If they give it the same treatment they gave the T6 Intrepid, it would probably look something like this...
Command Galaxy T6
Cmdr Eng
LtCmdr Eng Lt Sci/Cmd Lt Tac Lt Uni
5/2/3
Kinda, but the ship comes with a more science-y focus, so I would say the tac seat is the hybrid choice, as well as having 2 tac consoles in the initial T6 state and 3 as fleet T6.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
The same goes with you. Not everyone plays like you.
If you really want a LT Com tac Tier 6 cruiser, just buy an eclipse or guardian.
It is available now.
Seriously, what is your problem? You're repeating yourself over and over again for no reason. I dont care what you're doing, show me where I've said otherwise. On the contrary, you've told me how the Galaxy has to be used and how gimped my build is and how I am wasting skills.... and, for whatever reason, "RPers dont need LT Com Tac boffs."
I wish i had a Galaxy with a LtCmd Tac, because I love this ship and would like to use it the way I'd prefer to. But honestly, I don't see it happening, and I also understand that sometimes, diversity is necessary.
Spread your hostility elsewhere, because it is not required in this context, at all.
Why not keep beating a dead horse? We don't need the glue anyway. Just because someone wants a certain layout doesn't mean Cryptic will bend over to give that layout. Especially not when their metrics have shown that the majority will buy the ship regardless of one or two changes (see Pathfinder; see Galaxy R even after the release of the Odyssey).
On an aside, I personally see the Guardian as a valid successor to both the Ambassador and Galaxy lines, while it does share elements with the Ambassador concept, both it and the concept also share similar design styles to the Galaxy. It's not that far-fetched that the Federation could have combined the best elements of both and released a ship to succeed at what both used to do. I personally see the Odyssey as more of a Sovereign successor; it's pretty much a scaled-up Sovereign with a bit more modern styling and superior abilities compared to the Galaxy consoles.
But I do agree that it's likely that the Lt. Tac would become Lt. Tac/Hybrid, since the Ensign Eng would likely turn into Lt. Uni, and keep the rest the same. Which in effect will still leave the Galaxy with an Lt. for Tac skills while also being able to use whatever Lt. Hybrid skills it's given. And if players don't like the Specialization the new T6 Galaxy is for, well, they now have 2 Lt. Tac seats to play with, which by Cryptic standards, would already be 2 Tac abilities too many, but a livable tradeoff over how much money would be made.
But like I've stated in the other 2 Galaxy threads, A T6 Galaxy is not likely to happen until Cryptic has sufficient reason to market one. The Intrepid/Pathfinder was marketed due to being the iconic ship of the episode chain, having new assets worth selling (the interiors), and having a loadout half-ready (I recall the Devs mentioning that they had the seating setup for the NPC version so it'd use more skills than a typical NPC). I'd hazard that until at least 2 or all 3 of the conditions are met, we're unlikely to see a T6 Galaxy (or Defiant) until then.
On an aside, I personally see the Guardian as a valid successor to both the Ambassador and Galaxy lines, while it does share elements with the Ambassador concept, both it and the concept also share similar design styles to the Galaxy. It's not that far-fetched that the Federation could have combined the best elements of both and released a ship to succeed at what both used to do. I personally see the Odyssey as more of a Sovereign successor; it's pretty much a scaled-up Sovereign with a bit more modern styling and superior abilities compared to the Galaxy consoles.
I totally agree.
To me, the Guardian feels like Starfleet moving on from the Galaxy. The Guardian made the Galaxy obsolete in the same way the Odyssey made the Sovereign obsolete.
To me, the Guardian feels like Starfleet moving on from the Galaxy. The Guardian made the Galaxy obsolete in the same way the Odyssey made the Sovereign obsolete.
The Sovereign is less in size than the Galaxy and her layout hints at a different mission profile (not fighting, by the way ). So despite it being the next Enterprise, the Sovereign is not the Galaxy's successor. Likewise, the Oddyssey is not the successor of the Sovereign. The Oddyssey is a massive beast, the largest cruiser Starfleet ever built (in STO) - that is not a substitute for the way smaller and more economic Sovereign class ships. The Oddyssey is in function and mission profile the new Galaxy - only because it has a chevron doesn't mean it's the new Sovereign.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I'm fine with the Starfleet moving on (it's been plenty of years since the Galaxy's prime in-universe, but for game reasons, they exist as much as Mirandas, TOS Connie, and NX replicas), though I can understand the extreme stubbornness some have regarding the Galaxy. It's akin to how I still am stubborn over hoping for a modern-day battleship even though I know the futility of it.
In regards to the Odyssey, it outperforms the Ambassador, Galaxy R, and Sovereign, even though it's technically only a successor (design-wise and Enterprise name-wise at least) to the Sovereign. Being the lead ship bearing the name Enterprise has probably helped it out as well. Point being; Galaxy R was already outdated by the time the Odyssey series were released. The Guardian just helped hammer another nail into that coffin (even if a T6 Galaxy comes in Command Flavor, those Ensign and Lieutenant skills aren't as impressive as OsS or Ionic Turbulence+GravWell).
the odyssey is a replacement for the galaxy, its the new largest and most capable explorer/battleship. the sovereign was never superior to the galaxy in any way, its less then half its size, the sovereign originally was intended to fill a growing hole in the large cruiser lineup, at the time effectively replacing the ambassador with something truly modern. not do something as absurd as replace the galaxy, a ship more then twice its size and less then a decade old.
the guardian is more of a sovereign replacement though, being smaller and slightly newer then the odyssey. by 2409 the age difference between sovereign and the galaxy is pretty negligible, they are both middle aged classes operating on the exact same level of tech. being ONLY middle age, these ships are far from the end of their usefulness and should receive several more refits before retiring, its just that they probably haven't built any new ones for at least a decade now. if you think about it, in STO universe there's actually only like a 6 month to year age difference between the ody and guardian, the ody was not a class that was around before your character started it's career. it's why the longer we go without a tier 6 ody, the stranger it is.
another interesting ship is the avenger, and how it fits. to me, it appears the goal was to create a ship with at least the same capabilities as a sovereign, just built at a 2409 tech level, so an at least equivalent ship would end up in much smaller, more agile, more flexible, and less resource intensive. wile the guardian is intended to have about the combat potential of a 2409 sovereign, but actually have other general usefulness far beyond the more battlecruiser focus the sovereign had, much more like the balance the old ambassador would have had.
(...) if you think about it, in STO universe there's actually only like a 6 month to year age difference between the ody and guardian, the ody was not a class that was around before your character started it's career. it's why the longer we go without a tier 6 ody, the stranger it is.
(...).
It's refreshing to see someone understands ship design evolution
But in regards to the segment I quoted, STO doesn't make any sense. Look at the Venture, Bellerophon and Sao Paolo-Type refits - those roll out in the exact same year as the Vesta, Oddyssey and all the other refits, though those are completely forgotten by the game (literally, you have no option to use the refits at endgame which puts you back intro retrofits). Not to speak of all the huge Star Cruiser variants that make absolutely no sense considering their size and resources needed to build them. Now the Guardian is another new large cruiser, arguably a new Ambassador class, though the Ambassador itself was probably replaced by the Akira or Sovereign already... STOs ship line-up is a incohoerent mess
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
It's refreshing to see someone understands ship design evolution
But in regards to the segment I quoted, STO doesn't make any sense. Look at the Venture, Bellerophon and Sao Paolo-Type refits - those roll out in the exact same year as the Vesta, Oddyssey and all the other refits, though those are completely forgotten by the game (literally, you have no option to use the refits at endgame which puts you back intro retrofits). Not to speak of all the huge Star Cruiser variants that make absolutely no sense considering their size and resources needed to build them. Now the Guardian is another new large cruiser, arguably a new Ambassador class, though the Ambassador itself was probably replaced by the Akira or Sovereign already... STOs ship line-up is a incohoerent mess
ship class launch date and when stuff is made playable don't necessarily need to match up. something like the venture could have been around for a few years before the ody launched, could have been what led up to it, as apposed the the opposite being true outside of universe. and then the galaxy retrofit is a 2409 refit to the galaxy and all variants, the tier 4 venture would be like a 2399 as launched venture class, not up to 2409 standards.
the venture in particular is just awful and nonsensical. it takes every attractive detail of the galaxy class, and makes it less attractive, and even less functional or intuitive. especially on the saucer, they flatten the top out by basically removing the huge primary hanger.
honestly the whole ship costume variants thing, at least as far as cannon ships are concerned, its best to not acknowledge they exist and give them to much thought, they are merely silly video game things. that goes for the galaxy X too, its existence is a gross violation of established trek tech logic, easily dismissed as a Q creation and nothing more. also forget the star cruiser exists, talk about having no justification for existing wile the galaxy, and now ody, does. they never would have built that, and then the ody. and by comparison the star cruiser looks at least a decade old, way too soon to make such a galaxy replacing large cruiser, even the ody is too soon.
glad i am not the only one that thought theremoval of the largest hanger bay in star trek canon on the venture was the silliest thing
still think it;s strange and odd that the galaxy never got a hanger even though it has more hanger space then most of the ships that have the ability to launch fighters. i mean the vesta can barely house 2 runabouts the enterpise-D brought DS9's entire runabout compliment to them (all 4) wile still keeping it's normal shuttle load out
and let's not forget the actually on screen refitted galaxies with the double decker hangers for outbound and inbound fighter craft
Personally if anything was to be done with the Galaxy i'd be happy with any of these suggestions as they all are better than what we already have in game
1. Turn that ens engineer to Uni
2. Allow us to use the Galaxy-R skin on the Fleet Galaxy-X but you have to own the Zen Store Galaxy to do this, plus using the Galaxy skin disables the lance.
3. Allow us to use the Galaxy skin on the Fleet Guardian, Again the Zen store Galaxy must be owned to unlock the costume.
4. A completely new tier 6 Galaxy with a boff and console layout that makes the ship truly multipurpose, so she has access to Lt.Cmd stations for Tact/Sci and Eng.
glad i am not the only one that thought theremoval of the largest hanger bay in star trek canon on the venture was the silliest thing
still think it;s strange and odd that the galaxy never got a hanger even though it has more hanger space then most of the ships that have the ability to launch fighters. i mean the vesta can barely house 2 runabouts the enterpise-D brought DS9's entire runabout compliment to them (all 4) wile still keeping it's normal shuttle load out
and let's not forget the actually on screen refitted galaxies with the double decker hangers for outbound and inbound fighter craft
its all a part of handling large ships TERRIBLY. all of them, not just the galaxy, though of course its the worst off. i blame defiant fanboyism, were you can convince yourself a glorified corvette has better durability and firepower then ships 10, 20, 50 100 times its size. the defiant and all the other small tactical ships have the same number of abilities, console and equipment slots as ships up to 500 times their size, they're only penalized by like 15% less hull for that, wile piling on advantages like having 10 to 20 times the mobility potential of a large ships, and being the only ships really optimized for dealing damage, really the only thing that maters.
they would have been better off making larger cruiser non playable ships, and keeping our characters lower rank, and flying smaller ships. the ship stat system does not scale correctly once you get any bigger then an akira or vorcha, the fact that everything at the same tier, no mater the size, is as powerful as anything else, has always been a joke.
anything larger then the sovereign should automatically be considered a dreadnaught, have at least 1 hanger, double the typical escort hitpoints, 5/4 weapons, 2 COM stations, 2 LTC stations and a LT, and say 13 consoles, and able to have 5 in multiple categories. they should also be able to fit exclusive large ships weapons, like long beam arrays or super heavy cannons, maybe even let them take up 3 weapon slots. for this they should count as 2 ships for whatever team they are on.
the game is such an imbalanced mess now it couldn't actually hurt.
Heck, the first time 100k DPS barrier was broken it was in a Galaxy, so obviously the Lt. Com station isn't required.
wow! sorry, 2 wrong statement in the same sentence.
i don't think the first time the 100k barrier was broken it was in a galaxy... for the simple reason that the galaxy never reach that number as far as i known.
ryan do 82k with a galaxy x yes, but it was a galaxy x not a galaxy refit, let alone 100k in a galaxy r.
or maybe i am a little outdated with my information, but if one would get 100k with a galaxy retrofit i think i would have see it in the forum by now.
not that i don't believe this ship will reach it someday but for now this has not happened.
its all a part of handling large ships TERRIBLY. all of them, not just the galaxy, though of course its the worst off. i blame defiant fanboyism, were you can convince yourself a glorified corvette has better durability and firepower then ships 10, 20, 50 100 times its size. the defiant and all the other small tactical ships have the same number of abilities, console and equipment slots as ships up to 500 times their size, they're only penalized by like 15% less hull for that, wile piling on advantages like having 10 to 20 times the mobility potential of a large ships, and being the only ships really optimized for dealing damage, really the only thing that maters.
they would have been better off making larger cruiser non playable ships, and keeping our characters lower rank, and flying smaller ships. the ship stat system does not scale correctly once you get any bigger then an akira or vorcha, the fact that everything at the same tier, no mater the size, is as powerful as anything else, has always been a joke.
anything larger then the sovereign should automatically be considered a dreadnaught, have at least 1 hanger, double the typical escort hitpoints, 5/4 weapons, 2 COM stations, 2 LTC stations and a LT, and say 13 consoles, and able to have 5 in multiple categories. they should also be able to fit exclusive large ships weapons, like long beam arrays or super heavy cannons, maybe even let them take up 3 weapon slots. for this they should count as 2 ships for whatever team they are on.
the game is such an imbalanced mess now it couldn't actually hurt.
Quite on the money. The Defiant is the only ship in the entirety of Trek that breaks the common sense trend that large ships are much more powerful. The thing was powered by a [Overpowered Warp Core Mk XX [PltArmr]x8].
When the Plot Armor does go off, the Defiant-class is clearly shown for what it is: A fast moving, cheap corvette.
I also still remember when Escorts were far less durable than they are now. They had a few shades of hull more than a Bird of Prey and didn't have the Bonus Defense that Escorts do now. Back then, Escorts actually needed to be kept alive by someone.
Then the Escorts got almost Cruiser leveled hulls and shield mods. Then the Escorts got their +10% Bonus Defense. Then the first Escort with LtCdr ENG appeared, the C-Store Akira at T5, and IMHO, that's when the game slid into the infamous era that was "Escorts Online."
Newer players now don't know what it was like flying Escorts before they got buffed to not need any support at all
T6 Galaxy will have the T6 Intrepid's layout with a Lt Tac Hybrid. Stop that LTC tac TRIBBLE on the Galaxy. On the DC I could understand it, but not on the regular galaxy.
Hey fans want an improved starship for the galaxy so no we are not going to stop asking for a LTC tac bridge officer slot for the tier 6 galaxy R.
the odyssey is a replacement for the galaxy, its the new largest and most capable explorer/battleship. the sovereign was never superior to the galaxy in any way, its less then half its size, the sovereign originally was intended to fill a growing hole in the large cruiser lineup, at the time effectively replacing the ambassador with something truly modern. not do something as absurd as replace the galaxy, a ship more then twice its size and less then a decade old.
Nothing in this paragraph is correct.
1. The Sovereign is larger then the Galaxy both in game and in the movies. The Galaxy has a larger Saucer but is otherwise smaller then the Sovereign.
2. The Sovereign was the pinnacle of engineering at the time of it's introduction, hence making it the Federation Flagship. It's more advanced then the Galaxy in absolutely every way.
3. The Galaxy replaced the Ambassador, though it's unclear by cannon specification which ship was actually 'top of the line' at the time the Galaxy was introduced, so this point can be debated. The Ambassador was long out of date before the Sovereign was introduced, it was in no way a replacement for the Ambassador. That's like saying the Galaxy was the replacement for the Constitution even though the Constitution was clearly replaced by the Excelsior.
1. The Sovereign is larger then the Galaxy both in game and in the movies. The Galaxy has a larger Saucer but is otherwise smaller then the Sovereign.
The Sovereign-class is longer at 685 meters, even though a chunk of that is due to its warp engines protruding aft quite a bit, and with only 24-26 decks she is also considerably "shorter" in height than the Galaxy-class which has 42 decks, while also being 642.5 meters in length. In terms of sheer mass the Galaxy-class is a much bigger ship overall.
The Sovereign-class is longer at 685 meters, even though a chunk of that is due to its warp engines protruding aft quite a bit, and with only 24-26 decks she is also considerably "shorter" in height than the Galaxy-class which has 42 decks, while also being 642.5 meters in length. In terms of sheer mass the Galaxy-class is a much bigger ship overall.
Still, the argument that it's 'less then half the size' is completely inaccurate. The Galaxy will always be the 'largest' ship because of it's ridiculously large saucer. The proportions of the Galaxy is absolutely horrid.
Not sure why it was mentioned at all since the ship size really has nothing to do with which is more advanced. At no point in Star Trek has it been established that larger equals more advanced. it's generally a natural progression to make the next ship larger then the previous but far from being a rule.
The Sovereign was still far more advanced then the Galaxy. The idea that the Federation would build a new Flagship and make it inferior to it's predecessor is ridiculous. The Sovereign replaced the Galaxy in the movies, and then in STO the Odyssey replaced the Sovereign.
Rather or not the Guardian replaced the Odyssey is still up for debate, I feel that it did.. others don't, that's fine. Either way, the Galaxy is old hat at this point. As far as I know, in STO the Odyssey is still considered the 'Flagship.' At least for now.
1. The Sovereign is larger then the Galaxy both in game and in the movies. The Galaxy has a larger Saucer but is otherwise smaller then the Sovereign.
2. The Sovereign was the pinnacle of engineering at the time of it's introduction, hence making it the Federation Flagship. It's more advanced then the Galaxy in absolutely every way.
3. The Galaxy replaced the Ambassador, though it's unclear by cannon specification which ship was actually 'top of the line' at the time the Galaxy was introduced, so this point can be debated. The Ambassador was long out of date before the Sovereign was introduced, it was in no way a replacement for the Ambassador. That's like saying the Galaxy was the replacement for the Constitution even though the Constitution was clearly replaced by the Excelsior.
1) the sov was longer but the galaxy is much wider and taller taking up more cubic area. the galaxy really is twice as massive as the sov
2) it was only made the flagship because it was an enterpise and the writers where idiots the sov is only 8 years newer then the galaxy at launch as the sov program started after the Borg invation in the 2370's after wolf359 same time the defiant began development. much smaller thent he galaxy less phactually phaser arrays and the galxay does not suffer form the massive blind spots the sov has (the sov is unable to fire both main saucer arrays at the same time with out hitting it's self)
as a tactical standpoint that blind spot is really dumb for a tactical ship. at best the sov is a mid to close range explorer and threat response. the galaxy is the deep range explorer and mobile siege weapon and fighter command point
1. The Sovereign is larger then the Galaxy both in game and in the movies. The Galaxy has a larger Saucer but is otherwise smaller then the Sovereign.
2. The Sovereign was the pinnacle of engineering at the time of it's introduction, hence making it the Federation Flagship. It's more advanced then the Galaxy in absolutely every way.
3. The Galaxy replaced the Ambassador, though it's unclear by cannon specification which ship was actually 'top of the line' at the time the Galaxy was introduced, so this point can be debated. The Ambassador was long out of date before the Sovereign was introduced, it was in no way a replacement for the Ambassador. That's like saying the Galaxy was the replacement for the Constitution even though the Constitution was clearly replaced by the Excelsior.
1. Has already been adressed. Length =/= size.
2. This is true, so was Voyager when it was introduced. But the Intreppid did not replace the Galaxy, obviously, as their dimensions and specifications were vastly different. The Sovereign replaced the destroyed Galaxy as the next enterprise (for the movies), but if the D wasn't out of the game we don't know if a Sovereign would (in-universe) be made the new flagship. The difference of 8 years is not that advanced and a Galaxy was designed with a at least 100-year lifespan facing not only retrofits but large scale refits which would neglect the Sovereign's advancement. A Galaxy is a completely different ship from a Sovereign - they complement each other, not substitute for each other.
3. This point is debateable, since we never had much info on the Ambassador. The Ambassador was a quantum leap in ship design "back then" and became the new flagship which was eventually replaced by the Galaxy. Ambassadors, just like Excelsiors btw, continued their service however because they were still up to date after retro- and refits. Galaxy class ships were massive in comparision to all the other classes. They were few in numbers (originally only six were planned and Rodenberry wanted it to stay that way) like massive command ships that would watch over the entire sector they were placed in. The Galaxy is the ultimate swiss army knife of the fleet at that point, but the smaller vessels were all more specialized for some task. Again, the ships complement each other, not substitute for each other. The sovereign is in size and mission profile much closer to the Ambassador and Akira than it is to the Galaxy or Oddyssey.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
2) it was only made the flagship because it was an enterpise and the writers where idiots
Opinion, not supported by fact.
the sov is only 8 years newer then the galaxy at launch as the sov program started after the Borg invation in the 2370's after wolf359 same time the defiant began development.
The Galaxy came into implementation in the late 2350s. The Sovereign in the early 2370s. The Sovereign is almost 20 years newer then the galaxy. The Sovereigns first noted formal engagement was in 2379. It's far newer then the Galaxy and was built as the Federations most advanced ship of the time. It was the top of the line.
The rest of your post regarding ship blind spots or whatever you're talking about is just opinion and largely irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
You can read more info on the Sovereign class here, and the Galaxy here.
But the Intreppid did not replace the Galaxy, obviously, as their dimensions and specifications were vastly different.
As was the overall function of the vessel. Comparing the Intrepid to the Galaxy is like comparing the Defiant to the Sovereign, they're totally different animals. The Sovereign and the Galaxy however, are not.
The Sovereign replaced the destroyed Galaxy as the next enterprise (for the movies), but if the D wasn't out of the game we don't know if a Sovereign would (in-universe) be made the new flagship. The difference of 8 years is not that advanced and a Galaxy was designed with a at least 100-year lifespan facing not only retrofits but large scale refits which would neglect the Sovereign's advancement. A Galaxy is a completely different ship from a Sovereign - they complement each other, not substitute for each other.
The 8 year thing was wrong, it was closer to 20 years. The Sovereign was an obviously more advanced design and would make little sense for the Federation to continue using the Galaxy as it's flagship vessel when they had a more advanced ship that was in full production. On this point though, sadly we have to just agree to disagree since no formal statement has ever been made on this topic. To me, it's common sense that the newer and more advanced ship would be the flagship. It's further proven by the fact that the Enterprise which is the Federation Flagship is a Sovereign Class. If this wasn't true, the Enterprise E would have been a Galaxy Refit much like the Enterprise A was over the original design. Precedent is established on this.
Comments
Command Galaxy T6
Cmdr Eng
LtCmdr Eng
Lt Sci/Cmd
Lt Tac
Lt Uni
5/2/3
≡/\≡
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=1348281
And here was my suggestion:
Com Eng
Lt Com Eng/intel
Lt Tac
Lt Sci
Lt Uni
4 Eng consoles (5 for Fleet Refit)
3 tac consoles
3 sci consoles
Yeah, now that I read it back.. I see it too.
Kinda, but the ship comes with a more science-y focus, so I would say the tac seat is the hybrid choice, as well as having 2 tac consoles in the initial T6 state and 3 as fleet T6.
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And not everyone plays like you. Your arguments are flawed, biased and funny to look at.
The same goes with you. Not everyone plays like you.
If you really want a LT Com tac Tier 6 cruiser, just buy an eclipse or guardian.
It is available now.
Seriously, what is your problem? You're repeating yourself over and over again for no reason. I dont care what you're doing, show me where I've said otherwise. On the contrary, you've told me how the Galaxy has to be used and how gimped my build is and how I am wasting skills.... and, for whatever reason, "RPers dont need LT Com Tac boffs."
I wish i had a Galaxy with a LtCmd Tac, because I love this ship and would like to use it the way I'd prefer to. But honestly, I don't see it happening, and I also understand that sometimes, diversity is necessary.
Spread your hostility elsewhere, because it is not required in this context, at all.
On an aside, I personally see the Guardian as a valid successor to both the Ambassador and Galaxy lines, while it does share elements with the Ambassador concept, both it and the concept also share similar design styles to the Galaxy. It's not that far-fetched that the Federation could have combined the best elements of both and released a ship to succeed at what both used to do. I personally see the Odyssey as more of a Sovereign successor; it's pretty much a scaled-up Sovereign with a bit more modern styling and superior abilities compared to the Galaxy consoles.
But I do agree that it's likely that the Lt. Tac would become Lt. Tac/Hybrid, since the Ensign Eng would likely turn into Lt. Uni, and keep the rest the same. Which in effect will still leave the Galaxy with an Lt. for Tac skills while also being able to use whatever Lt. Hybrid skills it's given. And if players don't like the Specialization the new T6 Galaxy is for, well, they now have 2 Lt. Tac seats to play with, which by Cryptic standards, would already be 2 Tac abilities too many, but a livable tradeoff over how much money would be made.
But like I've stated in the other 2 Galaxy threads, A T6 Galaxy is not likely to happen until Cryptic has sufficient reason to market one. The Intrepid/Pathfinder was marketed due to being the iconic ship of the episode chain, having new assets worth selling (the interiors), and having a loadout half-ready (I recall the Devs mentioning that they had the seating setup for the NPC version so it'd use more skills than a typical NPC). I'd hazard that until at least 2 or all 3 of the conditions are met, we're unlikely to see a T6 Galaxy (or Defiant) until then.
I totally agree.
To me, the Guardian feels like Starfleet moving on from the Galaxy. The Guardian made the Galaxy obsolete in the same way the Odyssey made the Sovereign obsolete.
The Sovereign is less in size than the Galaxy and her layout hints at a different mission profile (not fighting, by the way
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In regards to the Odyssey, it outperforms the Ambassador, Galaxy R, and Sovereign, even though it's technically only a successor (design-wise and Enterprise name-wise at least) to the Sovereign. Being the lead ship bearing the name Enterprise has probably helped it out as well. Point being; Galaxy R was already outdated by the time the Odyssey series were released. The Guardian just helped hammer another nail into that coffin (even if a T6 Galaxy comes in Command Flavor, those Ensign and Lieutenant skills aren't as impressive as OsS or Ionic Turbulence+GravWell).
the guardian is more of a sovereign replacement though, being smaller and slightly newer then the odyssey. by 2409 the age difference between sovereign and the galaxy is pretty negligible, they are both middle aged classes operating on the exact same level of tech. being ONLY middle age, these ships are far from the end of their usefulness and should receive several more refits before retiring, its just that they probably haven't built any new ones for at least a decade now. if you think about it, in STO universe there's actually only like a 6 month to year age difference between the ody and guardian, the ody was not a class that was around before your character started it's career. it's why the longer we go without a tier 6 ody, the stranger it is.
another interesting ship is the avenger, and how it fits. to me, it appears the goal was to create a ship with at least the same capabilities as a sovereign, just built at a 2409 tech level, so an at least equivalent ship would end up in much smaller, more agile, more flexible, and less resource intensive. wile the guardian is intended to have about the combat potential of a 2409 sovereign, but actually have other general usefulness far beyond the more battlecruiser focus the sovereign had, much more like the balance the old ambassador would have had.
It's refreshing to see someone understands ship design evolution
But in regards to the segment I quoted, STO doesn't make any sense. Look at the Venture, Bellerophon and Sao Paolo-Type refits - those roll out in the exact same year as the Vesta, Oddyssey and all the other refits, though those are completely forgotten by the game (literally, you have no option to use the refits at endgame which puts you back intro retrofits). Not to speak of all the huge Star Cruiser variants that make absolutely no sense considering their size and resources needed to build them. Now the Guardian is another new large cruiser, arguably a new Ambassador class, though the Ambassador itself was probably replaced by the Akira or Sovereign already... STOs ship line-up is a incohoerent mess
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ship class launch date and when stuff is made playable don't necessarily need to match up. something like the venture could have been around for a few years before the ody launched, could have been what led up to it, as apposed the the opposite being true outside of universe. and then the galaxy retrofit is a 2409 refit to the galaxy and all variants, the tier 4 venture would be like a 2399 as launched venture class, not up to 2409 standards.
the venture in particular is just awful and nonsensical. it takes every attractive detail of the galaxy class, and makes it less attractive, and even less functional or intuitive. especially on the saucer, they flatten the top out by basically removing the huge primary hanger.
honestly the whole ship costume variants thing, at least as far as cannon ships are concerned, its best to not acknowledge they exist and give them to much thought, they are merely silly video game things. that goes for the galaxy X too, its existence is a gross violation of established trek tech logic, easily dismissed as a Q creation and nothing more. also forget the star cruiser exists, talk about having no justification for existing wile the galaxy, and now ody, does. they never would have built that, and then the ody. and by comparison the star cruiser looks at least a decade old, way too soon to make such a galaxy replacing large cruiser, even the ody is too soon.
still think it;s strange and odd that the galaxy never got a hanger even though it has more hanger space then most of the ships that have the ability to launch fighters. i mean the vesta can barely house 2 runabouts the enterpise-D brought DS9's entire runabout compliment to them (all 4) wile still keeping it's normal shuttle load out
and let's not forget the actually on screen refitted galaxies with the double decker hangers for outbound and inbound fighter craft
http://i328.photobucket.com/albums/l327/encia/Star%20Trek/M_G2_Shuttle.jpg
1. Turn that ens engineer to Uni
2. Allow us to use the Galaxy-R skin on the Fleet Galaxy-X but you have to own the Zen Store Galaxy to do this, plus using the Galaxy skin disables the lance.
3. Allow us to use the Galaxy skin on the Fleet Guardian, Again the Zen store Galaxy must be owned to unlock the costume.
4. A completely new tier 6 Galaxy with a boff and console layout that makes the ship truly multipurpose, so she has access to Lt.Cmd stations for Tact/Sci and Eng.
its all a part of handling large ships TERRIBLY. all of them, not just the galaxy, though of course its the worst off. i blame defiant fanboyism, were you can convince yourself a glorified corvette has better durability and firepower then ships 10, 20, 50 100 times its size. the defiant and all the other small tactical ships have the same number of abilities, console and equipment slots as ships up to 500 times their size, they're only penalized by like 15% less hull for that, wile piling on advantages like having 10 to 20 times the mobility potential of a large ships, and being the only ships really optimized for dealing damage, really the only thing that maters.
they would have been better off making larger cruiser non playable ships, and keeping our characters lower rank, and flying smaller ships. the ship stat system does not scale correctly once you get any bigger then an akira or vorcha, the fact that everything at the same tier, no mater the size, is as powerful as anything else, has always been a joke.
anything larger then the sovereign should automatically be considered a dreadnaught, have at least 1 hanger, double the typical escort hitpoints, 5/4 weapons, 2 COM stations, 2 LTC stations and a LT, and say 13 consoles, and able to have 5 in multiple categories. they should also be able to fit exclusive large ships weapons, like long beam arrays or super heavy cannons, maybe even let them take up 3 weapon slots. for this they should count as 2 ships for whatever team they are on.
the game is such an imbalanced mess now it couldn't actually hurt.
wow! sorry, 2 wrong statement in the same sentence.
i don't think the first time the 100k barrier was broken it was in a galaxy... for the simple reason that the galaxy never reach that number as far as i known.
ryan do 82k with a galaxy x yes, but it was a galaxy x not a galaxy refit, let alone 100k in a galaxy r.
or maybe i am a little outdated with my information, but if one would get 100k with a galaxy retrofit i think i would have see it in the forum by now.
not that i don't believe this ship will reach it someday but for now this has not happened.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=528931&page=271
Quite on the money. The Defiant is the only ship in the entirety of Trek that breaks the common sense trend that large ships are much more powerful. The thing was powered by a [Overpowered Warp Core Mk XX [PltArmr]x8].
When the Plot Armor does go off, the Defiant-class is clearly shown for what it is: A fast moving, cheap corvette.
I also still remember when Escorts were far less durable than they are now. They had a few shades of hull more than a Bird of Prey and didn't have the Bonus Defense that Escorts do now. Back then, Escorts actually needed to be kept alive by someone.
Then the Escorts got almost Cruiser leveled hulls and shield mods. Then the Escorts got their +10% Bonus Defense. Then the first Escort with LtCdr ENG appeared, the C-Store Akira at T5, and IMHO, that's when the game slid into the infamous era that was "Escorts Online."
Newer players now don't know what it was like flying Escorts before they got buffed to not need any support at all
Hey fans want an improved starship for the galaxy so no we are not going to stop asking for a LTC tac bridge officer slot for the tier 6 galaxy R.
Nothing in this paragraph is correct.
1. The Sovereign is larger then the Galaxy both in game and in the movies. The Galaxy has a larger Saucer but is otherwise smaller then the Sovereign.
2. The Sovereign was the pinnacle of engineering at the time of it's introduction, hence making it the Federation Flagship. It's more advanced then the Galaxy in absolutely every way.
3. The Galaxy replaced the Ambassador, though it's unclear by cannon specification which ship was actually 'top of the line' at the time the Galaxy was introduced, so this point can be debated. The Ambassador was long out of date before the Sovereign was introduced, it was in no way a replacement for the Ambassador. That's like saying the Galaxy was the replacement for the Constitution even though the Constitution was clearly replaced by the Excelsior.
The Sovereign-class is longer at 685 meters, even though a chunk of that is due to its warp engines protruding aft quite a bit, and with only 24-26 decks she is also considerably "shorter" in height than the Galaxy-class which has 42 decks, while also being 642.5 meters in length. In terms of sheer mass the Galaxy-class is a much bigger ship overall.
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Nil Intentatum Reliquit"
Still, the argument that it's 'less then half the size' is completely inaccurate. The Galaxy will always be the 'largest' ship because of it's ridiculously large saucer. The proportions of the Galaxy is absolutely horrid.
Not sure why it was mentioned at all since the ship size really has nothing to do with which is more advanced. At no point in Star Trek has it been established that larger equals more advanced. it's generally a natural progression to make the next ship larger then the previous but far from being a rule.
The Sovereign was still far more advanced then the Galaxy. The idea that the Federation would build a new Flagship and make it inferior to it's predecessor is ridiculous. The Sovereign replaced the Galaxy in the movies, and then in STO the Odyssey replaced the Sovereign.
Rather or not the Guardian replaced the Odyssey is still up for debate, I feel that it did.. others don't, that's fine. Either way, the Galaxy is old hat at this point. As far as I know, in STO the Odyssey is still considered the 'Flagship.' At least for now.
1) the sov was longer but the galaxy is much wider and taller taking up more cubic area. the galaxy really is twice as massive as the sov
http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/8792/3axissizecompare.jpg
2) it was only made the flagship because it was an enterpise and the writers where idiots the sov is only 8 years newer then the galaxy at launch as the sov program started after the Borg invation in the 2370's after wolf359 same time the defiant began development. much smaller thent he galaxy less phactually phaser arrays and the galxay does not suffer form the massive blind spots the sov has (the sov is unable to fire both main saucer arrays at the same time with out hitting it's self)
as a tactical standpoint that blind spot is really dumb for a tactical ship. at best the sov is a mid to close range explorer and threat response. the galaxy is the deep range explorer and mobile siege weapon and fighter command point
1. Has already been adressed. Length =/= size.
2. This is true, so was Voyager when it was introduced. But the Intreppid did not replace the Galaxy, obviously, as their dimensions and specifications were vastly different. The Sovereign replaced the destroyed Galaxy as the next enterprise (for the movies), but if the D wasn't out of the game we don't know if a Sovereign would (in-universe) be made the new flagship. The difference of 8 years is not that advanced and a Galaxy was designed with a at least 100-year lifespan facing not only retrofits but large scale refits which would neglect the Sovereign's advancement. A Galaxy is a completely different ship from a Sovereign - they complement each other, not substitute for each other.
3. This point is debateable, since we never had much info on the Ambassador. The Ambassador was a quantum leap in ship design "back then" and became the new flagship which was eventually replaced by the Galaxy. Ambassadors, just like Excelsiors btw, continued their service however because they were still up to date after retro- and refits. Galaxy class ships were massive in comparision to all the other classes. They were few in numbers (originally only six were planned and Rodenberry wanted it to stay that way) like massive command ships that would watch over the entire sector they were placed in. The Galaxy is the ultimate swiss army knife of the fleet at that point, but the smaller vessels were all more specialized for some task. Again, the ships complement each other, not substitute for each other. The sovereign is in size and mission profile much closer to the Ambassador and Akira than it is to the Galaxy or Oddyssey.
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i love both ships they are just not comparable 2 different mission profiles
Opinion, not supported by fact.
The Galaxy came into implementation in the late 2350s. The Sovereign in the early 2370s. The Sovereign is almost 20 years newer then the galaxy. The Sovereigns first noted formal engagement was in 2379. It's far newer then the Galaxy and was built as the Federations most advanced ship of the time. It was the top of the line.
The rest of your post regarding ship blind spots or whatever you're talking about is just opinion and largely irrelevant to the discussion at hand.
You can read more info on the Sovereign class here, and the Galaxy here.
As was the overall function of the vessel. Comparing the Intrepid to the Galaxy is like comparing the Defiant to the Sovereign, they're totally different animals. The Sovereign and the Galaxy however, are not.
The 8 year thing was wrong, it was closer to 20 years. The Sovereign was an obviously more advanced design and would make little sense for the Federation to continue using the Galaxy as it's flagship vessel when they had a more advanced ship that was in full production. On this point though, sadly we have to just agree to disagree since no formal statement has ever been made on this topic. To me, it's common sense that the newer and more advanced ship would be the flagship. It's further proven by the fact that the Enterprise which is the Federation Flagship is a Sovereign Class. If this wasn't true, the Enterprise E would have been a Galaxy Refit much like the Enterprise A was over the original design. Precedent is established on this.
They have shown you're almost right on the size issue. You're completely wrong in every other aspect and it's obvious.