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"We are looking into the data for making lock box and phoenix stuff account wide, but..."

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  • seaofsorrowsseaofsorrows Member Posts: 8,656 Arc User
    reyan01 wrote: »
    To be honest, they could make some small profit from this if they truly wanted. Something like a "Account-Wide Ship Unlock Token" for *enter amount* Zen.

    I would buy it.
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  • keladorkelador Member Posts: 318 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    At the very least I would like to see an account shared dry dock so you can use lockbox/lobi ships between characters.
  • strychnyne1strychnyne1 Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    sci321 wrote: »
    rattler2 wrote: »
    I've been with STO since it came out in stores and I bought the collector's edition (I still have my Starfleet badge that came with it). I HAVE bought lockbox keys before all in the pursuit of the U.S.S. Vengeance-Class Dreadnought. I have yet to even come close. That's all I want is the ONE ship and my odds of getting it are around 0.1%.

    Problem with this. The Vengeance is NOT in the lockbox. Its a Lobi ship. So why are you saying the odds are that low when all you need is either 900 Lobi or whatever the current market value is in ECs to buy one off the Exchange?

    Because when it was in the lockbox it would've been faster for me to win it vs. playing for Lobi or Ec's. Sorry I don't have time to play this like you do.

    I'm sorry...

    Firstly, it was never in the lock box to begin with. Secondly, the only way to currently get Lobi Crystals is from opening lock boxes. They are an additional reward on top of the random reward. Thirdly, the Lobi Crystals in a character's inventory can be used to access the Lobi store anywhere, so there's really no reason to complain about it taking longer to amass the Lobi to purchase a ship from the store that it is to earn a ship pack from a lock box.

    So, why can't I just buy the ship instead of going through the gambling process?
  • strychnyne1strychnyne1 Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    I've been with STO since it came out in stores and I bought the collector's edition (I still have my Starfleet badge that came with it). I HAVE bought lockbox keys before all in the pursuit of the U.S.S. Vengeance-Class Dreadnought. I have yet to even come close. That's all I want is the ONE ship and my odds of getting it are around 0.1%.

    Problem with this. The Vengeance is NOT in the lockbox. Its a Lobi ship. So why are you saying the odds are that low when all you need is either 900 Lobi or whatever the current market value is in ECs to buy one off the Exchange?

    Because when it was in the lockbox it would've been faster for me to win it vs. playing for Lobi or Ec's. Sorry I don't have time to play this like you do.

    I'm sorry...

    You just sell the keys instead of opening boxes and buy the Vengeance off the exchange.

    I picked up my last Vengence for 190M, they're practically free. Opening boxes trying to get to 900 Lobi 4-8 at a time is madness.. why on earth would you do that?

    As said before, the Vengeance has never at any time been available as a lock box drop. Being a lobi ship makes it cheap, the Vengeance is one of the cheapest T6 ships on the exchange.. it's a fantastic deal for such a great ship. Absolutely no one should be complaining about it being difficult to acquire a Vengeance.

    I have 800K EC.

    I don't have the time to play like you do.

  • strychnyne1strychnyne1 Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    You know what...

    I quit.

    I really enjoyed the time I spent with the game but now it's all confusing with the lootboxes/bank space/inventory space and not being able to just earn what I want. I tried, I really tried.

    It's just not fun for me anymore.

    I quit.
  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 3,742 Arc User
    You know what...

    I quit.

    I really enjoyed the time I spent with the game but now it's all confusing with the lootboxes/bank space/inventory space and not being able to just earn what I want. I tried, I really tried.

    It's just not fun for me anymore.

    I quit.

    That's fine. Every day some people stop playing (every game out there) and some people start playing (every game out there). Neither you nor STO are unique in this regard.

    About lock box ships: you don't have to gamble to get them; they can be bought on the exchange. If you don't have enough EC, you can "buy" that too (RL money > zen > master keys/promo packs > sell them on the exchange = EC).

    If you aren't willing to spend or grind to get the thing you want, that's ok too. But you can't make a valid complaint when you have a way to get something but just aren't willing to do it.

    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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  • davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 8,027 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    I have 800K EC.

    I don't have the time to play like you do.

    One Personal Endeavor box can award up to 500K EC, and 100+K is common.

    Admiralty gets you hundreds of K of EC fairly quickly along with a nice amount of dil.

    ~50,000 dil sold for zen gets you a lock box key that sells for 4-5 million EC.

    It's fine to not want to do anything, but if you are not then willing to spend some real world cash monies instead then no you can't have all the shinies. Time or money, pick one.
  • echattyechatty Member Posts: 4,873 Arc User
    Yeah, I get tons of EC just doing Endeavors. I've even occasionally gotten over 1m total from all three boxes, 4 if I choose to do the global. The least you can get from any endeavor box is 50k.
    Now a LTS and loving it.

    Just because you spend money on this game, it does not entitle you to be a jerk if things don't go your way.

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  • duasynduasyn Member Posts: 318 Arc User
    The title of this thread was not meant to be misleading, there simply was not enough room to fit the entire quote:
    "We are looking into the data for making lock box and phoenix stuff account wide but don't have anything to announce."

    From tonight's Ten Forward Weekly:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/sto/comments/dpfm75/ten_forward_weekly_30102019_memories_of_dst/

    That'd be nice. Since I've given up on really doing anything w/ my alt toons; if a ships isn't going to be used by my main I don't care about it. For example... I have a Sci toon that uses Tholian ships and would be interested in getting one of the new ones, but can't justify buying one for a character I don't really use anymore. Now if I could use it on my main AND that alt... I might be interested.
  • duasynduasyn Member Posts: 318 Arc User
    Lobi ships are around 200 million on the exchange.

    Never could understand why lobi ships were so low priced, unless you consider lobi essentially 'trash' items?
    You get 5 average per box, right? So to buy that 900 lobi ship you just used 180 keys. Exchange value of 810M EC (assuming 4.5M ea) Is all the other stuff (assuming you don't get a grand prize ship) you get from 180 boxes worth that other 610M EC to make it worth the keys used?
  • davefenestratordavefenestrator Member Posts: 8,027 Arc User
    duasyn wrote: »
    Lobi ships are around 200 million on the exchange.

    Never could understand why lobi ships were so low priced, unless you consider lobi essentially 'trash' items?
    You get 5 average per box, right? So to buy that 900 lobi ship you just used 180 keys. Exchange value of 810M EC (assuming 4.5M ea) Is all the other stuff (assuming you don't get a grand prize ship) you get from 180 boxes worth that other 610M EC to make it worth the keys used?

    It's because of the people who do open massive numbers of boxes to get lock box and pack ships to use or sell.

    It takes an average of 100 R&D packs or 250 lock boxes to get those ships. You get a lobi ship as a side effect.

    A big spender who wants every lock box and pack ship, or a really big spender who gets multiples of ships for their alts, will also earn an equal number of lobi ships.

    There are also supposedly people who do this just to sell the ships instead of using them, for which I say "thanks!"
  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 13,195 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    duasyn wrote: »
    Lobi ships are around 200 million on the exchange.

    Never could understand why lobi ships were so low priced, unless you consider lobi essentially 'trash' items?
    You get 5 average per box, right? So to buy that 900 lobi ship you just used 180 keys. Exchange value of 810M EC (assuming 4.5M ea) Is all the other stuff (assuming you don't get a grand prize ship) you get from 180 boxes worth that other 610M EC to make it worth the keys used?

    As @davefenestrator said, its basically because Lobi ships are far more common.

    Think about all the boxes people open. Every one of those lock boxes drops a minimum of four Lobi. The R&D/DOFF Promotion boxes drop ten.

    And there are two primary scenarios here:

    - The majority of those boxes opened don't yeild the prize ship, therefore the players opening them end up with a large stack of Lobi in their bank. They then use said Lobi to buy one of the Lobi ships, either to actually use themselves or to sell
    - Players open the boxes specifically for the Lobi - because honestly, the majority of the Lobi store ships are actually pretty darn good and some will open the boxes with accumilating enogh Lobi to buy one of the store ships in mind. I did this with the Tholian Iktomi, which I feel is a great ship.

    In the first scenario it could well be that the player feels that the Lobi ship is a consolation prize - which is a pity since the Lobi ships are not particuarly inferior to their 'prize' counterparts; in fact in some cases the Lobi ship is MORE popular. I mean, whilst I do see Kelvin Timeline Consitutions fairly often, the Kelvin Dreadnought (Vengence class) is absolutely everywhere and it is extremely rare that I enter an instance of anything that doesn't have a Vengence class present. I'd argue that it could well be the most popular ship in the game (judging by numbers seen) - and it's a Lobi ship.
    Post edited by reyan01 on
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  • postagepaidpostagepaid Member Posts: 2,531 Arc User
    The jarjar dred is popular because its a decent ship more than being one from a movie.

    Lobi was originally sold as being a reward point system to gloss over the awful win chance on the gamble boxes where you could trade in those points for a consolation prize. Back then they were but someone obviously saw that it was just another way to push gambleboxes at people so they put in desirable ships that tended to sit outside the normal factions or were needed to complete a set.

    I open boxes if my zen amount has gone over a minimum, keys are on sale, something in the box seems interesting to me (most important factor) and how much worthless padding has been put in. If I get nothing but TRIBBLE (like those damned R&D mats that are everywhere) in the first few boxes then I stop and delete any boxes that drop saving the remainder of the keys for next round.
  • strychnyne1strychnyne1 Member Posts: 6 Arc User
    Thanks for all of the positive and constructive replies. Me leaving the game isn't a knock on any one player or the game. It's just that when I was playing and the message "Soandso just won a tier-6 uber-dreadnought!" across the top of the screen, I figured "Oh, if I get the loot boxes, I'll win one too."

    The game never told me that "Hey, you can't actually win[ a ship, but here's how you can get one."

    I know, that some people might think that I needed my hand to be held, but I just didn't know and the game was vague at best on how to get one via playing the game.

    Thanks again for the positive replies and I hope you all enjoy your game.

    Peace.
  • thegrandnagus1thegrandnagus1 Member Posts: 3,742 Arc User
    It's just that when I was playing and the message "Soandso just won a tier-6 uber-dreadnought!" across the top of the screen, I figured "Oh, if I get the loot boxes, I'll win one too."

    Yeah, it's designed to mislead people into believing exactly what you thought. No disagreement there.

    The-Grand-Nagus
    Join Date: Sep 2008

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  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 49,962 Arc User
    I actually have those messages turned OFF. Was annoying seeing that go across the screen.
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    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
    The nut who actually ground out a Delta Pack, Temporal Pack, and Gamma Pack
    The resident forum voice of reason (I HAZ FORUM REP! YAY!)
  • postagepaidpostagepaid Member Posts: 2,531 Arc User
    PC can disable that message, one of the many basic quality of life functions that console players didn't get.

    The game will never explain the how's of getting a gamblebox ship thats not via a gamblebox. Which is kind of funny as googling with keywords like the ship name and buy will spit out the scummy 3rd party (breach of TOS) type sites just as much as info on how to grind out the ec and using the exchange. The blogposts can be equally vague, often using very similar wording for store and gamblebox ships in their titles to push the ship and not how to get it.
  • sci321sci321 Member Posts: 75 Arc User
    The game will never explain the how's of getting a gamblebox ship thats not via a gamblebox.

    That's a load of bull. When a new lock box is released, it is always preceded by a news post ON THIS VERY SITE that details the new ships' stats. Among the list there is always a bullet point near the top that specifies weather the ship is from the Lock Box or the Lobi Store. Even if you miss the news post, there is always the official STO wiki, of which this site has a DIRECT LINK to. It's not the developers' fault for being vague, it's your fault for not using the available resources to educate yourself when you don't understand something.
  • postagepaidpostagepaid Member Posts: 2,531 Arc User
    sci321 wrote: »
    The game will never explain the how's of getting a gamblebox ship thats not via a gamblebox.

    Among the list there is always a bullet point near the top that specifies weather the ship is from the Lock Box or the Lobi Store.

    As I said they don't tell you how to get a ship that's not via a gamblebox, they never mention the option to trade for it with other players either face to face or via the exchange. Neither do the wiki sections for lockbox based stuff (at least not currently). If they are being deliberately vague then it is by their choice and with the incentive that folk will gamble for the ships its obvious that choice of omission will stay.
  • sci321sci321 Member Posts: 75 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    sci321 wrote: »
    The game will never explain the how's of getting a gamblebox ship thats not via a gamblebox.

    Among the list there is always a bullet point near the top that specifies weather the ship is from the Lock Box or the Lobi Store.

    As I said they don't tell you how to get a ship that's not via a gamblebox, they never mention the option to trade for it with other players either face to face or via the exchange. Neither do the wiki sections for lockbox based stuff (at least not currently). If they are being deliberately vague then it is by their choice and with the incentive that folk will gamble for the ships its obvious that choice of omission will stay.

    There are three lines that say an item can't be traded.
    1. bind on pickup
    2. bound to character
    3. bound to account
    If an item doesn't have one of the above, it CAN. BE. TRADED! NO EXCEPTIONS! Plus, right clicking and selecting more details on the items that grant the lock box/lobi/promo pack ships has a line AT THE VERY TOP that clearly says the ship is currently packed up and can be traded. Again, your fault for not using the available resources, not the developer's fault for being vague.
    Post edited by sci321 on
  • captaincelestialcaptaincelestial Member Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    That's why they are looking at the data. If they see a very miniscule percentage of multiple opens for a Lockbox Ship on an Account, it's no skin off their nose to make it an Account Unlock.

    Doing so could generate more cash for them, as people who wouldn't partake before, may do so now as the Ships become availible to all appropriate Characters on an Account. And they would still be as rare as before as an individual Account can only fly a particular ship on one Character at a time.

    Plus, the way lockboxes are being looked into by governments, it'd be wise to head away from a more gamble oriented system.

    Out of all the R&D (and other promos that offered the special ships), all I've ever opened up is one 26th Century ship (the Universal-Class/aka Enterprise-J). It would be nice if the other characters on the account would be able to receive a 26th Century box to click on to receive the appropriate faction ship.

    But then again, it'd most likely won't be grandfathered in and I'd have to start from scratch.
  • captaincelestialcaptaincelestial Member Posts: 1,417 Arc User
    edited November 2019
    Body is required: I hope that this is a retroactive.

    But if it is, does it go by if you actively have the lockbox ship in your Active/Dry Dock slot, or does it go by the Admiralty card if you have deleted it to make room for other ships?
    Post edited by captaincelestial on
  • redeyedravenredeyedraven Member Posts: 849 Arc User
    Making the jackpot-ships eligible for account-unlock would actually increase their value and give players all the more incentive to actually *open* boxes.
  • foxrockssocksfoxrockssocks Member Posts: 1,133 Arc User
    sci321 wrote: »
    sci321 wrote: »
    The game will never explain the how's of getting a gamblebox ship thats not via a gamblebox.

    Among the list there is always a bullet point near the top that specifies weather the ship is from the Lock Box or the Lobi Store.

    As I said they don't tell you how to get a ship that's not via a gamblebox, they never mention the option to trade for it with other players either face to face or via the exchange. Neither do the wiki sections for lockbox based stuff (at least not currently). If they are being deliberately vague then it is by their choice and with the incentive that folk will gamble for the ships its obvious that choice of omission will stay.

    There are three lines that say an item can't be traded.
    1. bind on pickup
    2. bound to character
    3. bound to account
    If an item doesn't have one of the above, it CAN. BE. TRADED! NO EXCEPTIONS! Plus, right clicking and selecting more details on the items that grant the lock box/lobi/promo pack ships has a line AT THE VERY TOP that clearly says the ship is currently packed up and can be traded. Again, your fault for not using the available resources, not the developer's fault for being vague.

    Keep in mind anyone who has never won a ship doesn't know how winning a ship works without reading about it.

    No one randomly guesses to search the reward pack category in the exchange in hopes of finding a tradeable ship. It isn't even obvious what to search for if you do know a ship can be sold on the exchange. Logically you might search for "Ship" and you get a bunch of ship traits, but no ships.

    The reward announcement also doesn't suggest what the winner will do with their ship box, like whether they will keep it or sell it, so anyone unaware they can be sold reasonably assumes they are just keeping the ship. It might actually be better if the announcement told you when it was put on the exchange and when finally opened.
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 9,427 Arc User
    sci321 wrote: »
    sci321 wrote: »
    The game will never explain the how's of getting a gamblebox ship thats not via a gamblebox.

    Among the list there is always a bullet point near the top that specifies weather the ship is from the Lock Box or the Lobi Store.

    As I said they don't tell you how to get a ship that's not via a gamblebox, they never mention the option to trade for it with other players either face to face or via the exchange. Neither do the wiki sections for lockbox based stuff (at least not currently). If they are being deliberately vague then it is by their choice and with the incentive that folk will gamble for the ships its obvious that choice of omission will stay.

    There are three lines that say an item can't be traded.
    1. bind on pickup
    2. bound to character
    3. bound to account
    If an item doesn't have one of the above, it CAN. BE. TRADED! NO EXCEPTIONS! Plus, right clicking and selecting more details on the items that grant the lock box/lobi/promo pack ships has a line AT THE VERY TOP that clearly says the ship is currently packed up and can be traded. Again, your fault for not using the available resources, not the developer's fault for being vague.

    Keep in mind anyone who has never won a ship doesn't know how winning a ship works without reading about it.

    No one randomly guesses to search the reward pack category in the exchange in hopes of finding a tradeable ship. It isn't even obvious what to search for if you do know a ship can be sold on the exchange. Logically you might search for "Ship" and you get a bunch of ship traits, but no ships.

    The reward announcement also doesn't suggest what the winner will do with their ship box, like whether they will keep it or sell it, so anyone unaware they can be sold reasonably assumes they are just keeping the ship. It might actually be better if the announcement told you when it was put on the exchange and when finally opened.
    I tend to have a little more faith in human intelligence than that.
  • foxrockssocksfoxrockssocks Member Posts: 1,133 Arc User
    warpangel wrote: »
    sci321 wrote: »
    sci321 wrote: »
    The game will never explain the how's of getting a gamblebox ship thats not via a gamblebox.

    Among the list there is always a bullet point near the top that specifies weather the ship is from the Lock Box or the Lobi Store.

    As I said they don't tell you how to get a ship that's not via a gamblebox, they never mention the option to trade for it with other players either face to face or via the exchange. Neither do the wiki sections for lockbox based stuff (at least not currently). If they are being deliberately vague then it is by their choice and with the incentive that folk will gamble for the ships its obvious that choice of omission will stay.

    There are three lines that say an item can't be traded.
    1. bind on pickup
    2. bound to character
    3. bound to account
    If an item doesn't have one of the above, it CAN. BE. TRADED! NO EXCEPTIONS! Plus, right clicking and selecting more details on the items that grant the lock box/lobi/promo pack ships has a line AT THE VERY TOP that clearly says the ship is currently packed up and can be traded. Again, your fault for not using the available resources, not the developer's fault for being vague.

    Keep in mind anyone who has never won a ship doesn't know how winning a ship works without reading about it.

    No one randomly guesses to search the reward pack category in the exchange in hopes of finding a tradeable ship. It isn't even obvious what to search for if you do know a ship can be sold on the exchange. Logically you might search for "Ship" and you get a bunch of ship traits, but no ships.

    The reward announcement also doesn't suggest what the winner will do with their ship box, like whether they will keep it or sell it, so anyone unaware they can be sold reasonably assumes they are just keeping the ship. It might actually be better if the announcement told you when it was put on the exchange and when finally opened.
    I tend to have a little more faith in human intelligence than that.

    What does intelligence have to do with it? It isn't apparent how any of it works. You have to find some relevant info somewhere to clue you into it.

    Personally I forgot how to search for ships after a couple years break from the game. I didn't know what to search for, and couldn't figure it out until I went to the wiki to look up what the boxes were called. It isn't hard, but it sure isn't intuitive.

    Also, as George Carlin reminds us: Think of how dumb the average person is, then realize half the world is dumber than that.
  • littlesarbonnlittlesarbonn Member Posts: 467 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    I actually have those messages turned OFF. Was annoying seeing that go across the screen.

    I keep it on for the specific purpose of remembering there are other people playing the game with me.
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  • littlesarbonnlittlesarbonn Member Posts: 467 Arc User
    (If you know it's off topic, then don't derail the thread. Comments moderated out. - BMR)

    As an aside, the whole thread has been so interesting that I've kind of forgotten what the original topic was. And would still read it again. :smile:
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    Fleet Admiral Ventaxa Proxmire, U.S.S. Shaka Walls Fell
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  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 34,897 Arc User
    rattler2 wrote: »
    I actually have those messages turned OFF. Was annoying seeing that go across the screen.
    I keep it on for the specific purpose of remembering there are other people playing the game with me.
    Well, also turning off the System chat channel means turning off several other things.
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