You can choose to assume that or not. It doesn't change the fact that even if the people running the game "made a mistake", they can still make anything they want an exploit.
That's exactly when we get into "The Emperor's New Clothes" territory. You can argue that grass is purple not green until your are blue in the face, you can highlight that in the Terms and Conditions (which recently were labelled worthless in a US court) of whatever service agreement you like, it doesn't change the reality. The reality is that despite the claims of D'Angelo and now Geko that the players were exploiting, it was the dev's bug (which Geko also admitted in the podcast for P1 200) that was responsible and therefore they were responsible. To later claim that it was the players fault, which Geko did later was insulting.
Amusingly the part in the podcast when he claims that the change was scary or different and that people wouldn't be used to it is actually hilarious. I've played MMO's for years, I've played games for decades now, I've modded games and fixed games and added stuff to games. It's not in the least bit scary to deal with an update that adds 10 levels. It's not problematic until you hit that first XP wall at level 52. Then you go do a patrol and you see the miniscule increase in XP and you realise what they have done. The dawning of that realisation is like a hammer to the face.
First you sit there in disbelief. Then you look for an alternative way to get XP as you can see that 100 runs will be the minimum you'll see of Argala to get to 60. You check out the STF's, they are empty, odd considering normally they're full but you ignore that and expect everyone is just testing out the new area. You run a normal STF and find it's got far less progress than the Patrol you just did...
You head back to known territory, the hunting grounds of Tau Dewa, find a few people and run a patrol (just like that pop up back in the DQ told you to do) and suddenly you gain a few bars of XP. It's not excessive but it's progression at a pace you can recognise. Something that isn't measured in pixels but on a ruler.
That's how things run. That's the response most people have. It's not out of order, it's not wrong, it's just incorrect of the Lead Dev to think he got the balance right when he so clearly hasn't got a clue about it. The podcast only makes that clearer with each word uttered.
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
And there i thought that devs are slowly coming to their senses. I guess i was wrong and we are back to square one. Yeah why would they listen to a bunch of exploiters when they have released such a sucessful expansion that players love sooo much. I can't even say something constructive anymore. Everything is already said and it's time for devs to make a move now and judging by that podcast their move is gonna be made in a very wrong direction.
That's exactly when we get into "The Emperor's New Clothes" territory. You can argue that grass is purple not green until your are blue in the face, you can highlight that in the Terms and Conditions (which recently were labelled worthless in a US court) of whatever service agreement you like, it doesn't change the reality. The reality is that despite the claims of D'Angelo and now Geko that the players were exploiting, it was the dev's bug (which Geko also admitted in the podcast for P1 200) that was responsible and therefore they were responsible. To later claim that it was the players fault, which Geko did later was insulting.
I guess it could be done, hell what's one more frivolous court matter in the country that coined the term
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
Well congratz on the 200 Episode, I normally don't listen to podcast but I figured I'd give this a whirl because of the mil-stone and all.
I didn't listen to all it, maybe about 1/2 of it. One thing that caught my eye(ear) of among many other thing is what Geko said that the queues weren't displaying the proper numbers showing how many are queued up or playing. I'm just wondering, supposedly now that's fixed, has anyone noticed the difference or if there are now much more players showing up on the queue chart?
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
The number that was bugged was the people in the queue waiting. The actual number in current games was correct and still is. I never quantified the waiting in queue numbers as they were never accurately representative. The actual number of currently running games however is pretty easy to see and determine. The MU Event highlighted it nicely when compared to the prior CC Event. Numbers of active games were usually well below half and usually around 1/3 to 1/4 of the games that Crystalline Catastrophe had during it's Event window. That may be down to people disliking MU more than CC, but that wouldn't account for a drop from 600 active participants to just 100 at the usual time I game.
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
Well congratz on the 200 Episode, I normally don't listen to podcast but I figured I'd give this a whirl because of the mil-stone and all.
I didn't listen to all it, maybe about 1/2 of it. One thing that caught my eye(ear) of among many other thing is what Geko said that the queues weren't displaying the proper numbers showing how many are queued up or playing. I'm just wondering, supposedly now that's fixed, has anyone noticed the difference or if there are now much more players showing up on the queue chart?
What I suspect, and have suspected for a while, is that the numbers Geko is being given by the people working for him are not the same numbers that people in the game are seeing.
There's a bizarre disconnection between the day to day reality in the game and the line coming from Geko. Being a trusting person I'd naturally prefer to believe that he's telling us the truth from his perspective. I wouldn't like to call him an outright liar because I'm a nice person.
The number that was bugged was the people in the queue waiting. The actual number in current games was correct and still is. I never quantified the waiting in queue numbers as they were never accurately representative. The actual number of currently running games however is pretty easy to see and determine. The MU Event highlighted it nicely when compared to the prior CC Event. Numbers of active games were usually well below half and usually around 1/3 to 1/4 of the games that Crystalline Catastrophe had during it's Event window. That may be down to people disliking MU more than CC, but that wouldn't account for a drop from 600 active participants to just 100 at the usual time I game.
Thank you for that. So it was just the people waiting in the queue then that was bugged. So the slew of 0s in many queues were correct then...
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
Correct he specified that in the podcast that it was the number waiting, not the number in active games.
Chris Robert's on SC:
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
I would appreciate it if you wouldn't assume that kind of thing about me, nor call me such hostile names. I have no bias at all. I want to only believe true things, and I want to disbelieve false things, and I want to have as open of a mind as possible. If you disagree with me for good reason, please try to convince me, rather than antagonize me. .
You initiated hostilities by your carpet bombing here .
It counts as double offense when said offensive rhetoric is misspelled by a poster who has " Dictionary.com" and "List of common English language errors" in her sig .
In short , don't go insulting people when you can't even do that right ... -- and no , it does not matter if I was insulted or not -- the insult itself is the issue ... , and how you're willing to dish it out , but not take it .
But if you actually care about the game and think there is something objectively wrong with the it, putting sarcastic BS in your sig will not help anything.
Considering your own signature , I call that a double standard .
Yes, it does matter who he's talking about. If you did no exploiting, he's not talking about you. Simple as that.
Actually , you just proved meimei right in your very next sentence :
We're not the ones that get to decide what's an exploit and what isn't. Those that run the game do.
What Cryptic did was reclassify an act after the fact .
That (for the logic impaired) means that they were not guilty at the time of the act (playing in teams to gather XP -- a FEATURE THAT WAS INGAME SINCE LAUNCH) , but later on , once Cryptic decided to call that an exploit , they were guilty after the fact .
And that is true following your own logic of "We're not the ones that get to decide what's an exploit and what isn't. "
Now , looking upon the above mess of assumptions , fallacies and "truth by feeling rather than evidence" -- I have to ask two things :
- Considering the text in your sig , as well as your own need to tell ppl what to do or how to act -- where does this need to correct and control come from ?
- Also , since you seem to be a fan of ... well ... your interpretation of "critical thinking" -- why is it that you apply skepticism only towards the players , and zero / nada / nothing of that nature toward Cryptic ?
Isn't that one sided ... and therefore NOT critical thinking ?
Can they do no wrong ?
Can they not tell half truths or commercial propaganda ?
Are they not the product of a commercial enterprise that is guided by self interest ?
What I suspect, and have suspected for a while, is that the numbers Geko is being given by the people working for him are not the same numbers that people in the game are seeing.
There's a bizarre disconnection between the day to day reality in the game and the line coming from Geko. Being a trusting person I'd naturally prefer to believe that he's telling us the truth from his perspective. I wouldn't like to call him an outright liar because I'm a nice person.
Agreed.
To be fair he probably doesn't even have time to play the game(as with most devs) so probably doesn't see first hand what's really going on and therefore going based on what others are telling him.
Retired. I'm now in search for that perfect space anomaly.
There is also another column that specifies waiting time, in many queues that is represented by ---
meaning it cannot be calculated because nobody is running it!
Zactly! For instance, there are currently 2 persons queued for Starbase Fleet Defense, but, ever since DR, the queue time has always been ---.
I didn't exploit anything, he's not talking about me. But I am offended by the exploit remarks, because I know what people did, I know people who did it, and I know it wasn't an exploit.
And I SWEAR I just heard "Granted there where some exploits" Again... second time now that I have heard a high ranking employee of Cryptic call me an exploiter.
Huh? Where did he mention you specifically? He just said that there have been some exploits. Which, in STO (or any game for that matter), is like saying "The sky is blue".
Overreact much? Being a little dramaqueeny?
Technically, everyone who ran Japori exploited because the Tau Dewa Patrols did not scale with player level, making it much easier to complete them in quick succession.
As i said, I'm guilty as well, even though i just soloed the map and only a few at a time.
Granted, it wasn't THE exploit that everyone was talking about back then but, by definition, it was an exploit in every sense of the word.
You initiated hostilities by your carpet bombing here .
It counts as double offense when said offensive rhetoric is misspelled by a poster who has " Dictionary.com" and "List of common English language errors" in her sig .
In short , don't go insulting people when you can't even do that right ... -- and no , it does not matter if I was insulted or not -- the insult itself is the issue ... , and how you're willing to dish it out , but not take it .
I never "carpet bombed", and was never hostile to any particular person. If anyone assumes that I was including them, it's their own fault, not mine.
And what do you mean "double offense"? Are you implying that you're somehow judging me? I'll gladly take constructive criticism, but if all you're doing this for is because of some antagonizing 'you vs me' mentality, I'm not going to play that game.
Which is a brand of "ad hominem" -- you can find that in your signature as well , under " Logical fallacies" .
That was followed by these two jem's :
An ad hominem is only so if there's no other point behind it. Besides, I wasn't attacking you personally, I was pointing out that your signature accomplishes nothing positive.
What Cryptic did was reclassify an act after the fact .
That (for the logic impaired) means that they were not guilty at the time of the act (playing in teams to gather XP -- a FEATURE THAT WAS INGAME SINCE LAUNCH) , but later on , once Cryptic decided to call that an exploit , they were guilty after the fact .
They're not "guilty" of anything. That would imply that they're responsible for something that they never owned up to. This is simply not the case.
And that is true following your own logic of "We're not the ones that get to decide what's an exploit and what isn't. "
It might have been, but their minds change. If you think that is unjust and rsoblivion is correct in the claim that the TOS doesn't hold up in court, the best course of action would be to take Cryptic to court over it, rather than cherry picking your fellow STO players
Now , looking upon the above mess of assumptions , fallacies and "truth by feeling rather than evidence" -- I have to ask two things :
- Considering the text in your sig , as well as your own need to tell ppl what to do or how to act -- where does this need to correct and control come from ?
I'm not telling people how to do anything. I apologize if it seems that way. My only intent here is to convey information the way I see it as best as I can. If you just jump to the assumption that there's a 'need' at all to 'correct and control', then I'm not sure I can answer that, because as far as I know, there is not.
why is it that you apply skepticism only towards the players , and zero / nada / nothing of that nature toward Cryptic ?
Isn't that one sided ... and therefore NOT critical thinking ?
Can they do no wrong ?
Can they not tell half truths or commercial propaganda ?
Are they not the product of a commercial enterprise that is guided by self interest ?
Why are you asking such a loaded question? You're cherry picking away all the times I have in fact been critical of Cryptic. If You've taken time to look through my signature, why not also look through the posts I've made? Or hell, even threads. Because I've made more than one thread criticizing Cryptic(constructively, or at least as constructive as I could be at the time)
Is that why you claimed that my own signature was based in sarcasm? Because you think that I feel that Cryptic can do no wrong? How on Earth do you think that's a reasonable position to take?!?
That's exactly when we get into "The Emperor's New Clothes" territory. You can argue that grass is purple not green until your are blue in the face, you can highlight that in the Terms and Conditions (which recently were labelled worthless in a US court) of whatever service agreement you like, it doesn't change the reality. The reality is that despite the claims of D'Angelo and now Geko that the players were exploiting, it was the dev's bug (which Geko also admitted in the podcast for P1 200) that was responsible and therefore they were responsible. To later claim that it was the players fault, which Geko did later was insulting.
Amusingly the part in the podcast when he claims that the change was scary or different and that people wouldn't be used to it is actually hilarious. I've played MMO's for years, I've played games for decades now, I've modded games and fixed games and added stuff to games. It's not in the least bit scary to deal with an update that adds 10 levels. It's not problematic until you hit that first XP wall at level 52. Then you go do a patrol and you see the miniscule increase in XP and you realise what they have done. The dawning of that realisation is like a hammer to the face.
First you sit there in disbelief. Then you look for an alternative way to get XP as you can see that 100 runs will be the minimum you'll see of Argala to get to 60. You check out the STF's, they are empty, odd considering normally they're full but you ignore that and expect everyone is just testing out the new area. You run a normal STF and find it's got far less progress than the Patrol you just did...
You head back to known territory, the hunting grounds of Tau Dewa, find a few people and run a patrol (just like that pop up back in the DQ told you to do) and suddenly you gain a few bars of XP. It's not excessive but it's progression at a pace you can recognise. Something that isn't measured in pixels but on a ruler.
That's how things run. That's the response most people have. It's not out of order, it's not wrong, it's just incorrect of the Lead Dev to think he got the balance right when he so clearly hasn't got a clue about it. The podcast only makes that clearer with each word uttered.
Exactly this!! The opening mission was amazing! Instant 'joyjoy' feelings, things are moving forward, smiles on face, excitement growing then you hit a progress block, the DQ patrols, you realise that something is wrong, terribly wrong, you think to yourself "hmmm, this cant be right, must be a bug", then you think "if this is bugged, what else is?" So yeah, you head back to what you know, something to do while things are sorted, something to keep you occupied. You arrive back in Tau Dewa, so many players all chatting and grouping up, "ahaa, im not alone, we are all in the same boat", so you join a group and play, it was as simple as that.
Not once did I think that I was doing anything wrong, no machiavellian twiddling of my moustaches or rubbing together of my hands, I was having lots of fun with lots of people and getting to put my new T6 ships through their shakedown flights.. FUN! I was having FUN!
Anyway, Geko is playing another game and it's not STO the players play. Cryptic/Geko/Dev gbroke either ethical or moral connections with the players. They sent the first blows.
Revenge sucks and now the players is going take Cryptic to the bank. Directly creating ways to hit their pocket. Whoever says they are doing well. The latest report says they aren't.
So, take it to the bank.
Geko get off the high horse, play the game, and find ways to fix it all considering their going be tons of mmos out in the coming year ready to take STO business.
The fact that some of the most painful changes & nerfs that have been made to the game have not been made to Tribble suggests to me that Devs play the game on Tribble, and to give themselves an easy time they have not implemented the mind-crushing grind there.
The fact that some of the most painful changes & nerfs that have been made to the game have not been made to Tribble suggests to me that Devs play the game on Tribble, and to give themselves an easy time they have not implemented the mind-crushing grind there.
Nah, they play Holodeck. At least two of them, I can confirm.
While the operational efficiency of a Warship is proportional to the Ability and Aptitude of her Crew. Her Prowess and Standing is proportianal to the Ability, Integrity and Fortitude of her Captain, who can critically enhance or diminish the latter.
So, listening to the Podcast now. You guys mention you are hearing conflicting reports on how far one can level with the new content, starting from scratch. You have conflicting reports because Skiffy did it wrong!
Right around the same point in the Podcast, Geko is talking about how Story Missions reward scaled rewards, as in a % of the points needed to level to the next level. Sounds like Skiffy did all the content at level 50, while the other person who told you about it went from the beginning.
Even if the % is smaller on mission replay, if Player 1 need 5000 XP to get to the next level and playing the mission for the first time rewards 50% of the needed points, it rewards 2500 XP, while, even if the rewards for Mission Replay are 10%, and the points needed are 80,000 for Level 50-51, the reward is 8000, more than 3 times as much.
Of course Skiffy gained more XP.
"Logic is a little tweeting bird chirping in a meadow. Logic is a wreath of pretty flowers which smell BAD." - Spock
I never "carpet bombed", and was never hostile to any particular person. If anyone assumes that I was including them, it's their own fault, not mine.
Ok , just to be clear about this ... -- you have all that dictionary stuff in your sig to help yourself right ?
Because that's the only thing that would explain that answer ... -- but it'd still imply that you're not getting the help you need .
FYI , if your mud slinging has no specific target called by name , that does not clear you of mud slinging .
And what do you mean "double offense"? Are you implying that you're somehow judging me?
I'm not implying , I'm saying that your words (and how you use them) speak about who and what you are .
If you feel ok with a generic "crybabies" term to name others without having the guts to call someone out in person , then that is who you are .
Aren't you comfortable with yourself ?
So you're assuming my signature is sarcastic? It wasn't meant to be at all. I'm not sure why you'd assume that it is.
No , I assume that your sig is a form of protest against Tovan Khev .
Yet you allow yourself to preach about the antagonizing nature of someone elses sig ... , when they are protesting something else .
That is what I called a double standard . You allow yourself the right to protest but you do not extend the same right to the next poster .
Besides, I wasn't attacking you personally, I was pointing out that your signature accomplishes nothing positive.
You were responding to someone else's sig , not mine ... , and "positive" is in the eye of the beholder ... , just like Tovan Khev is .
I'm not sure how 'proving' anyone 'right' is meant to be any kind of useful retort. So what?
Does the truth not matter ?
You seemed to claim otherwise in another post .
They're not "guilty" of anything. That would imply that they're responsible for something that they never owned up to. This is simply not the case.
I ... have no idea what you just said there .
It might have been, but their minds change. If you think that is unjust and rsoblivion is correct in the claim that the TOS doesn't hold up in court, the best course of action would be to take Cryptic to court over it, rather than cherry picking your fellow STO players
This isn't about going to court .
It's about Cryptic's repeated behavior to single out long time features , and deciding that they no longer meet the needs of the game and removing them .
That can be the old Mirror invasion , that can be the 2.5 year old "Dil exploit" in the Foundry , that can be the EC we got from vendor trash or the XP gained from group play .
This is about Cryptic NEVER taking responsibility , and either spinning a tail about some fantastic replacement , or crying "exploit" or just pretending business as usual .
I'm not telling people how to do anything. I apologize if it seems that way.
Well it must be my fault then , as maybe I misread your intent when you wrote " putting sarcastic BS in your sig will not help anything." .
Because to me it still looks like telling someone (not me) how to do a sig .
If you just jump to the assumption that I have a 'need' at all to 'correct and control', then I'm not sure I can answer that, because as far as I know, there is not.
Well then you should have no problem answering my previous question : for who's "correctional benefit" does your sig have so many "opportunities" to correct one's writing & thinking ?
If you have a better way, please provide it. If I'm doing something wrong, I want to stop that and do better.
In our case , the saying "don't keep your mind so open that your brain falls out" seems to apply .
Cryptic is going by "everything is awesome" .
If you want to parrot that , be my guest .
If on the other hand you want to apply skepticism and wonder why there are empty queues , why there is no massive invasion of DR ships like we had with Romulan ships during LoR , or why they can take their sweet time to fix anything to our benefit but stuff to their benefit causes them to shut down an entire sector and leaves ONE patrol mission to gain some minute XP -- if THAT is what "awesome" sounds like , perhaps you can theorise what "bad" may sound like by Cryptics view .
I look at your sig and remember the only Romulan related question in the interview ... , when the question was : "could we get another Romulan Bridge ?" , to which the long winded answer was "no" , but a better interpretation would have been "Romulan wut lol ?" -- as if all the money that they got from LoR no longer meant anything .
That is the kind of "loyalty" that most of the older players (vets) of STO have had to put up with in many incarnations ... , because every time we wait for that "more" -- the answer is the same "that train has left the station" .
Yet you still question why we're skeptical .
Why we question Cryptic's "you want this but wait -- here is something BETTER !' .
Why are you asking such a loaded question? You're cherry picking away all the times I have in fact been critical of Cryptic. If You've taken time to look through my signature, why not also look through the posts I've made? Or hell, even threads. Because I've made more than one thread criticizing Cryptic(constructively, or at least as constructive as I could be at the time)
I asked you that because of this statement of yours :
I want to only believe true things, and I want to disbelieve false things, and I want to have as open of a mind as possible.
If this was year one of STO or even year two ... -- your attempts at even handedness would not cause ppl to be so skeptic about your motives .
Some of us are 5 years in ... , and judging by the responses (including those who left either the game or just the queues) -- what Cryptic is saying & doing is no longer worth being evenhanded about .
And that in itself is a very sad statement .
T6 Breen Sarr Theln Cruiser...did I read this right? So...they're next T6 ship will be...Breen? Not Romulan or Klingon...but Breen? Will this be accompanied by other Romulan and Klingon T6 ships?
You are just going to alienate the podcasters even further the more hate you throw their way
Really just justifying the way they treat you, in their mind, exactly like the developers.
You have to consider their gameplay is whatever pseudo-fame they get from STO being online rather than actually playing the game.
Is another thing they share with the developers, don't need the game to be playable, just need it be up.
So I actually think you are wrong calling them butt kissers that in reality feel estranged from the developers.
I believe they all think of themselves as special, elevated people from a higher class and that's what makes it so easy to walk all over you - since you are dehumanized as low class, worthless forum users.
T6 Breen Sarr Theln Cruiser...did I read this right? So...they're next T6 ship will be...Breen? Not Romulan or Klingon...but Breen? Will this be accompanied by other Romulan and Klingon T6 ships?
I'm speechless...
The Breen ship is an award to the upcoming Winter event , which has carried the theme "winter=cold=Breen ship award" for 3 years now .
Each year we got a new Breen ship , which is kinda cool .
Ok , just to be clear about this ... -- you have all that dictionary stuff in your sig to help yourself right ?
Because that's the only thing that would explain that answer ... -- but it'd still imply that you're not getting the help you need .
FYI , if your mud slinging has no specific target called by name , that does not clear you of mud slinging .
No. I have bookmarks for myself. I put those links in my sig to help others.
What do you mean "clear" me? Are you implying that I answer to you or any other forum poster in some way? Because I do not. If you think it violates the forum rules itself, you're welcome to report it. If not, why should I care?
I'm not implying , I'm saying that your words (and how you use them) speak about who and what you are .
If you feel ok with a generic "crybabies" term to name others without having the guts to call someone out in person , then that is who you are .
Aren't you comfortable with yourself ?
I can't "call anyone out", as that would be against forum rules.
No , I assume that your sig is a form of protest against Tovan Khev .
Yet you allow yourself to preach about the antagonizing nature of someone elses sig ... , when they are protesting something else .
That is what I called a double standard . You allow yourself the right to protest but you do not extend the same right to the next poster .
You misunderstand. I'm not criticizing the fact that they're protesting something. I'm criticizing the fact that they're doing it so insultingly.
This isn't about going to court .
It's about Cryptic's repeated behavior to single out long time features , and deciding that they no longer meet the needs of the game and removing them .
That can be the old Mirror invasion , that can be the 2.5 year old "Dil exploit" in the Foundry , that can be the EC we got from vendor trash or the XP gained from group play .
This is about Cryptic NEVER taking responsibility , and either spinning a tail about some fantastic replacement , or crying "exploit" or just pretending business as usual .
So you don't feel cheated and want justice? I mean slapping them with a lawsuit is a good way to achieve that.
Well it must be my fault then , as maybe I misread your intent when you wrote " putting sarcastic BS in your sig will not help anything." .
Because to me it still looks like telling someone (not me) how to do a sig .
I wasn't "telling" so much as pointing out what will not work. If sarcasm is used in a sig in an attempt to convey a message, that message might get lost under the insult. Would you not agree?
I mean if that person don't mind the message getting lost, that's their choice. But I did feel as thought I should pointr it out.
Well then you should have no problem answering my previous question : for who's "correctional benefit" does your sig have so many "opportunities" to correct one's writing & thinking ?
In our case , the saying "don't keep your mind so open that your brain falls out" seems to apply .
Cryptic is going by "everything is awesome" .
If you want to parrot that , be my guest .
That sounds like a horrible analogy. An open mind never seems like a bad idea. I mean, if your position can't hold up to scrutiny, wouldn't a better action be to get a new position rather than closing your mind off to the possibility?
And for the record, I definitely disagree that "everything is awesome", even within the game.
If on the other hand you want to apply skepticism and wonder why there are empty queues , why there is no massive invasion of DR ships like we had with Romulan ships during LoR , or why they can take their sweet time to fix anything to our benefit but stuff to their benefit causes them to shut down an entire sector and leaves ONE patrol mission to gain some minute XP -- if THAT is what "awesome" sounds like , perhaps you can theorise what "bad" may sound like by Cryptics view .
But I don't wonder why there are empty queues, because I am convinced that I have a sufficient explanation.
"Massive invasion" is subjective.
I'd rather not jump to any conclusions as to why they're "taking their sweet time"(which I'm also not convinced of), as I feel that I don't know enough about game development to judge any amount of time for bug fixes and patches. Especially since of my past MMO experience, most of that comes from games which are domestic versions of foreign games.
I look at your sig and remember the only Romulan related question in the interview ... , when the question was : "could we get another Romulan Bridge ?" , to which the long winded answer was "no" , but a better interpretation would have been "Romulan wut lol ?" -- as if all the money that they got from LoR no longer meant anything .
That is the kind of "loyalty" that most of the older players (vets) of STO have had to put up with in many incarnations ... , because every time we wait for that "more" -- the answer is the same "that train has left the station" .
Sounds like he wanted development to shy away from all bridges equally, as they apparently take too much development time.
Some of us are 5 years in ... , and judging by the responses (including those who left either the game or just the queues) -- what Cryptic is saying & doing is no longer worth being evenhanded about .
And that in itself is a very sad statement .
... you're welcome to disagree ...
Why do you care enough to post about it? Or even stay here at all? I'm not saying anything along the lines of "if you don't like it, then gtfo", quite the opposite actually. I'm just wondering why, if you've lost so much trust in Cryptic, and are so convinced that there's no hope any more, why are you staying?
I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, I'm just curious.
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Amusingly the part in the podcast when he claims that the change was scary or different and that people wouldn't be used to it is actually hilarious. I've played MMO's for years, I've played games for decades now, I've modded games and fixed games and added stuff to games. It's not in the least bit scary to deal with an update that adds 10 levels. It's not problematic until you hit that first XP wall at level 52. Then you go do a patrol and you see the miniscule increase in XP and you realise what they have done. The dawning of that realisation is like a hammer to the face.
First you sit there in disbelief. Then you look for an alternative way to get XP as you can see that 100 runs will be the minimum you'll see of Argala to get to 60. You check out the STF's, they are empty, odd considering normally they're full but you ignore that and expect everyone is just testing out the new area. You run a normal STF and find it's got far less progress than the Patrol you just did...
You head back to known territory, the hunting grounds of Tau Dewa, find a few people and run a patrol (just like that pop up back in the DQ told you to do) and suddenly you gain a few bars of XP. It's not excessive but it's progression at a pace you can recognise. Something that isn't measured in pixels but on a ruler.
That's how things run. That's the response most people have. It's not out of order, it's not wrong, it's just incorrect of the Lead Dev to think he got the balance right when he so clearly hasn't got a clue about it. The podcast only makes that clearer with each word uttered.
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
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I guess it could be done, hell what's one more frivolous court matter in the country that coined the term
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
I didn't listen to all it, maybe about 1/2 of it. One thing that caught my eye(ear) of among many other thing is what Geko said that the queues weren't displaying the proper numbers showing how many are queued up or playing. I'm just wondering, supposedly now that's fixed, has anyone noticed the difference or if there are now much more players showing up on the queue chart?
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
What I suspect, and have suspected for a while, is that the numbers Geko is being given by the people working for him are not the same numbers that people in the game are seeing.
There's a bizarre disconnection between the day to day reality in the game and the line coming from Geko. Being a trusting person I'd naturally prefer to believe that he's telling us the truth from his perspective. I wouldn't like to call him an outright liar because I'm a nice person.
Free Tibet!
Thank you for that. So it was just the people waiting in the queue then that was bugged. So the slew of 0s in many queues were correct then...
"You don't have to do something again and again and again repetitive that doesn't have much challange, that's just a general good gameplay thing."
You initiated hostilities by your carpet bombing here .
It counts as double offense when said offensive rhetoric is misspelled by a poster who has " Dictionary.com" and "List of common English language errors" in her sig .
In short , don't go insulting people when you can't even do that right ... -- and no , it does not matter if I was insulted or not -- the insult itself is the issue ... , and how you're willing to dish it out , but not take it .
Considering your own signature , I call that a double standard .
Which is a brand of "ad hominem" -- you can find that in your signature as well , under " Logical fallacies" .
That was followed by these two jem's :
Actually , you just proved meimei right in your very next sentence :
What Cryptic did was reclassify an act after the fact .
That (for the logic impaired) means that they were not guilty at the time of the act (playing in teams to gather XP -- a FEATURE THAT WAS INGAME SINCE LAUNCH) , but later on , once Cryptic decided to call that an exploit , they were guilty after the fact .
And that is true following your own logic of "We're not the ones that get to decide what's an exploit and what isn't. "
Now , looking upon the above mess of assumptions , fallacies and "truth by feeling rather than evidence" -- I have to ask two things :
- Considering the text in your sig , as well as your own need to tell ppl what to do or how to act -- where does this need to correct and control come from ?
- Also , since you seem to be a fan of ... well ... your interpretation of "critical thinking" -- why is it that you apply skepticism only towards the players , and zero / nada / nothing of that nature toward Cryptic ?
Isn't that one sided ... and therefore NOT critical thinking ?
Can they do no wrong ?
Can they not tell half truths or commercial propaganda ?
Are they not the product of a commercial enterprise that is guided by self interest ?
... something about Kool Aid ...
Agreed.
To be fair he probably doesn't even have time to play the game(as with most devs) so probably doesn't see first hand what's really going on and therefore going based on what others are telling him.
Zactly! For instance, there are currently 2 persons queued for Starbase Fleet Defense, but, ever since DR, the queue time has always been ---.
Can't we see the noumbers of running maps as well somewhere?
Whatver they claim. General usage in STO's end game maps is down and its more than understandable why.
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Overreact much? Being a little dramaqueeny?
Technically, everyone who ran Japori exploited because the Tau Dewa Patrols did not scale with player level, making it much easier to complete them in quick succession.
As i said, I'm guilty as well, even though i just soloed the map and only a few at a time.
Granted, it wasn't THE exploit that everyone was talking about back then but, by definition, it was an exploit in every sense of the word.
And what do you mean "double offense"? Are you implying that you're somehow judging me? I'll gladly take constructive criticism, but if all you're doing this for is because of some antagonizing 'you vs me' mentality, I'm not going to play that game.
So you're assuming my signature is sarcastic? It wasn't meant to be at all. I'm not sure why you'd assume that it is.
An ad hominem is only so if there's no other point behind it. Besides, I wasn't attacking you personally, I was pointing out that your signature accomplishes nothing positive.
I'm not sure how 'proving' anyone 'right' is meant to be any kind of useful retort. So what?
They're not "guilty" of anything. That would imply that they're responsible for something that they never owned up to. This is simply not the case.
It might have been, but their minds change. If you think that is unjust and rsoblivion is correct in the claim that the TOS doesn't hold up in court, the best course of action would be to take Cryptic to court over it, rather than cherry picking your fellow STO players
I'm not telling people how to do anything. I apologize if it seems that way. My only intent here is to convey information the way I see it as best as I can. If you just jump to the assumption that there's a 'need' at all to 'correct and control', then I'm not sure I can answer that, because as far as I know, there is not.
If you have a better way, please provide it. If I'm doing something wrong, I want to stop that and do better.
Why are you asking such a loaded question? You're cherry picking away all the times I have in fact been critical of Cryptic. If You've taken time to look through my signature, why not also look through the posts I've made? Or hell, even threads. Because I've made more than one thread criticizing Cryptic(constructively, or at least as constructive as I could be at the time)
Is that why you claimed that my own signature was based in sarcasm? Because you think that I feel that Cryptic can do no wrong? How on Earth do you think that's a reasonable position to take?!?
Are you even taking your own argument seriously?
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Exactly this!! The opening mission was amazing! Instant 'joyjoy' feelings, things are moving forward, smiles on face, excitement growing then you hit a progress block, the DQ patrols, you realise that something is wrong, terribly wrong, you think to yourself "hmmm, this cant be right, must be a bug", then you think "if this is bugged, what else is?" So yeah, you head back to what you know, something to do while things are sorted, something to keep you occupied. You arrive back in Tau Dewa, so many players all chatting and grouping up, "ahaa, im not alone, we are all in the same boat", so you join a group and play, it was as simple as that.
Not once did I think that I was doing anything wrong, no machiavellian twiddling of my moustaches or rubbing together of my hands, I was having lots of fun with lots of people and getting to put my new T6 ships through their shakedown flights.. FUN! I was having FUN!
Anyway, Geko is playing another game and it's not STO the players play. Cryptic/Geko/Dev gbroke either ethical or moral connections with the players. They sent the first blows.
Revenge sucks and now the players is going take Cryptic to the bank. Directly creating ways to hit their pocket. Whoever says they are doing well. The latest report says they aren't.
So, take it to the bank.
Geko get off the high horse, play the game, and find ways to fix it all considering their going be tons of mmos out in the coming year ready to take STO business.
Free Tibet!
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Right around the same point in the Podcast, Geko is talking about how Story Missions reward scaled rewards, as in a % of the points needed to level to the next level. Sounds like Skiffy did all the content at level 50, while the other person who told you about it went from the beginning.
Even if the % is smaller on mission replay, if Player 1 need 5000 XP to get to the next level and playing the mission for the first time rewards 50% of the needed points, it rewards 2500 XP, while, even if the rewards for Mission Replay are 10%, and the points needed are 80,000 for Level 50-51, the reward is 8000, more than 3 times as much.
Of course Skiffy gained more XP.
Ok , just to be clear about this ... -- you have all that dictionary stuff in your sig to help yourself right ?
Because that's the only thing that would explain that answer ... -- but it'd still imply that you're not getting the help you need .
FYI , if your mud slinging has no specific target called by name , that does not clear you of mud slinging .
I'm not implying , I'm saying that your words (and how you use them) speak about who and what you are .
If you feel ok with a generic "crybabies" term to name others without having the guts to call someone out in person , then that is who you are .
Aren't you comfortable with yourself ?
No , I assume that your sig is a form of protest against Tovan Khev .
Yet you allow yourself to preach about the antagonizing nature of someone elses sig ... , when they are protesting something else .
That is what I called a double standard . You allow yourself the right to protest but you do not extend the same right to the next poster .
You were responding to someone else's sig , not mine ... , and "positive" is in the eye of the beholder ... , just like Tovan Khev is .
Does the truth not matter ?
You seemed to claim otherwise in another post .
I ... have no idea what you just said there .
This isn't about going to court .
It's about Cryptic's repeated behavior to single out long time features , and deciding that they no longer meet the needs of the game and removing them .
That can be the old Mirror invasion , that can be the 2.5 year old "Dil exploit" in the Foundry , that can be the EC we got from vendor trash or the XP gained from group play .
This is about Cryptic NEVER taking responsibility , and either spinning a tail about some fantastic replacement , or crying "exploit" or just pretending business as usual .
Well it must be my fault then , as maybe I misread your intent when you wrote " putting sarcastic BS in your sig will not help anything." .
Because to me it still looks like telling someone (not me) how to do a sig .
Well then you should have no problem answering my previous question : for who's "correctional benefit" does your sig have so many "opportunities" to correct one's writing & thinking ?
In our case , the saying "don't keep your mind so open that your brain falls out" seems to apply .
Cryptic is going by "everything is awesome" .
If you want to parrot that , be my guest .
If on the other hand you want to apply skepticism and wonder why there are empty queues , why there is no massive invasion of DR ships like we had with Romulan ships during LoR , or why they can take their sweet time to fix anything to our benefit but stuff to their benefit causes them to shut down an entire sector and leaves ONE patrol mission to gain some minute XP -- if THAT is what "awesome" sounds like , perhaps you can theorise what "bad" may sound like by Cryptics view .
I look at your sig and remember the only Romulan related question in the interview ... , when the question was : "could we get another Romulan Bridge ?" , to which the long winded answer was "no" , but a better interpretation would have been "Romulan wut lol ?" -- as if all the money that they got from LoR no longer meant anything .
That is the kind of "loyalty" that most of the older players (vets) of STO have had to put up with in many incarnations ... , because every time we wait for that "more" -- the answer is the same "that train has left the station" .
Yet you still question why we're skeptical .
Why we question Cryptic's "you want this but wait -- here is something BETTER !' .
I asked you that because of this statement of yours :
If this was year one of STO or even year two ... -- your attempts at even handedness would not cause ppl to be so skeptic about your motives .
Some of us are 5 years in ... , and judging by the responses (including those who left either the game or just the queues) -- what Cryptic is saying & doing is no longer worth being evenhanded about .
And that in itself is a very sad statement .
... you're welcome to disagree ...
I'm speechless...
Really just justifying the way they treat you, in their mind, exactly like the developers.
You have to consider their gameplay is whatever pseudo-fame they get from STO being online rather than actually playing the game.
Is another thing they share with the developers, don't need the game to be playable, just need it be up.
So I actually think you are wrong calling them butt kissers that in reality feel estranged from the developers.
I believe they all think of themselves as special, elevated people from a higher class and that's what makes it so easy to walk all over you - since you are dehumanized as low class, worthless forum users.
The Breen ship is an award to the upcoming Winter event , which has carried the theme "winter=cold=Breen ship award" for 3 years now .
Each year we got a new Breen ship , which is kinda cool .
What do you mean "clear" me? Are you implying that I answer to you or any other forum poster in some way? Because I do not. If you think it violates the forum rules itself, you're welcome to report it. If not, why should I care?
I can't "call anyone out", as that would be against forum rules.
You misunderstand. I'm not criticizing the fact that they're protesting something. I'm criticizing the fact that they're doing it so insultingly.
I suppose that's true. But still, you invoked a false equivalence.
The truth definitely matters. If I claimed otherwise, I sincerely apologize, that was definitely not my intention.
I'm not sure how to word it better, sorry.
So you don't feel cheated and want justice? I mean slapping them with a lawsuit is a good way to achieve that.
I wasn't "telling" so much as pointing out what will not work. If sarcasm is used in a sig in an attempt to convey a message, that message might get lost under the insult. Would you not agree?
I mean if that person don't mind the message getting lost, that's their choice. But I did feel as thought I should pointr it out.
I'm not sure what you mean.
That sounds like a horrible analogy. An open mind never seems like a bad idea. I mean, if your position can't hold up to scrutiny, wouldn't a better action be to get a new position rather than closing your mind off to the possibility?
And for the record, I definitely disagree that "everything is awesome", even within the game.
But I don't wonder why there are empty queues, because I am convinced that I have a sufficient explanation.
"Massive invasion" is subjective.
I'd rather not jump to any conclusions as to why they're "taking their sweet time"(which I'm also not convinced of), as I feel that I don't know enough about game development to judge any amount of time for bug fixes and patches. Especially since of my past MMO experience, most of that comes from games which are domestic versions of foreign games.
Sounds like he wanted development to shy away from all bridges equally, as they apparently take too much development time.
I just see that as a standard aspect of MMORPGs. And might I add, a lot better handled than most I've experienced. IMHO, of course.
Skepticism is fine, but so is reason.
Why should I care if people are skeptic about my motives? What concern is it of yours?
Why do you care enough to post about it? Or even stay here at all? I'm not saying anything along the lines of "if you don't like it, then gtfo", quite the opposite actually. I'm just wondering why, if you've lost so much trust in Cryptic, and are so convinced that there's no hope any more, why are you staying?
I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, I'm just curious.
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I knew you were a yes-man, but this is fanboi-dom at its worst.