I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
The nut who actually ground out many packs. The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite colored text = mod mode
The problem with that is... how much Dilithium would equal 1 Lobi?
Good question.
I would propose that since we get roughly 5 Lobi per lockbox (average), the value of Lobi is probably about 25 Zen (this is a maximum; one could argue lower since lockboxes usually contain other things as well) which would equal 12,500 dilithium.
The above buyout (50/50 split) would be kind of prohibitive at that value, though... or even half of it.
However, as a possible alternative: what about putting lobi crystals themselves in the dilithium store? (This would allow people to customize the split)
Someone suggested *lobi* for bonus event completions in place of dilithium. I added the idea that they actually invert the two -- lobi bonuses and dilithium for the buyout.
Also your math is off on lobi : z ratio. 100/5 is 20. And that doesn't include the value of anything else in a lockbox, which would make the lobi worth less, not more. Granted, not a whole lot less, but less. So even 20z-per is still high for lobi's zen value. Because keys are generally purchased during key sales, where you get about 20% more keys for your zen. I'd peg it closer to 18ish.
good point regarding the actual reason for opening boxes...ships and consoles. the lobi is just a "nice" thanks for playing open the lockbox game. like a consolation prize.
so what is lobi really worth? ships go for what, 900 as stated, costumes 50+, etc. is there any way to actually break down the value of lobi then?
Uh. Not exactly. Costumes are 100-200 lobi.
Specialty ships have been priced at 4250z each (Mudd sales). Costumes are 550z. Account-wide for both. Oddly enough, it's about the same price ratio between between ships and costumes, so that's a pretty accurate measurement of how lobi is 'valued' relative to zen by Cryptic. That puts the average value of a lobi crystal at 4-4.5z each. At least from my math.
most of the lobi costumes are very old, most of them have glitches or streching textures; they don't worth 200 lobi, their zen cost should be adjusted.
After going through 15 pages, I didn't notice the following idea:
Bring the character level cap from 65 to 75.
Perhaps in combination with the earlier mentioned increase in fleet level caps.
This will increase the demand for dil for a while and there will be some time to develop a new sink.
Yes, that IS an increase of a demand since raising the level cap means expanding the gear levels. However, you're also not looking at the flip side of things.
Increasing the level cap means for the devs adjusting the experience bar so that specialization point XP starts again from the new cap, new rewards from reaching the next levels AND having to add new ranks associated with it. As it stands right now, we have the following for the characters that can go from 1-65:
* 0/Tutorial: Cadet for Feds & DSC Feds, Lieutenant J.g. for TOS Feds, Warrior for KDF, Citizen for Romulans
* 1-9: Lieutenant
* 10-19: Lieutenant Commander for Fed & Klingons, Centurion for Romulan
* 20-29: Commander for Fed & Klingons, Subcommander for Romulans
* 30-39: Captain for Fed & Klingons, Commander for Romulans
* 40-44: Rear Admiral Lower Half for Feds, Brigadier General for Klingons, Subadmiral I for Romulans
* 45-49: Rear Admiral Upper Half for Feds, Major General for Klingons, Subadmiral II for Romulans
* 50-54: Vice Admiral for Feds & Romulans, Vice General for Klingons
* 55-59: Admiral for Feds & Romulans, General for Klingons
* 60+: Fleet Admiral for Feds and Romulans, Dahar Master for Klingons.
Assuming they want to KEEP the ranking system, they'd have to adjust the ranking and maybe include Ensign/Uhlan for right after the tutorial, or even not make any further levels tied to rank increases.
However, there is ALSO something you haven't considered: Enemies have to be scaled too via level. When they LAST increased the cap when they introduced the Jem'hadar, they also for a time made the level 65 enemy groups very hard to beat. So much so that they had to scale BACK on how much those enemy groups did. They would have to do the same if they were to do it.
Well honestly I see some good ideas and some bad ideas but honestly...Rerolls for endeavours?! Really you thought that was a good idea?! I can see that you have no originality anymore and are desperate to for Zen purchases that people turn into Dil so they can buy your garbage. The only good thing you've done with Dil was the Pheonix boxes. Be more clever and Unique instead o putting already rare items behind a wall. Cryptic you've sold your soul to demons.
Yes, that IS an increase of a demand since raising the level cap means expanding the gear levels. However, you're also not looking at the flip side of things.
Increasing the level cap means for the devs adjusting the experience bar so that specialization point XP starts again from the new cap, new rewards from reaching the next levels AND having to add new ranks associated with it. As it stands right now, we have the following for the characters that can go from 1-65:
* 0/Tutorial: Cadet for Feds & DSC Feds, Lieutenant J.g. for TOS Feds, Warrior for KDF, Citizen for Romulans
* 1-9: Lieutenant
* 10-19: Lieutenant Commander for Fed & Klingons, Centurion for Romulan
* 20-29: Commander for Fed & Klingons, Subcommander for Romulans
* 30-39: Captain for Fed & Klingons, Commander for Romulans
* 40-44: Rear Admiral Lower Half for Feds, Brigadier General for Klingons, Subadmiral I for Romulans
* 45-49: Rear Admiral Upper Half for Feds, Major General for Klingons, Subadmiral II for Romulans
* 50-54: Vice Admiral for Feds & Romulans, Vice General for Klingons
* 55-59: Admiral for Feds & Romulans, General for Klingons
* 60+: Fleet Admiral for Feds and Romulans, Dahar Master for Klingons.
Assuming they want to KEEP the ranking system, they'd have to adjust the ranking and maybe include Ensign/Uhlan for right after the tutorial, or even not make any further levels tied to rank increases.
However, there is ALSO something you haven't considered: Enemies have to be scaled too via level. When they LAST increased the cap when they introduced the Jem'hadar, they also for a time made the level 65 enemy groups very hard to beat. So much so that they had to scale BACK on how much those enemy groups did. They would have to do the same if they were to do it.
Why all these assumptions that I wouldn't have considered this?
It's great that you bring up these points, but Kael wanted ideas. This is one that was not mentioned before and it is bad not to mention this idea.
Raising levels has already been done several times, so the Devs have the experience with a level increase.
Perhaps this has already been considered by the Dev team, only without two-way communication about what has already been considered by the Devs, these ideas will also be mentioned.
People here seem to ignore my Dil sink ideas, so let's break it down for people in the back if SPACE BARBIE is the TRUE ENDGAME, then SPACE BARBIE content would be an efficient Permanent Dil Sink, unlike some Moron'sperson's brilliant idea of a Dil Spike "ENDEAVOR AND AMIRMALTY REROLL TOKENS" why would I spend Dil on mechanics I barely use, when I can spend it all on Cosmetics or this might crazy but hear me out...
WHAT ABOUT SELLING CARDASSIAN GROUND WEAPONS FOR DIL.
It suits Cryptic\PWE for the exchange rate to be maxed because it means dil doesn't go as far and therefore players have greater incentive to pay real money for Zen.
A better dil sink than the endeavour re-rolls would be re-rolling the three choices available when spending perk points, it's frustrating when you're faced with a choice of three ground bonuses.
It suits Cryptic\PWE for the exchange rate to be maxed because it means dil doesn't go as far and therefore players have greater incentive to pay real money for Zen.
A better dil sink than the endeavour re-rolls would be re-rolling the three choices available when spending perk points, it's frustrating when you're faced with a choice of three ground bonuses.
It suits Cryptic\PWE for the exchange rate to be maxed because it means dil doesn't go as far and therefore players have greater incentive to pay real money for Zen.
A better dil sink than the endeavour re-rolls would be re-rolling the three choices available when spending perk points, it's frustrating when you're faced with a choice of three ground bonuses.
Really the only way I could see the dil exchange brought under control again is if they added a new Rep that cost dil and all previous rep costing dil. Though that would be a very unpopular change.
Hey look, 13 pages of ideas for dil sinks that the players will enjoy...what do they do? They make the game worse and sell the fraking solution. If it is not obvious that Kael has spend exactly zero seconds to pass along any of the ideas posted here...seriously, I'd like to talk to you about an investment opportunity in a bridge in Brooklyn.
This is why I am just done with the whole thing, I give up. They took one suggestion from this thread, to make re-roll tokens available using Dilithium and then they just added on the removal of the free ones and now they're passing it along like it's our idea.
Honestly, it's so typical it's my fault for expecting anything more. Giving them feedback is an obvious waste of time.
I agree, just fix it the way they have fixed everything else and remove the Dilithium exchange entirely. Just tell people that your studio is too small to maintain it, that seems to be your go to move anyway.
I'm still relatively new to the game (just reaching 100 days next week) but I agree with the lobi crystals for dilithium.
Another thing that might work is if we could use dilithium to play as another species on ground missions - no, I don't mean Romulan/Klingon/etc. What if you could spend dilithium to buy a one-hour unlock to play, say, an Iconian or a Tzenkethi? (Tzenkethi already is playable with the Captain Neth Parr mission) Undine would be another possible race, as well as the Hur'Q or even the Founders since all of them already have unique abilities and traits in game as enemies. This would be like the holographic gekli or Undine ship except it'd last 60 minutes in combat on the ground. Just an idea!
what if we could pay Dil to unbind bound items from a character (that started out as bind on equip/pickup) and either leaves it as bind on equip or put it into an account locked box if was original or leave it as something one could sell if they wanted to.
same could be done for specialty ships. want to delete a character but want to save the ship you worked so hard for? pay some dil, have it put back into a box and move it to whoever you wanted to. (accound bound of course or default box state.)
I know I'd pay a lot of dil to be able to move some of my specialty ships around to other toons. obviously I know theres a lot of issues with this but still.
How about heavier trade based gameplay like in 3x or 4x games and have one of the options to be to get dillithium from ferengi or other sources as payment. something that isn't a card game. Something where you actually haul trade goods in large numbers. It could generate more EC also. Or prefereably have more forms of currency from different species introduced which could be used for just about everything. Including have currency exchanges as a form of gameplay. This game lack economics as a fun gameplay.
If possible this could go with more insides for the ships. And potentially another ship specific cargo just for trade goods. This would represent a varied sized cargo going with ship size. In fact we could look at older game genres to introduce 2d esc version of ship interiors. Or even those newer ship games where the ship and crew are entirely on a 2d ship screen. This could replace the old crew and bring back or introduce some new features.
Going 2d to add more interiors could be nice for this game as it's less art intensive. And that means more gameplay functionality and complexity. Especially customizing things for the ship for more than aesthetics.
This is sort of taken account with increased stacks. But what if the new extra cargo hull tab is for more condensed or special trade specific items like very large qauntities. It could be for crates or special qauntum or other compressed items. They could be worth more than 9,999 items. Say the old cargo stacks of near 20 could be brought back in the form of the new cargo tab for these and each individual item represents a 9,999 stack or current items. (example a 20 stack is actually 9,999 x 20.) But it's only for certain items for certain gameplay. This could allow trading to make more money. Or at least earlier as all ships could have custom starting cargo depending on the specific ship and it's orientation as a ship. Although you could use 2d customization to make trade specific ships. Or the opposite. This could expand the whole game pretty quickly and give more avenues for new content. You could customize the interior for more or less cargo depending on the ships orientation with 2d interiors.
The other idea is more instances for such things. It could be more open world with RPG style drop down attacks or similar and be good for teamwork if people want. They coudl be focused on these currencies and be specific to each realm in the game for each species. The obvious one is the old klingon territory. All species with currencies could be given a custom map to drop down to with more access to more planets and areas for trade and 3x/4x style openworld gameplay. then if you don't want to participate you leave to the normal maps. If you want to participate then you drop down into a map you like. This could consist of ferengi, klingon, federation, Romulan(new and old as a decimated area could still have custom pirate and other groups), gorn, etc. (maybe not fed if they don't have currencies although subspecies might.) Any traditional species with a territory could have custom content with various in territory things going on. This has already been explored in the lore and could be expanded on in each area.
It could even add story by giving info subtely or not about each territory and explore government types or other content related to each species in the process.
Account unlocks: Give us the option to take character bound unlocks like ships (high end), mission rewards (low end), and old special rewards (medium range), and unlock them account wide? They do this over in SWTOR and it's fantastic. Especially when dealing with the horrible lockbox drop rates, this would alleviate some of the issues behind the lotto mechanics or turning free rewards into paid rewards.
Comments
My brain hurts from all the math!
normal text = me speaking as fellow formite
colored text = mod mode
most of the lobi costumes are very old, most of them have glitches or streching textures; they don't worth 200 lobi, their zen cost should be adjusted.
Bring the character level cap from 65 to 75.
Perhaps in combination with the earlier mentioned increase in fleet level caps.
This will increase the demand for dil for a while and there will be some time to develop a new sink.
Yes, that IS an increase of a demand since raising the level cap means expanding the gear levels. However, you're also not looking at the flip side of things.
Increasing the level cap means for the devs adjusting the experience bar so that specialization point XP starts again from the new cap, new rewards from reaching the next levels AND having to add new ranks associated with it. As it stands right now, we have the following for the characters that can go from 1-65:
* 0/Tutorial: Cadet for Feds & DSC Feds, Lieutenant J.g. for TOS Feds, Warrior for KDF, Citizen for Romulans
* 1-9: Lieutenant
* 10-19: Lieutenant Commander for Fed & Klingons, Centurion for Romulan
* 20-29: Commander for Fed & Klingons, Subcommander for Romulans
* 30-39: Captain for Fed & Klingons, Commander for Romulans
* 40-44: Rear Admiral Lower Half for Feds, Brigadier General for Klingons, Subadmiral I for Romulans
* 45-49: Rear Admiral Upper Half for Feds, Major General for Klingons, Subadmiral II for Romulans
* 50-54: Vice Admiral for Feds & Romulans, Vice General for Klingons
* 55-59: Admiral for Feds & Romulans, General for Klingons
* 60+: Fleet Admiral for Feds and Romulans, Dahar Master for Klingons.
Assuming they want to KEEP the ranking system, they'd have to adjust the ranking and maybe include Ensign/Uhlan for right after the tutorial, or even not make any further levels tied to rank increases.
However, there is ALSO something you haven't considered: Enemies have to be scaled too via level. When they LAST increased the cap when they introduced the Jem'hadar, they also for a time made the level 65 enemy groups very hard to beat. So much so that they had to scale BACK on how much those enemy groups did. They would have to do the same if they were to do it.
Why all these assumptions that I wouldn't have considered this?
It's great that you bring up these points, but Kael wanted ideas. This is one that was not mentioned before and it is bad not to mention this idea.
Raising levels has already been done several times, so the Devs have the experience with a level increase.
Perhaps this has already been considered by the Dev team, only without two-way communication about what has already been considered by the Devs, these ideas will also be mentioned.
WHAT ABOUT SELLING CARDASSIAN GROUND WEAPONS FOR DIL.
A better dil sink than the endeavour re-rolls would be re-rolling the three choices available when spending perk points, it's frustrating when you're faced with a choice of three ground bonuses.
absolutely right, good job!
This is why I am just done with the whole thing, I give up. They took one suggestion from this thread, to make re-roll tokens available using Dilithium and then they just added on the removal of the free ones and now they're passing it along like it's our idea.
Honestly, it's so typical it's my fault for expecting anything more. Giving them feedback is an obvious waste of time.
I agree, just fix it the way they have fixed everything else and remove the Dilithium exchange entirely. Just tell people that your studio is too small to maintain it, that seems to be your go to move anyway.
Another thing that might work is if we could use dilithium to play as another species on ground missions - no, I don't mean Romulan/Klingon/etc. What if you could spend dilithium to buy a one-hour unlock to play, say, an Iconian or a Tzenkethi? (Tzenkethi already is playable with the Captain Neth Parr mission) Undine would be another possible race, as well as the Hur'Q or even the Founders since all of them already have unique abilities and traits in game as enemies. This would be like the holographic gekli or Undine ship except it'd last 60 minutes in combat on the ground. Just an idea!
same could be done for specialty ships. want to delete a character but want to save the ship you worked so hard for? pay some dil, have it put back into a box and move it to whoever you wanted to. (accound bound of course or default box state.)
I know I'd pay a lot of dil to be able to move some of my specialty ships around to other toons. obviously I know theres a lot of issues with this but still.
Jagged_Jade on the forums
If possible this could go with more insides for the ships. And potentially another ship specific cargo just for trade goods. This would represent a varied sized cargo going with ship size. In fact we could look at older game genres to introduce 2d esc version of ship interiors. Or even those newer ship games where the ship and crew are entirely on a 2d ship screen. This could replace the old crew and bring back or introduce some new features.
Going 2d to add more interiors could be nice for this game as it's less art intensive. And that means more gameplay functionality and complexity. Especially customizing things for the ship for more than aesthetics.
This is sort of taken account with increased stacks. But what if the new extra cargo hull tab is for more condensed or special trade specific items like very large qauntities. It could be for crates or special qauntum or other compressed items. They could be worth more than 9,999 items. Say the old cargo stacks of near 20 could be brought back in the form of the new cargo tab for these and each individual item represents a 9,999 stack or current items. (example a 20 stack is actually 9,999 x 20.) But it's only for certain items for certain gameplay. This could allow trading to make more money. Or at least earlier as all ships could have custom starting cargo depending on the specific ship and it's orientation as a ship. Although you could use 2d customization to make trade specific ships. Or the opposite. This could expand the whole game pretty quickly and give more avenues for new content. You could customize the interior for more or less cargo depending on the ships orientation with 2d interiors.
The other idea is more instances for such things. It could be more open world with RPG style drop down attacks or similar and be good for teamwork if people want. They coudl be focused on these currencies and be specific to each realm in the game for each species. The obvious one is the old klingon territory. All species with currencies could be given a custom map to drop down to with more access to more planets and areas for trade and 3x/4x style openworld gameplay. then if you don't want to participate you leave to the normal maps. If you want to participate then you drop down into a map you like. This could consist of ferengi, klingon, federation, Romulan(new and old as a decimated area could still have custom pirate and other groups), gorn, etc. (maybe not fed if they don't have currencies although subspecies might.) Any traditional species with a territory could have custom content with various in territory things going on. This has already been explored in the lore and could be expanded on in each area.
It could even add story by giving info subtely or not about each territory and explore government types or other content related to each species in the process.