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[LEGACY] Measure of Morality - Feedback and Discussion

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  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,478 Arc User
    Does she say anything special for Klingons or Jem'Hadar?
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  • tom61stotom61sto Member Posts: 3,367 Arc User
    If you're non-Romulan that dialog comes up when you start the round with Hakeev, though directed at the dead Romulans instead of you.
  • lordmerc22lordmerc22 Member Posts: 776 Arc User
    I played both episodes, dont want to spoil any details for whoever didnt play them yet but easily its the best part of this 10th anniversary so far - far more than the giveaways, the controversial pack and the borgbox - so we got to congratulate them for it, nice story and high quality with great voice acting
  • jagdtier44jagdtier44 Member Posts: 358 Arc User
    tom61sto wrote: »
    If you're non-Romulan that dialog comes up when you start the round with Hakeev, though directed at the dead Romulans instead of you.

    That's interesting, and I to wonder if she says something if your a Klingon or if its just a Romulan thing
  • leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 4,465 Arc User
    I played both episodes too, and I've got to say the improvements in the environments were fantastic......and Cryptic NAILED Sonique's features!!! Not too bad a job on Jeri, but the lips were a tad too big. The cutscenes, references and the addition of something right at the end made my day (althought 'some' will throw a right fit!).

    Jolly Well Done!!!
    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
  • originalspockoriginalspock Member Posts: 794 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    I humbly request you add in the lines to the axe wielder of the mission. "Be excellent to each other. "
  • anodynesanodynes Member Posts: 1,971 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    stolok wrote: »
    The rewards for the latest missions are a bit odd. What use is a puddle of radiation damage? There are many AoE damage kits now. This one offers nothing new. But the real disappointment is the strange weapon we get at the end of the second one. An axe??? Is that really what Abe Lincoln is associated with? What would have been far better is a cosmetic item much more widely associated with the 16th president of the United States. For quite a while now I've wished for a decent fedora to go with the formal suit and Replica Thompson Submachine Gun. It would make a complete "gangster" outfit possible. But what would have been equally good is a stove pipe hat! Dapper gorns in ordinary suits are fun. A dapper gorn in a tux and stove pipe hat would be even more fun. While I don't know if there is any tuxedo or other older-style plain black suit that would go with it already available somewhere in the game, that could easily have been part of the package. There is still time. Convert the stupid axe to a stove pipe hat in the next patch.

    Among Lincoln's many nicknames is "The Rail Splitter." Guess what you would use to split wood to make rails? There are even rather famous paintings depicting him wielding an ax to split wood into fence rails. We don't need a weapon to be exchanged for a costume item, as they are different categories of reward. If they chose to add a stovepipe hat, I would be fine with it, though I doubt that I would use it, but it should not take the place of something that we already have right now.
    This is an MMO, not a Star Trek episode simulator. That would make for a terrible game.
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan Member Posts: 36,753 Arc User
    sentinels and ruins of doom are patrols, not missions - that's why they're just endless waves of enemies to blast​​
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  • jagdtier44jagdtier44 Member Posts: 358 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    sentinels and ruins of doom are patrols, not missions - that's why they're just endless waves of enemies to blast​​

    all the missions i mentioned are patrols, but our previous expansion patrols like in delta weren't as droll and end in exactly the same manor as all 4 of those missions did. It was just.. really bad. Even our old pal Argala, the old ship blaster for leveling mastery is more engaging than sit still and tabbing to keep blasting the new waves as they spawn in the exact same spot an absurd amount of times :S
  • daimon97daimon97 Member Posts: 330 Arc User
    These are really great. Kudos to DEVS!!! My question is if we beg like really hard would you implement these event missions allongside the Myceliical one in to the episodes section!! Pleaseeee
  • spiritbornspiritborn Member Posts: 3,389 Arc User
    jagdtier44 wrote: »
    tom61sto wrote: »
    If you're non-Romulan that dialog comes up when you start the round with Hakeev, though directed at the dead Romulans instead of you.

    That's interesting, and I to wonder if she says something if your a Klingon or if its just a Romulan thing

    Yeah she says something along the lines of "I don't recognize the uniforms on those vulcans" when she sees the dead romulan soldiers and there's dialogue starting with that.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    Champions Online has lots of hats. Fedoras and zoot suits are definitely part of the repertoire.
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  • arakim5arakim5 Member Posts: 76 Arc User
    The new missions were really good. It gives me hope for some amazing Picard tie-in's.

    Also like the crypto-transmission this weekend. These missions checked all the boxes I think.
  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 54,602 Community Moderator
    Did they change it in the Delta Rising missions too?

    I think they redid the character model, but kept the catsuit and hairstyle. So we now have two versions of Seven in game, Picard style casual in the new missions, and the older Voyager style in Delta Rising.

    I popped into the one where we first fight the Vaadwaur to check.
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  • where2r1where2r1 Member Posts: 6,054 Arc User
    What? New mission rewards a battle axe??? Oh that was all I needed to hear... I will have to spend some time to do that mission... Before dedicating my time to Omegas.
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  • colonelmarikcolonelmarik Member Posts: 1,894 Arc User
    So, I played through the new missions, and I have some thoughts on them.

    First, the good. I thought the opening where we get yanked off to Excalbia was good. A bit of gripping, even. I liked the voice work on the Excalbian, Yarnek. In the past, actors who have recreated roles (such as the Guardian of Forever) have done... poorly. THIS time, the voice was spot on, both in tone, rhythm and pacing. I don't know who the actor was, but he managed to sound like the original actor very well. The final battle in space was engaging, and it was nice to hear clips of Kirk, Archer, Sisko and the others during the battle. I mean, they were clearly not new material, but lifted from episodes, but it was still nice. It marks the first time we've actually heard from most of the Captains of Star Trek.
    Perhaps the BEST thing was that there were CHOICES to make that at least FELT like they had meaning. I don't know if it would make any difference to choose differently, I'll have to play it again to see. In any case, the sense that my choices mattered was a WELCOME change.

    However, there was lots about this that I didn't like. First, there was the voice work from Jeri Ryan. She's wonderful, but she sounds rushed and bored most of the time here. There's just something odd about her pacing. Is this what her performance is like in STPicard? It kind of threw me off a bit. I didn't like the inclusion of Burnham, as I loathe Discovery. However, I do understand including her in there, and could tolerate it.
    I was first put off by the appearance of Lincoln. That character was an Excalbian taking on Lincoln's appearance because KIRK admired him. There was no reason for there to be a Lincoln for MY character. I think choosing another character, one that might be revered by everyone, might have been better there. They might even have had different characters, depending on the faction of the character (eg. Kahless for Klingons). In any case, the idea that the Excalbians would still be wrestling with the question of good vs evil after 200 years... seems silly. More, they decide to test the concepts in exactly the same way as before. I felt it was sadly derivative and repetitive.

    The missions themselves, the trials, were fine for the most part. The problems I had were once we had to face the Iconians and Borg. The Iconian boss on Iconia was idiotically powerful, just repeatedly oneshotting my whole group, over and over and over. Between the endless juggling and the giant oneshot area effect, coupled with random mortar hits... that battle was INCREDIBLY tedious. Similarly, when fighting the Borg, it was just nonstop endless hordes that you simply couldn't damage because they would become immune after one, perhaps two shots. Then there were the invulnerable bosses with their multiple oneshot attacks, PLUS instant kill floor panels, PLUS automated AOE turret attacks, all coupled with nonstop roots and slows... my team would get immediately wiped again and again and again... Another incredibly tedious battle. Finally, there was the last battle in space. It began frustratingly, as it always does with the Borg (and many others), a deluge of non-stop tachyon beams, meaning no shields, plus barrages of a million plasma torpedoes... which will oneshot you, because you have no shields, no matter what you do. When you get through that, the hero ships join the fight, and honestly do more for the battle than you do. I mean, I spent the whole battle chasing down one ship, turned and found the others had already defeated everything else. A bit disappointing. Yes, they're the hero ships, Enterprises, Defiant, etc., but WE are supposed to be the heroes of THIS story.

    All in all, it was an interesting episode, enjoyable if you don't think about it much, despite the frustrating later battles.

    I give it a 7/10, on the high side for STO.

    (I may post other thoughts once I've played it through again)
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  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 15,234 Arc User
    Regarding President Lincoln..... yeah, I've only played this as a Federation character so far so genuine query, but is the dialogue different for KDF characters?
    (I mean, I don't see any reason why a Klingon/Orion/Jem'Hadar etc would either know who he is or particuarly care.)

    I can just about swallow a Starfleet Officer knowing of him, but the aforementioned races..... not so much.

  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,460 Arc User
    Like Hamlet, Klingons know of Abraham Lincoln as they often recite the Gettysburg Address in its native Klingon. :)
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
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    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
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  • reyan01reyan01 Member Posts: 15,234 Arc User
    ltminns wrote: »
    Like Hamlet, Klingons know of Abraham Lincoln as they often recite the Gettysburg Address in its native Klingon. :)

    Seriously?

    Well, unfortunate that the people who write this nonsense clearly lack the ability to write the Klingon people having their own culture/heritage outside of Kahless, and thus having a strange obsession with anicent Earth literature.
  • westx211westx211 Member Posts: 41,571 Arc User
    I both liked and disliked the mission. I agree with all of the ops points, burning really despised Burnham being in the mission. Not purely because of a dislike for discovery(I loathe the show as well) but mostly because I hated how her character interacted with everyone else. The fact that she gets Obisek killed because "you can't shoot Hitler that's murder" was so unfathomable stupid I legitimately had to take several minutes to recover and move on. She does this again and again throughout the missions.

    Secondly, there's a specific choice I have problems with, I chose to let Noye stay dead since we killed him in the original mission in STO anyway and Seven points out that without Noye and the Annorax the Temporal Liberation Front will fall apart.(which it did in the original timeline) then when I get out the Excalbians tell me that because Noye died the TLF committed mass genocide and successfully destroyed the homeworld of every species in the alliance? HOW THE TRIBBLE DID THEY MANAGE THAT? I know the choice ultimately have no impact overall, but being told that magically doing what we did before suddenly causes the good guys to lose and be wiped out doesn't make sense and upsets me.

    I didn't like how the Iconian was assimilated either. We've been shown that the iconians made themselves and their tech immune to Borg assimilation before and that atleast techwise, attempting to do so causes massive annihilation. I know there's the excuse that "evil Seven of Nine escaped the simulation" but... how did she manage to do that? And how did she in the span of a few hours manage to figure out how to get around the inability to assimilate iconians? It doesn't make sense.

    And I also felt that for the short period Shan was there with the Enterprise F his voice acting was especially bad. Like... horrifying even. There was so little emotion in his voice for what should have been a very dramatic moment that it almost ruined it.

    Though I do love the new voice actor for Noye. I never cared for the original, he just sounded too whiny.
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  • jagdtier44jagdtier44 Member Posts: 358 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    While I overall really liked the missions they did have their faults.
    Lincoln I actually didn't mind as I figured as I figured they had adopted Lincoln as a proponent for good from Kirk's era so continued to use him in our era.
    Burnham I honestly didn't mind, I don't like disco at at all and especially dislike her, BUT in sto she did a good job with the voice acting and face it someone had to be the voice of good while seven would be your more pragmatic pitch.
    The combat I didn't have an issue with. .but than again my kit is all maxed out epics..but I still didn't experience any one shots nor did I die in ground or space so I think it's more a ymmv depending on your load out.
    My only real let down was actually when all the hero ships warp in and you get that framed shot of your ship and all them....because I'm Romulan and obviously don't fit in that picture of a purely federation hurrah fleet.. kinda brought back that jarring schism of how this game is very federation in all design aspects that I felt they had done a good job of handling in the beginning with me explaining what romulans where to Burnham.
  • dongemaharudongemaharu Member Posts: 544 Arc User
    "Obisek, don't do it! You're better than that!"

    "Well, if you say s..."

    "ZAP!"

    Yup. That's Star Trek for ya.

    Bad points:

    -Discovery just won't seem to go the TRIBBLE away. Burnham is such a drag of a character.
    -This Seven is a smart TRIBBLE. Relentlessly so. It's just too much. I prefer the STO Seven. I don't know if they exist at the same time or are from different realities or whatever.
    -It didn't seem to matter what choice you made. You still complete the mission with Abe's approval. It's good to argue both choices, but it has no impact on the outcome.

    Good points:

    -You only have to play it once to get all the goodies. No replay several times to complete a set. Nice!
    -The battle at the end was great with all the other Enterprises.
    -I liked the story. I don't know how possible it was, even in Star Trek, it was a good way to get that Excaliban to see things your way. Though the morality kinda gets confusing and arbitrary.....
  • alexanderb#7559 alexanderb Member Posts: 186 Arc User
    I liked it, although it's a bit long, especially when you do the two parts straight after eachother.

    I think they could do some more on the borg part though, it's almost an exact copy of the Hive of Mind ground TFO. Maybe they could have made it more unique, since no borg cube (even the queen diamond) is the same in the series.
  • iamjmphiamjmph Member Posts: 204 Arc User
    I found out the choices are for the accolade. It's supposed to be a choice between Fed and Klingon version of "Good".... I mixed and matched, so go an accolade called "The Best Onfence"....

    I enjoyed the missions for the most part, i might replay them just to get the other accolades. I severely dislike the character of Burnham (hmm i guess since the thread has a spoiler warning... it's mostly because of the whole "I love you captain, I'd follow you to hell.. ohh hey Klingons! KILL THEM! wait, what do you mean NO, Daddy says its the best way... Still no, MUTINY!" thing that I just can't get over.) , and find the idea of HER being the voice of Good to be laughable (she comes off as more self-righteous imo), but I can deal with it i guess...

    I've put to much money into the game to quit now just because the brought in my second least favorite ST char (she ranks just before Nelix) into the game... I dealt with the Ugly Discovery Klingon aesthetics, i'll deal with this...

  • neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,464 Arc User
    I liked it, especially the Avengers last battle with all the hero ships from the shows showing up with the Enterprise F
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  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,478 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.
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  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5 Member Posts: 2,899 Arc User
    Including Lincoln was silly indeed. For most people outside the US (and probably inside the US too) the character has likely zero meaning.

    The battles were not hard at all. Enemies were pretty weak in my opinion (I should add that I play episodes on normal difficulty because there is zero reason to do it on higher difficulties as far as I know).

    Story-wise, the episodes were great, although at times it was hard to understand whether anything that happened, would affect our 'real' world or whether it was all just a simulation.
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5 Member Posts: 2,899 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.

    Get the T3 Omega trait that slows down adaptation ;)
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,478 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.

    Get the T3 Omega trait that slows down adaptation ;)

    Adaptation wasn't the issue, was using a Tommy Gun :) There were just so many of them that I couldn't stay alive when they all attacked me at the same time, and Seven and Burnham were useless in that part.
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  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5 Member Posts: 2,899 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.

    Get the T3 Omega trait that slows down adaptation ;)

    Adaptation wasn't the issue, was using a Tommy Gun :) There were just so many of them that I couldn't stay alive when they all attacked me at the same time, and Seven and Burnham were useless in that part.

    Oh that never happened to me. I had to keep looking and actively search for enemies.
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
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