That's what New Khitomer is for - since the old one was trashed by J'mpok.
Yes, this would be perfect. All playable factions would have an interest in it (the problem with my first example), and it wouldn't be tied to fleet holdings (the problem with my second example).
On the other hand, if its just something that gets more stuff added on as the storyline progresses, people who come in after the storyline is done wont get the feel of it being built up, since it would already be built up when they got there. And people who are playing the game now, but aren't actively doing the missions as they come out, would have the same problem. IT would just be built up without thier direct involvement, so they wouldn't get the feeling of being involved from it.
They would, if the storytelling was done right. People understand that the game changes through the arcs, and the things that occur in one arc stay in that arc. This is how an MMO works, and everyone gets that.
I'm absolutely and explicitly not suggesting another fleet holding. Bear in mind that if you want people's opinions on what the next arc should be, you should listen, and not just show up giving your (all too often stated as fact) opinion on why everyone else' ideas won't work.
Whatever they do as the next one, it should be something centered on one of the traditional Treks as a break from the steady stream of DSC-centric storylines lately (and no, the Klingon civil war does not count as a break from DSC since it intrinsically revolved around J'Ula for the most part). That would let off some of the pressure that has been building up in opposition to the DSC content.
I would like to see it as a collection of stand alone episodes, rather than a grand story line saving the galaxy.
Each episode is presented and solved in that sitting Each episode involves smaller goals like savings one’s ship, or planet, or correcting something that went wrong from an episode in one of the Star Trek series episodes.
A few examples.
1. While on patrol in a remote sector, you encounter another space amoeba like from TOS Immunity Syndrome. Maybe Tholians around and you have to team up with them to stop it. An enemy of my enemy is my friend situation.
2. Species 8472 has an interest in infiltrating the Dominion and you have to uncover their plot, gain trust of Founders, then stop it.
Yes, this would be perfect. All playable factions would have an interest in it (the problem with my first example), and it wouldn't be tied to fleet holdings (the problem with my second example).
If they did New Khitomer they would almost certainly do it as a fleet holding.
The problem with making it just a general social zone is that Cryptic stopped making social zones because they found that it didn't matter how unique they made them look, how many services they put in them, or how many times they used them in missions, the vast majority of players would just fly right by them to do their business at ESD or First City. People don't care about social zones, even fleet holding social zones. All they care about is the unique stuff you can get from the Fleet Holdings.
Not to mention, imagine how high the project costs for a public social zone you build up would have to be to balance it out with the entire playerbase. There was already stupidly absurd complaints about the Fleet Colony world project costs as is. Even if this public social zone was balanced to the older fleet holdings, you are still looking at project costs for things like dil in the literal hundreds of millions/billions. There would be so much rage about Cryptic "scamming" the playerbase over it, even if it actually wasn't any more then an old fleet holding was.
On the other hand, if its just something that gets more stuff added on as the storyline progresses, people who come in after the storyline is done wont get the feel of it being built up, since it would already be built up when they got there. And people who are playing the game now, but aren't actively doing the missions as they come out, would have the same problem. IT would just be built up without thier direct involvement, so they wouldn't get the feeling of being involved from it.
I still visit planet Vulcan occasionally but it's mostly because it's the home planet of my main toon and favorite trek species, "Live Long and Prosper".
I would like to see it as a collection of stand alone episodes, rather than a grand story line saving the galaxy.
Each episode is presented and solved in that sitting Each episode involves smaller goals like savings one’s ship, or planet, or correcting something that went wrong from an episode in one of the Star Trek series episodes.
A few examples.
1. While on patrol in a remote sector, you encounter another space amoeba like from TOS Immunity Syndrome. Maybe Tholians around and you have to team up with them to stop it. An enemy of my enemy is my friend situation.
2. Species 8472 has an interest in infiltrating the Dominion and you have to uncover their plot, gain trust of Founders, then stop it.
That is pretty much what they did with the Lukari arc (though it tied in with the Hurq stuff obliquely and loosely via the protomatter aspect) and that arc seems to be pretty popular so you are probably onto something there.
Yes, this would be perfect. All playable factions would have an interest in it (the problem with my first example), and it wouldn't be tied to fleet holdings (the problem with my second example).
If they did New Khitomer they would almost certainly do it as a fleet holding.
The problem with making it just a general social zone is that Cryptic stopped making social zones because they found that it didn't matter how unique they made them look, how many services they put in them, or how many times they used them in missions, the vast majority of players would just fly right by them to do their business at ESD or First City. People don't care about social zones, even fleet holding social zones. All they care about is the unique stuff you can get from the Fleet Holdings.
Not to mention, imagine how high the project costs for a public social zone you build up would have to be to balance it out with the entire playerbase. There was already stupidly absurd complaints about the Fleet Colony world project costs as is. Even if this public social zone was balanced to the older fleet holdings, you are still looking at project costs for things like dil in the literal hundreds of millions/billions. There would be so much rage about Cryptic "scamming" the playerbase over it, even if it actually wasn't any more then an old fleet holding was.
On the other hand, if its just something that gets more stuff added on as the storyline progresses, people who come in after the storyline is done wont get the feel of it being built up, since it would already be built up when they got there. And people who are playing the game now, but aren't actively doing the missions as they come out, would have the same problem. IT would just be built up without thier direct involvement, so they wouldn't get the feeling of being involved from it.
Uh, hello? Services are mostly absent from most zones or hugely inefficiently spread out over them. Likewise, people 'don't care' about fleet holdings because they're hugely inefficient.
Everyone can quickly get to ESD / Qo'nos - and stay there. With fleet maps, you have to transwarp every time you want to go there, spend ages waiting for a loading screen and still not have access to all services easily in the case of the holding most easily reached, the Starbase.
If they were just as accessible as regular zones, I'd gladly exchange ESD for my fleet's starbase as his main base of operations.
The same limitations apply to many other social zones. Starbase 39 looks great, it's calm there and I like the old look with darker colours. But it doesn't have all the services a player could need. K7 has most of them, but they're spread out in all different corners. DS9 has almost everything too, but its circular lay-out makes it difficult to remember where to find most things.
Dyson Joint Command doesn't have a Boff trainer. But at least this zone lets you quickly access zones with content.
If the Devs made (most of) these zones just as easily accessible as the home station / planet of the faction, ensured that all services were available and efficiently organised there and, where possible, included easy access to other zones like battlezones, then I'm sure people would spend time there.
Of course people will just fly to Qo'nos or ESD as long as those are the only zones where people can quickly (and consistently, without being taken back to some random spot after leaving the map!) get all the stuff they need. But that has little to do with some supposed inherent incapability of other zones to be interesting and everything to do with development choices.
[4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother
In short, if all other zones and holdings are designed in a sub-optimal way then you shouldn't be surprised that they're not the first choice of players.
That has nothing to do with them looking uninteresting or it simply not being possible to make other interesting zones. They can certainly make it work, but they'd have to ask themselves what a player wants from a holding or a zone.
[4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother
Yes, this would be perfect. All playable factions would have an interest in it (the problem with my first example), and it wouldn't be tied to fleet holdings (the problem with my second example).
If they did New Khitomer they would almost certainly do it as a fleet holding.
The problem with making it just a general social zone is that Cryptic stopped making social zones because they found that it didn't matter how unique they made them look, how many services they put in them, or how many times they used them in missions, the vast majority of players would just fly right by them to do their business at ESD or First City. People don't care about social zones, even fleet holding social zones. All they care about is the unique stuff you can get from the Fleet Holdings.
Not to mention, imagine how high the project costs for a public social zone you build up would have to be to balance it out with the entire playerbase. There was already stupidly absurd complaints about the Fleet Colony world project costs as is. Even if this public social zone was balanced to the older fleet holdings, you are still looking at project costs for things like dil in the literal hundreds of millions/billions. There would be so much rage about Cryptic "scamming" the playerbase over it, even if it actually wasn't any more then an old fleet holding was.
On the other hand, if its just something that gets more stuff added on as the storyline progresses, people who come in after the storyline is done wont get the feel of it being built up, since it would already be built up when they got there. And people who are playing the game now, but aren't actively doing the missions as they come out, would have the same problem. IT would just be built up without thier direct involvement, so they wouldn't get the feeling of being involved from it.
Uh, hello? Services are mostly absent from most zones or hugely inefficiently spread out over them. Likewise, people 'don't care' about fleet holdings because they're hugely inefficient.
Everyone can quickly get to ESD / Qo'nos - and stay there. With fleet maps, you have to transwarp every time you want to go there, spend ages waiting for a loading screen and still not have access to all services easily in the case of the holding most easily reached, the Starbase.
If they were just as accessible as regular zones, I'd gladly exchange ESD for my fleet's starbase as his main base of operations.
The same limitations apply to many other social zones. Starbase 39 looks great, it's calm there and I like the old look with darker colours. But it doesn't have all the services a player could need. K7 has most of them, but they're spread out in all different corners. DS9 has almost everything too, but its circular lay-out makes it difficult to remember where to find most things.
Dyson Joint Command doesn't have a Boff trainer. But at least this zone lets you quickly access zones with content.
If the Devs made (most of) these zones just as easily accessible as the home station / planet of the faction, ensured that all services were available and efficiently organised there and, where possible, included easy access to other zones like battlezones, then I'm sure people would spend time there.
Of course people will just fly to Qo'nos or ESD as long as those are the only zones where people can quickly (and consistently, without being taken back to some random spot after leaving the map!) get all the stuff they need. But that has little to do with some supposed inherent incapability of other zones to be interesting and everything to do with development choices.
True. For RP purposes the 'home base' for a lot of my Orions is Drozana (and a few Nimbus which is even worse despite being able to transwarp there via replay) but there is no way to transwarp there so they often end up on Qo'noS, my Vorta end up either at New Romulus or Sol instead of DS9, and my Risan ends up at Sol, ect. My Kobali is the only one who could possibly transwarp home, but her background has her officially assigned to work with Starfleet as part of the Alliance since she was Federation before she was killed and reborn so she doesn't need it.
If they added transwarp points to all of the social zones, or even just had a floating "home port" transwarp that could be set as any social zone then those zones would see a lot more traffic (and even more if they all offered all of the services). It just isn't worth the long sectorspace crawl to get to most of the social zones on a regular basis, even stubbornly RP oriented people like me get tired of it and just leave them in the faction capitals a lot of the time.
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch." "We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Passion and Serenity are one.
I gain power by understanding both.
In the chaos of their battle, I bring order.
I am a shadow, darkness born from light.
The Force is united within me.
Captain Chu'Lak: "Vulcan is still one of the better social zones, logically it's much more preferable than that useless iceball the Andorians call home."
Random Human redshirt: "The Andorians just got schooled by a Vulcan!"
For my main character, a TOS Tellarite, I use K-13. It has everything I need and the TOS aesthetics fit in well with my immersion and RP. I also like that is a bit out of the beaten path out in Draconis sector. That fits with my thoughts of it as a frontier star base. Also seeing the TOS ships flying around the asteroid field surrounding K-13 is a great background while I am flying my Gemini cruiser in to dock.
K-13 is a fleet asset that is of great value to me for a lot of reasons. I think K-13 is the next best thing to the 23c TOS ESD from AoY.
1. They don't. If they did they wouldn't have been things Cryptic has already explained why they don't do.
Which things? I never mentioned a social zone. I specifically said it shouldn't be a Holding. These are things that you have decided I said.
3. Expecting people to keep within believable boundaries, and using realistic limitations on their ideas, is the exact opposite of smug, superior, and not wanting reasonable dialog.
What is smug, superior, and not wanting reasonable dialog, is thinking that you can just ignore reality because your idea is just so good facts don't matter, and then trying to turn it around on others, and shut them down, when they point this out. Take a look in a mirror my friend.
Someone telling you no isn't an attack against you, nor is it them trying to claim superiority.
Like I stated already. I did not once ignore reality. You're trying to twist my words to fit your agenda. A common pattern.
Comments
Yes, this would be perfect. All playable factions would have an interest in it (the problem with my first example), and it wouldn't be tied to fleet holdings (the problem with my second example).
They would, if the storytelling was done right. People understand that the game changes through the arcs, and the things that occur in one arc stay in that arc. This is how an MMO works, and everyone gets that.
I'm absolutely and explicitly not suggesting another fleet holding. Bear in mind that if you want people's opinions on what the next arc should be, you should listen, and not just show up giving your (all too often stated as fact) opinion on why everyone else' ideas won't work.
Each episode is presented and solved in that sitting Each episode involves smaller goals like savings one’s ship, or planet, or correcting something that went wrong from an episode in one of the Star Trek series episodes.
A few examples.
1. While on patrol in a remote sector, you encounter another space amoeba like from TOS Immunity Syndrome. Maybe Tholians around and you have to team up with them to stop it. An enemy of my enemy is my friend situation.
2. Species 8472 has an interest in infiltrating the Dominion and you have to uncover their plot, gain trust of Founders, then stop it.
I still visit planet Vulcan occasionally but it's mostly because it's the home planet of my main toon and favorite trek species, "Live Long and Prosper".
That is pretty much what they did with the Lukari arc (though it tied in with the Hurq stuff obliquely and loosely via the protomatter aspect) and that arc seems to be pretty popular so you are probably onto something there.
Uh, hello? Services are mostly absent from most zones or hugely inefficiently spread out over them. Likewise, people 'don't care' about fleet holdings because they're hugely inefficient.
Everyone can quickly get to ESD / Qo'nos - and stay there. With fleet maps, you have to transwarp every time you want to go there, spend ages waiting for a loading screen and still not have access to all services easily in the case of the holding most easily reached, the Starbase.
If they were just as accessible as regular zones, I'd gladly exchange ESD for my fleet's starbase as his main base of operations.
The same limitations apply to many other social zones. Starbase 39 looks great, it's calm there and I like the old look with darker colours. But it doesn't have all the services a player could need. K7 has most of them, but they're spread out in all different corners. DS9 has almost everything too, but its circular lay-out makes it difficult to remember where to find most things.
Dyson Joint Command doesn't have a Boff trainer. But at least this zone lets you quickly access zones with content.
If the Devs made (most of) these zones just as easily accessible as the home station / planet of the faction, ensured that all services were available and efficiently organised there and, where possible, included easy access to other zones like battlezones, then I'm sure people would spend time there.
Of course people will just fly to Qo'nos or ESD as long as those are the only zones where people can quickly (and consistently, without being taken back to some random spot after leaving the map!) get all the stuff they need. But that has little to do with some supposed inherent incapability of other zones to be interesting and everything to do with development choices.
[3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
That has nothing to do with them looking uninteresting or it simply not being possible to make other interesting zones. They can certainly make it work, but they'd have to ask themselves what a player wants from a holding or a zone.
[3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
True. For RP purposes the 'home base' for a lot of my Orions is Drozana (and a few Nimbus which is even worse despite being able to transwarp there via replay) but there is no way to transwarp there so they often end up on Qo'noS, my Vorta end up either at New Romulus or Sol instead of DS9, and my Risan ends up at Sol, ect. My Kobali is the only one who could possibly transwarp home, but her background has her officially assigned to work with Starfleet as part of the Alliance since she was Federation before she was killed and reborn so she doesn't need it.
If they added transwarp points to all of the social zones, or even just had a floating "home port" transwarp that could be set as any social zone then those zones would see a lot more traffic (and even more if they all offered all of the services). It just isn't worth the long sectorspace crawl to get to most of the social zones on a regular basis, even stubbornly RP oriented people like me get tired of it and just leave them in the faction capitals a lot of the time.
#LegalizeAwoo
A normie goes "Oh, what's this?"
An otaku goes "UwU, what's this?"
A furry goes "OwO, what's this?"
A werewolf goes "Awoo, what's this?"
"It's nothing personal, I just don't feel like I've gotten to know a person until I've sniffed their crotch."
"We said 'no' to Mr. Curiosity. We're not home. Curiosity is not welcome, it is not to be invited in. Curiosity...is bad. It gets you in trouble, it gets you killed, and more importantly...it makes you poor!"
Random Human redshirt: "The Andorians just got schooled by a Vulcan!"
Ty, I will have to look that one up, it might be worth the hassle of keeping it constantly in the mission tracker.
K-13 is a fleet asset that is of great value to me for a lot of reasons. I think K-13 is the next best thing to the 23c TOS ESD from AoY.
Wow.
1. They do.
2. I'm going to just quote this to highlight exactly how smug and superior you are, and how uninterested you are in actual reasonable dialog.
Which things? I never mentioned a social zone. I specifically said it shouldn't be a Holding. These are things that you have decided I said.
Like I stated already. I did not once ignore reality. You're trying to twist my words to fit your agenda. A common pattern.