As you refer to it as a "cheese" skill, I'm assuming you're a PVPer who was pissed at being on the receiving end of an ability that's way OP in PVP while being a reasonable skill in PVE. Does this mean the skill is a mistake and should be removed/neutered? No, it means it's a skill that needed adjustment in how it affected players. Also, it was meant to not have such a terrible effect on players, but that failsafe wasn't functioning... yet they have *double* fixed it into near uselessness instead of JUST fixing it. Why cheer for double stupidity?
PVP it's impossible for large ships to avoid. All I fly is large ships. Again, the skill should have never existed... It's why I'm cheering. If it's useless, people wont use it, and it will be like it don't exist. Exactly what I wanted. Enough disables and holds in this game already. Insane to keep adding more. PVE is easy, it's why I normally don't pay strong attention to PVE players.
Their problems are no problems for PVP players. It's just how it is. PVE is mostly a cakewalk to PVP players. We don't rely on broken skills for PVE, just pure firepower...
Honestly all this crazy cheese being added to the game is just to annoy PVP players. PVE isn't that hard, and most added cheese don't even affect NPC's anyway-- Just players. (that's the joke).
The dress is gold and white. Over 70% people says so. When viewed from a certain screen angle it appears blue and black. The dress displayed on amazon is a blue and black dress, but it's not the same dress in the picture. If you're seeing blue & black you're slightly colored blind. A normal upright screen = white and gold.
There is no worthwhile use for Ionic anywhere in PVE, this ability is completely PVP based. So the change is good, as it was rather over the top since it was introduced.
If you enjoy the damage debuff, then obviously you have other means of control first.
What dink uses Ionic Turbulence for debuffs without other CC like EWP or particle emission clouds?
If it can't miss stationary targets, make the targets stationary first.
Why would I have other means of crowd control first? Ionic turbulence in it's present form doesn't miss, I don't have to crowd control things first simply to hit them with it as I anticipate we all shall have to once this patch goes live.
PVP it's impossible for large ships to avoid. All I fly is large ships. Again, the skill should have never existed... It's why I'm cheering. If it's useless, people wont use it, and it will be like it don't exist. Exactly what I wanted. Enough disables and holds in this game already. Insane to keep adding more. PVE is easy, it's why I normally don't pay strong attention to PVE players.
Their problems are no problems for PVP players. It's just how it is. PVE is mostly a cakewalk to PVP players. We don't rely on broken skills for PVE, just pure firepower...
Honestly all this crazy cheese being added to the game is just to annoy PVP players. PVE isn't that hard, and most added cheese don't even affect NPC's anyway-- Just players. (that's the joke).
That doesn't mean the skill should have never existed, perhaps it simply shouldn't have been made uncleanseable. For all those holds and disables, there's a handful of easy powers that pretty much make one shrug them off 50-100% of the time. If anything, the disables and holds are far too situational, and far too easily countered.
I feel that the holds and disables shouldn't be binary, they currently either work or don't work. For the longest time, tractor beam did not "slow" it either stopped you or had no effect. More recently they've made it so it actually can slow one to a crawl rather than the stop/go binary effect, but I believe that there should be more of a gradient of, for example, if one gets caught in warp plasma, hazard emitters significantly reduces the effect of it on you and perhaps makes it clear sooner, but isn't an instant "haha, nope."
The strange thing is, as someone who only fly's large ships, you should be thrilled with effective CC since those skills were relegated to the large engineering/science ships. I imagine you aren't thrilled because ironically, those CC's are only really effective on the slow hulks that already have a hard time getting around when they should actually be most effective on the tiny little ships zipping around entirely unaffected by the abilities.
I do not disagree with you that PVE is generally a cake walk, the only time it's not a cake walk is when the devs put in artificial difficulty of bloated NPC HP pools and instakill borg lances if you aren't parked where they told you to park.
I personally would be thrilled if the game were rebalanced so that PVE wasn't a heap of cannon fodder ships that barely use skills and are just meat bags to be beaten upon until they explode. I would welcome PVE and PVP being far more closely related so that we did not need separate rules for each.
The "cheese" skills add flavor to a game that is otherwise just pure DPS. The devs don't add these skills just to annoy PVP players, in fact, I can pretty much guarantee the reason you, and frankly I, have such a problem with "Cheese" skills is that the devs didn't give PVP a first thought, let alone a second before tossing the skill into the game. And yes, the devs have a disturbing tendency to make these flavorful skill "okay" to "meh" in PVE while being absolutely game breaking in PVP. Does that mean the skills should be removed/should never have exited? No. It means the skills should have been better thought out and better implemented. And once again, this particular skill you are so pissed at, isn't even working the way it's supposed to so judging it based on how it malfunctions is illogical.
There is no worthwhile use for Ionic anywhere in PVE, this ability is completely PVP based. So the change is good, as it was rather over the top since it was introduced.
The skill totally has use in PVE, I can cast it on a gate that's not going anywhere anyway and debuff it which helps the whole team kill it faster. I can cast it on enemies heading for a target I'm supposed to keep them from and pretty much stop them in their tracks, PLUS kill them easier cause of the debuff. What I'd like an example of is a way in which ionic turbulence has no use... it can't heal an ally... there's that.
All you pvper's are just popping in here to support the change cause you've had such trouble being the targets of the BROKEN version of the skill. We have yet to have a single PVE'er pop in here to be like "yeah, ionic turbulence was too great in PVE, it needed a nerf, that TRIBBLE was OP."
And is it even registering with ya'll that your experience in PVP with ionic turbulence has been with the skill's fail safes to prevent abuse not working?
And has it occurred to you that an appropriate solution to this inescapable skill might be allowing hazards or some other skill to cleanse it rather than nerfing it into the ground so it actually does have nearly no use in PVE and ABSOLUTELY no use in PVP?
Actually the fix is exactly what ONLY PVPers have been asking for. I have not seen anything anywhere about PVEers being like "Hey, this skill actually hits the target, could you make it miss more? like... WAY more please? Thanks." And, AGAIN, the vast majority of the player base are not PVPers, so TRIBBLE the larger game for poor implementation on the PVP side is ridiculous. And... AGAIN, it was not even working the way it was supposed to on the PVP side so... lol.
Bwaaa bwaaa I can't skillessly use Ionic anymore, my ship is doomed, TRIBBLE the PvPers I'm so gonna die now!
Bwaaa bwaaa I can't skillessly use Ionic anymore, my ship is doomed, TRIBBLE the PvPers I'm so gonna die now!
God forbid one skill behave under the same rules of auto-hitting to-be-resisted as Spread/GW/Tractor/Tachyon/FOMM/Subnuc/Scramble/Aceton/FBP/Siphon.......
In my opinion Op is right.Before Ionic was a good way to stop/harass/control a sci you playing a tac char.
Btw in this thread most people who are happy with ionic nerfs are sci.(at least ones I know their handle from PVP)
To be fully understand I play PVP only as kdf-reman and I have a tac char
(my other kdf alts were not and will not be upgraded so no PVP for them now or in near future).
I have stopped using ionic some time ago (~month or so) because I noticed that it was ineffective against 2-3 tac chars I always met in arena and almost always had to fight them.All are/were playing tac chars.
How they could avoid/counter ionic turbulence III I don't know but since I couldn't use it against them effectively I switched to other more productive ways to counter them .
In this moment I haven't used ionic for more than a month so I think that I can speak without having anything to gain or loose about this subject.
To be very honest before while using ionic I noticed how good was against sci chars and I liked it for that.
Ionic iii on a Sci that GWIII+tractor beam+danubed me as a tac . while rotating 2 FPBS and some even using TS3+neutronic torpedo ? For me it was justice.
Well it was fun while it lasted and we all know what happens with fun in this game no ? )
"There already is a Borg faction, its called the Federation. They assimilate everyone else's technology and remove any biological or technical distinctiveness and add it to their own."
I refuse to be content https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U
Quite a few people have become over-reliant on broken abilities or broken game mechanics. I've been in Kerrat and everyone is using Neutronic Torps, Enhanced Armor Penetration, Ionic Turbulence and (hopefully next for the nerf) Surgical Strikes 3.
You folks are using these broken things as a crutch. If you can't kill someone without these abilities then maybe you're not the awesome player you think you are.
you guys just want to make it easy for your pro beam-run @ pvp , next time you will want GW nerfed , after that , all other debuffs , you have years of pvp , but you have no ideea about game-playing . The elite pvp , and elite dps comunity are nothing but mediocre players , that exploits bugs . And as soon as you fail , you come and cry here .
Quite a few people have become over-reliant on broken abilities or broken game mechanics. I've been in Kerrat and everyone is using Neutronic Torps, Enhanced Armor Penetration, Ionic Turbulence and (hopefully next for the nerf) Surgical Strikes 3.
You folks are using these broken things as a crutch. If you can't kill someone without these abilities then maybe you're not the awesome player you think you are.
My Faeht cant dogfight with a T5u escort because it has no comparable hull ,not enough ENG stations.Intel Powers compensated in a way or other so I could have a enjoyable experience in PVP as it was.
Well if Intel powers will all be nerfed then logically all T6 intel ships should be buffed because there were launched to be used with that broken stuff and now without any effective Intel powers will be made almost useless.
That won't happen of course because they are already paid and if they are made obsolete by nerfing each intel power one by one from month to month then logically people will have to buy next broken OP stuff .... or come back to old builds and T5U ships.
( Again I havent PVP-ed in STO for some time now due to no queue's popping and me logging less,so if they nerf all T6 intel ships then it is not very important for me personally I will use another ship.In fact I am flying the free Kobali cruiser now. )
"There already is a Borg faction, its called the Federation. They assimilate everyone else's technology and remove any biological or technical distinctiveness and add it to their own."
I refuse to be content https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U
Virus said it all. Aimbot mechanic of Ionic turbulence combined with chain viral combined with UI lag was a certain 10-15 sec of "everybody to escape pods" "defiant is being destroyed by breen moment" and in PvE it didn't do much anyway compared to what you can do to borg and undine with other stuff.
If you're afraid you'll miss ISA Gateway now then lol.
I'm with the OP on this: a very bad nerf. PvP-ers whined about the disable. Fine, remove or shorten the disable. But now IT is no longer chasing the target, making IT a rather useless ability again, as spheres, and Undine ships, and what not, tend to move fast. Even mines have the decency to chase a nearby foe!
IT was also one of the few useful Intel abilites available at Lt. level. Sigh.
Quite a few people have become over-reliant on broken abilities or broken game mechanics. I've been in Kerrat and everyone is using Neutronic Torps, Enhanced Armor Penetration, Ionic Turbulence and (hopefully next for the nerf) Surgical Strikes 3.
You folks are using these broken things as a crutch. If you can't kill someone without these abilities then maybe you're not the awesome player you think you are.
Your argument is hopelessly self-defeating: nerf anything good, and then you'll just have a next set of things people will be using; and you'll cry for a nerf of those again. Etc.
Also, stop with the lame saying that using any good ability is using a 'crutch', whereas what you really mean is: 'Everything that can kill me needs to be nerfed, otherwise I'm not as awesome as I thought I was!'
So much good QQ about this bug fix... Let the tears flow...
Keep up the good work Cryptic. I might even change my sig.
Surgical strikes 3 is next
Fix all the cheese. Leave nothing but skill. I have faith now.
The dress is gold and white. Over 70% people says so. When viewed from a certain screen angle it appears blue and black. The dress displayed on amazon is a blue and black dress, but it's not the same dress in the picture. If you're seeing blue & black you're slightly colored blind. A normal upright screen = white and gold.
So much good QQ about this bug fix... Let the tears flow...
Keep up the good work Cryptic. I might even change my sig.
Surgical strikes 3 is next
Fix all the cheese. Leave nothing but skill. I have faith now.
Skill in your opinion is full speed , autoatack . Smart. Btw gravity well is OP , tbr , tractor beam, tyken rift , all broken skill , overpowered , they need a nerf , let the true skills rule again.
Hey look, a PvEr! Do a favour to the community, quit.
Before you do, I challenge you in 1v1 escort PvP T5U maximum class. Accept or bust.
People like you are what keeps me entertained. Think you're high enough with your ship when only thing you can do is killing mindless NPCs.
Hey look, another sociopath PvP-er smelling blood. Yup, Bort did you a solid today: you whined, you won. And that is about the only victory you'll ever taste. It's not like you could, I dunno, adapt, and use, say, a FBP or anything to defend yourself against stuff you deem OP . Nope, you like your victories the easy way: just cry for a nerf, and get your whiny way.
Hey look, another sociopath PvP-er smelling blood. Yup, Bort did you a solid today: you whined, you won. And that is about the only victory you'll ever taste. It's not like you could, I dunno, adapt, and use, say, a FBP or anything to defend yourself against stuff you deem OP . Nope, you like your victories the easy way: just cry for a nerf, and get your whiny way.
Comments
PVP it's impossible for large ships to avoid. All I fly is large ships. Again, the skill should have never existed... It's why I'm cheering. If it's useless, people wont use it, and it will be like it don't exist. Exactly what I wanted. Enough disables and holds in this game already. Insane to keep adding more. PVE is easy, it's why I normally don't pay strong attention to PVE players.
Their problems are no problems for PVP players. It's just how it is. PVE is mostly a cakewalk to PVP players. We don't rely on broken skills for PVE, just pure firepower...
Honestly all this crazy cheese being added to the game is just to annoy PVP players. PVE isn't that hard, and most added cheese don't even affect NPC's anyway-- Just players. (that's the joke).
Why would I have other means of crowd control first? Ionic turbulence in it's present form doesn't miss, I don't have to crowd control things first simply to hit them with it as I anticipate we all shall have to once this patch goes live.
That doesn't mean the skill should have never existed, perhaps it simply shouldn't have been made uncleanseable. For all those holds and disables, there's a handful of easy powers that pretty much make one shrug them off 50-100% of the time. If anything, the disables and holds are far too situational, and far too easily countered.
I feel that the holds and disables shouldn't be binary, they currently either work or don't work. For the longest time, tractor beam did not "slow" it either stopped you or had no effect. More recently they've made it so it actually can slow one to a crawl rather than the stop/go binary effect, but I believe that there should be more of a gradient of, for example, if one gets caught in warp plasma, hazard emitters significantly reduces the effect of it on you and perhaps makes it clear sooner, but isn't an instant "haha, nope."
The strange thing is, as someone who only fly's large ships, you should be thrilled with effective CC since those skills were relegated to the large engineering/science ships. I imagine you aren't thrilled because ironically, those CC's are only really effective on the slow hulks that already have a hard time getting around when they should actually be most effective on the tiny little ships zipping around entirely unaffected by the abilities.
I do not disagree with you that PVE is generally a cake walk, the only time it's not a cake walk is when the devs put in artificial difficulty of bloated NPC HP pools and instakill borg lances if you aren't parked where they told you to park.
I personally would be thrilled if the game were rebalanced so that PVE wasn't a heap of cannon fodder ships that barely use skills and are just meat bags to be beaten upon until they explode. I would welcome PVE and PVP being far more closely related so that we did not need separate rules for each.
The "cheese" skills add flavor to a game that is otherwise just pure DPS. The devs don't add these skills just to annoy PVP players, in fact, I can pretty much guarantee the reason you, and frankly I, have such a problem with "Cheese" skills is that the devs didn't give PVP a first thought, let alone a second before tossing the skill into the game. And yes, the devs have a disturbing tendency to make these flavorful skill "okay" to "meh" in PVE while being absolutely game breaking in PVP. Does that mean the skills should be removed/should never have exited? No. It means the skills should have been better thought out and better implemented. And once again, this particular skill you are so pissed at, isn't even working the way it's supposed to so judging it based on how it malfunctions is illogical.
The skill totally has use in PVE, I can cast it on a gate that's not going anywhere anyway and debuff it which helps the whole team kill it faster. I can cast it on enemies heading for a target I'm supposed to keep them from and pretty much stop them in their tracks, PLUS kill them easier cause of the debuff. What I'd like an example of is a way in which ionic turbulence has no use... it can't heal an ally... there's that.
All you pvper's are just popping in here to support the change cause you've had such trouble being the targets of the BROKEN version of the skill. We have yet to have a single PVE'er pop in here to be like "yeah, ionic turbulence was too great in PVE, it needed a nerf, that TRIBBLE was OP."
And is it even registering with ya'll that your experience in PVP with ionic turbulence has been with the skill's fail safes to prevent abuse not working?
And has it occurred to you that an appropriate solution to this inescapable skill might be allowing hazards or some other skill to cleanse it rather than nerfing it into the ground so it actually does have nearly no use in PVE and ABSOLUTELY no use in PVP?
So basically this is a thread complaining about a bug fix. Nice.
Free Tibet!
Bwaaa bwaaa I can't skillessly use Ionic anymore, my ship is doomed, TRIBBLE the PvPers I'm so gonna die now!
Useless for PvE though.
God forbid one skill behave under the same rules of auto-hitting to-be-resisted as Spread/GW/Tractor/Tachyon/FOMM/Subnuc/Scramble/Aceton/FBP/Siphon.......
Bah, who needs consistency?
Btw in this thread most people who are happy with ionic nerfs are sci.(at least ones I know their handle from PVP)
To be fully understand I play PVP only as kdf-reman and I have a tac char
(my other kdf alts were not and will not be upgraded so no PVP for them now or in near future).
I have stopped using ionic some time ago (~month or so) because I noticed that it was ineffective against 2-3 tac chars I always met in arena and almost always had to fight them.All are/were playing tac chars.
How they could avoid/counter ionic turbulence III I don't know but since I couldn't use it against them effectively I switched to other more productive ways to counter them
In this moment I haven't used ionic for more than a month so I think that I can speak without having anything to gain or loose about this subject.
To be very honest before while using ionic I noticed how good was against sci chars and I liked it for that.
Ionic iii on a Sci that GWIII+tractor beam+danubed me as a tac . while rotating 2 FPBS and some even using TS3+neutronic torpedo ? For me it was justice.
Well it was fun while it lasted and we all know what happens with fun in this game no ?
I refuse to be content https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U
You may have a T6 BoP now pat.
Quite a few people have become over-reliant on broken abilities or broken game mechanics. I've been in Kerrat and everyone is using Neutronic Torps, Enhanced Armor Penetration, Ionic Turbulence and (hopefully next for the nerf) Surgical Strikes 3.
You folks are using these broken things as a crutch. If you can't kill someone without these abilities then maybe you're not the awesome player you think you are.
Free Tibet!
My Faeht cant dogfight with a T5u escort because it has no comparable hull ,not enough ENG stations.Intel Powers compensated in a way or other so I could have a enjoyable experience in PVP as it was.
Well if Intel powers will all be nerfed then logically all T6 intel ships should be buffed because there were launched to be used with that broken stuff and now without any effective Intel powers will be made almost useless.
That won't happen of course because they are already paid and if they are made obsolete by nerfing each intel power one by one from month to month then logically people will have to buy next broken OP stuff .... or come back to old builds and T5U ships.
( Again I havent PVP-ed in STO for some time now due to no queue's popping and me logging less,so if they nerf all T6 intel ships then it is not very important for me personally I will use another ship.In fact I am flying the free Kobali cruiser now. )
I refuse to be content https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwI0u9L4R8U
If you're afraid you'll miss ISA Gateway now then lol.
Super SpecialStar Trek Online Review
SpecialTemporal PUG 100K DPS Build
We are Travelers
IT was also one of the few useful Intel abilites available at Lt. level. Sigh.
Know what's sad? I've tried to do a Ramming Speed on a Gateway and missed. I mean...wtf? I'd had it happen with Cubes, but on a Gateway? Man oh man...
Your argument is hopelessly self-defeating: nerf anything good, and then you'll just have a next set of things people will be using; and you'll cry for a nerf of those again. Etc.
Also, stop with the lame saying that using any good ability is using a 'crutch', whereas what you really mean is: 'Everything that can kill me needs to be nerfed, otherwise I'm not as awesome as I thought I was!'
ohh intelligent , pro,player , can you please-please tell me whats broken at SS 3 ?? Q,Q maybe im to idiot to figure it ...
This is why PvP-whiners should never get a say in anything. If it were up to me, I'd ban you all.
Keep up the good work Cryptic. I might even change my sig.
Surgical strikes 3 is next
Fix all the cheese. Leave nothing but skill. I have faith now.
Hey look, a PvEr! Do a favour to the community, quit.
Before you do, I challenge you in 1v1 escort PvP T5U maximum class. Accept or bust.
People like you are what keeps me entertained. Think you're high enough with your ship when only thing you can do is killing mindless NPCs.
Skill in your opinion is full speed , autoatack . Smart. Btw gravity well is OP , tbr , tractor beam, tyken rift , all broken skill , overpowered , they need a nerf , let the true skills rule again.
Hey look, another sociopath PvP-er smelling blood. Yup, Bort did you a solid today: you whined, you won. And that is about the only victory you'll ever taste. It's not like you could, I dunno, adapt, and use, say, a FBP or anything to defend yourself against stuff you deem OP . Nope, you like your victories the easy way: just cry for a nerf, and get your whiny way.
You still haven't answered me.
1v1 me Escort vs Escort, T5U old style stuff.
Afraid to get rekt?
As you so astutely pointed out yourself, I'm a PvE-er, remember?! The answer should be self-evident. Consider it an IQ-threshold, if you will.