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[LEGACY] Measure of Morality - Feedback and Discussion

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  • tom61stotom61sto Member Posts: 3,635 Arc User
    If you're non-Romulan that dialog comes up when you start the round with Hakeev, though directed at the dead Romulans instead of you.
  • lordmerc22lordmerc22 Member Posts: 776 Arc User
    I played both episodes, dont want to spoil any details for whoever didnt play them yet but easily its the best part of this 10th anniversary so far - far more than the giveaways, the controversial pack and the borgbox - so we got to congratulate them for it, nice story and high quality with great voice acting
  • jagdtier44jagdtier44 Member Posts: 376 Arc User
    tom61sto wrote: »
    If you're non-Romulan that dialog comes up when you start the round with Hakeev, though directed at the dead Romulans instead of you.

    That's interesting, and I to wonder if she says something if your a Klingon or if its just a Romulan thing
  • leemwatsonleemwatson Member Posts: 5,331 Arc User
    I played both episodes too, and I've got to say the improvements in the environments were fantastic......and Cryptic NAILED Sonique's features!!! Not too bad a job on Jeri, but the lips were a tad too big. The cutscenes, references and the addition of something right at the end made my day (althought 'some' will throw a right fit!).

    Jolly Well Done!!!
    "You don't want to patrol!? You don't want to escort!? You don't want to defend the Federation's Starbases!? Then why are you flying my Starships!? If you were a Klingon you'd be killed on the spot, but lucky for you.....you WERE in Starfleet. Let's see how New Zealand Penal Colony suits you." Adm A. Necheyev.
  • originalspockoriginalspock Member Posts: 809 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    I humbly request you add in the lines to the axe wielder of the mission. "Be excellent to each other. "
  • anodynesanodynes Member Posts: 1,999 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    stolok wrote: »
    The rewards for the latest missions are a bit odd. What use is a puddle of radiation damage? There are many AoE damage kits now. This one offers nothing new. But the real disappointment is the strange weapon we get at the end of the second one. An axe??? Is that really what Abe Lincoln is associated with? What would have been far better is a cosmetic item much more widely associated with the 16th president of the United States. For quite a while now I've wished for a decent fedora to go with the formal suit and Replica Thompson Submachine Gun. It would make a complete "gangster" outfit possible. But what would have been equally good is a stove pipe hat! Dapper gorns in ordinary suits are fun. A dapper gorn in a tux and stove pipe hat would be even more fun. While I don't know if there is any tuxedo or other older-style plain black suit that would go with it already available somewhere in the game, that could easily have been part of the package. There is still time. Convert the stupid axe to a stove pipe hat in the next patch.

    Among Lincoln's many nicknames is "The Rail Splitter." Guess what you would use to split wood to make rails? There are even rather famous paintings depicting him wielding an ax to split wood into fence rails. We don't need a weapon to be exchanged for a costume item, as they are different categories of reward. If they chose to add a stovepipe hat, I would be fine with it, though I doubt that I would use it, but it should not take the place of something that we already have right now.
    This is an MMO, not a Star Trek episode simulator. That would make for a terrible game.
  • legendarylycan#5411 legendarylycan Member Posts: 37,276 Arc User
    sentinels and ruins of doom are patrols, not missions - that's why they're just endless waves of enemies to blast​​
    Like special weapons from other Star Trek games? Wondering if they can be replicated in STO even a little bit? Check this out: https://forum.arcgames.com/startrekonline/discussion/1262277/a-mostly-comprehensive-guide-to-star-trek-videogame-special-weapons-and-their-sto-equivalents

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  • jagdtier44jagdtier44 Member Posts: 376 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    sentinels and ruins of doom are patrols, not missions - that's why they're just endless waves of enemies to blast​​

    all the missions i mentioned are patrols, but our previous expansion patrols like in delta weren't as droll and end in exactly the same manor as all 4 of those missions did. It was just.. really bad. Even our old pal Argala, the old ship blaster for leveling mastery is more engaging than sit still and tabbing to keep blasting the new waves as they spawn in the exact same spot an absurd amount of times :S
  • daimon97daimon97 Member Posts: 368 Arc User
    These are really great. Kudos to DEVS!!! My question is if we beg like really hard would you implement these event missions allongside the Myceliical one in to the episodes section!! Pleaseeee
  • spiritbornspiritborn Member Posts: 4,248 Arc User
    jagdtier44 wrote: »
    tom61sto wrote: »
    If you're non-Romulan that dialog comes up when you start the round with Hakeev, though directed at the dead Romulans instead of you.

    That's interesting, and I to wonder if she says something if your a Klingon or if its just a Romulan thing

    Yeah she says something along the lines of "I don't recognize the uniforms on those vulcans" when she sees the dead romulan soldiers and there's dialogue starting with that.
  • markhawkmanmarkhawkman Member Posts: 35,231 Arc User
    Champions Online has lots of hats. Fedoras and zoot suits are definitely part of the repertoire.
    -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
    My character Tsin'xing
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  • arakim5arakim5 Member Posts: 82 Arc User
    The new missions were really good. It gives me hope for some amazing Picard tie-in's.

    Also like the crypto-transmission this weekend. These missions checked all the boxes I think.
  • rattler2rattler2 Member Posts: 57,973 Community Moderator
    Did they change it in the Delta Rising missions too?

    I think they redid the character model, but kept the catsuit and hairstyle. So we now have two versions of Seven in game, Picard style casual in the new missions, and the older Voyager style in Delta Rising.

    I popped into the one where we first fight the Vaadwaur to check.
    db80k0m-89201ed8-eadb-45d3-830f-bb2f0d4c0fe7.png?token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJzdWIiOiJ1cm46YXBwOjdlMGQxODg5ODIyNjQzNzNhNWYwZDQxNWVhMGQyNmUwIiwiaXNzIjoidXJuOmFwcDo3ZTBkMTg4OTgyMjY0MzczYTVmMGQ0MTVlYTBkMjZlMCIsIm9iaiI6W1t7InBhdGgiOiJcL2ZcL2ExOGQ4ZWM2LTUyZjQtNDdiMS05YTI1LTVlYmZkYmJkOGM3N1wvZGI4MGswbS04OTIwMWVkOC1lYWRiLTQ1ZDMtODMwZi1iYjJmMGQ0YzBmZTcucG5nIn1dXSwiYXVkIjpbInVybjpzZXJ2aWNlOmZpbGUuZG93bmxvYWQiXX0.8G-Pg35Qi8qxiKLjAofaKRH6fmNH3qAAEI628gW0eXc
    I can't take it anymore! Could everyone just chill out for two seconds before something CRAZY happens again?!
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  • where2r1where2r1 Member Posts: 6,054 Arc User
    What? New mission rewards a battle axe??? Oh that was all I needed to hear... I will have to spend some time to do that mission... Before dedicating my time to Omegas.
    "Spend your life doing strange things with weird people." -- UNK

    “Tell me and I forget. Teach me and I remember. Involve me and I learn.” -- Benjamin Franklin
  • ltminnsltminns Member Posts: 12,569 Arc User
    Like Hamlet, Klingons know of Abraham Lincoln as they often recite the Gettysburg Address in its native Klingon. :)
    'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
    Judge Dan Haywood
    'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
    l don't know.
    l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
    That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
    Lt. Philip J. Minns
  • westx211westx211 Member Posts: 42,205 Arc User
    I both liked and disliked the mission. I agree with all of the ops points, burning really despised Burnham being in the mission. Not purely because of a dislike for discovery(I loathe the show as well) but mostly because I hated how her character interacted with everyone else. The fact that she gets Obisek killed because "you can't shoot Hitler that's murder" was so unfathomable stupid I legitimately had to take several minutes to recover and move on. She does this again and again throughout the missions.

    Secondly, there's a specific choice I have problems with, I chose to let Noye stay dead since we killed him in the original mission in STO anyway and Seven points out that without Noye and the Annorax the Temporal Liberation Front will fall apart.(which it did in the original timeline) then when I get out the Excalbians tell me that because Noye died the TLF committed mass genocide and successfully destroyed the homeworld of every species in the alliance? HOW THE TRIBBLE DID THEY MANAGE THAT? I know the choice ultimately have no impact overall, but being told that magically doing what we did before suddenly causes the good guys to lose and be wiped out doesn't make sense and upsets me.

    I didn't like how the Iconian was assimilated either. We've been shown that the iconians made themselves and their tech immune to Borg assimilation before and that atleast techwise, attempting to do so causes massive annihilation. I know there's the excuse that "evil Seven of Nine escaped the simulation" but... how did she manage to do that? And how did she in the span of a few hours manage to figure out how to get around the inability to assimilate iconians? It doesn't make sense.

    And I also felt that for the short period Shan was there with the Enterprise F his voice acting was especially bad. Like... horrifying even. There was so little emotion in his voice for what should have been a very dramatic moment that it almost ruined it.

    Though I do love the new voice actor for Noye. I never cared for the original, he just sounded too whiny.
    Men are not punished for their sins, but by them.
  • jagdtier44jagdtier44 Member Posts: 376 Arc User
    edited January 2020
    While I overall really liked the missions they did have their faults.
    Lincoln I actually didn't mind as I figured as I figured they had adopted Lincoln as a proponent for good from Kirk's era so continued to use him in our era.
    Burnham I honestly didn't mind, I don't like disco at at all and especially dislike her, BUT in sto she did a good job with the voice acting and face it someone had to be the voice of good while seven would be your more pragmatic pitch.
    The combat I didn't have an issue with. .but than again my kit is all maxed out epics..but I still didn't experience any one shots nor did I die in ground or space so I think it's more a ymmv depending on your load out.
    My only real let down was actually when all the hero ships warp in and you get that framed shot of your ship and all them....because I'm Romulan and obviously don't fit in that picture of a purely federation hurrah fleet.. kinda brought back that jarring schism of how this game is very federation in all design aspects that I felt they had done a good job of handling in the beginning with me explaining what romulans where to Burnham.
  • dongemaharudongemaharu Member Posts: 544 Arc User
    "Obisek, don't do it! You're better than that!"

    "Well, if you say s..."

    "ZAP!"

    Yup. That's Star Trek for ya.

    Bad points:

    -Discovery just won't seem to go the TRIBBLE away. Burnham is such a drag of a character.
    -This Seven is a smart TRIBBLE. Relentlessly so. It's just too much. I prefer the STO Seven. I don't know if they exist at the same time or are from different realities or whatever.
    -It didn't seem to matter what choice you made. You still complete the mission with Abe's approval. It's good to argue both choices, but it has no impact on the outcome.

    Good points:

    -You only have to play it once to get all the goodies. No replay several times to complete a set. Nice!
    -The battle at the end was great with all the other Enterprises.
    -I liked the story. I don't know how possible it was, even in Star Trek, it was a good way to get that Excaliban to see things your way. Though the morality kinda gets confusing and arbitrary.....
  • alexanderb#7559 alexanderb Member Posts: 188 Arc User
    I liked it, although it's a bit long, especially when you do the two parts straight after eachother.

    I think they could do some more on the borg part though, it's almost an exact copy of the Hive of Mind ground TFO. Maybe they could have made it more unique, since no borg cube (even the queen diamond) is the same in the series.
  • iamjmphiamjmph Member Posts: 210 Arc User
    I found out the choices are for the accolade. It's supposed to be a choice between Fed and Klingon version of "Good".... I mixed and matched, so go an accolade called "The Best Onfence"....

    I enjoyed the missions for the most part, i might replay them just to get the other accolades. I severely dislike the character of Burnham (hmm i guess since the thread has a spoiler warning... it's mostly because of the whole "I love you captain, I'd follow you to hell.. ohh hey Klingons! KILL THEM! wait, what do you mean NO, Daddy says its the best way... Still no, MUTINY!" thing that I just can't get over.) , and find the idea of HER being the voice of Good to be laughable (she comes off as more self-righteous imo), but I can deal with it i guess...

    I've put to much money into the game to quit now just because the brought in my second least favorite ST char (she ranks just before Nelix) into the game... I dealt with the Ugly Discovery Klingon aesthetics, i'll deal with this...

  • neoakiraiineoakiraii Member Posts: 7,468 Arc User
    I liked it, especially the Avengers last battle with all the hero ships from the shows showing up with the Enterprise F
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  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,950 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.
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  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5 Member Posts: 4,754 Arc User
    Including Lincoln was silly indeed. For most people outside the US (and probably inside the US too) the character has likely zero meaning.

    The battles were not hard at all. Enemies were pretty weak in my opinion (I should add that I play episodes on normal difficulty because there is zero reason to do it on higher difficulties as far as I know).

    Story-wise, the episodes were great, although at times it was hard to understand whether anything that happened, would affect our 'real' world or whether it was all just a simulation.
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5 Member Posts: 4,754 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.

    Get the T3 Omega trait that slows down adaptation ;)
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • evilmark444evilmark444 Member Posts: 6,950 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.

    Get the T3 Omega trait that slows down adaptation ;)

    Adaptation wasn't the issue, was using a Tommy Gun :) There were just so many of them that I couldn't stay alive when they all attacked me at the same time, and Seven and Burnham were useless in that part.
    Lifetime Subscriber since Beta
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  • fleetcaptain5#1134 fleetcaptain5 Member Posts: 4,754 Arc User
    One thing that annoyed me was the limit of only one boff for the away team, in the parts with swarms of borg I found myself constantly dieing cause they all seemed to tunnel me, and then my boff would quickly get killed before they could resuscitate me. If I could bring my full team things would have gone differently I think, maybe I'll try it again later with a medical boff rather than a tactical and see how that goes.

    Get the T3 Omega trait that slows down adaptation ;)

    Adaptation wasn't the issue, was using a Tommy Gun :) There were just so many of them that I couldn't stay alive when they all attacked me at the same time, and Seven and Burnham were useless in that part.

    Oh that never happened to me. I had to keep looking and actively search for enemies.
    [4:46] [Combat {self}] Your Haymaker deals 23337 (9049) Physical Damage(Critical) to Spawnmother

    [3/25 10:41][Combat (Self)]Your Haymaker deals 26187 (10692) Physical Damage(Critical) to Orinoco.
  • burstorionburstorion Member Posts: 1,750 Arc User
    Played the missions all the way through on several drones (sic), taking the different paths

    First of all the Burnham issue - I'm not fond of her or the show but thats by the by - what got me was she acknowledged she knew none of the history yet still tried to exert her own viewpoint - If they had given Obisek or the MC a chance to detail his crimes and she still reacted like that then it'd be far more acceptable

    Heck, they should have given the MC the ability to say something or remained silent on the matter to enforce the idea the MC has an opinion on the matter - after all they had lived through it and the rommies/remans deserved a chance to state their opinion

    On a different note... How in the seven orbs of borejor did Hakeev not be disarmed? If it had been a concealed weapon I'd accept it (like a borg nanoprobe tubule 'dagger') but a great big compression pistol behind his back?!?

    As an aside...why if its a simulacrum wasn't Hakeev deactivated after the trial ended instead of marching them (somehow) down a ship coridoor? I would have had the static hakeev left where it was and the borg simply takes it

    The Noye trial I had little to complain about - it was pretty much as I expected and at least this time Burnham had a reason to react as the event happened so she had a reason to pose her choice - although my god cryptic, brutal murder much? I think thats the first time you've offed someone in a bloody manner...but I'll admit I let the murder stand for most runs for cathartic reasons

    Now we come to the dsc portion

    First of all... you really ought to have had more explanation - for dsc I'm presuming this is a major event but for those not into it...there was zero context - Unlike the last two trials it had NO content to do with the game world (may I remind you this is supposed to be a review of the game history mind) - there was no past episodes or content to do with it nor control

    This basically meant the dsc portion had no meaning in the game sense - only if you knew the lore did it have any context or meaning unlike all other evens in the FEs - The MC has zero stake in the result from a 'relieving past events' angle. Personally I would have retread the dsc content we had, maybe the choice being to save Patel or let her do as she did - which would have had extra poignancy for Burnham

    Luckily I could happily follow the commands and so not knowing was not too much of an issue

    The boss battle was fun although the control blob was a -tad- similar to the founders, ect. Simple and not staying too long, I will admit it was clever to introduce the borg crowd control power via control - which set my alarm bells ringing (I read the patch notes)

    On an aside, I love the new seven and my next question has to be - when do we get her guns?

    Before I wrap up part one...I am not going to complain about the summaries by Rocky - they simply showed no matter what option you took someone was going to be hurt, the test being wether you could live with what you did

  • burstorionburstorion Member Posts: 1,750 Arc User
    Now for part two

    I loved the redesign of Iconia, short as it was - I'm still not sure how Burnham knew about Iconians (I may be wrong but I don't think pre tng had any contact with them) but anyway... The combat was suitably against the odds (although random mortars were pretty lame...really it should have been orbital blasts to match T'kets words)

    Then we came to the T'ket battle (pt1) - After the initial suprise (I would have liked reference to the time travel and ancient T'ket being aghast at what they became to be honest) it was a good boss battle that was not infuriating (looking at you, tzenkethi wariior on the space station preventing you from arming the consoles with not enough health to last long enough to do it)

    Then Hackeev appeared.

    Thank you for the nightmare fuel cryptic - Undine borg were bad but assimilated iconians?!?

    That is until we moved on..

    If they had said the assimilation was imperfect then it'd make sense but Assimilated T'ket should have been a lot more involved as a boss - even on adv she folded like paper. I would used her original boss battle as a reference, having to mimic the hive tfo - in this case the nodes being to activate energy discharges to weaken her while Secundus and his entourage try to stop you - Secundus doing his Hakeev thing and transporting away the moment hes shot at until T'ket uses the new borg shield steal gimmick and drain kills Secundus

    From there it was basically cut price hive until the end - no real complaints although I would have liked some more time to get used to the new borg tricks (its amusing me no end several people I know have said the mission was lagging...not realising it was the new nannotubule ability (which amusingly doesn't pin you 100% of the time and instead turns into a bungee cord)

    Fighting Nu7, the beams were a bit of a suprise but nothing too difficult (its a pity we didn't have a Nu'ket/Nu7 double battle to make the battle more epic but all the same it was a good tussle

    Skipping the portal gauntlet as it was just what it was, I'll skip to the space battle


    Expecting something epic I was pleased and dissapointed in equal measure

    First of all by the context I expected the longer I left the battle, the more intresting ships would appear (like the alternate timeline borg considering Secundus) but got none of those (by Khalesses beard, I was hoping the borg update would include them) much to my dissapointment

    As to the battle itself... I would have liked it if the allies appeared after you hit 50% damage to give some urgency - if your firepower was enough to take them all out Nu7 laughs and pulls into being a tfos worth of borg and the boss ships (including the assimilated carrier and Donnie) that fills the area

    I digress however - as it was the battle was great, the nostalgia was wonderful (although the comms chatter would have been better if the battle was more frantic with everyone using the abilities in quick succession)

    One complaint I have is twofold

    1. What happens to all the created ships? If Burnham was allowed to stay why not Kirk, Sisko and company?
    2. Why didn't you play up Nu7, as shes dying she states something like "...you may have stopped me but existance ends...as you know it!" Before someone (Daniels, would be best) mentions before exploding she sent out a wideband temporal databurst to all borg in the area and temooral frame containing the data of the updated borg

    That way it ends explaining overtly why all borg now have that ability and Nu7 basically flipped you and the universe a post humous bird before expiring to cement her villainy

    *****

    All in all, both missions were amazing and worth the time invested. As to the rewards, I don't know if I'll use the modules the axe however... I think I'll have to make a splatterhouse toon for that :3
  • warpangelwarpangel Member Posts: 9,427 Arc User
    burstorion wrote: »
    I'm still not sure how Burnham knew about Iconians
    We told her when they appeared in the first part.
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