You know, two months ago when AoY was announced, in every Thread where appropriate I maintained that this all fell in line to where CBS was going with the new Series. Each Season would be sort of self-contained and jump around to and between various Star Trek Franchise Eras.
We too as Temporal Agents and all that Temporal stuff we were doing could also easily jump around to various Eras to run Missions. Now we have a Yesterday's War Arc that is far from complete.
NO ONE ever took me up on my supposition even to call me an idiot or do the normal Forum things.
And no, you already lost your chance to call me an idiot.
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I don't think the CG is the final cut. I love love LOVE it. Lets start by explaining that the ship design is the same one that they were GOING to initially use for the USS Enterpris- A <- Circa motion picture.... IT's a design from a never produced series called "Planet of the titans", and this confirms the rumors that this series takes place after the TOS but before Picard, in fact, perhaps before/during the Motion picture era.
I believe this show will be more gritty and Battle Star Galacticaesque.
As for the "monstrosity" comment about the Discovery, we all had bad reactions to the U.S.S. Defiant, and Voyager, I personally find the Galaxy class to be my least favorite.
Give the Discovery a chance! I actually had a bad reaction at first to the design but after researching the history of this design, (and remembering it instantly from my Art of Star Trek Book from the 1990's) I am very quickly warming up to her. The elements of the wing/chevron style star drive is reminiscent of the very beginnings of a Galaxy class starship. The ship also looks more utilitarian, and "gritty" which fits the era when Starfleet was moving away from it's minimalist submarine designs of TOS and more in to the Modular design of the late 23rd century/early 24th century!
As for the Asteroid launch, in the original sketches of this Starship class (which I remind you, was originally going to be the Enterprise-A) this asteroid was exactly in the sketches of that ship.
Again, the low quality of CGI and asteroid are all just the first draft of the design to give us a taste of what's to come.
Be open!!! I'm loving this, and loving that a rejected design that's being re-cycled with love.
I think that if you look at the people working on this show, and the utilitarian design of this ship, they are clearly telling us that this series will be character driven! Focus on the content not the frame/exterior.
The Music is also reminiscent of Wrath of Khan battle music.... *I think* this show is going to surprise you, and you'll learn to love and accept this ship the way we did with the Defiant in DS9.... Lets wait until we see what she can do!
Obviously, the overall design is based on the Phase II Enterprise.
There are some hints to when the new series takes place, based on what we have seen in the video.
1) The four digit hull registry number. That places it before the 24th Century.
2) The deflector dish is sunken into the hull, something not seen before The Motion Picture.
3) The font used for the hull markings are in the style of The Original Series.
These all say to me that the new series will be taking place between The Original Series and The Motion Picture.
"I'm not big on telepaths myself. I'm not big on guns either. But if everyone else has them, I want to make sure I can get my hands on the biggest one I can."
Though I find this particular ship to be a bit off for my tastes, I'm willing to let it eventually grow on me if they tell us in the first episode that it's an experimental design and as we progress through the series it's shown that it is not meeting the specs they thought it would.
Having a not so perfect ship as a part of the understory would certainly be something they have never done before.
(I don't really count the Enterprise-B as an example as she was just not finished being put together in "Generations")
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Good on them for using the first canon concept art of the Connie, a great way to pay homage to the designer of the Enterprise.
The first concept design of the Constitution class ship was the model that became the Daedalus design. This ship's design is inspired by the Phase II/Titan design concept, which was for after TOS and prior to TMP.
You know, two months ago when AoY was announced, in every Thread where appropriate I maintained that this all fell in line to where CBS was going with the new Series. Each Season would be sort of self-contained and jump around to and between various Star Trek Franchise Eras.
We too as Temporal Agents and all that Temporal stuff we were doing could also easily jump around to various Eras to run Missions. Now we have a Yesterday's War Arc that is far from complete.
NO ONE ever took me up on my supposition even to call me an idiot or do the normal Forum things.
And no, you already lost your chance to call me an idiot.
Bryan Fuller has said publicly that the show is not an anthology series.
I mean, people even complained about the JJ-Constitution, yet at least it holds true to it's basic shape.
I've read so much hatred and complaining on these forums for the Kelvin Timeline Constitution class design over the past couple of months that I have to take issue with your use of it as a "at least it looks Trek" type of example. Most of the people here hating on this Discovery ship, are the same who felt the Kelvin Timeline ship's design was an abomination and a slap in the face to all true Trek fans.
These posters are continually feeling like official Star Trek shows and movies are slapping their fandom in the face. There must be some big red hand prints on their cheeks by now.
"Finally, after many years, the time has come for us to once again get our Star Trek fix in the form of TRIBBLE.
I mean Star Trek Discovery, duh."
I didn't notice that, very funny, LMFAO.
TRIBBLE: Star Trek Discovery or TRIBBLE: Sexually Transmitted Disease.
DIS, actually. The "Star Trek" part is never used in the acronyms TOS, TAS, TNG, DS9, VOY or ENT.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
... why bother? It's like trying to get people hyped over TNG by portraying the hero ship as a D'Deridex. Some people are going to like the double D. Others are going to like the Galaxy.
As for the "this goes back to designs that never made it into production"... I think that ship has warped off. This ship is a large departure from design aesthetics we have seen on screen. Even Cryptic's own designs follow the more "traditional" ship architecture.
Not an auspicious start at all. Again, I feel the success or failure of this series is going to hang on it's crew.
I mean, people even complained about the JJ-Constitution, yet at least it holds true to it's basic shape.
I've read so much hatred and complaining on these forums for the Kelvin Timeline Constitution class design over the past couple of months that I have to take issue with your use of it as a "at least it looks Trek" type of example. Most of the people here hating on this Discovery ship, are the same who felt the Kelvin Timeline ship's design was an abomination and a slap in the face to all true Trek fans.
These posters are continually feeling like official Star Trek shows and movies are slapping their fandom in the face. There must be some big red hand prints on their cheeks by now.
I hope it's their "lower" cheeks that are marked thusly, I truly dislike the constant whining about it.
I get that they don't care for the design, but the incessant "krap-talk" has become extremely annoying.
(and yes, I am looking at you Crash...)
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
'But to be logical is not to be right', and 'nothing' on God's earth could ever 'make it' right!'
Judge Dan Haywood
'As l speak now, the words are forming in my head.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I mean, people even complained about the JJ-Constitution, yet at least it holds true to it's basic shape.
I've read so much hatred and complaining on these forums for the Kelvin Timeline Constitution class design over the past couple of months that I have to take issue with your use of it as a "at least it looks Trek" type of example. Most of the people here hating on this Discovery ship, are the same who felt the Kelvin Timeline ship's design was an abomination and a slap in the face to all true Trek fans.
These posters are continually feeling like official Star Trek shows and movies are slapping their fandom in the face. There must be some big red hand prints on their cheeks by now.
I hope it's their "lower" cheeks that are marked thusly, I truly dislike the constant whining about it.
I get that they don't care for the design, but the incessant "****-talk" has become extremely annoying.
(and yes, I am looking at you Crash...)
Yeah. I really feel like using the KT Constitution now as an example to defend the look and feel of Trek is really disingenuous.
Also, this Discovery ship looks different. And I want to know why. Which means I want to know a lot more about the show. Maybe we find out exactly why IN the show? In an episode or two. Won't that be exciting?
I mean wow, this is a new Star Trek TV show. With new crews and this is a new ship. I'm excited as heck. I can't wait to find out more about this ship its crew this show and its story.
This is Trek! Real deal Trek! Hating on it seems like the exact opposite of "true" Trek fandom to me anyways. But if it offends a person's personal headcanon, I guess that level of emotional backlash is to be expected.
Why does the new star trek TV ship have a cloaking device ?
( you can heard it is cloaking near the end of the latest clip ,
no visible evidences have been discovered by klingon intelligence yet cough cough lol )
"This is outragous!"
"The Klingon Empire demands explanation !"
"Fed scum building battlecruisers with cloaking device at a secret shipyard !"
"Finally, after many years, the time has come for us to once again get our Star Trek fix in the form of TRIBBLE.
I mean Star Trek Discovery, duh."
I didn't notice that, very funny, LMFAO.
TRIBBLE: Star Trek Discovery or TRIBBLE: Sexually Transmitted Disease.
DIS, actually. The "Star Trek" part is never used in the acronyms TOS, TAS, TNG, DS9, VOY or ENT.
Why did the KT have to be the odd one out
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
I have a answer to that, but the JJFans have put a shock collar on me.
I assume it was your usual reasonably, measured, and well thought out critique?
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though. JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
So the complaint that this is a rough and "shouldn't they have a finalized production quality trailer" ready by August for a show coming out in January is kind of silly. They haven't started principal shooting on the show yet. This is a television series that will be getting shot between September and March, according to the show runner. They still are finalizing cast and the writing team.
So suggesting that this is too close to launch date for them to be releasing a rough CGI teaser, is just ignoring the rest of the context of the show. It's IN production. They can't even show you the uniforms yet or the captain. But the OP complains that this is too rough and too close to launch date to be too rough.
I was hoping that the look of the ship could be explained by some development with the Klingons. But, given the time it will probably be set in, I don't think I should hope for Klingons being part of the Federation in the new series.
Maybe an alliance.
I still think it would have been better to have the new series set after Nemesis. It would have given the writers a lot more freedom (in this setting they cannot have too breaking developments take place since it would be strange never to hear about it during the 'later' series) and it would have been more interesting to see future developments of the Federation, rather than developments that we already know the outcome of.
Whatever the story will be, I hope we'll see a more prominent role of aliens. An Andorian captain with a Vulcan chief engineer and a Tellarite helmsman and maybe one human chef or something Something different than a story about an human crew with a token Vulcan or Klingon.
If they want it to appeal to the populace on the whole (instead of just to TREK fans), it's got to have a mostly human crew with a sprinkling of Aliens added, in order for it to be relatable to the general public.
Also, IF it takes place in the period between ENTERPRISE and TOS, having anything but a mostly human crew would be problematic.
STO Member since February 2009. I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born! Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
I have a answer to that, but the JJFans have put a shock collar on me.
That's what the admiralty did to Mad Kathy after she got Voyager back home... You couldn't see the anklet in Nemesis, because her desk was in the way, but if she went more than a mile from Command or Campus grounds, zzzzzzzzzzzt, she'd be on the floor twitching and needing a clean uniform
I'd love ship designer to decide if its a klingon vessel or fed vessel - ita cannot be both at once >.>
Can't it? I've a feeling that - along with the hybrid look of the design - the fact that they're playing a hybrid of the Klingon theme music that this ship and crew will be a joint exploration mission between the Federation and the Klingon Empire or something. If rumors are true about it taking place after "Star Trek: The Undiscovered Country" and "Star Trek: The Next Generation" are true then it might make some sort of sense.
Also, they've stated that this is early work on the design and something that they've put together specifically for San Diego Comic Con, so I expect the design will change a bit, especially based off of fan reaction. Obviously the CG isn't very polished, and there's a hell of a lot riding on this for CBS, so things are going to look a lot better by the time this hits the airwaves/Internet.
Hopefully they'll be a lot more information coming out at the Las Vegas convention coming up, like the cast and the characters and some information on the story. After all, they have to start shooting soon if they're going to get it done by January.
So I'm holding off on hating things until we see a more.
I'm still excited as hell for a new Star Trek show though.
Has "KT" been used officially? Otherwise it could still be KTL, but it's in any case not elegant. TAR would really work better, but meh.
^ Memory Alpha.org is not canon. It's a open wiki with arbitrary rules. Only what can be cited from an episode is. ^
"No. Men do not roar. Women roar. Then they hurl heavy objects... and claw at you." -Worf, son of Mogh
"A filthy, mangy beast, but in its bony breast beat the heart of a warrior" - "faithful" (...) "but ever-ready to follow the call of the wild." - Martok, about a Targ
"That pig smelled horrid. A sweet-sour, extremely pungent odor. I showered and showered, and it took me a week to get rid of it!" - Robert Justman, appreciating Emmy-Lou
I'd love ship designer to decide if its a klingon vessel or fed vessel - ita cannot be both at once >.>
Can't it? I've a feeling that - along with the hybrid look of the design - the fact that they're playing a hybrid of the Klingon theme music that this ship and crew will be a joint exploration mission between the Federation and the Klingon Empire or something. If rumors are true about it taking place after "Star Trek: The Undiscovered Country" and "Star Trek: The Next Generation" are true then it might make some sort of sense.
Also, they've stated that this is early work on the design and something that they've put together specifically for San Diego Comic Con, so I expect the design will change a bit, especially based off of fan reaction. Obviously the CG isn't very polished, and there's a hell of a lot riding on this for CBS, so things are going to look a lot better by the time this hits the airwaves/Internet.
Hopefully they'll be a lot more information coming out at the Las Vegas convention coming up, like the cast and the characters and some information on the story. After all, they have to start shooting soon if they're going to get it done by January.
So I'm holding off on hating things until we see a more.
I'm still excited as hell for a new Star Trek show though.
Well, if they plan on making changes they can start by deleting that secondary hull and going back to the drawing board.
Comments
We too as Temporal Agents and all that Temporal stuff we were doing could also easily jump around to various Eras to run Missions. Now we have a Yesterday's War Arc that is far from complete.
NO ONE ever took me up on my supposition even to call me an idiot or do the normal Forum things.
And no, you already lost your chance to call me an idiot.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
I believe this show will be more gritty and Battle Star Galacticaesque.
As for the "monstrosity" comment about the Discovery, we all had bad reactions to the U.S.S. Defiant, and Voyager, I personally find the Galaxy class to be my least favorite.
Give the Discovery a chance! I actually had a bad reaction at first to the design but after researching the history of this design, (and remembering it instantly from my Art of Star Trek Book from the 1990's) I am very quickly warming up to her. The elements of the wing/chevron style star drive is reminiscent of the very beginnings of a Galaxy class starship. The ship also looks more utilitarian, and "gritty" which fits the era when Starfleet was moving away from it's minimalist submarine designs of TOS and more in to the Modular design of the late 23rd century/early 24th century!
As for the Asteroid launch, in the original sketches of this Starship class (which I remind you, was originally going to be the Enterprise-A) this asteroid was exactly in the sketches of that ship.
Again, the low quality of CGI and asteroid are all just the first draft of the design to give us a taste of what's to come.
Be open!!! I'm loving this, and loving that a rejected design that's being re-cycled with love.
I think that if you look at the people working on this show, and the utilitarian design of this ship, they are clearly telling us that this series will be character driven! Focus on the content not the frame/exterior.
The Music is also reminiscent of Wrath of Khan battle music.... *I think* this show is going to surprise you, and you'll learn to love and accept this ship the way we did with the Defiant in DS9.... Lets wait until we see what she can do!
There are some hints to when the new series takes place, based on what we have seen in the video.
1) The four digit hull registry number. That places it before the 24th Century.
2) The deflector dish is sunken into the hull, something not seen before The Motion Picture.
3) The font used for the hull markings are in the style of The Original Series.
These all say to me that the new series will be taking place between The Original Series and The Motion Picture.
Having a not so perfect ship as a part of the understory would certainly be something they have never done before.
(I don't really count the Enterprise-B as an example as she was just not finished being put together in "Generations")
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
The first concept design of the Constitution class ship was the model that became the Daedalus design. This ship's design is inspired by the Phase II/Titan design concept, which was for after TOS and prior to TMP.
Bryan Fuller has said publicly that the show is not an anthology series.
I've read so much hatred and complaining on these forums for the Kelvin Timeline Constitution class design over the past couple of months that I have to take issue with your use of it as a "at least it looks Trek" type of example. Most of the people here hating on this Discovery ship, are the same who felt the Kelvin Timeline ship's design was an abomination and a slap in the face to all true Trek fans.
These posters are continually feeling like official Star Trek shows and movies are slapping their fandom in the face. There must be some big red hand prints on their cheeks by now.
DIS, actually. The "Star Trek" part is never used in the acronyms TOS, TAS, TNG, DS9, VOY or ENT.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
... why bother? It's like trying to get people hyped over TNG by portraying the hero ship as a D'Deridex. Some people are going to like the double D. Others are going to like the Galaxy.
As for the "this goes back to designs that never made it into production"... I think that ship has warped off. This ship is a large departure from design aesthetics we have seen on screen. Even Cryptic's own designs follow the more "traditional" ship architecture.
Not an auspicious start at all. Again, I feel the success or failure of this series is going to hang on it's crew.
I hope it's their "lower" cheeks that are marked thusly, I truly dislike the constant whining about it.
I get that they don't care for the design, but the incessant "krap-talk" has become extremely annoying.
(and yes, I am looking at you Crash...)
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
http://www.slashfilm.com/new-star-trek-tv-series-details/
I see now that by June he said no.
l don't know.
l really don't know what l'm about to say, except l have a feeling about it.
That l must repeat the words that come without my knowledge.'
Yeah. I really feel like using the KT Constitution now as an example to defend the look and feel of Trek is really disingenuous.
Also, this Discovery ship looks different. And I want to know why. Which means I want to know a lot more about the show. Maybe we find out exactly why IN the show? In an episode or two. Won't that be exciting?
I mean wow, this is a new Star Trek TV show. With new crews and this is a new ship. I'm excited as heck. I can't wait to find out more about this ship its crew this show and its story.
This is Trek! Real deal Trek! Hating on it seems like the exact opposite of "true" Trek fandom to me anyways. But if it offends a person's personal headcanon, I guess that level of emotional backlash is to be expected.
( you can heard it is cloaking near the end of the latest clip ,
no visible evidences have been discovered by klingon intelligence yet cough cough lol )
"This is outragous!"
"The Klingon Empire demands explanation !"
"Fed scum building battlecruisers with cloaking device at a secret shipyard !"
( all the klingon warriors are pissed! )
ok everyone go listen to the cloaking sound now
ssssssssh be quiet !
listen... it is cloaking again....
Why did the KT have to be the odd one out
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
I assume it was your usual reasonably, measured, and well thought out critique?
Norway and Yeager dammit... I still want my Typhoon and Jupiter though.
JJ Trek The Kelvin Timeline is just Trek and it's fully canon... get over it. But I still prefer TAR.
#TASforSTO
'...I can tell you that we're not in the military and that we intend no harm to the whales.' Kirk: The Voyage Home
'Starfleet is not a military organisation. Its purpose is exploration.' Picard: Peak Performance
'This is clearly a military operation. Is that what we are now? Because I thought we were explorers!' Scotty: Into Darkness
'...The Federation. Starfleet. We're not a military agency.' Scotty: Beyond
'I'm not a soldier anymore. I'm an engineer.' Miles O'Brien: Empok Nor
'...Starfleet could use you... It's a peacekeeping and humanitarian armada...' Admiral Pike: Star Trek
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
So suggesting that this is too close to launch date for them to be releasing a rough CGI teaser, is just ignoring the rest of the context of the show. It's IN production. They can't even show you the uniforms yet or the captain. But the OP complains that this is too rough and too close to launch date to be too rough.
Maybe an alliance.
I still think it would have been better to have the new series set after Nemesis. It would have given the writers a lot more freedom (in this setting they cannot have too breaking developments take place since it would be strange never to hear about it during the 'later' series) and it would have been more interesting to see future developments of the Federation, rather than developments that we already know the outcome of.
Whatever the story will be, I hope we'll see a more prominent role of aliens. An Andorian captain with a Vulcan chief engineer and a Tellarite helmsman and maybe one human chef or something
Also, IF it takes place in the period between ENTERPRISE and TOS, having anything but a mostly human crew would be problematic.
I Was A Trekkie Before It Was Cool ... Sept. 8th, 1966 ... Not To Mention Before Most Folks Around Here Were Born!
Forever a STO Veteran-Minion
Can't it? I've a feeling that - along with the hybrid look of the design - the fact that they're playing a hybrid of the Klingon theme music that this ship and crew will be a joint exploration mission between the Federation and the Klingon Empire or something. If rumors are true about it taking place after "Star Trek: The Undiscovered Country" and "Star Trek: The Next Generation" are true then it might make some sort of sense.
Also, they've stated that this is early work on the design and something that they've put together specifically for San Diego Comic Con, so I expect the design will change a bit, especially based off of fan reaction. Obviously the CG isn't very polished, and there's a hell of a lot riding on this for CBS, so things are going to look a lot better by the time this hits the airwaves/Internet.
Hopefully they'll be a lot more information coming out at the Las Vegas convention coming up, like the cast and the characters and some information on the story. After all, they have to start shooting soon if they're going to get it done by January.
So I'm holding off on hating things until we see a more.
I'm still excited as hell for a new Star Trek show though.
Has "KT" been used officially? Otherwise it could still be KTL, but it's in any case not elegant. TAR would really work better, but meh.
Get the Forums Enhancement Extension!
Well, if they plan on making changes they can start by deleting that secondary hull and going back to the drawing board.