what an awful system. Now I am no longer just putting in only time to upgrade my stats, now I have to pay money as well!!!!!
Welcome to season 6. :P
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
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Yeah pretty much. To a (maybe large?) part of the playing population (including myself obviously) "standard" meant "the best you can get because why on Earth would you use anything else?"
Standard is what *the average player* can get their hands on, not "the top 10% of the game". Sure Fleet Elite is awesome, but can most people use them? You tell me.
I like the idea of changing the cost from Zen to Dilithium. It makes it more accessible to both F2P and Subscribers.
I do have a question regarding the c-store ships, particularly those in packages. What will happen to those purchased after the patch? Will the upgrade be included or will it be a separate purchase?
How you like getting ripped off by a company who claims to be fair?
How you like paying for upgrades that's inferior?
How you being a Star Trek fan and ripped off because you like a particular canonical ship?
And guess what, they are happening!
You're not happy... I grant you that. Again, not exactly thrilled myself.
Just not getting the whole "this is a ripoff" thing. At worst, you are losing out on one extra BOFF power. At most, one extra BOFF power plus the new BOFF station. I'd love to have these in my Defiant... and who knows, we may get them at some point. They never said they'd never release a T6 version of canon ships.
We know a lot more today, but we STILL don't know everything that's coming. I just find your reaction a bit... premature.
According to Gongonzolla, upgraded Fleet, lockbox and lobi ships will be equivalent, if not superior to T6 vessels, because they will have more hull and shield hitpoints and one console slot more, while theT6 only gets the extra boff ability, 10 consoles and a "ship trait" unlock that you can also get from other sources.
You are misrepresenting what he said in his post. Tier VI ships are basically one step up from Tier V non-fleet ships as they gain +1 bridge officer ability and +1 console slot. Additionally, Cryptic is introducing a "mastery system" that adds extra hull as your ship "levels up". Now, putting a FLEET ship through the upgrade process allows us to keep the Season 6 upgrades (10% hull/shields/+1 console slot). We don't get a 13th bridge officer ability BUT we get the Tier VI console slot (10th console). This bonus stacks with the fleet bonus for a total of 11 console slots and we also get access to the new mastery system. This leaves Tier V-U and Tier VI ships balanced...unless (or rather until) Cryptic decides to pop the Tier VI Fleet ship can of worms.
Will the Fleet ships be T5U standalone or will there be 2 sets of fleet ships T5 and T5U?
From everything written we can see that Fleet ships will be T5 but if you have paid the account unlock for that ship then it will be shown as T5-U. What you see is what you have paid for.
Personally, since we're already paying zen to get the fleet ships to begin with, you'd think that the Fleet ships would already be turned into T6 since you're paying on average $20 usd for the normal ships, 25(if you didn't get the standard c-store ship before hand) to 30(if you got the c-store ship before hand plus the cost for a fleet module) for the C-Store Fleet variants.
Of course you can pvp in any ship. I have pvped in mirror ships... still when it comes down to it if I'm going to play in a game that isn't just messing around vs pugs... or trolling some folks in kerrat. I am going to be in a lockbox ship. (your not going to see a pro sport player saying ya this cheap X or Y from wal mart is good enough... there going to get the best gear to play)
There's no pro-pvp here, its all street hockey
People bring pro gear (lockbox ship of the week, every lockbox trait, every advantage they can get) but its not at all needed. I bring TRIBBLE ships and come out with positive K/D ratio if the team will hit my called targets.
T6 is a big jump though, no doubt, it resets the field, too much of an advantage. I have no idea if/when I'll every splurge on a T6 ship so I'm out of PVP for the meantime.
All it does is further increase the barrier to entry for new players into Space PvP.
Tier VI ships will have an extra bridge officer station (i.e. Lt. upgraded to Lt. Commander). They will also obtain a unique trait and access to unique bridge officer abilities. Tier V-U will be excluded from all that...it will make a difference.
*smacks majortira on the head for using the word "potential" together with "STO PVP".
go to your room and think about what you just said there. .....real join date
The lack of starship trait for T5-U ships is irrelevant because you can level up a T6 ship, get the trait and transfer it to your favorite T5-U ship. All that's really missing for T5-U is the specialist bridge officer and T6 ships should have something to differentiate them.
1- I'm still a very very big Star Trek fan. And this game is still a Star Trek game. I'm done with the hamster wheel. But who knows, in the future something might happen and I might be interested again. So I'm writing off the expansion. And I'm obviously not happy with the game as it is. But I still am a huge fan of the IP and the idea of the game.
2- I'm mostly upset at T6 for the simple reason that I spent a lot of money and resources to get my main's ship to a certain point and now it seems like a complete waste of money. That is what hurts the wallet and my soul. I can't trust the game because it's model isn't trustworthy in that sense. I'm not sure I see the benefit. At least to me. I see it for NEW players that the game is trying to attract. Just not vet players.
I just want to throw out there that for all the song and dance about "T5-U" being almost functionally equivalent with only the most insignificant of differences there is a very significant difference in the BO seating... and this is what really can determine the effectiveness of a ship.
The additional BO ability when combined with the BO Specialist abilities will set the T6 Delta Rising launch ships significantly ahead of a ship missing them. I also highly doubt that a T5-U ship will be considered effective in whatever future 'forced team' content gets deployed either and as a result the only viable ships moving forward forced team content will be those with the max number of BO slots available. It's frustrating enough when a T4 or under ship shows up in the fleet events, I imagine the same will be true for future events as well if a T5 or T5U shows up.
How about just releasing "true" T6 versions of the T5 ships and actually allow us to fully upgrade a T5 ship to a real T6 ship... I'm sure the workload would be enormous but if all the new whizbang "gameplay features" are going to require these enhanced ship abilities then why not? I'm not giving you $5 or $10 to get a ship missing BO slots.
Its a money grab its cryptic sorry craptic's favourite thing to do!
You don't want this to become a rage thread then stop making it so damn easy for us to do
You do understand they have to make money somewhere in order to fund development of the game right? You're not paying anything for Delta Rising, it'll just show up for free on release day. Compare that to something like World of ******** where you're paying $15 every month and still get to pay $40-60 for an expansion.
As long as the zen cost is around 500 per ship, I don't see a big deal here. I'm going to be iffy on 1000 zen per ship though, and any more than that is a complete waste. At that point I'd be better off saving for a proper Tier 6.
On the plus side, of my 6 max level characters, 5 of them are flying at least one ship that qualifies for a free upgrade. The 6th one could too if I wanted to put him in a 1000 day veteran ship.
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rattler2Member, Star Trek Online ModeratorPosts: 58,478Community Moderator
edited August 2014
Also... T5U does get the scaling HP boosts and extra console slot.
1. the point of fleet ships and lobi ships are to have superior base stats than every other ship and the fact that their not being upgraded to 6 (maybe 6.5) is really disappointing
2. I was expecting a free or more fair upgrade price than 500-1000 zen. At the max it should only be five hundred zen
1. Yes (see. T6 ship upgrade blog, leveling from 50-60 takes you through the upgrade process.)
2. You can certainly bet so (after they introduced fleet ships most new vessels in the "special" category were at that level. The T5-U very much seems to be a way of accommodating old content, and I wouldn't expect it to be the primary mode of new ship leveling in future. There may still be some new event ships that start off at T5 if they also plan for a T6 c-store or lobi version, but things like the Risian and breen ships are probably going to take advantage of the new systems.)
Bipedal mammal and senior Foundry author.
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
You know, the fact that we have to pay to upgrade isn't a big deal. We ALL knew (even if some were in denial) that it was coming.
What bugs me is that my favorite canon ship (which I paid for the C-Store variant AND the upgraded Fleet version) will now be out-dated, and it cannot be EQUAL to a Tier6 ship.
I would pay money to upgrade my favorite canon ship to be EQUAL to a Tier 6 ship.
I don't know if I would pay money to upgrade my favorite canon ship to be sub-par with the new ships.
The BO seating thing implies to me that the new ships will have a dedicated slot for the new class of BOFF rather than a universal slot or another of the traditional slots.
Meaning the extra BOFF ability is the specialized T6 power, and that's why the T5Us don't get that.
Would really like to see the Mirror ships eligible for upgrade. Maybe resources dictated that this has to happen later, but I hate to see ships that provide so many options to players get left two steps behind.
On a more humorous note, I would say this represents CaptainGeko all too well on the current state of T6 upgrading.
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You're not happy... I grant you that. Again, not exactly thrilled myself.
Just not getting the whole "this is a ripoff" thing. At worst, you are losing out on one extra BOFF power. At most, one extra BOFF power plus the new BOFF station. I'd love to have these in my Defiant... and who knows, we may get them at some point. They never said they'd never release a T6 version of canon ships.
We know a lot more today, but we STILL don't know everything that's coming. I just find your reaction a bit... premature.
Yes, they have yet to reveal what the Tier 6 is all about. But they made it blatantly clear that our upgraded Tier 5s will not benefit from everything Tier 6 ships are.
To me, they could've easily made the new ships BOFFs be a gimmick, specific to those ships. But instead, Cryptic gives another massive middle finger to Star Trek fans who love certain canonical ships and telling them if they want to fly their canonical ships and enjoy the new content (talking about Traits), you have to pay up!
And I'm betting Tier 6 ships will be cheaper than buying the Fleet Tier 5Us.
Nitpicking is a time-honored tradition of science fiction. Asking your readers not to worry about the "little things" is like asking a dog not to sniff at people's crotches. If there's something that appears to violate natural laws, then you can expect someone's going to point it out. That's just the way things are.
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Welcome to season 6. :P
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Oh, I stand corrected. I think I just ended up springing for the Fleet version and blocked that one out of sight and out of mind. My mistake.
HOPE the Raptor is going to be a dominating escort now. Feels like the Raptors always been 2nd rate citizens.
Standard is what *the average player* can get their hands on, not "the top 10% of the game". Sure Fleet Elite is awesome, but can most people use them? You tell me.
I do have a question regarding the c-store ships, particularly those in packages. What will happen to those purchased after the patch? Will the upgrade be included or will it be a separate purchase?
*read-read*
Yeah, I'm okay with this.
You're not happy... I grant you that. Again, not exactly thrilled myself.
Just not getting the whole "this is a ripoff" thing. At worst, you are losing out on one extra BOFF power. At most, one extra BOFF power plus the new BOFF station. I'd love to have these in my Defiant... and who knows, we may get them at some point. They never said they'd never release a T6 version of canon ships.
We know a lot more today, but we STILL don't know everything that's coming. I just find your reaction a bit... premature.
You are misrepresenting what he said in his post. Tier VI ships are basically one step up from Tier V non-fleet ships as they gain +1 bridge officer ability and +1 console slot. Additionally, Cryptic is introducing a "mastery system" that adds extra hull as your ship "levels up". Now, putting a FLEET ship through the upgrade process allows us to keep the Season 6 upgrades (10% hull/shields/+1 console slot). We don't get a 13th bridge officer ability BUT we get the Tier VI console slot (10th console). This bonus stacks with the fleet bonus for a total of 11 console slots and we also get access to the new mastery system. This leaves Tier V-U and Tier VI ships balanced...unless (or rather until) Cryptic decides to pop the Tier VI Fleet ship can of worms.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
Will future event ships be tier 6?
From everything written we can see that Fleet ships will be T5 but if you have paid the account unlock for that ship then it will be shown as T5-U. What you see is what you have paid for.
Still waiting to be able to use forum titles
People bring pro gear (lockbox ship of the week, every lockbox trait, every advantage they can get) but its not at all needed. I bring TRIBBLE ships and come out with positive K/D ratio if the team will hit my called targets.
T6 is a big jump though, no doubt, it resets the field, too much of an advantage. I have no idea if/when I'll every splurge on a T6 ship so I'm out of PVP for the meantime.
*smacks majortira on the head for using the word "potential" together with "STO PVP".
go to your room and think about what you just said there. .....real join date
a history of sto pvp: 2010 - 2011
a history of sto pvp: 2012 - 2013
unless 5>6.
Understatement.
Some more feedback, in case anyone is curious:
1- I'm still a very very big Star Trek fan. And this game is still a Star Trek game. I'm done with the hamster wheel. But who knows, in the future something might happen and I might be interested again. So I'm writing off the expansion. And I'm obviously not happy with the game as it is. But I still am a huge fan of the IP and the idea of the game.
2- I'm mostly upset at T6 for the simple reason that I spent a lot of money and resources to get my main's ship to a certain point and now it seems like a complete waste of money. That is what hurts the wallet and my soul. I can't trust the game because it's model isn't trustworthy in that sense. I'm not sure I see the benefit. At least to me. I see it for NEW players that the game is trying to attract. Just not vet players.
The additional BO ability when combined with the BO Specialist abilities will set the T6 Delta Rising launch ships significantly ahead of a ship missing them. I also highly doubt that a T5-U ship will be considered effective in whatever future 'forced team' content gets deployed either and as a result the only viable ships moving forward forced team content will be those with the max number of BO slots available. It's frustrating enough when a T4 or under ship shows up in the fleet events, I imagine the same will be true for future events as well if a T5 or T5U shows up.
How about just releasing "true" T6 versions of the T5 ships and actually allow us to fully upgrade a T5 ship to a real T6 ship... I'm sure the workload would be enormous but if all the new whizbang "gameplay features" are going to require these enhanced ship abilities then why not? I'm not giving you $5 or $10 to get a ship missing BO slots.
Captain Ariel Trueheart Department of Temporal Investigations
U.S.S. Valkyrie - NCC 991701
=/\= ================================= =/\=
You do understand they have to make money somewhere in order to fund development of the game right? You're not paying anything for Delta Rising, it'll just show up for free on release day. Compare that to something like World of ******** where you're paying $15 every month and still get to pay $40-60 for an expansion.
As long as the zen cost is around 500 per ship, I don't see a big deal here. I'm going to be iffy on 1000 zen per ship though, and any more than that is a complete waste. At that point I'd be better off saving for a proper Tier 6.
On the plus side, of my 6 max level characters, 5 of them are flying at least one ship that qualifies for a free upgrade. The 6th one could too if I wanted to put him in a 1000 day veteran ship.
1. the point of fleet ships and lobi ships are to have superior base stats than every other ship and the fact that their not being upgraded to 6 (maybe 6.5) is really disappointing
2. I was expecting a free or more fair upgrade price than 500-1000 zen. At the max it should only be five hundred zen
1. Yes (see. T6 ship upgrade blog, leveling from 50-60 takes you through the upgrade process.)
2. You can certainly bet so (after they introduced fleet ships most new vessels in the "special" category were at that level. The T5-U very much seems to be a way of accommodating old content, and I wouldn't expect it to be the primary mode of new ship leveling in future. There may still be some new event ships that start off at T5 if they also plan for a T6 c-store or lobi version, but things like the Risian and breen ships are probably going to take advantage of the new systems.)
Notable missions: Apex [AEI], Gemini [SSF], Trident [AEI], Evolution's Smile [SSF], Transcendence
Looking for something new to play? I've started building Foundry missions again in visual novel form!
Ctrl + F is OP, plz nerf.
--->Ground Combat General Bugs Directory
Real join date: March 2012 / PvP Veteran since May 2012 (Ground and Space)
What bugs me is that my favorite canon ship (which I paid for the C-Store variant AND the upgraded Fleet version) will now be out-dated, and it cannot be EQUAL to a Tier6 ship.
I would pay money to upgrade my favorite canon ship to be EQUAL to a Tier 6 ship.
I don't know if I would pay money to upgrade my favorite canon ship to be sub-par with the new ships.
Meaning the extra BOFF ability is the specialized T6 power, and that's why the T5Us don't get that.
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Yes, they have yet to reveal what the Tier 6 is all about. But they made it blatantly clear that our upgraded Tier 5s will not benefit from everything Tier 6 ships are.
To me, they could've easily made the new ships BOFFs be a gimmick, specific to those ships. But instead, Cryptic gives another massive middle finger to Star Trek fans who love certain canonical ships and telling them if they want to fly their canonical ships and enjoy the new content (talking about Traits), you have to pay up!
And I'm betting Tier 6 ships will be cheaper than buying the Fleet Tier 5Us.
Joined January 2009