I'm not a fan of grind. I don't like grind. I don't grind huge reserves of dilithium.
But even I have to admit that it gives people something to do when they think they've run out of things to do.
I honestly can't see this being a huge problem except in the Ultra-Elite/Nightmare difficulty mode we have yet to learn much about or in PvP. You're going to want the best gear you can get, probably. Hardcore players want an edge, or a way to neutralize somebody else's edge, and they're willing to pay or grind for it or walk away to play another game. That's a sales opportunity for Cryptic.
Everybody else needs to be choosy about what they upgrade, if they upgrade. It's probably still not going to make sense to hang on to that phaser pistol you started the game with, sentimental value or not. But that super rare thing you got out of a lockbox and equip every chance you get? Why not?
Other than that, once you've got Mk 12 Purples, you probably don't need to worry too much about Mk 14 Gold for most things.
Hah! I just realized... Our stuff will be 14 k Gold. Hope that comes with GPL plating.
My views may not represent those of Cryptic Studios or Perfect World Entertainment. You can file a "forums and website" support ticket here Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
As a captain-rank character I purchase the refit escort for the levelless quad cannons. These scale up with me and as I gain levels they get better.
Once I reach level 50, the levelless quad cannons stop improving. To improve them further, I can apply Tech Upgrades. As soon as I opt to upgrade the quad cannons at level 50, they convert from levelless items to Mk 12 items. (If I'm below level 50, they don't convert, because making them Mk 12 would make them unusable to me!) After that, I can apply Tech Upgrades to improve them to Mk 13, Mk 14, ultra-rare (ultraviolet), and eventually epic (gold) quality.
My question is, when im upgrading my quad cannons, can i still use them ??
Cause if 1 upgrade can take hours, and to level up i need to do it multiple times wil i be without my weapon(s) on my ship ??
My question is, when im upgrading my quad cannons, can i still use them ??
Cause if 1 upgrade can take hours, and to level up i need to do it multiple times wil i be without my weapon(s) on my ship ??
Simple solution.
Start the upgrade process before you log off for the night.
My number one concern is they respect the previous investments we have made and this looks like it does just that. Especially only having to spend a little dil per attempt. With this new reason to spend dil might I suggest a modest refine cap increase? (I can dream).
what hasn't been addressed is not having the item for the required time it takes to upgrade which means it seems you need to do this stuff when your not playing
Start the upgrade process before you log off for the night.
Yes but if it takes 10's of times to upgrade it will take forever to upgrade your stuf with 4/5 projects and if you still need to do the r&d to level up you don't have and project space !!
I'm really excited to be able to level up some of these unique mission reward components, so thanks for that!
Will we ever see warp cores added to crafting/upgrades?
When upgrading between rarities, how will added modifiers work?
Do we get to pick the new mods?
Do we just roll the dice?
Is there a set pool of available mods through upgrading?
Are the crafting mods available through this?
Speaking of which, status updates on secondary deflectors and a master list of all the available crafting mods would be really appreciated.
Then I'm afraid I know how the future "exploration" system will look like. I bet it will use Gateway and bridge officers.
Judging by the Arc feedback threads, they may very well be.
Porting mechanics from another game is not a bad thing in itself. I just hope we are going to see some mechanics that were developed for STO and not for a different game. Didn't mean to sound negative. Ability to upgrade gear mark is actually cool. Just noticing a trend here, that's all.
Hmm, well they've been working towards integrating Gateway into the game for a long time, and it has been requested as far as the DOFF system is concerned.
It's no problem, you didn't sound particularly negative at all.
Here are some answers to some of those question marks that are floating over your heads!
* Upgrading Item Mark is Always Successful
When your item gains enough Tech Points to upgrade to a higher Mark, this operation always succeeds. Your Mark 12 Breen shield will become a Mark 13 Breen shield with no failure chance. It's only when your item reaches maximum Mark and you are trying to improve its quality (color) that there is a chance that the upgrade won't succeed -- but even then, you keep your quality improvement chance and add to it for the next upgrade, and eventually you will reach a 100% chance of quality improvement.
* Item mods are not re-rolled
Your item's mods don't change as part of the upgrade, so if you like the mods on your Phaser Beam Array [Acc]x3, you won't lose them. You just have a chance to get a new, extra mod. You might turn your array into a Phaser Beam Array [Acc]x4, or Phaser Beam Array [Acc]x3 [Dmg], or Phaser Beam Array [Acc]x3 [CrtH].
For most items, if you get a new mod, it is randomly selected. Set reputation gear does not get a random modifier; instead, the mod gained is always the same for a specific item. When you upgrade a MACO deflector to ultra-rare (ultraviolet) quality, for instance, it will always get one specific mod. That way you never have to worry about a random mod and having to grind out another piece of expensive rep gear and then upgrading it again -- once it improves in quality, you know that you have gained the one upgraded version.
* Epic (Gold) items have special bonus mods
The bonus mod for an item at Epic (Gold) quality is a unique special mod that doesn't otherwise appear, generally more powerful than other mods. These are: Space Shield: [Cp/Rg] Combined capacity/regen boost Space Impulse Engine: [Drv2] Overcharged driver coil, double coil bonus Space Deflector: [SS/SI] Interlaced integrity, structural integrity/shield systems combined bonus Space Weapon: [Ac/Dm]: Bonus accuracy/damage combo Ground Shield: [Cap2] Double capacity bonus Ground Armor: [ResAll/HP] Bonus HP and bonus resist all damage Ground Weapon: [Dm/CrH] Bonus damage and critical chance combo
* Your item can't accidentally out-level you
If you aren't a max level captain, you can't upgrade an item past the Mark that you can currently use. You don't need to worry about accidentally making a good piece of gear unusable.
* Making Tech Upgrades doesn't cost crafters dilithium
Tech Upgrades do not require dilithium to make; the dilithium cost is on use. This means that crafters don't have to worry about spending their dilithium to make Tech Upgrades for their friends and fleet, or for sale on the Exchange.
* Set Gear
As part of the upgrade system implementation, we've made set bonuses Mark-independent. This means that you can have Jem'Hadar shields Mk 10, deflector Mk 11, engines Mk 12, and still get the three-piece set bonus.
* Levelless items
Many pieces of levelless gear will stop receiving bonuses at level 50. After this, you can upgrade the item and it will gain a Mark, and will then improve after this. This will allow your levelless gear to actually keep up with your other gear, since Mk 12 gear is actually above level 50 and Mk 14 is even better than that.
* Special Mission Rewards
Almost everything you can get should be upgradeable. As noted in the blog, you can upgrade Breen set gear, caustic plasma beams, Hargh'peng torpedoes -- if you're on Tribble and you find something that you can't upgrade, post on the Tribble forum.
As noted before, set upgrades will not break set bonuses. If you have a Mk 11 purple Jem'hadar engine and a Mk 13 ultraviolet Jem'hadar deflector, they will work together for the set bonus.
Levelless items will generally be upgradeable once you are level 50. Here is an example:
As a captain-rank character I purchase the refit escort for the levelless quad cannons. These scale up with me and as I gain levels they get better.
Once I reach level 50, the levelless quad cannons stop improving. To improve them further, I can apply Tech Upgrades. As soon as I opt to upgrade the quad cannons at level 50, they convert from levelless items to Mk 12 items. (If I'm below level 50, they don't convert, because making them Mk 12 would make them unusable to me!) After that, I can apply Tech Upgrades to improve them to Mk 13, Mk 14, ultra-rare (ultraviolet), and eventually epic (gold) quality.
Lobi store weapons will follow this same sort of conversion. Since most lobi store levelless items are actually a little behind the power curve, going to Mk 12 is a significant improvement for them. The Ferengi energy whip will be a pretty mean weapon at Mk 14!
The conversion of a levelless item to Mk 12 at character level 50 is automatic and doesn't cost you anything -- no dilithium, no time, no money, not even a Tech Upgrade kit; just selecting "Upgrade Item" will make the conversion instantly. If you want the item to stay levelless (capped at 50), just don't select "Upgrade Item" and it won't be converted. After the item is converted it will take the usual Tech Upgrades to improve it further.
Upgrading converted gear uses the same Tech Upgrades and costs as any other gear. You do not need to spend extra lobi to upgrade your lobi store purchases.
A few items will not be upgradeable (such as the TR-116A -- hey, what's with the torches and pitchforks?!?). C-store ship consoles such as Saucer Separation do not need upgrades; they will be considered Epic (Gold) quality already, and since you already purchased the ship, you don't need to pay more for the console that came with it. C-store ship weapons can be upgraded, because they will see significant performance improvements. (Yes, you will also be able to upgrade Spiral Wave Disruptors, if you are a Galor-class ship owner.)
If you try to upgrade a specific mission reward item on Tribble and it does not allow you to upgrade, please post on the Tribble forums! When in doubt, I recommend copying your character to Tribble and trying to upgrade your favorite gear. If it doesn't work, please let us know. You should be able to use the gear that you like and upgrade it to be useful at high Marks
Ahh, thank you, these are great answers. As expected even the C-Store stuff is getting upgraded. One question I am curious about as well is, will the set bonuses increase in strength and efficacy with the mark of the set pieces? And to delve deeper, we know that the set bonuses will work across Marks, which is awesome and a continuation of what you started in 9.5, but if the set bonus does increase in strength will it be dependent on the mark level of the highest item or the lowest?
For instance to get a Mark XIV Graviton Beam from the MACO set will I need a single MkXIV MACO piece or will I need a full set?
I noticed that the driver coil bonus on a Gold Quality Impulse engine is a Double driver coil bonus, but will the driver coil bonus on the MACO Transwarp engine improve from MKXII to MKXIII and MkXIV?
That's all I got for now, good stuff.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
I'm really excited to be able to level up some of these unique mission reward components, so thanks for that!
Will we ever see warp cores added to crafting/upgrades?
When upgrading between rarities, how will added modifiers work?
Do we get to pick the new mods?
Do we just roll the dice?
Is there a set pool of available mods through upgrading?
Are the crafting mods available through this?
Speaking of which, status updates on secondary deflectors and a master list of all the available crafting mods would be really appreciated.
warp cores are already available under engineering
Yes but if it takes 10's of times to upgrade it will take forever to upgrade your stuf with 4/5 projects and if you still need to do the r&d to level up you don't have and project space !!
Pretty use it's not using the R&D upgrade slots. It has its own UI. We will know in a few minutes.
A few items will not be upgradeable (such as the TR-116A -- hey, what's with the torches and pitchforks?!?). C-store ship consoles such as Saucer Separation do not need upgrades; they will be considered Epic (Gold) quality already, and since you already purchased the ship, you don't need to pay more for the console that came with it. C-store ship weapons can be upgraded, because they will see significant performance improvements. (Yes, you will also be able to upgrade Spiral Wave Disruptors, if you are a Galor-class ship owner.)
What about C-Store ship consoles that deal damage and which aren't weapons? For example the Isometric Charge. Will their damage be upped to compensate for more hitpoints that both players and enemies will have?
Are active and passive set bonuses going to be upgraded to match new marks even though the bonuses are no longer bound to marks? Or are they going to remain at their Mark XII level?
Basically, I'm wondering what you're doing about balance with non-weapon damage, shield buffs, and armor buffs. We know hitpoint and shield values are going up as a result of new levels and better armor and shields. Will the rep/set bonuses and non-weapon consoles be tweaked to adjust for this? I can imagine some of those consoles will become useless otherwise.
No idea about hangar pets, but the others are covered by the post you just quoted: 'C-store ship consoles such as Saucer Separation do not need upgrades'
I think he was referring to consoles that added an effect. Saucer Separation, Cloak Devices, MVAM for the Prometheus. Stuff like that. What wasn't addressed were consoles that do damage. Isometric Charge, Point Defense System, the torpedo one, Anti-Matter Spread and such.
Yes but if it takes 10's of times to upgrade it will take forever to upgrade your stuf with 4/5 projects and if you still need to do the r&d to level up you don't have and project space !!
Well you don't use the R&D system for leveling. It's separate. The Tech and Research experience points are on each individual item. So you don't need to worry about project space. The only thing crafting is needed for is for someone somewhere to create the upgrade kits.
Second, looking at the picture in the blog, it is about 50,000 Tech points to get a Breen Shield from MkXII to MkXIII, and the Very Rare upgrade kit with an accelerator seems to get it to 15% further along from 27% to 42%. So, that's 6.6 upgrade projects for that item by that picture (always subject to tweaking and change of course) and it costs 1885 dilithium, bringing it to 12,567 dilithium. Which if I recall correctly is roughly comparable if you place it against a MkXII Fleet shield.
As to the idea of setting your upgrades for over night, that seems about right. Or even in the morning when you go to work, the longest upgrade time they mentioned was a few hours, like a Crafting project (probably using the same time table of crafting too I think it's like 4 seconds per dilithium). But I'm fairly sure you will not be able to access the item while it's being worked on, which makes sense to me since it's being rebuilt. A bit of gameplay and story integration.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
What about C-Store ship consoles that deal damage and which aren't weapons? For example the Isometric Charge. Will their damage be upped to compensate for more hitpoints that both players and enemies will have?
Are active and passive set bonuses going to be upgraded to match new marks even though the bonuses are no longer bound to marks? Or are they going to remain at their Mark XII level?
Basically, I'm wondering what you're doing about balance with non-weapon damage, shield buffs, and armor buffs. We know hitpoint and shield values are going up as a result of new levels and better armor and shields. Will the rep/set bonuses and non-weapon consoles be tweaked to adjust for this? I can imagine some of those consoles will become useless otherwise.
A lot of this is already on Tribble. If the console doesn't do damage, it is made into a "Gold" version automatically. If not, it will likely be treated like the ones above and can changed into a mk XII that can be upgraded.
I think he was referring to consoles that added an effect. Saucer Separation, Cloak Devices, MVAM for the Prometheus. Stuff like that. What wasn't addressed were consoles that do damage. Isometric Charge, Point Defense System, the torpedo one, Anti-Matter Spread and such.
Ah, good point. How do those work now? Do they scale with level, or just associated skills? I honestly have no idea.
While the blog was confusing the two Dev posts were good and answered all but one question. How much dil?
I'm praying that its cheaper than the source of this mechanic, because in never winter the diamond cost to upgrade mounts companions etc is multiple millions of diamonds each.
I am interested that they moved the diamond/dil cost off the upgrade catalyst and onto the refining item directly, thus removing any way to upgrade for free over time.
@bluegeek, in never winter unbound items can be upgraded and remain unbound, i predict the same here.
-How much crafting materials will the upgrade kits cost ? costing 10 green mats is not the same as costing 30 purple ones.
-Can we upgrade only one item at a time? Or upgrade more of them?
-How many upgrade points will they take to upgrade? How grindy is this, will it take forever?
I posted this last page.
Second, looking at the picture in the blog, it is about 50,000 Tech points to get a Breen Shield from MkXII to MkXIII, and the Very Rare upgrade kit with an accelerator seems to get it to 15% further along from 27% to 42%. So, that's 6.6 upgrade projects for that item by that picture (always subject to tweaking and change of course) and it costs 1885 dilithium, bringing it to 12,567 dilithium. Which if I recall correctly is roughly comparable if you place it against a MkXII Fleet shield.
As to the idea of setting your upgrades for over night, that seems about right. Or even in the morning when you go to work, the longest upgrade time they mentioned was a few hours, like a Crafting project (probably using the same time table of crafting too I think it's like 4 seconds per dilithium). But I'm fairly sure you will not be able to access the item while it's being worked on, which makes sense to me since it's being rebuilt. A bit of gameplay and story integration.
That's just a guess from a picture though.
"Rise like Lions after slumber, In unvanquishable number, Shake your chains to earth like dew, Which in sleep had fallen on you-Ye are many they are few"
-How much crafting materials will the upgrade kits cost ? costing 10 green mats is not the same as costing 30 purple ones.
-Can we upgrade only one item at a time? Or upgrade more of them?
-How many upgrade points will they take to upgrade? How grindy is this, will it take forever?
Crafting kits cost a component, two mats and a thousand or so ECs on Tribble if I remember correctly. Basic kits are white mats and are available at level 5, next ones are green mats and unlock at 10, superiors are one purple mat and some blues and unlock at 15. There is an experimental one at 15 that needs a special UR mat called "Salvalged Technology", which we have not seen in the game yet.
It sounds so complex and yet what I've gather it will cost me dearly in D-ore if I want better gear. Would the Delta Rising Rep Tier1,2,3,4,5 Gear Sets going to cost a me a lot more with every new upgrade I am seeing now. Double, Triple Much More D-ore at this rate.
A simple Upgrade button attached to the amount in EC, D-ore or (Z-coins for those who must have it now can't wait to the time allowed to upgrade their proir mark xx gear).
Comments
But even I have to admit that it gives people something to do when they think they've run out of things to do.
I honestly can't see this being a huge problem except in the Ultra-Elite/Nightmare difficulty mode we have yet to learn much about or in PvP. You're going to want the best gear you can get, probably. Hardcore players want an edge, or a way to neutralize somebody else's edge, and they're willing to pay or grind for it or walk away to play another game. That's a sales opportunity for Cryptic.
Everybody else needs to be choosy about what they upgrade, if they upgrade. It's probably still not going to make sense to hang on to that phaser pistol you started the game with, sentimental value or not. But that super rare thing you got out of a lockbox and equip every chance you get? Why not?
Other than that, once you've got Mk 12 Purples, you probably don't need to worry too much about Mk 14 Gold for most things.
Hah! I just realized... Our stuff will be 14 k Gold. Hope that comes with GPL plating.
Link: How to PM - Twitter @STOMod_Bluegeek
My question is, when im upgrading my quad cannons, can i still use them ??
Cause if 1 upgrade can take hours, and to level up i need to do it multiple times wil i be without my weapon(s) on my ship ??
Do you intend to address the complaints about the 100% shield penetration on the TR-116B?
Simple solution.
Start the upgrade process before you log off for the night.
I Support Disco | Disco is Love | Disco is Life
My number one concern is they respect the previous investments we have made and this looks like it does just that. Especially only having to spend a little dil per attempt. With this new reason to spend dil might I suggest a modest refine cap increase? (I can dream).
Thanks
Yes but if it takes 10's of times to upgrade it will take forever to upgrade your stuf with 4/5 projects and if you still need to do the r&d to level up you don't have and project space !!
Will we ever see warp cores added to crafting/upgrades?
When upgrading between rarities, how will added modifiers work?
Do we get to pick the new mods?
Do we just roll the dice?
Is there a set pool of available mods through upgrading?
Are the crafting mods available through this?
Speaking of which, status updates on secondary deflectors and a master list of all the available crafting mods would be really appreciated.
It's no problem, you didn't sound particularly negative at all.
Ahh, thank you, these are great answers. As expected even the C-Store stuff is getting upgraded. One question I am curious about as well is, will the set bonuses increase in strength and efficacy with the mark of the set pieces? And to delve deeper, we know that the set bonuses will work across Marks, which is awesome and a continuation of what you started in 9.5, but if the set bonus does increase in strength will it be dependent on the mark level of the highest item or the lowest?
For instance to get a Mark XIV Graviton Beam from the MACO set will I need a single MkXIV MACO piece or will I need a full set?
I noticed that the driver coil bonus on a Gold Quality Impulse engine is a Double driver coil bonus, but will the driver coil bonus on the MACO Transwarp engine improve from MKXII to MKXIII and MkXIV?
That's all I got for now, good stuff.
warp cores are already available under engineering
Pretty use it's not using the R&D upgrade slots. It has its own UI. We will know in a few minutes.
Fleet leader Nova Elite
Fleet Leader House of Nova elite
@ren_larreck
What about C-Store ship consoles that deal damage and which aren't weapons? For example the Isometric Charge. Will their damage be upped to compensate for more hitpoints that both players and enemies will have?
Are active and passive set bonuses going to be upgraded to match new marks even though the bonuses are no longer bound to marks? Or are they going to remain at their Mark XII level?
Basically, I'm wondering what you're doing about balance with non-weapon damage, shield buffs, and armor buffs. We know hitpoint and shield values are going up as a result of new levels and better armor and shields. Will the rep/set bonuses and non-weapon consoles be tweaked to adjust for this? I can imagine some of those consoles will become useless otherwise.
I think he was referring to consoles that added an effect. Saucer Separation, Cloak Devices, MVAM for the Prometheus. Stuff like that. What wasn't addressed were consoles that do damage. Isometric Charge, Point Defense System, the torpedo one, Anti-Matter Spread and such.
Well you don't use the R&D system for leveling. It's separate. The Tech and Research experience points are on each individual item. So you don't need to worry about project space. The only thing crafting is needed for is for someone somewhere to create the upgrade kits.
Second, looking at the picture in the blog, it is about 50,000 Tech points to get a Breen Shield from MkXII to MkXIII, and the Very Rare upgrade kit with an accelerator seems to get it to 15% further along from 27% to 42%. So, that's 6.6 upgrade projects for that item by that picture (always subject to tweaking and change of course) and it costs 1885 dilithium, bringing it to 12,567 dilithium. Which if I recall correctly is roughly comparable if you place it against a MkXII Fleet shield.
As to the idea of setting your upgrades for over night, that seems about right. Or even in the morning when you go to work, the longest upgrade time they mentioned was a few hours, like a Crafting project (probably using the same time table of crafting too I think it's like 4 seconds per dilithium). But I'm fairly sure you will not be able to access the item while it's being worked on, which makes sense to me since it's being rebuilt. A bit of gameplay and story integration.
A lot of this is already on Tribble. If the console doesn't do damage, it is made into a "Gold" version automatically. If not, it will likely be treated like the ones above and can changed into a mk XII that can be upgraded.
Ah, good point. How do those work now? Do they scale with level, or just associated skills? I honestly have no idea.
Hey, sure enough. Can't believe I never noticed that. Thanks!
The ones that come with a ship or from a lockbox scale with your level, and fall into the "push the upgrade button and they become Mk XII" category.
I'm praying that its cheaper than the source of this mechanic, because in never winter the diamond cost to upgrade mounts companions etc is multiple millions of diamonds each.
I am interested that they moved the diamond/dil cost off the upgrade catalyst and onto the refining item directly, thus removing any way to upgrade for free over time.
@bluegeek, in never winter unbound items can be upgraded and remain unbound, i predict the same here.
-How much Dilithium will it take?
-How much crafting materials will the upgrade kits cost ? costing 10 green mats is not the same as costing 30 purple ones.
-Can we upgrade only one item at a time? Or upgrade more of them?
-How many upgrade points will they take to upgrade? How grindy is this, will it take forever?
I posted this last page.
That's just a guess from a picture though.
Crafting kits cost a component, two mats and a thousand or so ECs on Tribble if I remember correctly. Basic kits are white mats and are available at level 5, next ones are green mats and unlock at 10, superiors are one purple mat and some blues and unlock at 15. There is an experimental one at 15 that needs a special UR mat called "Salvalged Technology", which we have not seen in the game yet.
no problem
A simple Upgrade button attached to the amount in EC, D-ore or (Z-coins for those who must have it now can't wait to the time allowed to upgrade their proir mark xx gear).
Time will only tell!