In find it a little odd that the Plasma Shockwave benefits from Particle Generators but the Absorption heal type one doesn't seem to benefit from hull repair or shield emitters.
I imagine it's supposed to be a pseudo miracle worker type power, so it should surely gain from the character specs in the same way.
The charge seems a little long and a little arbitrary. Perhaps limiting the different levels of charge but have it take longer to do so?
The Level 10 Warbird is described as having a high turn rate, but in practice seems to turn very slowly, if it does turn quickly, it doesn't seem right from the model and if it doesn't, why does mine have a turn of ~20 with very little engine power?
T2 ship, remember? Until you get the T5 retrofit, you can't tell for certain. Sad, isn't it...
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Did some testing in a PvP challenge with a common [Singularity Warp Core - Mk 4]:-
- Quantum absorbtion is way too powerful, especially given it's cooldown. Even tier 2 will fully heal your shields in a few seconds, while under fire.
(bug: It's buffing cloaked ships shields)
- Warp Shadow at the moment is basically a 1-minute cooldown photonic displacent console power. Ship gets tractored, ship uses warp shadow, ship battlecloaks, repeat every one minute.
- Plasma shockwave is fine.
The quantum singularity as a whole needs both a longer cooldown (like 3 minutes) and longer build-up. Even without traits or special cores, it's reaching tier-5 easily eithin 30 seconds.
As for Romulan power levels, they're fine. All Romulan ships have battlecloak and easy access to Romulan boffs, which will more than make up for the power reduction when it comes to alpha-strikes.
One question though - why a turnrate buff while cloaked? That does not make any sense whatsoever. The ship's mass hasn't been reduced and the cloaking device has nothing to do with the engines. If anything the cloaks power requirements
Summary - Romulans already have all ships with battlecloak (including tanky ones), they don't need the substantial advantages powers like quantum absorbtion and warp shadow gives them. Please reduce them drastically in effectiveness and increase the cores cooldown period.
<<Ships>>
T1 Warbird:-
Much more pleasant experience than a T1 starfleet vessel.
T2 Warbird:-
Pretty different doff station setup. Fine in itself, but if I was in a race to level up a toon I'd fly a KDF or Fed escort. Not a complaint, merely an observation.
T3 Warbird:-
Nice tac/sci focus, well balanced. Will be flying this when leveling my Romulan on holodeck. On Tribble I *may* stick to this ship instead of getting a D'deridex.
T'Liss "Warbird" - First off, should be named T'Liss Bird of Prey. Secondly, didn't like the smoke trail coming from the engines. They should be the green plasma trail that other Romulan ships have. But liked the material options of the original TOS paint job, and Two Romulan green paint jobs. The brown paint job did not suit me. It's a Romulan ship. That's a color that I would not associate with Romulans.
I also don't like the linear progression from ship to ship. First off, people having played Federation, are used to having 3 choices between Cruisers, Escorts, and Science ships. Romulans should also have this diversity among their ship designs. My recommendation would be to follow the example you laid out with the Vesta and Odyssey Classes, which is to offer three variants for each ship design: a Cruiser, Escort, and Science set up. That way, players who know how to play Tactical, can get an Escort variant of the Mogai, or D'deridex. BUT DO NOT MAKE THESE Z-STORE SHIP OPTIONS! That'd just TRIBBLE people off.
Also, I'd recommend a ship costume option for the Dhelan/Dhael where the top folded wing can be removed. I personally detest the Dhelan/Dhael class design with that top wing. If I could remove it, I would find the Dhelan/Dhael class ship more aesthetically pleasing in that regard.
As for the D'ridthau Class upgrade of the D'deridex, the forward hull (the head of the ship), I do not like either, as it looks like a Cylon helmet attached to a D'deridex forward hull. It just doesn't look right.
Otherwise, the models looked fantastic, and I really look forward to flying the ships!
That being said, I recently made a change to RCS Consoles that is currently in internal testing. This change significantly improves the benefit that slower ships like the D'deridex and the Galaxy Retrofit receive from using these consoles. (Roughly doubling the benefit in the case of the D'deridex, in our current tests.) Some players do enjoy flying a slow, tanky ship - but this should allow you to customize for higher turn rates if you choose to. You're still not going to be flying like an escort in a gigantic ship like that, but there will be more flexibility.
Will Tachyokinetic Converter console benefit from this change as well?
That being said, I recently made a change to RCS Consoles that is currently in internal testing. This change significantly improves the benefit that slower ships like the D'deridex and the Galaxy Retrofit receive from using these consoles.
Thank you so very much. Though, Will not quite as slow ships, like the Sovereign and Star Cruiser get the same boost?
One question though - why a turnrate buff while cloaked? That does not make any sense whatsoever. The ship's mass hasn't been reduced and the cloaking device has nothing to do with the engines.
Just wanted to point out... that currently if your under battle cloak or enhanced battle cloak shield heals do 100% heal your shields. Not a bug as far as a I know.
Also battle cloak and E BC... buff your turn rate now on klink ships... its been that way for a long time.
The brown paint job did not suit me. It's a Romulan ship. That's a color that I would not associate with Romulans.
!
The brown paintjob is from Nemesis.
FKA K-Tar, grumpy Klingon/El-Aurian hybrid. Now assimilated by PWE.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
Just wanted to point out... that currently if your under battle cloak or enhanced battle cloak shield heals do 100% heal your shields. Not a bug as far as a I know.
I mean quantum absorption causes you to still have shields when cloaked.
Singularity mechanic is great! I really love the versatility it adds to the Warbirds!
However, that being said. I noticed while browsing the ships that the D'deridex Retrofit has a base turn rate of 2! :eek: Is this a bug, a mistype or is it working as intended? I noticed the standard has a turn rate of 5 which is bad enough but 2 is unbelievable. Even the Bortasq doesn't have that bad a rate.
long time? i haven't checked on tribble, but kdf cloaks arent buffing turn rate on holo at this very moment
(in and amongst enough rubber banding to keep an Office Depot stocked) I just slipped into my old worn out stock Hegh'ta on Holodeck and put him into DS9 orbit:
Battle Cloak
Toggle
1s
Targets Self
20s recharge
-5 current power per sec
+4 flight speed
+50% Defense
After Decloaking, +15% Defense for 5s After 3s, +13.2 Flight Turn Rate
After 3s, +4,966.1 Stealth
The base Cloaks on the Raptors and Cruisers don't seem to have the Turn bonus, though.
However, that being said. I noticed while browsing the ships that the D'deridex Retrofit has a base turn rate of 2! :eek: Is this a bug, a mistype or is it working as intended? I noticed the standard has a turn rate of 5 which is bad enough but 2 is unbelievable. Even the Bortasq doesn't have that bad a rate.
One of the yellow-names (dev) noted that that 2 is supposed to be a 5.5 in one of these threads. Given one of the mid-tier zen ships (TII or TIII, idr) has zero console slots, I think it's safe to say that we can wildly distrust any ship stats beyond the T'Liss, Dhelan, and Mogai. And even those will probably get savaged by the balance stick.
One of the yellow-names (dev) noted that that 2 is supposed to be a 5.5 in one of these threads. Given one of the mid-tier zen ships (TII or TIII, idr) has zero console slots, I think it's safe to say that we can wildly distrust any ship stats beyond the T'Liss, Dhelan, and Mogai. And even those will probably get savaged by the balance stick.
Well, nerf or not, at least that's a load off my mind.
Hello all, i think romie need more ships at Vice Admiral And Admiral, i look and see only 3 ships . They dont have carriers why?, manny people like to play whit carriers. So put more ships i dont wanna to play romie toon and have fleet ships or klingon ship, i wanna play romie whit romie ships.
Hello all, i think romie need more ships at Vice Admiral And Admiral, i look and see only 3 ships . They dont have carriers why?, manny people like to play whit carriers. So put more ships i dont wanna to play romie toon and have fleet ships or klingon ship, i wanna play romie whit romie ships.
There are 11 Romulan Ships at T5.
There are the various non-faction lockbox ships as well.
You can't fly Fed/KDF T5 Ships.
That gives you 19 ships at T5. There are more on the way.
Did you expect them to have ~69 ships available at T5 like they do for the Feds? Took three years to get to that number.
Did you expect them to have ~47 ships available at T5 like they do for the KDF? Took three years to get to that number.
They need to see how well the Romulans do and they can progress from there.
Will there be Romulan Temporal Science Vessels and Destroyers?
Will there be a Scimitar flagship 3pack?
Will there be a Drone Carrier?
Will there be other carriers?
What about non-Warbird support vessels - more Science vessels, etc?
They need to see how well the Romulans do and take it from there, no?
t'liss - What can I say except it was just utterly amazing to fly this iconic ship. I did notice the impulse trails coem out of the warp engines, but I did not see an impulse engine in the hull, so I am just thinking this is by design. The turn rate felt a fine and very snappy. I was a little disappointed that we were lvl 5 almost 6 when we started space combat, limiting the amount of time I got to fly this to only 5 or so levels. I wanted to fly it for a lot longer myself.
Dhelan - I was not jazzed with the design of the ship. I just felt it was just too reminiscent of the Klingon BOP. Having spent the most time with this ship I found it to respond well, even when armed with DBB's and plasma torpedoes. Its hull and shields seems good, and when looking at stats it outclasses the escort with 1500 more hull, .1 more shield modifier and only losing 1 point in turn. I did not try cannons, but with have a lt tactical and and 2 ensign science this ship will perform very well IMHO.
Plasma shock wave - I liked this ability and at lvl 5, coupled with tactical team, it really seemed to do massive damage, especially to the frigate 3 packs. I am interested to see what this looks like at tier 5.
Quantum Absorbsion - Compared to the Plasma shockwave I found this very much underwhelming. With a hazard emitter, EPTS, and a polorize hull, I had plenty to keep my ship and shields alive so i saved up for the shockwave.
Consoles
Tac - Induction Coil Mk IV,Distribution Manifold Mk VI
Eng - Victorium Alloy Mk VI
Sci - 2x Field Generator Mk VI
Devices - Eng Batt, Wep Batt, Shield Batt
Yep, that fun hodgepodge of leveling gear...
Some basic stats:
Base Power: 104/100 - 49/50 - 32/25 - 29/25
Hull: 26781
Hull Repair: 107.5% (non-combat)
Hull Resists: 9.1%
Shields: 5220
Shield Regen: UNKNOWN
Shield Resists: UI Doesn't List
Defense (standing still): +3.5%
Turn (current power levels and full speed): 17.5
Speed (current power levels and full speed): 13.64
Bonus Defense (standing still): +3.5%
Bonus Defense (full speed at current power levels): +47.1%
Bonus Accuracy: +22.7%
CrtH: +7.0%
CrtD: +61.3%
Skills - Space:
Weapons Training - 99
Energy Weapon Training - 99
Projectile Weapon Training - 99
Maneuvers - 89
Targeting - 84
Stealth - 300 (0 pts in the skill)
Shield Emitters - 109
Power Insulators - 99
Shield Systems - 114
Hull Repair - 99
Structural Integrity - 109
Warp Core Efficiency - 84
Warp Core Potential - 84
If I kick Eng Power up to 100, I get 99/100.
Turn: 24.9
Speed: 27.06
Bonus Defense: +73.5%
That defense is telling me something.
1) Subterfuge +Def doesn't stack (is that my Sub or one of my four BOFF's Sub?)
2) Warbirds, at least the Mogai, are not considered Escorts/Raiders/Raptors for the +10% Escort Bonus Defense.
Speed/Turn/etc are all going to feel off because the toon simply doesn't have those skills yet.
Going back to the 32/25 Eng Power...
Cloaking takes Speed to 16.63 and Turn to 27.5.
EM3 takes Speed to 48.17 and Turn to 73.5.
Cloaking and EM takes Speed to 63.17 and Turn to 123.5.
I could have used the spare BOFF slot for a Tac with APO, but uh...I didn't. Sorry. I'm sure somebody out there has tested it with APO1.
With as nasty as the Mogai has been in my hands, it's a VERY good thing it doesn't have the defense bonus for being an escort.
I ended up with a bunch of disruptor weapons and consoles, so I stuck disruptor quad cannons on it. BEAST.
On a side note, can we get Plasma Quad Cannons added to Romulan rep (and from here on out have quads added to the other reps as the come as well). Or at least give romulans a chance to get plasma quads since they are supposed to use plasma weaponry.
On a related note: I noticed the shipyard requisitions sells neutrino delfectors. It would make MUCH more sense if they sold tachyon deflectors since those bosst stealth (which affects cloak) and particle generators (which affects plasma shockwave).
With as nasty as the Mogai has been in my hands, it's a VERY good thing it doesn't have the defense bonus for being an escort.
It's just one of those things...I suppose.
The Chel Grett has the +10%. The Fed HEC has the +10%, but the JHEC doesn't have the +10%.
Wondering if any of the Warbird vessels were going to have it or not. The T'liss, T'varo, Dhelan, Dhael, Mogai, and Valdore all would (imho) fit into the category that would receive that +10%...that Raider, Raptor, Destroyer...Escort...group.
Likewise, with Stealth Detection and how Sci Vessels receive a different boost from Aux than non-Sci Vessels. Will there be any Romulan vessels that qualify as a Sci Vessel for that?
My experience with the Warbirds and their singularity drives has been great.
I understand the base power being lower, as power levels change throughout combat. I've had no problems building and releasing power from the drive.
It's a very different playstyle, and requires some adaptation, but I think it's a welcome change. Although I hope you listen to player feedback, I would discourage you from changing the mechanic in a way that makes them more like Warp powered vessels.
My friends and I that are testing beta have all enjoyed this new system, and we have VERY different play styles.
As a sci player I worried that I wouldn't be able to fly a mogai, and that the there would be no way to utilize sci powers in a warbird. I've found it actually works quite well, and seem to be doing decent damage. The PartGen skill affecting the Plasma Shockwave is great.
Just have one question: When we continue testing the toons at higher levels, how can we test the missions/content without being able to use zen to get the retrofits? Fleet vessels will also be impossible to test sense tribble fleets are generally very low tier/level.
I plan to fly a haakona advanced warbird lolz the 5 turn doesnt scare me. I will just spec into impulse,use the singularity core that gives you +2.5 turn rate and some rcs consoles i bet i will make 10-11 turn rate lol. Stop crying roms have a lot of items to boost turn rate. EPTS? i find that it is buff not not a nerf to most cruisers. I will run 2 epts and i will enjoy my hp boost every 20 seconds. 5 sec gap? NOPE! maco 2 piece makes it 2.9. seems to me escorts got hit hard on the ept deal i however (a cruiser captain since luanch) think it is a buff
PoPeRz WiLl PoPeRz Ur BoPeRz UnTilz PoPeRz GeTz GaNkz
Thank you all for the feedback. We're still reading this thread and the others on the forum.
A few quick notes:
-We have some changes coming to the Singularity mechanic soon. After testing that more, we'll evaluate if the power level penalties feel to harsh. Note that there are some higher level abilities to cut cooldowns and such that might make the Singularity feel more effective, but we're aware that it needs to feel worthwhile at low levels when only the Plasma Shockwave is available.
-We've discussed renaming the Plasma Shockwave, but we're probably going to stick with the name and just make some tooltip updates to Plasma Consoles, Particle Generators skill, and the Shockwave itself to make it clearer how these abilities interact.
-For those of you who are concerned with the D'deridex Retrofit's bridge officers seating and such, this is another reminder that all the higher level stuff is unfinished. Our test build already has different seating.
-On the subject of the turn rate for the D'deridex, it will most likely retain a 5.5 base turn rate to keep it slower than the Galaxy. That being said, I recently made a change to RCS Consoles that is currently in internal testing. This change significantly improves the benefit that slower ships like the D'deridex and the Galaxy Retrofit receive from using these consoles. (Roughly doubling the benefit in the case of the D'deridex, in our current tests.) Some players do enjoy flying a slow, tanky ship - but this should allow you to customize for higher turn rates if you choose to. You're still not going to be flying like an escort in a gigantic ship like that, but there will be more flexibility.
Moreover, please keep in mind that Battle Cloak provides a significant turn rate boost, Singularity Jump can provide added mobility, and that the D'ridthau's Molecular Phase Inverter console can also be used to increase your turn rate (in addition to the console's other functions).
These aren't the only changes we're making based on feedback, just some ones I've already had a chance to address personally and/or discuss with the rest of the team.
Right now I consider it the "D'faildex" - there is very little place in STO for a slow moving Engineering Tank that only loads beams. A higher science focas would even be better.
Please don't Launch LoR with the most sought after ship - the most recognizable ships - the ship everyone has been asking for:
And let it be called in the first few week : the "D'faildex"
This will be a very bad omen for the success of the launch.
Heck I think there should be 2 uni Boff slots on her - like the Oddy
Let's take a quick look at the three ships. Three? Yes, the three Fleet versions of the comparable Captain vessels, eh? The former flagships, so to speak, eh?
D'Deridex - Negh'Var - Galaxy
See what we're currently looking at...acknowledging changes are already underway...sound good?
Fleet D'Deridex Warbird Battle Cruiser Retrofit
Hull: 44550
Shield Mod: 1.1
Weapons: 4/4
Crew: 1500
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 3 Tac / 4 Eng / 2 Sci (+1 Console, Sci or another 5 Eng boat?)
Turn: 5.5
Impulse Modifier: ?
Inertia: ?
Bonus Power: +10 Shield, +5 Aux, -10 All
Abilities: Romulan Battle Cloak, Plasma Shockwave, Quantum Absorption, Warp Shadows, Singularity Jump, Singularity Overcharge
BOFF Layout: (will it be Fleet Gal or Fleet Negh? shouldn't the Gal have that En Uni like the Negh? /cough) X, X X, X, X, X
X, X, X
X X, X
Fleet Negh'Var Heavy Battle Cruiser
Hull: 42900
Shield Mod: 1.1
Weapons: 4/4
Crew: 2500
Device Slots: 3
Consoles: 3 Tac / 5 Eng / 2 Sci
Turn: 9
Impulse Modifier: 0.15
Inertia: 25
Bonus Power: +10 Weapon, +10 Engine
Abilities: Cloak
BOFF Layout: X, X X, X, X, X
X, X, X X, X X
Fleet Exploration Cruiser Retrofit
Hull: 44000
Shield Mod: 1.1
Weapons: 4/4
Crew: 1000
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 2 Tac / 5 Eng / 3 Sci
Turn: 6
Impulse Modifier: 0.15
Inertia: 25
Bonus Power: +5 All
Abilities: None X, X X, X, X, X
X, X, X
X X, X
First of all, just want to say that even though I'm not a fan of the Galaxy in the least (fugly boat, imo) - I honestly believe that it should drop that En Eng for an En Uni to bring it in line with the Negh'Var. Do that, and you've basically got your BOFF layouts for the three ships. Kind of like the Ody/Bort and what one figures they'll do with the Scim too, eh?
Then with regard to the Consoles, well - we've got the 3/5/2 Negh and the 2/5/3 Gal. Do they go 3/5/2 or 2/5/3 with it...or...do they break out the 3/4/3 on it? Given that it is a Warbird Battle Cruiser, even though I'd prefer the 3/4/3 - have to figure it might go 3/5/2 to match the Negh, eh?
Then you get into some of the balancing things that took place between the Negh and Gal which appear to be missing from the D'D... which will be interesting to see what they do.
Sometimes, I wonder if one of the devs created a little tool that functions along the lines of the Subsystem Power sliders. Heh, can't you picture it? Load a base ship/base stats. You adjust the slider up on something, it lowers the rest of the stuff. You can lock individual sliders in place so they can't be lowered (or raised if you select to lower something). There would be a selection of custom sliders they could assign variables to...so when they were in an on/off position, it would adjust the other sliders with the overall available "points" for the ship.
But with all the discussion about the D'Deridex, we kind of have to expect it to be along the lines of the Galaxy and Negh'Var, no? They were the flaghips...they're going to be somewhat alike, somewhat balanced, etc, etc, etc.
its not so much that there is a unique problem with the D'deridex having one of the lowest turn rates, compared to other ships it probably should. the problem is the floor for turn rates, the lowest they go, is WAAAAAAAAY to low to be any fun to use, or to be even useful. the correct turn rate floor is that which the kdf battle cruisers have, between 9 and 11. these turn MUCH worse then escorts, and noticeably worse then sci ships, but at least they arent unusably bad, they are about perfect.
turn rate is a more important to combat stat then hitpoints, or consoles, even station setup. it allows positioning, damage mitigation, and being able to point weapons that do more then a net of 0 damage to your target. thats another problem, weapons that arent DHCs being useless, but thats for another topic.
this is pretty much the last straw, seeing the D'deridex this way. at least the negvar is a viable ship with its turn rate, hell even the horrible galaxy R can separate its saucer. the battle cloak with the +10 to turn rate is nice and all, but like i said its the floor thats the problem. turn rate is modified multiplicative, not additively, so engine power, skill points, abilites and consoles all multiply by your base, the difference of 1 base after all these modifiers is absolutely huge. a ship with a base of 20 sits at about 50 turn without even trying. a ship with a 6 turn will never see better then 15.
i dont think certain ships should turn better then their size should let them just because, but for christ sake everything has to be usable. theres a really simple way to fix this, and do the entire game a huge amount of good, and thats by basically just giving every cruiser plus ~2 turn rate. as a category of ships, they still have the worst turn, but like the kdf cruisers, they would be enjoyable to fly.
odyssey- 8
all galaxys- 8.5
star cruiser- 9
ambassador- 9
sovereign- 9.5
excelcior-10
chyenne-10.5
everyone would be happy, people would buy more cruisers, new players drawn to LOF wile leveling their romulans would not stop playing as soon as then went from the 14 turn mogia to the 5 turn D'deridex. you know, stuff like that, that makes business sense. players will hate, HAAAAATE going from the mogai to the D'deridex, all the new customers your trying to attract especially. its time, finally, to fix how horrible and unfun all the iconic ships in the game are, the cruisers.
balance concerns? what balance concerns. cruisers are so freaking underpowered right now its not even funny. all the defensive power creep, combined with high speed avoidance has made escorts nearly unkillable, and theres been nearly as much power creep to spike damage. cruisers benefit from the healing power creep to a lower degree, because they cant combine it with maneuvering, and their damage over time is now rendered null by the average regeneration and resistance levels. then the kick in the balls EPt skill change, holy TRIBBLE, its a bad time to like cruisers. unless that 10 second gap is completely walked back, cruisers will be nonviable compared to escorts and sci ships. YOU NEED TO ADDRESS THIS TOO.
it being intentional that cruisers be this tank healer, that are downright pathetic, costs you money. people want to kill stuff and use their favorite ship to do it, there should be at least limited ways for people to do that. the best way to start doing that is to let them turn better. the second thing you need to do is massively buff pressure damage weapons, keeping in mind the anti pressure levels ships have now with the high resistance and high regeneration. maybe these weapons need to be more front loaded in their damage dealing, 2 shots per cycle instead of 4 on beam arrays and single cannons. in pvp, cruiser damage used to have a modest effect, it could force healing, ware targets down, chase away lone escorts if they couldn't achieve a quick kill, stuff like that. now for any healer it doesn't even mater if they fire.
ok, actual ship stats feedback to come in later posts. DON NOT DISREGARD THIS ONE, this subject is more important then a silly new faction.
Endorsed by a fellow OPvPer and lover of cruisers.
Thank you all for the feedback. We're still reading this thread and the others on the forum.
A few quick notes:
-We have some changes coming to the Singularity mechanic soon. After testing that more, we'll evaluate if the power level penalties feel to harsh. Note that there are some higher level abilities to cut cooldowns and such that might make the Singularity feel more effective, but we're aware that it needs to feel worthwhile at low levels when only the Plasma Shockwave is available.
-We've discussed renaming the Plasma Shockwave, but we're probably going to stick with the name and just make some tooltip updates to Plasma Consoles, Particle Generators skill, and the Shockwave itself to make it clearer how these abilities interact.
-For those of you who are concerned with the D'deridex Retrofit's bridge officers seating and such, this is another reminder that all the higher level stuff is unfinished. Our test build already has different seating.
-On the subject of the turn rate for the D'deridex, it will most likely retain a 5.5 base turn rate to keep it slower than the Galaxy. That being said, I recently made a change to RCS Consoles that is currently in internal testing. This change significantly improves the benefit that slower ships like the D'deridex and the Galaxy Retrofit receive from using these consoles. (Roughly doubling the benefit in the case of the D'deridex, in our current tests.) Some players do enjoy flying a slow, tanky ship - but this should allow you to customize for higher turn rates if you choose to. You're still not going to be flying like an escort in a gigantic ship like that, but there will be more flexibility.
Moreover, please keep in mind that Battle Cloak provides a significant turn rate boost, Singularity Jump can provide added mobility, and that the D'ridthau's Molecular Phase Inverter console can also be used to increase your turn rate (in addition to the console's other functions).
These aren't the only changes we're making based on feedback, just some ones I've already had a chance to address personally and/or discuss with the rest of the team.
I find this line of replies sadly hilarious. We put a lot of work into the massive list of fixes/changes above, and ya'll are hung up on the ability to skip our content. =p
It all comes down to whether or not the D'D will be able to use DHCs or not. If it can, then there is some potential for the ship with Battle cloak and its nifty fiddly bits with the singularity. If it cannot, then it is just a colossal waste of time.
Sometimes, I wonder if one of the devs created a little tool that functions along the lines of the Subsystem Power sliders. Heh, can't you picture it? Load a base ship/base stats. You adjust the slider up on something, it lowers the rest of the stuff. You can lock individual sliders in place so they can't be lowered (or raised if you select to lower something). There would be a selection of custom sliders they could assign variables to...so when they were in an on/off position, it would adjust the other sliders with the overall available "points" for the ship.
If they did, it's obviously broken. Because 1100 hull point is worth DHC / cloak / universal ensign and +3 on Fleet Negh'Var vs Fleet Galaxy. And I'm not even talking about crew/inertia and more useable console layout :rolleyes:
"Cryptic Studio’s Jack Emmert (2010): Microtransactions are the biggest bunch of nonsense. I like paying one fee and not worrying about it – like my cellphone. The world’s biggest MMO isn’t item based, even though the black market item GDP is bigger than Russia … microtransactions make me want to die.”
If they did, it's obviously broken. Because 1100 hull point is worth DHC / cloak / universal ensign and +3 on Fleet Negh'Var vs Fleet Galaxy. And I'm not even talking about crew/inertia and more useable console layout :rolleyes:
Heh, it was one of the many reasons that I was disappointed with Champions Online. I mean, c'mon - Champions is based on the Hero System. You get a base, you add advantages/disadvantages - even as you build abilities/powers/weapons/whatever - it's advantages and disadvantages. Things have a point value. You want something, you have to give up something, etc, etc, etc.
With STO, it appears to be very inconsistent. I think part of that comes from the turnover they've had in personnel and a combination of time constraints and even reluctance to go back to look at how things might have been valued at one point no longer having that same value. Just certain changes, eh?
Going from the Galaxy Retrofit/Negh'Var to the Fleet Galaxy/Fleet Negh'Var...that BOFF layout, changing for one but not the other?
Heck, compare the Romulan ships to the KDF ships - they definitely look better off in comparison, no? They're not giving up what the KDF did...and...some don't think the KDF gave up enough across all the ships. Which again gets into some of that potential inconsistency.
A was working on X ship. B was working on Y ship. C was working on Z ship.
One would think they'd all be working under the same guidelines, no? But what we see - that doesn't seem to be a case. And when there's a change to those guidelines - the older ships aren't updated to reflect that.
Comments
T2 ship, remember? Until you get the T5 retrofit, you can't tell for certain. Sad, isn't it...
Infinite possibilities have implications that could not be completely understood if you turned this entire universe into a giant supercomputer.
Did some testing in a PvP challenge with a common [Singularity Warp Core - Mk 4]:-
- Quantum absorbtion is way too powerful, especially given it's cooldown. Even tier 2 will fully heal your shields in a few seconds, while under fire.
(bug: It's buffing cloaked ships shields)
- Warp Shadow at the moment is basically a 1-minute cooldown photonic displacent console power. Ship gets tractored, ship uses warp shadow, ship battlecloaks, repeat every one minute.
- Plasma shockwave is fine.
The quantum singularity as a whole needs both a longer cooldown (like 3 minutes) and longer build-up. Even without traits or special cores, it's reaching tier-5 easily eithin 30 seconds.
As for Romulan power levels, they're fine. All Romulan ships have battlecloak and easy access to Romulan boffs, which will more than make up for the power reduction when it comes to alpha-strikes.
One question though - why a turnrate buff while cloaked? That does not make any sense whatsoever. The ship's mass hasn't been reduced and the cloaking device has nothing to do with the engines. If anything the cloaks power requirements
Summary - Romulans already have all ships with battlecloak (including tanky ones), they don't need the substantial advantages powers like quantum absorbtion and warp shadow gives them. Please reduce them drastically in effectiveness and increase the cores cooldown period.
<<Ships>>
T1 Warbird:-
Much more pleasant experience than a T1 starfleet vessel.
T2 Warbird:-
Pretty different doff station setup. Fine in itself, but if I was in a race to level up a toon I'd fly a KDF or Fed escort. Not a complaint, merely an observation.
T3 Warbird:-
Nice tac/sci focus, well balanced. Will be flying this when leveling my Romulan on holodeck. On Tribble I *may* stick to this ship instead of getting a D'deridex.
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
T'Liss "Warbird" - First off, should be named T'Liss Bird of Prey. Secondly, didn't like the smoke trail coming from the engines. They should be the green plasma trail that other Romulan ships have. But liked the material options of the original TOS paint job, and Two Romulan green paint jobs. The brown paint job did not suit me. It's a Romulan ship. That's a color that I would not associate with Romulans.
I also don't like the linear progression from ship to ship. First off, people having played Federation, are used to having 3 choices between Cruisers, Escorts, and Science ships. Romulans should also have this diversity among their ship designs. My recommendation would be to follow the example you laid out with the Vesta and Odyssey Classes, which is to offer three variants for each ship design: a Cruiser, Escort, and Science set up. That way, players who know how to play Tactical, can get an Escort variant of the Mogai, or D'deridex. BUT DO NOT MAKE THESE Z-STORE SHIP OPTIONS! That'd just TRIBBLE people off.
Also, I'd recommend a ship costume option for the Dhelan/Dhael where the top folded wing can be removed. I personally detest the Dhelan/Dhael class design with that top wing. If I could remove it, I would find the Dhelan/Dhael class ship more aesthetically pleasing in that regard.
As for the D'ridthau Class upgrade of the D'deridex, the forward hull (the head of the ship), I do not like either, as it looks like a Cylon helmet attached to a D'deridex forward hull. It just doesn't look right.
Otherwise, the models looked fantastic, and I really look forward to flying the ships!
Just wanted to point out... that currently if your under battle cloak or enhanced battle cloak shield heals do 100% heal your shields. Not a bug as far as a I know.
Also battle cloak and E BC... buff your turn rate now on klink ships... its been that way for a long time.
long time? i haven't checked on tribble, but kdf cloaks arent buffing turn rate on holo at this very moment
The brown paintjob is from Nemesis.
Sometimes, if you want to bury the hatchet with a Klingon, it has to be in his skull. - Captain K'Tar of the USS Danu about J'mpok.
I mean quantum absorption causes you to still have shields when cloaked.
Daizen - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
Selia - Lvl 60 Tactical - Eclipse
However, that being said. I noticed while browsing the ships that the D'deridex Retrofit has a base turn rate of 2! :eek: Is this a bug, a mistype or is it working as intended? I noticed the standard has a turn rate of 5 which is bad enough but 2 is unbelievable. Even the Bortasq doesn't have that bad a rate.
(in and amongst enough rubber banding to keep an Office Depot stocked) I just slipped into my old worn out stock Hegh'ta on Holodeck and put him into DS9 orbit:
The base Cloaks on the Raptors and Cruisers don't seem to have the Turn bonus, though.
One of the yellow-names (dev) noted that that 2 is supposed to be a 5.5 in one of these threads. Given one of the mid-tier zen ships (TII or TIII, idr) has zero console slots, I think it's safe to say that we can wildly distrust any ship stats beyond the T'Liss, Dhelan, and Mogai. And even those will probably get savaged by the balance stick.
Well, nerf or not, at least that's a load off my mind.
There are 11 Romulan Ships at T5.
There are the various non-faction lockbox ships as well.
You can't fly Fed/KDF T5 Ships.
That gives you 19 ships at T5. There are more on the way.
Did you expect them to have ~69 ships available at T5 like they do for the Feds? Took three years to get to that number.
Did you expect them to have ~47 ships available at T5 like they do for the KDF? Took three years to get to that number.
They need to see how well the Romulans do and they can progress from there.
Will there be Romulan Temporal Science Vessels and Destroyers?
Will there be a Scimitar flagship 3pack?
Will there be a Drone Carrier?
Will there be other carriers?
What about non-Warbird support vessels - more Science vessels, etc?
They need to see how well the Romulans do and take it from there, no?
edit: at the bottom of this blog, you can see the current proposed ship progression chart: http://sto.perfectworld.com/news/?p=869551
t'liss - What can I say except it was just utterly amazing to fly this iconic ship. I did notice the impulse trails coem out of the warp engines, but I did not see an impulse engine in the hull, so I am just thinking this is by design. The turn rate felt a fine and very snappy. I was a little disappointed that we were lvl 5 almost 6 when we started space combat, limiting the amount of time I got to fly this to only 5 or so levels. I wanted to fly it for a lot longer myself.
Dhelan - I was not jazzed with the design of the ship. I just felt it was just too reminiscent of the Klingon BOP. Having spent the most time with this ship I found it to respond well, even when armed with DBB's and plasma torpedoes. Its hull and shields seems good, and when looking at stats it outclasses the escort with 1500 more hull, .1 more shield modifier and only losing 1 point in turn. I did not try cannons, but with have a lt tactical and and 2 ensign science this ship will perform very well IMHO.
Plasma shock wave - I liked this ability and at lvl 5, coupled with tactical team, it really seemed to do massive damage, especially to the frigate 3 packs. I am interested to see what this looks like at tier 5.
Quantum Absorbsion - Compared to the Plasma shockwave I found this very much underwhelming. With a hazard emitter, EPTS, and a polorize hull, I had plenty to keep my ship and shields alive so i saved up for the shockwave.
T3 Mogai w/ Sci Captain (L30)
Traits - Accurate, Conservation of Energy, Romulan Operative, Limited Telepathy, Photonic Capacitor, Singularity Specialist, 2 Available Slots
Passives - none
TT1, FAW2, TS3
EPtS1, AtS1
HE1, TSS2
PH1
DOFFs - none
Deflector - Positron Mk VI [ShdS]
Impulse - Efficient Mk VI
Singularity - Field Stabilizing Mk VI [SingA]
Shields - Resilient Mk V [Pla]
Weapons
Fore - Radiant Plasma Torp Mk IV, Bio-Molecular Warhead Mk VI, Plasma-Disruptor Hybrid Array Mk IV
Aft - Plasma-Disruptor Hybrid Array Mk VI, Disruptor Array Mk IV [Acc][CrtH]
Consoles
Tac - Induction Coil Mk IV, Distribution Manifold Mk VI
Eng - Victorium Alloy Mk VI
Sci - 2x Field Generator Mk VI
Devices - Eng Batt, Wep Batt, Shield Batt
Yep, that fun hodgepodge of leveling gear...
Some basic stats:
Base Power: 104/100 - 49/50 - 32/25 - 29/25
Hull: 26781
Hull Repair: 107.5% (non-combat)
Hull Resists: 9.1%
Shields: 5220
Shield Regen: UNKNOWN
Shield Resists: UI Doesn't List
Defense (standing still): +3.5%
Turn (current power levels and full speed): 17.5
Speed (current power levels and full speed): 13.64
Bonus Defense (standing still): +3.5%
Bonus Defense (full speed at current power levels): +47.1%
Bonus Accuracy: +22.7%
CrtH: +7.0%
CrtD: +61.3%
Skills - Space:
Weapons Training - 99
Energy Weapon Training - 99
Projectile Weapon Training - 99
Maneuvers - 89
Targeting - 84
Stealth - 300 (0 pts in the skill)
Shield Emitters - 109
Power Insulators - 99
Shield Systems - 114
Hull Repair - 99
Structural Integrity - 109
Warp Core Efficiency - 84
Warp Core Potential - 84
If I kick Eng Power up to 100, I get 99/100.
Turn: 24.9
Speed: 27.06
Bonus Defense: +73.5%
That defense is telling me something.
1) Subterfuge +Def doesn't stack (is that my Sub or one of my four BOFF's Sub?)
2) Warbirds, at least the Mogai, are not considered Escorts/Raiders/Raptors for the +10% Escort Bonus Defense.
Speed/Turn/etc are all going to feel off because the toon simply doesn't have those skills yet.
Going back to the 32/25 Eng Power...
Cloaking takes Speed to 16.63 and Turn to 27.5.
EM3 takes Speed to 48.17 and Turn to 73.5.
Cloaking and EM takes Speed to 63.17 and Turn to 123.5.
I could have used the spare BOFF slot for a Tac with APO, but uh...I didn't. Sorry. I'm sure somebody out there has tested it with APO1.
Stealth @29/25 Aux is 5104.6
Based off of the post by Bort in the Mar 8th Tribble notes thread...
4925 base
+4 from Aux
+150 from "Skill"
=5079
...not sure how it's running at 5104.6 there.
All in all, generally speaking, so to speak...it felt superior in every way compared to a comparable T3 Fed/KDF ship...hrmmm.
I ended up with a bunch of disruptor weapons and consoles, so I stuck disruptor quad cannons on it. BEAST.
On a side note, can we get Plasma Quad Cannons added to Romulan rep (and from here on out have quads added to the other reps as the come as well). Or at least give romulans a chance to get plasma quads since they are supposed to use plasma weaponry.
On a related note: I noticed the shipyard requisitions sells neutrino delfectors. It would make MUCH more sense if they sold tachyon deflectors since those bosst stealth (which affects cloak) and particle generators (which affects plasma shockwave).
It's just one of those things...I suppose.
The Chel Grett has the +10%. The Fed HEC has the +10%, but the JHEC doesn't have the +10%.
Wondering if any of the Warbird vessels were going to have it or not. The T'liss, T'varo, Dhelan, Dhael, Mogai, and Valdore all would (imho) fit into the category that would receive that +10%...that Raider, Raptor, Destroyer...Escort...group.
Likewise, with Stealth Detection and how Sci Vessels receive a different boost from Aux than non-Sci Vessels. Will there be any Romulan vessels that qualify as a Sci Vessel for that?
I understand the base power being lower, as power levels change throughout combat. I've had no problems building and releasing power from the drive.
It's a very different playstyle, and requires some adaptation, but I think it's a welcome change. Although I hope you listen to player feedback, I would discourage you from changing the mechanic in a way that makes them more like Warp powered vessels.
My friends and I that are testing beta have all enjoyed this new system, and we have VERY different play styles.
As a sci player I worried that I wouldn't be able to fly a mogai, and that the there would be no way to utilize sci powers in a warbird. I've found it actually works quite well, and seem to be doing decent damage. The PartGen skill affecting the Plasma Shockwave is great.
Just have one question: When we continue testing the toons at higher levels, how can we test the missions/content without being able to use zen to get the retrofits? Fleet vessels will also be impossible to test sense tribble fleets are generally very low tier/level.
Right now I consider it the "D'faildex" - there is very little place in STO for a slow moving Engineering Tank that only loads beams. A higher science focas would even be better.
Please don't Launch LoR with the most sought after ship - the most recognizable ships - the ship everyone has been asking for:
And let it be called in the first few week : the "D'faildex"
This will be a very bad omen for the success of the launch.
Heck I think there should be 2 uni Boff slots on her - like the Oddy
D'Deridex - Negh'Var - Galaxy
See what we're currently looking at...acknowledging changes are already underway...sound good?
Fleet D'Deridex Warbird Battle Cruiser Retrofit
Hull: 44550
Shield Mod: 1.1
Weapons: 4/4
Crew: 1500
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 3 Tac / 4 Eng / 2 Sci (+1 Console, Sci or another 5 Eng boat?)
Turn: 5.5
Impulse Modifier: ?
Inertia: ?
Bonus Power: +10 Shield, +5 Aux, -10 All
Abilities: Romulan Battle Cloak, Plasma Shockwave, Quantum Absorption, Warp Shadows, Singularity Jump, Singularity Overcharge
BOFF Layout: (will it be Fleet Gal or Fleet Negh? shouldn't the Gal have that En Uni like the Negh? /cough)
X, X
X, X, X, X
X, X, X
X
X, X
Fleet Negh'Var Heavy Battle Cruiser
Hull: 42900
Shield Mod: 1.1
Weapons: 4/4
Crew: 2500
Device Slots: 3
Consoles: 3 Tac / 5 Eng / 2 Sci
Turn: 9
Impulse Modifier: 0.15
Inertia: 25
Bonus Power: +10 Weapon, +10 Engine
Abilities: Cloak
BOFF Layout:
X, X
X, X, X, X
X, X, X
X, X
X
Fleet Exploration Cruiser Retrofit
Hull: 44000
Shield Mod: 1.1
Weapons: 4/4
Crew: 1000
Device Slots: 4
Consoles: 2 Tac / 5 Eng / 3 Sci
Turn: 6
Impulse Modifier: 0.15
Inertia: 25
Bonus Power: +5 All
Abilities: None
X, X
X, X, X, X
X, X, X
X
X, X
First of all, just want to say that even though I'm not a fan of the Galaxy in the least (fugly boat, imo) - I honestly believe that it should drop that En Eng for an En Uni to bring it in line with the Negh'Var. Do that, and you've basically got your BOFF layouts for the three ships. Kind of like the Ody/Bort and what one figures they'll do with the Scim too, eh?
Then with regard to the Consoles, well - we've got the 3/5/2 Negh and the 2/5/3 Gal. Do they go 3/5/2 or 2/5/3 with it...or...do they break out the 3/4/3 on it? Given that it is a Warbird Battle Cruiser, even though I'd prefer the 3/4/3 - have to figure it might go 3/5/2 to match the Negh, eh?
Then you get into some of the balancing things that took place between the Negh and Gal which appear to be missing from the D'D... which will be interesting to see what they do.
Sometimes, I wonder if one of the devs created a little tool that functions along the lines of the Subsystem Power sliders. Heh, can't you picture it? Load a base ship/base stats. You adjust the slider up on something, it lowers the rest of the stuff. You can lock individual sliders in place so they can't be lowered (or raised if you select to lower something). There would be a selection of custom sliders they could assign variables to...so when they were in an on/off position, it would adjust the other sliders with the overall available "points" for the ship.
But with all the discussion about the D'Deridex, we kind of have to expect it to be along the lines of the Galaxy and Negh'Var, no? They were the flaghips...they're going to be somewhat alike, somewhat balanced, etc, etc, etc.
Endorsed by a fellow OPvPer and lover of cruisers.
If they did, it's obviously broken. Because 1100 hull point is worth DHC / cloak / universal ensign and +3 on Fleet Negh'Var vs Fleet Galaxy. And I'm not even talking about crew/inertia and more useable console layout :rolleyes:
Heh, it was one of the many reasons that I was disappointed with Champions Online. I mean, c'mon - Champions is based on the Hero System. You get a base, you add advantages/disadvantages - even as you build abilities/powers/weapons/whatever - it's advantages and disadvantages. Things have a point value. You want something, you have to give up something, etc, etc, etc.
With STO, it appears to be very inconsistent. I think part of that comes from the turnover they've had in personnel and a combination of time constraints and even reluctance to go back to look at how things might have been valued at one point no longer having that same value. Just certain changes, eh?
Going from the Galaxy Retrofit/Negh'Var to the Fleet Galaxy/Fleet Negh'Var...that BOFF layout, changing for one but not the other?
Heck, compare the Romulan ships to the KDF ships - they definitely look better off in comparison, no? They're not giving up what the KDF did...and...some don't think the KDF gave up enough across all the ships. Which again gets into some of that potential inconsistency.
A was working on X ship. B was working on Y ship. C was working on Z ship.
One would think they'd all be working under the same guidelines, no? But what we see - that doesn't seem to be a case. And when there's a change to those guidelines - the older ships aren't updated to reflect that.
Dude. its confirmed that the D'DerpaDex isn't going to have those ships boffslots.
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That could be as simple a change as making an En Eng into an En Uni...