I believe you missed Mr. Gecko's explanation in his very first AoY interview with P-1, about Their 'reasons' for limiting the player character types for this expansion...
And according to him at that time, yes it was "set in stone."
Lol yea davey, as usual you dont read between the lines or just dont post it when you do, i will.
What Mr. Gecko's explanation didn't include as reasons for limiting character types is this.
The overhead it would have cost to do it was put into z-store ships instead.
After all this time, I kinda-sorta figured THAT went without actually saying, but it does get covered in the "reasons" part of my post.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I was pretty bummed out about it at first too. And to a degree, I still question Cryptic's reasoning behind this as I think it's a turn off more than much else.
That being said, I'm going to roll an Andorian for the first time and I intend to enjoy the hell out of it.
What if Cryptic limited the amount of TOS races so it can add a bunch of Kelvin Universe races? Just think about how many people want to purchase the Kelvin Universe Caitians, but think the Prime Universe Caitians are a bit too furry for their catgirls and/or catboys.
We haven't seen any Caitians in the Kelvin Timeline though.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
They were not Caitians. Caitians are cat aliens. The twins were humans with head ridges on their ears similar to Cardassians.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Because we are slowly being pushed into just human Federation.
The devs decided in their infinite wisdom to do this, as they seem to have problems taking any notice of actully paying attention to those that play the game, unless its something stupid or not really that great.
Because we are slowly being pushed into just human Federation.
The devs decided in their infinite wisdom to do this, as they seem to have problems taking any notice of actully paying attention to those that play the game, unless its something stupid or not really that great.
Yes! Insulting devs is the quickest way to express your hurt feelings and get what you want!
there is no species change token; one of the devs killed that speculation weeks ago
Have a link? Not saying I don't believe you, always considered it a long shot anyway, I'd just like to read it, the only thread I've been following on the subject hasn't had a post in some time.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
There's a bit how they are confirmed to be Caitians on Startrek.com
Just keep in mind that the Kelvin Timeline is more of an alternate universe that's different in more ways than just Spock and Nero's incursion.
I've read it. But as their existence in canon material is limited to their appearance with no name they remain unnamed aliens with ridged ears.
What's likely to have happened is the writer didn't consult with the makeup artists on what alien they had designed and instead said 'sure, yes' when asked off the cuff if they were Caitians.
Bearing in mind that there are zero differences between the PR and AR prior to the attack on the Kelvin in any other species at all.
Also bear in mind Lindelof hardly had a hand in anything other than story work so wouldn't have been responsible for characters in the first place, not does he seem to be in any position to even know Caitians were, as, like Abrams, he was not a watcher of the show, he got the gig through writing alongside Abrams on Lost.
So, no, despite an off the cuff remark by some bloke in some interview, they are not Caitians and just remain some nameless aliens.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
there is no species change token; one of the devs killed that speculation weeks ago
Have a link? Not saying I don't believe you, always considered it a long shot anyway, I'd just like to read it, the only thread I've been following on the subject hasn't had a post in some time.
There's a bit how they are confirmed to be Caitians on Startrek.com
Just keep in mind that the Kelvin Timeline is more of an alternate universe that's different in more ways than just Spock and Nero's incursion.
I've read it. But as their existence in canon material is limited to their appearance with no name they remain unnamed aliens with ridged ears.
What's likely to have happened is the writer didn't consult with the makeup artists on what alien they had designed and instead said 'sure, yes' when asked off the cuff if they were Caitians.
Bearing in mind that there are zero differences between the PR and AR prior to the attack on the Kelvin in any other species at all.
Also bear in mind Lindelof hardly had a hand in anything other than story work so wouldn't have been responsible for characters in the first place, not does he seem to be in any position to even know Caitians were, as, like Abrams, he was not a watcher of the show, he got the gig through writing alongside Abrams on Lost.
So, no, despite an off the cuff remark by some bloke in some interview, they are not Caitians and just remain some nameless aliens.
Umm... The Kelvin and uniforms used on board are pretty big differences between Kelvin and Prime universes actually. There's a pretty good discussion that based on several things in the first film, there's ample evidence to show that the Kelvin universe was different before Nero and Spock arrived. This is a silly argument anything and a weird thing to get upset about in the first place. As long as we establish rules of canon that accept that anything on screen becomes canon and you have a someone involved in the film directly stating that they are Caitians, then by all definitions regarding what we consider to be canon that sums it up quite nicely. I mean, it can be your headcanon whatever and you can hate Into Darkness for doing that and hate towards Into Darkness is most certainly justified, but it still happened. It still has been confirmed. That makes it official.
You actually expected them to put effort into the minimalist expansion that people are tripping over themselves to buy because of three letters? Tee Ohh Ess...
There's a pretty good discussion that based on several things in the first film, there's ample evidence to show that the Kelvin universe was different before Nero and Spock arrived.
Yes, that ENT and TAR are one separate quantum reality is indeed my headcanon, doesn't make it true though.
As long as we establish rules of canon that accept that anything on screen becomes canon and you have a someone involved in the film directly stating that they are Caitians, then by all definitions regarding what we consider to be canon that sums it up quite nicely.
But CBS says only things said or shown onscreen are canon. They are not said to be Caitians (through dialogue) or shown to be Caitians (by having the appearance of them) onscreen so as far as CBS' official canon policy is concerned, they are not Caitians.
If people want to use directors and writers comments in their headcanon, that's fine. I don't see why anybody would want to take off the cuff remarks with no background thought into their headcanon, but that's up to them.
I mean, it can be your headcanon whatever and you can hate Into Darkness for doing that and hate towards Into Darkness is most certainly justified, but it still happened. It still has been confirmed. That makes it official.
You're speaking to one of the only people in the forums that liked ID. So yes, it's 'official' in the sense it was said by somebody involved in the production of a Star Trek film. It however remains, non-canon. Because, again, Lindelof would not have had a hand in being anywhere near any part of design, casting, or scripting. He was there to tidy up from the other two writers, nothing to do with naming aliens.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
There's a bit how they are confirmed to be Caitians on Startrek.com
Just keep in mind that the Kelvin Timeline is more of an alternate universe that's different in more ways than just Spock and Nero's incursion.
I've read it. But as their existence in canon material is limited to their appearance with no name they remain unnamed aliens with ridged ears.
What's likely to have happened is the writer didn't consult with the makeup artists on what alien they had designed and instead said 'sure, yes' when asked off the cuff if they were Caitians.
Bearing in mind that there are zero differences between the PR and AR prior to the attack on the Kelvin in any other species at all.
Also bear in mind Lindelof hardly had a hand in anything other than story work so wouldn't have been responsible for characters in the first place, not does he seem to be in any position to even know Caitians were, as, like Abrams, he was not a watcher of the show, he got the gig through writing alongside Abrams on Lost.
So, no, despite an off the cuff remark by some bloke in some interview, they are not Caitians and just remain some nameless aliens.
Umm... The Kelvin and uniforms used on board are pretty big differences between Kelvin and Prime universes actually. There's a pretty good discussion that based on several things in the first film, there's ample evidence to show that the Kelvin universe was different before Nero and Spock arrived. This is a silly argument anything and a weird thing to get upset about in the first place. As long as we establish rules of canon that accept that anything on screen becomes canon and you have a someone involved in the film directly stating that they are Caitians, then by all definitions regarding what we consider to be canon that sums it up quite nicely. I mean, it can be your headcanon whatever and you can hate Into Darkness for doing that and hate towards Into Darkness is most certainly justified, but it still happened. It still has been confirmed. That makes it official.
I love how some of the same people howl about how big the JJprize is based on comments by people vs in screen vs written licensed material... Even after CBS/Paramount have given a stated size as a final answer... then some of these same people ignore the Caitians on the same grounds they howled that the JJprize is huge.
Either way... they were kinda hot sex kittens stop tryin to argue over an IP that rewrites itself every new movie/episode/series
There's a pretty good discussion that based on several things in the first film, there's ample evidence to show that the Kelvin universe was different before Nero and Spock arrived.
Yes, that ENT and TAR are one separate quantum reality is indeed my headcanon, doesn't make it true though.
As long as we establish rules of canon that accept that anything on screen becomes canon and you have a someone involved in the film directly stating that they are Caitians, then by all definitions regarding what we consider to be canon that sums it up quite nicely.
But CBS says only things said or shown onscreen are canon. They are not said to be Caitians (through dialogue) or shown to be Caitians (by having the appearance of them) onscreen so as far as CBS' official canon policy is concerned, they are not Caitians.
If people want to use directors and writers comments in their headcanon, that's fine. I don't see why anybody would want to take off the cuff remarks with no background thought into their headcanon, but that's up to them.
I mean, it can be your headcanon whatever and you can hate Into Darkness for doing that and hate towards Into Darkness is most certainly justified, but it still happened. It still has been confirmed. That makes it official.
You're speaking to one of the only people in the forums that liked ID. So yes, it's 'official' in the sense it was said by somebody involved in the production of a Star Trek film. It however remains, non-canon. Because, again, Lindelof would not have had a hand in being anywhere near any part of design, casting, or scripting. He was there to tidy up from the other two writers, nothing to do with naming aliens.
curious, can you cite anything on screen that ever directly names Caitians as thus? Because Memory Alphamemory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Caitian seems to point to otherwise. So... if that's accepted at least into STO canon as Prime Universe Caitians, then it completely stands to reason that the twins in ID are Caitians by the same measure of logic.
There's a pretty good discussion that based on several things in the first film, there's ample evidence to show that the Kelvin universe was different before Nero and Spock arrived.
Yes, that ENT and TAR are one separate quantum reality is indeed my headcanon, doesn't make it true though.
As long as we establish rules of canon that accept that anything on screen becomes canon and you have a someone involved in the film directly stating that they are Caitians, then by all definitions regarding what we consider to be canon that sums it up quite nicely.
But CBS says only things said or shown onscreen are canon. They are not said to be Caitians (through dialogue) or shown to be Caitians (by having the appearance of them) onscreen so as far as CBS' official canon policy is concerned, they are not Caitians.
If people want to use directors and writers comments in their headcanon, that's fine. I don't see why anybody would want to take off the cuff remarks with no background thought into their headcanon, but that's up to them.
I mean, it can be your headcanon whatever and you can hate Into Darkness for doing that and hate towards Into Darkness is most certainly justified, but it still happened. It still has been confirmed. That makes it official.
You're speaking to one of the only people in the forums that liked ID. So yes, it's 'official' in the sense it was said by somebody involved in the production of a Star Trek film. It however remains, non-canon. Because, again, Lindelof would not have had a hand in being anywhere near any part of design, casting, or scripting. He was there to tidy up from the other two writers, nothing to do with naming aliens.
curious, can you cite anything on screen that ever directly names Caitians as thus? Because Memory Alphamemory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Caitian seems to point to otherwise. So... if that's accepted at least into STO canon as Prime Universe Caitians, then it completely stands to reason that the twins in ID are Caitians by the same measure of logic.
No. I use the name Caitian because it's shorter than saying 'member-of-the-species-that-M'Ress-from-TAS-was'. I accept the two cat Admirals from TVH as Caitians because they are identical live action reproductions of M'Ress. By the same measure, the green women in 09 and ID are Orions because they are identical to existing ones. The aliens in ID are humans with human features except for the ears, they have ridged ears. This is not even a TMP vs. TNG Klingon issue, where they have completely dissimilar ridge makeup but are still identifiable as the same species. There are no features in common between the 'member-of-the-species-that-M'Ress-from-TAS-was' from TVH and the two alien women from ID, They share nothing.
For the cat Admirals from TVH to be the same species as M'Ress requires a look at canon material (i.e. the makeup seen on screen) to identify them as the same species. Looking at the canon evidence provided to make the unnamed allies Caitians? Well there is none. Almond eyes? No check. Cat ears? No check. Fur? No check. Digigrade legs? No check. Purring voice? No check. The onscreen evidence does not support supplementary assertions that they are Caitian.
I love how some of the same people howl about how big the JJprize is based on comments by people vs in screen vs written licensed material... Even after CBS/Paramount have given a stated size as a final answer... then some of these same people ignore the Caitians on the same grounds they howled that the JJprize is huge.
Correct. There is little onscreen evidence for a 700m Constitution and zero onscreen evidence for those being Caitians.
So by CBS' own canon policy, the onscreen evidence stands alone.
I suspect that's not what you were trying to say though.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
You ca do an image search on the "twins". There are several concept sketches for them and all of them were supposed to be just some random colourful alien (human with bodypaint, basically). There's nothing at all hinting at any planned resemblance to anything else, least of all Caitians that have actual cat features.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
There have been a couple of not-bad suggestions in this thread. I'm hesitant to jump on board with them, or call them out publicly, since it might be too late for a major change like this. I have to check a lot of variables on my end before pulling any triggers.
The GOOD news of this thread is that it contains a whole bunch of ideas that, while they might not be excellent suggestions for a Skill, would definitely make the cut for Traits, Starship Traits, Spec Abilities, Set Bonuses, or Doff Abilities. So while I might shoot them down now, I'm also bookmarking the thread for later reference.
This thread is shaping up to be another one of those where the suggestions being made don't quite fit what our design is aiming for, but aren't bad designs for other aspects of gameplay. So, again I'm bookmarking it!
Does [Nikeix's proposal] address the other feedback in this thread? Cause other issues?
I speak "Dev" very well. I'm offering free advice on how to actually get what you want. No one will make you take it.
Anyone can beat that wrong assumption. It is wrong to state "they hear" in matters that are critical to this game. Either that or you must be real new to STO to forget about the history.
Here is just a "small" sampling of the stuff they don't want to hear past a few years ago that some probably dont remember....
-DR launched and the Argala nerf fiasco. Massive feedback from players to change what was done in the game. Cryptic punished players for the crimes of the few with a huge nerf that basically left this MMO empty:
This can go on...pages after pages...point being is that it is the norm here for Players to have "no say" in this game when it comes to critical matters. If you are talking something being tested in tribble thats a different story.
You ca do an image search on the "twins". There are several concept sketches for them and all of them were supposed to be just some random colourful alien (human with bodypaint, basically). There's nothing at all hinting at any planned resemblance to anything else, least of all Caitians that have actual cat features.
It's because Lindelof latched onto the word 'Caitian' and agreed because he assumed it made him look like he knew what he was on about. At no point in the design of the random aliens (including the final one onscreen) were Caitians considered.
Not unless somebody finds anything feline about this?
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
if anything, the shape of those ears makes them look far more like vorta than caitians
I thought Cardassians. At least those have been made contact with in the KT.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
if anything, the shape of those ears makes them look far more like vorta than caitians
Indeed, they make better Cardassians than Caitians... do they at least have tails?
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
if anything, the shape of those ears makes them look far more like vorta than caitians
Indeed, they make better Cardassians than Caitians... do they at least have tails?
Yes. A generic mammalian tail.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Comments
After all this time, I kinda-sorta figured THAT went without actually saying, but it does get covered in the "reasons" part of my post.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
That being said, I'm going to roll an Andorian for the first time and I intend to enjoy the hell out of it.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Kirk bangs two of 'em in Into Darkness
New players.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
The devs decided in their infinite wisdom to do this, as they seem to have problems taking any notice of actully paying attention to those that play the game, unless its something stupid or not really that great.
Yes! Insulting devs is the quickest way to express your hurt feelings and get what you want!
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Unnamed_Caitians
There's a bit how they are confirmed to be Caitians on Startrek.com
Just keep in mind that the Kelvin Timeline is more of an alternate universe that's different in more ways than just Spock and Nero's incursion.
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline#/discussion/1215698/playable-tos-character-options-beyond-founding-4/p4
near the bottom of page 4
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
I've read it. But as their existence in canon material is limited to their appearance with no name they remain unnamed aliens with ridged ears.
What's likely to have happened is the writer didn't consult with the makeup artists on what alien they had designed and instead said 'sure, yes' when asked off the cuff if they were Caitians.
Bearing in mind that there are zero differences between the PR and AR prior to the attack on the Kelvin in any other species at all.
Also bear in mind Lindelof hardly had a hand in anything other than story work so wouldn't have been responsible for characters in the first place, not does he seem to be in any position to even know Caitians were, as, like Abrams, he was not a watcher of the show, he got the gig through writing alongside Abrams on Lost.
So, no, despite an off the cuff remark by some bloke in some interview, they are not Caitians and just remain some nameless aliens.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Thanks. I guess my TOS character will never have the privilege of serving the Collective
Umm... The Kelvin and uniforms used on board are pretty big differences between Kelvin and Prime universes actually. There's a pretty good discussion that based on several things in the first film, there's ample evidence to show that the Kelvin universe was different before Nero and Spock arrived. This is a silly argument anything and a weird thing to get upset about in the first place. As long as we establish rules of canon that accept that anything on screen becomes canon and you have a someone involved in the film directly stating that they are Caitians, then by all definitions regarding what we consider to be canon that sums it up quite nicely. I mean, it can be your headcanon whatever and you can hate Into Darkness for doing that and hate towards Into Darkness is most certainly justified, but it still happened. It still has been confirmed. That makes it official.
No. The Kelvin and it's uniforms pre-date The Cage and post-date ENT, they have no counterparts so there is no difference.
Yes, that ENT and TAR are one separate quantum reality is indeed my headcanon, doesn't make it true though.
But CBS says only things said or shown onscreen are canon. They are not said to be Caitians (through dialogue) or shown to be Caitians (by having the appearance of them) onscreen so as far as CBS' official canon policy is concerned, they are not Caitians.
If people want to use directors and writers comments in their headcanon, that's fine. I don't see why anybody would want to take off the cuff remarks with no background thought into their headcanon, but that's up to them.
You're speaking to one of the only people in the forums that liked ID. So yes, it's 'official' in the sense it was said by somebody involved in the production of a Star Trek film. It however remains, non-canon. Because, again, Lindelof would not have had a hand in being anywhere near any part of design, casting, or scripting. He was there to tidy up from the other two writers, nothing to do with naming aliens.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
I love how some of the same people howl about how big the JJprize is based on comments by people vs in screen vs written licensed material... Even after CBS/Paramount have given a stated size as a final answer... then some of these same people ignore the Caitians on the same grounds they howled that the JJprize is huge.
Either way... they were kinda hot sex kittens stop tryin to argue over an IP that rewrites itself every new movie/episode/series
curious, can you cite anything on screen that ever directly names Caitians as thus? Because Memory Alphamemory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Caitian seems to point to otherwise. So... if that's accepted at least into STO canon as Prime Universe Caitians, then it completely stands to reason that the twins in ID are Caitians by the same measure of logic.
No. I use the name Caitian because it's shorter than saying 'member-of-the-species-that-M'Ress-from-TAS-was'. I accept the two cat Admirals from TVH as Caitians because they are identical live action reproductions of M'Ress. By the same measure, the green women in 09 and ID are Orions because they are identical to existing ones. The aliens in ID are humans with human features except for the ears, they have ridged ears. This is not even a TMP vs. TNG Klingon issue, where they have completely dissimilar ridge makeup but are still identifiable as the same species. There are no features in common between the 'member-of-the-species-that-M'Ress-from-TAS-was' from TVH and the two alien women from ID, They share nothing.
For the cat Admirals from TVH to be the same species as M'Ress requires a look at canon material (i.e. the makeup seen on screen) to identify them as the same species. Looking at the canon evidence provided to make the unnamed allies Caitians? Well there is none. Almond eyes? No check. Cat ears? No check. Fur? No check. Digigrade legs? No check. Purring voice? No check. The onscreen evidence does not support supplementary assertions that they are Caitian.
Correct. There is little onscreen evidence for a 700m Constitution and zero onscreen evidence for those being Caitians.
So by CBS' own canon policy, the onscreen evidence stands alone.
I suspect that's not what you were trying to say though.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Anyone can beat that wrong assumption. It is wrong to state "they hear" in matters that are critical to this game. Either that or you must be real new to STO to forget about the history.
Here is just a "small" sampling of the stuff they don't want to hear past a few years ago that some probably dont remember....
-DR launched and the Argala nerf fiasco. Massive feedback from players to change what was done in the game. Cryptic punished players for the crimes of the few with a huge nerf that basically left this MMO empty:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1180988/incoming-argala-nerf-enjoy-the-grind
Nobody, except for a dev (who shall remain nameless) responded..."The players think that DR is the BEST game and they Love it". I will leave at that.
-Ground PvP concerns: and where's PvP...NO feedback or they dont want to listen"
Ground PvP
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1168718/ground-pvp-concerns-directory-4-0
-Space PvP concerns and still broken:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1104268/space-pvp-concerns-discussion-section
-Defera Broken and YES until now with no real listening to players concerns...broken for over years and counting
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1197671/defera-hard-mission-bugs
-Graphic bugs with no ear to lend players:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1208842/list-of-gameplay-graphics-bugs-issues-ive-noticed-in-sto
-Unanswered bugs from yesteryear and still broken:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1116788/consolidated-lor-bug-list-2
-Oldie but goodie...the great nerf of Science (when it used to rule STO) and no acknowledgment to lend an ear:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1116788/consolidated-lor-bug-list-2
-Foundry feedback and lots of unsawered feedback:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1093526/foundry-mission-drop-rates-nerfed
-List of the major unsawered feedback:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1169840/devs-why-nerf-everything-is-not-ideal-for-sto
-AOY bug list:
http://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/startrekonline/#/discussion/1215526/agents-of-yesterday-master-bug-list
This can go on...pages after pages...point being is that it is the norm here for Players to have "no say" in this game when it comes to critical matters. If you are talking something being tested in tribble thats a different story.
It's because Lindelof latched onto the word 'Caitian' and agreed because he assumed it made him look like he knew what he was on about. At no point in the design of the random aliens (including the final one onscreen) were Caitians considered.
Not unless somebody finds anything feline about this?
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
I thought Cardassians. At least those have been made contact with in the KT.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Indeed, they make better Cardassians than Caitians... do they at least have tails?
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Yes. A generic mammalian tail.
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"