Its not so much inteligence but more about human nature as i have proven already.
Smacks of arrogance. "Those who disagree with you simply don't know what they really want..."
Negative stimuli when used correctly can produce positive emotional effects.
The motto of slave drivers everywhere...
"Spare the rod and you spoil the child", its a simple saying but accurate.
STO is not raising children...
Why are you so afraid of having a opinion of your own?, is it cos you know how easy it is to troll one due to your own posting style?.
Once again, you have to go personal when you can't defend your points. I would have thought your recent "vacation" would have tought you better. So much for "negative stimuli producing positive emotional effects".
I am not the one using 2000 year old sayings that were misquoted to justify a DP, thats you. You get a grip and realize it is a game we don't need a DP to re-enforce consequences that real life teaches, especially since it won't even do that, it will be a small penalty, like an overdue library book hardly a life lesson. The fact is not needed really, its a tedious time sink that will detract and not teach.
1. I do not need to trust cryptic all i need to do is wait until the patch is on tribble, check it out and then il decide if its good or bad for the game and will post accordingly for or against it.
2. Im not a hippocrite, im going to wait until the DP is on tribble and then im gonna decide what i think about it and if its good for the game or not, and if i think its bad for the game...well you have seen how much i post so be prepared lol.
You however are trying to stop ppl from even seeing wtf it is and that makes you a COWARD.
Cool downs DO persist after death ffs lol.:eek:
DO YOU EVEN PLAY THIS GAME?.:D
No your hypocrite because you insisted on having a DP, with no indication they can do it right, thats one. If they concentrated on actual problems and not your myths and "life lessons" the game might become a good addition, but no people like you with no horse in the race complain, they respond in a horrible fashion and we'll never be rid of it. Bulling tactics from gaming elites and pro gamer reviewers ruin casual play. All of this cause you FEELING and MINDSET is too rigid to be creative. Everyone has a DP so we have to, thats really what you have been saying.
I will have to disagree with your signature Slarus. I'll state TNG: Tapestry as my source. If it was all inclusive Picard would have ended up a Captain no matter what he did. But because he took (or didn't take) some risk in the start (and admittedly paid for it) he was (or wasn't) chosen to be Captain because someone though he was better than someone else.
No your hypocrite because you insisted on having a DP, with no indication they can do it right, thats one.
ERM no that is not even close to the definition of hypocrite, its more a definition of openmindedness and a willingness to at least know what the change is going to be before deciding its bad.
In fact your utter unwillingness to even find out and instead condemning crytic without any info on it while also claiming to want a better STO is extreemly hypocritical.
If they concentrated on actual problems and not your myths and "life lessons" the game might become a good addition, but no people like you with no horse in the race complain, they respond in a horrible fashion and we'll never be rid of it.
If its horrible and hurts the game they will not keep it, in fact when it hits tribble and if its awful the outcry will stop it in its tracks....seriously you need to chill and DL the tribble patch lol.
Bulling tactics from gaming elites and pro gamer reviewers ruin casual play. All of this cause you FEELING and MINDSET is too rigid to be creative. Everyone has a DP so we have to, thats really what you have been saying.
Im not sure what you consider to be casual play but to me its a player with limited time, you seem to think it means they lack skills or that they wish the game to be set to a absurdly easy level with no downsides to failing at things.
Now that maybe how you are but i know plenty of players with limited game time that are plenty skillful and enjoy a challenge.
If so-called community voices changed it once, why would you believe it can't change it again?
Do you honestly think cryptic are gonna stop it from at least going on tribble just cos of this thread or its pointless poll?.
Maybe if its a stupid DP and tonnes of ppl say so after seeing it on tribble they will stop it going live or change it but after the works done they are going to show it to ppl so they can get a educated responce from the community instead of spams from a few ignorant drama bombers and ppl with PTSD from poorly designed DP is other games.
I really do not see why you and others are so afraid of the community making a educated decision and why you wish it killed before even you know what it is.
I agree the poll gave us points. I disagree as to the content of the poll.
Edit: And it was linked from the login window, so technically, it wasn't a necessary thing to complete. Please bear in mind that the forums comprise a very small percentage of actual players - and many forumettes have a tendency to wax on about how THEY would like things as if they were the majority.
ummm if you actually took the time (yes i know there are a lot of pages) you would see this has been raised and discussed already in this thread. and most of us here, on both sides, have agreed the forums are not the best place to find a majority.
which was the whole point of us saying we need a login poll on this issue. the other poll did not deal with this issue, and we need a more focused poll to find the majority.
the poll did not ask us if we wanted a DP or give us options for a DP if one was to be put in.
if you are going to join in so late at least take the time to read some of what has been posted before you
I really do not see why you and others are so afraid of the community making a educated decision and why you wish it killed before even you know what it is.
because like i keep telling you (i know its hard for you to get it, but ill do it yet again) not all of us want the current system changed. we actually enjoy playing it, and do not see the addition of a DP as a challenge. so we dont need a DP added in to prove to us that we didnt want one to start with.
change the challenge by changing other systems, the DP will not effect that.
and i thought we got the issue of human nature out of the way before you got banned before? oh no thats right, you couldnt refute, you ignored and misinterpreted so that your claims would appear to you as still valid. dont take this the wrong way, but you are still beating that dead horse without being able to back it up. please dont try and dictate to us all how the human brain works, how everyones minds is, etc. you cant make that analysis of us all and if you had the training you claim you would know this.
I agree the poll gave us points. I disagree as to the content of the poll.
Edit: And it was linked from the login window, so technically, it wasn't a necessary thing to complete. Please bear in mind that the forums comprise a very small percentage of actual players - and many forumettes have a tendency to wax on about how THEY would like things as if they were the majority.
As I said before.. You are wrong. There was nothing in the survey about death penalties.
I'm sort of stepping in the middle of whomever you were talking to, but I remember the survey and remember seeing death penalties mentioned in there as an option. Just because it didn't appear in the results doesn't mean it was absent from the survey. But my memory could be wrong for all I know as it was a while ago.
Actually if you look at those results, they say "here are SOME of the responses we received".
I know it asked about it, because I answered it and thought "wow that's bold". There were no options, it was yes/no.
And no offense, but I was part of the previous argument.. just because one says "it wasn't there" over and over doesn't mean that's the literal truth, just the truth as you perceive it - because it WAS there, and obviously others remember it as well.
And again i refer to the statement that its moot, because they've already announced it.
Actually if you look at those results, they say "here are SOME of the responses we received".
I know it asked about it, because I answered it and thought "wow that's bold". There were no options, it was yes/no.
And no offense, but I was part of the previous argument.. just because one says "it wasn't there" over and over doesn't mean that's the literal truth, just the truth as you perceive it - because it WAS there, and obviously others remember it as well.
And again i refer to the statement that its moot, because they've already announced it.
just because one says it was there over and over doenst make it truth either. i for one dont remember a question on DP in the poll at all...
and the previous arguement i was talking about was the forums and majority's. not the subscriber poll. and the statement is not moot at all. they announced it based on a nonexistant majority. if they claim what they had was a majority vote then people can also claim by the same method there is a majority vote against it now. no? my point exactly.
they need to poll the players. plain and simple. until then no it isnt moot at all. or when a change is coming that you really dont want you will just sit quietly and watch it happen? you wont post that you disagree with the change? i seriously doubt it...
Actually if you look at those results, they say "here are SOME of the responses we received".
I know it asked about it, because I answered it and thought "wow that's bold". There were no options, it was yes/no.
And no offense, but I was part of the previous argument.. just because one says "it wasn't there" over and over doesn't mean that's the literal truth, just the truth as you perceive it - because it WAS there, and obviously others remember it as well.
And again i refer to the statement that its moot, because they've already announced it.
The other questions were how much should the box cost and how much do you think the monthly fee should be and how you would rate STO on a 1-10. Besides that, the questions I posted already are it for the whole survey.
There was NOTHING on a death penalty. Others even commented on that fact when the poll was released:
Given that the implementation of a death penalty is quite obviously a VERY important issue to the player base (those for, against and ambivalent about it), why was any feedback option about it completely vacant from the survey which addressed so many other areas of the game?
......
***Underline mine in above quote.***
Do you have any proof of any kind that there was even a single question about DP in the survey? Any proof at all? Just one single measly little citation?
Until I see some sort of proof which counters what I have cited I will continue to believe that you are wrong and your memory is flawed in this respect.
Do you honestly think cryptic are gonna stop it from at least going on tribble just cos of this thread or its pointless poll?.
Funny how the community voice to get a DP (as weak as it was) is something you supported and now suddenly you think people speaking up for what they want in the game is a bad thing.
No.. I stand corrected. It's not funny... it's simply sadly hypocritical.
I guess the real question is, what are you afraid of? That they might listen?
I'm sort of stepping in the middle of whomever you were talking to, but I remember the survey and remember seeing death penalties mentioned in there as an option. Just because it didn't appear in the results doesn't mean it was absent from the survey. But my memory could be wrong for all I know as it was a while ago.
I will feign my shock that someone who wants a DP distinctly remembers a DP question on a survey where there was none.
Yes... I think it is necessary as long as it isnt overdone i liked the idea of as your crew is killed it is replaced by holograms. One would have to return to starbase and requisition more crew. of course the crew shouldnt be killed too easily, just the red shirts lol.
In the absence of any precision concerning the DP in question, and assuming the OP would like a crippling one, I will have to say NO.
A small DP (there is already a very light one in place) can bring a sense of danger, but given the nature of the game, going any farther than a time out penalty would be overkill here imo.
YES in PvE, with a small percentage of damage to 1 or 2 subsystems you have to return to a starbase to repair, and on a very rare occasion maybe the death of a BO. Both of these things happened in ST episodes.
ERM no that is not even close to the definition of hypocrite, its more a definition of openmindedness and a willingness to at least know what the change is going to be before deciding its bad.
In fact your utter unwillingness to even find out and instead condemning crytic without any info on it while also claiming to want a better STO is extreemly hypocritical.
If its horrible and hurts the game they will not keep it, in fact when it hits tribble and if its awful the outcry will stop it in its tracks....seriously you need to chill and DL the tribble patch lol.
Im not sure what you consider to be casual play but to me its a player with limited time, you seem to think it means they lack skills or that they wish the game to be set to a absurdly easy level with no downsides to failing at things.
Now that maybe how you are but i know plenty of players with limited game time that are plenty skillful and enjoy a challenge.
See it is not being open minded, YOU NEVER considered a posible way of solving problems without resorting to age old tired death penalties, your position is the MUST be a death penalty. My position was there need not be one, BUT people could live with encounter reset as a penalty, so Hypocrite is perfectly fine.
See it is not being open minded, YOU NEVER considered a posible way of solving problems without resorting to age old tired death penalties, your position is the MUST be a death penalty.
My position was there need not be one, BUT people could live with encounter reset as a penalty, so Hypocrite is perfectly fine.
Im sorry you have a limited definition of what DP means but do not parcel me up in that same blinkered view, i have on every occasion when asked said it should be a positive effect and have used DP as a referance simply until somebody invents a new short designation
YOU are well aware of this as you have discused it with me before, i even started a thread about it as well as posted my ideas about a encounter/episode reset DP but you choose to continually ignore it as it gives you the oportuunity to vent some anger.
because like i keep telling you (i know its hard for you to get it, but ill do it yet again) not all of us want the current system changed. we actually enjoy playing it, and do not see the addition of a DP as a challenge. so we dont need a DP added in to prove to us that we didnt want one to start with.
I may like a lot of things about the game but if cryptic say they are gonna try and improve them i have the sense to wait and see what they are on tribble before i make a decision.
I do not believe you are doing this just cos you are happy with the currant system i think you saw the words DP, hit emo red line and are now refusing to see reason like some stubborn teenager.
I may like a lot of things about the game but if cryptic say they are gonna try and improve them i have the sense to wait and see what they are on tribble before i make a decision.
I do not believe you are doing this just cos you are happy with the currant system i think you saw the words DP, hit emo red line and are now refusing to see reason like some stubborn teenager.
why does there have to be improvement on something i think needs no improvement? this comes back to your opinion overriding everyone elses, and being superior.
i state i dont want a change. the death mechanic ingame doesnt need improvement, its working just fine. my opinion.
you respond by calling me a coward, emo, idiot, TRIBBLE, all sorts. you remember those posts where you resorted to personal attacks cause you were getting owned? seems kind of familiar as you did it yet again. ignored everything in my post except for one paragraph you felt you could attack.
when are you leaving again? id like to help hasten that along if possible, so here goes:
you are not superior. your reading skills are extremely low level, and your comprehension does not exist. while you may think your opinion trumps all, it doesnt. people can actually think and decide for themselves. while its true that in general people are sheep, at times even a sheep can prove itself an individual.
your prior claims to a position in life you have shown you could not possibly hold will not sustain you in your attempts to ignore and misinterpret your way through a debate. your superior "i know how everyone thinks cause i am right" attitude fails. your arguements fail. you do not try to debate in meaningful way, all you do is try to impose your opinion on the way people are over others opinions.
you are a very sad and pitiful individual. one hopes that one day you can stop deluding yourself and see that only you can improve this. stop telling lies, stop using deflection and ignorance as debate tools. read and comprehend before replying. simple things mate. telling someone they are wrong because you believe you ahve all of life's answers in your hands does not make it so. sorry about that
feel free to do your usual, and misquote me, and reply to only one paragraph, or attack only what you can and ignore the rest. ill be here to refresh your memory of the last time you failed to drive me away with your personal attacks and nerd rage and false claims
why does there have to be improvement on something i think needs no improvement? this comes back to your opinion overriding everyone elses, and being superior.
No its the oposite its your opinion that you are trying to force on everybody.
My opinion involves ppl seeing the changes on tribble and ppl making a educated decision.
Yours if you get your way involves not allowing them even that.
im not trying to force mine on people like you, i am defending my opinion from an ignorant person who thinks they know everything there is to know about others. and you have been trying to stuff a superior attitude down our throats long before tribble was even up, so you didnt want to see people on tribble trying it out when you first started raving thx
you attacked my opinion pages back and called me a coward for not wanting a change. since then i have been defending it to the point of proving you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
and again you delude yourself into thinking that your opinion overrides mine, where the rest of us realise people want what they want. and that differs. its just you that cant see it.
and you want to compare me to a TRIBBLE? congratulations on proving yet again you cannot afford to read others posts, because you simply cannot relate to the world around you without degenerating into whimsical flights of fancy about how the world revolves around you.
Comments
Smacks of arrogance. "Those who disagree with you simply don't know what they really want..."
The motto of slave drivers everywhere...
STO is not raising children...
Once again, you have to go personal when you can't defend your points. I would have thought your recent "vacation" would have tought you better. So much for "negative stimuli producing positive emotional effects".
If so-called community voices changed it once, why would you believe it can't change it again?
I am not the one using 2000 year old sayings that were misquoted to justify a DP, thats you. You get a grip and realize it is a game we don't need a DP to re-enforce consequences that real life teaches, especially since it won't even do that, it will be a small penalty, like an overdue library book hardly a life lesson. The fact is not needed really, its a tedious time sink that will detract and not teach.
No your hypocrite because you insisted on having a DP, with no indication they can do it right, thats one. If they concentrated on actual problems and not your myths and "life lessons" the game might become a good addition, but no people like you with no horse in the race complain, they respond in a horrible fashion and we'll never be rid of it. Bulling tactics from gaming elites and pro gamer reviewers ruin casual play. All of this cause you FEELING and MINDSET is too rigid to be creative. Everyone has a DP so we have to, thats really what you have been saying.
If they expect growth within the community the principal applies.
Come on you must have a opinion or are you honestly afriad ppl will do to you what you constantly try to do to them?.
.
ERM no that is not even close to the definition of hypocrite, its more a definition of openmindedness and a willingness to at least know what the change is going to be before deciding its bad.
In fact your utter unwillingness to even find out and instead condemning crytic without any info on it while also claiming to want a better STO is extreemly hypocritical.
If its horrible and hurts the game they will not keep it, in fact when it hits tribble and if its awful the outcry will stop it in its tracks....seriously you need to chill and DL the tribble patch lol.
Im not sure what you consider to be casual play but to me its a player with limited time, you seem to think it means they lack skills or that they wish the game to be set to a absurdly easy level with no downsides to failing at things.
Now that maybe how you are but i know plenty of players with limited game time that are plenty skillful and enjoy a challenge.
Do you honestly think cryptic are gonna stop it from at least going on tribble just cos of this thread or its pointless poll?.
Maybe if its a stupid DP and tonnes of ppl say so after seeing it on tribble they will stop it going live or change it but after the works done they are going to show it to ppl so they can get a educated responce from the community instead of spams from a few ignorant drama bombers and ppl with PTSD from poorly designed DP is other games.
I really do not see why you and others are so afraid of the community making a educated decision and why you wish it killed before even you know what it is.
ummm if you actually took the time (yes i know there are a lot of pages) you would see this has been raised and discussed already in this thread. and most of us here, on both sides, have agreed the forums are not the best place to find a majority.
which was the whole point of us saying we need a login poll on this issue. the other poll did not deal with this issue, and we need a more focused poll to find the majority.
the poll did not ask us if we wanted a DP or give us options for a DP if one was to be put in.
if you are going to join in so late at least take the time to read some of what has been posted before you
because like i keep telling you (i know its hard for you to get it, but ill do it yet again) not all of us want the current system changed. we actually enjoy playing it, and do not see the addition of a DP as a challenge. so we dont need a DP added in to prove to us that we didnt want one to start with.
change the challenge by changing other systems, the DP will not effect that.
and i thought we got the issue of human nature out of the way before you got banned before? oh no thats right, you couldnt refute, you ignored and misinterpreted so that your claims would appear to you as still valid. dont take this the wrong way, but you are still beating that dead horse without being able to back it up. please dont try and dictate to us all how the human brain works, how everyones minds is, etc. you cant make that analysis of us all and if you had the training you claim you would know this.
They posted the results of the survey here:
http://www.startrekonline.com/survey_one_results
Desired Gameplay Features
18% = Ship Interiors
17% = Bridge Functionality
17% = First Contact Missions
15% = Diplomacy System
12% = Persistent PvE Zone
11% = More Dialog Options
10% = PvP Territory Endgame
Desired Star Trek Feature
29% = Bridge Combat
29% = More Alien & Planet Discovery
23% = More Dialog & Diplomacy Missions
11% = More Notable Star Trek Locations
8% = More Notable Star Trek Characters
Least Liked
34% = Crafting / Memory Alpha
20% = Ground Combat
18% = Something Else
13% = PvP
8% = Exploration
3% = Story
2% = Character / Ship Customization
2% = Space Combat
Most Liked
59% = Space Combat
14% = Character / Ship Customization
11% = Story
7% = Exploration
4% = Ground Combat
3% = Something Else
2% = PvP
0% = Crafting / Memory Alpha
As I said before.. You are wrong. There was nothing in the survey about death penalties.
I'm sort of stepping in the middle of whomever you were talking to, but I remember the survey and remember seeing death penalties mentioned in there as an option. Just because it didn't appear in the results doesn't mean it was absent from the survey. But my memory could be wrong for all I know as it was a while ago.
I know it asked about it, because I answered it and thought "wow that's bold". There were no options, it was yes/no.
And no offense, but I was part of the previous argument.. just because one says "it wasn't there" over and over doesn't mean that's the literal truth, just the truth as you perceive it - because it WAS there, and obviously others remember it as well.
And again i refer to the statement that its moot, because they've already announced it.
just because one says it was there over and over doenst make it truth either. i for one dont remember a question on DP in the poll at all...
and the previous arguement i was talking about was the forums and majority's. not the subscriber poll. and the statement is not moot at all. they announced it based on a nonexistant majority. if they claim what they had was a majority vote then people can also claim by the same method there is a majority vote against it now. no? my point exactly.
they need to poll the players. plain and simple. until then no it isnt moot at all. or when a change is coming that you really dont want you will just sit quietly and watch it happen? you wont post that you disagree with the change? i seriously doubt it...
The other questions were how much should the box cost and how much do you think the monthly fee should be and how you would rate STO on a 1-10. Besides that, the questions I posted already are it for the whole survey.
There was NOTHING on a death penalty. Others even commented on that fact when the poll was released:
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=127585
***Underline mine in above quote.***
Do you have any proof of any kind that there was even a single question about DP in the survey? Any proof at all? Just one single measly little citation?
Until I see some sort of proof which counters what I have cited I will continue to believe that you are wrong and your memory is flawed in this respect.
There was nothing on DP in the survey.
It doesn't.
You do know that refuting your inane points about humanity and child raising techniques is, right?
You do know what it is when people disagree and state why is, right?
Sometimes what you claim to be looking for is right before your eyes but you are simply to blind to see it.
PS: Agreeing with you is not the only way to have an opinion.
Funny how the community voice to get a DP (as weak as it was) is something you supported and now suddenly you think people speaking up for what they want in the game is a bad thing.
No.. I stand corrected. It's not funny... it's simply sadly hypocritical.
I guess the real question is, what are you afraid of? That they might listen?
I will feign my shock that someone who wants a DP distinctly remembers a DP question on a survey where there was none.
:eek:
A small DP (there is already a very light one in place) can bring a sense of danger, but given the nature of the game, going any farther than a time out penalty would be overkill here imo.
NO in PvP
See it is not being open minded, YOU NEVER considered a posible way of solving problems without resorting to age old tired death penalties, your position is the MUST be a death penalty. My position was there need not be one, BUT people could live with encounter reset as a penalty, so Hypocrite is perfectly fine.
Im sorry you have a limited definition of what DP means but do not parcel me up in that same blinkered view, i have on every occasion when asked said it should be a positive effect and have used DP as a referance simply until somebody invents a new short designation
YOU are well aware of this as you have discused it with me before, i even started a thread about it as well as posted my ideas about a encounter/episode reset DP but you choose to continually ignore it as it gives you the oportuunity to vent some anger.
You are the hipocrite so do away and grow up.
I may like a lot of things about the game but if cryptic say they are gonna try and improve them i have the sense to wait and see what they are on tribble before i make a decision.
I do not believe you are doing this just cos you are happy with the currant system i think you saw the words DP, hit emo red line and are now refusing to see reason like some stubborn teenager.
why does there have to be improvement on something i think needs no improvement? this comes back to your opinion overriding everyone elses, and being superior.
i state i dont want a change. the death mechanic ingame doesnt need improvement, its working just fine. my opinion.
you respond by calling me a coward, emo, idiot, TRIBBLE, all sorts. you remember those posts where you resorted to personal attacks cause you were getting owned? seems kind of familiar as you did it yet again. ignored everything in my post except for one paragraph you felt you could attack.
when are you leaving again? id like to help hasten that along if possible, so here goes:
you are not superior. your reading skills are extremely low level, and your comprehension does not exist. while you may think your opinion trumps all, it doesnt. people can actually think and decide for themselves. while its true that in general people are sheep, at times even a sheep can prove itself an individual.
your prior claims to a position in life you have shown you could not possibly hold will not sustain you in your attempts to ignore and misinterpret your way through a debate. your superior "i know how everyone thinks cause i am right" attitude fails. your arguements fail. you do not try to debate in meaningful way, all you do is try to impose your opinion on the way people are over others opinions.
you are a very sad and pitiful individual. one hopes that one day you can stop deluding yourself and see that only you can improve this. stop telling lies, stop using deflection and ignorance as debate tools. read and comprehend before replying. simple things mate. telling someone they are wrong because you believe you ahve all of life's answers in your hands does not make it so. sorry about that
feel free to do your usual, and misquote me, and reply to only one paragraph, or attack only what you can and ignore the rest. ill be here to refresh your memory of the last time you failed to drive me away with your personal attacks and nerd rage and false claims
No its the oposite its your opinion that you are trying to force on everybody.
My opinion involves ppl seeing the changes on tribble and ppl making a educated decision.
Yours if you get your way involves not allowing them even that.
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Dionaea
im not trying to force mine on people like you, i am defending my opinion from an ignorant person who thinks they know everything there is to know about others. and you have been trying to stuff a superior attitude down our throats long before tribble was even up, so you didnt want to see people on tribble trying it out when you first started raving thx
you attacked my opinion pages back and called me a coward for not wanting a change. since then i have been defending it to the point of proving you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
and again you delude yourself into thinking that your opinion overrides mine, where the rest of us realise people want what they want. and that differs. its just you that cant see it.
and you want to compare me to a TRIBBLE? congratulations on proving yet again you cannot afford to read others posts, because you simply cannot relate to the world around you without degenerating into whimsical flights of fancy about how the world revolves around you.