crazy how many time i ve to sell laque 1by 1 supercutted because ppl dsnt buy and i see 30/40 come back to me after 5 day so dsnt change vip ah tax pls will be bad ppl with vip will stop to sell a lot think for dant lost money.if this will be applied prob is my goodbye to the game.

    Adding currency and vip store will be cool but i will not touch the daily key i was on twitch and ppl asked yu about give more not less remember??? Yu still have to give an overage value 30-50k day if yu remove some key .

    .....4 the daily key......
    a choice what yu want today a key or currency for buy in a vip store? This will be cool choice between rewards maybe not forever but for a some months transition in wait yu set up store and yu are sure we enjoy the remove key idea or not yu cant just remove some key yu need to be gentle let us try yur store and we see.this change not let me say goodbye lol just ah tax
  • devilxjkdevilxjk Member Posts: 97 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    A ) Add a legendary mount pack to vip 12 and every 12 vip mounth (account bound)
    B ) Add more stuff to tradebar store, ward,character customization, hair, companion token, reroll race,.... old skin stuff (a lot) need more weapon skin MORE MORE MORE customization
    C ) vip 1 50% more campaign value
    D ) vip1 50% profession gold/heart discount


    p.s. however the vip system is'nt bad now



    little note off topic,

    Dungeons feedback
    dungeon rewards aren't on line to the effort(scaling system),
    my only target on Dungeon->AD,(boring, it's like a work)
    need more shiny stuff,tatoo....
  • darthpotaterdarthpotater Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,116 Arc User
    Here is my feedback.

    - VIP ranks doenst make sense for me. Only confuses new players and make coding more complex. You have the service or you dont. I dont get why players whould be angry against this.

    - Decreasing the number of keys is a bad idea. You only will get angry players. IMHO giving keys and other things with vip was a bad idea since the start because VIP should be QoL oriented, but now is late to change this.

    - Increasing Lockboxes odds: I dont care, but this shouldnt affect VIP. Lockboxes are in general bad since we only get mostly refinement. You wont sell to players an increase in odds in exchange for less keys. Wont work. Lockboxes should be totally changed but thats other topic. I think you should increase tarmalune bars, more later.

    - Implementing another shop and currency is a Big NO. You already have tarmalune trade bars. You need to give more bars with lockboxes (or even direct bars with VIP) and add more items to the tradebar store. Items that we need daily, like preservation wards, companion tokens, and important: Reroll tokens. Actually you get only 3 per day per character, I think a player with VIP should be able to get 10 or 15 per acount per day or more. Also legendary keys should be more accesible to people with VIP as I understand (QoL -> if you are VIP you can open legendary chest without having to farm old currency for keys).

    - Changing Loadouts everywhere. When loadouts were implemented I was disapointed that they only could be changed in campfires. Some dungeons doesnt have campfires where you need to change so this should be implemented no matter if you are VIP or not, but whatever.

    - Increasing rough AD per day. I dont care, not much of a difference for me. I dont have internal numbers, but the economy of the game is already bad with lots of AD entering the game. If you give players the chance to get more AD with no efective AD sinks the economy will be worse.

    - AH Fees. This is a controversial one. I have to say that I am a big AH user so this feature saves me millions of AH in fees. But I recognize this was a bad feature for the game health. I was surprised when they introduced VIP with this feature and instantly bought rank 12 the first day just for this.

    I remember when you had fees and AH prizes were more realistic, and there were good opportunities to buy some deals because some people were afraid to not sell. If you dont have fees you post higher prizes with no risk, so in general AH prizes are higher. People wont accept this and you expose to a major flame but I think this feature is bad for the game in general. You need to compensate people if you are going to remove this. I suggest 1 free posting in AH per day.

    Another idea that came to mind was to overhaul the tarmalune trade store to have some items that cost Tarmalune + AD to implement a new AD sink. But you need to put items that people wants a lot like preservation wards or companion tokens.

    my 2 cents
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  • sobi#1980 sobi Member Posts: 401 Arc User
    So recently the phenomenon of "undercutting" has been prevalent in the community. I was thinking if this could be a symptom of having a higher ratio of end game players to newcomers? If you look at the market, there are enough people selling the same items but much less buyers i.e. demand and hence people undercut.

    As for your CDP topic, I feel as if you are asking the playerbase " would you like more choice"? A clear example of this is giving players the option to choose between keys and other items as part of their daily VIP rewards.

    The ones I find really important are and why:

    1) "Removal of VIP ranks meaning that anyone who purchases VIP gets full benefits immediately" - A welcoming change for newcomers.
    2)A higher cap on refined AD per day for VIP, 15% more for a cap of 115,000 - I like the idea, gives the incentive to players to grind.
    3)Ability for VIP to change loadouts away from campfires - Why was it limited to campfires in the first place? You have made this game way too restrictive.
    4) Increased health gain from VIP – grants every member of your group 1% of their base HP as additional Max HP. Maximum 5% with a full group of VIP - Welcomed by End game players.
    5) Bringing back listing fees on Auction House for VIP - This could backfire and for me it is clearly restricting our freedom. A big reason why undercutting even happens is when supply increases the demand and you took long enough to fix darkened to know this well.

    My current most preferred benefit/s:

    Travelling signpost and Mailbox!


  • tassedethe13tassedethe13 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 806 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    So basically, you want to make a Zen Market for VIP ?

    You want to know how I feel ? I just am speechless, wow.
  • myrddyn#6504 myrddyn Member Posts: 3 Arc User
    Hi,

    First post on the forums, as I want to contribute to these important topics !

    Let me start, by answering the asked questions :

    *) The rate of free keys : Personally, I'm not hung up on the daily key. They are a nice gift, but are in effect a lottery ticket... I don't mind giving them and the chance to that one-in-a-million legendary item up alltogether in favour of something more low-key but consistent. (Because this is what VIP should be I think, a little help/nudge to do away with some of the free-to-play grinds.)

    For me the lockbox and its odds should be separated from VIP. They are as I said lotterly tickets, be up front with odds, prizes and prices and let people decide if they want to play that game. Honestly I don't. So my answer : I don't care about the key, as long as it is replaced with something that adds comfort or lessens the grind.

    *) Alternates to keys : I'm all for it. As you mentioned, this could be giving out VIP currency (trade bars) and a rework of the trade bar store and having items there that are actually in demand, like preservation wards. Items that are quality of life or lessen the grind, not pay to win rewards. BUT, please do away with the manual claiming on different characters. This is not what playing a game should be... When I see my guild/alliance members log on, there are first 2-50 log on/offs while they go claim/invoke things on every alt... This only creates frustration in my opinion. Add the rewards as you please, daily/monthly, to your account (with the balance accessible for everyone of your chars) and make the rewards BoA. (No monetizing your benefit, but you are completely free to use them where you want.) (Also there should be no difference if you have 50 characters or just one. so the reroll tokens as far as I'm concerned can go too. Or come at a cost : you get your reroll tokens, but that means that what you get will be BoA. Same thing as before, VIP should not be monetized !)


    *) Ranks : I'm okay with removing the system of ranks. You could have some sort of loyalty program is you so like, on top of VIP. But the core of VIP should be the same for everybody and that should at least include those quality-of-life perks (sign post, mail box, (seal) vendor, bank portal...) I'm not too sure about injuries, I'm an oldskool player, so I don't mind injuries... but the current system is weird.. VIP just springs all the traps without a care and the newbie behind is handicapped into the ground. So either take out injuries alltogether, or leave them in but for everybody... adding value to trapdisarming classes and injury-healing classes. (This is actually a very difficult one, players often dislike these systems, same as they do loss of control over their character (crowd control)... )

    What do I value about VIP benefits ? Just that : Quality-of-life : Travel signpost/bank portal/mailbox/vendor. Besides that, it is mainly the AH posting fee. Again as with the injuries, this should not be part of VIP, again it is monetizing... I will argue that it should even not exist at all. I understand the need for an AD/Zen drain, but do it on the sale only rather than on the listing. You now have a perverse system where the rich and or those with VIP can just relist without a care, while the others often can't even list a high-value item... because the risk of not selling and losing the posting fee is just such a big hit. So in short, either do away with the posting fee completely (or if that is really needed for the AD/Zen drain, make it reasonable and fixed, independant of the item list price), or add it to the sales fee when you actually sell an item.

    *) Auction House : See above.

    *) VIP Example

    - VIP Currency : See above. All for it, but with the remarks I made.
    - 10-15 Lockbox Keys per month : For my part do away with keys, but I do understand that for a lot of players those are the things they want. So as a compromise, put them in the VIP currency store, and make sure people can get the same worth out of their keys if they want to buy them, or if not, that they can choose another item from the store.
    - Increased odd chances on items in Lockboxes moving forward. : I don't really have an opinion other than be upfront with the lockboxes : price/prizes/chance at winning should be displayed in the tooltip plain for everyone to see.
    - Instead of directly getting reroll tokens, VIP would be given a VIP currency and would have a store. The contents of this store would adjust over time but would likely start with things such as Preservation Wards, Enchanting Stones, Companion Upgrade Tokens, and yes Reroll Tokens. : All for it, but with the remarks I made.
    - A higher cap on refined AD per day for VIP, 15% more for a cap of 115,000 : As the game stands, and the current endless grind, that sounds very nice... but again VIP should not be monetized I think. So I'd love it really, but on the other hand I don't think it is a good thing. (What I'd rather see e.g. is VIP gets auto-refind for AD => This is again quality-of-life, non-vips can get the same, but they need to put in more effort.)

    - Ability for VIP to change loadouts away from campfires : YES ! Playing a healer I feel this pain daily... While trying to make a group and being wanted as a healer, I effectively have to just idle in my healer-loadout... which is very annoying. (Or keep playing and trying to heal mobs to death.... :s) I do get this might have more repercussions than I can judge, people abusing and switching back and forth.. really I don't know... but at this point I can't play the game the way I like to. (Maybe keep players from switching inside public dungeons/queues.. to avoid queue role scams etc.. But private you can do whatever you like.)

    - Increased health gain from VIP : Don't care for it, not quality-of-life... but an edge over other players. Shouldn't exist. If you truly are free to play, this should not be necessary or even desirable.

    - Removal of VIP ranks meaning that anyone who purchases VIP gets full benefits immediately. : All for it. (You could have some sort of loyalty program on top to add to retention... But I'm not sure what this would look like.. A voucher for store discount ? A cosmetic item, title, ... ?)

    *) Overall feedback : For me something is flawed in the way character power is built up... The fact that (augment) companions, and as a result runestones, represent so much of a characters power feels very wrong to me. Actually I don't feel like I'm making my character stronger, I think at this point my polar bear would best me in combat :s I know this is not a direct comment on VIP, but it all ties in together I feel. At a certain point, you log in (daily or not) to do a grind... foregoing playing/doing (fun) things (like dungeon runs with friends), for grinding boons/AD/reputation/currencies. At some point you realise this, step out of the hamster wheel and the game lost a player. I know having a grind is an integral part of an MMO and very much needed, but they way you make that grind makes all the difference.... It should be fun and make you feel like you are getting somewhere. (Perfect example is SKT... does any player even enjoy that ? The campaign starts of so well, good story, nice quests... but then you realize the grind you are facing, and the fun goes down the drain and becomes a chore...) Make me play a (fun and well designed) dungeon over and over, give me things to chase by all means... but first and foremost this is a game... make it fun and rewarding to do so !

    Sorry for the wall-of-text, but in the end I do think this is/could be a great game (with great storytelling) and great potential and I would love to see it go in the right direction.

    Thank you,
    Ama
  • regenerderegenerde Member Posts: 2,924 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    The rate of free keys
    ... should stay the same, just add a counter to opening lockboxes with them like it's with refining, after xy keys used an bound to account reward from the top bracket is granted. That wouldn't affect those lucky ducks that allways get a legendary drop after spending 3 keys, but everyone else would at least have something to look forward to at some point.

    Alternates to keys
    ... again, hands of those daily lockbox keys! Do whatever you like to those bloody Reroll Tokens, but keys should remain off limit regarding any changes to ViP!

    Ranks
    ... why is there no notion of actually increasing those ranks?! I mean, we're stuck on Rank 12 for YEARS now!

    Current Benefits
    ... i value the daily keys above anything else, and the rest is nice to have.

    New Benefits
    ... should go with NEW ViP RANKS!

    Auction House
    ... what the AH really needs are updated sections and search options. For example, a category (Fighter, Mystical, Invoker and so on) filter option in the companion department. Not to mention a fix for the issue when we have to relist an item over and over again before it's actually in the AH.


    VIP Example
    ... add a ViP Trader to Protectors Enclave, where we can exchange Reroll Tokens for Preservation Wards, Enchanting Stones, Companion Upgrade Tokens and so on.

    ... +1% more Tarmalune Trade Bars from lockboxes per ViP Rank.

    ... +x% more raw AD from dungeon/skirmish runs per ViP Rank.

    ... +y% more Seals from dungeon/skirmish runs per ViP Rank.

    ... +z% more campaign currencies from weekly quests per ViP Rank.


    The redesign of the lockboxes allready did a pretty good job on decreasing the value of ViP, add most of the examples listed in the opening post to that and ViP would become worthless to a good portion of players.
    Post edited by regenerde on
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  • kors#9447 kors Member Posts: 105 Arc User
    The droprate and keys
    I have the idea that, in general, the droprate should be increased. Legendary mount, for example, is around 0.15% and it's a too little chance. Increasing it at around 1% should be more honest. On the other hand 1 key per day, per account, is fair and with the "correction" of the droprate I don't think it's needed to decrease the amount per month, but could be nice to have an increasing of number of keys per day depending on VIP rank (for example each 8 VIP rank for a maximum of 2 keys per day, with also and increase in number of VIP ranks up to rank 16 - read below).

    Alternatives rewards
    Here, a different value from heals potions could be interesting. Maybe a currency with a dedicated shop where to spend this currency for Marks of Potency, Stones of Health, Enchanting Stones, Companion Upgrading tokens, Wards (and in general worth stuff in game) can be really, really nice to have.

    Ranks
    Ranks are good. The idea of giving same benefits should be limited in things such as travelling portal, bank, etc. While other benefits like WB discounts, bonus stats, etc are good for different ranks. It's possible to add more ranks with more rewards (maybe up to rank 16 to put some more rewards).

    VIP Benefits
    Travelling, bank, vendor could be up from any rank, while other stuff depending on rank.

    New Benefits
    New currency instead of potions of health with a dedicated store.

    Auction House
    - No fees in posting/removing things,
    - A better search engine,
    - Decreasing in fees (when selling a thing) depending on the VIP rank,
    - Maximum % of decreasing or increasing prices depending on the cheapest or most expensive one, to better controll big oscillation of the market (maybe can help?).

    I'll think other option in the meantime and upgrade the comment later.
  • tskywalker#4880 tskywalker Member Posts: 2 Arc User
    VIP overhaul:
    1) Keys - reduced rate would be acceptable if a commensurate bump in rewards was attached to it. Not only an increase in rate, but an improved range of rewards. Stop giving outdated artifacts and start giving rewards of value between stones and leg mounts
    2) I do like the store idea - I have more reroll tokens than I am likley to ever use. How about adding a Character to Account unbind token? Or even an Unbind token (acceptable for it to be expensive - like 3 months worth of daily VIP claims...)
    3) Reroll tokens - how about adding more uses for reroll tokens (hunts, zok boxes, lockboxes). Or even a premium reroll token that can be bought with regular reroll tokens (maybe 9 regular = 1 premium), or with new VIP currency
    3) VIP ranks - Since some of the purchases that used to include free ranks no longer do, buying VIP for an extended play pretty much provides ranks anyway, so don't have a real issue with that
    4) VIP Current benefits listed in order of usage: 1) Signpost. 2) Seal vendor (as much to sell to as to spend seals - put a merchant in my workshop and that would be curbed significantly - that would be a nice VIP feature) 3) Mailbox 4) Banking Portal. Rarely use professional vendor (though could use instead of seal trader - seal trader is kind of 2 birds with 1 stone option as I can check some of my seals and sell stuff in one place. Almost never use Moonstone Mask - replace that with a teleport to stronghold. Other VIP benefits that would be nice - higher RAD refine cap, HP idea is OK - but a bigger bump for solo play would be nice), Professions bank in the workshop to allow crafting goods to be transferred between characters without all the steps involved with mailing them
    5) Auction House - not sure of the answer here. I don't want to give up my 0% listing fee - and I am not a power seller. What about just adding a de-listing fee, or a re-listing within 24 hours fee (or escalating fee for multiple re-posts)? Not sure anything would get rid of undercutting as its not just power sellers that undercut
  • kreatyvekreatyve Member, Neverwinter Moderator, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 10,516 Community Moderator
    My initial thoughts so far:

    1. I think that making the keys not be a daily thing, even with increased lockbox odds, would still feel more like something is being taken, than something being given, and would anger a large part of the player base. There would be a massive amount of angry players posting on all the social media. It would be another "coal gate" situation, or potentially even worse. I would rather not go through that again, please.
    2. I like the idea of not having the VIP ranks anymore. And, I wonder, if you were to remove the ranks, if maybe there could be limited sales of "Lifetime VIP" made available? I don't know if those make money for games or not, so I would guess, look at the numbers from STO's and see? I do understand that it's a business, and ya'll do need to make money to keep the game going.
    3. The AH fees... most games have AH fees for a reason, as a gold sink. Removing these completely for a large portion of the player base feels like it has caused more harm than good. I would be ok with this being replaced by something else, though I feel a lot of veteran players would be upset by this, the majority of the player base would understand as long as the reasoning was communicated efficiently.

    That's all my opinion on the proposed changes for now.
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  • arkai#8115 arkai Member Posts: 172 Arc User
    > @kreatyve said:
    > My initial thoughts so far:
    >
    > 1. I think that making the keys not be a daily thing, even with increased lockbox odds, would still feel more like something is being taken, than something being given, and would anger a large part of the player base. There would be a massive amount of angry players posting on all the social media. It would be another "coal gate" situation, or potentially even worse. I would rather not go through that again, please.
    > 2. I like the idea of not having the VIP ranks anymore. And, I wonder, if you were to remove the ranks, if maybe there could be limited sales of "Lifetime VIP" made available? I don't know if those make money for games or not, so I would guess, look at the numbers from STO's and see? I do understand that it's a business, and ya'll do need to make money to keep the game going.
    > 3. The AH fees... most games have AH fees for a reason, as a gold sink. Removing these completely for a large portion of the player base feels like it has caused more harm than good. I would be ok with this being replaced by something else, though I feel a lot of veteran players would be upset by this, the majority of the player base would understand as long as the reasoning was communicated efficiently.
    >
    > That's all my opinion on the proposed changes for now.

    Sry if i quote yu but sometime we have item rank15 or mount leg not bis we spend to mutch es for pushing up a enc and we never bring back value if we cant able to put in ah lot time until we get the right price...maybe for some item we need no tax
  • jules#6770 jules Member Posts: 670 Arc User
    I am so disappointed.
    Please read this thread, read @oremonger#9999 s feedback, then read it again, and contemplate really really hard, brainstorm in team if you must, if this is the correct path.

    You get an A for wording it nicely, tho. This is the tone my former boss used to ask me if I can stay longer for every day the next month long.
    - bye bye -
  • thefiresidecatthefiresidecat Member Posts: 4,486 Arc User
    edited January 2020

    > @kreatyve said:

    > My initial thoughts so far:

    >

    > 1. I think that making the keys not be a daily thing, even with increased lockbox odds, would still feel more like something is being taken, than something being given, and would anger a large part of the player base. There would be a massive amount of angry players posting on all the social media. It would be another "coal gate" situation, or potentially even worse. I would rather not go through that again, please.

    > 2. I like the idea of not having the VIP ranks anymore. And, I wonder, if you were to remove the ranks, if maybe there could be limited sales of "Lifetime VIP" made available? I don't know if those make money for games or not, so I would guess, look at the numbers from STO's and see? I do understand that it's a business, and ya'll do need to make money to keep the game going.

    > 3. The AH fees... most games have AH fees for a reason, as a gold sink. Removing these completely for a large portion of the player base feels like it has caused more harm than good. I would be ok with this being replaced by something else, though I feel a lot of veteran players would be upset by this, the majority of the player base would understand as long as the reasoning was communicated efficiently.

    >

    > That's all my opinion on the proposed changes for now.



    Sry if i quote yu but sometime we have item rank15 or mount leg not bis we spend to mutch es for pushing up a enc and we never bring back value if we cant able to put in ah lot time until we get the right price...maybe for some item we need no tax

    having everyone pay this tax upfront would do more harm than good. this game has an established RICH player base already. this tax isn't going to hurt the rich but it will hurt the average and poor player. they will not be able to compete. Especially on the sales of items that could help them the most. it would be a ad sink yes, but there would be less posting and probably less sales thru the ah effectively lowering the amount of ad removed from the economy. trade channels would be come more active again. people would be disillusioned that they have to spend hours in chat going.. come to me come to me to get value for their items instead of playing the game. it would be a disaster.

    as it is there is a tax on items being sold. a hefty one. it's good enough. for the last number of years most of the people in game have vip that I have played with. it's rare to have someone say please put down a bank or mail box. Most have it. the last time I remember that being a thing was in the first year after vip was introduced. the only people that do not have it are the newer or poorer players (although I have been witnessing it more recently. I think there are a contingent of old time players who are letting their vip run out and refusing to renew it due to dissatisfaction with the game). they (newer and poorer) do get taken advantage of because of this.
    I've seen them in pe trying to make deals with people selling items at half price once they raise the funds to list their item so they can afford to buy vip. tbh that really does Hamster... just getting rid of the posting fee is reasonable imo. it's a very valid way to get people to buy vip though. I'm also ok with them moving that particular perk down the ranks. I see the inequality that one invokes.


    This particular tiger they've taken by the tail is an angry one with big teeth.. I'm really confused by the statement they're going to win back our trust, and then taking THIS on.. instead of the topic that we were all looking forward to and seeing as a positive move forward. Even broaching this with the examples put forth is just a huge trust beater. I'm at a lower morale point than I was a month and a half ago after reading this. honestly.. this is dynomite. tread carefully or the situation will explode in an angry leaving player base. some of us have a lot of laundry and dishes to do that look more and more attractive..
  • tanais58cranetanais58crane Member Posts: 111 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    Throne knows why I waste the time I've left like this but, I have finished my book and still haven't picked a new one.

    In the first phase of this CDP we would like you to think and comment about these questions:


    • The rate of free keys
      • We currently grant a key a day, which is 30 a month. We want to preserve the value of VIP, so if lockbox odds are improved by 2x or even 3x, how would you view altering the rate of free keys to keep a similar value?
    No, no no no, no no. No. Just no. Don't do this, don't even think about doing this, don't even think about thinking of doing this. Just don't do it.

    With the amount of keys in the market, if we simply get an "Improved chances" lockbox, everything in it will be devalued to the point of inconsequence.

    If you want to go this way, or ever want to add a Mythic tier reward like mythic mounts, probably the best way to go about it while keeping drops valuable would be to make a "Two locks lockbox", or something along those lines. Increase the number of keys required along with the improvement in rewards to not make all the older lockboxes outdated and the drops in the new one too common to have any value.

    Alternates to keys

    How would you feel about getting a currency with VIP that allowed you to get items other than keys from your daily login? Would you choose to get wards, enchanting stones, or other valuable items instead of keys if you had that option?


    There will be significant backlash if you lower the amount of keys awarded by VIP. But if you make it so players can either get a daily key or choose from other rewards, that might help with your intent of lowering the amount of awarded keys in practice. Still, I don't think this would accomplish what you are aiming for.

    Ranks
    How would you feel about the removal of ranks on VIP, granting full benefits of VIP 12 while active? What do you value about ranks?


    The removal of ranks is a relatively good choice, after all adding additional ranks would make it look like a significant paywall. However it should be handled with care, as those that have already paid for more than 12 months of VIP for the sake of ranking it up would feel cheated out of their money and effort.

    I doubt that many people like or value VIP ranks in a particular sense, they are little more than a paywall between players and benefits they might want, but just getting rid of them without any sort of compensation would not leave your current playerbase happy.

    Current Benefits
    Which of the current benefits of VIP do you value and why?


    Travelling signpost, Mailbox, Bank, these three might stab immersion in the face and then throw its gasping soon-to-be corpse in a lake of acid full of rabid acid-breathing piranhas, but they do make life much easier while adventuring.

    The Bazaar discount is a nice addition that made ranking VIP up desirable to begin with past the aforementioned rewards. But this is not a quality of life matter, I don't see a problem with it being dropped from the table in a theoretical future iteration of VIP, as long as a reward of similar value is put in its place so dropping it doesn't just make the grind for upgrades steeper.

    As for the rest, they barely register.

    Auction House
    Having one group able to list an item, de-list, and re-list again at no cost/penalty to undercut is not healthy for the Auction House and we’d like that to be a better experience for everyone. What are your thoughts in regard to this statement?


    The problem here is that some items are just /difficult/ to sell, it can take you days if not weeks to get them sold, and if you don't occasionally re-list them they will simply never sell. If you take steps to making re-listing no longer a viable option, the entire workings of the Auction House would need a serious rework so players aren't stuck just tossing their items in its general direction and praying for deliverance.

    And just in case this needs to be clarified, that would be a very bad thing. A potentially your-decision-just-damned-this-game-to-bankruptcy kind of bad thing.

    No need for seers or tarot reading to see that.

    I can give a more detailed insight in two of these matters, but that'll be at another time.
    The stars are falling, and the old gods silent as death, with the blood sworn to rip you down from the night sky, what cost will pose too high?
  • otoole68#6922 otoole68 Member Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    Keep this short and sweet. Vip is broken as it is 80% of these ideas would completely destroy it. As for keys make it like upgrades after a set amount of keys/tries make it a 100% drop. The set amount for a upgrade is one of the best things you have done for a long time in my opinion.
  • zebulondaktoidzebulondaktoid Member Posts: 80 Arc User
    Being able to change loadouts away from a campfire would be crazy. All people would have to do is temporarily come out of combat and swap loadouts from aoe to single target and vice versa. I mean, you could even swap all your gear if you wanted which is hardly realistic.
  • franklin223franklin223 Member Posts: 42 Arc User


    Feedback Overview: Overall changes to VIP

    After reading through everyone's comments it is clear that making big changes (i.e. removing/changing existing benefits) would no sit well with people that have pre-paid VIP for months and years into the future. This problem is due to the fact that you sold rank plus time together...

    Please don't take away existing benefits. People will value each benefit differently, but we all purchased VIP for a reason and making a change or removing will suck a lot.

    Feedback Goal
    If you want to add your list of new benefits to the system, then we can (mostly) agree that (some of) your suggestions would be great additions. What I would suggest is to add more ranks to VIP (above 12) to fit in your additions. You can bundle some of them together, of course.

    Consider reordering which benefits are accrued at each rank. However, you must ensure that if a player has an existing benefit at their current rank, that the are advanced in rank to still receive that benefit during your restructure.

    Feedback Functionality
    Unbundle time from rank. If I am Rank 12 VIP with 24 months of time, and you restructure the system to have 16 ranks of VIP available, then I am advanced in Rank to match my current benefits (having access to all ranks rewards under my new rank). In my example let's say I get bumped to Rank 13... Now I am Rank 13/16 with 24 months and if I want the next level of reward, then I can purchase Rank 14, but still only have 24 months of time. In the future I can choose to buy more VIP time (or not) and you get the benefit of adding more ranks later on the other side of the model.


    Feedback Overview Regarding lockbox percentage increases
    The percentage chance of getting the orange items we are all after is SO LOW that there is no real meaningful change that you would reasonably make (you wont increase our odds to 1/90).

    Feedback Functionality
    What if you played into your dice rolling model a little more and included a 'Streak bonus' for VIP members. Could be anything rewarding free value to the results. Say, if we open 10 lockboxes and receive the same pack twice or three times in a row, we get increased odds at something, or a free key, or heavily increased odds of getting an orange result in our next open (say 2%).

    Risks & Concerns
    Ultimately, any change to the lockbox odds will haev a heavy effect on the economy.

This discussion has been closed.